Mini 1826: The Purge - Game Over

[Realeo]

Why would it hurt town to be as clear as possible

+1

Next time you two become masons, please make it painless.

Ugh..Vedith..Why you replaces out?

lane, I noticed that I made wrong observation against you. You didn't quite go broad. Well, you did as we're approaching the end of D1. At the beginning, you pretty much tunnel at {kraska,Realeo}. You don't have any other scum suspects early in D1?

[lane0168]

I'm not sure. If you read everything, then that's everything. Pretty sure I had shos on there at some point. Why?

[Realeo]

I just isoed you... I can't see your scum motivation, but having trouble understanding your town mechanism.

[Persivul]

Votecount 2.5

Not voting (7) - lane0168, PeregrineV, Inifinity, shaddowez, MagnaofIllusion, Realeo, pisskop

With 7 alive, it takes 4 votes to strand.

(expired on 2016-09-26 18:30:00) remain until day end

[Realeo]

OK. Moi, infinity, which of you is the strongman?

[Realeo]

Based on lane and shadow's interaction at D1, I have concluded that both of them can't be in the same team. Now, I need to dodge the strongman. My feeling is that both strongman and town is in {lane,Shadow}, but it doesn't hurt to ask.

[Infinity 324]

I'm the town strongman

[Realeo]

Har. Har.

[Infinity 324]

Seriously, why can't lane and shadow be scum together

[Realeo]

Here's the logic.

lane fos shadows' for his logic.
lane acknowledge logic error
Shadow acknowledges lane' action and defend it when being questioned by kraska.

And this happen quite early part of the game.

Why would scum do that?

a) It has no positive effect. It's done early in day 1. You want to gambit to make yourself looks nice? Do it at the end of day 1. Classic Mafia 101.

b) If they're scum trying to seem 'rational', when one of them flips scum, it will seem bad. There is a better way to seem "town scumhunting" without the association. If I were scum!shadow, I will press on the issue at scum!lane "how come do you think like that? Are you an opportunistic scum who misstep?", enter a page of exchange, end it with "ok ok". You seems like town who is trying without the association. In fact, if either of them flip scum, the other seems townier because "why would scum bus at that point? Too early!"

As a result, I believe there is one town in {lane,shadow}, so the remaining scum is in {MOI,infinity}

[Infinity 324]

What?

First of all scumbuddy interactions don't change much based on the timing of them; they're mainly for when people look back after someone has already flipped scum.

I think what happened was that lane pushed on shadow to make it look like he was scumhunting and to group shadow with the townies he was pushing. He turned out to be wrong, and shadow didn't want to call attention to the fact that it was suspicious/he didn't think he needed to.

[PeregrineV]

Why would it hurt town to be as clear as possible

Because everyone is a viga

[MagnaofIllusion]

Because everyone is a viga

You do understand that scum only needs to net an additional kill on any Town, not just the Masons, above kills made on scum to win the game, right?

I mean this whole "we don't need to be explicitly clear" is pretty stupid when being stubborn doesn't increase Towns chances of winning.

So I'll be looking at the interactions between Lane / Shaddow / Infinity / Realeo and coming up with my assessment of the most likely scum team.

Also for the record if Shaddow is in that scum team I will not support stranding anyone but him. I know for a fact he's not the Strongman so if he is scum him being stranded helps Town signficantly.

[shaddowez]

Also for the record if Shaddow is in that scum team I will not support stranding anyone but him. I know for a fact he's not the Strongman so if he is scum him being stranded helps Town signficantly.

Considering all the win conditions (i.e. if everyone's dead scum still win), do you think it would have been in scums best interest for any of them to barricade N1? I understand that this could be WIFOM, but logically I can't see why scum wouldn't take advantage of as many shots as possible on N1.

[Infinity 324]

I think we should focus on stranding scum as opposed to specifically the strongman. I'm not sure why MoI doesn't think shadow is the strongman, but I think in general it's hard to distinguish between strongman and non-strongman scum play. If we try and get too clever, we may just end up stranding town which will probably make us lose.

[MagnaofIllusion]

I'm not sure why MoI doesn't think shadow is the strongman, but I think in general it's hard to distinguish between strongman and non-strongman scum play.

Because I shot him last Night. If he was the Strongman he'd be dead. If you choose to not believe me I can't help that. But I know for certain Shaddow isn't the Strongman.

[Infinity 324]

Derp, gotcha

[shaddowez]

Derp, gotcha

I find it interesting that you just accept his word for how things went down, considering you think that MoI and I are scum together (based on 13016),

[Infinity 324]

I understand why he thinks that, obviously I think he's making shit up.

[PeregrineV]

I'll have to come back later with my choices of who to strand.

[Realeo]

What?

First of all scumbuddy interactions don't change much based on the timing of them; they're mainly for when people look back after someone has already flipped scum.

I think what happened was that lane pushed on shadow to make it look like he was scumhunting and to group shadow with the townies he was pushing. He turned out to be wrong, and shadow didn't want to call attention to the fact that it was suspicious/he didn't think he needed to.

1. I disagree. I find it that mafia get manipulative in their reaction as time goes on. "Time around RVS" is when you get "pure" reaction. As game progress, it will be harder to differ buddying, scum butting each other, or town cross-checking. Remember that (from time stamp) that this exchange is around ~ 2 days from game start.

2. It will be easier to just ignore lane altogether insteaf of defending it. Lane got his hand dirty. Why Shadow has to join the dirty club?

[Realeo]

Rabble..Rabble. Uh....Ah...Ah. Uh uh Uh ah.

[Infinity 324]

What?

First of all scumbuddy interactions don't change much based on the timing of them; they're mainly for when people look back after someone has already flipped scum.

I think what happened was that lane pushed on shadow to make it look like he was scumhunting and to group shadow with the townies he was pushing. He turned out to be wrong, and shadow didn't want to call attention to the fact that it was suspicious/he didn't think he needed to.

1. I disagree. I find it that mafia get manipulative in their reaction as time goes on. "Time around RVS" is when you get "pure" reaction. As game progress, it will be harder to differ buddying, scum butting each other, or town cross-checking. Remember that (from time stamp) that this exchange is around ~ 2 days from game start.

2. It will be easier to just ignore lane altogether insteaf of defending it. Lane got his hand dirty. Why Shadow has to join the dirty club?

1. Never seen the phenomenon you talk about here.

2. Honestly I don't think it was that scummy of a push, so I think it was fine to defend it. Don't you?

[MagnaofIllusion]

So looking at Lane / Shaddow / Realeo / Vedith + Infinity interactions on Day 1 …

Lane –

Realeo – Question to him at 86. He follows up Realeo’s response with another question at 116. At 128 Lane explains his issues with Realeo’s 4 minute meta. Soft assertion that Realeo is scum at 231. Questions to Realeo at 509. Votes Realeo at 902. But immediately votes Shos again at 905 after quoting Realeo voting Peregrine but saying he would move back to Shos. Prods Realeo for not discussing R’s Peregrine read at 1039. Lists Realeo in his “kill pool” Day 1 with Shos and kraska.

Vedith / Infinity – Very soft attack on Vedith at 146.

Shaddow – Lane votes Shaddow at 147 for effectively “playing dumb” which he also said Shos was doing. Backs off attack on Shaddow at 157.

--

Lane has minimal interactions with the Vedith slot and the Shaddow slot. Both were soft interactions very early that didn’t amount to anything of significance. Meanwhile his interactions and questions to Realeo are pretty plentiful and don’t look like partners.

The only conclusion I can draw from just looking at Lane is very likely he and Realeo aren’t partners.

[Realeo]

1. Never seen the phenomenon you talk about here.

2. Honestly I don't think it was that scummy of a push, so I think it was fine to defend it. Don't you?

1. So it doesn't happen in mafiascum.net? It happens a lot in my playing group. At the beginning, people are chillin' out. As game progress, bussing and buddying at its maximum. You can't really pick up true intention except on early phase.

2. If shadow is town? Sure. If shadow!scum and lane!scum, easier to just ignore it.