Newbie 1747 (Game Over)

rb · Post Post #200 (ISO) » Fri Oct 14, 2016 10:38 am

Thor I'd answer your question but we fundamentally disagree about whether post 50 is purely worthless shade throwing or not. You want me to 'respond' to a case that is just a bunch of one liners. That's not a case, anyone can do that.

Also as mentioned, it's not productive to argue with scum or bad town players. It just derails useful discussion. What I want you to do is outline how post 50 is supposedly the product of critical thought and not just shitty shade-throwing.

My god I can't stand it when the IC is illogical and lost.

rb · Post Post #201 (ISO) » Fri Oct 14, 2016 10:39 am

Response to accusations of me being fluffy:

Use your brain and read my ISO, then use brain to realise how not-fluff my posts actually are. Thx.

rb · Post Post #202 (ISO) » Fri Oct 14, 2016 10:41 am

Also lol @ creeps 'scumtell' on me, I missed that gem.

rb · Post Post #203 (ISO) » Fri Oct 14, 2016 10:51 am

Oh right about why I'm not voting you.

Because you're probably town for your posts up to and including 112. I don't explain early game townreads, deal with it. And yes, I think some of the things you said were utterly worthless but I have no doubt you're a good player. Being IC doesn't make people immune to missing info or doing dumb stuff.

Hermie · Post Post #204 (ISO) » Fri Oct 14, 2016 12:12 pm

In post 200, rb wrote:Thor I'd answer your question but we fundamentally disagree about whether post 50 is purely worthless shade throwing or not. You want me to 'respond' to a case that is just a bunch of one liners. That's not a case, anyone can do that.

Also as mentioned, it's not productive to argue with scum or bad town players. It just derails useful discussion. What I want you to do is outline how post 50 is supposedly the product of critical thought and not just shitty shade-throwing.

My god I can't stand it when the IC is illogical and lost.

In post 201, rb wrote:Response to accusations of me being fluffy:

Use your brain and read my ISO, then use brain to realise how not-fluff my posts actually are. Thx.

In post 202, rb wrote:Also lol @ creeps 'scumtell' on me, I missed that gem.

In post 203, rb wrote:Oh right about why I'm not voting you.

Because you're probably town for your posts up to and including 112. I don't explain early game townreads, deal with it. And yes, I think some of the things you said were utterly worthless but I have no doubt you're a good player. Being IC doesn't make people immune to missing info or doing dumb stuff.

Rb why are all your posts, defensive or offensive, based off the supposed quality of said players? Remember this is a newbie game and player quality may or may not be great..

But having said that you have ranted many times about how good of a player you are.. why is all your suspicioun and scum tells based off of "You are either a bad mafia or a worse townie" line of reasoning? Can we move past attacking the player and try attacking the play?

I haven't noticed any mass quotes from you and 1 scum list? Why not? I am attacking the player here but you have stated openly you are a good player. Why is that not plain to the rest of us?

Thor665 · Post Post #205 (ISO) » Fri Oct 14, 2016 12:14 pm

In post 200, rb wrote:What I want you to do is outline
how post 50 is supposedly the product of critical thought and not just Smurfy shade-throwing.

Bolded section is for reference below;

So you can't emotionally or intellectually handle addressing a post - but you want to demand I do it?
Okay, because apparently my brain can handle it

Here is the post in question so people can look upon the thing that you claim is not a product of critical thought.

http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.ph ... 4#p8410844
and here is a definition of critical thinking aka critical thought
http://www.criticalthinking.org/pages/d ... inking/766

So per the definition of critical thinking - we can see that the required definition is to gather information and assess it based on (a wide number of things, but the vital one for this point is) a formed set of beliefs based on experience.

By that definition alone he easily meets the needs as he first draws up info (all of your posts) and second offers his viewpoints on it from his experience of what non-game relevant (aka fluff) posting is. So, on a purely objective scale - yes, he is using critical thinking. That, however, is not your real boggle I suppose, your issue is that you *disagree* with his value calls.

Well, in looking at your posts - I find it awkward for you to disagree with much of it.
Objectively, for anyone anywhere, I would submit that his points about your following posts are just straight up true - 30, 37 and 39.
Your other posts I would happily argue with him are not fluff - that said he makes *specific* notes about why he finds those posts to be lacking, and for the most part I would say I agree with the issues he raised - when he noted that you hadn't explained reads, he was correct. When he noted that you hadn't really responded to questions, he was correct. When he raised issues of opinion with your posts, he may or may not be correct, but he was clear with his issues, so you could understand what he meant. That, to my mind, shows him expressing thoughts, doing so clearly, explaining his issues, and pointing out failings he sees - all of which does not to my mind qualify only as throwing shade.

Which, brings us back to the bolded.
You *HATE* people throwing shade - or so you say. You act like it's scummy.
Yet, in your post you throw immense shade at both Hermie (calling him not worth responding to - all while insulting his play repeatedly) and then at me (suggesting I'm a bit of a buffoon for not seeing his tomfoolery)

Ergo, your biggest complaint about Hermie?
You're doing exactly that - only more so.
I'm very happy voting you right now.

In post 203, rb wrote:Oh right about why I'm not voting you.

Because you're probably town for your posts up to and including 112. I don't explain early game townreads, deal with it. And yes, I think some of the things you said were utterly worthless but I have no doubt you're a good player. Being IC doesn't make people immune to missing info or doing dumb stuff.

It's amazing that I'm posting apparently just blindly silly and illogical things - yet I'm such a solid town read.
WHat am I doing that's town besides just posting dumb things and missing stuff exactly?
I would think someone posting dumb stuff and overlooking things would look like a very lazy and bad town at best and assuredly not a strong town read, no?

My god I can't stand it when the IC is illogical and lost.[/quote]

Thor665 · Post Post #206 (ISO) » Fri Oct 14, 2016 12:27 pm

RB hates the shade.

In post 115, rb wrote:Thor are you seriously insisting that the post by Hermie in 50 is a 'case'?

It's just crap shade throwing.

In post 156, rb wrote:Knowing how to find town means you spend less time attacking your allies and more time pressuring scum.

So he doesn't like tossing shade, and he doesn't think attacking town reads (like his Thor town read) is a good idea.
Okay...

Spoiler: Shade throwing and attacking town reads!

rb · Post Post #207 (ISO) » Fri Oct 14, 2016 12:31 pm

So Thor, do you think me being pissed off at shit players in my games is scummy?

rb · Post Post #208 (ISO) » Fri Oct 14, 2016 12:34 pm

Because right now you're apparently happy with your vote on me not because you think I'm scummy but because you (mistakenly) think I'm not being consistent with what I say and do, which isn't actually the case. When someone is constantly throwing shade at you, pointing this simple fact out does not also constitute throwing shade.

I'm _responding_ to Hermie's incessant shade-throwing at me, and the _FACT_ that he is barely interacting with anyone else or making any other kind of relevant contributions to the game. This is an undeniable _FACT_. He is making _ZERO_ effort to actually sort alignments, he's just tunneling on me. Read his ISO, you will see that I'm 100% correct. I am not making up stupid bullshit ideas to try and make it look like Hermie is being fluffy and not contributing - this is an ACTUAL FACT.

rb · Post Post #209 (ISO) » Fri Oct 14, 2016 12:36 pm

And yes, the fact that both of you are tunneling on me when I'm town, makes it abundantly obvious that you are indeed, lost. This isn't shade, it's a fact.

Also, if you're happy with your vote on me because you dislike my play: unvote. If you're happy with your vote oon me because you think I'm scum, state why.

Hermie · Post Post #210 (ISO) » Fri Oct 14, 2016 12:53 pm

First point.. I have had plenty to say with other players then you, rb.

Secondly my vote is because I think you are scum.

So from a purely play point of view let's look at this:

If rb is mafia his play is bad but not terrible.. He has 2 players tunneling on him but only 2.. He can possibly flip a Lynch off him but only one.. so not impressive play but not so bad..

If he is town his play is awful . He has 2 players throwing suspicioun at him. His contributions are sketchy at best. He will get a townie lynched when he dies and he is diverting town unnecessarily with his angry posts....

I give 2000 pats some value and I don't understand either outcome really but if he is town... Wow is all I can say

I will be gone till 10 or 11

Thor665 · Post Post #211 (ISO) » Fri Oct 14, 2016 12:56 pm

In post 207, rb wrote:So Thor, do you think me being pissed off at Smurf players in my games is scummy?

No.
As stated, I think the hypocrisy of you acting like shade throwing is an issue while continuously shade throwing is scummy.

In post 208, rb wrote:I'm _responding_ to Hermie's incessant shade-throwing at me, and the _FACT_ that he is barely interacting with anyone else or making any other kind of relevant contributions to the game. This is an undeniable _FACT_. He is making _ZERO_ effort to actually sort alignments, he's just tunneling on me. Read his ISO, you will see that I'm 100% correct. I am not making up stupid bullSmurf ideas to try and make it look like Hermie is being fluffy and not contributing - this is an ACTUAL FACT.

I would note that I pointed out his FACT of you fluff posting.
I also pointed out the FACT that you are shade throwing.
Also, besides your interaction with me (initiated by me) you are *also* only really interacting with Hermie just as he is only really interacting with you, which is not so much a FACT but is assuredly a fairly reasoned observation.

In post 209, rb wrote:Also, if you're happy with your vote on me because you dislike my play: unvote. If you're happy with your vote oon me because you think I'm scum, state why.

I already stated why in that expansive wall wherein I analyzed Hermie's post - something you asked me to do and then didn't respond to.
I also stated why earlier than that, as my reasoning has changed a few times - you didn't respond to my RVS (perfectly fine) but you also didn't respond when I called you out for some logical flaws except insomuch as to "throw shade" at Hermie again.

Do you need me to quote my most recent scum reasoning for you so you can find it, or will you eventually respond to my discussion on Hermie's post since you wanted me to do it, so I presumed you wanted to analyze my thinking (critical or not)?

rb · Post Post #212 (ISO) » Fri Oct 14, 2016 4:50 pm

I don't know if you actually understand that context is paramount to sound logic and you're completely misunderstanding the context of many of my posts. I think you're town though, so I'll just ignore you and hope you stop derptunneling on me when I'm obvtown.

rb · Post Post #213 (ISO) » Fri Oct 14, 2016 4:52 pm

Actually I really cbf carrying such an awful town.

@Zaicon, replace me out.

I'm Vanilla Town. Bye. Blacklisting Hermie for having less IQ points than birthdays.

Hermie · Post Post #214 (ISO) » Fri Oct 14, 2016 7:34 pm

Interesting... I would not call that a usual scum tactic. But I remain certain that slot is scum... I will wait for the replacement to join before I Lynch tho!

VOTE: creeps20

For a general inactivity and an unnatural playstyle.. I want more posts before a Lynch but something doesn't quite feel right...

Hermie · Post Post #215 (ISO) » Fri Oct 14, 2016 7:35 pm

In post 212, rb wrote:I don't know if you actually understand that context is paramount to sound logic and you're completely misunderstanding the context of many of my posts. I think you're town though, so I'll just ignore you and hope you stop derptunneling on me when I'm obvtown.

In post 213, rb wrote:Actually I really cbf carrying such an awful town.

@Zaicon, replace me out.

I'm Vanilla Town. Bye. Blacklisting Hermie for having less IQ points than birthdays.

Hermie · Post Post #216 (ISO) » Fri Oct 14, 2016 7:37 pm

I don't quite know what to say as I thought my demands where rather clear... I wanted more posts about the actual gameplay rather then all the comments about the quality of town.. His replacement has some talking to do in my opinion...

Hermie · Post Post #217 (ISO) » Fri Oct 14, 2016 7:41 pm

One last thing... Just as a disclaimer... I put all likes and dislikes out of my mind in a mafia game so don't take anything I say personally... I never take anything said in a tvm/mafia game personally.. I will attack my best friends and buddy up with my worst enemies if that is what the game requires..

Just as a disclaimer...

Creeps20 · Post Post #218 (ISO) » Fri Oct 14, 2016 7:45 pm

Okay lets get the activitiy back.

Alein the only reason your voting me is because I voted you. This is called OMGUS and it is a pretty terrible scum tactic

VOTE: VTL ALEIN

Creeps20 · Post Post #219 (ISO) » Fri Oct 14, 2016 7:48 pm

In post 214, Hermie wrote:Interesting... I would not call that a usual scum tactic. But I remain certain that slot is scum... I will wait for the replacement to join before I Lynch tho!

VOTE: creeps20

For a general inactivity and an unnatural playstyle.. I want more posts before a Lynch but something doesn't quite feel right...

Okay just read.this. I am trying a new one out

Hermie · Post Post #220 (ISO) » Fri Oct 14, 2016 7:50 pm

That is what scum would say but I will let it slide... Interesting how a vote drops on you and you are suddenly active again.. it is 1:50 am here so imma get some sleep

Creeps20 · Post Post #221 (ISO) » Fri Oct 14, 2016 8:20 pm

Herm I thought there were no new posts. Didn't see the next page exist

Thor665 · Post Post #222 (ISO) » Sat Oct 15, 2016 2:29 am

In post 213, rb wrote:Actually I really cbf carrying such an awful town.

@Zaicon, replace me out.

I'm Vanilla Town. Bye. Blacklisting Hermie for having less IQ points than birthdays.

Please blacklist me too - you're oddly rude to others, and this replace out was unkind to whomever your teammates are.

I'm going to guess that this was not strategic.
Let's see if Creep can impress me.

Unvote: rb
Vote: Alein

MisaTange · Post Post #223 (ISO) » Sat Oct 15, 2016 6:40 am

Not too sure what to take of rb replacing out... besides being a townie replace (out of frustration rather than an actual flake).

Thor665 · Post Post #224 (ISO) » Sat Oct 15, 2016 6:46 am

There's a certain amount of debate there.
It was clearly a frustration replace out.
The question is;

1. Was it a replace out because his brain couldn't handle the horrors of the playing quality here?
2. Was he scum and frustrated that he was caught for reasons he disagreed with?

Both are potentially likely. I *slightly* favor #1 because it seems a little more on point with his level of rage flail. But it's a narrow value call for me.