Mini 1581--The Final Radiant Tales...(Fin)

[EspeciallyTheLies]

Egopost. Hydra already confirmed

[EspeciallyTheLies]

Quarter's On the Table

Guyett

What does this mean?

[EspeciallyTheLies]

well fuck me.... now it's not a secret anymore :"(

let this be a lesson to you all... don't drink and alt.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

It's laughable because I think you're scum or ... what? Give some reasoning. Disparaging my reads isn't going to get you very far Ffery. Which head is posting doesn't change the read.

P-edit: ok.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

It looks to me like he is giving his experience with bastard games but I don't know. A lot of what he says is somewhat non-sequiter but it hasn't been alignment indicative in the past. I didn't think much of it. Why are you so interested in it over the other stuff in the thread?

ETL

[EspeciallyTheLies]

I'm asking Mirhawk because that's where my vote has been and your read wall seems like a good jumping off point for further discussion with my main scum read.

The strong reads bug me because they don't fit the amount of content those players have posted. It stretches my suspension of disbelief to think you have those reads, and consequently makes me think you miscalibrated what would be a plausible amount of fake confidence.

Fair enough. That doesn't mean they are made up. They are the reads I have. The one on Bert is very much based on previous games with him, and more specifically, the fact that I saw from an informed POV his scum game in Dark Age of the Law, and it doesn't look the same to me here. Same for ZZZX, though different games, but he's being very much his townself. The other one, Oversoul, because his posts are very transparent, and make it easy for me to read him. Of course I could be wrong, but I have to put some faith in my own reads or I'll waffle all over the place and my reads will never evolve properly.

The waffly reads bug me because you spend so much time writing about how waffly you are, without working to make yourself less waffly by scumhunting those players.

This is something you have no way of knowing at all. I caught up on the thread and posted my initial thoughts. The next step involves engaging those null players to refine my read on them.

This makes it look like you care more about writing about your reads than improving them.

At this point? Well.. yes. It's important that I get my thoughts out there and then work on building them into stronger reads. That involves talking through those reads with my stronger town reads. Can't do that if they aren't at least posted. But none of it was fabricated. Like, I didn't just say shit to say shit. Everything I wrote was something I actually thought.

The fake-sounding reads just pattern match as the kind of reads scum like to make up to look like they have a position.

No. I don't think you know the difference. I don't know why they sound fake to you, but they aren't. And furthermore, what you're talking about is a non-committal reads list, which I didn't do at all.

Also, calling me lynch-bait which I don't understand from our (almost nonexistent) meta experience together.

We have meta you are not aware of. It allows me to see who is pushing you because they think you are easy or because they think you are scum. I shared it because not everyone may see it the same way.

Could you talk more about this?

What exactly is there to talk about? I have alts. End of story. However, I think you are just insulted that I called you lynch bait, which actually makes me feel better about you. I think scum would be more likely to take the lynch bait title and roll with it, than to fight it.

This doesn't make me feel better about you making stuff up considering no one has pushed or even mentioned me at all so far.

Again, I have not made anything up. You need to stop saying that like it's a fact. You think it sounds fake, ok, then that's what you think. That doesn't mean it actually is. And I don't think you get what I meant at all.

If I think X is an easy mark, I'm going to be looking for the people who are opportunistically going for an easy lynch. It helps me sort other people, and sharing my insight might help others sort other people as well. Does that mean that X is already being pushed? No.... I never said it did and the statement isn't dependent on that in any way.

ETL

[EspeciallyTheLies]

^ scum.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

Don't be stupid ETL. you should wait until tomorrow to decide if we are scum or not.

1) Not when you call me stupid which is uncharacteristic for you - both of you.
2) Not when your opening post is so uncomfortably awkward and unnatural.

Also what's your flavour name? We're Ivan or something

3) Not when you start role fishing right away.

ETL

[EspeciallyTheLies]

the fact you are thinking we are scum after a few posts indicates you've gone either pants on head stupid or are scum.

So, if I'm wrong, it's not cuz I'm just mistaken or overconfident in my ability to read you? I find this lack of logic unimaginable for a town player, especially one so familiar with me and my town playstyle. Did you even bother to ISO me and determine if I'm lying scum or mistaken town? (I'm guessing not)

I could also go quote all the games I've called your alignment within 5 posts or less, if you want. Like Red Wine mafia and Antihero micro, to name two.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

Is it true Bert?

[EspeciallyTheLies]

no moar dimples eva

[EspeciallyTheLies]

ifthat wasn't classic guyetti;d ldt you buyou pushin nkthat knowing it si ais scumjy as fuck. fi it wroent for beli i'd be lyncing you.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

HIGYUST

[EspeciallyTheLies]

btui lvoeyou.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

My readings that require no afterthought, rather they are spewed.

I think KA is scum. I think gameplay is lean-scum. I think ETL *might* be scum.

I think Lady Ffery is town. Mirhawk might actually be town. Who knows about IA.

Oversoul is null. Rubicon is null. Bulba *seems* town. That's all I have for now. A lot of other mehs (read: Varsoon, ZZZX (pointless slip that seems unrelated to this game)) that aren't really worth talking about.

So <ETL, KA, gameplay>

tghis is quite liatrlly the worst post yhou hava evrmade ever bert. wow.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

iwasnt'. fot somereason iu though is was kaze whic i = with ffyr. which is not in this game.

lokin is fine but id ont thinkyou are look in tuhe right place and is a wast of time. sespcially when i made work to do my reas and itslik you just vomit iwthout investigating.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

Even in the case of (1), why SK over mafia?

This is exactly what I was thinking and I'm very interested in the word choice there.

will quote later when I'm not busy.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

This head of Lying Scum hydra has a very unexpected V/LA of indeterminate length. Should still have mobile for a bit.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

ETL, I assume this post was you:

ifthat wasn't classic guyetti;d ldt you buyou pushin nkthat knowing it si ais scumjy as fuck. fi it wroent for beli i'd be lyncing you.

That was your reaction to me telling IA that we'd lynch the fuck out of them if they set up another huge pyramid of fake-claims like they did in GiF's cult micro.

lol... of course it was me - it's from my main account.

Translation:

If that wasn't classic Guyett, I'd let you, but you pushing that knowing it is, is scummy as fuck. If it weren't for beli, I'd be lynching

you

.

I don't remember the fake claims comments.

What I was saying with that is that being part of Guyett's general meta makes it not alignment indicative, though I was referring solely to the fake vig. He has been rather trolly lately, so I haven't quite figured him out just yet, but I'm confident I will. At the moment, they are less than town. My reads are stale though. I will get back to you.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

Also, I am mid-page 17 and going mobile now for lunch. Notes are in notepad on my computer but I should be able to finish up over lunch and post them when I return from break.

P-edit: because they are. They show less intent to actually sort people and more in the way of pushing whatever bs you fancy at the time.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

I read the thread. I commented on everything I felt needed a response. I have been paying very close attention, Bulb. Trying to wash it all away by claiming that I haven't is bullshit. IA has not been rolefishing. I don't personally give a shit why he asked for flavor claims, though I'd be willing to bet his VT claim is nonsense cuz of this

-Incredibly bastard! Power madness!

I don't know why you are acting like everyone has to live up to your ideals of play. Jake from State Farm does that and it annoys the fuck out of me because he's wrong 90% of them time when he does it. This is pretty standard shos/Guyett fucking around and

it is not alignment indicative

. Not to mention... WHAT ROLEFISHING?

And then, your argument against my complaints on the lack of a counterwagon is "hurrdurr town are the majority". Are you serious? Please tell me you aren't serious. This applies to pretty much every mafia game ever and is irrelevant because of this. I find it hard to believe that you are unable to see what I'm saying. The IA wagon never stalled. The claim that it did is preposterous. It took off at the speed of light in terms of number of posts from your vote to L-1.

And "given the evidence in the thread", town is very much NOT in sync or there wouldn't have been scattered votes all over everywhere all fucking day long.

Please stop fucking lying to me. I'm not stupid and I don't appreciate being treated as such.

You're scum and you're trying to whitewash my arguments because you know I know you're scum.

ETL

[EspeciallyTheLies]

are you fucking shitting me maruchan... wtf. i'm not reading that.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

Bert.... I drive... to play trivia.... drive. You know... in a car. I don't wasted at bars. I get wasted at home. These are two different things. One is a few beers and the other is a fifth of rum.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

I'm not playing with you.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

There's a lot of resistance to lynching the ZZZX slot now, isn't there? Lots of people are all "synced" on IA. They were "synced" on ZZZX too for a while, weren't they? The IA wagon had far more momentum. And hell yeah that gives me pause! It should make

you

wonder too!

I'm not letting this go. Maru being in the slot now only makes me want it more.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

No I don't? I just didn't understand the statement in your vote post. What bulb is talking about is unrelated to your "synch achieved" comment.

Also - wat? I haven't "grossly mischaracterized" anything. It is my perception of your words. If it's wrong, that's your fault.

I am really in a foul mood at the moment for various non-MS related reasons. I should really step away. I'm going to do that now.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

Rubicon - do you not understand what he did there? His head is so far up his ass, he doesn't realize shos is part of IA. He thinks shos is saying that IA has a PT. What shos actually said is copy/paste, post with IA.

But you see, Maruchan is so wow scumhunter he doesn't need to read the game, let alone his role pm.

@bulb: My opinions of their posts are just that. If he thinks they are wrong, I don't really care, because he could be lying, and if he's not, then it's really on him to show me that I'm wrong, not just tell me.

And I will quote all this dumb shit later. I'm busy.

p-edit wtf mad posts.. later.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

As for rubicon wanting responses, I'm skimming atm, because I don't have the time tonight to activity participate

THEN WHY DID YOU REPLACE INTO A GAME YOU DO NOT HAVE TIME TO PLAY?!?!?!?????????

tepmted to replace out, so this slot isn't burdened by ETL's outside-game-influence on wanting it gotten rid of.Like extremely tempted. Because that's bad for the slot, bad for the town, and bad for the game as a whole.

No. What you're doing now is bad for the game.

Do not replace into a game if you do not have the time to read it and be an active member.

Do not neglect to read your role PM.

Do not skim the game, and then engage people under the false guise that you are informed.

Do not post unformatted, no-space fucking walls with no references, links, or quotes, and expect anyone to read it.

Do not pretend like we are scum-reading you for being you. But yeah, I'm disappointed you replaced in here given all of the above. Please don't do it again.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

Rubicon - do you not understand what he did there? His head is so far up his ass, he doesn't realize shos is part of IA. He thinks shos is saying that IA has a PT. What shos actually said is copy/paste, post with IA.

I understood the mistake Maruchan was making, but not why IA would have any private topics. But I get what was actually said now.

Anyway, how do you square 173 with the case you're making?

Not sure what you mean. So what if he's in a Jester game. Big deal. That's not the issue. The issue is his response to morph, followed by his reaction, which was way more overblown than a simple "oops, wrong game" slip.

Not to mention, this is simple game mechanics. I think he's scum, I want him on a fucking rope. He has a counterwagon - IA - who previously had no counterwagon. The ZZZX lynch is catching resistance out of thin air from people who should have no vested interest in his survival.

Should he flip town, I know where to look. I look at the whiteknights and the opportunists, and we fucking lynch them for good game go town.

Should he flip scum, IA becomes as good as conftown, we ignore Beli and lynch morph the cat for good game go town.

I know what I'm doing.


p-edit:

MARU - KEEP PERSONAL SHIT OUT OF THE GAME. I don't care about your uniform or whatever the fuck. I don't want to lynch you or get rid of you for being "Maruchan". I want to lynch you because you're scum and with you now in the slot, the posts are even harder to read than when partial-English-ZZZX was there.

I also don't know what PMs you are talking about. If it has to do with the server and IRC - I'VE BEEN BUSY AND HAVING A SHITTY LIFE AT THE MOMENT. Blake is on it. Ask him stuff. I need a break.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

Please note: I am having a really sad, really depressing, and really frustrating week. I just finished a game, so the feeling of overwhelm should be less now, but I likely will not be up for doing anything until Friday afternoon. I am so behind, and I'm sorry.

Some comments I do want to make -

Gameplay is fucking town. Anyone who hopped on that once it got started without giving reasoning is scum.

Bulbazak is scum. I am telling you this. I am fucking certain of it. His interaction with Mirhawk is extremely telling. He accused him of "twisting" words, when it was 100% clear to me what Mirhawk was asking, repeatedly, and Bulbazak dodged and threw sand and tried to hide his dodging with angry noises.

ZZZX - egh. Nobody seems to get why that post isn't about the Jester comment. Nobody seems to get why that post is fucking damning.

IA is town. For now, though I'm pretty sure. Especially now that SC's game is over, I can say, this is a very close match to Guyett's attitude/play there, with shos adding pleasant streams of logic. Voting here is a scumclaim and I will not fucking back down.

I will happily die to validate my reads and get this town moving in the right direction, so who is willing to play trades with me????

[EspeciallyTheLies]

Shadoweh? SHADOWEH! <3

BLEH. I will catch up tomorrow.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

How do you know it's wrong, morph?

[EspeciallyTheLies]

I'm working through whether to value your guyett read over my sns read (and Cabd's as well).

You should. I've never been wrong about him.

Tbf Snork is one of the few people who can read me very well very quickly (along with ETL, Grimgroove and Mastina... as well as a few others)

ETL can be quite good at reading me and prob would have caught me out

Add Red Wine Mafia, Antihero UPick, and a slew of others for evidence. Sthar8 is another one I generally always catch, but with Sthar it's often too late. Guyett is never too late.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

I feel like Bulba, if town, should have a similar thought process about you, and yet he's asking me to vote IA with him.

yes exactly... ? He's trying to butter you up because you disagree with me, and using AtE and trying to make me feel guilty about wanting to lynch him.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

No you were a stubborn butthead screaming about how you were right and OMGUSing people all over the place.

You're not doing that here. You're trying to be manipulative and it's not working.

My read on Guyett will evolve into the correct read given enough time depending on the game. Is it possible I'm wrong and shos is clouding the read? Yes. I've thought of that. But I've been paying attention. I feel really good about my read on him. The wagon and resistance to his counterwagon all just add to my read. They are not the foundation.

TownBulb should be biting my head off and trying to force your preferred lynch. Instead you're being all reasonable and slyly trying to make me question what I want to do.

We aren't even voting for you. But I think we will as I feel far more strongly about my read on you than my read on ZZZX/Maru/??

p-edit: guyett stop being toxic. go sober up and then come back later.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

What are you talking about Bulb? I've been perfectly civil???

[EspeciallyTheLies]

I tried to explain my thought process behind Mirhawk and you essentially tunneled and shouted at me.

Show me. I remember my first wall post on you regarding Mirhawk's question. I distinctly remember taking my time to make sure the post itself wasn't rude.

I tried to explain my thought process on IA and why you were wrong, and you insulted me.

No I didn't. Show me.

You essentially bit Maru's head off.

Are you maru?

[EspeciallyTheLies]

I really dislike how you've continually used specific vocabulary to paint my position in this game as "volatile" and it really comes across as an effort to discredit me. For someone who is townreading us, this really just makes no sense.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

And if I wasn't sure about your alignment, then maybe I'd be paranoid and waffling. I'm not unsure about your alignment.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

1) Where is the tunneling and shouting in the first quote? I wanted you to answer the question, and you still didn't answer it, so I asked you again and tried to make it clearer. So, where is the "tunneling and shouting"?

2) I did not feel you answered them to my satisfaction, so I pointed them out for you specifically to answer. I also explained how I form my reads, that I skimmed ISOs at the start of the game to catch up, and then fully read the thread which gave the argument more context. Hence the change in my read.

3) No. You said that the argument was invalid because town make up the majority. If there were various other reasons, why did you pick that one and not mention anything else that would prove your point? Because "town is the majority" is pretty lame, especially if there are "a variety of reasons", none of which you expanded upon.

And then you call it strawmanning when I am referring to things you yourself said and asking you about them.

Nowhere in 551 did I insult you. Not once. I didn't call you names. I didn't insult your intelligence. I didn't verbally abuse you. Just because I used the words "bullshit" and "fucking" to color my narrative doesn't make it insulting.

I was pretty clear on why you were wrong. And again you are trying to discredit my read on you by calling it confbias, and besides being one of my biggest pet peeves on this site, it's most often done to me by scum.

p-edit: Bert, what are you doing? I am in the middle of finishing my catch up and discussing things. Why are you trying to shut everything down?

[EspeciallyTheLies]

i just want to get a flip and move on at this point, we've had extensions and all kinds of stuff already.

such a drag.......

Do you not trust my ability to read Guyett, with whom I've played a good number of games with, as well as hydra'd a good number of games with? He's like my best friend on this site...

Do you also not trust my ability to obtain valid reads? mastin said you were competent. I agree. But the way you have been treating me here is really giving me problems, and especially because I believe you are town.

I told Beli, and I'll tell you all now, I don't want to leave this game just yet and I feel like we will die tonight. I'm having fun and getting through all the content is important to me. Please let me get my thoughts out.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

Also lots of support for Bulbazak makes me go hmmm Still tons of resistance to zzzx/maruchan/bc lynch. Please someone tell me this is ringing alarm bells. Every counterwagon to ZZZX has taken off like a rocket and no one wants to lynch ZZZX.

It's impossible for

all

the people not voting zzzx to be scum.

Yeah I know but it's the only wagon of the day that has had major resistance. So if he's scum, then some of the resisters could be buddies and some could just be town being convinced. Or if he's town some of the resisters could be whiteknighting scum, which is easier to figure out imo.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

The only one resisting IA is me and I don't count in my own analysis...

I want to lynch the ZZZX slot.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

opportunism #2.

For an awesome name? Okay...

Unvote

Vote Interdimensional Arsehole

yeah. Missed this one.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

Yeah, it's not like we're playing this on the internet, where Wikipedia is a thing.

I don't understand how this is relevant? I mean, the game can't be broken by flavor, and just because you think a particular character could be a particular role doesn't mean they are at all.. it's just guessing, just like any speculation the scumteam would be doing. I don't particularly give a crap about the flavor, and tbh, I don't really think IA does either. But you're taking the bait and trying to look townie by opposing something that site meta would normally deem "anti-town" when it really isn't. Why do you think he's been calling you opportunistic this entire time?

[EspeciallyTheLies]

Why are you denying me my ZZZX lynch?

[EspeciallyTheLies]

Do you know what the scum fakeclaims were in that game? The exact same things as their real roles.

This actually isn't true. We were given fakeclaims. I was the only one who claimed what we actually had as I believe scum are more easily caught when they lie about what they are than trying to pass of what they are as a town role (which is much easier imo). I also knew there was likely a flavor or name cop or something out there in the town, so lying would have been just stupid.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

I like the way you think Shadoweh

[EspeciallyTheLies]

We should hydra sometime

[EspeciallyTheLies]

Was that our actual name? I don't even remember. I might actually be thinking of a different game now that you posted that.

Pedit stufd

[EspeciallyTheLies]

In Dark Age of the Law, we were a scum name cop. It was a useless role. Remember?

[EspeciallyTheLies]

OH yeah those guys. (:? Can you tell how checked out I was >.<)

I would tend to think that having a "villain" type character is not indicative of alignment. If that was true, I don't know why KA would just volunteer that information about his own character.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

SSK BEING FUCKING SSK

WHERE IS EVERYONE. IT IS DEADLINE.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

And I'm kinda mad at everyone not listening to me about this and now its down to the wire. Bulb softed his game thing a long time ago. Why you thi k i wasnt voting him ever???

[EspeciallyTheLies]

Well I am just mad right now at everything. Losing arcadia and my work computer being A FUCKING SLOW PIECE OF SHIT OBSOLETE FUCKING GARBAGE MACHINE FROM HELL.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

inb4 he flips town tho

yeah this post isn't weird

at all

.

I did think the "i have no opinion" thing was weird but I wouldn't consider it a crumb.

FUCKING HELL I MISS MY OLD KEYBOARD. They have me on a temporary machine while mine dies and goes to

heaven

the 7th circle of hell. And it's a piece of shit. A fucking piece of fucking slow molasses junk piece of shit.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

35-40% chance of scumflip I'd say, but that's better than a NL.

Where are you getting this from?

[EspeciallyTheLies]

RAGE.

BAH.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

Why did you kill us

[EspeciallyTheLies]

lol KA... First of all, it was "Limbo", not the dead thread, and according to Nat, the game was still in play there. Secondly, I never said were town.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

I said we were not scum, which was true.

But really good job, Town. Impressive.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

Oversoul, replacing out is not something to be used in that manner. I can understand your frustration, but it's really meant as a last resort when you absolutely have no way to continue playing. Replacements add work for the mod, create a disconnect in the gamestate, force another player to read and become involved in a game they did not experience first hand, and in LYLO, is just.. irresponsible and rather rude. It's not to be used as an escape from a player you are having difficulty with. If you have a problem with a player, it is best handled via the mod and/or the reporting system.

I really enjoyed playing with you here, I really did. Please take the above as advice for the future, and nothing more. <3