Mini 2331 - Touhou UPick: Anonymous Edition (Game Over)

[Tenshi Hinanawi]

Where did you deny it?

[Yuuka Kazami]

That was a joke, not a reaction test. Hence why I never brought it up again.
I don’t do day vigs for reaction tests for similar reasons as to why I don’t do cop guilties.

It sucks up a whole lot of air.

…does a YouTube video link look like busy work to you? /:
It took me around a minute to do that and I can fake busy work.

[Clownpiece]

That hyperposters are getting the occasional side-eye doesn't actually matter when the only wagons with more than one vote this game have been "bottom half of the activity count + Kagerou"

This is only a problem is zero of the scum are in the bottom half of activity count. Which is not something that I am actually worried about on Day 1 of a mafia game.

After sleeping on it I'm not a big fan of the goalpost shifting of "The hyperposter townreading isn't happening ok well actually it is but it isn't a problem"

I said that I don't think that the hyper posters are getting town binned in a harmful way to the game state.

You countered that they still are not getting wagoned.

I further said that that is not a problem in my eyes.

If you misunderstood my first point to be that hyperposters were in danger of miselimination, that is a misread of my original post - not a goal post being moved in my second.

[Tenshi Hinanawi]

Hm. I’m going to take some time to mull this all over. I don’t know if it’s damning as Koishi is making it out to be but I also didn’t realize you’d reacted to it either.

More on this later, have to be productive.

[Clownpiece]

At this point I feel like the thing that I am most interested in are the rest of koishi's cases, which means I'm just twiddling my thumbs for now.

[Koishi Komeiji]

It's going to be a while, so probably spend your time doing other game-advancing things?

[Clownpiece]

It's going to be a while, so probably spend your time doing other game-advancing things?

Here is the thing.

I have largely done the amount of active sorting that I know how to do for day 1.

And my overall impression of the game thread is that the thread direction is slowly shifting towards my desired elim (this requires consulting the stars, not a vote count)

I kind of feel like my desired elim has basically no chance that it is gonna change until said desired elim comes back and makes a lot of content, or someone discovers something that I missed, or I guess someone comes and puts their foot in the mouth (but given the playe so far, that seems unlikely?)

So the thumbs, they be a twiddling.

[Sanae Kochiya]

That's sort of where I'm at tbh
I want to get better reads on the part of the PL that I don't have great reads on (Reisen, Dai, Aya, Koishi) but I'm not expecting anything else to drastically change

[Tenshi Hinanawi]

VOTE: Ichirin

I’m tired of waiting for the catchup

[Sanae Kochiya]

I can add Ichirin to that list too
I feel like I had a townread on them 500 posts ago but can't remember why

[Clownpiece]

VOTE: Ichirin

I’m tired of waiting for the catchup

As the stars foretold

[Daiyousei]

if people are bored and looking for something to do they can have a glance over my handful of posts starting here and agree or disagree with them before koishi gets to them so that if your opinions align with her you get to look cool because you had those thoughts first

i even used capital letters and ended sentences with periods and everything! @_@

alternatively piece can use her torch on unsuspecting half-ghosts, that's always good for a laugh

[Daiyousei]

VOTE: Ichirin

I’m tired of waiting for the catchup

assuming ichirin eventually catches up and responds will you take credit for it while pointing at this vote

[Tenshi Hinanawi]

Duh.

[Daiyousei]

my my my, how the turntables !_!

[Ichirin Kumoi]

Spoiler: Divine Fist "GIANT FUCKING WALL"

Im reserving my vote for when I feel confident on something, whether it is my POE or a scumread. I’m trying to take more of a voyeur approach this game which is probably part of why I’ve been stuck on my own island, but I also feel the desire for some more data to analyze.

I referenced Dai up there, but I can give Dai and Kaguya a look over when I get home tonight.

My gut feels bad about "I also feel the desire for some more data to analyze." because I feel like there were already plenty of things to analyze...? Meh.

Clown can you say some words to me about Kaguya?

i really liked her posts about Marisa. there is a lot of merit to the charisma argument that made me reevaluate Marisa myself

it would be a weird choice for scum in Kaguya's position, who is likely seeing the writing on the wall that she is in the PoE pool, to just throw out a Marisa vote and barely even substantiate or push it? i expect calculated scum to target a potential town bloc player to make a splash or go against the grain in a way that will garner town reads on them and help them escape the elimination pool. Kaguya's stance on Marisa does not feel manipulative in that way and does not further an agenda whatsoever, it keeps her more removed from the "in-crowd" and she doesn't really seem to care

in fact a lot of her scum reads seem to center around the consensus town-read players (Yuuka, Sanae, Marisa) which is a strange strategy as scum when it's likely these players will be influential in deciding the ultimate elimination today

i guess she is also scum reading Reisen who would fit the bill as a viable elimination alternative to herself but i have a soft spot for other players scum-reading Reisen...

I really like this, it's pointing me in the right direction for Kaguya because I'm realizing I kinda like Kaguya's reads (on a towniness level not a "I wanna vote that" level), but that might be because we share some ideas. Also yeah. My heart of hearts still thinks blurting out "I'm town" at 2 votes is an eyebrow-raiser but I don't think that's really relevant now.

I'm trying not to, but off-the-cuff I don't actually think you have a lot of content?
I admit that I'd have to re-read your ISO to confirm that but a lot of what I remember you posting is vibes

I remember Koishi's whole dance bit with Kagerou, which I'm probably stealing in the future lol, but off the top of my head I don't really remember Koishi generating new content otherwise, and even after checking ISO I don't really see anything truly noteworthy by this point? But also Koishi keeps stressing their playstyle and how it pertains to that. I'm withholding proper judgement for now until I go back and specifically evaluate Koishi's 1164 and similar, however, maybe after she completes the set.

Re: Yuuka, is someone shading someone by talking nonsense townie now somehow?

Here is the only post about Yuuka you made before the vote

The assaulted one is the post you’re looking for in exhibit A for” this can’t possibly be real/serious”

They never said it was a joke.
So, I’m not taking it as one.

Horrendous take

You have twisted my position into saying that those post are townie, when in fact I think that it is a Yuuka-ism in a way that is entirely divorced from alignment

I found it a little hard to swallow that you think that Yuuka taking Ichirin's post seriously, and not as a joke, is something that would be based on Yuuka's alignment.

Seeing someone point out something that is "bad" or "wrong" and then voting on it, without drawing the line on why being "bad" or "wrong" in that way is more likely to come from scum instead of town pings me.

Nonsense takes tend to come from scum, it being a Yuukaism is completely irrelevant because I don't know who Yuuka is and don't have a past pattern of behaviour for her. This is also the reason why the scumread got softened after I found out it was a Yuukaism (because those parts no longer applied to the read), why are you ignoring that?

Ding ding ding. It being a "Yuukaism" is wholly irrelevant when it seems pretty clear that she's trying to evaluate a read on me out of it, nonsense or no. In general, I don't like Yuuka just completely ignoring my slot now after 970 but I suppose I did all but tell her to stop riding my dick and I haven't exactly been around until now. Didn't stop her from dredging up old posts before, though.

wow! this is by far the worst post i've seen all game! @_@ it contributes nothing to the hunting process and is obviously designed just to kick a clearly hurting player while they're down

in an iso vacuum i'm still not thrilled with aya's body of work but this post and sanae co-signing it in 598 makes me want absolutely nothing to do with voting aya for the foreseeable future and everything to do with exterminating the kagerou/sanae mafpair asap

I really hate this, I feel like it is trying to exacerbate the situation when I frankly raised an eyebrow at the same quote as Kagerou?

That said, this looks like a really weird way to talk about me when you have much wordier qualifiers on the rest of the people you were asked about? It's not like I haven't been majorly present since your last block of reads, I suspect I'm going to be showing up on this week's episode of Hyperposters Least Wanted, starting John Walsh.

you're in a unique position where i was very much not a fan of your predecessor, but was also starting to rethink that stance because i wasn't sure if it was because she was mafia or because her foundational ideas for how to play differed strongly with mine

and then the replacement happened, which means that i still feel how i felt about the slot prior to the replacement but my concerns may no longer apply going forward

so i couldn't just drop you in either the "interested in voting" bin or the "not interested in voting" bin with any sort of confidence, hence the couched wording

I'm not sure I like how cognizant they are of their own trajectory, however I know that I can be a bit susceptible to this too? But referencing their own posts here felt kinda weird

I can see why there are votes on this slot, although admittedly part of me wonders if there is a disconnect with players struggling with the length of Dai's posting?

Have to disagree here on both counts. I'm not particularly invested in a Dai townread but I do think that Kagerou's post was a little gross in addition to getting what Aya was saying wrong, and while this is an anon game and this means jackshit, I have self-referenced quite a bit in the past and I generally do not believe it's a very inherently alignment-indicative thing to do.

My bias to town read active players is a massive issue this game if there's at least one, but definitely if there's two, high-energy scum.

I’m thinking Koishi is town plus the list from the top of the page, which I am now repurposing for my own needs.

I also want to townread this even though it's probably really easy to post as scum, because it's so easy scum probably won't do it. Or something...

I think this is a fallacy of some sort.

Town:
Yuuka - Playing way too aggressive for scum, actively antagonizing others makes it very easy for others to want to murderlate you
Kagerou - 2chaotic2bescum

I think this is a fallacy of some sort. In general I think regularly flushing your brain of the idea that scum only play as conniving tricksters or whatever is good for you because scum playstyles can vary comically and they will especially love it if you hand them a townread for it. Rest of the readlist is like, fine, ig.

2) what makes a tenshi vote more interesting than a vote for me? maybe this is the self-loathing from generations of fairy hatred kicking in but i see myself as more likely to get exterminated than tenshi at this point in the game, so i don't understand why you'd vote tenshi ahead of me while thinking i'm more likely to be mafia

2) I'm more interested in seeing people's stances on Tenshi than you, i feel like the general avoidance around this slot could come from a place of more well inserted scumbuddies uneasy with the idea of drawing the light to their weak like

2) assuming your interest in seeing people's stances on tenshi is honest, what effort did you make to draw those stances out between the tenshi vote and the post i am responding to with this question? (this actually ties pretty neatly into what yuuka and piece have been saying about you lately)

still waiting for an answer to this btw ?_?

(ed. note: nested quotes are cleaned up for ease-of-reading purposes)

sorry missed it

- well, i maybe didn't get as much as i hoped directly at the, but i also feel like i've managed to prevent tenshi from just being able to fly under the radar undetected, and it's just that people don't really care about pushing there

actually hmmm

one thing i find weird is how Marisa didn't include Tenshi in her vote pool

VOTE: Tenshi

yeah ik it's dumb counting the vote as that by itself, but it's true

I've lost the plot completely here too.

Just gonna step away and come back with fresh brain.

before you leave give me gun to head a read on Tenshi

save a townie, join the Tenshi wagon

So, a couple of things with this:

1) Posts 717 and 745 come after the time frame I was asking about. I was specifically asking about the time frame between the vote for Tenshi, in 553, and the claim that the vote for Tenshi was cast because you "were more interested in seeing people's stances on Tenshi than [me]", in 655. Presumably, if you were town and telling the truth about this, you would have made efforts to draw out people's stances between 553 and 665. I looked back and did not see any. Given you didn't quote any, I'm assuming you didn't see any either. Therefore, I have to conclude that the reason you gave for the vote is bunk, and because town has no reason to give bunk reasons for their votes, you are Mafia.

2) Posts 717 and 745 don't really give any reason to consider Tenshi voteworthy. In fact, Sanae's question in 719 is the only real response one can to 717, because you hadn't given any reason for anyone else to consider voting for Tenshi up to that point. Your response in 723 exists, sure, but even setting aside that the reasoning there appears to amount to "vibes", there was no reason town you couldn't have provided that reasoning 150 posts prior. This instead comes across as making something up after the fact, which suggests Mafia.

holy shit shes cooking. Big huge agree here.

Please forgive my breaking of character, I'm tired.

VOTE: Daiyousei

The entire line of questioning in 889 is really bad. Why does Daiyousei care about the fact that my scumread of Kaguya can be applied to other people? I'm explicitly fine with voting the other people. Why does Daiyousei care that I said I don't understand how anyone could have a townread on Kaguya? Even if only Kagerou was townreading Kaguya, nobody else was voting her. I didn't understand why nobody was interested in a Kaguya vote and said so. None of this is actually relevant to my alignment in any way and none of this even gives a reason not to vote Kaguya. It just feels like a discredit attempt, or at best an attempt to look like Daiyousei is questioning and investigative (and therefore towny).

Why does Daiyousei care about the fact that my scumread of Kaguya can be applied to other people?

- Because the line I asked about

didn't

apply to Kaguya. Here, I'll ask directly - how does "Anything that looks town indicative can be faked with a bit of practice" apply to someone about whom you just said ""none of her posts are town indicative"? If you can answer that question to my satisfaction then I'll feel better about you using it as justification for the Kaguya vote.

Why does Daiyousei care that I said I don't understand how anyone could have a townread on Kaguya? Even if only Kagerou was townreading Kaguya, nobody else was voting her. I didn't understand why nobody was interested in a Kaguya vote and said so.

- "I don't understand how anyone can have a strong townread on her!" is

not

the same thing as "I don't understand why nobody is interested in a Kaguya vote". Do not try to equate these two things. If you can give me evidence that a non-trivial collection of people that actually had a strong townread of Kaguya at the time, then I'll gladly (and sheepishly) withdraw the point. But don't give me evidence that a non-trivial collection of people weren't interested in a Kaguya vote and try to present that as them having strong townreads on Kaguya. Speaking for myself, there are a handful of people I presently am not interested in voting but also do not have strong townreads on, and I imagine the same is true of most of the rest of the game.

How this is all relevant to your alignment is related to the "town has no reason to give bunk reasons for their votes" thing I covered above. I was skeptical of your vote, and your response to my questioning about it made me more skeptical, ergo I lean toward you being Mafia.

I also mentioned that her cases on both Aya and Kagerou were fake, and I stand by that.

Aya breaking character happened after Daiyousei's bad case on Aya and therefore has no relevance to whether or not the case was good.

I already covered this in 891, but I suppose I can expand on the Aya stuff specifically.

My comments on Aya were made in 392. Aya had made nine posts up to that point. Here's the first so that anyone that wants to follow along can click the ISO link. In those nine posts, there is a partial role claim in 229 and a general Mafia behavior opinion in 255. Beyond that, I do not see any game state opinions in any of those posts - who she thinks is town, who she thinks is Mafia, reasons for those beliefs, etc. Given this, I do not think it is particularly unfair to have categorized her play up to that point as "do-nothing" or "pretending to contribute". If there are game state opinions in those posts that I have missed, please do point them out for me! Otherwise I will stand by what I said in 392 and find it very suspect that you continue to disagree.

Also, as long as I'm talking about this, given you very recently settled on Yuuka being town, what do you think of her vote for and commentary on Aya from that same general time frame compared to my commentary?

i take back what i said about not being invested in a daiyousei townread this little big fairy can BALL

Leaving things at like page 49 because I need to take a walk, but I think this is pretty much everything I'd wanna say anyway. VOTE: Kagerou

[Ichirin Kumoi]

I feel the best about the fairies (yes even clownpiss as much as she wants to kill me) and I need Kagerou or perhaps Koishi in a bodybag (but again we'll see on Koishi).

[Tenshi Hinanawi]

I take all credit for this catch-up, it is clearly due to pressure of my naked vote.

[Daiyousei]

king crimson: it just works

[Daiyousei]

to be actually serious though i am glad that at least one (1) person read my posts and understood them and agreed with them and i hope the trend continues

at a glance i find myself generally nodding along with the rest of the post

my gth gut admittedly still leans tenshi town atm but i'd probably have to go back and review why if asked to explain it

[Daiyousei]

my brain just reminded me that my general feeling on tenshi for most of the game has been "me but looser" so that's probably what it is

[Clownpiece]

I have read Ichirin's Divine Fist "GIANT FUCKING WALL" twice now, and I think that the most town indicative part of it is the fact that she put it in spoiler tags.

However, I am underwhelmed by the actual content.

[Aya Shameimaru]

I take all credit for this catch-up, it is clearly due to pressure of my naked vote.

Ayaya

[Aya Shameimaru]

This reporter phoning in from her mental health retreat with a huge scoop! Digital Media is the way of the future, and by digital media I mean using the Wind God's blessings to send pamphlets to everyone. Youkai's Witness, or something to that effect.

[Tenshi Hinanawi]

to be actually serious though i am glad that at least one (1) person read my posts and understood them and agreed with them and i hope the trend continues

at a glance i find myself generally nodding along with the rest of the post

my gth gut admittedly still leans tenshi town atm but i'd probably have to go back and review why if asked to explain it

I did actually reread it, I’m pondering it