Micro 70 ~ Mafia in Triplicate (Game Over!)

[F-16_Fighting_Falcon]

Saulres 53, I am curious as to how you found time to follow the activity of other players, and more importantly why you felt the need to check it when you yourself can barely find time to post. I do get your point about RL vs posting elsewhere on site, but this seems like a really odd thing to pay attention to. Why were you specifically checking people's posts on site to see their activity level as opposed to reading the thread? Did Xalxe ever fool you as scum before? Why the specific attention to and paranoia of Xalxe?

Tierce, why do you think Saulres is pandering to you as a scum strategy? If he played with you before, he should know that it wouldn't do him any good.

Anyways, I'll wait for Saulres's response and I want to hear Empire's, Konowa's and Xalxe's opinions as well.

Another thing - the lack of a counterwagon is noticeable as well. So, we have a 9 player game with 3 scum. Meaning if town mislynches once, we are at LYLO after the N1 kill. So, we need to be extra-careful. Scum would be looking to mislynch as opposed to bus in a setup like this one since only 2 scum need to die for a town win.

Hypothetical, let's say Saulres is town - he gets mislynched and puts town at 7P LYLO. At that point, as long as ONE townie votes another townie, scum can hammer to win - a bad position to be in.

So, given the choice, scum will mislynch a townie D1. I think we should be more careful with this one.

[Tierce]

Tierce, why do you think Saulres is pandering to you as a scum strategy? If he played with you before, he should know that

it wouldn't do him any good

.

Sadly, not really. I'm getting better at spotting these, but I'm still a sucker for subtle praise.

[Vi]

Vote Count VIII:

Cloud birds
saulres (L-1) ~ Nobody Special, Shamrock, Tierce, Shmugen
Nobody Special (L-3) ~ Empire, Konowa
Shmugen (L-3) ~ saulres, F-16_Fighting_Falcon
F-16_Fighting_Falcon (L-4) ~ Xalxe

Not Voting:

{F-16_Fighting_Falcon}

-saulres is at L-1!

-Empire is being prodded...

--With 9 alive, it takes 5 to lynch.
--Deadline is November 12, 2012 - in

(expired on 2012-11-12 20:00:00)

.

[Empire]

Prodded. Still writing obnoxious 30 page paper. Catch up post and content tomorrow.

[Nobody Special]

I appreciate F-16's pointing out that if we mislynch today that we'd be in Lylo tomorrow -- I didn't realize that at all. Therefore, I really think we should use all the time available to us in order to catch scum today.

[Tierce]

ITT, shameless posturing by Nobody Special.

[Shamrock]

Why are you, Nobody Special, voting saulres?

F-16, two things:
The lack of a counterwagon isn't really notable given that Empire is V/LA, Konowa is spam prod-dodging, Nobody Special is active lurking, and Xalxe has been a nonentity all game;
Even supposing there is scum on the wagon, there probably isn't a higher probability of hitting scum by picking from among the wagon relative to picking among the general population, given that this setup is 3:6.

[Shmugen]

Is this a typical white flag setup? I've never done one, do scum have a traditional wincon?

[saulres]

By the top of page 3, you were so convinced that Shmugen was scum that you were willing to start drawing conclusions about other people's alignment based on their interactions with him? This seems like a bit of a stretch.

Do you agree or disagree with this quote

Sorry I missed that.

Yes, by the time I got there I felt he was scum. But it was more than that. In 54 you questioned him, and questioned me. But then you didn't place a vote until the next post. That felt like town saying "You know, this bothered me enough that I think it's worth putting a vote on that guy." If you were scum, no matter what Shmugen's alignment was, when you crafted 54 you would have intended to vote at that time and you would've put the vote in there in the first place.

@ Saulres, did you find my 39 suspicious? If so, why are you voting the person I voted in that post? (Unless you think I am bussing Shmugen that early in the game).

I found it suspicious enough on my read-through that if I were following real-time I would have asked you about it. But I didn't read it real-time, and I have other notes on you that made me not as worried about that for now.

you're saying that not waffling on a RVS-born Townread by post 39 is scummy?

Where did I say that?

I am curious as to how you found time to follow the activity of other players, and more importantly why you felt the need to check it when you yourself can barely find time to post.

I wanted reactions from Xalxe. I kept hoping they would materialize. It takes no time at all to click on his name, view all his posts, and search for "trip". It also requires no thought. Reading and analyzing a game takes work, seeing activity doesn't.

I really think we should use all the time available to us in order to catch scum today.

If you were

really

worried about that, you'd have unvoted. Unless you think I'm scum and both the other scum are already on my wagon.

More likely you don't really care. And there's only one reason for that.

VOTE: Nobody Special

L-2.

[Shamrock]

So... your read on Shmugen is so strong that you're drawing associational tells based on his presumed scumflip, and you've given no indication of having disavowed that read... yet now you're switching your vote?

[Shamrock]

Yes, by the time I got there I felt he was scum. But it was more than that. In 54 you questioned him, and questioned me. But then you didn't place a vote until the next post. That felt like town saying "You know, this bothered me enough that I think it's worth putting a vote on that guy." If you were scum, no matter what Shmugen's alignment was, when you crafted 54 you would have intended to vote at that time and you would've put the vote in there in the first place.

This is pretty weak stuff. I'd call it "bush league" if I were trying to suck up to Tierce.

It's also different reasoning than what you used to explain your mystery read on me earlier.

Your play literally makes no sense to me if you are town.

[saulres]

Huh what?

I just explained that the way you placed the vote cemented my read on you regardless of his alignment.

Yes I moved my vote. There's not just one scum in this game.

pedit: "different reasoning": mea culpa. My note on you from the readthrough is "54-55: Town". When I first went back to explain it I had to recreate my thinking. Today I was clearer and expounded on it.

[Shamrock]

That's not the point I was trying to make. Given the strength of your professed Shmugen read, I don't understand your votehop to NS.

[saulres]

I don't think it's in town's best interest for me to discuss that any further until after NS posts again.

[Empire]

Finished my paper (30 pages with 160+ citations) but I don't want to do anything involving critical thinking for a bit. Expect a large, obnoxious catch-up wallpost tonight or tomorrow at the latest.

[Vi]

Vote Count IX:

Toward red
saulres (L-1) ~ Nobody Special, Shamrock, Tierce, Shmugen
Nobody Special (L-2) ~ Empire, Konowa, saulres
Shmugen (L-4) ~

{saulres,}

F-16_Fighting_Falcon
F-16_Fighting_Falcon (L-4) ~ Xalxe

-saulres is at L-1!

--With 9 alive, it takes 5 to lynch.
--Deadline is November 12, 2012 - in

(expired on 2012-11-12 20:00:00)

.

[Shmugen]

Prod-dodge while someone opts to wise up.

[Tierce]

Is this a typical white flag setup? I've never done one, do scum have a traditional wincon?

What does your Role PM tell you?

@ Saulres, did you find my 39 suspicious? If so, why are you voting the person I voted in that post? (Unless you think I am bussing Shmugen that early in the game).

I found it suspicious enough on my read-through that if I were following real-time I would have asked you about it. But I didn't read it real-time, and I have other notes on you that made me not as worried about that for now.

you're saying that not waffling on a RVS-born Townread by post 39 is scummy?

Where did I say that?

That's how you treat it when you call F-16_Fighting_Falcon's behavior "suspicious".

[Shmugen]

Something about lynching two scum. Looks eerily similar to the sample PM.

[Tierce]

...are you seriously expecting someone to go "oops

my

the scum wincon is X?"

We don't know it.

[Shmugen]

Is that truly what you think I meant when I said 'wise up'? I was referring to the Saulres wagon.

[Tierce]

No, I was answering 207.

[Shmugen]

I'm a stranger to the White Flag format, I was of the opinion this was a funky game that followed the town portion of what is apparently a semi-common game type. In that case, the scum wincon of the White Flag format should be semi-common knowledge.

[Tierce]

White Flag (Mechanic). It's a normal wincon.

But we don't know if it's the same here.

[Shmugen]

I see.