Mini Normal 2304: Conway's Game Of Life [GAME OVER!]

[Invisibility]

hey guys I will read all the stuffs soon

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I do too

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I'm on like page 15 but I think Espeonage is town from this recent interactions like

If you're town, you might be tunneled. Imagine I'm town and re-read the game.

Like the chance that one or more scum are literally unreadable because of how fresh the game is and the number of disengaged slots is so high that not going after you monkey is the bit that wouldn't doing my job as town.

The first part of your sentence is why you should be reconsidering if you have the right perspective. You've been going after me. You scumread me. Fine. Go after the other slots as well because they're disengaged and unreadable.

this feels like weird undermining stuff? HEM is saying things in a way that seems like they're suggestions when they're really just hollow refutations

Would you mind if we speak in a more civil manner from now on? I feel like the frustration isn't even warranted when I'm extending a lot of goodwill toward you. If I am not clear in my speech, ask for a clarification.

I do not see the goodwill and this feels very manipulative. Like, using the fact that Espeon is upset in a situation that I quite understand why he would be frustrated in and trying to use it to paint him as being unreasonable. Also Espeon is being described as "uncivil" when I think it's more like "peeved" which makes 375 scummy cuz HEM is painting themself as the rational party while Espeon is being coocoo for cocoa puffs.

I thought Espe's read that HEM was trying to control the game was weird, but it feels like he was being toyed with(? idk if that's the right term) here and it's very scummy

I don't appreciate your defensiveness. Your recent posts come off as frustrated, short, and lashing out.

You weren't like this earlier.

Question is whether or not this behavior is a Scumtell of yours or not.

Anyone else here have experience playing with Scum!Espeonage?

in the same vein it makes these posts kinda scummy too

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ok recent to me not everyone else

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VOTE: humaneatingmonkey I am an unstoppable force moving at extreme velocities

[Invisibility]

I see nothing in that exchange that suggests an attempt at a sincere conversation. You're mostly just being "hoohoo but what if I am a townie??" (which isn't all the groundbreaking) and trying to compare your mannerly ways with Espeon's frustration

pedit: ok soz the Vizzy pizazz is an unstoppable razzmatazz but my intent wasn't to make you sound like a jerk. I don't think I'm wrong about the way you're trying to present yourself in comparison to Espeon though. You did ask Espeon to speak in a more civil manner though and I don't think Espeon was really being that unreasonable. I smell optics shenanigans

[Invisibility]

Okay nice dude, your portrayal is definitely fair and not a total misrepresentation of me. I know because your quotes include "hoohoo" in them, which usually found when you're portraying someone fairly.

we get a little silly with it

[Invisibility]

I'm not "comparing" my "mannerly ways" with Espeon's frustration. I was asking Espeon to speak with less attitude. If Espeon is frustrated, then so am I.

I feel like the frustration isn't even warranted when I'm extending a lot of goodwill toward you.

you're painting Espeon as irrational in comparison to your goodwill. But there wasn't much to respond to, and I don't see your goodwill.

i get it. you need to undermine me. have at it.

tally ho!
how do you think my word choice here reflects on my alignment?

[Invisibility]

Okay nice dude, your portrayal is definitely fair and not a total misrepresentation of me. I know because your quotes include "hoohoo" in them, which usually found when you're portraying someone fairly.

i think one of you is about to be eliminated, and you're in a bad spot so you're extra desperate to regain control of the narrative - which starts by undermining me. so desperate that you're willing to paint me as a huge jerk because... what other alternatives do you have?

lol I think you're just trying to use the way I talk to make it sound like I'm making up ghost stories. I have reasons! And you've been responding to them! But it's easy to take my silliness and act like that's some scheme to pull rugs you're standing on. I don't think it's particularly ai cuz, while scum would be incentivized to discredit me for this here, both alignments would be incentivized to be very confused and/or annoyed here. Still, I'm saying what I'm seeing and talking weird doesn't make me wrong

[Invisibility]

sweet dreams & suchlike

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also I'm caught up now lol

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I love all the terms

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I don't see how people are reading Hu Tao's recent posts as town. Basically all they did is defend themselves against suspicion and vote the person who voted them. I mean, maybe that doesn't make them mafia, but how are people going from null to town?

because this is exactly how they behaved in previous games with them when they were town

So you're saying that you think I'd be uncapable of doing this as scum? If so, what would be hard to replicate?

I don't see how people are reading Hu Tao's recent posts as town. Basically all they did is defend themselves against suspicion and vote the person who voted them. I mean, maybe that doesn't make them mafia, but how are people going from null to town?

Suspicious post. Reads as someone that is upset that someone they know is town is being townread unrighteously. How about instead of saying why I'm not town for those posts, explain why I'm mafia?

I like these posts

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they're good questions I think. They seem to come from a place of genuine inquiry and not just fighting for towniness or whatever. Like, they question townreads on themself as part of their inquiries, but not in a way that reads as showy

[Invisibility]

they're good questions I think. They seem to come from a place of genuine inquiry and not just fighting for towniness or whatever. Like, they question townreads on themself as part of their inquiries, but not in a way that reads as showy

That is not what is happening in post 405.

ok yeah true that one isn't much of anything

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VOTE: T3 yeah good catch I would expect T3 to probably advocate for his actually scumreads a little harder here. He did vote for HEM but you would think that T3 would like, argue for them at least somewhat even if he did ultimately compromise vote

[Invisibility]

where is not mafia when you need him

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HEM you really do go out of your away to push anyone that points any flaw in espe wagon. If you are town are you really ignoring the fact that you could be wrong and that scum are doing mixture vanity voting and inactive. Whith maybe no more than one scum on espe. Why do you think you have not seen any real pivot of you if he isnt town? Instead he is focused on you which would actual indicated that your interactions would be svs as he is self proclaimed busser

If you ask why no more than one, although wagon has some energy it doesnt feel like it has the energy of two scum skew natural propagation of wagon. P.s. wanted to use a fancy word even if doesnt 100% fit :-P


One thing Espe is certianly right about is that your going out of your way to control the narative. In respone to me getting sheeps view on dragons odd vote on sheep. You make two big posts directed towards me

Of HEM, Peregrine, and Random Nurse if feel no more than one is scum as really do not think more than one scum is on that wagon. and that wagon is pere, sheep, Nurse and you.

this post bugs me. Feels super informed in hindsight VOTE: Bob

like the first paragraph sort of defends Espeon without a very good reason. Also harping on the one scum on the wagon is weird. Saying that HEM and Espeon's interactions are svs is also a weird statement like they shaded HEM and then immediately undermined themself by defending Espeon.

[Invisibility]

i didn’t actually read any of Invisibility’s posts

but I worked so hard to write them

[Invisibility]

Like I said yesterday he had a similar thought process to me toward the end. Also I'm not liking how Bob is the sudden scumread from RN flip. Seems like a lazy read. Who else do you think is scum? Maybe we should look as to why Dunn died?

what makes it lazy? Also why do you think Dunn died?

[Invisibility]

VOTE: T3 yeah good catch I would expect T3 to probably advocate for his actually scumreads a little harder here. He did vote for HEM but you would think that T3 would like, argue for them at least somewhat even if he did ultimately compromise vote

Supper scummy vote


VOTE: Invisibility

You voted his for saying he rather a slot he knew was town wasnt exed over a slot he only had a slight town lean on.

Same logic as confirmed scum nurse

PLus the veloicty of that wagon day 1 implys 2 scum.

what's your argument here exactly? I had similar logic to known scum? Y'know, I also had similar logic as known town. Plus I don't think that agreeing with scum is a very good indicator of scumhood

[Invisibility]

Invisibility jumping on Bob right away after Norwegian is suspect too. What happened to your previous reads?

was the question directed at me or Norwegian

[Invisibility]

Misrep. its quite clear i was pointing out that the wagonomics screamed town espe

not gonna lie. It wasn't very clear to me and I had difficulty understanding what you meant. Were you saying that, if Espeon were scum, votes would pile onto HEM?

if it were not for the risk of nolynch i would never of voted T3.

this is a weird thing to clarify when no one had brought it up at this point. You're defending yourself from arguments that no one's made

Also misreping the fact that espe tends to buss his partners especialy if they are weaker. And at no point did i ever day their interactions was svs.

I might've also misunderstood you here but like, what was your point here? If Espeon was scum, that he'd only push other scum? So from that HEM should conclude Espeon is town? Correct me if I'm wrong, but that's not very compelling

[Invisibility]

Invisibility jumping on Bob right away after Norwegian is suspect too. What happened to your previous reads?

was the question directed at me or Norwegian

Probably you.
How would my reads have changed from day 1 when i wasn’t there?

I thought they might've meant earlier in your catchup or soemthing

[Invisibility]

Invisibility so what are your reads on other players?

In post 485 you said you were caught up. I cant see you stating anywhere who you town read, who is neutral and you have only made 3 pushs. One vs HEM, second one against T3 with weak reasoning and third against me.

I did say how I found posts from Hu to be townie yesterday. I agreed with Owl the assertion that coming out of the gate swinging with the wagon thing suggested Owl was town. Don't really have much else on that slot or any slot for that matter.

[Invisibility]

Then why did you choose T3 over owl.

why would I?

Also why did his vote for owl change your read on him from town to scum. Post 469 you say that you think espe is town. and in that same post you say two of nurse posts ( 315,316) look "makes these posts kinda scummy too".

it looked like a pretty major mistake to me

So we have your only reference to nurse day one first sayign you think they made some scummy posts too you agreeing with them on T3 vote. Were you reading Nurse at end of day one as town and if so why?

the slot did irk me but not majorly (especially since, if T3 was scum, then the point I made in 469 was moot). When T3 flipped town I started to dig into Nurse's posts (there were a few other pings) but then it ended up not mattering lolz

[Invisibility]

Invisibility so what are your reads on other players?

In post 485 you said you were caught up. I cant see you stating anywhere who you town read, who is neutral and you have only made 3 pushs. One vs HEM, second one against T3 with weak reasoning and third against me.

I did say how I found posts from Hu to be townie yesterday. I agreed with Owl the assertion that coming out of the gate swinging with the wagon thing suggested Owl was town. Don't really have much else on that slot or any slot for that matter.

Care to quote these posts reagrding owl. As you iso shows nothing when i search "owl". Well apart from this post im quoting.

dude I don't know what you want from me. When I caught up there was barely any time left in the day like I focused on the thing that drew my attention the most

[Invisibility]

Also what are your current reads on


Doctor Drew/BloodB0t

Peregrine

sheepsaysmeep

Save The Dragons

humaneatingmonkey


I would add NM but who can say to have a read on him lol

what do you hope to gain from asking this?

[Invisibility]

I should say that I didn't like Hu Tao's posting at the beginning of today. She said to look elsewhere without providing a substantive elsewhere to look (592).

[Invisibility]

Invisibility jumping on Bob right away after Norwegian is suspect too. What happened to your previous reads?

read singular. Random Nurse died and I still suspect HEM but I was waiting to see how they'd approach today

[Invisibility]

Also what are your current reads on


Doctor Drew/BloodB0t

Peregrine

sheepsaysmeep

Save The Dragons

humaneatingmonkey


I would add NM but who can say to have a read on him lol

what do you hope to gain from asking this?

So are you saying you have no reads on these players?

I already said that they were null except for like HEM. Again, what are you hoping to get from me that I haven't already said?

[Invisibility]

Expect before this post you had not made a single mention of dragon,sheep drew/blood and pere. Thats 40% of the remaining players. Also i think this is the second time you have tried to deflect questioning by saying that you "already said" when you hadnt

Do you think its a unreasonable question to ask? As before now you had not stated at any point if you thought they were scum, null or town.

what did you think I meant when I said I didn't have many thoughts on other slots? Your question doesn't feel like genuine inquiry cuz I don't know what you expect to get from me. Like, I get thinking I've been ignoring slots or whatever, but just asking a question that I'd already answered (and I did. Idk why you think I didn't just cuz I didn't individually mention them by name) feels like you're more interested in making me pursue waterfowl than sorting me

[Invisibility]

I should say that I didn't like Hu Tao's posting at the beginning of today. She said to look elsewhere without providing a substantive elsewhere to look (592).

Just trying to start a conversation

then state an opinion on the stuff you brought up lol

[Invisibility]

Expect before this post you had not made a single mention of dragon,sheep drew/blood and pere. Thats 40% of the remaining players. Also i think this is the second time you have tried to deflect questioning by saying that you "already said" when you hadnt

Do you think its a unreasonable question to ask? As before now you had not stated at any point if you thought they were scum, null or town.

what did you think I meant when I said I didn't have many thoughts on other slots? Your question doesn't feel like genuine inquiry cuz I don't know what you expect to get from me. Like, I get thinking I've been ignoring slots or whatever, but just asking a question that I'd already answered (and I did. Idk why you think I didn't just cuz I didn't individually mention them by name) feels like you're more interested in making me pursue waterfowl than sorting me

To be frank you have had a single reference to those slots in any form before i pushed you. Not even a generic claim that all other slots were null as you claim. In fact you first use of slots, null was a direct response to my questioning. Which is pretty common in scum that dont want to be nailed down to any town reads


You seem be getting super defensive in our interactions. For instance in post 649 you responded in defensive manner rather than as i would expect a town player behave. Which would be yes followed by somethign along teh lines that you would look at them. Instead you cam out with defensive what more do you want.

okay this post is good cuz I can see the point of your questions now. Like seeing my cooperativeness or whatever

still don't really understand why my vote was scummy (607) though

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So i'm gonna keep my vote on BloodB0t because i thought their predecessor seemed a bit scummy and they haven't convinced me they're townie at all from the sparse content they've given today.

what was scummy about their predecessor?

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human monkey eating

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considering HEM scummy for wanting to vote n_m feels too easy lol
I still have my misgivings but I feel sorta better about Bob after our exchange made me see like a solving viewpoint from them.

VOTE: Hu Tao

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I would expect nurse partner to be town reading him

why?

[Invisibility]

!!GLOBAL INFORMED!!

There are multiple Bodyguards in the setup.

!!GLOBAL INFORMED!!

if anyone wanted to counterclaim or something don't forget this lolz

[Invisibility]

I think that thought actually makes a lot of sense but I think nurse hyperfocused on owl in a way that doesnt rly make sense as w/w? like a substantial portion of nurse's content was just pressing owl for response, would be inefficient play

yeah I kinda agree I think Nurse similarly dug into Espeon over weird like not answering questions things (307, 316). He also sorta sussed both Owl and Espeon while giving himself some plausible deniability room to I guess give himself a quick escape route in case the pushes didn't work or something (187 on Owl, 328 on Espeon (where he claims that he didn't scumread Espeon, even though he considered the possibility of having his questions ignored being indicative of scumminess in 316)). He treated both slots similarly which makes me think he was setting up on both of them which means Owl slot is probably town

[Invisibility]

considering HEM scummy for wanting to vote n_m feels too easy lol
I still have my misgivings but I feel sorta better about Bob after our exchange made me see like a solving viewpoint from them.

VOTE: Hu Tao

Why?

why to what

[Invisibility]

Feeling better about the Invis slot.

why?

Although I do get scummy feeling from nurse/HEM/(invis) interactions but leaning towards if my feeling is right then its more likely to be HEM thats scum out of HEM and Invis.

I don't think you've explained what makes HEM scummy from those interactions

[Invisibility]

Spoiler: Massive quote wall involving HEM

The vibes in this thread are gnarly in a bad way!!

I will catch up tonight or tomorrow (it shouldn’t take long!) but as a sneak peek I see Espeonage as mafia still, and they are coming across poorly in their interaction with HEM!

I’m unsure if it is personality or not at this point, if I am honest but Espe keeps choosing to take the worst faith interpretations and assumptions!

I take umbrage with this because I feel like I am giving back what I am getting from the thread. I think why I am so frustrated by this game right now is that there is so much rhetoric for the sake of posting, and it is so stagnating.

So I don't think I am taking worst faith, I am taking logical subtext. Like contrast the iso of someone like sheep vs someone like monkey and tell me with a straight face that you think monkey isnt being obtuse on purpose.

If you're town, you might be tunneled. Imagine I'm town and re-read the game.

I understand you scumread me. But just imagine the two worlds beside each other co-existing. Like Schrodinger's humaneatingmonkey. If you're town, that's what you're supposed to be doing anyway.

We're the top two posters by far, we can chill for a bit as well.

Agree. I've been doing this. You have no idea how chill I am by the standard of how pushy I really am.

Like the chance that one or more scum are literally unreadable because of how fresh the game is and the number of disengaged slots is so high that not going after you monkey is the bit that wouldn't doing my job as town.

The first part of your sentence is why you should be reconsidering if you have the right perspective. You've been going after me. You scumread me. Fine. Go after the other slots as well because they're disengaged and unreadable.

I.. I. What?!?

Would you mind if we speak in a more civil manner from now on? I feel like the frustration isn't even warranted when I'm extending a lot of goodwill toward you. If I am not clear in my speech, ask for a clarification.

Would you mind if we speak in a more civil manner from now on? I feel like the frustration isn't even warranted when I'm extending a lot of goodwill toward you. If I am not clear in my speech, ask for a clarification.

This is textbook narcissistic gaslighting, and I really hope you are scum and this is not a personal trait.

@Mod: Please replace me, all goodwill is gone.

Okay then, sir. Post-game, please enlighten me on how that's "textbook narcissistic gaslighting". Maybe if you really feel that I harmed you in anyway, you should report me to the mods. I mean it.

I maintain that I do not believe that I ever escalated my language to verbal abuse or anything that might be described as "going at someone's throat". Suspicion, interrogation, and pressure are a natural part of this game. I'm willing for an outside arbiter to judge the situation accordingly and make their sanctions, but otherwise, I suggest we move on from this.

I'm on like page 15 but I think Espeonage is town from this recent interactions like

If you're town, you might be tunneled. Imagine I'm town and re-read the game.

Like the chance that one or more scum are literally unreadable because of how fresh the game is and the number of disengaged slots is so high that not going after you monkey is the bit that wouldn't doing my job as town.

The first part of your sentence is why you should be reconsidering if you have the right perspective. You've been going after me. You scumread me. Fine. Go after the other slots as well because they're disengaged and unreadable.

this feels like weird undermining stuff? HEM is saying things in a way that seems like they're suggestions when they're really just hollow refutations

Would you mind if we speak in a more civil manner from now on? I feel like the frustration isn't even warranted when I'm extending a lot of goodwill toward you. If I am not clear in my speech, ask for a clarification.

I do not see the goodwill and this feels very manipulative. Like, using the fact that Espeon is upset in a situation that I quite understand why he would be frustrated in and trying to use it to paint him as being unreasonable. Also Espeon is being described as "uncivil" when I think it's more like "peeved" which makes 375 scummy cuz HEM is painting themself as the rational party while Espeon is being coocoo for cocoa puffs.

I thought Espe's read that HEM was trying to control the game was weird, but it feels like he was being toyed with(? idk if that's the right term) here and it's very scummy

I don't appreciate your defensiveness. Your recent posts come off as frustrated, short, and lashing out.

You weren't like this earlier.

Question is whether or not this behavior is a Scumtell of yours or not.

Anyone else here have experience playing with Scum!Espeonage?

in the same vein it makes these posts kinda scummy too

Also Espeon is being described as "uncivil" when I think it's more like "peeved" which makes 375 scummy cuz HEM is painting themself as the rational party while Espeon is being coocoo for cocoa puffs

It's frustrating being treated like that when you're trying to have a sincere conversation and you get things like "What?!?"

I never described anyone as "uncivil" and "coocoo". Stop this.

That's cool buddy. Just don't put words in my mouth that makes me sound like an abusive jerk. That's beyond this game.

I see nothing in that exchange that suggests an attempt at a sincere conversation. You're mostly just being "hoohoo but what if I am a townie??" (which isn't all the groundbreaking) and trying to compare your mannerly ways with Espeon's frustration

pedit: ok soz the Vizzy pizazz is an unstoppable razzmatazz but my intent wasn't to make you sound like a jerk. I don't think I'm wrong about the way you're trying to present yourself in comparison to Espeon though. You did ask Espeon to speak in a more civil manner though and I don't think Espeon was really being that unreasonable. I smell optics shenanigans

Okay nice dude, your portrayal is definitely fair and not a total misrepresentation of me. I know because your quotes include "hoohoo" in them, which usually found when you're portraying someone fairly.

my intent wasn't to make you sound like a jerk

we're cool. don't do it again. i know what you're doing, but sometimes lines can be crossed.

I'm not "comparing" my "mannerly ways" with Espeon's frustration. I was asking Espeon to speak with less attitude. If Espeon is frustrated, then so am I.

I feel like the frustration isn't even warranted when I'm extending a lot of goodwill toward you.

you're painting Espeon as irrational in comparison to your goodwill. But there wasn't much to respond to, and I don't see your goodwill.

i get it. you need to undermine me. have at it.

tally ho!
how do you think my word choice here reflects on my alignment?

i think one of you is about to be eliminated, and you're in a bad spot so you're extra desperate to regain control of the narrative - which starts by undermining me. so desperate that you're willing to paint me as a huge jerk because... what other alternatives do you have?

I'm confident that this is scum!HEM. HEM was feigning civility to tilt Espeon, who was very clearly not in a good mood and was an easy target. Invisibility caught onto it and called it out, which HEM responded to by making an emotional outburst and trying to reframe the situation as Espeon and Invisibilty making personal attacks against him and his character. This is blatant sea lioning, and HEM

loves

doing that as scum.

Spoiler: HEM/Nurse interactions

VOTE: sheepsaysmeep

projection. this guy is the real wolf among sheep.

But how would you know? :?

VOTE: humaneatingmonkey

hi hello

why

do we have a wagon forming this early

Do you think page 1 *wagons* are serious?

What I do wonder is why you appear concerned for humaneatingmonkey.

the man-eater is fine. it is odd to see a wagon form on page one though, and particularly odd that you took that so personally so quickly. why is your immediate response an attempt to discredit me and then deflect my point by misinterpreting it?

Guess I'm trying to parse through what you mean by he's "fine."

Doesn't sound like you've been playing that long if you think three same votes on page 1 is odd, tbf.

What does kind of ping my radar is you saying it was taken personally—could you share where, because this does sound like you're adding something that isn't there.

Again, it seems like you're adding things by saying I'm attempting to discredit you. Three same votes on page 1 does not a wagon make, and they are rarely if ever serious.

And what I said to you, Sir, is that it appears to me that you are concerned over HEM's safety. That's just how it seems to me so if you react defensively I can't help that.

Monkey's eagerness to control the game feels scum-motivated. And this is only exacerbated by the fact that they have really gone hard on the proverbial low hanging fruit.

The lining up of lynches is also always something I am watchful of. In both cases, if owl is town, monkey is just being negligent if town, and if owl is scum it's a very aggressive theater strat. The common thread being that monkey lining up lynches is poo poo.

vote: humaneatingmonkey

IIRC HEM had 3 votes at this time.

Could it be reaching for low-hanging fruit adding a fourth vote at this time?

HEM, how do you read Invisibility currently?

The obvious agenda to undermine me was enough to call them scum. There was no inch of fair assessment of my alignment - he immediately went after me to discredit me.

He doesnt even bother doing anything else. It's a 13-p he just replaced into. Where are his other reads?

Hm..

VOTE: Invisibility

These posts on a surface level feel like scum trying to lead on a townie with bad reads. But I think these are actually planned distancing interactions, since if they're both scum and one of them flips, it makes the other look good and a third person (Owl and Espeon) look worse. Furthermore, in 220 HEM already injected the idea that scum were setting him up to push townie wagons before anyone even flipped or was close to flipping, yet instead of doing anything to reassess he just...kept pushing those slots. Like as if he only wanted to mention that to help set up a narrative.

VOTE: HEM

thank you for reminding me that I'm always right forever. I think the sealioning got to me cuz I kinda got cold feet when only one other person had anything to say abt what I was posting about (I think) which made me decide to wait and see how HEM is today (their posting today has not impressed me anyway). Will probably vote there eventually. The vote is on in spirit.

I kinda don't care if the role is real or not cuz if it is real it's a silly role that's added and doesn't do much and considering that it could probably go on scum or town. I don't see the point in limming N_M today. I think the stated reasons are that we can determine HEM's role (which I don't think really matters) and that what N_M flips will tell us HEM's alignment (but I agree with Bob in that it really doesn't). I guess the biggest point to the latter is that scum!HEM would have to survive subsequent days and explain why they weren't NK'd but I mean they could say stuff about how their role isn't that useful and how people doubt the spew and whatever so idk still not that compelling

[Invisibility]

wow great argument There are 10 players alive in this games that would all say the same thing and 2 of them are not going to be telling the truth.

yes but people can be confbiased into thinking they caught scum when they're absolutely wrong.

in this case, you're absolutely wrong

this conversation is silly

[Invisibility]

you should say your N1 result

[Invisibility]

A period-19 oscillator has been discovered today!

woah!

[Invisibility]

I think the most likely situation is that N_M is town and HEM hopes they can either talk their way out of a lim or have their partner pull the scumteam to victory. Regardless I'm not convinced that keeping this slot alive is worth much of anything

VOTE: HEM e-1

[Invisibility]

i think hem is town though. i think the way he posts isn't really calculated and seems more off the cuff

I visited Save The Dragon and he's not a bodyguard

Which posts from STD gave you Bodyguard vibes

i felt as if std was reading the game from a place of distance. so i thought the distance meant he could be a pr - and i imagine - a bodyguard

That doesn't answer my question

also something about how HEM checked STD but can't actually give specific posts explaining why irks me. Also not a fan of how they only posted the check results after STD stated a townread but that timing's a lot less important considering STD had already stated a townread in a readslist (764). Still the fact that HEM can't concretely justify why they checked STD and that STD townreads HEM makes me think that HEM may have gambled on STD not being a bodyguard because they knew that STD would respond well to a stated (virtual, probably) greencheck and not like, suspect pocketing or whatever. It seems to be working considering how STD is sort of defending HEM. Probably means that STD is town if HEM is scum

[Invisibility]

Is it E-1? Dunno if i should hammer yet.

it is

[Invisibility]

WHY would you not want to keep a potential pro-town role/loud spewing scum for A DAY MORE to see what other information you might be missing?

what if you're a good scumrole and you think you can buy yourself one more night action? How should we weigh that possibility?

[Invisibility]

like yeah we will most likely flip N_M at some point but I don't think the arguments for doing it right now in lieu of you are very compelling

[Invisibility]

UNVOTE:

I actually think std is scum now. But I know we probably won't have enough votes for it

where does STD being scum leave HEM?

[Invisibility]

I don't think the arguments for doing it right now in lieu of you are very compelling

why is it not very compelling? what have i said about eliminating N_M first before me isn't true?

I don't think N_M's alignment really helps us sort you and I don't see the value in testing your role. Even if it does exist that doesn't say much about your alignment

[Invisibility]

N_M solves sometimes

[Invisibility]

hi

[Invisibility]

who's scum idk anymore
Hu Tao flipping onto STD yesterday felt townie

[Invisibility]

Why did it feel townie? I don’t think I liked it

nvm I was gonna say that Hu seemed to be evaluating stuffs cuz even though the STD wasn't very good I dunno how much reason there was it steer the lim from a townie to N_M but then I reread it and like
Hu Tao just flipped to thinking HEM was town when she previously scumread them for their N_M stuffs. The HEM read change didn't actually feel all that justified by STD being scum. Also like she just started agreeing with HEM's N_M plan which I don't think you would do even if you started thinking that it wasn't actually scummy

lol VOTE: Hu Tao

[Invisibility]

Well invisibility that was a quick 180

what made you change your mind about limming N_M

[Invisibility]

ah

he can still pull off a shot the night he dies. the 2nd death is like 99% him

Why would he not shoot NM. I don't get it..

idgi either but I think another killing power makes even less sense

[Invisibility]

UNVOTE:

[Invisibility]

no e minus juan yet

[Invisibility]

invisibility whats your stance on killing NM

idk that's probably what we should do today but I wanted to push Hu Tao

[Invisibility]

if I don't think about this game at night it invades my dreams and I am forced to think about it

[Invisibility]

Peregrine where are you

[Invisibility]

is this a situation where we need to lim N_M to force ourselves to think again

[Invisibility]

yeah

[Invisibility]

VOTE: nm
ok

[Invisibility]

hi

[Invisibility]

ok

[Invisibility]

how do we choose the order I've never actually orchestrated this

[Invisibility]

should I claim now

[Invisibility]

I'm a compulsive bodyguard
N1 I targeted Dunnstral, N2 I targeted Peregrine, N3 I targeted sheep

[Invisibility]

I don't see a slip

[Invisibility]

it is possible that there are just a lot of compulsive bodyguards

[Invisibility]

like the joke might be that the number of kills isn't gonna change just the targets can get all wacked up

[Invisibility]

it is possible that there are just a lot of compulsive bodyguards

Pretty sure mod said there are a lot of bodyguards

yeah

[Invisibility]

it is possible that there are just a lot of compulsive bodyguards

Pretty sure mod said there are a lot of bodyguards

yeah

he just didn't say that everyone who is not something else interesting is a bodyguard

[Invisibility]

I think he meant that as he wasn't sure about Peregrine not as a blank space lol. That's how I read it

[Invisibility]

oh that's really funny

[Invisibility]

this setup is funny

[Invisibility]

hi

[Invisibility]

Hi invis did you read my guilty

yeah and I'm kind of not believing it :P

[Invisibility]

though I kind of am. Nvm let me think about it

[Invisibility]

idk thinking about mech and setup spec and that jazz I am unsure but I have just consistently found STD townier than you lol

[Invisibility]

im not a vt

and I think it means there must be mafia in hu tao / ???peregrine?????

because that would be like, a ridiculous number of town non-vanillas

And this is the clearest slip of all time. Invis do you understand why this is a slip? From sheep's point of view there is 2 mafia in 4 people confirmed. So if he names 3 people there is confirmed 1 mafia in them. There is no reason to say "I think" in that situation

he didn't name three people though

[Invisibility]

hi I'm still kinda lost but I'm leaning more towards Hu Tao scum I think. The Bob defense thing felt pretty unnatural like it could be setting up for this. Also reading Hu's iso I'm having trouble actually seeing like, solving

[Invisibility]

Well to be fair. A few of you wanted Bob beginning of yesterday and I derailed that fast. And hem was towntelling at the end and I tried to derail that. Not sure what else to say

like this feels so awkward when Hu was derailing a mall train* and guiding us on to more or less nothing

Spoiler: * these things

Peregrine is probably scum cuz I assume the other bodyguard claim is scums

[Invisibility]

Hu what happened to your suspicion of me

[Invisibility]

why use a traffic analyst in this setup over a cop if there were no other PTs to find

i think it's a weird claim regardless of the supposed guilty on me

I feel like the NRG or whoever want there to some games where the traffic analyst only gets positive results on scum so that it's never a sure thing that masons or a neighborhood exist or whatever. Still more likely to not be the case but like not totally unlikely

[Invisibility]

Peregrine is probably scum cuz I assume the other bodyguard claim is scums

this is interesting to me, can u explain it a bit more

like I guess from my pov theres gotta be scum between the two bodyguards. but earlier in the game I was thinking a mafia bodyguard makes no sense. and I do believe that peregrine is a bodyguard

I was thinking the joke of the game being that there's a crap ton of bodyguards and stuff that cares about bodyguards would mean that scum should have a bodyguard which matters more cuz of the finder and stuff and also compulsiveness makes the vig shot more humorous. I also think Peregrine is a bodyguard

[Invisibility]

The ??? Is the 3rd person but that's besides the point.

you cared a lot about this point like ten seconds ago

ah yeah

I just put question marks around peregrine as in "I am realizing I gotta consider peregrine as mafia when Ive been thinking I could just assume they were town for many day phases"

like what do you think of this

[Invisibility]

none of Hu's softs are really that convincing cuz like they're just stuff taht you would do otherwise. Like, the context of his role doesn't make his previous behavior "click" if that makes sense. This could easily just be a continuation of backpedaling on folks for towncredz

I think if you do this search-through for progressions on some flipped villagers it looks similar too. there is basically never a semblance of something positive expressed - which is like, just really unnatural to me. it is just progressive shading

I dont get the feeling he is genuinely trying to sort these different players alignments (especially something I felt toward me from my pov)

I agree with this. Also like I think the only two townread slots from Hu were Bob and HEM unless I'm forgetting something.

Also look at my reaction to hme claiming bodyguard finder, I was initially suspect of it but then realized it was to help find town and my role was to help find scum.

I don't see this in your reaction. I see you jump off the train to claim the fame of being right about the game and it doesn't make your role more credible. Also this actually doesn't make that much sense at all. Actually yeah this logic is a stretch cuz like even if you considered that possibility that didn't rule out the world that HEM was trueclaiming scum. Also the reason to scumread STD wasn't good

I would expect town to want to more gracefully steer away from Bob than you did either. If you're town you'd have been begging to eat the nightkill and I think you'd be more aware that you don't want to do that

[Invisibility]

it's probably just Hu here
I don't see genuine solving in the iso. Hu's read on STD (945) is wack and on Sheep (1064) feels contrived. Hu seems wholly uninterested in considering that me or Peregrine are STD's partner. Like not even acting the least bit suspicious about me even though he was before and even if he thinks std/sheep team is most likely that doesn't rule me out. Peregrine is more reasonable to not suspect since I don't think Hu ever expressed suspicion of that slot

am I too reliant on the wisdom of other folks? Is that why Hu is trying to get my vote here? That's possible honestly. I think Hu would know this lol

[Invisibility]

wow

[Invisibility]

I think Hu Tao trying to like shame me into voting elsewhere is just flailing VOTE: Hu Tao

if you're town, then, like, don't do this. If you're scum, also don't do this actually

[Invisibility]

UNVOTE:

[Invisibility]

I forgot about Peregrine. I would like to hear their night action probably

[Invisibility]

Is it likely that there are this many compulsive bodyguards within a setup and all are town??

When I have read over the past pages quickly Inthoight that Invisibility was town! Which is concerning for the setup at large!!!

who do you think is scum?

[Invisibility]

hi

[Invisibility]

I'm not quick hammering scum

[Invisibility]

haha yup

[Invisibility]

but then I realized I could honestly see the way this day has gone as std/hu tao being w/w

can you elaborate on this

[Invisibility]

What do u think about the suggestion that hu Tao/std is w/w lol

I don't super get where you're coming from

[Invisibility]

Also look how it was announced there were multiple bodyguards this game. You think only 2? With sheep claiming he's a bodyguard enabler??

are compulsive bodyguards commonplace on MS? Cuz like is this a slip? Like is the team Pere/Hu and Pere's fakeclaiming or something and Hu slipped that there's only two bodyguards even though fmpov there's three. Maybe. This might be kind of a stretch also

well maybe Hu is slipping that their partner fakeclaimed cuz like I never expressed doubts about Pere being truthful regardless of his alignment. May be

[Invisibility]

Std is low motivation to fight hard and hu Tao approach today is just weird in a way that I don’t get

ok I can kind of see this cuz I would think STD would like to Not Lose if getting limmed would lose him the game. But also there's not that much impetus on Hu's guilty so like idk if he's even in any danger
I guess I am also at like 98% certainty in Pere/Hu

[Invisibility]

hi

VOTE: hu tao

i'm VT

the fact that Hu Tao came into this saying "I have a guilty" and not "I could have a guilty" proves this is just bullshit

why use a traffic analyst in this setup over a cop if there were no other PTs to find

i think it's a weird claim regardless of the supposed guilty on me

like these posts are very unconvincing responses to Hu's guilty I thought

[Invisibility]

yeah opk

[Invisibility]

ok****
yeah I think Hu onto STD was a weird jump like more like trying to set something up. Idk why you'd go all out with this with your partner when like if they were partners they'd be in a good enough position and potentially drawing bad vibes to STD would be dumb and pointless I think

[Invisibility]

ok

hu tao/peregrine final answer

yeah ok I think I agree

[Invisibility]

VOTE: peregrine do you still want to vote Peregrine cuz I think she's scum basically no matter what

[Invisibility]

wow good job Sheep lol

[Invisibility]

I regret nothing ever

[Invisibility]

this is a good lesson to be more open-minded in the future though lol considering it is easier to consider all the permutations at that point of the game

[Invisibility]

cool game though & gg and stuff

[Invisibility]

this is a good lesson to be more open-minded in the future though lol considering it is easier to consider all the permutations at that point of the game

this is a game I'll definitely have to read back over knowing what I know now lol

[Invisibility]

im used to invisibility being able to super obvtown and he is simply nothing close to that in this game

oh also I wanted to ask when the game was over is this true? I'm so used to like, being incorrigibly null, but also the last time I played Mafia regularly was like four years ago