Newbie 1768: Party Mafia - Game over!

[Revan]

V/LA until the 29th due to exams

[EccentricLemon]

At the start of day 2 I made it clear I wanted EL lynched.

I don't agree that you made it clear you wanted me lynched:

VOTE: EL

Also, when he thought I directed one of my earlier questions at him that was paranoia I think.

@EL: A little over-defensive but I'll consider it newbiness for now.

@AS: 2 weeks should be long enough to decide on a vote.

VOTE: Titus

I'm not even sure how I convinced myself to do that, lapse in concentration probably.

VOTE: AS for the reasons above.

VOTE: Titus Defeatism and over-reacting to my fked up vote.

At the start of day 2 I made it clear I wanted EL lynched.

This is an extremely quick progression. If you really wanted me lynched that bad, why'd you vote AS and then Titus again instead of going back to me?
This doesn't make sense at all. You go from voting me because I seem "paranoid", to having a "lapse in concentration" and voting Titus, to voting AS for not voting, to voting Titus again because she's acting defeated and overreacting, to finally "I made it clear I wanted EL lynched".
I'm having a VERY tough time believing you're town. If you're town, you need to get your crap together because disorder only helps scum.

EL posts as if he knows everyone in the thread is town.

How on earth do I post as if I know everyone is town? In post #740, I presented a scenario where GL was scum. I've been pretty consistently distrusting of tojam. Like I said before, just because my strongest scumread is you, doesn't mean I townread everyone else.

[Sobolev Space]

@Titus - I've looked through EL's ISO and I'm not sure if I agree. Can you give me a couple of quotes supporting this?

[SirCakez]

Votecount 2.5

Titus (3) - GuiltyLion, EccentricLemon, tojam2
GuiltyLion (2) - Sobolev Space, Titus
Revan (1) - Agent Sparkles

Not voting (1) - Revan

With 7 alive, it takes 4 votes to lynch someone.

Revan is V/LA until January 29.

(expired on 2017-02-01 15:04:00) remain until day end

[GuiltyLion]

GL, I would still like to hear your response on Titus' post.

what, the one where she just quoted my ISO where none of the posts had any kind of shade at nancy without any kind of explanation whatsoever? The one where she called my hammer "opportunistic" despite the fact there was no time left in the day? Frankly I don't even know how to respond to it, I assumed her lack of apparent thought or effort would speak for itself. Titus can't show where I "shaded" nancy, because it never happened and she got caught in a lie.

[GuiltyLion]

case on GL is based on forced interactions with Titus especially today and some overall behavior I can go more in depth on if requested from yesterday.

how are my interactions "forced"? What does that mean?

@GL - would you be fine with a Revan lynch today?

not really. I don't see any reason not to lynch Titus.

[GuiltyLion]

like, take your time and create discussion if you want, but I'm not interested in moving my vote at all. Titus is scum.

[Sobolev Space]

@GL - that was just my gut impression of your posts from reading through the game. Just looked through your ISO and I would say specifically 1. misrepresenting Titus's argument by repeatedly claiming it's only based on post 82 and in general (ex. post 661), 2. overreacting like in post 722.

Requesting a response to Lemon's question to you.

[GuiltyLion]

1. misrepresenting Titus's argument by repeatedly claiming it's only based on post 82 and in general (ex. post 661), 2. overreacting like in post 722.

1. Sorry, am I misrepresenting it? Can you show me what other arguments she has made?

2. I'm not overreacting at all. Titus scumtold. She completely lied about the narrative of events that happened in this game, and I have

never

seen that come from town. It's infuriating that anyone is letting it slide. She's accusing me of things that never happened and refusing to acknowledge her mistake - town do not do that.

I missed the Lemon question though, will respond

[GuiltyLion]

Why exactly are you so focused on not getting me lynched? At times, it definitely seems like you know more than what's been given to you. Defending me would be quite an advantage for you assuming you are scum and I am town:
1. It would give you towncred to back a town.
2. It would clear allegations that you are scum because since everyone's been mostly looking at you in the context of my scumpartner. If I flip green, that's to your advantage.
I'm not 100% convinced that you're scum, but it seems logical to me that you definitely could be.
So I'm asking you to convince me that you have a reason for defending me that isn't scummy.

I don't really agree I'm "so focused" on not getting you lynched. I pushed you early cause I thought you sounded scummy, then your responses to me felt genuine and transparent so I dropped it.

Titus is the one pushing this narrative of "GL derailed the Lemon wagon!". Which, again, I already covered simply did not happen. You were probably going to get lynched D1 if it weren't for Jae yanking the wagon over to nancy.

I don't think I did anything other than say that I townread you and looked elsewhere. I generally try not to push what look like mislynches, it's against my wincon.

[GuiltyLion]

also, I'd like everyone to look at these two posts again:

Also, in 503, Titus comments on "how easy it is to derail EL". But she's also suggested multiple times that I am scum with EL. I didn't lead the change to Nancy, nor was I wagoning EL prior. So it doesn't make sense that she would suggest scum!motivation to Jae/Revan, who were the primary reasons the wagon switched over yesterday. She's not thinking through her reads organically, she's sticking to a narrative and pretending to scumhunt.

I am at EL/GL GL/Revan or EL/Revan,

yet GL is correct that town essentially became unhinged at EoD yesterday

.

here, Titus is even

acknowledging

that I am right, that the EL wagon was "derailed" by Jae and Revan. She straight up admitted as such. But has she changed her reads or sought to investigate this? No, she hasn't, and when she was pressed she defaulted

back

to a lie about how I was the one who "shaded nancy".

[Sobolev Space]

1. Lots of arguments on EL (being too confident in people being town etc.) combined with your seeming buddying with EL seems semi-convincing. Your answer to EL's last question was decent however and I may have to rethink this.

2. Debatable. Either way I feel town would respond by further questioning Titus, not a giant post containing not very good arguments to the contrary.

@Revan - you seemed to be interested in a GL lynch yesterday, what are your feelings on the wagon today? What about the Titus wagon?

[GuiltyLion]

2. Debatable. Either way I feel town would respond by further questioning Titus, not a giant post containing not very good arguments to the contrary.

I'm sorry, "not very good"? What part of it do you not understand?

1. Titus accuses me of "shading nancy" as the reason the wagon moved from EL -> nancy at the end of D1.
2. I point out two things: a) I never "shaded nancy" and b) the wagon derailed explicitly due to a plausible scumslip

Do you disagree with #2, or find #1 to be an accurate description of events? What part of this am I missing here? I don't see how this argument isn't anything but crystal clear.

[Sobolev Space]

Reread the posts in question. I was interpreting Titus's argument as "GL shaded nancy earlier in the day setting up for an opportunistic hammer at the end" because of stuff like 725 which makes your argument look weak since you were only talking about stuff after the "scumslip". Now I see what you're saying.

Most opportunistic vote on that wagon was clearly Revan IMO.

[Sobolev Space]

GL - what is your opinion on the case on Revan?

[Titus]

also, I'd like everyone to look at these two posts again:

Also, in 503, Titus comments on "how easy it is to derail EL". But she's also suggested multiple times that I am scum with EL. I didn't lead the change to Nancy, nor was I wagoning EL prior. So it doesn't make sense that she would suggest scum!motivation to Jae/Revan, who were the primary reasons the wagon switched over yesterday. She's not thinking through her reads organically, she's sticking to a narrative and pretending to scumhunt.

I am at EL/GL GL/Revan or EL/Revan,

yet GL is correct that town essentially became unhinged at EoD yesterday

.

here, Titus is even

acknowledging

that I am right, that the EL wagon was "derailed" by Jae and Revan. She straight up admitted as such. But has she changed her reads or sought to investigate this? No, she hasn't, and when she was pressed she defaulted

back

to a lie about how I was the one who "shaded nancy".

You tricked them. You tricked Nancy into believing she slipped when she hadn't. That lynch was terrible.

Yet, you try and make yourself blameless when you were the scum cause to save EL and lynch the one person who refuses to mislynch town.

[tojam2]

At the start of day 2 I made it clear I wanted EL lynched.

I don't agree that you made it clear you wanted me lynched:

VOTE: EL

Also, when he thought I directed one of my earlier questions at him that was paranoia I think.

@EL: A little over-defensive but I'll consider it newbiness for now.

@AS: 2 weeks should be long enough to decide on a vote.

VOTE: Titus

I'm not even sure how I convinced myself to do that, lapse in concentration probably.

VOTE: AS for the reasons above.

VOTE: Titus Defeatism and over-reacting to my fked up vote.

At the start of day 2 I made it clear I wanted EL lynched.

This is an extremely quick progression. If you really wanted me lynched that bad, why'd you vote AS and then Titus again instead of going back to me?
This doesn't make sense at all. You go from voting me because I seem "paranoid", to having a "lapse in concentration" and voting Titus, to voting AS for not voting, to voting Titus again because she's acting defeated and overreacting, to finally "I made it clear I wanted EL lynched".
I'm having a VERY tough time believing you're town. If you're town, you need to get your crap together because disorder only helps scum.

EL posts as if he knows everyone in the thread is town.

How on earth do I post as if I know everyone is town? In post #740, I presented a scenario where GL was scum. I've been pretty consistently distrusting of tojam. Like I said before, just because my strongest scumread is you, doesn't mean I townread everyone else.

Time between those 2 quotes was 3 days, don't misrep that.

[tojam2]

Ah fk, mod, can you remove one of those please.

[GuiltyLion]

You tricked them. You tricked Nancy into believing she slipped when she hadn't. That lynch was terrible.

Show us the post where I "tricked" Jae/Revan/bowdown, which caused them to move their votes. Show. us. the. post. Quote it, directly from my ISO, and show where I cast the "shade", where I "tricked" these players.

I'll be waiting. Again, I NEVER POSTED during the time when the wagon completely flipped. I posted when Nancy was at L-0, and then came back to her at L-1.

[GuiltyLion]

Or tracker?

Slip in Nancy's 429? Not running her up today but need to make sure we talk about this tomorrow.

Yup. Would vastly prefer to lynch her off that alone. It shows knowledge of there being a roleblocker in the setup. The only people who would know for sure the setup are scum and the jailkeeper, and scum would be more likely to be fixated on jailkeeper to the point where they forget main thread knowledge isn't in line with that. The jailkeeper would be doing everything in their power to not slip knowledge of the setup because scum could find them and nightkill them in that situation.

Had another look and I can't remember why I had early in my notes a nancy/Agent team but it might not be Agent as her partner. I wasn't looking at her pairings as closely all game because I was townreading her.

I mean, this is a case that's strongest if we get a jailkeeper flip and rendered completely moot with a tracker flip so idunno for sure yet, but I'm pretty sure I just witnessed an actual slip, which is usually really rare and things people push on as slips generally comes to semantics but I don't think that's what this was.

3 more votes on nancy, please.

@Titus, GuiltyLion, tojam2, EccentricLemon, bowdown

EL especially, you should vote nancy to put her at L-2 and make her into a proper counter to you if you're town.

@GL vote nancy please when you get back.

like, the only plausible explanation I can possibly come up with for this massive lie is if you thought these posts came from me instead JaeReed, or something.

[Sobolev Space]

GL - what is your opinion on the case on Revan?

@Sparkles - would like your opinion on the Titus case as well.

[EccentricLemon]

I think GL's frustration is pretty genuine and I don't think I'd see something like that from scum. I'm still not 100% convinced because I've never played with GL before and I don't know how good he is at appearing town.
I'm keeping my vote on Titus because of how accusing her posts are. She doesn't support her arguments and frankly, resorts to insults. That's the complete opposite of what I expect from a townie because it's chaotic, which benefits the scum. I also went and reread the nancy lynching and I definitely wouldn't say GL was leading the push. I think it was more bowdown and Jae.

V/LA until Saturday

[SirCakez]

Votecount 2.6 (unchanged)

Titus (3) - GuiltyLion, EccentricLemon, tojam2
GuiltyLion (2) - Sobolev Space, Titus
Revan (1) - Agent Sparkles

Not voting (1) - Revan

With 7 alive, it takes 4 votes to lynch someone.

Revan is V/LA until January 29.
EccentricLemon is V/LA until January 28.

(expired on 2017-02-01 15:04:00) remain until day end

[Agent Sparkles]

Sobolev, I'm in favor of lynching Titus today, but I'm not going to vote her while she's at L-1.

As for GL's heated reactions, I would consider that a scumtell in most circumstances, but it's understandable for someone who's being accused of things he never said or did, especially now that Titus is just continuing to throw out baseless arguments.

[tojam2]

@AS, I'm fine with you hammering, game's going stale so we might not get any closer to finding a partner today.