Newbie 991 - Newbieville! (Game Over)

[Thor665]

@EarthIntruder - is you folding up on your case on me really predicated on Travis and *me* not liking it or agreeing with the logic? Why should you give a flying fudge if I don't like your case on me? Scum or town I'm not likely to. I'm surprised I factor into your opinion unless you're changing your view on me, what's up there? You've also been a little dodgy around some of my return fire (like when I asked why it's more likely that reluctant and I aren't partners and you quickly just went with 'oops, typo error - pay no mind!' as the response) that pings my scumdar a bit more.

What are your thoughts on Post 171 and how Travis is giving me the bro-hug of buddiness?

[seth]

@cirno

That's why you BW

[EarthIntruder]

Whether you're scum or town, you can tell if a case makes any sense or not. And I'm not exactly seeing much support from anyone else, either. Speaking of which, where did everyone else go? Aran, reluctant, willow, I want to hear your opinions on all of this, already!

And in regards to post 171, I do find it strange that he went from saying all three people suspecting him had no reason (I got the impression he was referring to you, seth and cirno, unless I'm wrong, Travis?) to saying that at least Thor had one. And like I said before, I honestly don't like Thor's reasoning in the first place. Why haven't you been defending yourself against accusations of following Thor, since that's pretty much the biggest part of his case on you, Travis?

[Coach Travis]

First off, the third person I was referring to willows_weep, he just said he finds me suspicious, with no explanation whatsoever, and then moved onto something else.

And yeah, maybe I have been following Thor, but part of it is that because we both have good experience, we're better at reading people and at playing, so it's not exactly a surprise I agree with him a lot, he's probably the best player in this game. It didn't take long to get a town read on him, so that made me pay attention to his posts, see who he found scummy, not scummy, and a lot of the time we just happened to agree, because we're somewhat similar in how we read people. And a lot of my defending comes down to he's making way more convincing arguments to defend himself, than what people are saying about him. Basically, he's a good player, and I'm reading him as town, plus we can be similar in reads, so it's more that than an intended effort to follow him.

[seth]

That post smells funny

[Cirno]

@cirno

That's why you BW

Vote: Coach Travis

Essentially for hopping bandwagons and gut.
I particularly don't like how he changed his mind on reluctant and hopped on the Scapegoat wagon within an hour of Thor doing the same, or that his explanation for doing so which boils down to ''Scapegoat is scummy' and 'Thor is a good player'.

That wagon is on. If you do not wagon, you are not a bro.

[Thor665]

Whether you're scum or town, you can tell if a case makes any sense or not.

Except when I look at the reluctant wagon, amirite!?!

Also, why are people giving me all my wishes wrapped up in chocolate bubble wrap??? I need to figure out how to wagon Travis and EarthIntruder at the same time.

@Cirno - what's your read on EarthIntruder and his shifting beliefs and anger at the death of the reluctant wagon? I know what I think of it, but you don't even seem to want to vote him while now pushing Travis off of 'gut'. I loves me my gut, but I want to make sure you've sampled the other dishes on the menu first.

[EarthIntruder]

Except when I look at the reluctant wagon, amirite!?!

Guuuh. I'm just frustrated, is all.

Travis, can you be more specific on why you had an early town read on Thor? Maybe point out a specific post or something?

[Coach Travis]

He's been scumhunting, his arguments on me have been the only ones on that actually make any sense whatsoever, and the way he's been asking questions has been very townish, using them for reads and to see if people are on the same page as him or not, and just to see what others are thinking, who they suspect, etc. When things are slowing down, he's usually there to ask something or make a comment that makes things pick up again, and that's also townish. Basically, I think he's done the best job at hunting scum so far.

[Thor665]

I'd be interested to hear your thoughts on which two players you think are most likely scum. We're only 6 pages in so it really shouldn't be too hard to catch up and offer some views.

@seth - still hoping to hear something about this. I'll go out on a limb and guess Travis is one of them, I'd love to hear a second name added to the list. Including reasons would be the whipped cream upon this milkshake of awesome I'm requesting.


@EarthIntruder - Guuuh? I understand you are frustrated, but I feel my question, though phrased in a joking manner, is valid and needs a solid response. I'll break it down so you can see what I'm getting at;

1. I say reluctant wagon is fail because it is on a weak case and unvote.
2. You say this is scummy (amongst other things) and that the case is strong, you vote for me. (scummy Thor misreps strength of case - grrrr, I shall lynch him!)
3. I say your case on me is fail
4. You unvote me because you believe that I and Travis are able to spot a good or bad case. (scummy Thor tells it like it is, better work on my reluctant case, thanks Thor!)



It seems to me that we have some built in contradictions to these actions by you and I really don't understand them. Can you explain your thought process to me better, what am I missing here?

[EarthIntruder]

@EarthIntruder - Guuuh? I understand you are frustrated, but I feel my question, though phrased in a joking manner, is valid and needs a solid response. I'll break it down so you can see what I'm getting at;

1. I say reluctant wagon is fail because it is on a weak case and unvote.
2. You say this is scummy (amongst other things) and that the case is strong, you vote for me. (scummy Thor misreps strength of case - grrrr, I shall lynch him!)
3. I say your case on me is fail
4. You unvote me because you believe that I and Travis are able to spot a good or bad case. (scummy Thor tells it like it is, better work on my reluctant case, thanks Thor!)



It seems to me that we have some built in contradictions to these actions by you and I really don't understand them. Can you explain your thought process to me better, what am I missing here?

My case is based on more than just your switch off the reluctant wagon. I don't like any of your top three scum candidates, like I said before. And I never unvoted you.

But I'm beginning to doubt the case is as strong as I initially thought it was, and I realize that I've been needing to stretch a bit for it all to make sense.

But neither of my other scum candidates have been around for me to build cases on, either x_x

[Thor665]

I realize that I've been needing to stretch a bit for it all to make sense.

I'll also note that your issue with my top three is that two are newbies and one of them you don't understand.

I don't know how you expect me to make a top three list that doesn't contain newbie players in this game, and will note that lack of understanding of a case is not inherently scummy.

I'm going to need to sleep on you - but jeez you are not making this one easy.

[EarthIntruder]

I'll also note that your issue with my top three is that two are newbies and one of them you don't understand.

No, my issue is that one is a newbie that's easy to lynch because he's had a newbie meltdown that can be easily misinterpreted (and also, is me), and one is a newbie that's made one post with content and then disappeared, whose lynch won't give us any info because the most suspicious thing he's done is not post. Reluctant is a newbie, too, if I'm not mistaken there as well, and I still suspect him.

I'm going to need to sleep on you

Oh, baby.

[Aranneas]

Ahola.

Likely going to be V/LA this weekend. Am flying to Europe. Should get access again when I land.

This is done. You guys have had some interesting stuff going on while I was out. I need to mull/analyze a bit. If anyone has specific questions for me to answer that would be lovely.

[reluctant]

I skip out for a day and a half and there is so much content. That is exciting, I'm glad to see the replacements participating so much. To answer an earlier question regarding my scum feel for Thor it is pretty weak. It was based on phrasing that I lead to see him pushing for a lynch before we had heard from everyone. I also am just somewhat distrustful as he seems to be the de facto town leader (or did, it is appearing like that less so now), everyone seemed to jump and do everything he said. Just made me nervous. Regarding Anton he had a nice post, then responded quickly to something else, then kind of disappeared. Just the way it happened made me think that it was scummy lurkiness. But there's been many people telling me since then that it isn't a scum tell but a null tell.

I can kinda understand the argument against Coach Travis, but I'm not sure I agree. Seth came in for Duke Jupiter and immediately tunnelvisioned on him w/ barely any argument as to why. Am I just a huge newb for not seeing it?

Here's the vote info as I went back and read it (I hope I'm not making a mistake): Thor voted for me, then Araneas did ~3 hrs later, then Travis did the next day. Scapegoat's came 4 days later. On the switch to scapegoat's BW it went: Me, Thor later that day, Coach Travis w/in an hour and then Aranneas the next day. It appears like Aranneas & Coach Travis seem to pile on, if the argument is against Coach Travis, why does it not equally apply to Aranneas? What's the scum team?

I'm going to have to go back and re-read everything that has happened recently before I give out more thoughts on the replacements.

Also EarthIntruder's explanation of the phrase 'newbie mislynch' makes sense to me. It still seemed a bit similar to an AtE action to me and still rubs me the wrong way. I'll unvote to take him back down to L-2. I'm still pretty willing to bandwagon him, but I want to read the last few pages more closely. UNVOTE: EarthIntruder.

I'd also like to hear thoughts on the scapegoat/EI and Coach Travis BW from Aranneas and willows_weep.

[seth]

@Thor

I dunno who his partner is, and until I'm sure he's scum I don't really want to think about it.

[Thor665]

No, my issue is that one is a newbie that's easy to lynch because he's had a newbie meltdown that can be easily misinterpreted

Not when I called him scummy and voted for him though - unless you're saying I'm smart enough to see a meltdown coming before it happens.

So you think my top three suspect list is suspicious because someone I listed eventually had a meltdown...or do you think it's suspicious I didn't immediately unvote him after the meltdown?

@seth - who do you find the second most scummy person here in general?

[seth]

Dunno. Reluctant or Arraeneas I think.

[Thor665]

@seth - are there any particular reasons you can describe for those two suspicions?

[seth]

Not anything that has particularly strong reasoning or I'd be pushing one of them, not Travis.

[Thor665]

What is your weak reasoning? You're not pushing them, I'm asking for the information.

[seth]

I don't like his FoS on someone and RV on someone else and I dunno why else. Arraneas' vote looked like an OMGUS and his attitude in his first post popped out to me as over cautious and jumpy.

[xRECKONERx]

scapegoat (3): Thor665, Coach Travis, Aranneas
Thor665 (1): EarthIntruder
Coach Travis (2): seth, Cirno

Not voting (3): Anton, willows_weep, reluctant

With 9 alive it's 5 to lynch. Replacing Anton.

[EarthIntruder]

Not when I called him scummy and voted for him though - unless you're saying I'm smart enough to see a meltdown coming before it happens.

Sure, but you kept pushing the wagon to L-1 after the fact.

Going to get to responding to reluctant, got a lot of work to do today x_x

[Thor665]

I see no reason to dismantle a wagon because of AtE - your opinion may differ but last I checked sometimes it was legitimate town meltdown and sometimes it was scum meltdown and sometimes it was scum fake meltdown. Unless you can show me evidence that it's more likely for a townie to have a meltdown then a scum I see no reason to act like your opinion is any more valid then mine. I'm still not sure how to take you, I'm getting some town energy off you but your presented thoughts are so muddled and elastic they are screaming scum to me - do you have any links to completed games of yours I can look at?

I'm redefining my scum list to;

EarthIntruder
Coach Travis
seth

@seth - you ding Arraneas for being "over cautious" in his first post. What part do you think he was being cautious on exactly - I'm not sure I see it.

Also, what's your call on this post by Coach Travis - do you see it as less cautious then Arraneas' post?