Open 657: JK9++ (Game over)

[Creature]

Not my fault everybody's being hard to read lol

[Creature]

bangthemafia, what are you?

[Fountain of Dreams]

how would Kling's reply be role/alignment indicative?

I was referring to the fact that Klingon might slip or MDS might read her one way and be able to form an opinion on Klingon's alignment which she could use to gauge the threat against the scum team.

If Klingon alignment slipped wouldn't that be a good thing? As far as PR slipping goes, how would that happen in the first place?

So you agree with her scumlist? And her reasons?

I think it is less that i agree with Klingon's scumlist and more that i read MDS as scum and if in the end she is, tha would put a suspicious gaze on the other members of Klingon's scumlist. I guess on the end i view the others on the list as guilty by association.

Can you restate why you scumread MDS again?

@Fountain of Dreams: Why were you lawyering me in front of Secret Agent Jin?

Lawyering? I assume this means something related to interrogation. In any case, why not? His post was worth questioning, you just happened to be the subject of it.

bangthemafia, what are you?

Did you look at his username? His name is Bang and he's the mafia.

[lane0168]

@fountain ,why do you ignore several people asking why you said nevermind on page 1?

[Gamma Emerald]

I'm with FoD on bang, his thought process looks weird
VOTE: bangthemafia

Care to elaborate what is weird? Or just because I think differently?

You don't seem to be having a logical progession in your catchup.

[Gamma Emerald]

MDS points out good things to note about Creature

[Gamma Emerald]

Also not scumreading bang as much, he seems to be progressing better and his catch up was just awk
UNVOTE:

[Secret Agent Jin]

Ok... I can't... Are we really going to believe SAJ that he had this super long post but his delete key cut stuck so he's just there frantically trying to get it to stop deleting his post while watching his whole post be deleted and got it to stop at that part???

@saj, Pretending that actually happened, what was the first part of your big post? Summarize it

Why not? I fully relate to what SAJ said with that delete thing. I myself was about to do that. Started writing a quick reply on last page and in a hurry went 2 pages back to read something not realizing that what I wrote vanished. Had to hit back keys 2-3 times to recover that!

Having said that, SAJ doesnt seem to have any solid reason against Mini. She explained spoilers. I believe her explanation and rest of SAJ's case can be argued both ways!

That's completely different. The only time delete keys get stuck and you're watching everything get deleted is in the movies

I actually missed this post regarding the delete thing. Ill explain, i am using mobile and my screen is cracked a tiny bit over the delete button. The reason i got fed up with the delete thing is it has happened multiple times in the last few days. Since the keyboard is digital and pressure sensitive, there is nothing i can do until the keyboard program decides to correct the mistake and stop deleting. It happened, it sucks, i actually ended up typing out most of the message again. I added the delete part because i was frustrated and not because i wanted an excuse in case my post was lacking.

[Secret Agent Jin]

Alright, i have read the last page and a half and i was WAY out there in suspecting MDS. I dont know what my yesterday self was thinking and i am 100% backing off for now. I didnt even have good reasons for going after MDS. I am placing MDS under null, no more scum.

Uhm, if I were scum, I'd obviously know if Klingon was scum or not. Why would I need to get a read on her alignment?

As far as this goes, i was more saying that the scum could figure out if she was a vanilla townie or a PR and act accordingly.

My brain is still on morning mode so if i missed anything that anyone feels needs answering, state it again and i will answer.

[Randomnamechange]

VC 1.4

lane0168 - L-7
Klingoncelt – L-7
Tiger Moth - L-7
Gamma Emerald - L-6 - Alban
Fountain of Dreams - L-6 - Lane0168
alban - L-6 - Klingoncelt
Charloux - L-7
Kop - L-7
MiniDeathStar - L-5 - Tiger Moth, Secret Agent Jin
Creature - L-7
Secret Agent Jin - L-7
bangthemafia - L-7
Spade_Ace - L-6 - Fountain of Dreams

(expired on 2016-11-20 12:10:00)

[Gamma Emerald]

Alban might be scum guys
he's still voting me from RVS

[Secret Agent Jin]

If Klingon alignment slipped wouldn't that be a good thing? As far as PR slipping goes, how would that happen in the first place?

That would be a good thing as we could then question who was against Klingon. I absolutely have no idea why i was so adamant on MDS last night.

Can you restate why you scumread MDS again?

I originally scumread MDS because her posts against Klingon looked way too defensive. I then proceeded to speak out of my butt without much evidence to back up my claim. I REALLY jumped the gun on MDS, all i can ask is for her forgiveness and that it be out to rest.

[Secret Agent Jin]

OH! I almost forgot

UNVOTE:

[Tiger moth]

@Tiger moth:

I had a lot to say and splitting the entire quotes would have taken me super long time and they would have all appeared chopped up. I'm sorry I wasn't considerate with the gold text though; I'm using the black scheme and I haven't really tested what works best across all of them. I'll keep that in mind in future, thank you.

What's 'ott'? And sure, maybe. I'm not saying she *can't* be scum; I just don't *think* she is. I can't be certain of anything unless I have evidence.

If Klingon is scum, she may pass under the radar for a while, but I doubt she can last forever. I somehow can't see her surviving to 3-way LYLO and winning with this strategy. I think it's much more likely she'd be policy-lynched when most of her scumreads die as town and her confidence flops. In my experience towns that mislynch a couple times and lose their leaders to nightkills eventually grow paranoid of lurking scum and start lynching the kind of people that mafia would never kill while they still have the chance.

So for the moment I feel safe ignoring Klingon and focusing on other potential suspects. I might revisit her later in the game if I have to.

Sorry for being so grumpy last night. I was very tired.

ott = over the top

Judging by Klingon's join date and post count I doubt she's going to continue like that. How are you so sure that most of her scumreads are town? Looks like you're preparing the ground for a future mislynch or bus (if she's a scumbuddy) here under the guise of a policy lynch.

[Tiger moth]

@ Fountain: Did you miss this?

Bang's catch-up was bad.Kop's catch-up was bad.

What was bad about them?

[MiniDeathStar]

Not my fault everybody's being hard to read lol

Give it your best effort? Pretty please? For me?

I originally scumread MDS because her posts against Klingon looked way too defensive. I then proceeded to speak out of my butt without much evidence to back up my claim. I REALLY jumped the gun on MDS, all i can ask is for her forgiveness and that it be out to rest.

Okay, now I'm just... confused. I literally don't know what to think about this. Like, at all.

Judging by Klingon's join date and post count I doubt she's going to continue like that. How are you so sure that most of her scumreads are town?

When did I say I'm sure most of her scumreads are town? Reality check:

That's why I think she's town, but I think her reads are very bad (as in poorly reasoned) and sticking with them is just very poor play. Even if she's actually found scum

(because other than me I can't guarantee that the rest on her list aren't scum)

, that would be sheer luck.

In the post you quoted I was speaking under the assumption Klingon is scum and therefore at least mathematically wrong about having found "the 3 scum". Assuming that she's town and assuming there are 3 scum, she has about 67% chance of having no scum in her list, and about 1.8% chance of having all 3 (0.4% if you consider my POV because I know I'm not scum but I'm still in her list). So yeah, I'm going with her probably being wrong on most of those people, but I'm not excluding them from my suspect list. Just, *if* she's found scum, she's either been lucky or bussing. Her reasoning is complete bollocks.

Looks like you're preparing the ground for a future mislynch or bus (if she's a scumbuddy) here under the guise of a policy lynch.

I've literally no idea where you got that from. I already said I think she's town. Please stop misrepresenting me.

And please start interacting with people who aren't me. You're not being helpful right now and I can't get a read on you if all you do is tunnel me with "she winked!!!" and "she's totally preparing a mislynch on this townread of hers!!!"

[Fountain of Dreams]

Alban might be scum guys
he's still voting me from RVS

No

@Tiger moth:

I had a lot to say and splitting the entire quotes would have taken me super long time and they would have all appeared chopped up. I'm sorry I wasn't considerate with the gold text though; I'm using the black scheme and I haven't really tested what works best across all of them. I'll keep that in mind in future, thank you.

What's 'ott'? And sure, maybe. I'm not saying she *can't* be scum; I just don't *think* she is. I can't be certain of anything unless I have evidence.

If Klingon is scum, she may pass under the radar for a while, but I doubt she can last forever. I somehow can't see her surviving to 3-way LYLO and winning with this strategy. I think it's much more likely she'd be policy-lynched when most of her scumreads die as town and her confidence flops. In my experience towns that mislynch a couple times and lose their leaders to nightkills eventually grow paranoid of lurking scum and start lynching the kind of people that mafia would never kill while they still have the chance.

So for the moment I feel safe ignoring Klingon and focusing on other potential suspects. I might revisit her later in the game if I have to.

Sorry for being so grumpy last night. I was very tired.

ott = over the top

Judging by Klingon's join date and post count I doubt she's going to continue like that. How are you so sure that most of her scumreads are town? Looks like you're preparing the ground for a future mislynch or bus (if she's a scumbuddy) here under the guise of a policy lynch.

Bad post. Welcome to the scum pile.

@ Fountain: Did you miss this?

Bang's catch-up was bad.Kop's catch-up was bad.

What was bad about them?

They don't look genuine.

Anyways, other head wants this and I don't tr this either.

VOTE: Secret Agent Jin

Pedit: p sure Creature is a mislynch but i can't remember for the life of me why I think so.

[MiniDeathStar]

DAE think that Secret Agent Jin cease and desist was weird af? I've literally never seen that in any game I've ever played.

[Charloux]

I can't find any importance in most of the quoted posts. Honestly i'm envious of you guys...

[Secret Agent Jin]

DAE think that Secret Agent Jin cease and desist was weird af? I've literally never seen that in any game I've ever played.

Ill elaborate on my reason on the cease and desist. I believed your post against Klingon was scummy but then when i poated what i did, your response and defense against my claims were very well out and i changed my view on your alignment. I apoligize for thinking you were scummy.

[Tiger moth]

In the post you quoted I was speaking under the assumption Klingon is scum

My bad. Somehow I missed the opening part of that para. I was focusing on your use of the words "policy lynch" and your suggestion that her confidence would flop when her reads die as town. It seemed odd to use the word policy there, not just lynch. If we're lynching someone we think is scum, that's not a policy lynch. And it's townies who lose confidence when their scumreads flip town, not scum who are glad to have got another mislynch. I think that was what gave me the impression that you were thinking of her as town there.

And please start interacting with people who aren't me. You're not being helpful right now and I can't get a read on you if all you do is tunnel me with "she winked!!!" and "she's totally preparing a mislynch on this townread of hers!!!"

I'm already addressing others but there hasn't been much I need to comment on yet. Fountain is stonewalling me so I'm not getting far there and most other stuff that's going on has either been questioned by others or I don't think is alignment telling.

[Tiger moth]

They don't look genuine.

What's not genuine about them?


@ SAJ: Why are you apologising for your reads?

[MiniDeathStar]

My bad. Somehow I missed the opening part of that para. I was focusing on your use of the words "policy lynch" and your suggestion that her confidence would flop when her reads die as town. It seemed odd to use the word policy there, not just lynch. If we're lynching someone we think is scum, that's not a policy lynch. And it's townies who lose confidence when their scumreads flip town, not scum who are glad to have got another mislynch. I think that was what gave me the impression that you were thinking of her as town there.

Addressing this for the sake of transparency and completedness. The reason I was hypothetically speaking about Klingon as scum was because you suggested that super confident early reads (which I townread her for) would be a good cover for scum-her. I don't think they would be. How would scum-her explain her confidence once it turns out she was wrong? Because she has to know that's what's coming. I feel like whatever excuse she makes town would stop buying it after a while and lynch her based on principle (rationalising that if she's town, she's an extra suspect scum would never kill). That's what I called a policy lynch. Towns close to judgement day consider everyone a suspect.

That's why the only sound explanation I have is that she genuinely believes she's found the scum. Why did *you* doubt my townread on her? Do you have a reason to suspect Klingon?

I'm already addressing others but there hasn't been much I need to comment on yet. Fountain is stonewalling me so I'm not getting far there and most other stuff that's going on has either been questioned by others or I don't think is alignment telling.

I've been extremely transparent with you and everyone who accused me and you still think I'm scum. Why?

Fountain hasn't answered your questions. What's your opinion on that? They scumread you, too. Why did you ignore that?

I also find it pretty hard to believe you just think I'm the most interesting person this game. I'm super generous with my explanations and open with my thoughts, even if they are just hunches. Why do you need *me* to elaborate further but don't probe your zillion null reads for information?

You say the other stuff has been questioned by others. You must have thought those questions were reasonable then, since you didn't mention them. Why don't you say which questions you think are reasonable?

Honestly I've seen very little actual content from you that's not suspicion on me that I've already addressed. You're actively lurking and I don't like that.

I don't like anything from you right now.

Ill elaborate on my reason on the cease and desist. I believed your post against Klingon was scummy but then when i poated what i did, your response and defense against my claims were very well out and i changed my view on your alignment. I apoligize for thinking you were scummy.

Fair enough. Still weird but I think I get it now. Don't worry, I wasn't going to give you the Transcend treatment. Your reads were bad but they were still reads, not... that.

That still doesn't mean I'm townreading you though.

To anyone who's wondering, I think the apology was directed to me as a person and not as a player. I would explain why but that would break the rules. Just forget about it.

[Secret Agent Jin]

The apology was 100% because as a person, i apologize heavily and if i make a claim that i later feel was wrong, i feel bad about it.

[Klingoncelt]

I take it this isn't the first time someone has called your reads forced?

I never force reads. Anytime someone says I have a post that seems fake or forced, they're lying, regardless of my alignment.

I can't say too much at this point in time, but what I saw is becoming site meta.

Meta is super unreliable. Like for example, I've only been on the site for a month and I haven't finished a single game yet. I've literally no idea what the site meta is so how could I have taken part in it?

Wat?

I think you misunderstand.

The site meta is shifting. This may be due to new players coming from other sites and bringing those sites' influence with them. (All I can say at this point.)

Okay, the Mafia are 3 of those 4.

If there's a Serial Killer he/she might be outside that group.

Again, you can't be positive you've found 3 scum on page 1, based on the reasons you gave + "site meta". Assuming you're actually town, chances are you'll be tunneling the wrong people all game while the mafia rofl at you, or you'll have found some scum by pure luck like I feel you've done before.

Either way, I think your reads are total rubbish and I'll likely ignore any future read you happen to conjure in case your rock solid confidence wavers.

How nice for you.