Star Trek Deep Space Nine Season 1 Mafia(game over!)

[Nero Cain]

Nero, why do you want to lynch PereV first? What's the logic behind it? What has you so against sheeping my read and voting Titus first?

I'm not convinced Titus is scum, however PV is scum. RN I'm thinking that scum is Pv and Gum. The only reason I'd lynch Titus is over myself or for town cohesion.

This is where I'm at, actually

So...you've been tunneling me all game. And now you want to "sort me"?

I'll take things that scum say to sound town for 500, Alex.

[Nero Cain]

Basically here are my thoughts

I know that Gumball is cop "cleared" and PV says there is no GF but I dont trust either of them. I think Sin is wrong as shit on Titus and Gummy blindly sheeping Sin makes me edgy.

One thing that still really bothers me about Suzune is that she said she thought Thor was scum b/c he had a pr and she makes prs and didn't think their roles could coexsist but as soon as I asked about it she didn't respond (or atleast I don't remember it) and dropped it.

town

Nero
Titus
Sinsun
Thor
Dave
Rabi
Suzune
Gumball
pv

scum

[LittleGumball]

I know that Gumball is cop "cleared" and PV says there is no GF but I dont trust either of them. I think Sin is wrong as shit on Titus and Gummy blindly sheeping Sin makes me edgy.

Oh I'm not sheeping him. I've been thinking Titus, Riabi, and Kling are scum for what feels like forever. I'm just working together with him to vote for scum because he seems to be the only one that actually wants to lynch scum.

Like I said way, way earlier, the town needs to work together, and we've been doing an okayish job of it. At the end of the day, feel free to lynch me till the cows come home if I'm wrong about Titus. However, I doubt that I'm wrong.

[Thor665]

Knowing enough of the roles in this game gives one power. The power to claim anything. So if you remember back when I thought that Sinsun might be a sensor, Titus said something about anyone claiming to be a sensor because there was no way to prove the claim. This got to me thinking about the Oracle claim. One does not need to actually be one to claim one. If PV knew there was a doctor, maybe because they were a doctor, it is easy enough to write yourself into your own prediction. Since no one is claiming it either means that no one actually has the doctor role, read as PV has the doctor role, or that actual doctor is one of the people who has not claimed.

Okay, so the working theory would be that he was scum and faked role awareness? The real question then becomes one of timing.

I'm

motivated

to find

scum

, but the

doctor

has been doing a shit job, and I think the "

tracker

" is also

scum

, and if he doesn't get lynched, he'll probably be

roleblocked

anyway. It would be nice if I could just

tree stump

myself like that one game, (but I waited too long). Oh well.

So here's his thing.

He knew about a Tracker, a Doc, a Motivator, a Roleblocker, and a Tree Stump
At the time he made this claim we had a claimed...Tracker, right?
Since then the Motivator, the Roleblocker, and the Tree Stump have all flipped confirmed scum.
The Tracker has flipped confirmed town but is a restricted Tracker and Pere argues that there is a non restricted scum Tracker.
We have also had zero Doc claim.

I, personally, see no reason for a scum Pere to basically just call out most of his team's PRs in a hidden way and then to also push a massclaim after the fact.
I am of the opinion that even if Pere is scum, he is also an Oracle.
His callout also seems to be almost entirely scum even if you think it was an intentional attempt to stab the town Tracker in the back somehow and maybe out a Doc...who doesn't appear to exist if he's town (an elaborate multi-scum bus attempt that they gave up on in favor of just shooting him instead)

Ockham's, yeah?

Basically here are my thoughts

I know that Gumball is cop "cleared" and PV says there is no GF but I dont trust either of them. I think Sin is wrong as Smurf on Titus and Gummy blindly sheeping Sin makes me edgy.

One thing that still really bothers me about Suzune is that she said she thought Thor was scum b/c he had a pr and she makes prs and didn't think their roles could coexsist but as soon as I asked about it she didn't respond (or atleast I don't remember it) and dropped it.

town

Nero
Titus
Sinsun
Thor
Dave
Rabi
Suzune
Gumball
pv

scum

So you think Sinsun is hard pushing town (Titus) and also can see that I just helped nail two scum back to back and even in a way that didn't even cost a lynch - but you have Sinsun as more likely town than me...

Shall I also presume you are claiming 'not Doc'?
Since you think Pere is scum, and if you're the town Doc, a claim of 'Doc' would definitely help get Pere lynched, y'know - so I'm taking it you're not a Doc, yes?

[Sinsun1]

Like I said Thor, it's down to Riabi to claim town doctor or else the scum team will have confirmed that the doctor is indeed scum.

Either way, Titus is getting lynched today. No matter how you roll the dice, his flip sends us one direction or the other.

[Sinsun1]

Vote Count 6.02- Up to post 3811

PeregrineV[5]: NeroCain, Riabi, KlingonCelt, Titus, davesez
Titus[2]: PergrineV, LittleGumball
St Augustine the Hermit[1]: Thor665

Not Voting[4]: St Augustine the Hermit, Psyche, Suzune, Sinsun1

With 12 alive, it takes 7 to lynch

Day ends Sunday, August 9th, at 9 AM USA Mountain Time or when a lynch occurs

[/area]

Vote Count 6.03- Up to post 3922

Titus[5]: PergrineV, LittleGumball, Suzune, Psyche, St Augustine the Hermit

[L-2]

PeregrineV[4]: NeroCain, Riabi,Titus, davesez

[L-3]

St Augustine the Hermit[1]: Thor665
Sinsun1[1]: KlingonCelt

Not Voting[1]: Sinsun1

With 12 alive, it takes 7 to lynch

Day ends Sunday, August 9th, at 9 AM USA Mountain Time or when a lynch occurs

[/area]

2 vote counts taken from the day Hermit was lynched before he was on the board to be lynched. What you can notice is that there are 2 sides mostly here.

For the first vote count at least 2 scum were voting PereV. Kling and at least one other (if not a 3rd voting him as well). On Titus you had PereV, LG and my hammer vote being on the ready.

Then the second vote count one scum switched to vote me (Kling), still at least 1 scum on PereV's wagon and Hermit was voting Titus when she was nearly lynched (so could be bussing to be on a scum lynch). As we remember Hermit was on the Ika lynch as well.

A note also looking at vote counts on Ika and RIP is that Titus and Riabi voted both of them side by side.

Now then, my theory here is that if Titus flips scum, Riabi out of the Nero/Riabi unknowns will be mafia.

However, if Titus flips town, thus making PereV the wagon on scum yesterday, then we would have PereV for sure but it'll be harder to find the second scum.

A lot of this is pending on Titus flip, but lets say Titus flips town, making PereV scum, who would be the second mafia?

Also, anyone have any idea why Riabi would be taking so long to come back? If he has to be replaced, we should force the replacee to immediately claim or risk being auto-lynched. Because something tells me they wont be able to come up with a proper fake claim without rereading everything that went on.

[Titus]

And that is why I want Suinsun to be godfather. There's nothing that requires PerV to be scum if I flip town. I merely think PerV is. Mislynching PerV and myself is an excellent method for a scum win.

PerV should out the last role.

[Thor665]

Would it make you feel better to know he already has to me, and I've already spotted the player with the role and have reasonable belief in its backtrackability at this point insomuch as if it's a fake - then scum arranged it very much in a convoluted and pre-planned method?

Because if the answer is 'no' then what's the need to have the role discussed?

And if the answer is 'yes' then where are your reads at the new moment?

[Suzune]

Does the amount of information that goes on behind the scenes in this game drive anyone else crazy?

While it is true Thor that he revealed the roles early. On his initial reveal of them they were not all listed as scum just that they existed it was not until later that they became scum. Now whether or not it was clarified for him later is another point. I apologize I just feel so skeptical about this oracle thing. I feel like it breaks the idea of the game if it is just revealed I mean, why bother playing if we can just go down the list and lynch everyone on it. I guess I just feel put out that it would be so easy and I want there to be a trick somewhere. Some way to prove the town is being played because I just have a bad feeling about it.

[LittleGumball]

Just think about how weak our town is with all the negative roles and vanilla townies we have. Would scum have an Oracle on top of everything else scum has? Or is this Oracle given to us to help us balance the power?

[Thor665]

Does the amount of information that goes on behind the scenes in this game drive anyone else crazy?

Not really - after three scum 'lynches' in a row I'm actually feeling pretty good about it.

While it is true Thor that he revealed the roles early. On his initial reveal of them they were not all listed as scum just that they existed it was not until later that they became scum.

I would suggest that is not actually true thanks to his color coding. You disagree about that?

I apologize I just feel so skeptical about this oracle thing. I feel like it breaks the idea of the game if it is just revealed I mean, why bother playing if we can just go down the list and lynch everyone on it. I guess I just feel put out that it would be so easy and I want there to be a trick somewhere. Some way to prove the town is being played because I just have a bad feeling about it.

I think if Pere is vanilla that the mod didn't really think through potential implications of the role properly.
That said, I've assuredly been in games before and "broke" them - it is not a sign or poor play on town's part when that happens, nor do I see a need to outguess reality beyond what is in front of me. When we get to lylo/mylo or a Doc claim I will be happy to embrace some paranoia with you - but as currently stands I'm not really seeing the point. Your issues with balance are a matter to discuss with the mod post game, not during the game other than to present incredulity and then move on with assessing what we can assess.

[Sinsun1]

Suzune, you want there to be a trick. The trick is, if PereV did not ask the right questions.. a mafia doctor could have slipped by the entire game without us knowing. After Kling's flip, why are you so reluctant to just help test one more person that will either make or break your paranoia based on how she flips.

Vote Titus with me, get the flip, then we can see if your paranoia has any need to worry about. Sometimes, games come together for town and we get lucky. PereV could have died so many times between Day 1 and when he outed that information that we could have lost it all. Our tracker could have died before they got a useful track (which in this case, he did), our cop could die before catching any mafia (which he did) and the miller was in play to affect cop results.

There's about a hundred ways it could have gone that would have left us in a very bad position today. But through scum offing people who we weren't sure about, cop reads and this oracle claim, we're able to catch them.

Lets say your paranoia is true. The only way to find out is to take a leap of faith right now and get results from a lynch on Titus or PereV. I personally pick the least helpful and the scummiest of the two.

[LittleGumball]

sinsun always says things better than i do

me no word good

[Sinsun1]

Almost 24 hours and no replies. Either you're going to vote Titus or PereV today, come on guys, get with the program.

[Titus]

^^ Can we lynch Sinsun? I fucking HATE her recent posting.

[Sinsun1]

^^ Can we lynch Sinsun? I fucking HATE her recent posting.

*Yawn* Not going to happen there deary. Pick a wagon that is viable today. Stop wasting space with something that will never happen.

[Thor665]

Would it make you feel better to know he already has to me, and I've already spotted the player with the role and have reasonable belief in its backtrackability at this point insomuch as if it's a fake - then scum arranged it very much in a convoluted and pre-planned method?

Because if the answer is 'no' then what's the need to have the role discussed?

And if the answer is 'yes' then where are your reads at the new moment?

@Titus

[LittleGumball]

^^ Can we lynch Sinsun? I fucking HATE her recent posting.

No because we're lynching you.

In case you haven't noticed this is endgame. This is not the time for policy lynches just because you personally find someone irritating.

A Sinsun lynch will not happen today. Get over it.

[Titus]

Would it make you feel better to know he already has to me, and I've already spotted the player with the role and have reasonable belief in its backtrackability at this point insomuch as if it's a fake - then scum arranged it very much in a convoluted and pre-planned method?

Because if the answer is 'no' then what's the need to have the role discussed?

And if the answer is 'yes' then where are your reads at the new moment?

@Titus

Thor, just because you've spotted something, doesn't mean scum have. There's a faulty premise there.

The townie outs the role, assuming their is one, PV can match it.

I've already answered what happens if PV is town.

[Sinsun1]

Titus, with knowledge that it WILL be you, Riabi or Nero today. Nobody else. Who would you want to lynch to help further town's goal? Which of the 3 do you think will net a scum flip?

[Titus]

I have already answered that.

[Sinsun1]

[quote="In post 4545, Titus"][/quote]

Thanks for confirming Riabi deary. We'll get all 5 scum in a row thanks to you done goofing it for your entire team.

[Thor665]

Would it make you feel better to know he already has to me, and I've already spotted the player with the role and have reasonable belief in its backtrackability at this point insomuch as if it's a fake - then scum arranged it very much in a convoluted and pre-planned method?

Because if the answer is 'no' then what's the need to have the role discussed?

And if the answer is 'yes' then where are your reads at the new moment?

@Titus

Thor, just because you've spotted something, doesn't mean scum have. There's a faulty premise there.

No it isn't - what I'm asking is how that reacts with your apparent demand to have Pere claim the role. If we establish that he has and it has been "confirmed" what does that accomplish for your read of Pere?

[Thor665]

Riabi has been prodded.

Can we get a prod on the mod also

[MonkeyMan576]

There haven't been any votes from my recollection, I'll do a vote count tonight though.