Mini 1504 - Antihero Mafia REBOOT [GAME OVER]

[Majiffy]

Quickhammer Pasch, it'll be worth it.

Such a RUSH.

[Thor665]

BLATENT LIES, THOR. I HAVE DISCUSSED THEM WITH YOU. BUT WHY, I HAVE NO IDEA.

Well, you have offered up a vague glimpse of the case on Varsoon after prodding.
i asked you a question about it.
You chose not to respond to anything.
You have also specifically answered my requests for info on your cases with "I posted it once before" which is doing what AP is dinging Grim about, not bringing up and clarifying the case on a regular basis.

You could probably rub my nose in it worse if you quoted the case on Varsoon or the town case on FB.
I like a slightly raw nose.

[Majiffy]

Are we going to discuss reads *now* then?
Because this feels weak.

It is weak. He was buddying me early-game and frankly until Grim started pointing out some serious discrepancies I've been reading him as town. You know how I do when people rub my buttons.

This is my current town-core:
{Buck, Beauties, Grim, Beli, Thor}

I'm open to hanging elsewhere.

[Thor665]

Can you defend the Buck and Grim town positions?

[Thor665]

Also, I'm actually leaning Lies as town, just with a derpy view towards playstyle and tells - can you tell me why I'm wrong?

[Majiffy]

Buck is my mason butt-buddy and Grim looks pretty distinctly town in his motivations and pushes.

I have no feelings either way on ETL.

[Thor665]

So...gut and decent pushes.
Can you clarify the gut bit at all? If we want him in the town core you'll need to sell him better than that.

Also, as far as Grim goes, I think AP has a point about the odd dissonance, as I picked up on that too, albeit I sort of thought it was due to the 'lulz, drunk' thing. But is that a first, or have they done that in the past, and if so why do you still like their pushes?

[AngryPidgeon]

So two scum reads, a possible scum read, a...confirmation bias read, and a 'I dunno' read.
I'm guessing this means you think Majiffy and Grim are town - or are you expecting more than 3 scum on your wagon right now?

What is the point of posting this? What is wrong with Pasch finding yo and Darthe scummy on his wagon? He explicitly said he thinks Grim is just conf-biasing here. He never proposed more than 3 scum being on his wagon and hes not OMGUSing, but it feels like you are trying to imply he is w/o saying it.

--

Nobody should have a scumread on EtL after 1032. That sort of indignance is way more often from town.

Grim is

townscum

. My read on him has changed about 100 times while reading this game.

Although what is the underlined supposed to be?

Well my only good scumread was on your slot and Im certainly not going to waste your time preaching to you about you being scum.

that's a fair point, but it still seems drastically underperforming from you.
Am I wrong?

Annnd, this is still probably scum. This is just like Thor from mini 1393.

You should be specific about how it is the same.

Thor v Grim is terrible in general actually, both propagating shitty arguments over Pasch that don't actually go anywhere. I thought that Grim was very sure Varsoon was town and they certainly didn't antagonize him this way. Suddenly Thor replace in and we get all this crap and "omg Thor needs to pass burden of proficiency or hes scum".

That would tend to indicate they see me as a threat and are scum - but only if I am town...which you are saying I am not.
Clarify?

Grim did in a scumgame of mine recently. I'd link it but Im gonna go out on a limb and guess you dont care.

Not really, it was a question for him.
Let's be serious, you know my attitude towards anyone pointing out your fluctuating reads and calling it a scumtell.

What is the point in asking me this? Oh right there is none. Just smoke.

I'll explain when Im not in a time crunch.

I think its scummy on rim to be sure. A slot they've been cozy with replaces out and all of a sudden we get spam wars with you and them and forced dissonance? So ok, mostly a point against them. You are scummy on your own accord anyhow.

A scumtell for me specifically? I mean obviously its wrong. I couldnt even tell you if my reads 'fluctuated' similarly to my town meta in that game. But why beat around the bush if you don't care - tell them that there read is crap and move on.

Right and suddenly in 992 Thor is ok with just putting Pasch at L - 1 after this scummy herpaderp with Grim.

Because up till then I'd been opposed to it...?

Lets not start this, thanks.

If you are town you know this sort of crap is going to result in a repeat of mykonian's game.

Since she makes up meta on me and tries to lynch me as town - I don't really care.

Then what were you saying? This post is so useless, but I know I was scumreading Thor for propagating crap with Mollie in Patator and that was a crap read as it turned out. sadlkfjaskfj

What?
Go read what she actually asked me that I was answering - and then tell me why this even remotely matters to you.

least of all putting Pasch At L - 1 which is certainly not what I'd expect from town Thor.

Oh my gawd, you till have no concept of my meta and still choose to talk like you do.
I am an open and strong advocate of early L-1 and even preach it in Newbies as the IC.
Derpa-derp AP, this is fething terrible. Why do you do this gak?

What changed your mind? And I don't like that you are trying to play a "Oh don't you want me to read before the hammer?" card and also putting Pasch in hammer range. That is not town motivated thinking.

Ok. Stop doing blatantly anti-town things ans just ignore her then.

You are being obtuse instead of saying what you meant. Stop.

Why is Pasch scum then or are you just trolling Grim?

[Majiffy]

No pretty much just gut and I have plenty of options elsewhere to deal with before I start looking at him.

Which dissonance is this? I've been glazing over their posts the past few pages because lulz, drunk.

[AngryPidgeon]

Quickhammer Pasch, it'll be worth it.

Such a RUSH.

Was mollie right about you all along?

[AngryPidgeon]

Can you defend the Buck and Grim town positions?

Buck is town because he is largely apathetic about how his posts come across. Also he expressed a lot of pride in his play which is more often from town by a longshot.

[AngryPidgeon]

Also, as far as Grim goes, I think AP has a point about the odd dissonance, as I picked up on that too, albeit I sort of thought it was due to the

'lulz, drunk' thing

. But is that a first, or have they done that in the past, and if so why do you still like their pushes?

How is that even remotely a valid excuse?

[Majiffy]

Quickhammer Pasch, it'll be worth it.

Such a RUSH.

Was mollie right about you all along?

That I loves me a quickhammer? Yes.

You're reading him as scum; you were even troubled by his reaction that he didn't claim when put at L-1 in a speed wagon; why are you suddenly trying to shift blame to me if he flips town?

Why aren't you unvoting if you're worried I'm scum?
(Are you even on the wagon?)

[Majiffy]

Oh, it appears you've been avoiding the wagon like the plague.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

BLATENT LIES, THOR. I HAVE DISCUSSED THEM WITH YOU. BUT WHY, I HAVE NO IDEA.

ETL chooses me because we already have a QT together describing ways Majiffy can go fuck himself

Damn, you're good. Chose you without even seeing this.

Update: I'm on page 15 (every fuckin time I get a few more pages further yall post 10 more). Also angrybird, lay off my style. If my bubbly helpful nature is all you can come up with to scumread me when I was all of 4 pages in then I suggest you go back to the newbie queue. <3

Ok, so as of page 14ish or whatever, Grim Reaper's post are really bugging me something fierce. Consider him my top suspect at the moment. I'll clarify and post full reads list as soon as I finish catching up tonight.

On Majiffy v. Flying Beauties: I get good feels from mollie's posts and they remind me of her town games. At first, I was pretty willing to trust her read on Majiffy (and honestly, going in, if she didn't give me scum vibes, I was hoping to get a peg on jiffy from her), except now I kind of feel like she's been tunneling. As far as his alignment goes, I have no fucking clue, but if one of him and angrybird is scum, I think the other would be town only because I don't see scum so openly buddying a partner, and the buddy buddy shit between the two of them is strange to say the least. Both could be town but I

don't

think both could be scum.

Ummmm what else.... that's all for now off the top of my head and I'll have more later.

"A justification for not posting very much" lol... there's like 35 pages and I just replaced in. Suspecting the slot is fine and all, but don't then try to rationalize my intro post as anything more than that. Also, I did not get the impression that he was suspecting you, unless that occurred after page 15, so shush until I'm done with that.

Maybe you should re-read the first 15 pages to see where I'm coming from. You'd think someone who's been in the game from the beginning would realize that is my perspective thus far and remember what they have already read. I'm not "trying to start something petty" with you. It was a joke, nothing more. Pin your balls back in and stop overreacting.

I was willing to trust Mollie's read on Majiffy, contingent on whether I felt she was town or not, because I know she knows him and I know she's a good player. I don't know a lot of the people on the player list and the mod mentioned both of them when he asked me to replace. I knew they were going to be here, and I knew I'd be able to lean on one of them for a read on the other. Also, I never said she wasn't credible, I said I got the feeling that she has been tunneling, because after about page 9 or so, it didn't seem like she was willing to consider any other possibility. However, that doesn't negate her original impression of him this game, so it's something I'm willing to work with. It's important to be open enough to trust your town reads, and mollie is one of them.

How is it taking you this long to read the thread?!?

Could you explain your pasch town read

~G

lol... because I replaced into about 5 games, am getting ready to mod 2, and boss pulled some last minute mandatory overtime bullshit so i have less time than i expected. But once i'm all caught up it will be fine.

For pasch, it was more about the motivation behind the questions he (she?) was asking on d1, or at least, perceived motivation. I dont agree with all of his reads but i understand the thinking behind them because he took the time to explain himself. I would say my reads on pasch and lying cat are more gut, but its good.

I DID IT GAIZ. I finished the thread <3<3<3

Now on to business. >:(

Varsoon:

His attitude this game has been apathetic, pitiful, and full of AtE. He has called himself out for being useless as if that somehow negates any suspicion it might cause. He tries to excuse it all away with "I'm busy" and "I'm lame", and expects to be given a pass (which he was). I get that people get busy and life gets in the way, but to that end, I also believe every player has an obligation to the other players to allow someone who is able to put effort into the game do so. But he doesn't. So, either he's extremely inconsiderate and selfish town, or he's scum using "RL" to excuse his blatant uselessness.

Spoiler: Reasons why Varsoon cannot give evidence, support his "reads", explain his votes

Gonna spend more time with this when I get a moment.

@PASHCE:

I'm not cautious, just belligerent and busy.

@FLYING BEAUTIES:

Yo, Mollie, I don't quite like your appeal to ethos in 222. I've been skeptical of you for this whole game, but that's because I'm -always- skeptical of you. How do you feel about AP, and what insight can you give me about how your hydra partner plays?

-V

(What I found interesting about this one is that he didn't even mention angelmollie until the above post.)

Then again, maybe I need to sit down with this game, look over all the posts, and stew with it for awhile before hitting the submit button here.
Nah.

Guess I'll have to get in here and do some work soon.

I'm not doing my best, that's for sure.

I'm pretty busy now, but I'll try to post something worthwhile later today.

@Grim: I'll elaborate a bit more when I get some time to do so.

However, the biggest reason I believe Varsoon is scum is the way he acted towards the end of JKLM's lynch.

Spoiler: Varsoon calls JKLM townscumtownscumtownscumtown

JKLM is a terrible wagon that doesn't really get us much further in the game.

<snip>
Why should I be on the JKLM wagon when all my biggest scum-reads are pushing it the hardest?

Here he says JKLM is a bad wagon. Why would a wagon on scum (or what people thought was scum) be bad? Unless you knew he was town.

If there's not scum between Grim, FlyBeau, Beli, and JKLM, then the scum's already won.

Except at the time of the above post here, the JKLM wagon was gonna go through, and you knew that. So, better change tune, right? "JKLM is scum!"

Angry pidgeon is scum.
Beli is scum. That's all I'm sure of.

Angry is scum because look at who he thinks is scum: me, varsoon, and NEARLY EVERYONE ELSE. Scum trying to leave mislynched open.


Please don't let them discredit me tomorrow. Don't underestimate me ever, Beli is scum for sure. (I'm just really bad at presentation)

You all ready to eat your foot? Not really, it isn't your guys fault for the mislynch, it's really mine, a don't need to tell me that, so yay.

Good luck town. This is a tough list of people.

I tried, JKLM.
I really did.

It was really obvious from your play so far that you're town.
Reads list, bro?

OH no wait, JKLM is town again!

But, AP, the problem with your lists is that
You have had JKLM as scum for awhile

(he probably isn't).

You have me as scum (I definitely am not).

Bold pinged me so hard. I don't know that I've ever heard this from town or said this myself (except as scum). :/

VOTE: Varsoon

P-edit: I had started with the currently living player list, and Varsoon was at the top, so I'm making this a single post, and the rest in another.

WIFOM.

my definition of being on the wagon would be actually voting .

I do find it suspicious that he both pushed and distanced himself from the wagon at numerous times.

Where?
I'm fairly certain that while I couldn't be -sure- that JKLM was scum, I knew damn well he was town since he claimed.
It was obvious, and you're all either scum or blind for staying on that wagon after that point.

Yes, because a claim is always truthful.



He claimed VT. Then you waffled around calling him scum and town and scum and town. But the cherry on top was the "It was really obvious from your play so far that you're town." If it was so damn obvious, why did you vote him?

Pretty much.

If there's not scum between Grim, FlyBeau, Beli, and JKLM, then the scum's already won.

You are specifically saying here that JKLM is among your scum list. You are not saying this is contrary to what you think.

Am I supposed to read minds now?

Wow. Its like a switch. I made my case based on what I saw. This is like alice through the looking glass with you, Varsoon. You are saying there is scum in those 4 but you knew jklm was town all along? I'm sorry but that is exactly what I'm getting out of it. And that doesnt make sense to me.

Yet you vote me because i dont understand your motivation for saying any of that and forthinkng you are scum because of it? How is that NOT omgus?

I'm voting you because you lied about me in post 850, and because your case on me is a misrepresentation of my play so far.

You're literally twisting my words to fit your own ends, and that's scummy.

Also, it really pisses me off when people do that, so if you insist on lying and misinterpreting/misrepresenting me despite the several times I've explained what I meant, I will replace out of this game.

This is absolutely not true. I am attempting to interpret the motivation behind your posts. You know. Scumhunting. Which you have LITERALLY done none of.

My case was a list of direct quotes of things you said! Its not like I had to explain what they already showed. If I spent a lot of time overexplaining your words and translating and cobbling together obscure reasons for things, then I could see how you would call it misrepping, but I'm in actual fact not doing that.

I don't understand why you would put your town reads in a group with your scum reads and then say if scum isn't in this group of people, then scum has won. I seriously, honestly, 100% do not fucking understand.

P-edit: i heart you antihero.

[Majiffy]

Woah doggy next time you want to post a quote armada try scaling it down to just the relevant parts of the quotes.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

I cant I'm mobile.

[Antihero]

Buckwild has requested replacement. Currently looking... Tell your friends/enemies/evil twins!

[Majiffy]

Well then doggy don't make quote armadas when mobile!

[Majiffy]

Brb making an account called Mojoffo.

He's definitely

not

my evil twin.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

I dont like being called lazy and made to seem stupid when someone else doing just that. I have made my case, that slot is scum, I am voting it. I also dont like arguing with scum reads and it fucking frustrates me when they distract me and waste my time.

I dont care that i'm not as good a player or have a different idea of what constitutes a scum tell. I will do what i feel makes sense and i will vote who i think is scum. Simple as that. I am not going to just sheep someone because they are better when i have no clue on their alignment. Absolutely not.

[Majiffy]

Ok well in the meantime you should hammer Pasch for the lulz.

[Lying Cat]

Jesus. Day phase just started. Isn't it a bit early to be lynching? The sun's not all the way up yet! It's so early even a drill sergeant wouldn't wake anyone up. Hell, even God isn't out of bed!

I mean, yeah we've got other stuff to do today. But he's scum and there's no harm in getting his claim and intent out of the way before we discuss reads and shit. Are you going to do anything today, or do you still need your coffee first?

I guess pasch's scumminess isn't as universally understood as I thought? I'll post a wall after work if that'll help. You can each then choose your own brick from it and help me beat him to death.

Also I think I had an epiphany re: AP's play. I'm not sure what it means yet, so I'm going to iso him and talk with my other head to see if it's imaginary like the music I hear or real like the ants all over my skin.

Town reads: beauties, majiffy, grim

Need more from: AP, beli, thor, etl

Who the fuck is: Darthe, buck

Thor has not repaired the damage varsoon did, but he's making a start. This looks like it's gonna be a POE and associative tells game for me, as townreads abound and nobody but pasch is really overt scum. Jingle still thinks buck is scum, but all I'm getting there is "VI in over his head."

-sthar8

p-edit Yay I was right about buck. Jingle should do something horrible as penance. Suggestions? (that enough celebration for you AP?)

[Majiffy]

Make him put a picture of your avatar with a big pink heart around it as his avatar for an indeterminate amount of time.

[Antihero]

mastin2 replaces Buckwild!