Mini 1653: A Game of Pokes - game over

[Formerfish]

Rando, have you asked the mod yet? I feel like if you gave half a shit you would have done that already.

[massive]

I don't think it matters whether he has a shot left or not.

[Formerfish]

I think it matters that he didn't bother to clarify with the mod if his shot was used or not, or that it wasn't explicitly stated in his role pm.

[Wickedestjr]

*Prod dodge* even though I responded eight posts ago

Nothing more to say right now

[FA_Q2]

Back. Sorry I am a bit late - it took longer than I thought.

I have resisted getting on vikings wagon because I was sure that he was crumbing a PR earlier. I don't like his claim at all and it makes more sense to me now why he was not killed for what I thought was an obvious crumb.

VOTE: viking

MRT?

Stands for maintenance recovery team

[Formerfish]

What did you see earlier for crumbs? And what don't you like about a vt claim?

[Aristophanes]

Friday post didn't happen so I will take a post-work nap and post post-nap.

[FA_Q2]

He mentioned 'tracking' people that were not posting and the reference seemed out of place and matched his meta for the last time I played with him (where he claimed cop, was lynched anyway and was telling the truth)

I don’t like the VT claim because I was thinking that he was trying to crumb tracker. Possible that he set this up then and forgot to follow up when he received some pressure. The case around him others have presented is a decent case and without him being a PR I don’t see a good reason not to lynch him.

[Wickedestjr]

Eh... while I think vikingfan is the best lynch today, I don't think he was bread crumbing there. The 'tracking' comment was made on day 2, after the cop had already died.

[vikingfan]

It's not Aristophanes, it's definitely vikingfan who is running that show.

738: Do we direct him or do we forego having him shoot at all?
771: How do we know even if we are directing him that he will shoot who we want?
783: Can we replace him?
804: How do we know even if we are directing him that he will shoot who we want?
807: Can we replace him?
812: Are you going to do what we tell you to do?
843: Are you going to do what we tell you to do? (while voting him)
852: Gonna keep voting him until he says he'll do what we tell him to do
858: Fitz do you think he will do what we tell him to do?
866: Are you going to do what we tell you to do? (the Circle Yes/No edition)
882: Well clearly he's not gonna do what we tell him to do

END SCENE

Aristophanes' involvement is basically to say "if we lynch Oka, are you OK shooting Kop?" That's 762. He runs with that in 795 and 844 and moves his vote to Random to try and force it, but it doesn't feel nearly as desperate to line up a confirmed shot as vikingfan does.

Um, first of all, it was clearly documented on days 1 and 2 that rando was clearly not involved in the game. If you want to go back and look, clearly and repeatedly, rando has not been involved. When called on various things, he has said repeatedly, 'I forgot to post that' or 'I thought I said that'. The last thing I wanted was for him to weasel out and say, 'I forgot' AGAIN. Heck, even a statement, 'yes, I am going to shoot tonight' would have sufficed. SOMETHING to show that yes, he is involved and playing the game. That wasn't forthcoming and for that reason I am still dubious that he is town...had he claimed VT instead of vig, he would have been long gone by now. As it is, it's an unprovable claim, espeically if he claims tomorrow that 'well I don't have my shot anymore'. Then what?

[vikingfan]

He mentioned 'tracking' people that were not posting and the reference seemed out of place and matched his meta for the last time I played with him (where he claimed cop, was lynched anyway and was telling the truth)

I don’t like the VT claim because I was thinking that he was trying to crumb tracker. Possible that he set this up then and forgot to follow up when he received some pressure. The case around him others have presented is a decent case and without him being a PR I don’t see a good reason not to lynch him.

Correct, that was not a breadcrumb, I was simply trying to follow up on people who were not posting. That would have been a good breadcrumb if I was actually scum and fakeclaiming though, but I'm not.

[massive]

Um, first of all, it was clearly documented on days 1 and 2 that rando was clearly not involved in the game. If you want to go back and look, clearly and repeatedly, rando has not been involved. When called on various things, he has said repeatedly, 'I forgot to post that' or 'I thought I said that'. The last thing I wanted was for him to weasel out and say, 'I forgot' AGAIN. Heck, even a statement, 'yes, I am going to shoot tonight' would have sufficed. SOMETHING to show that yes, he is involved and playing the game. That wasn't forthcoming and for that reason I am still dubious that he is town...had he claimed VT instead of vig, he would have been long gone by now. As it is, it's an unprovable claim, espeically if he claims tomorrow that 'well I don't have my shot anymore'. Then what?

Why was it imperative that you know whether or not he was going to shoot? At which points in the day did you think he was town, and which points did you think he was scum?

[Randomnamechange]

I didn't say I was going ti shoot because I hadnt decided until thw night phase.

[Randomnamechange]

Also I wouldn't have my shot if blocked :/

[vikingfan]

Um, first of all, it was clearly documented on days 1 and 2 that rando was clearly not involved in the game. If you want to go back and look, clearly and repeatedly, rando has not been involved. When called on various things, he has said repeatedly, 'I forgot to post that' or 'I thought I said that'. The last thing I wanted was for him to weasel out and say, 'I forgot' AGAIN. Heck, even a statement, 'yes, I am going to shoot tonight' would have sufficed. SOMETHING to show that yes, he is involved and playing the game. That wasn't forthcoming and for that reason I am still dubious that he is town...had he claimed VT instead of vig, he would have been long gone by now. As it is, it's an unprovable claim, espeically if he claims tomorrow that 'well I don't have my shot anymore'. Then what?

Why was it imperative that you know whether or not he was going to shoot? At which points in the day did you think he was town, and which points did you think he was scum?

So that we could verify if he was telling the truth, of course. I think you've forgotten just how much rando was under fire day one and two and probably would have been lynched if not for his claim. I still don't think he's town per se, but if he is, he has been very dumbtown especially day one and two. think about how he assumed he was just 'lynched' and how he says he posted things but forgot (too many times to count). I think you've forgotten just how scummy he was day one and two, although admittedly day 3 he's been far better at being engaged. not sure why you're asking the same questions over again I just answered. And now rando has said that if he was blocked, his shot is gone, so that makes his claim perfectly unverifiable now and now makes him VT with an ability nobody can prove he ever used.

[havingfitz]

Prodded.

Sorry...busy RL weekend with family visiting and spring yard work.

I got 3/4 through a viking ISO before the weekend hit. Will finish today even though it looks like my vote won't be necessary.

[massive]

So that we could verify if he was telling the truth, of course. I think you've forgotten just how much rando was under fire day one and two and probably would have been lynched if not for his claim. I still don't think he's town per se, but if he is, he has been very dumbtown especially day one and two. think about how he assumed he was just 'lynched' and how he says he posted things but forgot (too many times to count). I think you've forgotten just how scummy he was day one and two, although admittedly day 3 he's been far better at being engaged. not sure why you're asking the same questions over again I just answered. And now rando has said that if he was blocked, his shot is gone, so that makes his claim perfectly unverifiable now and now makes him VT with an ability nobody can prove he ever used.

Maybe if you were pushing him to answer IF he was going to shoot. The real difference here is not that you were concerned IF he was going to shoot (to potentially determine whether he was lying about his role) but WHO he was going to shoot. WHO he is going to shoot is immaterial to determine whether he's lying about his role -- if we have two deaths, no matter who they are, then he was telling the truth. WHO he is going to shoot is only important if you have the ability to affect it.

[havingfitz]

So begrudgingly taking random idgit out of the equation (for now).....I'm going to look at the other players in the game. Not interested in wicked or Formerfish atm so I'll start with today's current leading lynch candidate; vikingfan.

#36 - rvs fluff

#69 - meh

#92 - encourages Flames (aka Saul/EPM) to vote Hodor (aka Oka) and criticizes Kelbris (aka Kop) early claim. Mentions "policy advantage"...wth is that?

#118 - gives his read on all players. Mostly nulls or towns with a vote on Flames. Can accept lack of scum reads since it's early in game.

#122 - defends his Flame vote (Flames is replacing out) to Riblet (aka FF)

#174/175 - defends his Flames vote to wicked. Says it was just to make a statement. Viking IS the only vote on Flames so that COULD be the case. Not sure it is scummy or "awful."

#201 - defends Flames vote to Aristo...unvotes Flames. Promises read through. meh

#241 - defends Flames vote to Wicked..laments replacements (again). Promises read through.....

#242 - apparently has completed his read through and determined everyone is null. Except random who he then votes. Obviously not bothered by the random idgit vote but surprised everyone else is null. :/

#258 - trying to determine reasoning behind massive's vote on Oka. ok

#375 - RL distractions...more content to follow. meh

#376 - a post to wicked offering more explanation of the Flames vote (zzzzzzz)

#438 - Large post. Had to read it a few times. I think he is saying his lynch list is kelbris, Aristo and random (in no particular order). Not a terrible post. Decent for him I suppose.

#458 - discusses Slandaar's push on Fish. Puts FOS on Aristo. Getting involved and taking sides. good

#459 - a correction to part of his 458 post. meh

#471 - reprimands Oka for being a quitter. Mentions thought of voting kelbris (Kop) for policy related reasons? and opts not to put Oka at L-1 to extend D1. so so

#480 - Talks policy of kelbris lynch and how kelbris and Oka seem to be the options. Though I think random and Aristo are his preferences.

#495-497 - Jumps to the Monkey wagon and states L-2. I assume Monkey support comes from wicked's case? ok

#514/515 - makes a few twilight posts to wicked regarding my D1 hammer. meh

#526 - Starts D2 with affirmation of random suspicions (yay!). Minimizes role in Monkey lynch...."had to do it" (guilty conscience?)

#537 - Pushing the underposters a bit. Still suspects random.....meh

#543 - Exchange with wicked. Not sure if there are suspicion towards wicked or not.

#559 - Defends his gameplay to massive. States he has been hunting people (i.e. random and others). Objects to massive providing townreads. meh

#597 - v/la

#635 - Votes random...makes comment to Saul and wrt to me but not sure of the context at the moment. meh

#639 - clarifies on a question from Oka.

#662 - Large response to wicked. Seems to be casting a bit of suspicion wicked's way without explicitly stating so.

@viking....what is your read on wicked at this point in the game?

Answered in later post....simon says....town.

#665 - answers to Saul wrt some VCA questions. good

#682 - non game comment to Fish. ok

#685 - 744 - Numerous posts basically supporting a random lynch over and Oka one. Supporting what he believes in...good.

#752 - Questions Fish on whether letting random pick his own target or not makes sense. hmmm....

#771/772 - Pushing that random is not to be trusted (agreed) and obtw..Saul due prod.

#783 - asks mod about a replacement for random....lol....he really wants random gone one way or another. I prefer the vote over the replacement.

#784 - pointing out underposters to mod. ok....trying to keep activity up. good thing.

#791 - moto post. meh

#804 - explains to wicked how he isn't for the let random shoot plan. Though I do not recall seeing him push any targets.

#807 - Asks mod for an extension. I see this as pro-town.

#812 - snaps at random. meh

#814 - makes what looks to be a good observation towards random regarding random's change of stance on Oka.

#822 - Discussing random's shot options with Fish. meh

#843 - More going after random. OK

#852 - prodding random wrt what his plans are with the ~vig shot.

#858 - says wicked would the the best candidate (for what?) and gives me credit for the random vig shot plan. Which I believe he meant for someone else.

#859 - tries to slow things down while EPM catches up. good thing

#866/867/869 - trying to confirm what random intends to do. I don't think this is necessarily a bad thing given random's flakiness.

#882 - explains his views on random "plan".....ok

D3

#897 - opines on N2 actions and lack of 2nd kill. ~ok

#908 - I read this a few times and it made my head hurt. Think suspicion was being cast towards Kob. meh

#922 - Gets on Kob's case a bit. OK

#923 - Still in the random is scum camp (ok by me)

#924 - Long point by point defense of random's vote on him. ok

#933 - decent random point brought to massive's attention.

#935 - random speculation with massive.

#943 - poking random to answer questions (good)

#954 -Seems to waffle a bit on random....(not sure if he's scummy or not?) bleh Some VCA (fair enough/deflection?)

#956 - Goes off I think on random for not answering questions. ok

#983 - prod dodge

#1004 - random IS scummy. Votes random. Gives reads. Claims VT. Don't care for waffle on random. reads and claim ok.

#1007 - Question to FA

#1008 - Question to random

#1034 - Long defense to massive suspicions

#1035 - Post to FA saying he had not bread-crumbed anything.

#1039 - more defense to massive suspicions. ok

Done. whew. zzzzzzzzzzzzzzz (j/k)

OK...so I still like a random lynch but I'm not sure the crowd will wait around long enough for me to provide summarized case on him. Which I could probably have by Wednesday afternoon.

WRT viking...I thought he had played a better game but his ISO did seem a bit underwhelming. Not sure how much original thought there is and a lot of time spent on the defense for his opinions regarding random's potential vig shot N2. Not sure he did anything really damning in my eyes....and I do see some pro-town effort from him. The worst thing I saw whas him saying he wasn't sure random was scummy after being on him much of the time prior and then shortly after...reiterating he felt he was scummy. If it was early in the game that might be enough on it's own to warrant a vote from me but taken as a whole...not sure. I'm going to refine my case on random and if someone pulls the plug on viking, so be it. Probabaly be better that way from a VCA perspective anyway since I'm not sold on his wagon.

More later.

[Iknal]

Vote Count 3.4

vikingfan(4): Kop, randomidget, wickedestjr, FA_Q2
Not voting: Aristophanes, vikingfan, Formerfish, havingfitz, massive
With 9 alive it takes 5 to lynch.

Deadline is 23/05/2015 1900 UTC +10
(expired on 2015-05-23 19:00:00)

Searching for a replacement for Kop.

[Aristophanes]

Fitz, why no interest in FF for now?

Massive what conclusion do you reach with Aris being the one to push hardest for handcuffing?

Honestly, this rubs me wrong.
It looks like he saw an opportunity to shift the focus off of Viking and jumped on it, even though I was definitely not the one pushing hardest for it.
I really just wanted acknowledgement either way.

Not saying for sure scummates, but the tone of that plus a scumviking flip would be a decent place to start tomorrow.

Won't hammer now, but happy to at some point.

[FA_Q2]

So begrudgingly taking random idgit out of the equation (for now).....I'm going to look at the other players in the game. Not interested in wicked or Formerfish atm so I'll start with today's current leading lynch candidate; vikingfan.

#36 - rvs fluff

#69 - meh

#92 - encourages Flames (aka Saul/EPM) to vote Hodor (aka Oka) and criticizes Kelbris (aka Kop) early claim. Mentions "policy advantage"...wth is that?

#118 - gives his read on all players. Mostly nulls or towns with a vote on Flames. Can accept lack of scum reads since it's early in game.

#122 - defends his Flame vote (Flames is replacing out) to Riblet (aka FF)

#174/175 - defends his Flames vote to wicked. Says it was just to make a statement. Viking IS the only vote on Flames so that COULD be the case. Not sure it is scummy or "awful."

#201 - defends Flames vote to Aristo...unvotes Flames. Promises read through. meh

#241 - defends Flames vote to Wicked..laments replacements (again). Promises read through.....

#242 - apparently has completed his read through and determined everyone is null. Except random who he then votes. Obviously not bothered by the random idgit vote but surprised everyone else is null. :/

#258 - trying to determine reasoning behind massive's vote on Oka. ok

#375 - RL distractions...more content to follow. meh

#376 - a post to wicked offering more explanation of the Flames vote (zzzzzzz)

#438 - Large post. Had to read it a few times. I think he is saying his lynch list is kelbris, Aristo and random (in no particular order). Not a terrible post. Decent for him I suppose.

#458 - discusses Slandaar's push on Fish. Puts FOS on Aristo. Getting involved and taking sides. good

#459 - a correction to part of his 458 post. meh

#471 - reprimands Oka for being a quitter. Mentions thought of voting kelbris (Kop) for policy related reasons? and opts not to put Oka at L-1 to extend D1. so so

#480 - Talks policy of kelbris lynch and how kelbris and Oka seem to be the options. Though I think random and Aristo are his preferences.

#495-497 - Jumps to the Monkey wagon and states L-2. I assume Monkey support comes from wicked's case? ok

#514/515 - makes a few twilight posts to wicked regarding my D1 hammer. meh

#526 - Starts D2 with affirmation of random suspicions (yay!). Minimizes role in Monkey lynch...."had to do it" (guilty conscience?)

#537 - Pushing the underposters a bit. Still suspects random.....meh

#543 - Exchange with wicked. Not sure if there are suspicion towards wicked or not.

#559 - Defends his gameplay to massive. States he has been hunting people (i.e. random and others). Objects to massive providing townreads. meh

#597 - v/la

#635 - Votes random...makes comment to Saul and wrt to me but not sure of the context at the moment. meh

#639 - clarifies on a question from Oka.

#662 - Large response to wicked. Seems to be casting a bit of suspicion wicked's way without explicitly stating so.

@viking....what is your read on wicked at this point in the game?

Answered in later post....simon says....town.

#665 - answers to Saul wrt some VCA questions. good

#682 - non game comment to Fish. ok

#685 - 744 - Numerous posts basically supporting a random lynch over and Oka one. Supporting what he believes in...good.

#752 - Questions Fish on whether letting random pick his own target or not makes sense. hmmm....

#771/772 - Pushing that random is not to be trusted (agreed) and obtw..Saul due prod.

#783 - asks mod about a replacement for random....lol....he really wants random gone one way or another. I prefer the vote over the replacement.

#784 - pointing out underposters to mod. ok....trying to keep activity up. good thing.

#791 - moto post. meh

#804 - explains to wicked how he isn't for the let random shoot plan. Though I do not recall seeing him push any targets.

#807 - Asks mod for an extension. I see this as pro-town.

#812 - snaps at random. meh

#814 - makes what looks to be a good observation towards random regarding random's change of stance on Oka.

#822 - Discussing random's shot options with Fish. meh

#843 - More going after random. OK

#852 - prodding random wrt what his plans are with the ~vig shot.

#858 - says wicked would the the best candidate (for what?) and gives me credit for the random vig shot plan. Which I believe he meant for someone else.

#859 - tries to slow things down while EPM catches up. good thing

#866/867/869 - trying to confirm what random intends to do. I don't think this is necessarily a bad thing given random's flakiness.

#882 - explains his views on random "plan".....ok

D3

#897 - opines on N2 actions and lack of 2nd kill. ~ok

#908 - I read this a few times and it made my head hurt. Think suspicion was being cast towards Kob. meh

#922 - Gets on Kob's case a bit. OK

#923 - Still in the random is scum camp (ok by me)

#924 - Long point by point defense of random's vote on him. ok

#933 - decent random point brought to massive's attention.

#935 - random speculation with massive.

#943 - poking random to answer questions (good)

#954 -Seems to waffle a bit on random....(not sure if he's scummy or not?) bleh Some VCA (fair enough/deflection?)

#956 - Goes off I think on random for not answering questions. ok

#983 - prod dodge

#1004 - random IS scummy. Votes random. Gives reads. Claims VT. Don't care for waffle on random. reads and claim ok.

#1007 - Question to FA

#1008 - Question to random

#1034 - Long defense to massive suspicions

#1035 - Post to FA saying he had not bread-crumbed anything.

#1039 - more defense to massive suspicions. ok

Done. whew. zzzzzzzzzzzzzzz (j/k)

OK...so I still like a random lynch but I'm not sure the crowd will wait around long enough for me to provide summarized case on him. Which I could probably have by Wednesday afternoon.

WRT viking...I thought he had played a better game but his ISO did seem a bit underwhelming. Not sure how much original thought there is and a lot of time spent on the defense for his opinions regarding random's potential vig shot N2. Not sure he did anything really damning in my eyes....and I do see some pro-town effort from him. The worst thing I saw whas him saying he wasn't sure random was scummy after being on him much of the time prior and then shortly after...reiterating he felt he was scummy. If it was early in the game that might be enough on it's own to warrant a vote from me but taken as a whole...not sure. I'm going to refine my case on random and if someone pulls the plug on viking, so be it. Probabaly be better that way from a VCA perspective anyway since I'm not sold on his wagon.

More later.

This is somewhat confusing to me.

The one thing I think is fairly solid is that viking and rando are not on a scum team together - the interaction makes that highly unlikely in my eyes particularly with where the scum team is at.

I would think that you would be more against vikings lynch if you are sure that rando is scum.

[Wickedestjr]

I'm starting to think havingfitz is scum again.

I like post 1045.

#783 - asks mod about a replacement for random....lol....he really wants random gone one way or another. I prefer the vote over the replacement.

If you are scum and random is town, then it would make sense for you to want him lynched before replaced. If you are town, why wouldn't you be willing to wait for a good replacement?

[Randomnamechange]

I think we are looking at a Viking/fitz/FF?

[massive]

I don't see Formerfish letting his team kill Slandaar N1 after the rumble Slandaar and Riblet had D1.

[Aristophanes]

I don't see Formerfish letting his team kill Slandaar N1 after the rumble Slandaar and Riblet had D1.

Is that because you know FF's metaor because you wouldn't have done so yourself?