Mini 1747: Cinnamon Roll Mafia Endgame

[davesaz]

What is a soul read supposed to mean? Where's the glimpse of towniness from Soap?

[davesaz]

That was in response to 824. I didn't notice there was a whole new page.

[Syndesis]

A soulread is like a gut read but

deeper

Glimpse of towniness is 767 but even looking at it now I'm not sure it's something I can townread.

[iraonavp]

To get this out of the way: my phrasing in my ISO read on dave wasn't the greatest. I said he was trying to make people look scummy -- more like "hint that people might be scum in order to undermine townreads."

I think you're missing the point of what I'm doing.

A calls B town for no reason or a bad reason.
I point out to A that their reasoning is bad.

This does not mean I think B isn't town, nor does it mean I'm trying to convince A that B isn't town.
I'm pointing out that A might be scum because they're using bad reasoning to townread B. And trying to do it in a way that engages A to explain further, so I can sort A.

Now, go back through that again and see if you understand...

This is a good post. Dave going down on the "hope he's dead" meter.

It's literally just theory, I don't see how that could be very indicative..? Davesaz doesn't even address the point that toolenduso is making here. Are you saying that you think what toolenduso said in 263 applies?

[iraonavp]

Can you give some details on the Syndesis read?

They... seem town-aligned? Their posts are genuine and train-of-thought, s that what you want to hear? I am not good at town-aligned reads. Let's say it is a "gut read", if that makes it easier.

This sounds like you have no true scum reads at all?

I don't understand where you're getting this from. I read Metrion, FA_Q2, TheCow and you as scum-aligned to various degrees. The deadline is forcing a compromise lynch.

How is this a compromise lynch? You want to lynch me and I am one of the leading wagons.

A compromise lynch because Metrion would be my first pick for today's lynch.

Wait. Where the actual fuck did this just come from? I could be wrong here, but I don't think I remember this ever being said before. Now, at deadline suddenly the top lynch choice is a lurker who is not one of the 2 main wagons who I don't recall you making a case on before?

Come again?

I mentioned Metrion in 76, 372 and 416. I also had my vote placed on him previously... I often try and keep track of my feelings about players in my head and don't post all my thoughts, so I can see how you might've missed my scum-aligned read on Metrion.

I missed that in my skim but went back and you're right. I still don't like the push, and actually reading the early posts I like it even less. Especially considering the fact that he said a large part of his reasoning for why he thought met was scum was because he thought it was trying to distract from the hawk wagon, a wagon that we now know was town, which didn't seem to deter him at all.

Okay then.

In response to your concern here which has already been raised:

Metrion was subtly whiteknighting a town member here to avoid awkwardly joining the wagon and looking bad after the flip, rather than trying to dissolve the wagon on his partner.

It's also a very small part of my scum-aligned read on Metrion and in the infancy of my suspicion of him.

[iraonavp]

D1 end. Nice job town!

That makes my previous post all the more important. Throwing a wrench into the lynch equation when a scummy is on the chopping block makes trying to derail a buddy a real possibility. Especially because the post literally made me do a double take.

at hawkeyes fake claim as town.

I fucking hate that. Even if it worked this time.

I mean maybe you have a point about the counterwagon thing, this has been discussed at length, but note that FA_Q2 was the counterwagon not Metrion. I'm not convinced from your blind notes of d1 that you would've voted CN over FA_Q2 here either.

[iraonavp]

All caught up.

vote: iraonavp

Reasoning is in 836 and 837.

DIE SUCK DIE DIE DIE SUCK DIE SCUM SUCK DIE

Anything else? We have a lot more than just d1 to work with here.

[iraonavp]

Page 20. Has lolbabe taken a strong stance on literally anything this entire game?

What do you think of this slot (lolbabe was replaced by Raskolnikov)? This is the only mention I see of lolbabe / Raskolnikov, and you haven't included them in your list of scum-aligned reads.

[iraonavp]

Page 26. Not a huge fan of the metrion lynch because a) it seems to have been pulled out of some asses b) those asses seem to be working in concert and c) those asses all belong to people who I am reading as scum.

Are you referring to more than just me and FA_Q2 here, and if so, who? I got the feeling that the scum were supporting either my or Metrion's lynch and were willing to switch momentum at the slightest whim.

(Also, sorry for attacking you with such a barrage of questions but it's great to finally have more activity in the thread and an opportunity to pressure your slot!)

[FA_Q2]

LOL's entrance was also horrendous.

Sorry if you've explained this before but could you explain why or at least point me to the post where you explain why?

With CN's flip lolbabe looks really bad to me. Yesterday she seemed to be avoiding the whole CN wagon as much as possible only commenting on it when forced to. Her push on me was manufactured. There were legitimate votes on me but lol was not one of them. I think her 'case' was contrived to push her partners counter wagon as it was a real possibility that I was going to be lynched instead. She soft defended CN and really avoided taking a hard stance on him.

VOTE: lolbabe

[FA_Q2]

There is definitely 1 scum in
[iraonavp, FA]

but probably 2.

What happened to your Dave read? Are you thinking he is town now?

[davesaz]

Are you referring to more than just me and FA_Q2 here, and if so, who? I got the feeling that the scum were supporting either my or Metrion's lynch and were willing to switch momentum at the slightest whim.

Metrion was your scum read. You are using hindsight to say scum were pushing him or you, projecting his flip onto yourself.

[Thestatusquo]

Soap is town.

Why?

iraonavp likely scum.

Why

I assume the defense of CN?

page 14. FA is still scum!

Whyyyyy

Mostly these are gut reads.

I will delve a little more into FA though.

The reason I think they're scum is because they are giving the appearance of contributing to the game without actually contributing to the game. In addition to that, they don't seem to give too much of a care about who gets lynched. Oh sure, they might say they do, but to me it seems like they're more concerned with getting A lynch rather than the correct one.

[Thestatusquo]

Page 20. Has lolbabe taken a strong stance on literally anything this entire game?

What do you think of this slot (lolbabe was replaced by Raskolnikov)? This is the only mention I see of lolbabe / Raskolnikov, and you haven't included them in your list of scum-aligned reads.

I lean scum, but its hard to get a good handle on the slot.

I'm not a huge fan of lurker hunting (and think scum is more often found in those doing the hunting, such as yourself) but lolbabe was just on the line between lurking and trying to feel like they're not lurking. In addition, the posts they did have seemed averse to stating opinions and making waves. Most of the posts were entirely related to asking for small points of clarification on other peoples posts.

[Thestatusquo]

All caught up.

vote: iraonavp

Reasoning is in 836 and 837.

DIE SUCK DIE DIE DIE SUCK DIE SCUM SUCK DIE

Anything else? We have a lot more than just d1 to work with here.

I don't really do cases, but I will say there is indeed more reason to the vote than just that.

The main one is, and I know this is hard for you to defend against so I'm sorry for that, that your posts just feel... off. To me. They feel like they're not invested in scum hunting. When I read most of your posts they don't seem too focused on finding scum.

Shrug. It's a feel thing. I don't expect anyone else to vote based on it, and I don't really have interest in getting into a big discussion about it because you're not going to change my mind, but that's the main reason.

There are bits and pieces of more concrete stuff, like the met stuff and the thing you quoted too, but I don't have enough to be compelling to other people other than saying "read his iso. does he look like he's trying to find the bad guys?"

[Thestatusquo]

D1 end. Nice job town!

That makes my previous post all the more important. Throwing a wrench into the lynch equation when a scummy is on the chopping block makes trying to derail a buddy a real possibility. Especially because the post literally made me do a double take.

at hawkeyes fake claim as town.

I fucking hate that. Even if it worked this time.

I mean maybe you have a point about the counterwagon thing, this has been discussed at length, but note that FA_Q2 was the counterwagon not Metrion. I'm not convinced from your blind notes of d1 that you would've voted CN over FA_Q2 here either.

I almost certainly would not have been voting cn. But I did detail when my attitude shifted on CN and when I would have been willing to include CN in my "list of people willing to vote for" in post 834.

[Thestatusquo]

There is definitely 1 scum in
[iraonavp, FA]

but probably 2.

What happened to your Dave read? Are you thinking he is town now?

No strong read on dave atm.

I would have been pushing the hell out of him d1 but he's kind of fallen off my radar. Would be willing to look deeper if someone would point me in a direction they think merits investigation.

[MoosyDoosy]

moosey likely town but dear god I hope they get force replaced.

I'm still here !!

[MoosyDoosy]

UNVOTE:

VOTE: iraonavp

I'm still all on board with this to be honest.

[MoosyDoosy]

@Thestatusquo, what do you think of dave's mechanical posting in general? Town or scum?

[davesaz]

A soulread is like a gut read but

deeper

Glimpse of towniness is 767 but even looking at it now I'm not sure it's something I can townread.

How did you get a read of any kind on cow?

[davesaz]

@Thestatusquo, what do you think of dave's mechanical posting in general? Town or scum?

What do you mean by mechanical? Do you perhaps mean logical?

[Thestatusquo]

@Thestatusquo, what do you think of dave's mechanical posting in general? Town or scum?

What do you mean by mechanical? Do you perhaps mean logical?

Why do you feel the need to respond to a question that is not directed at you?

[davesaz]

I feel the need to respond to a mischaracterization of my posting.

[Thestatusquo]

I feel the need to respond to a mischaracterization of my posting.

How could it be a mischaracterization if, by your own admission, you don't even know what he meant by it?

And why was correcting this phantom mischaracterization more important to you than hearing my answer to the question?