Open 652- Making Friends and Enemies: Over

[Io]

The policy lynch page even says it's based off of randomness. It is lynching non scummy people for arbitrary reasons.

[Thor665]

Thor, is there a reason you ignored my response to you?

Because there wasn't much to discuss and it was a long time from me even having interest in the questions, but if you'd like my thoughts I'll offer them;

Why should he have? I see people repeat questions all the time in games. Like, why would he do that as scum, but not as town?

The point was that Hark questioned Naru on something that I had already said. So, given I had said it first, why did he not question me on it instead of Naru? Especially as he then went on to misrep the Smurf out of Naru - looks like a premeditated attack to me.

There is, first off, no misrep there. I know what you're trying to sell as a misrep - but I find Hark's answer quite reasonable.
Also, though I can see the double standard concept you're selling here, it's not valid - because Hark was reacting to Naru's first ad only post, whereas you had posted multiple times at that stage and easily could have said things that weren't triggering Hark's 'safe play' scumtell, whereas Naru had a lot of the thread to react to, and opted to only ding at a very recent moment, sheep an already made comment, and offer no real thoughts while also hopping on the biggest wagon of the moment. That makes COMPLETE sense to me as a reaction from Hark, and I don't get your boggle there at all.

He's actually taken a hard stance either way and flip flopped positions a bit.
I, personally, find that an unlikely scum play, and also see it easily falling within the confines of town reacting to new info.

You're missing the point. He scum read Martha, she was the leading wagon (and a very good one at that), and he was trying to start a new wagon. Why?

It looks like the classic 'FoS buddy (Martha) and vote town (Zyf)'.

Mmmmm, maybe.
That said, also requires a 'vote buddy' period - and functionally you're complaining that he hopped off a large wagon to start a smaller one, which would then only make it scummy if Martha is indeed scum. So I understand your point - but it's a point that is meaningless as a stance until we flip Martha and/or Zyf (and/or Hark) and have one of them flip scum, so there's nothing to really say about it and it's not valid case info at this stage.

[Thor665]

The policy lynch page even says it's based off of randomness. It is lynching non scummy people for arbitrary reasons.

In this case the arbitrary reason is 'lack of contribution/posting' which makes it a valid policy lynch call.

@Loop - could you react to my comment about how the Tex slot and the N_M slot are basically equivalent on info provided to the thread, and then explain why you'd like to lynch the one that has posted less to say nothing as opposed to the one who has posted more to say nothing - because I know which one looks more scummy to me, and it's not the lesser posting one.

[Thor665]

To be perfectly frank, you can add in Martha's posting to Tex and it's *still* barely more info than N_M.

[Thor665]

@Loop - I mean, quick test - describe Martha's and Tex's reads to me.

[Harkonnen97]

I am so glad that you understand me Thor, and at the same time I'm so paranoid of you pocketing me so hard

[Zyf]

thor, why are you hard defending hark like that?

it's seriously bothering me

[Thor665]

Because I was explicitly asked by BBT to offer feedback on allegations made against Hark after I had clearly already chosen not to defend him.

[Thor665]

I mean, seriously Zyf, what the hell?

[karnos]

Can we please not let karnos slide when he plays like this?

Zyf might be scum with him too, stay tuned

If I'm sliding what do you call what not_mafia is doing?

[Thor665]

Continual low quality play on this site justified by others doing the same?

[Loopdan]

@Loop - could you react to my comment about how the Tex slot and the N_M slot are basically equivalent on info provided to the thread, and then explain why you'd like to lynch the one that has posted less to say nothing as opposed to the one who has posted more to say nothing - because I know which one looks more scummy to me, and it's not the lesser posting one.

OK, I'll look at this.

Not_Mafia's info provided to the thread:
383 - A vote on BBF
402 & 405 - Claims he didn't know the game started and hasn't caught up yet.

Martha/Texcat:
36 - Martha says she is "playing dumb"
52 - Martha tries to explain why she changed RVS vote from BBT to NM.
70 - Requests replace out and then rescinds it.
78 - Again Martha says she is playing dumb.
81 - Votes BBT again (claims it's OMGUS)
85 - Seems to be saying she doesn't think everyone is really scum-reading her, but rather they are just trying to get a wagon going early game. Also says she wants to lynch Zyf. Says Zyf is sheeping and has a nonsense reason for voting her.
104 - Says Hark is scum for calling out only 2 members of a potential scum-team.
114 - Then says she isn't voting Hark because saying Hark is scum doesn't mean she is scum-reading him.
188 - Claims VT
189 - Says she loves Hark's post 182, where he says Martha's frustration looks genuine and NAI.
211 - Votes Zyf for questioning the placement of her sigh.
242 - Asks why people are voting Narurider.
Then Texcat shows up and asks what the case is on his slot.
295 - Tex votes BBT for not seeing Martha's frustration when she said she'd self-hammer in 165.
350 - Asks for Zyf's reads because they are confusing
356 - Asks for Zyf to explain his townreads
393 - Joins the NM wagon

Martha/texcat have given us more to work with. Not saying that's town, but your question was about info provided to the game.

I can certainly see the possibility of texcat being scum. If nothing changes, I could vote comfortably for any of NM, tex, or Zyf.

[Thor665]

I will note that a lot of your "info provided" posts, are total hash jobs.

Saying you're playing dumb, or asking for reads is not providing info.
Allow me to parse down your list.

Not_Mafia's info provided to the thread:
383 - A vote on BBT

Martha/Texcat:
52 - Martha

tries

to explain why she changed RVS vote from BBT to NM.
81 - Votes BBT again (claims it's OMGUS)
114 - Then says she isn't voting Hark because saying Hark is scum doesn't mean she is scum-reading him.

Which then invalidates most of the reads she's given

188 - Claims VT
211 - Votes Zyf for questioning the placement of her sigh.
295 - Tex votes BBT for not seeing Martha's frustration when she said she'd self-hammer in 165.
393 - Joins the NM wagon

So...outside of placing more votes and a claim, you've got nothing.
Yet, so many posts.
I mean, lack of info from a slot that hasn't said gak is actually kind of a self-fulfilling reality.
Lack of info from a slot with 53 posts (compare/contrast with my slot -with 30...)
Yeah, that says something.

[PenguinPower]

If I'm sliding what do you call what not_mafia is doing?

Don't know what not_mafia is doing, but you're playing your scum game. Weaker than I would have thought, but...yeah.

[Loopdan]

@Thor-- Like I said, I'm OK with a texcat lynch. I prefer NM Today, as I don't anticipate an increase in his involvement. I think we can more definitively sort texcat later, whereas we will be no further into sorting NM on Days 2, 3, etc.

@Penguin-- Can you explain how this is Karnos' scum-game? I asked Dunn a similar question, but he hasn't posted since then.

[karnos]

I think they are both just playing cautious after http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=51&t=67000

It's a compliment if they think my town game looks the same as my scum game, but I am town this time.

[PenguinPower]

@Penguin-- Can you explain how this is Karnos' scum-game? I asked Dunn a similar question, but he hasn't posted since then.

Short version (read: because I'm lazy right now): Scum!Karnos is quiet, careful, and calculated in his posts and votes (of course, the level will vary depending on setup). Town!karnos doesn't give a rat's ass (this does not appear to vary).

I really don't care for this:

Spoiler:

I don't always get to post much on the weekends. It looks like hardly anyone else in this game does either.

I was hopping we could leave texcat at L-1 a little longer to see if anything interesting occurred, but it's probably a town slot. I think Martha looked incredibly scummy due to a language issue, she wasn't using the correct words for certain things and it came out making relatively innocent comments looking very scummy.

Why is everyone voting not_mafia now?

Hey

VOTE: BBT

Well I didn't know game had started so it will take me a bit of time to catch up

Wait what? You posted on Wednesday, and then again Friday, but as of today you didn't know the game had started?

VOTE: not_mafia

CAUTION: I think that might be L-1

The "Caution" is just uncharacteristic and almost screams LAMIST. The "Why is everyone voting NM?" crap and then hopping on is probably him trying to further a mislynch while still allowing himself an out when NM flips town.

To be fair, I'm almost always going to have an initial scum read on karnos.

p-edit

Scum.

[karnos]

Personally, I think calling out L-1 is not necessary and I have never seen a true lolhammer from town occur because someone forgot to call L-1.

But, in http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=83&t=67428 I didn't call L-1 on day 1, was continually read as scum by a few certain players, and I eventually got misslynched day 3.

It is dumb and I agree it's LAMIST but it's just a silly hoop I have to jump through so I don't get misslynched by scum.

...and that concludes my self-defense posts for today, I don't want to muddle the thread and distract from real scum-hunting.

[PenguinPower]

Personally, I think calling out L-1 is not necessary and I have never seen a true lolhammer from town occur because someone forgot to call L-1.

But, in http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=83&t=67428 I didn't call L-1 on day 1, was continually read as scum by a few certain players, and I eventually got misslynched day 3.

It is dumb and I agree it's LAMIST but it's just a silly hoop I have to jump through so I don't get misslynched by scum.

...and that concludes my self-defense posts for today, I don't want to muddle the thread and distract from real scum-hunting.

No, no. It's not that you called out L-1...you call L-1 as scum and town...it's the manner in which you did it. Soooo over the top, and I haven't seen that before.

[texcat]

Penguin, You didn't say anything about Zyf's 297 which I found over the top. Why call out Karnos and not Zyf?

[Zyf]

Penguin, You didn't say anything about Zyf's 297 which I found over the top. Why call out Karnos and not Zyf?

I do that all over the place regardless of alignment
let me pull some stuff up

[PenguinPower]

Penguin, You didn't say anything about Zyf's 297 which I found over the top. Why call out Karnos and not Zyf?

I haven't played with Zyf before. I've played a lot with karnos.

Plus...that kind of behavior seems normal for Zyf based on this game alone.

[Zyf]

neat-o burrito, the thread's locked.

[Zyf]

i always do it like that because in my first game there WAS a lolhammer by an idiot that got lynched the next day

[Loopdan]

neat-o burrito, the thread's locked.

What is this?