Mini 2308 | Blood over Utopia | Utopia fell.

[biancospino]

Votecount 2-V

With 12 alive, it takes 7 to hammer.

flavor

Spoiler:

execution votes

Deal With The Devil (2):

meowmeow (1505), RCEnigma (1524)

RCEnigma (1):

camelCasedSnivy (1466)

Aureal (1):

Flavor Leaf (1651)

Not voting (8):

Merlyn, Deal With The Devil, Enchant, SirCakez, Aureal, Hu Tao, Cat Scratch Fever, marcistar

projects votes

Torture (6):

SirCakez (1470), Cat Scratch Fever (1471), Merlyn (1495), Flavor Leaf (1497), Deal With The Devil (1580), Hu Tao (1684)

Trading Outpost (3):

, Enchant (1504), meowmeow (1505), camelCasedSnivy (1571)

Guildhall (1):

Aureal (1474)

Not voting (2):

RCEnigma, marcistar

notes

• The Deadline is due in (expired on 2023-08-19 11:00:00).

[meowmeow]

I have no idea what it does for my range, but definitely not out of your scum range.

I think overtime, I’ll be able to town read Meowmeow correctly if they’re town.

To be fair, most of my last few pages, and my whole pink tier push has really been to solve Meowmeow anyways.

what does "I have no idea what it does for my range" mean?

also, it's even true that i can get townread as scum, but i don't think the ausuka you were familiar with would have been able to play like this so i'm wondering why you think that?

[meowmeow]

i mean, if you have to put me with a scumteam, there's nothing *wrong* with saying it's merlyn and marcistar and aureal or whatever. like from an outside perspective it would be possible for me to be scum with any of these people. i don't think there's much gained taking this kind of approach though and not sure what you're seeing if town, regarding how it helps sorting

like, all of your interactions with aureal in particular with me are confusing. marci i can kind of get? ironically, there

could

actually be a parallel with the drew situation, in that i think it's possible you wanted that miselimination available because it's easy to make a 'logical' case there and you wouldn't likely get much flak from it, but i also think it's possible for town you to just feel that way. like, i have miseliminated marcistar more than once.

but aureal? you're 'pushing' there and voting for her but you haven't like really given anything, except she doesn't want you to be tortured, but you also said that about marci and most of your talking about her is just like, 'oh she could be scum with meow'. like, you've done the mechanical disagreement reads a lot on d2 which i don't vibe with and i don't really get what this approach to aureal does?

[meowmeow]

speaking of aureal


@aureal; how did you get to townreads on me and fl? right now, we have 12 alive, so for town players 4/11 of people are scum, and that's not far from half of everyone. and 1552 seemed to indicate you thought i could be scum, but just didn't think that world was likely enough to push me in that moment. you say you agreed with us on stuff; what would you say those things were, that made you think scum wouldn't say that? (i'm not sure how useful it is sorting wise, but i think fl is *less likely* to do ate - i said as much at the time, i think he likes to have fun with it if he can - but think it could easily be maf!fl feeling frustrated at marci in a genuine way)

[Merlyn]

So yeah, if you're town and you're reading FL town too, I don't know how you're going to argue that it's not still good for gamestate to know for sure. In my eyes anyone who starts to argue against it is someone to watch closely.

I wouldn't have been advocating for using Sacrifice on FL here either. Because I'm townreading him.

]That whole discussion was not something I ever agreed with so there's nothing for him to 'wiggle out of' as far as I'm concerned

. Setting up chains of flips based on having a wrong read isn't a healthy state for town.

What I want to know here is: who is actually scumreading FL? I think that's the important factor here. Please raise your hand if you support this because

you

actually don't trust Flavor Leaf rather than because of some perceived sentiment that other people don't so may as well go along with it because we were gonna use sacrifice anyway or something.

What he would be wiggling out of is his own agreement to be tortured and has nothing to do with you or anyone's reads on him.

I don't trust FL and I'm scumleaning him.

[Enchant]

Day is still going?

VOTE: Deal With The Devil

[Merlyn]

What are your pie in the sky reasons for sr'ing me, Aureal? I kind of have my own guess (meta related) but I might be off base

Well, first you agreed with me when I commented on the weather thing from the first post flavor. I... Well that was more of a moment of "ha ha I'll look so insightful if this actually DOES mean something!!" than actually thinking it would mean something. You seemed fairly serious in your agreement though, which made me feel rather weird about your reaction. In Scarfolk I made a read for a reason that I didn't actually have a lot of confidence in because I wanted to cover for a PR read and scum picked it up to amplify it, so that kinda gave me some of the same vibes.

Eventually I started liking your takes more and I can't quite remember anything specific about why, but I was starting to get tired of my vote on you. I had thought about your theory about how scum might get funds determined by what action we take, and decided it was likely a take from town because scum wouldn't TMI giving us ideas like that if it does actually work that way. I didn't even remember it came from you, I had to go back and look for who had said it and it turned out it was you (that was where I started bringing up more reads because I was reading back and forming them a little more).

Now I'm second-guessing that you wouldn't TMI that, because the new stuff we got is really actually giving me doubts about what's going on here. Torture is so obviously the 'right' thing to do here, mechanics-wise. Having to add 'mechanics-wise' to that sentence should give you pause. I'm feeling like it's a lot more likely the setup does operate by funding insurgents based on which action we take and that is clearly a prime choice. We may be operating on Undertale principles here. The game we see makes us want to do what the rules make us think is optimal, but actually we're supposed to be applying real-world morality.

Okay, definitely different from what I thought. Fwiw I had come up with that thought on the clouds on my own and was happy to see that someone else had thought the same. Of course I was serious, we were literally told that the flavor would have game elements in it.

Not really sure what to say or think about the rest of your thoughts re: TMI. Since we don't know how scum get its funds, its not really something that could be easily proven or disproven. On my side, I'm trying to decide if I think this is a real reason for a sr from you or a fake one from scum!Aureal. Idk, it's seems a bit odd to me but you did say that it was pie in the sky.

I'm not sure what Undertale is, but your thought is interesting. What about the game is making you think that we're supposed to be applying real world morality though? I'm not sure intelligentia or bureau read as morally positive things to me, more neutral leaning dark in real world. And the flavor of the game is- I mean, it's pretty clear that we don't really live in Utopia, the place is a post apocalyptic government controlled nightmare.

[Merlyn]

please sacrifice me guys xoxo

Hey Marci, I've asked you a couple of times now, what's your readlist?

[camelCasedSnivy]

I don't trust FL and I'm scumleaning him.

then are you willing to torture FL?

[RCEnigma]

I have no idea what it does for my range, but definitely not out of your scum range.

I think overtime, I’ll be able to town read Meowmeow correctly if they’re town.

To be fair, most of my last few pages, and my whole pink tier push has really been to solve Meowmeow anyways.

what does "I have no idea what it does for my range" mean?

also, it's even true that i can get townread as scum, but i don't think the ausuka you were familiar with would have been able to play like this so i'm wondering why you think that?

There isn’t a mind explode smiley here so use your own imaginations.

[Flavor Leaf]

What it does for my reads*

[Flavor Leaf]

Oh yeah, Merlyn’s scum this game.

[Flavor Leaf]

They’re rolling scum a lot lately

[Flavor Leaf]

UNVOTE: Aureal

Let’s think for a bit.

@CSF - who you thinking for the day?

[Flavor Leaf]

I don’t mind being tortured, idk what Merlyn’s talking about there.

[Flavor Leaf]

i mean, if you have to put me with a scumteam, there's nothing *wrong* with saying it's merlyn and marcistar and aureal or whatever. like from an outside perspective it would be possible for me to be scum with any of these people. i don't think there's much gained taking this kind of approach though and not sure what you're seeing if town, regarding how it helps sorting

like, all of your interactions with aureal in particular with me are confusing. marci i can kind of get? ironically, there

could

actually be a parallel with the drew situation, in that i think it's possible you wanted that miselimination available because it's easy to make a 'logical' case there and you wouldn't likely get much flak from it, but i also think it's possible for town you to just feel that way. like, i have miseliminated marcistar more than once.

but aureal? you're 'pushing' there and voting for her but you haven't like really given anything, except she doesn't want you to be tortured, but you also said that about marci and most of your talking about her is just like, 'oh she could be scum with meow'. like, you've done the mechanical disagreement reads a lot on d2 which i don't vibe with and i don't really get what this approach to aureal does?

I’ve already said my entire purpose right now was to figure your slot out.

Everything I’ve done was completely by design, including the nothing on Aureal.

Do I have reasons, yes, but I’m more interested in what happened to gamestate after

[Flavor Leaf]

Devil flips town, Torture town clears me, we probably always go Meowmeow after that situation.

[meowmeow]

i mean, if you have to put me with a scumteam, there's nothing *wrong* with saying it's merlyn and marcistar and aureal or whatever. like from an outside perspective it would be possible for me to be scum with any of these people. i don't think there's much gained taking this kind of approach though and not sure what you're seeing if town, regarding how it helps sorting

like, all of your interactions with aureal in particular with me are confusing. marci i can kind of get? ironically, there

could

actually be a parallel with the drew situation, in that i think it's possible you wanted that miselimination available because it's easy to make a 'logical' case there and you wouldn't likely get much flak from it, but i also think it's possible for town you to just feel that way. like, i have miseliminated marcistar more than once.

but aureal? you're 'pushing' there and voting for her but you haven't like really given anything, except she doesn't want you to be tortured, but you also said that about marci and most of your talking about her is just like, 'oh she could be scum with meow'. like, you've done the mechanical disagreement reads a lot on d2 which i don't vibe with and i don't really get what this approach to aureal does?

I’ve already said my entire purpose right now was to figure your slot out.

Everything I’ve done was completely by design, including the nothing on Aureal.

Do I have reasons, yes, but I’m more interested in what happened to gamestate after

ok well, i don't really see how exactly that solves my slot

do i know devil is scum? obviously not. i have reasons to suspect they're scum, as i've gone over already, but i don't think i'm confident in anyone's alignment right now. a massive proportion of the playerlist is just like, 'i don't know who's scum' which is just like, yeah i don't know who is scum either. we kind of have to guess? and i feel like there's practically zero movement going on right now. if you're not presenting aureal as a serious alternative, and obviously hate the devil wagon, i mean where do you expect the gamestate to go? it probably keeps going nowhere until we lim devil if they're town or we flop onto some other random slot if devil is scum.

so i mean, what am i to do? i would like other people to push wagons and create a gamestate where i can like read people more effectively but this doesn't seem likely to happen!

[Merlyn]

I don't trust FL and I'm scumleaning him.

then are you willing to torture FL?

I refer you to my torture vote for the answer to this

[Merlyn]

I don’t mind being tortured, idk what Merlyn’s talking about there.

I don't know what you're referring to here

[meowmeow]

ok whatever let's experiment

VOTE: sircakez

[meowmeow]

actually, since flavor leaf has appointed me as being responsible for the entire gamestate, i think that makes me the mayor of this town

therefore i have the authority to become a leader and make demands for the good of utopia, revealing the identities of the most vile insurgents who seek to ruin our perfect society where we have witch hunts and are totally the good guys and the flavour is about how good we are

i demand everyone give an ordered reads list. everyone. anyone who doesn't do it, uh... well i still want to torture flavour leaf today but we'll sacrifice you on day 3 or something so look forward to that. also i'm super nice and a cat so if you don't do it that's just a little bit rude actually. flavour leaf can be exempt from this because he gives a read list every 5 seconds without prompting.

here is mine;
hu tao, merlyn, snivy

Marcistar!!!!

cat scratch fever, rcenigma
aureal, enchant, flavour leaf, sircakez
devil drew

[meowmeow]

oh, btw, someone will need to clue me in on why this is apparently enchant's town meta

if anything i'm feeling the opposite

[meowmeow]

wow, i proclaimed myself as mayor and now everyone is giving me the silent treatment

anyway @aureal, sorry to ask you three things at once, but i noticed you were calling me 'she' earlier. i don't think we're that familiar with each other, but if you were like, scum with marci (or maybe someone else? i think marci would be the most likely to realise who i am) i imagine you would have been able to find out about who i am pretty quickly. but that's reachy, so; is there like a reason you opted for that? i realise it might seem like a trivial point, and like maybe it is lmao, but it stood out to me since i don't think anyone else was doing that

[Deal With The Devil]

oh, btw, someone will need to clue me in on why this is apparently enchant's town meta

if anything i'm feeling the opposite

In my experience, solvy Enchant is the town tell.....not seeing too much trolling so far. Not a strong read at the moment tbh.

Also I chuckle how you spell Flavor(minus the u) Leafs name......reminds of Datisi posting about New London to annoy you lol.

Also I will consult with Alianna before posting reads, I will bend the knee to the temporary mayor haha.

We are mainly on the same page, I will say that she town reads you way more than I do fwiw......just a little spoiler

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