New York 180 (Endgame)

[Green Crayons]

Why wouldn't you use the same level of energy to ISOdive 3-4 players who are still alive? It just seems like there's a discrepancy in effort and this excuse just seems weird. :/
Also, could you link a game that you replaced into where you took a scumslot? If it's not too much trouble.

I tried ISOing a few players, and without greater context of what's going on, it's pretty worthless.

My level of effort on replacement isn't alignment indicative. Past five games I have replaced into, separated by alignment:

GC-scum-replacement from Mini 1647: replacement case 1; replacement case 2

GC-scum-replacement from Open 584: replacement case 1; replacement case 2; replacement case 3

GC-town-replacement from Micro 452: replacement case 1

GC-town-replacement from Open 587: replacement case 1

GC-town-replacement from Open 579: replacement case 1; replacement case 2

[Green Crayons]

Also also, I'm not sure if you've answered already, but what're your thoughts on Marquis atm?

I don't think Marq is lynch worthy based off of yesterday's play.

There's probably a bit of "she and I did the same thing" involved, but her rapid-fire jumping back and forth between TSO-GC-Ozgin looks too un-calculated for scum.

[Green Crayons]

See, I'd agree with you if it didn't seem like Shin has been being super reserved with his vote like all game.
Like, I feel like getting him to vote someone/anyone at times has been like pulling teeth and iirc it hasn't been just during times when scum has been getting run up. It's come across as more of a playstyle thing.

This type of information is useful, and is the type of information I have been consistently asking for.

Actually, or are you kidding? :/

Actually. GM's redic effort post shows that late game bandwagons competing against a mafia lynch are usually, but not always, against town.

[dragonspawn]

VOTE: kitz

I'm not sure how far from the deadline we are. But I know kits play is bothering me.

I think id rather lynch marquis today but I don't see us finding the votes for that. Ive had scummy vibe on him all game and nothing has really changed.

if we have to have a compromise vote I can do it but of really prefer with lynch one of them.

[goodmorning]

I'm really glad my fairly baseless Cheetory townread was apparently right.

[Shinobi]

Eh.

[goodmorning]

Now that I'm looking I think dragon's vote might have put Kitz at L-1.

Just so nobody derphammers.

[Kitz]

I already said what I can say, and no one cares about it.
My logic and deduction is not adequate in any shape apparently.

K.
Why are you voting for GM then?
Who are you townreading and who are you scumreading and why?
Why not try to engage people?

I feel this line of questiioning is very disconnected and missing the main point of mine.
I said no one cares about it, and see, no one even bothers to look it up. Reduces chance for me to engage with others because they don't listen / care.

Why do I scumread GM is what I post here :

I already deduced the logic behind the night actions and GM makes both contradictions and excuses.
1. I breadcrumbed for GM to neighbour someone, didn't because "omg reasons", even though it was very important.
2. Claims to have attempted to neighbour a dead target, which means no claim to it.
3A. T S O has no reason to lie that he did try to kill GM but failed.
3B. It failed because GM was sendt to do the kill so GM wasn't at "home". Refer MM mechanic.
Obviously also was the one to kill T S O.

Due to the apathy and how the game runs, I'm more or less inclined to just vote self because logic is banned.

[Kitz]

For refference, look at

#6367
#6334

[Cheetory6]

Claims to have attempted to neighbour a dead target, which means no claim to it.

Can you explain what this means a little more clearly? I'm not sure I understand.

T S O has no reason to lie that he did try to kill GM but failed.

Neither did ABR, and he was town. Why take the word of a SK at face value when he could have just been trying to set up that someone was trying to frame him by stopping kills or something?
Also, I feel like you're ignoring the rest of the details of what I'm asking q.q
Are you so convinced that GM is scum that nobody else in this game matters anymore?

I said no one cares about it, and see, no one even bothers to look it up.

I'm caring about it right now. Voila. Stop being self-pitying. [I know I'm being a hypocrite but whatever ]

There's probably a bit of "she and I did the same thing" involved, but her rapid-fire jumping back and forth between TSO-GC-Ozgin looks too un-calculated for scum.

Except there was no jump onto Ozgin at any point. That's what bugs me about it.
Will check out games tonight provided that I don't get lost in the madness of trying to pack q.q

[Kitz]

Are you so convinced that GM is scum that nobody else in this game matters anymore?

Town paranoia fuel syndrome.

Why am I not hammered yet? Scum would do that. Multiple opporturnies, still no hammer.
The list with that cuts short with just Dragon and GM, and GM is the most questionable of all the players.

Look, Shin there could've voted me, and you too. Unless you're some high-adrenaline scum ofc.

SK

NOPE

Quiz : What is T S O's role and his mechanic?
This is extremely important.

---

I chose to believe a 3P because he knows who the other Scum is and did fail an attack, he was in a full situation that required him to help the town to get them.
ABR just blatantly gamethrew.

[Cheetory6]

Quiz : What is T S O's role and his mechanic?
This is extremely important.

Okay yeah he was that weird probably visiting role, but doesn't that make it super unlikely for us to be able to understand exactly what happened that night? Like, couldn't there be a scum roleblocker? Or maybe TSO's role didn't kill people when they're at their own house and it instead only kills the people who visit them?
Like, I just don't really get how the role works and it makes me find it hard to trust the picture that TSO was trying to paint when it makes it seem like he was potentially just trying to fuck with all of us and trying to get us to eat into the paranoia. I don't think it's a bad lead, but I think there are enough people giving me bad vibes that I'm not going to trust the possibility of a confirmed non-town role's claims of their night actions potentially incriminating someone in an uncomfirmable manner.

Claims to have attempted to neighbour a dead target, which means no claim to it.

I still don't know what this means. If you could give me any clarity on this, that'd be great.

Why am I not hammered yet?

I feel like this a weird reason to PoE people. Like.. we're still at 7 people. I think there's at most two scum left, but I could see there being one left if it was something really strong. There are a lot of reasons why there probably hasn't been a hammer yet and while I'm leaning that you're not scum, that possibility is also there. So, I get the reasons for the narrowvision on goodmorning, but I'm sad/confused that you haven't even given a glance at why I've been saying Marquis is probably scum. [I'd really appreciate it if you could look at that and give me thoughts plsssss]

[Kitz]

Or maybe TSO's role didn't kill people when they're at their own house and it instead only kills the people who visit them?

Here's one piece of information I know about mass murderers.

The normal variation kills whoever rests at a location, so everyone who visits that target is at a location and if target has targeted another they have moved to a different location.
Killing more than one puts them to a cooldown unable to act for a while.

Killed :
N1
- Pisskop - Maifa Non-consecutive Roleblocker killed night 1
- Boonskiies - Town Non-consecutive Doctor killed night 1
- Viking (attacked & healed)
= All by T S O. Where's the mafia kill? It went on T S O?
= All visited Viking and Viking couldn't move.

N2
-Ellie - Town deputy turned cop killed night 2
= Mafia. Can visit.

Mathblade - Town vengeful killed night 3
= Mafia? Or MM? Cannot visit.

Nobody Special town Non-consecutive Doctor killed night 4
= Mafia if heal N2 and N4 (Visit N4), or add in possible MM if N1, N3. (No visit N4)

T S O - Mass Murder Killed night 6
= Mafia.

Lynched :
- Klingoncelt town citizen lynched day 1
- vikingfan - Town Cop lynched day 2
- Albert B. Rampage - Town Tracker lynched Day 3.
- FA_Q2 - town citizen lynched day 4
- Aeronaut - Mafia Goon lynched day 5
- Ozgin - Mafia goon/Neighbor - lynched day 6

[Cheetory6]

Oh so if viking was roleblocked he couldn't leave his place?
I guess that kind of makes sense.
That's still like the least important question of all of the things I was talking about in my last post though lol.

[Kitz]

I still don't know what this means. If you could give me any clarity on this, that'd be great.

If GM is the neighbourizer, why no neighbour on the night that T S O had claimed to attack GM?
Coincidentally, no neighbourizing at all, when that was important.

Then T S O dies and GM claims to have visited T S O.

... Actually, that might be the truth, but instead of neighbourizing, killing.

If there's a last scum and GM neighbourized someone alive or a more probable target like me, you or anyone but T S O who were obviously chosen to be killed clear as day...
Let's just say that neighbourizing someone alive would give a very high boost of town cred.

It were very obvious that T S O would be killed at that point for being such a threat to the mafia, so why did GM even chose to target him?

[Kitz]

And just FYI, if my logic keeps dripping the wrong direction and it doesn't go directions, I'll just go all "fuck it all".

[Cheetory6]

So, is your general argument that you think GM can't be neighborizing anymore because she has to be making the kills at this point?

[Cheetory6]

Otherwise, what does she stand to gain by not neighborizing people? Like, I don't necessarily get it, that's all.

[Kitz]

So, is your general argument that you think GM can't be neighborizing anymore because she has to be making the kills at this point?

At least the most recent one. I'm not sure about the other ones, however there could be some wifom involved.

I'll let you articulate on the matter and come to a conclusion.

The following actions make no sense : Skipping neighbourizing, Made a shitty excuse doing so, Targeting someone who were quite obviously the target of the night.
The third there could be some biased alibi : Not targeting anyone would be scummy due doing the kill, but targeting someone dead is just fine.

[Cheetory6]

Why skip neighborizing if it brings your claim into question? If GM could neighborize someone on whichever night it was that she didn't, I can't see a reason why she would skip it on purpose.

[dragonspawn]

unvote

dont need a hammer yet.

I've thought about that too kitz. The lack of neighborizing has me concerned.

[Kitz]

Why skip neighborizing if it brings your claim into question? If GM could neighborize someone on whichever night it was that she didn't, I can't see a reason why she would skip it on purpose.

Reason. I called out on it heavily too.

Gm why didn't you neighorize anyone again?

Because I didn't feel there was much point.

It's not a group. Me and the person I Neighbourise get a thread that's only open the Day after the Night I Neighbourise them in.

Has this not been clear?

No, it's a new thread every time. Me and the person I Neighbourise get a thread that opens ONE DAY ONLY.

I don't know how I can make this clearer.

[Cheetory6]

Oh jesus I thought it was just for a single night cycle. Having a neighborhood for an entire day cycle with someone seems way more useful. I guess it could be that as scum, she didn't want to have to deal with having to directly interact with someone and deal with the extra pressure?
Ehhhhh.
Fuck. I should probably read over GM's ISO q.q

[goodmorning]

At this point there's nothing I can say in a Neighbour thread that I wouldn't also be willing to say in the actual thread. I'm not very good at reading people via Neighbour thread either.

[dragonspawn]

That's a poor explanation for why it hasn't been happening lately.