Mini 1431: The Tenements (Game Over)

[WT Snacks]

Vote: Limo

[WT Snacks]

UNVOTE: VOTE: UberNinja for breaking the chain and voting someone not in the game. Is mastin2 in one of your other games or something?

[WT Snacks]

Far too early for a serious vote. Mostly I'm upset you broke the chain :p

[WT Snacks]

Re: Uberninja: Party Pooper (No link provided )

Re: CoolDog:
1) It isn't incomprehensible
2) Nor is it irrelevant. It was merely a tool to help get us past RVS.

Lol how does posting

random

shit help us get past the

random

vote stage? This is bullshit scum filler posting. UNVOTE: VOTE: The Rufflig

[WT Snacks]

Mostly useless, no scum pings from him tho.

[WT Snacks]

a) there are no pirates and lazers and gold in that story
b) it was a fucking useless story
c) of course he's "mostly useless", 3/4 of the game is "mostly useless" at this point
d) what kind of scum pings are you expecting on page 3 of a game with 0 activity?
e) there is no e, but I want a damn good response to the above 4 points.

a) k
b) k
c) no shit, sherlock
d) we'll take whatever we can get. you think we should all just go "oh lol it's early game, no scumhunting to be done here"?
e) huehuehuehue

[WT Snacks]

Yeah. You know what? I find that I'm really not that interested in defending my early posts against the charge of them being garbage or filler as there was nothing going on at the time. However, there are relevant topics available for WT to discuss and he's actively avoiding them in favor of posting garbage.

I'm not sure how us answering a question is "garbage" compared to your stupid spammy youtube links, but okay.

[WT Snacks]

cooldog admitted to being scum

lynch the fuck out of him

that's all. thanks for listening

Can you explain why cooldog is scum? I want to sheep you but I don't see it.

[WT Snacks]

Uber:

Can you explain why cooldog is scum?

[WT Snacks]

how does this reconcile itself in your mind?

Well, first of all, different heads.

Secondly, I made no pretense that I was posting youtube videos to push us out of RVS. Secondly, you asked a bunch of derpty questions and got some derpty answers. Trying to spin it as though I'm scum for answering the questions you asked is disingenuous at best.

[WT Snacks]

he's scummy because he's trying to get town cred for something mundane
he's scummy because he's making all sorts of weird assertions which seem uncharacteristic of townies

You voted

before

he did his stupid fake day action.

[WT Snacks]

This game needs some prods

[WT Snacks]

While i see he getting paranoid at L-1 and how he called me scum the moment i asked for being paranoid.

Getting paranoid at L-1 isn't a scum tell. Lots of players, both scum and town, get frustrated being at L-1. The refusal to claim is the scum tell. The town has spoken by running CD up to L-1. Town expects a claim at that point, and his refusal to do so is nothing more than the giving of a middle finger to the town.

Disagree. There's no way in hell I'd claim on page 6.

[WT Snacks]

Thanks for checking in, JacobSavage. I find it difficult to believe that you forgot about this game when your posts keep showing up about 2 hours before you are due to be prodded. We'll see you again in about 46 hours then?

That's just how Jacob plays. I've been in two+ other games with him and he just lurk lurk lurks. It's very annoying but not indicative of alignment.

[WT Snacks]

Well, I happen to know Limo and JacobSavage are both in Mainstream Mafia (large theme). I know they are both active in that game. I also know that Mainstream Mafia went into night 2 yesterday evening. So the two of them should have enough bloody time currently to play this game or decide they can't handle this many games and replace out!

I reported this post as well; that's really not appropriate.

[WT Snacks]

and the rest haven't been much active yet to tell anything about them...

We've been pretty active. What do you think about us?

[WT Snacks]

If Uber is town and truly believes CD is scum, why would he care if there was a derp hammer?
If Uber is scum and knows CD is scum, he sure doesn't want a hammer, he wants to derail the CD lynch(which Uber has clearly tried to do).

Specious reasoning is specious.

What about the case where Uber is town and CD's reaction changes Uber's read?

[WT Snacks]

@WT what are your current reads at the moment. (Is this redundant current - moment?)

I don't like to give lists of reads; it just helps scum know who to kill.

Leaning town on Slandaar and Mr Obvious tho.

I want ArcAngel to answer my question.

[WT Snacks]

Good luck getting anything out of him. I've been trying for a few days now.

No you haven't. I just skimmed through your iso and you haven't addressed anything to us personally. So if you have a direct question, ask it. Otherwise stop trying to mischaracterize what's happened this game.

[WT Snacks]

WT, man, you gotta tells us your reads.

Not really, no.

[WT Snacks]

VOTE: ArcAngel

I see you active on site. Come answer my question.

[WT Snacks]

VOTE: ArcAngel

I see you active on site. Come answer my question.

wrong reason to vote for arcangle. If this is your real reason you would hop on jacob.

Your post makes zero sense.

1) You don't get to decide what our reasons for voting are.

2) I haven't asked jacob any questions that I want answered. I agree that Jacob's play has been even shittier than he usually is, but I'm focusing on other things right now. Meanwhile, Arc has been throwing OMGUS at anyone who votes her, so I want to see where this goes.

[WT Snacks]

Believe me, we're not letting jacob go by unnoticed.

[WT Snacks]

you're sheeping my wagon with no reason. This is a scum vote.

Huehuehue, fucking called it.

The only people who you think are scummy are the ones who vote you? Nope. You're scum and my vote stays.

[WT Snacks]

give us some fucking reads or your head will be on a pike

Oooooh, the Internet Tough Guy is threatening me. Go fuck yourself, Uber. You're consistently a prick in every game you play and it doesn't do you any favours. Last game we played together you tunnelled on us the whole game and at the end it was revealed we were town. Then you admitted you need to learn to read us better.

Are you sure you're just not as good at mafia as you think you are?

This continual dick-waving you do to try to be the dominant player in the game won't work.

[WT Snacks]

let's all call each other scum
and vote each other

She's voting cooldog you retard.

[WT Snacks]

Well, I blame myself for not being clear. When I said reads. I actually meant scum reads. That's what I am looking for. Like, who do you think is scummy and why?

Hey, since you're not a prick i'll actually answer.

- Arc Angel has done nothing but throw omgus and then argue about game theory instead of scum hunting.
- I'm also actually thinking Jacob might be scum. I played with him in a few other games and yeah, he lurks and is shitty, but I've seen his town game and this is a new level of shit, even for jacob.
- Null-scum on uber because despite the constant "hurr i'm the alpha male" routine, he's not actually doing much analysis, and his play is different from/more schizophrenic than in happy tree friends. Instead, he's just quoting posts and going "probtown," "probscum"... that's not worth anything at all, to anyone.

Everyone else is either null or town. I'm not going to get into who.

Anyways, the reason I don't like doing this:

@WT Snacks: I would understand if you withheld some of your town reads. There can be good reasons for that. Robbing the scum of information on who to nk falls under that. I don't understand the rationale to withhold your scum reads. Why do this?

Is because listing your reads is basically the same thing. If everyone posted just their scum reads, then it would be a simple process of elimination to see who wasn't listed in very many scum lists. That person is likely to be seen as town by most.

It's really not a difficult concept and I don't see why it's so hard for you guys to grasp. If you want to know who someone finds scummy, look where their vote is.

[WT Snacks]

But yes, it will work.

I bet it won't. Your opinion only carries weight because the newbies in this game are letting you lead them around by the noses.

[WT Snacks]

- I'm also actually thinking Jacob might be scum. I played with him in a few other games and yeah, he lurks and is shitty, but I've seen his town game and this is a new level of shit, even for jacob.

There. Now you see, you just told me something that I didn't know. Why hide a scum read like that behind something like this?

That's just how Jacob plays. I've been in two+ other games with him and he just lurk lurk lurks. It's very annoying but not indicative of alignment.

That doesn't get scum lynched. That gives scum a pass for lurking.

Opinions. They change.

[WT Snacks]

Nothing like a post-by-post analysis to get you out of a hole when you're scum, am I right Angel?

[WT Snacks]

Pro-tip: fluff posting is not, in and of itself, a scum tell.

[WT Snacks]

1) She's scum, I'm not obligated to answer/respond to anything she says

2) Why are you defending her?

[WT Snacks]

It looks more like he's pointing out your argument sucks.

Grats on making your 4th post. Are you going to actually play the game, or what?

[WT Snacks]

Just because I don't slosh the forum with snarky posts like you and UN doesn't mean I'm not playing the game.

Says the lurker with 5 posts across 16 pages.

[WT Snacks]

she at least made a comparatively decent effort in #365, which was sneeringly ignored.

Difference of opinion?

Doing a PBPA where you just list the contents of each post is not, in my opinion, decent effort. Anyscum can do that.

[WT Snacks]

Says the lurker with 5 posts across 16 pages.

Not completely true is it?

Not true at all, Syryana replaced in near the end of page 12.

Oh, my mistake. I was looking at the Activity Overview.

[WT Snacks]

Uber why are you calling for doc? Either you're hinting at having a PR - which is a stupid move for day 1 - or you're scum trying to establish town cred.

[WT Snacks]

People should vote Gorckat

Why?

[WT Snacks]

Ugh, this game.

There is literally no way that our wagon is composed solely of townies. I'm looking at gorckat, possibly rufflig, and definitely Uber.

VOTE: UberNinja

He spent all game wagon-hopping. This is not scummy in and of itself, but because most of you sheep follow him around, it allows him to drag out the day and get us close to deadline, which makes it convenient and provides a nice cover for him to limp onto our wagon. He has no real reason, he just says it's for his peace of mind, and that it's because we're getting close to deadline. How convenient. If you try to call him on weak reasoning he'll say "lol I was hopping all day" and "it was close to deadline, stfu newbie" or something along those lines.

He'll also probably spout some WIFOM about how "I wouldn't do this as scum, it's in scum's best interest to end the day early" which will again be a convenient smoke screen. As if scum can't purposefully do something pro-town to gain towncreds

If there's only 3 days left to deadline, then we need to lynch SOMEBODY.

When we flip town he can lament that it was a "compromise lynch." Notice he set himself up for not having time to get a re-read in:

I'm doing a reread right now. I'm up to page 13 and my reads have changed substantially. I'll finish out my reread tomorrow evening and share my thought and new reads then. Jacob didn't move from the scum category, so my vote is fine there for the moment.

I'm going to do this exact thing.

Okay fine let's lynch WT. If I get a re-read in, great. Otherwise, WT should die before Day 3 anyway for my peace of mind

Vote: WT Snacks

Posts 459 and 460 came 1 minute apart, btw. So much for reading the thread, am I right? Nope, a convenient excuse to limp onto a wagon.

--

Even though we're only at L-2 (and we were before), since I can't trust any of you shitlords not to just fast-hammer instead of waiting for us to claim I will do it now. We are the

Lessor's Assistant

.

At night we can

salvage

metal scraps (or unused items from other dead players) from the junk yard, we can

manufacture

items using the DIYconstruct, or we can

use items

that we've got. We also have a passive

day ability

that I'm not going to claim, because fuck you.

--

Lynch us if you want, but you fuckers had better take a good hard look at the people on this wagon after we flip town. I want to reiterate the bit about Uber not being as good as he thinks he is, and having no idea whatsoever how to read us in Happy Tree Friends.

[WT Snacks]

Other head also had a good point: Uber is buddying up to a lot of people, trying to make town friends.

http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.ph ... 6#p4791606

http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.ph ... 5#p4788955

http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.ph ... 8#p4786778

[WT Snacks]

L-1 btw

[WT Snacks]

This stuff right here?

Rufflig, please tell us again why you faked a PR.

*sigh*
---

Welcome back to the music, friends. MrObvious has requested a blast from the past. Our next song was an international hit reaching number 4 on the Billboard chart on the week of Easter in 1974. The song itself was a successful blend of rock music and biblical verse paving the way for modern contemporary Christian rock music. The song was sung by Sister Janet Mead (well worth reading about on wikipedia) who donated her share of the royalties from the song to charity. Here she is: Sister Janet Mead and The Lord's Prayer.

---

No. Feel free to make your case on me, though. Meanwhile, I'll just wait to see what gorckat has to say before jumping into that particular topic.

It's both (what a shock)

Here is a musical riddle for you:
What do you get when you cross Star Trek (the original series) with J.R.R. Tolkien's The Hobbit?

Spoiler:

Leonard Nimoy singing The Ballad of Bilbo Baggins.

Do you honestly not see why CoolDog did not have a point?

CoolDog was trying to argue that I was scared of making an rvs vote and I was trying to avoid drawing attention to myself by faking a post restriction. Really? I'm scared of making a rvs vote so instead I guarantee that I'll bring the attention of every damn player in the game on me by pretending I have a post restricition. Yeah, ok. Go with the scared theory. I'd love to see you argue in favor of it.

At any rate, let's talk about CoolDog's reason for voting me and the others, too.

His "I'm scared" theory is obviously a bunch of it. What I expected from a townie was questioning about the PR. As CoolDog stated fake PRs are very easy to see through. All CD had to do is establish what mine was and then watch for a slip, but he voted way before then. I would have accepted policy lynch as a valid reason for his vote or reaction testing or even that he thought my PR was obviously fake among other reasons. I got none of that from him or WT Snacks or SoraAdvent. I got terrible reasons from them for their votes that didn't hold any water. Why should I not have been suspicious of them? You guys can call it paranoid, if you want. I state that I had valid reasons for my suspicions.

It's from scum who's upset that he got caught for the wrong reasons.

[WT Snacks]

It's from scum who's upset that he got caught for the wrong reasons.

Hey, welcome to the game, WT Snacks! Glad to have you with us. We're happy to have a fresh set of eyes look over the game and give us some new opinions and insights. Would you care to back your opinion with a vote?

Okay UNVOTE: VOTE: The Rufflig

I can't seem to get enough support for a UN lynch, but I'll settle for a Rufflig.

[WT Snacks]

Fine.

VOTE: Gorckat

Also I want to say that the way Rufflig words his posts is irritating as fuck.

[WT Snacks]

Yeahhhh that wasn't my ideal lynch, but it's better than no lynch at all.

U scum bro?

[WT Snacks]

Yet, when gorckat was at L-1, you ignored him completely. The question being why?

Gorckat was at L-1, we waited for the claim, what else is there to do?

[WT Snacks]

VOTE: Rufflig

[WT Snacks]

Well, you could have voted for him before he hit L-1. Ok, so maybe you weren't around at that time. You could have added your comments or arguments for why gorckat was scum. You could have threatened a hammer to force a claim out of gorckat instead of just pointing out that gorckat was at L-1. You could have pressed him on any part of his play with questions as you were in a position to hammer him.

And you could have voted gorckat. Instead you conspicuously stayed off the wagon.

After the claim while we were in deadline crunch, you might have mentioned that you were willing to hammer or going to hammer after a specific length of time. You might have decided that you didn't like the argument against gorckat and stated that you would not hammer. You might have stated that you weren't going to hammer a claimed PR day 1. In fact, there were many things you could have done besides be non-committal during deadline crunch to let the town know whether you would or would not help to lynch gorckat. Instead, you sat on the fence apparently content to let a no lynch happen until you were goaded.

Wasn't goaded. Came back at deadline to hammer because it was necessary. Weak scum read turned out to be a good read. Meanwhile where were you on the gorckat wagon? Oh right, parking your vote on an obvtownie.

As far as the way I'm wording my posts being irritating, you are correct. I've been goading you on purpose. I started out being polite and then direct. Neither approach worked. You did respond to me intentionally getting under your skin, so I've been doing that whenever I really want a response from you.

Nah, I've read some of your other games and you word your posts the same way. It's annoying either way.

I don't mind getting lynched, if the town will afterwards look at who was trying to revive my wagon while gorckat was getting lynched.

Good, then shut up and get lynched, scum.

[WT Snacks]

Read Rufflig's iso. He has done zero scumhunting.

His content consists of asking people what their scum reads are and trying to defend himself. He's more concerned about establishing himself as town then he is with finding scum.

[WT Snacks]

Given that you claimed yesterday, did you take action last night?

We salvaged and got a piece of scrap metal. So I assume that means we won't be able to make anything until N3, and won't be able to use anything we make until N4.

It might give us an idea of what powers mafia has.

I don't see how, given what we claimed, that it would give us any insight into scum's powers whatsoever. Trying to see if we got a sweet item that you should nightkill us over?

[WT Snacks]

That means that a Hathor Drone can salvage metal scraps. Perhaps it's an equivalent power to the tenants.

wat

[WT Snacks]

Pshaw! Well, if you're going to lie, you might as well lie big. Btw, I notice that you are still ignoring the questions I put to you.

You're scum. We're not obligated to answer your questions.

I keep having to ask who are your suspects because 1) You don't tell us and 2) you aren't doing any scum hunting, so we can't tell who you suspect.

1) Keep asking.
2) Demonstrably false.

I don't suppose you'd care to answer any of the questions about your suspects or your play late yesterday? Didn't think so. Ok, just keep burying your head in the sand and hoping for the best.

I like how you answered your own question in the same post you asked it, as if that somehow makes your point stronger.

When you're done pretending to provide content and analysis I'll be over here, lynching you.

[WT Snacks]

WT, I support Rufflig in you needing to answer his questions on the premise that you don't absolutely know if he's scum.

He doesn't actually ask many questions that have gone unanswered. Mostly it's just posturing and defending himself from 20 pages ago. He keeps harping on about "who do we find scummy" well, look where our fucking vote is. I wonder who we find scummy?

[WT Snacks]

Hi, we're still here. It's Easter this weekend, probably won't get a post up today as we're both busy. Likely tomorrow.

[WT Snacks]

Do you think the scum was inactive while gorckat was getting run up or would you suspect that the scum tried to ignite interest in another wagon (that would be mine) during this time frame?

Try again, scum. Gorkat had 2 votes when I voted you. That's hardly a wagon that needs to be distracted from. I'd gladly support a Slandaar lynch as well.

I'll admit that your vote (with no case) came while gorckat had only 2 votes. However, your case on me didn't come until after gorckat was at L-1, at which point you did start pushing for my lynch.

Let's go over your case, shall we?

Why did Rufflig fake a PR?

Reason 1 - get us out of the RVS
Reason 2 - gather reactions.

Scummily inconsistent!

My apologies for snipping the quoted parts out, but they weren't necessary. What gets the game out of rvs? Content. What is content at the beginning of a game? Reactions to posts or reactions to lack of posts mainly. Why is getting out of rvs scummily inconsistent with gathering reactions? This is the thrust of your initial argument, but it doesn't make any sense to me. Would you care to explain?

---

Your next argument involved my dismissal of CoolDog's "points". You dismissed my argument that CoolDog's "points" had no basis in favor of a lynch all liars approach.

You are missing the point. I really don't care what Cooldog's argument was. Whether you like it or not, or agree with them or not, Cooldog had made several points when you said he had made none.

The trouble is that your first argument supported some of CoolDog's arguments and you obviously care about CoolDog's arguments from your next post.

Rufflig, Cooldog's spot on, could only be from a townie, post 69 kicked your ass so hard, you've been butthurt crying about it ever since.

---

You also try to link me with JacobSavage.

It is clear to see here that Rufflig is coaching his scumbuddy JacobSavage.

You should know better than this. You can't make a link like this without knowing either player's alignment. You are concluding that I am scum based off JacobSavage's alignment. I think the tv legal phrase is "Objection! Assumes facts not in evidence".

Rufflig continues to defend himself thoroughly against the day 1 case against him. This reads to me like he's upset that he got caught on a weak case, he can't resist the urge to point out why the case if flawed. This is not helpful to town.

---

It is possible that the scum did not try to push a competing wagon. In which case, korranth and SoraAdvent come readily to mind. Neither of them appeared to be around while gorckat was at L-1. Unfortunately, neither of them is available for questioning -- we can only question their replacements.

---
I'm going to leave off JacobSavage for now for a couple of reasons. The most important being that I want to hear his answer to Syryana.

Here Rufflig provides his incredibly valuable and insightful scum hunting. He's not going to vote anyone and he's going to provide some obvious commentary on the game. He's just trying to appear involved in the game for townie points, but not actually doing anything.

Am I living in the twilight zone? How do people think this is town behaviour. It's very shallow gameplay devoid of critical thinking, analysis, pressure votes, anything that a real town would do when trying to find scum.

Our vote stands where it is.

[WT Snacks]

Did someone just poked me!!Huh!!


Am not sure about Ruflling, this is his usual town meta unless he is faking it now....

We're gonna need some more content from you than this.

[WT Snacks]

You have zero reading comprehension.

@WT Snacks: Wow. Way to not read anything I wrote. I wasn't defending my actions. I was showing what crappy, misleading and contradictory arguments MrObvious was piling on me while gorckat was at L-1 as this was possible scum activity to save gorckat.

Pointing out what how bad a case is that someone made on you is called defending yourself.

You said that this analysis on MrObvious is

obvious

and shallow

I said no such thing.

As far as my not going to vote anyone -- now you're

obviously

just making things up now in order to try and push my lynch through.

Did I miss any votes besides your OMGUS on MrObvious and us?

[WT Snacks]

I have been posting nearly everyday, so not proddodging ...

I don't think you understand what proddodging is.

[WT Snacks]

I don't think the pressure will work on Klick.

VOTE: JacobSavage

Anyways, I agree with Fitz.

What a completely weak-ass way to jump ship when your scumbuddy gets to L-1.

Would happily lynch any of Klick, Rufflig, Jacob. Let's pick one and go for it.

[WT Snacks]

^
Two of your suspects are viable wagons. What are you waiting for? Make a choice and vote. If you're really feeling daring, make a case as well.

---

Why kick Guille over voting for someone that you are willing to lynch?

Any time you want to contribute to the game is fine with me.

[WT Snacks]

^
Two of your suspects are viable wagons. What are you waiting for? Make a choice and vote. If you're really feeling daring, make a case as well.

---

Why kick Guille over voting for someone that you are willing to lynch?

1) You WERE a viable wagon until your scumbuddy Guile hopped off when you got to L-1
2) I meant to include Guile on that list but I was in a rush to finish the post
3) Currently voting my biggest scumread while you've spent the whole game defending yourself because you're upset you got outed as scum for the wrong reasons, too early in D1

[WT Snacks]

3) Turn off the tape machine. You've been saying that since day 1. You've yet to make any headway. Time to face reality, I'm not going to be lynched today. We're darn close to another deadline crunch, so how about you make yourself useful and put your vote somewhere where it will count for something?

We have three days still to go, that's plenty of time for scumhunting. You appear to be happy to just wagon on to klick for lurking while providing none of your own insights, just hoping on what you hope is an easy wagon.

Ok.
UNVOTE:
VOTE: klick

Looks like somebody doesn't really care that much about finding scum today.

[WT Snacks]

Sheeping a quality case

VOTE: Guille2015

[WT Snacks]

Does this argument between Matt and Mr Obvious have a point?

[WT Snacks]

I'll take that as a "no"

[WT Snacks]

Needs moar guille votes.

[WT Snacks]

Wow, I had to log in because I could feel you buddying so hard that it transcended time and space to reach me offline.

[WT Snacks]

D1: Salvage - Metal Scraps
N1: Dusa Injection
D2: Salvage.

It only takes you 1 metal scrap to make an item?

[WT Snacks]

Oh wait, whoops, I misread my role pm. Never mind.

[WT Snacks]

Nah MrObvious is p town, not willing to wagon him.

[WT Snacks]

I'm close to claiming just to wake you up

Don't do that

[WT Snacks]

UNVOTE: guille
VOTE: The Rufflig

As much as I'd love to lynch Rufflig right in his fedora-wearing face, I think this is a wasted vote given the time frame we're dealing with.

[WT Snacks]

Well, deadline is in 4 hrs so

VOTE: JacobSavage

[WT Snacks]

Well, shit. Got roleblocked last night.

[WT Snacks]

Theory question: How many scum would you expect in a 13p game? 3?

[WT Snacks]

Well, shit. Got roleblocked last night.

How do you know this?

My role manufactures at night, not during the day. Manufacturing failed last night, some bastard probably gave us the Dusa injection.

[WT Snacks]

How would I know?

[WT Snacks]

I have that option, in addition to manufacturing from metal scraps. But as I already mentioned, I was roleblocked last night.

[WT Snacks]

You do choose which item when you use the ability, right?

I don't really understand what you're asking. We choose the item we wish to manufacture, just like the Tenants do. The difference is we salvage at night instead of during the day, I assume because of our day ability.

As far as knowing what other peoples' items are: My understanding of the mechanic was that if a player dies and has unused items on their corpse, that item has a random chance to be given to a salvaging player instead of metal scraps. My understanding is also that you don't get to choose whether you receive scraps or an unused item. See the Sample PM in the inaugural post; that portion of our PM is worded very similarly.

We didn't salvage last night, we tried to manufacture and were blocked, and so we have no way of knowing what items Guille may or may not have had.

[WT Snacks]

The likelihood of there being a DayDoc (or insert protective/blocker role here) that got lucky and blocked the SK Day 1 is pretty low IMO.

Since we are playing the speculation game, my guess is the reason there was no D1 kill is because the targeted(Slandaar) is bullet/fireproof.

VOTE: Slandaar

How do you know Slandaar was targeted?

[WT Snacks]

TWO PEOPLE GOT SHIT STOLEN???? DOES NOT COMPUTE. YOU STOLE MY MOTHER FUCKING THING.

I didn't steal shit. I salvaged the first night and got metal scraps. Someone stole them last night and I tried to salvage again, but the action failed. I now have no items.

Sure you do. What about that prophetic augmentation??? How did you get that? hm?

How do you know he had a Prophetic pill?

Stolen items: I find it difficult to credit that both CoolDog and MrObvious both had an item stolen from them night 2 while there were no reported thefts night 1. It seems to me that it is CoolDog who is putting on an act for us and using this issue to vote for MrObvious.

except that you are an asshole and no one cares about your opinion because you have contributed nothing. Moving on.

I haven't heard anyone step up and say they protected Slandaar on D1.

I haven't heard anyone step up and say they targetted Slandaar on D1.

I really don't believe there were no steals N1 and 2 N2 also.

even night stealer. It could work. But two steals make no fucking sense. Mr. obvious is lying through his goddamn teeth. PLUS. NOT EVERYTHING IS STOLLEN JUST ONE THING. AND IT DOESN'T STEAL YOUR GODDAMN ITEM THAT YOU JUST GOT TONIGHT. BECAUSE IT IS ONLY ONE ITEM. Obvious is not telling the truth lynch his fucking ass.

Also, I know you guys are inclined to believe the guy who talks first. But seriously, if I'm wrong you can lynch me tomorrow.

Appealing to emotion won't make your case stronger. If you can prove he's lying, then step up. Otherwise you should unvote because MrObv is unlikely to be scum.

And, like WT said, fuck you if you think I'm explaining the details of my day action. However, it was what I was referring to here...

guille burned by my hands for his quick jump from L-1 on Klick.

You might as well fullclaim your day abilities since you've already sort-of outed them.

2) If MrObvious truly thought Slandaar was scummy then why did he wait until day 3 under threat of being lynched to come forward with this information?

Reasons for not outing yourself as a very powerful PR in the early game should be obvious.

@WT Snacks: What do you think of MrObvious' claim of lessor and bbq based on your own role?

I am strongly inclined to believe it. We had him pegged as the Lessor about 10 pages ago.

If I claim we may aswell just massclaim I think

I'm against massclaiming at this point.

Do you and Snacks have some kind of private QT, MrObv? Since you're Lessor and he's Lessor's assistant, are you two affiliated behind the scenes or is that just flavor?

We have no private communication with MrObv. Our role PM said that the Lessor existed, but we were not told who he was.

Indeed, I have played in and read games with a GF (or godfather like role) before, but never one that was bulletproof -- occasionally, the GF would have a second ability. Could you show me a

mini

that had a BP GF? I suspect that the role you are describing would be more common to large games (which I don't play or read very often).

Setup speculation is not usually a winning strategy.

[WT Snacks]

And that's your only duty during the day?

[WT Snacks]

And that's your only duty during the day?

Other than my vote, yes.

Was it described as a Duty?

[WT Snacks]

We have no private communication with MrObv. Our role PM said that the Lessor existed, but we were not told who he was.

Did it state that the Lessor was town aligned?

Strictly speaking, no. But based on the wording of things I probably shouldn't reveal it would be extremely unlikely if the Lessor was scum

[WT Snacks]

'Kay

Well in my eyes MrObvious is all but confirmed town. Prudent town should be unvoting him.

I am going to read some isos, Slandaar and Cooldog in particular

[WT Snacks]

Scumteam is ArcAngel, Rufflig, Cooldog?

GG.

VOTE: Cooldog

[WT Snacks]

So, either MrObv or CoolDoG is lying about being stolen from, so you want to lynch the dayvig? Are you sane?

The sk has been conspicuously ignoring CoolDog in favor of lynching someone else. I surmise that a CoolDog lynch will therefore prove that CoolDog is telling the truth and that MrObvious is the one who has been lying. How else do you explain MrObvious' behavior?

Put your money where your mouth is and lynch cooldog, then.

[WT Snacks]

I don't know. How many would you expect in a 12p?

I'm mostly used to playing face to face games, where typical ratios are 3:1 town:scum. For a 12p game that equates to 4 scum, give or take depending on relative power of town or scum teams.

[WT Snacks]

WT Snacks, Did you claimed role?
Why i am thinking that you already claimed. Please correct me if i am wrong.

If you were actually reading the game, you would know the answer to this question.

Go read the game.

[WT Snacks]

Can you just answer the damn question..

No

[WT Snacks]

If you aren't going to read the thread, why did you sign up to play the game?

[WT Snacks]

If you aren't going to read the thread, why did you sign up to play the game?

I said i read the game. I couldn't find that you claimed but i some how feel like i read it some where and wanted to confirm it with you
since you want to act like uncoperative old woman, I can't do anything about it. feel free to think what ever you fell like.

Jesus Christ. Use the iso tool at the bottom of every page. Do an iso on WT Snacks. CTRL+F "claim"

[WT Snacks]

Not our fault if you don't know how to use a computer. Now sit there in the corner while we finish finding your scumbuddies.

[WT Snacks]

I like the part where you threaten to change your read because you're mad. Real strong town play.

[WT Snacks]

Okay, ignoring the part where certain players named ArcAngel are useless, here is the MrObvious wagon:

Slandaar, havingfitz, CooLDoG, The Rufflig

The chance of this wagon being all townies approaches 0%.

[WT Snacks]

Yeah you stuck your neck out, didn't get the mislynch, and now you need to retreat into your QT to discuss strategy.

[WT Snacks]

Obvious: did you know beforehand that when you kill someone their alignment would be hidden?

Yes.

Why would you ever use it then? you must understand how bad this is if you hit town; the person who you killeds posts are useless you can't look at their interactions or their wagon(s) etc and it makes VCA useless all because we do not KNOW their alignment. It makes the town more uninformed than normal.

And then the question arises from that; Would town ever have such a role?

Slandaar is still trying to push through the MrObv wagon. This is a stupid argument, if we’re going to speculate about game setup what seems more likely, town has a dayvig that doesn’t reveal alignment? Or scum has an added daykill?

Nice try scum, you can't weasel your way out of this one.

UNVOTE: VOTE: Slandaar

[WT Snacks]

TWO PEOPLE GOT SHIT STOLEN???? DOES NOT COMPUTE. YOU STOLE MY MOTHER FUCKING THING.

I didn't steal shit. I salvaged the first night and got metal scraps. Someone stole them last night and I tried to salvage again, but the action failed. I now have no items.

Sure you do. What about that prophetic augmentation??? How did you get that? hm?

^ This right here. Either CoolDog or MrObvious is lying. I will not support any other lynch today.

VOTE: MrObvious]

100% agree. I am 100% willing to take one for the team on this one. My reads are usually wrong and And I'm probably a distraction. Here is the deal though. WHEN I FLIP TENANT YOU MUST KILL OBVIOUS WITH THE FUCKING FLAMES OF HELL TOMORROW. I will stalk your games and policy lynch any dipshits who don't. period.

And lets talk hypothetically, lets say you are town, why would you target me for the kill?

he is bullshitting you.

also, wt snaks vote basically is a scum claim at this point. Because there is no reason on earth not to lynch one of me or obvious. Any other vote is 100% unproductive and can not come from town. Unless that town is a genuine dipshit.

Lynch order if I get lynched has to go like this:
obvious->snacks->game over.

This is all setup speculation with nothing to go on. It's certainly possible that two people had items stolen since we have no idea which role(s) have the ability to steal items.

It all seem very weak. You claim that MrObvious has your item, he says he doesn't, therefore we

must

lynch one of them?

If I say you're scum and you say you're town, does that mean we

must

lynch one of us since one of us is lying? Do you have any reason to think its MrObvious that has your item?

[WT Snacks]

This far into the game we should be able to build stronger cases than "I think he stole my shit, he says no therefore lets lynch us to find out."

[WT Snacks]

Where did CD claim this? I missed it.

[WT Snacks]

So what the fuck was that shit about the prophetic augmentation?

VOTE: cooldog

[WT Snacks]

Well, told u guys he was town.

That basically confirms us town.

[WT Snacks]

Although I have to say I was genuinely surprised when Cooldog flipped town.

[WT Snacks]

Let's be careful with votes. If both the burnt bodies were town we could conceivably be in LyLo right now.

[WT Snacks]

OK lets massclaim

order is;
Syry
AA
Fitz
Me
WT

Syry claim.

Hahaha, I don't fucking think so.

Slaandar claims first.

[WT Snacks]

So you can clear ArcAngel?

[WT Snacks]

AA has done absolutely nothing this game. She just skims the surface and picks at the most superficial nuggets. If she is town she has zero chance of finding scum, and if I were scum I'd be keeping her alive for that reason.

[WT Snacks]

I have 2 votes therefore Syry/AA cannot be buddies

How does that clear AA

[WT Snacks]

So, you think MrObv burning your townreads is a good thing, do you?

Where are you going with this post?

[WT Snacks]

Slandaar says he can confirm himself town. My problem with that statement is that lots of people will say "I'm conftown" when really they are not confirmed. Having a 100% solidly confirmed would be awesome in this game.

I'm okay with Slandaar claiming last as long as Slandaar is okay with the notion that if he's not 110% confirmed town after the claim sequence, we're fricasséeing his ass today. Because I'm not going to let him just go last and then have him pull something weak that doesn't actually confirm him unless you give him the benefit of the doubt, or something that only confirms him if you believe his claimed night actions, or something that only confirms him if you can read his role PM, etc. etc. Because that's not "confirmed".

[WT Snacks]

.

any one has any clue how many scum left now.. I hated the burnt to crisp concept..
Its like someone had janitor ability.

How many scum do you think are left? Do you think MrObv burned any scum? What are your current reads?

did I ask the same question in my post, about how many scums being left in the game???
you're reversing my question to me without answering it.

That's because you've done nothing all game. You contribute nothing to the town. Instead of asking how many scum are left, we want you to actually do some thinking on your own, and tell us about it. Your play this game has been objectively horrible and you should feel bad about it.

[WT Snacks]

How many scum do you think are left, ArcAngel?

Who do you think they are, and why?

Who do you think is town, and why?

[WT Snacks]

How many scum do you think are left, ArcAngel?

Who do you think they are, and why?

Who do you think is town, and why?

[WT Snacks]

I would be conftown because when noone else claims PR the town power level dictates I am town.

That's your reason for wanting to go last? That's what you think confirms you as town?

HUEHUEHUEHUEHUEHUEHEUHEUHE

[WT Snacks]

How many scum do you think are left, ArcAngel?

Who do you think they are, and why?

Who do you think is town, and why?

[WT Snacks]

^ I know you would bring this up lady, Hang on.. I ll put my reads in sometime.

Do it now.

[WT Snacks]

Have you already submitted an action today?

[WT Snacks]

I am a Cartographer, I can choose to either be untargettable during the day as I retreat to work on my maps or I can choose to Salvage (I can't manufacture during day)

At night I can manufacture or use items.

I also started with a Recording Wire.

Actions were;
D1; untargettable; N1; Nothing; D2; Salvage; N2; Syringe; D3; Untargettable; N3; Nothing.

Also it's fucking laughable that you think this makes you confirmed town.

[WT Snacks]

ArcAngel I see you posting elsewhere on the site.

Come answer the questions or you're going to die today.

[WT Snacks]

this is a 13 player game

there has to be 3 scum and 10 townies (with power roles)

5 confirmed townies are already dead.
1 scum is dead
2 burnt down to nothing, god know who they are..

having 5 people alive, if the burnt two players are town, there should be 2 scum players alive and we are LyLO situation right now
if miraculously one of the burnt people are scum, we are okay today.

Wow thanks for stating the obvious. All you did was list things that everyone knows, because that info is from mod posts.

And I am leaning to believe that there are 2 scum alive, becuz Janitor is usually a mafia power, i don't see if that power role benefit an town person, so its the work of mafia too confuse the deaths and moreover all these janitized bodies are from either night kill or some surprise deaths, but the lynches.

Being said. Havingfitz gaining CoolDog's vote seems like a town power. So I think HavingFitz is town
WT snacks reads town to me..

And I am confirmed TOWN
so that leaves Slaandar and Syarana as the remaining two scums.
i will read more about their ISO tomorrow and votes one of them.

Oh. My. Fucking. God.

You're not reading the thread at all, are you? You think the "janitor" was scum? You think he's still alive? I can't believe how awful you are.

Get ready to die tonight.

[WT Snacks]

Syryana....WT just gave a claim name iirc. No details. Those should be claimed. We have few enough players now that I see no harm in WT clarifying the connection to MrObv.

Also... RL overload today...will try to comment more nlt tomorrow

Wow, nobody's reading the thread it seems. I claimed everything but our passive day ability, which is Fireproof. In hindsight I imagine that's so the Lessor can't accidentally kill his assistant.

[WT Snacks]

Basically WT/Obvious is some weird kind of lost masons deal with obvious also being a really weak vig. That clearly isn't all the town power; hence I am confirmed town as there must be another PR. My role lessens the impact on town Obvious's ability had and prevents any day actions scum have.

Setup speculation DOES NOT confirm you as town.

[WT Snacks]

I am a Cartographer, I can choose to either be untargettable during the day as I retreat to work on my maps or I can choose to Salvage (I can't manufacture during day)

At night I can manufacture or use items.

I also started with a Recording Wire.

Actions were;
D1; untargettable; N1; Nothing; D2; Salvage; N2; Syringe; D3; Untargettable; N3; Nothing.

What did you receive with your D2 Salvage?
Who did you target with your synringe?

[WT Snacks]

Well, keep in mind that Slandaar's claimed ability is to actively make himself untargetable, compared to passive fireproof.

I want to hear Slandaar's answers to other head's questions before we give reads.

[WT Snacks]

What did you receive with your D2 Salvage?
Who did you target with your synringe?

Scraps, Ruff then You.

Wait, are we talking dusa injection or robotic syringe?

Setup speculation DOES NOT confirm you as town.

I am completely obvtown from it; whats the difference?

Because constantly trying to get people to perceive you as conftown is a scum move.

Whatever the claim is the result is the same...we're left to believe two townies (assuming you are town) are able to avoid MrObv's daykills.

What is hard to believe? 3 PR 1 being a dayvig of sorts the other 2 are immune to it? Nothing because its the truth of the matter. I am sure you know that town can have similar roles in a setup if not 2 of exactly the same role.

[/quote]
On this topic, I was just in a game where there was a passive reflexive jailkeeper and also a combination ascetic/PGO in the town. Pretty similar.

[WT Snacks]

fitz what do you think of syryana?

[WT Snacks]

Can you outline why?

[WT Snacks]

Town doesn't have enough power? We've got 2 confirmed PRs (Obv/WT, and it's a more powerful combo than you're making it out to be) and everyone can be a 1-shot jailkeeper, 1-shot roleblocker, vote mover, 1-shot watcher and I can't even remember what else. You being some sort of untargetable guy doesn't make you conf-town; if anything it makes you conf-scum since scum would need

some

way to counterbalance all that town power. Your argument that you're some kind of self-preserving town PR to "lessen the impact of a vig ability" is frankly ludicrous.

I might be slightly biased knowing my alignment still your logic is wrong because I am town and that is all I need to say. But perhaps I shall show everyone;

Can scum build items?

Do you have some indication that they can't build items?

[WT Snacks]

That is the point; fitz and syry both suggest the items are protown but if scum can build them they are null.

I'm really not sure what point you're trying to make by saying the items are null;

of course

the items themselves are null.

But that doesn't change the fact that, due to having items, this town is basically composed of a lot of 1-shot power roles so again I really don't understand what you're trying to accomplish by arguing this way. Are you suggesting they're both scum?

[WT Snacks]

Surprisingly, I want to wait and see what AA9 comes up with. Let's not hammer until she comes back.

[WT Snacks]

All will be revealed in time.

[WT Snacks]

AA I don't understand what the different colours mean in the list of wagons you posted. Can you explain please?

[WT Snacks]

What I'm saying is I don't understand why you colour-coded us the same as havingfitz, when you say we're town and he's scum.

So, could you just tell me please:

What red means, what green means, and what pink means in #1122?

[WT Snacks]

Red means possibility of scum

At this moment, WT snacks is the only player who I read as confirmed town

WT Snacks

WT Snacks

WT Snacks

Ummmm what? WT is confirmed town, red means possible scum, so let's colour WT as red.

Oh now I get it

Lynch reached! Mod scene will be up later.

MrObvious (2) -

Slandaar

,

CooLDoG

CooLDoG (5) -

Syryana

,

havingfitz

,

ArcAngel9

,

WT Snacks

,

MrObvious

Not voting (1) -

The Rufflig

You've literally just labelled everyone still alive other than you as possible scum. That's really insightful and really helpful analysis. "Everyone other than me could potentially be scum." Great work there AA, legendary game analysis.

[WT Snacks]

Why the VCA and its colors are so important..

Because they contradict your reads, it looks like you're not trying very hard to analyze the game you're just trying to generate content so people stop harassing you and so you don't get prodded again.

It's filler content, which this late in the game is a scum move.

[WT Snacks]

^ that's what i mean that you don't understand what logic going in my brain unless you're in my shoes...

As a townie it's your responsibility to explain that logic to the rest of town. You can't just post some contradictory content and when you get called out on it say "well that's what I think, you have to be me to understand." It doesn't help town at all, it's just useless.

[WT Snacks]

I still think Slandaar is probtown based on early play. That early push on gorckat doesn't feel like a bus.

[WT Snacks]

I also don't think there's much chance that Guille and Rufflig were both town, and therefore we're probably not in lylo.

[WT Snacks]

Here's my thing, though:

AA's play has been so superficial, so shallow, and so unequivocally

bad

that I feel like scum are keeping her alive because they know that she has no chance of finding scum and no chance of winning the game if we get to lylo.

So I actually think she's town. If I was scum with her I'd have been bussing so fucking hard, there's no way I'd be satisfied with anything other than an AA lynch. So unless scum are a bunch of care bears, I don't think AA is scum.

Syryana: You think Slandaar was bussing gorckat?

[WT Snacks]

Why not slandaar? Well because it doesn't read like bussing.

Your scum reads appear to be Slandaar, the reasons you quote being "why not?" and AA, because she's just objectively awful and is pushing a bad case.

That's weak as fuck, fitz.

[WT Snacks]

I want to try something: VOTE: fitz

[WT Snacks]

Haha, nice quickhammer scum.

[WT Snacks]

Guess who's getting turbo-wagoned tomorrow?

[WT Snacks]

You solo or are all your buddies dead?

[WT Snacks]

Well, fuck.

AA was the only genuine town read. Slandaar was a town read but weaker.

Couldn't decide if the scum was Syryana or Fitz, but having inherited MrObvious' burn ability, the plan was:

Burn Syryana, lynch Fitz, and then inject Slandaar with a Dusa injection -> auto-win. The Burn failed, so that totally fucked the plan up.

Sorry, my fault.

[WT Snacks]

I'm not going to try to blame this loss on AA9 but I agree that her play was almost comically bad.

Whether or not that's due to a language barrier is irrelevant. AA9 is exactly the sort of player that policy lynches are for.

[WT Snacks]

On a positive note, I

really

liked the flavour for this game.

[WT Snacks]

I suppose not, but I wanted 4nxi3ty to know that I liked the theme.