Open 905: Pick Your Power X/Y S/S [game over!]

[the worst]

It is not being helpful. It gets frustrated too easily and it needs to go.

VOTE: Oblivion

nvm he engaged

I had a dream last night where we limmed Pav and he flipped scum woah

[the worst]

Pavowski [3]: Brian Skies, gob, Jake The Wolfie

Bad wagon

How so?

not townreading anyone on it

what's ur read on Jake I think Jake is super towny

[the worst]

what do you make of no one trying to help you, NaS

Probably no one really knows what is going on.

And in your opinion, telling you to read the game or it will vote you for attempting to dodge having opinions or reads is not trying to solve?

Is that the hill you are seeking to die on? That your laziness is somehow something that any town player would leap to assist you with? So then what of those players who have ignored you?

Those who has ignored me has a plausible deniability that they could've simply missed the post. You saw my post and chose not to be helpful at all but told me to figure it out all by myself. Preposterous.

Just comment on what's happening right now / when you're in thread please. Your vote on oblivion read like a shitpost but it was 10 times more useful than continuously complaining.

[the worst]

I want to townread Brian for getting angry at me but it was one of those things scum could get angry about. :/

Mafia is a cursed game I wish everyone was town

Maybe I wish I was always scum and everyone else played town and I could believe there's good in everybody's heart like Felicia Day in Dr Horrible Sing-along blog

I honestly really feel this

[the worst]

"I do find it interesting that he came to the same scumreads I did initially and then lumped me in with those scumreads. What does that say about him? I don't know."

How does town ever write this

Just run around shouting that things are salient in an indeterminate way

It's still more preflip assoc

hmm I think it's indicative of an introspective style of viewing the game moreso than a "this is always scum" kinda post

I don't really think it's from town but I think this is a little too confident. or overconfident. I can't remember.

[the worst]

Just bus him worst you're the one with the vig shot

I'm trying but I have to build up a plausible mixed read so that when I inevitably dramatically turn on him, cinching his elimination at the 11th hour, I am regarded as a town hero

[the worst]

That only works if I'm scum.

that was the joke

[the worst]

Pavowski [3]: Brian Skies, gob, Jake The Wolfie

Bad wagon

You think Pavlovski is town?

I think all of the people pushing it are in my to be sorted folder. So its a bad wagon.

So you don't have any opinions on Pavlovski?

What are your thoughts on Pavlovski?

Easiest person to push here.

Outside of NotAScum
Though I think NotAScum has decent odds of actually flipping scum regardless of that where as Pavloski im like meh on overall. Could be scum or town, more null and think scum will see that as easier mislim if town. If u got a strong scum case or town case im ears

? i feel like pav gets increasingly untownreadable the more we push him lol

[the worst]

few of my reads are like, superbly confident, but if i had a bullet i'd shoot pav and i know that's flushing a good draft placer.

[the worst]

The universe conspires against me. Got corrupted disk and can't boot to os. Backup hard drive is gonezo too. Gonna be a mobile gamer for a while

i'm 90% mobile poster these days, may i recommend caffeine

[the worst]

i'm not like regular mods i'm a cool mod

[the worst]

I did say I'm going long on the pp stonks. Which is to say I'm hard townreading him

I townread pp. Why do you hard townread pp?

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that's how cool i am.

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pagetop best bird etc.

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georgebailey

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am i saying that because he posted in the scum pt? am i saying it because georgebailey?

only time will georgebailey

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I'm rly high right now (on a plane). If anyone entertains me they can join my new cool towncore before I'm inevitably martyr'd on night one.

[the worst]

okay Jake what's fun? who should we sort?

I'm in this whimsical mood where I think yessiree might be scummier than NAS.

[the worst]

vote count 1.13

with 14 votes in play, it takes 8 to make a decision. day 1 ends in (expired on 2024-03-09 21:00:00).

yeet

NotAScum [3]:

davesaz, Jake The Wolfie, Brian Skies

yessiree [2]:

Pavowski, PenguinPower

gob [2]:

Firebringer, the worst

Brian Skies [2]:

Dannflor, May

Oblivion [1]:

NotAScum

May [1]:

gob

not voting [3]:

June, Oblivion, yessiree

I feel like yessiree is using his vote in the least towny way possible at any time and I wonder if it's a personality trait. I don't recall yessiree being a tryhard or anything but I don't remember him being like... fake...

I don't really think I believed his Brian read, the fact he didn't care to vote his scumreads felt bad, he's still not voting despite-- wait

[the worst]

@NotAScum

If you want to get a quick recap of the game, rather than reading a thousand posts you could ISO one of the high posters and only need to read 100 or so and still get a feel for what's happened.

While I'm personally not willing to tell you all of the major hits that happened in the game, if you have any specific questions about those events I would be able to assist with those. If you can show that you have some dedication to this game and are willing to put in some effort, I'll be willing to reciprocate.

i started with your iso and looks like most are shitposting. I also shitposted, but to a much lesser quantity. I think I've just caught upto this game

-- I lied, he did vote NAS after this post which is like, blegh idk. I think I'm increasingly feeling like wagoning NAS is just not doing anything and we're better off just deciding whether or not this is a policy lim conversation.

yessiree is actually just not doing anything to solve at all who is it who said that

[the worst]

I cant rememeber anything from yessiree at all. they are just a blur to me.

lets sort Fire or perhaps May. I have some ideas that I haven't combed through and detangled yet.

I'd be excited for that, I think Fire is the next person I'd like to feel a bit more confident about

Untangle a little for me? I'll help once I've got a thread

[the worst]

I think yessiree is also vibing in a way that's like, interested in fitting in, but I haven't really felt any authenticity or any attempt to advance the game from him either

I love vibin, vibin is my jam, just depends on the nature of the vibin

[the worst]

VOTE: Oblivion

Run this up folks

how often does this work for u btw

I think that this post sounds towny, but feels like it's scummy.
I'd like to think that this is just Fire mocking Gob, but it could be an underhanded attempt at cutting off a push early for various reasons.

That's something worth talking about with firebringer, always. He's very capable of audacity as mafia. He's also naturally audacious, so he can be a lil tricky to pin down.

If this was a marathon game, I'd be much more wary of firebringer for a couple of reasons:
- I think his reads are fairly static (they're moving, but they're moving slowly for someone who's so present).
- he has uh, semi regularly ig, made comments which undermine the credibility of people presenting views he considers weird.

Thing is it's such a long game, and he's gotta live with that post being in his ISO for a long time. If he's scum with oblivion, I don't think he benefits from drawing that much attention especially from someone like gob who is very loud and audacious. A fire+oblivion team would be really cosy, honestly I'd guess even as early as that post.

Maybe that post actually makes the most sense either if Firebringer is town, or if Firebringer is specifically scum with Gob which is a kinda fun but very weird thought

I think my point is that I think Firebringer is a contrarian, so I'm not sure if him shooting down ideas he doesn't connect is something that's indicative of his scumgame

[the worst]

Based on the few limited games I've played, D1 lims are mostly mislims. Not surprisingly at all since there's nothing solid backing the lim up, usually something acts a little odd or make somewhat suspicious comment and everyone just jumps on it without even questioning it.

It's usually whoever vibes the least with the rest of the playerlist, to be honest (if sceptical).

I think the more players we can get to vibe, the harder it becomes to find an easy elimination to put through. The harder it becomes to find an easy elimination to put through, the more dirt we have to sift through, the higher the chance we find gems.

Is there a particular reason you're not clicking with this game so far?

[the worst]

VOTE: Oblivion

Run this up folks

how often does this work for u btw

I think that this post sounds towny, but feels like it's scummy.
I'd like to think that this is just Fire mocking Gob, but it could be an underhanded attempt at cutting off a push early for various reasons.

That's something worth talking about with firebringer, always. He's very capable of audacity as mafia. He's also naturally audacious, so he can be a lil tricky to pin down.

If this was a marathon game, I'd be much more wary of firebringer for a couple of reasons:
- I think his reads are fairly static (they're moving, but they're moving slowly for someone who's so present).
- he has uh, semi regularly ig, made comments which undermine the credibility of people presenting views he considers weird.

Thing is it's such a long game, and he's gotta live with that post being in his ISO for a long time. If he's scum with oblivion, I don't think he benefits from drawing that much attention especially from someone like gob who is very loud and audacious. A fire+oblivion team would be really cosy, honestly I'd guess even as early as that post.

Maybe that post actually makes the most sense either if Firebringer is town, or if Firebringer is specifically scum with Gob which is a kinda fun but very weird thought

I think my point is that I think Firebringer is a contrarian, so I'm not sure if him shooting down ideas he doesn't connect is something that's indicative of his scumgame

Personally, I see town!Obliv, so I had an idea: What if Fire was defending It here in an attempt to help pocket It later?

That's not outlandish for sure. Agreeing with consensus reads and slapping down people who oppose them is a good way to sneak into the towncore (I won't start that convo again I promise).

Thing is, I'd need to already assume Firebringer is scum to view the post that way. I think this kind of thing is equally likely for his kind of personality as either alignment.

[the worst]

There's also Fire's campaign against

Ducklan

you that my brain just glossed over. I'm not even sure why he thought you were scummy.

I think he's used to the way I played several years ago, where I was a lot more bubbly and flamboyant. I was also a lot harder to read accurately back then and tweaked my style in very small weird ways between games so idk.

I was sick at the start of this game so my tone was quite flat. I wasn't all that engaging and I wasn't reacting to as many things, or as probingly, as I usually would have.

His scumread on me makes sense. I think the early wagon on me was like, cute and probably felt superficially worthwhile since I wasn't really ~here~. I'm also keen to hear his update on it because I think I'm a lot more lucid and interactive now.


One thing I do like about Firebringer - his read on me isn't changing. He doubled down early and he's solving around me, but he isn't going to give me an easy time. A lot of other people with lukewarm early scumreads on me feel like they've come around. He doesn't. I don't think mafia-Duckland is a popular take anymore.

[the worst]

But also when I mentioned his reads being a bit glacial, his lack of nuance on his read on me was what I meant.

[the worst]

VOTE: Oblivion

Run this up folks

how often does this work for u btw

I think that this post sounds towny, but feels like it's scummy.
I'd like to think that this is just Fire mocking Gob, but it could be an underhanded attempt at cutting off a push early for various reasons.

I know you're working on sorting fire over there (ostensibly) but this post seems like such a strange one to focus in on, when you have the breadth of Fire's (massive, and there's still plenty of d1 ahead) iso to choose from.

"Sounds towny but feels scummy" - is such weird shade, too, I mean what does that even mean?

This post is setting off alarm bells

I know you're working on sorting jake over there (ostensibly) but this post seems like such a strange one to focus in on, when you have the breadth of Jake's (massive, and there's still plenty of d1 ahead) iso to choose from.

"ostensihly" - is such weird shade, too, I mean what does that even mean? like really it's a big word

This post is setting off alarm bells

[the worst]

jokes aside that tangent made me townread Jake MORE

[the worst]

no because it was weird!! it was so random and bizarre and I saw Jake cite that post and l was like "howmst" but then Jake explained and I 100% buy that he's been uncomfortable watching Firebringer leading the game along the way he has because of some earlier-game gripes with the way Firebringer handled a few reads.

I don't think it's a way to read Firebringer that's likely to get his alignment right, and I'm hoping Jake jams with me a bit more when we're both around about that.

But I think it's a genuine thought and it makes me think Jake had a secret scumread on Firebringer. Secret scumreads on Firebringer aren't popular. I love that Jake is proud to rip the tablecloth off a spicy read like that even if I don't agree with the read.

It's so idiosyncratic I absolutely believe it's real.



Why are you voting Jake other than the fact he has a acumread which you think is a bad look? I know this is a leading question I'm calling u out

[the worst]

allegedly

suspected it, welcome again <3

[the worst]

Have you read anything?

not really being sick

= minimal care

appreciate the confession
VOTE: ydrasse

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Worsts jam w Jake was kinda scummy

it felt unproductive but I didn't get scummy vibes it was just a bit like... I was hoping there'd be like 5 people around I wasn't in the mood to do work but I was here

scummy is a roughly fine way to view it

[the worst]

Pav and duck are both scummy for giving lip service to my sentiments about Brian Skies but not moving forward with me to the part where we pull a Kylo Ren on Brian

I honestly, to this day, have no strong feelings about brian skies

[the worst]

Virtue signal

idrc about the push just sharing the love

sorry

[the worst]

It was designed to make davesaz town read it, for one

The Firebringer analysis was fine. Maybe even on the hard to fabricate side of 50/50. The declaration that Jake is towny felt like walking into chucke cheese and offering 500$ cash for the middle shelf stuffed and then showing up to elementary school yo tell everyone you're really skilled at arcade games. Jake didn't say much that proves his alignment and was already widely townread going into the interaction. The idea he's more towny for secretly scum reading Firebringer than he is for popping in with mildly insightful takes every 8 hours for the last 108 hours or whatever is absurd and self-aggrandizing

i don't think his firebringer take is townier than the rest of his content no. just that it is yet another thing i townread from Jake which makes me baffled that Pav saw that and was like "this is scum" like its an unpopular read and it was not coded in a modern MS player fashion but I very much struggled to find that post scummy.

[the worst]

local woman suspected of being alt that links to her main in the signature

hmmm

I've never claimed to be particularly bright

VOTE: Pavowski back on this one

[the worst]

Worsts jam w Jake was kinda scummy

it felt unproductive but I didn't get scummy vibes it was just a bit like... I was hoping there'd be like 5 people around I wasn't in the mood to do work but I was here

scummy is a roughly fine way to view it

I'm sorry Ducklan, I was a little too high for a convo at that time.

nothing to be sorry for

[the worst]

local woman suspected of being alt that links to her main in the signature

hmmm

I've never claimed to be particularly bright

VOTE: Pavowski back on this one

why don't you like any of the current wagons?

I like most of the current wagon I'm making a STATEMENT

[the worst]

local woman suspected of being alt that links to her main in the signature

hmmm

I've never claimed to be particularly bright

VOTE: Pavowski back on this one

why don't you like any of the current wagons?

I like most of the current wagon I'm making a STATEMENT

So you like both of the current wagons...

Which one do you like more?

*scrolls down*

brian skies,,

[the worst]

Dear god this wagon comp. I don’t want to be on gob because notascum is in there. I don’t want to be on Brian because gob is on here. I don’t want to be on notascum because Brian is in there.

Alright second best bird. You choose, I’ll follow (or stay).

prefer brian to NAS rn, like unironically

[the worst]

that's how cool i am.

well caffeine is an ethical substance so hold ur horses

I feel like yessiree is using his vote in the least towny way possible at any time and I wonder if it's a personality trait. I don't recall yessiree being a tryhard or anything but I don't remember him being like... fake...

What makes u think I'm being fake?

And i agree with this assessment. i don't think yessiree is actually interested in playing the game, moreso just vibin' and having a good time. I think it's suspicious.

I'm not having a good time. There are too many content police around.

a notable absence of anything from u that feels individualistic

[the worst]

Geriatrics gonna complain about posts.
Tryhards gonna complain about shit posts.
Mafiascum gonna complain about not enough quality content.

Just do you.

i dislike the way you categorise players by their broad playstyle category & disdain for posts which are significantly different from their style

[the worst]

does NaS really feel like the slot with the highest percent chance of flipping scum

eh somewhere between NAS/yessiree/pavowski

[the worst]

does NaS really feel like the slot with the highest percent chance of flipping scum

yes

this game def has the feeling that scum are lurking and not leading in it

that might be true but im not sure why that makes NaS a better shot at scum over like brian or yessirree or pavowski who are all lurky or low-impact but have also posted discernibly more alignment indicative content

ok i promise this isn't a bit

[the worst]

Idk what this means

i just want you to say stuff that you find interesting or noteworthy about this game

all ur takes feel really undercooked or, even worse, very popular

[the worst]

VOTE: Oblivion

Run this up folks

how often does this work for u btw

I think that this post sounds towny, but feels like it's scummy.
I'd like to think that this is just Fire mocking Gob, but it could be an underhanded attempt at cutting off a push early for various reasons.

I know you're working on sorting fire over there (ostensibly) but this post seems like such a strange one to focus in on, when you have the breadth of Fire's (massive, and there's still plenty of d1 ahead) iso to choose from.

"Sounds towny but feels scummy" - is such weird shade, too, I mean what does that even mean?

This post is setting off alarm bells

This post ironically is setting of my alarm bells

i'm so sad you posted this but didn't react to my funny response saying the same thing.

[the worst]

i'm so sad you posted this but didn't react to my funny response saying the same thing.

well urs was a joke, i am serious.
I did find it amusing u commented the same thing as me when i went back after making the post.

mine wasn't a joke i was being funny while being earnest. i actually rarely joke if it's counter to my opinion.

i am glad you posted the thing about not giving me a fair shake

[the worst]

Idk what this means

i just want you to say stuff that you find interesting or noteworthy about this game

all ur takes feel really undercooked or, even worse, very popular

I am interested in you

you have made me blush but have not fixed my read on you.

what about me interests you?

[the worst]

Infact, if it had to identify who among the people pushing for Brian are scum, it would say Gob and Dave are at the top of its list, followed by maybe Penguin. It thinks you and FB are town.

It still doesn't know what to think of Yessirree if it's being honest. It feels totally confused by how they approach the game.

i have not considered may's push on brian as scummy for a moment

maybe i'm actually just sheeping dannflor and lost interest in my may scumread

[the worst]

Dave rested on Brian for a time, and is now on NAS. Perhaps... it should consider that a sign not to do NAS?

It isn't sure even it's willing to dive that deep into layers of If, Then, given the number of possibilities.

it may be tempted to overthink wagonomics here. i'd always caution doing what feels best to your reads/solve, rather than what feels right wagonomically - scum can do weird shit so sometimes wagon logic never feels right.

[the worst]

Name four elements of the periodic table

Neon, Lithium, Boron, Calcium.

the obvtown starts with a noble gas

of course

every damn time

made me laugh

1915 reads like a townpost but i'm not sure how to say why

had the same brain thought going to let it bounce around a little

[the worst]

you lost the courage to try to mislim me when I started POSTING

i don't think i've ever had the courage to try and mislim you that feels exhausting.

still rate the wagon on you & think the push there was fine. i lost the motivation to actively scumread you when dann stopped scumreading you.

though like, more accurately, when dann mentioned he borrowed so much from your early posts. my read on you was very discomfort/underwhelmed-coded and looking back i probably slept on a lot of your better observations bc you were aligned w people pushing me and i was looking elsewhere.

i don't think you or firebringer characterise my play in a way that's conducive to solving my alignment. that's fine, i've like played mafia before, 1928 just made me raise an eyebrow

[the worst]

Idk what this means

i just want you to say stuff that you find interesting or noteworthy about this game

all ur takes feel really undercooked or, even worse, very popular

I am interested in you

you have made me blush but have not fixed my read on you.

what about me interests you?

Wasn't trying to fix your read. Just a tongue in cheek response

Not sure why you treat everything I say as a business transaction...

because i find this way of interacting socially uncomfortable and i'm hoping it'll be awkward enough that your response will be interesting

[the worst]

Still don't understand why you think me being interested in sorting you would warrant you "fixing" your read on me tho?

I'm kind of assuming you were responding to my request for something of interest because you wanted me to change your read on you.

like "fypov I need to fix my read"

[the worst]

Wait could that be a slip?

GOTTEM

FOILED AGAIN

[the worst]

you lost the courage to try to mislim me when I started POSTING

i don't think i've ever had the courage to try and mislim you that feels exhausting.

still rate the wagon on you & think the push there was fine. i lost the motivation to actively scumread you when dann stopped scumreading you.

though like, more accurately, when dann mentioned he borrowed so much from your early posts. my read on you was very discomfort/underwhelmed-coded and looking back i probably slept on a lot of your better observations bc you were aligned w people pushing me and i was looking elsewhere.

i don't think you or firebringer characterise my play in a way that's conducive to solving my alignment. that's fine, i've like played mafia before, 1928 just made me raise an eyebrow

This post made me check if you were really 2nd in the draft oops you're not maybe I should be mature and stop emote spamming

the draft is another very bland way to dismiss a conversation but whatever I'm also irreverent towards mechanics

[the worst]

you lost the courage to try to mislim me when I started POSTING

i don't think i've ever had the courage to try and mislim you that feels exhausting.

still rate the wagon on you & think the push there was fine. i lost the motivation to actively scumread you when dann stopped scumreading you.

though like, more accurately, when dann mentioned he borrowed so much from your early posts. my read on you was very discomfort/underwhelmed-coded and looking back i probably slept on a lot of your better observations bc you were aligned w people pushing me and i was looking elsewhere.

i don't think you or firebringer characterise my play in a way that's conducive to solving my alignment. that's fine, i've like played mafia before, 1928 just made me raise an eyebrow

This post made me check if you were really 2nd in the draft oops you're not maybe I should be mature and stop emote spamming

the draft is another very bland way to dismiss a conversation but whatever I'm also irreverent towards mechanics

I wanted to try to figure out why I don't care about sorting you for introspective reasons. I kinda feel like I don't. I still don't after learning you're last in the draft

I'm still confused about why I don't care enough.

I guess that's radically different from the post you quoted in terms of tone but a serious tone isn't very useful anyway until I feel ready to jam idk

That was sort of the vibe I was getting idk I think that's just a thing I agree about? It's not super noteworthy or anything

If you're town let's simply win the game without thinking too hard about it?

[the worst]

worst has been ignoring me for a while.

do we have an appointment

[the worst]

VOTE: notascum

i haven’t read anything but i like tying wagons

I wish I could explain how badly I want you to be town this game

[the worst]

VOTE: notascum e-1

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eh maybe

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vig??????

am I the only one who thinks me negligently allowing gob to lolhammer was really towny

VOTE: Pavowski

[the worst]

SUCCESS

[the worst]

I do feel like we're wagoning more than 0 scum rn

I have no strong feelings on whether they're t/s or s/s

[the worst]

to lift the curtain a bit when I read Dave's 1090 a little voice in the back of my mind was like "I wonder if we eliminated NAS and NAS flipped red if we'd have one of those games where we hit d1 then lose in 5p"

I do think NAS is pretty scummy even in the context of lhf. I might call u boring if u vote there but I won't fight you on it, I don't think NAS is a bad lim honestly and if day was ending in 14 seconds I'd probably be advocating that we flashyeet NAS!

this is a messy game to sort satisfactorily tho and given thw impeccable standards of NAS' posts so far, I fear he may have peaked and that wagoning him further would be fruitless.



less poetically: he's refusing to play or interact. I doubt wagoning him will fix that. why bother when we can do things that'll actually be interesting?

I also feel obligated to quote this and say I hope I'm not an oracle.

[the worst]

vig??????

am I the only one who thinks me negligently allowing gob to lolhammer was really towny

VOTE: Pavowski

by that logic, you and me are both really towny

there's some fringe logic that as mafia you could've tried to bait gob into the lazy hammer so he looked sketchier today but eeehhhh thats a stretch

honestly already found you plenty towny

[the worst]

i'm a master manipulator, ducky. didn't you know?

I watched mawaru penguindrum when it came out I'll never fully trust a penguin again in my entire life

[the worst]

I do feel like we're wagoning more than 0 scum rn

I have no strong feelings on whether they're t/s or s/s

Do you have any strong feelings about which one is scummier than the other?

Separating my head & my heart for a sec:

My soul screams at me to flip Pav. I do not think his d1 was towny, and I think he responded poorly to pressure. I believe keeping him in contention is going to improve the quality of the gamestate.

My head sees what people are seeing re. gob but doesn't necessarily think it's alignment indicative, or all that aligned with NAS. I also think gob is just gonna keep doing gob things whether he's run up or not, and we're probably better running him up when he's in contention for a lim. I don't think he's not in contention for a lim rn, honestly, so I don't dislike that wagon. It's just not all that interesting fmpov.

If I had a gun with one bullet maybe I'd shoot yessiree just to see what happened

[the worst]

ohhhhhhhhhh

rolecop is a really interesting pick since scum took informed

unsure if it's strictly optimal but Ydrasse's creativity is not to be underestimated

[the worst]

I'm rly conflicted on yessiree and I'd love for someone townier and smarter than me to point me in the direction I need

I do not enjoy how he had NAS in his second-tier scumlist, but then was absolutely unable to elaborate on the read & seemed glacial about budging on reads which were in the scummier tier than NAS

he's voting someone who isn't even on his list of 5 scum suspects in a game with 3 scum oh maybe I hate that.......

i wanted to let the wagons between brian and me play out a bit more, cause i was already getting some reads out of it

but i didn't have anything better to post at the time, so i went ahead and posted that

i don't actually think i believe in the relative strength of those reads all that much

june & dunn were both low-content and unreadable at that point.
i was a pretty popular scumread so am not surprised about being in that tier, nor is it noteworthy that you had me there.

pavowski & notascum are both genuinely intriguing but you don't feel interested in pressing there.

you had your vote on brian skies who you townread - and now you've unvoted despite wagons picking up and you having several scum/non-town reads?
where are you at? i don't even need you to catch up i just can't work out what's going on

thats ok my day 1 reads are not that accurate anyway, but i thought it would still be good to put them out there

as to why i townread brian, i can dig the thought process of him scumreading me based on how i joined his wagon, and linking pav and me as some sort of distancing play. It's basically how i would approach early game, only reason i called it a shitpush is cause the conclusion he drew about me is wrong

June and pav was two-fold, one was mostly vibe, the other is mechanical that i will not out yet, the only reason i suspected them is cause only they happened to fall in this overlap

dunn i already gave reasonings for
noteascum had a stellar entrance but ruined it by asking people to summarize the game

I've had several recent town losses where scum was eliminated d1 and it didn't help in the slightest.

This is a vibe I'm starting to get from the concept of yeeting NotAScum

HUH?

i think NotAScum is pretty yeetable and probably actually scum but it doesn't feel like a smart wagon rn

yea i had to do a double take on this because reading it made me raise an eyebrow first and then reading the explanation gave me whiplash

if u think the former, you wouldn't have an issue with people pushing that slot
if u think the latter, you wouldn't have held that predisposition in the first place

i dont mean this as a "gotcha" like i caught soemone doing a contradiction, i genuinely can't imagine how u can come to these conflicting opinions about a particular slot

am i being too harsh on ducky? or i just dont like the way he waddles right now

VOTE: notascum

But then votes yessiree which really just felt more like a compromise given yessiree has no actual ostensible read on NAS

It still doesn't know what to think of Yessirree if it's being honest. It feels totally confused by how they approach the game.

It give me the vibe it views things in black and white, and I'm in the grey zone. So that's fine.

It is capable of nuance, but it does tend to... how does it explain.

It builds mental models to understand others because it does not easily or naturally comprehend them without that framing? It finds them useful for predicting behaviour and analyzing intent. It thinks itself pretty good at those things, once it has that lock on.

It is having a harder time locking on to you than others, and it attributes that to not having had as much direct connection. Would you be willing to rectify this with it sometime soon?

Sure, it has my attention

Can you explain to it your read on... any three slots you feel strongly on, give it a breakdown as if you were attempting to teach it how to come to the same conclusion as you.

I don't have any strong feelings on a particular slot. My holistic take is that there are probably 2 scums in this group. I'm not sure how I can break it down for you in detail other than to say that's the lens I'm using to view the game as a whole.

davesaz 6
Ydrasse 10
Pavowski 11
gob 55

and 1 scum in this group

NotAScum 2
the worst 3
Brian Skies 3

The people not on this list are my townreads and I'm largely tuning their interactions out as noise to reduce my cognitive load.

But for some reason this post tings a little towny but I think it's just individualistic and interesting. I don't actually get it.

[the worst]

Actually ig yessiree has me & brian as clear in his vibe solve now that's kinda fun

[the worst]

also don't want to hear anything about the speed of gob wagon is indicative that gob isn't scum here. There is only one other scum assuming gob is scum as well. Scum barely have ability to influence wagons here.

I think there's like, 6 versions of reality here and I don't think any of them are absurdly likely or unlikely. Anyone who thinks these wagons are happening too quickly is a joker.

[the worst]

Respectfully worstie, I don't wanna engage with you much more this day phase. I feel like you're just going to give me diplomatic, politically-correct responses that are not helpful at all for me to get a read on you. I will probably delegate that responsibility elsewhere

assuming that my responses are diplomatic & designed to be politically correct feels like you're coming at me from a place where you've already decided I'm being manipulative

in saying this I respect your decision, I talked thru my concerns about you for the same reason - I don't think I'm going to read you accurately on my own.

[the worst]

Y'all might not know this, but Gob is a very intelligent and observant player.

He not the type of guy to make silly mistakes like confusing "ducky" and the worst as two different people, and actually believing Dannold to be voting randomly

The only reason I can think of for him to be feigning ignorance like that is that he's just scum

for what it's worth, just restating that I have seen gob faking dumbtells as mafia before. this is a very good observation.

[the worst]

someone had to say and it and you were probably the best option

[the worst]

Gob why am I highly likely toqn

You and NAS had same draft number. Plus the way Dunn opened by voting NAS makes it even less likely,imo.

This is not bad thinking, I can see and have pondered whether scum might draft the same number for exactly this reason, but I dunno, that puts you late in the draft order and makes not getting a PR significantly higher.

Then again, they did choose informed, so ...

so....what?

Like I think I get what you're getting at but I feel like it's such an abstract way to try and keep your reads open

What do you actually think?

[the worst]

i feel like im the only player brazen enough to do same numbers in this game

???? Id obviously do it with you

[the worst]

Gob why am I highly likely toqn

You and NAS had same draft number. Plus the way Dunn opened by voting NAS makes it even less likely,imo.

This is not bad thinking, I can see and have pondered whether scum might draft the same number for exactly this reason, but I dunno, that puts you late in the draft order and makes not getting a PR significantly higher.

Then again, they did choose informed, so ...

What does mafia choosing informed have to do with that? Also yea I agree that scum would do that play on purpose, but given how NAS and Dunn played early, I don't think thats as likely. I feel like we would've at least seen NAS cross vote Dunn. But im open for other intrepretations.

They chose informed rather than multitasking. So if a scummo or two didn't get a role, it's NBD because a vanilla goon can still night kill, was my assumption

If every scum is multitasking, they would try harder for PRs

This is assuming I understand the setup correctly, which, y'know, I have never claimed to be particularly smart

Where are your reads at Pavo

I think at their core both modifiers are there primarily to make a mechanical solve harder (this is, like, broadly philosophising, SS might be throwing rotten fruit in my rough direction)

[the worst]

i feel like im the only player brazen enough to do same numbers in this game

???? Id obviously do it with you

i don't think u had time to talk to allies to coordinate picks, u were out sick much of early day 1 if i recall

Me being sick increases the odds of fuckery honestly but granted!

[the worst]

Spoiler: quotes getting wallish, hidden

Gob why am I highly likely toqn

You and NAS had same draft number. Plus the way Dunn opened by voting NAS makes it even less likely,imo.

This is not bad thinking, I can see and have pondered whether scum might draft the same number for exactly this reason, but I dunno, that puts you late in the draft order and makes not getting a PR significantly higher.

Then again, they did choose informed, so ...

What does mafia choosing informed have to do with that? Also yea I agree that scum would do that play on purpose, but given how NAS and Dunn played early, I don't think thats as likely. I feel like we would've at least seen NAS cross vote Dunn. But im open for other intrepretations.

They chose informed rather than multitasking. So if a scummo or two didn't get a role, it's NBD because a vanilla goon can still night kill, was my assumption

If every scum is multitasking, they would try harder for PRs

This is assuming I understand the setup correctly, which, y'know, I have never claimed to be particularly smart

Where are your reads at Pavo

I think at their core both modifiers are there primarily to make a mechanical solve harder (this is, like, broadly philosophising, SS might be throwing rotten fruit in my rough direction)

When you say both modifiers, are you talking about informed vs multitasking?

I'm ready to townlock Dann mechanically for a while, and I wanna lim Gob today, partially on his play (did not like the hammer) and partially because if gob is town, scum never kills there, and we'll have to sort the slot sooner or later.

I vote sooner.

Uh Oblivion is still town, I'm still leaning town on you for weak reasons like I was d1, I still think May is towny.

As for the rest, I'm thinking more about the draft.

I like Dave's lolsolve of mafia going 1,2,3, but I think PP at 4 is a high candidate for a scum choice also. That makes my lim pool Fire, you, Brian, and PP. Oblivion has a low # but I feel it's town.

I dunno, I have a lot of thoughts about the draft but they're half-baked at best.

That lim pool has 2+ town in it (mechanically) and seems to include me who you already townread. I also feel like solving by the draft is really regressive at this point in the gamestate?

How do you feel about Jake? How do you feel about gob's alignment (fuck the draft)? Why do you have penguin has a reasonably high scum equity choice?

[the worst]

It is currently not voting Gob for the sake of fear of another quick hammer, it wishes to kill Gob regardless of claim except for perhaps Cop, but imagine it's full support on that.

There has to be at least one mafia outside of gob. Why aren't you voting to find them?

This sounds harsher than intended, its more a call to action than an accusation

[the worst]

P.S. Yes I know Gob isn't in that lim pool, but I still like my gob vote. I'm voting Gob on play; there's plenty of time to untangle the rest.

Fireb if this is it, it's dire. He puts a lim pool of 4 when there's 2 scum left alive, then says he's voting someone outside that pool "on play". I'm not asking him easy questions I'm trying to find out if he actually had any reads :p

[the worst]

Pavo out here openwolfing and y'all are sitting around discussing the best way to season poor Gob

idk, or even currently care what gob's alignment is, I'm just floored that so few others are interested in solving around him?

[the worst]

have fun May! be present, we will solve the game 4 u

[the worst]

It is currently not voting Gob for the sake of fear of another quick hammer, it wishes to kill Gob regardless of claim except for perhaps Cop, but imagine it's full support on that.

There has to be at least one mafia outside of gob. Why aren't you voting to find them?

This sounds harsher than intended, its more a call to action than an accusation

Did you not pay attention on day 1? It cast one vote on day 1, for NAS. It is not a player for whom personality and pressure comes naturally. It recognizes the value of a vote but if all it can do is vote, it struggles to follow up on pressure. It prefers mental modeling, and that requires it to be somewhat neutral to mimic the mental state. As a result, it tends to... decide who it wants to kill, and vote them, as opposed to using votes as a weapon.

It understands that is perhaps a weakness in its game but it tries to use it as a strength.

Best to assume I did not pay attention as a rule of thumb

Noted

[the worst]

It is currently not voting Gob for the sake of fear of another quick hammer, it wishes to kill Gob regardless of claim except for perhaps Cop, but imagine it's full support on that.

There has to be at least one mafia outside of gob. Why aren't you voting to find them?

This sounds harsher than intended, its more a call to action than an accusation

Did you not pay attention on day 1? It cast one vote on day 1, for NAS. It is not a player for whom personality and pressure comes naturally. It recognizes the value of a vote but if all it can do is vote, it struggles to follow up on pressure. It prefers mental modeling, and that requires it to be somewhat neutral to mimic the mental state. As a result, it tends to... decide who it wants to kill, and vote them, as opposed to using votes as a weapon.

It understands that is perhaps a weakness in its game but it tries to use it as a strength.

Best to assume I did not pay attention as a rule of thumb

Noted

Ah, that came across ruder than it intended it to. It was trying to point at it and thought it was something people would note on, not.... Apologies.

No offence taken!

[the worst]

Spoiler: quotes getting wallish, hidden

Gob why am I highly likely toqn

You and NAS had same draft number. Plus the way Dunn opened by voting NAS makes it even less likely,imo.

This is not bad thinking, I can see and have pondered whether scum might draft the same number for exactly this reason, but I dunno, that puts you late in the draft order and makes not getting a PR significantly higher.

Then again, they did choose informed, so ...

What does mafia choosing informed have to do with that? Also yea I agree that scum would do that play on purpose, but given how NAS and Dunn played early, I don't think thats as likely. I feel like we would've at least seen NAS cross vote Dunn. But im open for other intrepretations.

They chose informed rather than multitasking. So if a scummo or two didn't get a role, it's NBD because a vanilla goon can still night kill, was my assumption

If every scum is multitasking, they would try harder for PRs

This is assuming I understand the setup correctly, which, y'know, I have never claimed to be particularly smart

Where are your reads at Pavo

I think at their core both modifiers are there primarily to make a mechanical solve harder (this is, like, broadly philosophising, SS might be throwing rotten fruit in my rough direction)

When you say both modifiers, are you talking about informed vs multitasking?

I'm ready to townlock Dann mechanically for a while, and I wanna lim Gob today, partially on his play (did not like the hammer) and partially because if gob is town, scum never kills there, and we'll have to sort the slot sooner or later.

I vote sooner.

Uh Oblivion is still town, I'm still leaning town on you for weak reasons like I was d1, I still think May is towny.

As for the rest, I'm thinking more about the draft.

I like Dave's lolsolve of mafia going 1,2,3, but I think PP at 4 is a high candidate for a scum choice also. That makes my lim pool Fire, you, Brian, and PP. Oblivion has a low # but I feel it's town.

I dunno, I have a lot of thoughts about the draft but they're half-baked at best.

That lim pool has 2+ town in it (mechanically) and seems to include me who you already townread. I also feel like solving by the draft is really regressive at this point in the gamestate?

How do you feel about Jake? How do you feel about gob's alignment (fuck the draft)? Why do you have penguin has a reasonably high scum equity choice?

Any pool of 4 is gonna have 2 town in it, what are you even trying to say? My town read on you is for not good reasons

Not really concerned with whether you like how I'm thinking about the game

Jake is null at best, Gob scum would not surprise me even a little bit, Penguin scum depends on my draft thoughts and a lot of WIFOM.

that's my point. a pool of 4 which has no conviction is a pretty weak solve and this game feels p advanced for day two. I'm finding it difficult to believe that you believe in what you're saying.

[the worst]

It doesn't rly matter if u like my read on u either? I'm going to advocate that you're likely scum unless I change my mind. I'll still challenge you to change my mind.

pedit: lol I've spent half the game talking about it

[the worst]

He had a fever and couldn't remember how to pretend to care

[the worst]

It doesn't rly matter if u like my read on u either? I'm going to advocate that you're likely scum unless I change my mind. I'll still challenge you to change my mind.

pedit: lol I've spent half the game talking about it

See that's my point, you've been all over me since d1

I hold something back, you say that's scummy from me

I offer a read, you say it's weak or obvious or just bad

I try to share thoughts, you say I'm not engaging with the game

Pardon me if it begins to feel like you're not operating in good faith

ur pardoned just keep up the good work I'm sure I'll see the light eventually

[the worst]

Anyway, what are YOUR thoughts on Gob? You say you don't know or care but my dude is at e-2; to quote Vincent Vega before he shot some dude in the face, you gotta have an opinion

I have opinions when I have opinions. I actually kinda like gob. At an intellectual level I can see what people are seeing and I'm fallible and given the fairly strong consensus gob is a long-term liability and technically the hammer on NAS may be slightly partner indicative

but I've enjoyed that he's been a contrarian, I didn't feel his slippy stuff was as manufactured in this game, he kinda needed to hammer NAS or he would've caught heat + Penguin said he was about to, and I haven't actually read a case against gob that compelled me?

so my heart wants him to be town, my head acknowledges that wiser heads than my own disagree and its obviously a pretty popular wagon.

[the worst]

I'm towny af????

[the worst]

I agree with that objectively & subjectively

[the worst]

do it like this btw

[the worst]

I don't know why rolecop is a bad draft either

I'm down to jam if u want, I think a lot of people aren't really talking about anything meaningful this phase

rolecop is a good draft. with informed rolecop is an excellent draft.

[the worst]

{warmpup, ducky, penguin, Mr dr Brian skies, Dannold}

For example. This is my town block.

Interesting, I didn't register that was your townbloc. Would you mind still vigging me please? Hypothetically.

Why hard town on Brian?

[the worst]

Why couldn't scum pick the same numbers

I think it's a lot less likely given they chose informed

why are those ideas connected to you

I'm starting to wonder why they don't seem to be connected to anybody else

You know when most people are condescending they are least are explanatory

Sorry, really wasn't trying to be condescending. I just, like... It feels obvious to me? If scum picked informed they can't be multitasking. That means if they all got roles, one would have to not use their role to take the NK. And if two of them pick the same numbers, one of them has to end up as a vanilla goon (and both might), so multitasking wouldn't matter.

But as informed, multitasking already doesn't matter, so it's no big deal if one of them ends up as a VT as that person can take the NKs.

Look I'm high as hell right now, I'm not sure that explanation makes sense outside of my head at the mo

Even if you won rb in the draft and never used it you're still neutralising a powerful draft row I don't think this holds a lot of weight but I enjoy the alternate theory

[the worst]

I don't know why rolecop is a bad draft either

UB is better as town than rolecop lest you’re trying to catch someone in a lie

So, refer back to me saying UB is better…

Actually…this explains the ydrasse kill

oh maybe yeah

I think Ydrasse was probably just a low info high tpr equity kill

[the worst]

Why hard town on Brian?

Yes.

was there anything in particular that triggered that read?

my read on Brian is so half assed rn I'm hoping I can sheep someone else's and I like you


pedit: I assumed it was, like, a list of players that someone was looking at or something I wasn't thinking that hard about it

[the worst]

I don't know why rolecop is a bad draft either

UB is better as town than rolecop lest you’re trying to catch someone in a lie

So, refer back to me saying UB is better…

Actually…this explains the ydrasse kill

oh maybe yeah

I think Ydrasse was probably just a low info high tpr equity kill

Who was middle pack for PRs and scum knew what they got and didn’t, as well as what was and wasn’t, and they knew watcher flipped.

Ah granted. I hadn't really revisited that.

[the worst]

That's fair. I still don't feel pressured to have Brian locked in and I think Brian is exploring interesting stuff which is net positive for solving this game anyway.

[the worst]

inb4 gob hammers anyway

i get n_m vibes

this made me laugh


I'm sad this game is dead this is the last time we'll have so many competent players but it's also flat by default when gob is not here.

[the worst]

I’m dealing with some irl stuff rn.

Take care friend

[the worst]

intent to hammer

rly nervy there isn't a counterwagon like ... at all ... but i guess i'd bus gob in these circumstances too...

[the worst]

Brian is absolutely clear.

I'm still on this
VOTE: Pavowski

[the worst]

I feel guilty for not clocking Penguin's Brian townread earlier. Brian is, obviously, clear.

[the worst]

Oh there's one scum alive provable power roles are clear now

[the worst]

And no multitasking*

Removing thoughts from my brain is hard.

[the worst]

Gob is wifoming firebringer right?

Is this a conversation we need to have? I think firebringer just needs to be dead before f3 so we don't have to think about it

[the worst]

He's p low on my list but clear?

[the worst]

the interaction is a little more blatant and obvious than i tend to see from scum i guess

this is the place I talked myself into. I do think gob made votes on firebringer which were like, kind of bizarre and grated against the gamestate. one of those was also hella opportunistic to the point of being kinda obvious so I'm coming around to "gob probably knows he was TMI-ing Firebringer but ig that makes firebringer more likely town"

[the worst]

I think there's enough lims to kill pav, firebringer and myself before endgame esp if this is mechanically cleanable!

[the worst]

Two truths and a lie:

I have a secret Mafiauniverse account named "Ruby" with multiple completed games
My girlfriend wanted to play scarlet and violet together on release weekend but I insisted on only catching and using pokemon from Ruby and Sapphire in every single part where it was allowed. She ended up doing the same but with Black and White (after she finished evolving meowscarada).
I have not left my apartment without a Mawile plushie on my person since 2022

false true true?

this doesn't feel like a perfect guess but I really want to believe the mawile plushie part

[the worst]

Worst kinda fostered a d1-2 environment where we didn't flip lhf idk

???

I spent all of d1 pushing higher profile people while reminding folks that NAS was an option and was scummy as fuck. like the whole thing.

[the worst]

I haven't felt this obviously towny in a hot minute but I'm also fine being limmed if it's gonna help

I still think its pav

[the worst]

atp the cop is dead and any provable roles are clear as long as the nk goes through. I'm in favour of massclaim.

[the worst]

Pavowski has reacted to me pushing him but it has been very unconvincing/future promise-ey. I'm also surprised he hasn't really reacted to you.

[the worst]

Wait wtf don't massclaim

[the worst]

roleblocker & jailer are both cops

wait do massclaim waaaah

[the worst]

wait wait we could be auto

[the worst]

1/8 Brian Skies cleared
0-2/8 roleblcoker + jailkeeper claims
0-2/8 already cleared by roleblocker + jailer
0-2 Rb + jk targets tonight
0-1 future rb/jk targets

[the worst]

because they're stronger than cops, they can pre-confirm their targets and can't be stopped

I also wasn't counting the vit

[the worst]

We do not want the rb/jk/vig targeting each other either

[the worst]

It's probably not auto if mafia got rb or jk right

still auto, they need to select fake targets & scum chose informed.

[the worst]

I can run some numbers when I get to my laptop

[the worst]

I'll check but I don't think it gets weird enough

[the worst]

And we have last night and maybe a n3 vig

[the worst]

It's a bit of a hydra situation too where killing one clear requires other clears to be generated and stuff

Lemme check something

[the worst]

i'm really in my boring era.

[the worst]

assuming only the jk, i can only see a scenario where the game goes into f6 with 3 clears, so far.

[the worst]

though i guess if there's only one power role left the game can actually just continue but it's going to get significantly easier.

i wonder if penguin checked me last night\


pedit: @oblivion, yeah - it's not material whether scum have the JK or town have the JK. it's the concept of the JK which is important, and the fact scum are forced to look like they're making towny JK decisions or we just lim them before endgame

[the worst]

this is the kind of logic i'm working through. i'm rusty so someone else check my brain do thing please.

if there's only a vig, obviously we are not in auto but i think we just lim scummy players until we win..



only jk, n3 vig, scum no kills:

Spoiler:

d3 - 10 alive, 2 clears (Brian + jk's target last night), 2 power roles. jk pre-selects, vig doesn't have to announce target but needs to make sure they are targeting a claimed vt and not the jk's target.
n4 - 9 alive, one kill goes through (vig), no more clears.
d5 - 8 alive, 2 clears (Brian + n2 jk target), vig & jk are not clear. lim uncleared VT.
n5 - 7 alive, 2 clears (Brian + n2 jk target), scum are forced to eventually kill to avoid auto-loss.
- killing the jk replaces the jk with another clear.
- killing a cleared player means a new clear is generated by the jk having pre-selected.

- it's mechanically optimal for scum to shoot the jk at some point.
n4: 9 alive, vig & scum kills the jk, 1 more clear generated + vig kill.
d5: 7 alive, 4 clears (Brian + 2x jk targets + vig), scum auto-lose.

otherwise:
n4: 9 alive, vig kills, scum no kill, no new jk clear
d5: 8 alive, 2 clears (Brian + n2 target), lim uncleared VT.
n5: 7 alive, 2 clears, scum shoot jk & jk generates new clear.
d6: 6 alive, 3 clears, game isn't auto but scum are in pretty bad shape.

only jk, no vig, no rb, scum no kills:

Spoiler:

d3 - 10 alive, 2 clears (Brian + jk's target last night), 1 power role. jk pre-selects.
n3 - 9 alive, no kills, no clears generated.
d4 - 9 alive, 2 clears (Brian + n2 jk target), jk pre-selects, we lim an uncleared VT
n4 - 8 alive, 2 clears ... you get the idea. scum eventually forced to kill someone. if scum shoot a clear, the jk will replace them with another clear.

d3 - 10 alive, 2 clear (Brian + n2 jk target), jk pre-selects.
n3 - 9 alive, scum shoot jk, 1 clear generated.
d4 - 8 alive, 3 clears, lim an uncleared vt
n4 - 7 alive, 3 clears, scum forced to shoot a clear
d5 - 6 alive, 2 clears... game goes on but this is hard for scum.

[the worst]

Wow no one got it right

is the pokemon game on the lie??? i feel so sad

[the worst]

y'all gotta stop being cute for a sec we have auto-win to calc

[the worst]

What if I'm mafia trying to disrupt the calc

hilariously this was exactly my kneejerk brain reaction

then i realised i actually know you

[the worst]

there's 2 votes in play so i doubt it matters but w/e

UNVOTE:

[the worst]

worst do you think I have the physical spiritual metaphysical capability to execute subroutine "stop being cute"

no, i thought that was why my post was funny

I know at least one person who would disagree with you if so

2 including myself

Tbhuh it's probably so close to auto it's fine to mass and punt a smidge of ev and like try to win or whatever

basically if the draft went horribly and we have no TPRs left it's not auto. if there's only a non-clearing PR, we aren't in auto (but i'd be surprised if this is salvageable for any scum).

[the worst]

What is your plushie of

It's plushie is a tiny Eevee named Jet.

no way. jet is a really cute eevee name.

[the worst]

dave the tension is killing me i'm so hype.

[the worst]

the 2nd one had too much detail to be a lie of course it was a lie

i'd feel bad for applying this logic to isis specifically but point taken.

What is your plushie of

It's plushie is a tiny Eevee named Jet.

no way. jet is a really cute eevee name.

Mmhmm! He has a whole plushie army of eeveelutions who are big sisters/brothers to him cause he is smol.

i'm literally melting that is fantastic.

[the worst]

i've unvoted bc unvotes during massclaim are probably, like legally speaking, good practice. pav is also still my #1 lim today.

[the worst]

If we are tracker RB is it auto?

not quite, but it's a matter of playing on with like 3/8 people cleared or something like that.

[the worst]

I love Eevee because I view it as a trans metaphor

Also if you consider the associations between designs eevee is kinda like the protagonist of gen1 yet you don't get it early

I played a radiant Eevee control deck to locals once I think it was a barely-correct alternative to the bird most people played instead. Starley? Pidgey? Whichever it was

i was really happy to see one of the let's go games being eevee-flavoured. it always confounded me that the other originally conceived mascot was like, was it jigglypuff? that still feels like a fever dream. eevee is clearly one of the best concepts out of gen 1.

[the worst]

It just realized scum is informed cant one of these claims not exist and allow scum to fake claim it?

given scum have to pretend to be towny, the threat of a clearing role with 1 scum alive is equally valuable to the existence of a clearing role.

sorry, this concept is really difficult to explain. basically scum can't fuck around bc they get caught immediately.

[the worst]

I love Eevee because I view it as a trans metaphor

Also if you consider the associations between designs eevee is kinda like the protagonist of gen1 yet you don't get it early

I played a radiant Eevee control deck to locals once I think it was a barely-correct alternative to the bird most people played instead. Starley? Pidgey? Whichever it was

i was really happy to see one of the let's go games being eevee-flavoured. it always confounded me that the other originally conceived mascot was like, was it jigglypuff? that still feels like a fever dream. eevee is clearly one of the best concepts out of gen 1.

It's eevee plushie Jet was based on it naming its cute Eevee in that game Jet. It got given a male eevee which is why the Eevee is male but it also put flowers on the eevee in designing it so it thinks it is kinda a non binary gender fluid eevee. It can decide it's gender when it evolves.

i really love that. eevee is too cute to be held back by the gender binary anyway.

[the worst]

y'all please be very careful talking about provable aspects of private mod communications

[the worst]

let's play nightless vanilla instead this is boring

i agree but i've got a wincon and i will bludgeon everyone with it until i win

[the worst]

i'm not even particularly toxic i just love winning

[the worst]

clear:
Brian Skies
[neighbouriser]
[dave's n2 target?]
???

davesaz
Dannflor
Jake The Wolfie
May
Pavowski
Oblivion
the worst
yessiree
Firebringer


y'all we can very likely lock this can we just massclaim and get it over with

[the worst]

i'm fine trusting you if you insist, either we're in auto and it doesn't matter, or we're not in auto and it doesn't matter.

is there value in you claiming your n2 target or nah?
& is there value in you claiming a n3 target in advance or nah?

pedit: hi may

[the worst]

any of [tracker, jk, rb, backup-watcher] may want to consider claiming their n2 targets

any of [jk, rb, vig?] may want to consider claiming their n3 targets. i put a question mark next to vig for obvious reasons.

[the worst]

I'm annoyed Brian isn't scum so basically I will have never done anything this game this is why setups suck

kinda agree, though scum picking informed then losing 2/3 members early is like, extremely blessed for town.

[the worst]

i feel like i've done a lot in the first 2 phases of this game

pedit: granted.

[the worst]

Worst are you mafea

Are you just rolefish mafia

i am the roll fish

[the worst]

n1 tracker does not compel me to unvote

By itself it wouldn't be enough to bother claiming.
I actually double checked Pavowski n2 because by the numbers Pavowski fit the medium of a low-medium-high set of numbers.
If I were scum, clearing a 2nd player by nudging one of the neighbors toward realizing it can clear someone would be a fairly bad move, no?
So either gob is medium and 3rd scum is an even higher number, or scum did low,low,medium/high.

can you confirm pavowski is town? that's pretty pertinent

[the worst]

clear:
Brian Skies
Pavowski
[neighbouriser]
any n2 jk target?

davesaz
Dannflor
Jake The Wolfie
May
Oblivion
the worst
yessiree
Firebringer

[the worst]

only things left to do today:

- find out if there's a n2 jk target
- make sure if there's a vig they have an uncleared VT they can target lol

i'm a fine lim just not before these two things please or we're dropping a lot of ev

pedit: yessiree is a better lim!

[the worst]

it's auto because we flipped scum 2 days in a row :/

[the worst]

jake is cleared, dave needs to target in the uncleared pool

[the worst]

clear:
Brian Skies (cop clear)
Pavowski (tracker clear)
Jake The Wolfie (neighbouriser)
any n2 jk target?

davesaz (tracker claim)

basically if dave hits any of these, excepting any of [jk / n2 jk target / n3 jk target (pre-selected) / vig], we're gonna win.
Dannflor
May
Oblivion
the worst
yessiree
Firebringer

[the worst]

that's why he's separate from the clears, but also separate from possible dave targets.

[the worst]

Demonstrating an ability to tell Jake what Jake did while people die clears him

Altho I guess Jake is probably gonna die

But not necessarily

unnecessary, oblivion just confirmed that jake acted last night

[the worst]

it's strictly better honestly

[the worst]

need jk to check in (or to confirm there's no jk) before we can decide targets tbh

this is boring but the game is over

[the worst]

sorry - there's no jk. i'm talking about a rb/doctor. rb is a townier choice

pedit: rb has a clear from last night & can generate a guaranteed clear tonight

[the worst]

doctor can pile on dave and i think we're in auto, lemme calc

[the worst]

no rb/doc, no vig (not autowin but close)

Spoiler:

d3: 10p (3 clears), lim an uncleared VT
n3: 9p (3 clears), scum shoot dave
d4: 8p (3 clears - Jake, Pav, Brian)

rb, no vig (autowin)

Spoiler:

d3: 10p (4 clears - Brian, Pav, Jake, n2 rb target), rb announces a target, lim an uncleared VT
n3: 9p (4 clears), scum kill either dave or rb
d4: 8p is guranteed another clear because of rb, may have another clear because of dave. 5-6 clears wins.

doc, no vig, assuming worst case scenario (autowin)

Spoiler:

d3: 10p (3 clears), lim uncleared VT
n3: 9p (3 clears), scum hunt for doc
d4: 8p (4 clears), as dave is guaranteed to survive
n4: 7p (4 clears), scum shoot dave to avoid further clears
d5: 6p (4 clears)

OR:
n4: 7p (4 clears), scum shoot a clear in hopes of hitting doc, dave gets another clear
d5: 6p (4 clears) anyway

no rb/doc, 1 vig (autowin)

Spoiler:

d3: 10p (3 clears), vig announces target so dave doesn't double, we lim uncleared VT
n3: 9p, vig shoots uncleared VT, scum shoot dave
d4: 7p (4 clears) autowin

OR:
n3: 9p, scum no kill, dave gets a clear, vig shoots uncleared VT
d4: 8p (5 clears)

[the worst]

someone pls check me i'm lazy

i'm p sure no other TPRs is the only way we don't have autowin and it's strictly better for everyone to just out & claim n3 targets?

[the worst]

oh doctor should not claim, sorry, correct

[the worst]

like doctor should claim vt, but it's a bad pick anyway. vig or rb should definitely claim & out targets.

[the worst]

Worst is trying to rolefish doctor bc he's maf

i find it increasingly hard to believe that you believe this

plus even if there's only a doc & they are shot n3 i think we're still auto right?

[the worst]

i've already won!!! that's the point!!!!!!

[the worst]

VOTE: damaynnf??lor

[the worst]

the deepwolf manifest

[the worst]

Hiya everyone! I've played a little bit of mafia many years ago, and some Town of Salem maybe a year back. Looking forward to getting into this format, MS looks like great fun!

VOTE: legoboyvdlp

[the worst]

I feel like everyone would be friendlier if we all had kittens as avatars

[the worst]

It believes we should claim those roles in the order of, if they exist

Tracker/Jailkeeper

Then

Doctor/Roleblocker

If Tracker claims and there is a doctor doctor should not claim. Instead, it believes every player should proxy claim RB targets at that point instead of a claim.

If JK claim, then it believes RB should claim doctor still should not so no need to proxy this time, but it leaves doctor to protect our JK.

Tracker has claimed so there's no jk. Roleblocker should claim, I think doctor should just claim vt tho honestly

[the worst]

wait that was like 5 pages ago

[the worst]

omg good save. kittens do be fierce af until they're socialised.

[the worst]

Jesus Christ the game reopens when I'm at work and there's 10 pages almost.

Diving into this in an hour or so.

hi you're cleared & we're in auto-win.

if you're an rb, your n2 target & future n3 target will help a lot.

if you're not an rb, enjoy work

[the worst]

no rb/doc, no vig (not autowin but close)

Spoiler:

d3: 10p (3 clears), lim an uncleared VT
n3: 9p (3 clears), scum shoot dave
d4: 8p (3 clears - Jake, Pav, Brian)

rb, no vig (autowin)

Spoiler:

d3: 10p (4 clears - Brian, Pav, Jake, n2 rb target), rb announces a target, lim an uncleared VT
n3: 9p (4 clears), scum kill either dave or rb
d4: 8p is guranteed another clear because of rb, may have another clear because of dave. 5-6 clears wins.

doc, no vig, assuming worst case scenario (autowin)

Spoiler:

d3: 10p (3 clears), lim uncleared VT
n3: 9p (3 clears), scum hunt for doc
d4: 8p (4 clears), as dave is guaranteed to survive
n4: 7p (4 clears), scum shoot dave to avoid further clears
d5: 6p (4 clears)

OR:
n4: 7p (4 clears), scum shoot a clear in hopes of hitting doc, dave gets another clear
d5: 6p (4 clears) anyway

no rb/doc, 1 vig (autowin)

Spoiler:

d3: 10p (3 clears), vig announces target so dave doesn't double, we lim uncleared VT
n3: 9p, vig shoots uncleared VT, scum shoot dave
d4: 7p (4 clears) autowin

OR:
n3: 9p, scum no kill, dave gets a clear, vig shoots uncleared VT
d4: 8p (5 clears)

just writing this up so i can quote it later:

dave has claimed tracker, with a n2 clear on pavowski. there was a kill on n2, and only one scum alive, so pavowski is confirmed to be town.
jake has been outed as a neighbouriser. jake targeted oblivion last night (it has confirmed), meaning that jake is confirmed to be town.
if the above logic is correct, then as long as there is a vig, a roleblocker, or a doctor, we are in autowin.
any doc should claim vt (just protect dave tonight) and i'm pretty confident we win.
if any vig or roleblocker exists, please claim a n3 target as this will put us in auto-win right away.

[the worst]

i yearn for a future where e.g. "man" (a la the dude) ias a non-gendered term but sadly it's just not

[the worst]

VOTE: damaynnf??lor

my brilliant plan worked

i deliberately fuddled this vote so it was ambiguous whether i was voting for dannflor or may
datisi counted it as a vote for dannflor which is definitely a mod slip

can't believe i so effortlessly caught the deepwolf himself

UNVOTE:

[the worst]

that made me smile. i'm down.

[the worst]

i didn't see claims from worstie or even jake but apparently he is clear

I am missing context even when i caught up.

I didn't claim bc I figured it was obvious I'm vt atp

Jake is a neighbouriser who acted last night (softed by Dave, confirmed by o-ring) I'll grab a quote one sec.

[the worst]

no rb/doc, no vig (not autowin but close)

Spoiler:

d3: 10p (3 clears), lim an uncleared VT
n3: 9p (3 clears), scum shoot dave
d4: 8p (3 clears - Jake, Pav, Brian)

rb, no vig (autowin)

Spoiler:

d3: 10p (4 clears - Brian, Pav, Jake, n2 rb target), rb announces a target, lim an uncleared VT
n3: 9p (4 clears), scum kill either dave or rb
d4: 8p is guranteed another clear because of rb, may have another clear because of dave. 5-6 clears wins.

doc, no vig, assuming worst case scenario (autowin)

Spoiler:

d3: 10p (3 clears), lim uncleared VT
n3: 9p (3 clears), scum hunt for doc
d4: 8p (4 clears), as dave is guaranteed to survive
n4: 7p (4 clears), scum shoot dave to avoid further clears
d5: 6p (4 clears)

OR:
n4: 7p (4 clears), scum shoot a clear in hopes of hitting doc, dave gets another clear
d5: 6p (4 clears) anyway

no rb/doc, 1 vig (autowin)

Spoiler:

d3: 10p (3 clears), vig announces target so dave doesn't double, we lim uncleared VT
n3: 9p, vig shoots uncleared VT, scum shoot dave
d4: 7p (4 clears) autowin

OR:
n3: 9p, scum no kill, dave gets a clear, vig shoots uncleared VT
d4: 8p (5 clears)

just writing this up so i can quote it later:

dave has claimed tracker, with a n2 clear on pavowski. there was a kill on n2, and only one scum alive, so pavowski is confirmed to be town.
jake has been outed as a neighbouriser. jake targeted oblivion last night (it has confirmed), meaning that jake is confirmed to be town.
if the above logic is correct, then as long as there is a vig, a roleblocker, or a doctor, we are in autowin.
any doc should claim vt (just protect dave tonight) and i'm pretty confident we win.
if any vig or roleblocker exists, please claim a n3 target as this will put us in auto-win right away.

for firebringer

[the worst]

Brian Skies - n1 cop clear, vt
Jake the Wolfie - neighbouriser who acted n2, confirmed town
Pavowski - n2 tracker clear, vt

davesaz - claimed tracker, not clear but mechanically necessary


Dannflor
May
Oblivion
the worst - vt
yessiree - vt
Firebringer



I think that's all the affirmative claims we have so far noting I do not retain enough information to nail this

[the worst]

oh oops

really well played Oblivion!!

[the worst]

I also strongly prefer multitasking. I think maybe I'd pick informed if I was with a team of stronger scum players than I am, but the utility of nerfing mechanical breaks in pypx/y is huge.

[the worst]

I also strongly prefer multitasking. I think maybe I'd pick informed if I was with a team of stronger scum players than I am, but the utility of nerfing mechanical breaks in pypx/y is huge.

Perhaps it should have considered that when it saw its team but.... it didn't really know?

oh, definitely. I was the, er, I'd feel egotistical to call myself the co-designer of this set-up, but talked with SS a lot while he was visualising this take on PYPX/Y. it's been bouncing around in my mind for a long time.

this is an extremely overwhelming set-up to roll scum in, particularly for its first scumgame. I wanna roll scum w it next time please

[the worst]

I also strongly prefer multitasking. I think maybe I'd pick informed if I was with a team of stronger scum players than I am, but the utility of nerfing mechanical breaks in pypx/y is huge.

Perhaps it should have considered that when it saw its team but.... it didn't really know?

oh, definitely. I was the, er, I'd feel egotistical to call myself the co-designer of this set-up, but talked with SS a lot while he was visualising this take on PYPX/Y. it's been bouncing around in my mind for a long time.

this is an extremely overwhelming set-up to roll scum in, particularly for its first scumgame. I wanna roll scum w it next time please

It made a suggested draft of:

Gob- OSV
Oblivion -N3V
NAS- OSW

With the idea of using OSW to find power roles, shoot twice night 1 in the tops to remove Cop instantly then use it as our anchor and shoot twice with N3V such that by day 4 there would be 8 players dead, leaving us with 6, which could possibly be 4-2 and thus perpetual ELO, but even if not, not too many clears. That was its strategy.

This is a really good holistic strategy for this set-up. You get a lot of valuable townies dead.

It may run into issues where scum are caught via the draft (e.g. the one shot vig is confirmed scum immediately on n1; if someone directly under it in the draft chose 1sv & missed, for example, you're pretty much confirmed to be that role, etc.).

It's also a bit of a swingy strategy, like we saw in this set-up losing a member earlier can be devastating when the team strategy really wants all 3 members to be alive to use their roles

but I'm old and jaded and unambitious. I really admire the ambition of its strategy.

[the worst]

The fact you got all of those role pairings with your draft standing is pretty impressive.

+1 I was like "these people know this set-up who tf made these suggestions"

[the worst]

Good point! Honestly, very little could've prepared for the b2b scum lims, and just the pure luck of penguin + Dave both hitting really strong clear targets.

[the worst]

I played dogshit

You were an absolute delight to play with and every time your presence was needed you were there.

I think this is a game where a small number of townies (who were not necessarily widely townread) had very good reads and the rest of us made good compromises.

Don't think you were bad honestly.

[the worst]

Sorry my play was piss. I'm in a round of job interviews and other life things and just couldn't find the spoons to really get after it.

Well played Oblivion, you 100% had me. And thanks again for modding Dats.

good luck with the job interviews!!!! you got this <3

I missed that pavowski vibe magic this game which I think was a big part of me just...not seeing you as town. but we're gonna crush it next time.