Team Mafia 2018: White Flag — Day Six

[Gamma Emerald]

Don't like how fast the Marquis wagon got going, especially when not everyone has even checked in yet (as far as I am aware).

I personally don't see anything wrong with it. Are there any votes you specifically have a problem with?

[Llamarble]

LINE OF DEMARCATION
Whoever said that one guy was bussing that other guy is probably town. Wait no nevermind, I found that post and it's pretty lame.

Reads:
Llamarble somewhat misguided town, his scumread on Postie is p silly, but I feel like he's right on the money with Marqius, could also be right about Dunnstral's vote on Marquis being a bus
VOTE: Marquis

How am I misguided town if I'm voting scum day 1 of day 1 when only 20% of players are scum? And I also maybe found a buddy? Wouldn't that make me... pretty awesome?

[Tchill13]

is there anything i NEED to directly comment on?

[Tchill13]

Put it this way:
If you believe Llamarble hasn't found anything and is fishing for reactions, it makes sense to help him out by voting me or pretending you know what it is or even just staying quiet and letting things play out.
If you believe Llamarable really believes they've found something obvscummy, the logical thing to do is to ask what it is, in case it actually is something that makes sense.
You did neither or these things and instead instantly assumed he couldn't have found anything and attacked him for it. In what world does that make sense? In one where you know he can't have a good reason, because you know I'm town.

doubt llamarble actully found anything that soon.

it makes sense to attack him because you could believe he's scum trying to build a wagon off false hypothetical evidence.

[Tchill13]

And yeah, I think scum might have their eyes on the start time a bit more particularly since we didn't have to confirm roles.

I feel like this is more a product of you not understanding current MS playerbase. Which holds for the spam comment I didn't quote.

You're still laying it on and contributing to a much stronger null-because-i-want-it-to-be-null-read now.

i think this is more of a product of llamarble pushing a biased agenda. Ethier way he either genuinely believes Marquis is scum at this point or llamarble is scum.

[Tchill13]

Alright, I'm caught up. I'm not particulary town-reading anyone right now, though I could see Llama and N potentially being it. Want to see their reactions first.

Not all too thrilled by Marquis posts as off yet, though he could well be town yet to get properly into the game. I'm not sure, but I'm going to place my vote there for now until I get more content from him. May move if Llama or N don't explain themselves somewhat better.

VOTE: Marquis

wgeurts what exactly is wrong with the marquis posts? just feels awkward right? where's the long term scum motivation in that?

[Tchill13]

OK, I am caught up, feel free to fire questions at me.

Is this a scumclaim. What make you so special that anyone needs to ask you instead of the other way around --maybe it's your catch-up posts, let's investigate-- are you scum?

sauce has a "i want the spotlight on me" feel.

[Tchill13]

LQ that's a good assessment, if that gets more votes I'll vote it but I'm sticking with Marqius for now

very interesting to look back at if marquis or Sauce ever flip.

[Tchill13]

LQ is it weird that I responded to a thought you had and then you stated you were caught up and that you were open for questions but completely ignored that like the LAST POST had been a thought directed at you?

Or is it just me that I think that's weird.

Asking for four friends.

points to TSQ for comedy and the fact it's a bit weird.

[Gamma Emerald]

LINE OF DEMARCATION
Whoever said that one guy was bussing that other guy is probably town. Wait no nevermind, I found that post and it's pretty lame.

Reads:
Llamarble somewhat misguided town, his scumread on Postie is p silly, but I feel like he's right on the money with Marqius, could also be right about Dunnstral's vote on Marquis being a bus
VOTE: Marquis

How am I misguided town if I'm voting scum day 1 of day 1 when only 20% of players are scum? And I also maybe found a buddy? Wouldn't that make me... pretty awesome?

somewhat misguided, it's about your Postie read, I feel you're reading way too deep into Postie's remarks.

Also WTF Tchill you shouldn't be asking what you should comment on, you should just read and if anyone asks do what they ask

[Tchill13]

llamarble is quite the confident player. Already isssued a warning about being NK'd if he's sorted. Not a fan of players talking about they'll get NK'd this early in the game.

Marquis just seems a bit awkward but nothing super scummy from him imo.

If i had to guess 1 scum on the marquis wagon rn it's Postie. 110 percent gut read.

[EddieFenix]

Would also like to know whose teammates are reading this game and whose are likely to give input d1

Also bumping this

Given WHO she is and how she's playing with my team, I'm just gonna point to this and hope she gets a good laugh out of it when she finally sees it.

I wonder if we win by lynching EddieFenix and Marquis and Postie. Wouldn't be surprised.

"Two out of three is all you need, and you should have it, so just lynch Marquis and Postie and we win" - Mastina.

Sorting me is pointless, either I'll get nightkilled immediately or we'll win. Well, both is probably the most likely outcome.
(Or I'm scum and you can autolynch me a day before lylo)
Marquis is making a grand spectacle of trying to get help from his teammates.
EddieFenix totally picked the scum role PM
You're accomodating and full-breakdowny

-point to my team leader- He know's me, he knows my IRL situation right now, and we're playing to win. Slapping me with a scum role when the last 3 games I rolled scum in were subpar at best ain't the best thing for me to have right now. I was forced town and will gladly take the time to hunt. It's also why I changed my avatar from Miles Edgeworth to Rexxar (hunter reference, heh heh heh). So keep that in mind as we go forward. Mastin already also has town vibes from you and I am inclined to agree.

-cracks knuckles- So here's where

I

sit. I really don't like the fact that Lycanfire just walks in, drops a vote and then walks out without so much as a "hi, bye, I'm caught up," nothing. So you can insert the grandpa from the Simpsons entering and exiting the building gif here and I'll need some clarification on that vote at some point, Lycan. Marquis is going in my null section for now. I'll do a double over later tonight and get with my team on things for business going forward. ActionDan has town vibes. Marble is on my town list for now.

[Tchill13]

Don't like how fast the Marquis wagon got going, especially when not everyone has even checked in yet (as far as I am aware).

i don't think early wagons are bad. Get better reads late game from vote placement.

[northsidegal]

he forces a read to a) pretend like he's generating useful content and b) stagnate things by ending rvs early. moreover, i think in general a forced entrance like that is just more likely to come from self-conscious scum than from town. that's not to say that i believe that he's necessarily scum or that any of those were necessarily his strategy – just that i think it's likely enough to warrant moving my vote while we're still in rvs.

Alright, I'm not convinced this is a scum post as you are still relatively new to the site and thus, the game. Care to talk some things through with me?

Why would Llama want to attract so much attention so early on as you've mentioned? As scum it could be a really bad play in an attempt to draw suspicion on Postie, Llamarble knows whoever he'd have to play this perfectly as to not risk it backfiring. A very dodgy move as scum unless he's intentionally trying to have people think he can't be scum for that exact reason. As town, it could be an attempt to get this moving and test reactions, or he could legitmately have a reason to suspect Postie right now. For these reasons I don't particulary lean either way on thiese actions of his, though gun to head I'd say town.

like other people have said, llamarble is pretty experienced and apparently hard to lynch – i don't doubt that as scum he'd be willing to make a bold play / put himself out there. you also have to keep in mind that this entire conversation is within the context of

my rvs vote

– i was hardly making a case against him, and if i was i certainly wouldn't be using that reasoning.

This brings me to my next point.

How is generating content stagnating the game. The RVS is named that, because it's, well, random. Random votes don't generate alignment-indicative content, anything moving away from the RVS is something that is generating content from which we can try to guess people's alignments. I don't really think your second point holds up, do you see what I mean?

well, that's where we slightly disagree. the r in rvs stands for random, yes, but it's really much better played as a "low-information" voting stage, and that's how i like to look at it. yes, town will eventually need to move out of rvs to get the actual game going, but this process should come naturally. every time i've seen people try to instantly force things out of rvs (eg self-voting just to explain how it's nai or whatever), all it ends up with is a conversation that doesn't really end up going anywhere. to move the game out of the low-information voting stage you need actual information, which i didn't think llamarble actually had.

[Tchill13]

LINE OF DEMARCATION
Whoever said that one guy was bussing that other guy is probably town. Wait no nevermind, I found that post and it's pretty lame.

Reads:
Llamarble somewhat misguided town, his scumread on Postie is p silly, but I feel like he's right on the money with Marqius, could also be right about Dunnstral's vote on Marquis being a bus
VOTE: Marquis

How am I misguided town if I'm voting scum day 1 of day 1 when only 20% of players are scum? And I also maybe found a buddy? Wouldn't that make me... pretty awesome?

somewhat misguided, it's about your Postie read, I feel you're reading way too deep into Postie's remarks.

Also WTF Tchill you shouldn't be asking what you should comment on, you should just read and if anyone asks do what they ask

appreciate the insight.

[Tchill13]

VOTE: postie

im caught up.

[northsidegal]

the same thing i said to wgeurts largely applies @tsq with regards to rvs.

@lla – if i was scum i definitely would have lurked out the beginning of the game – activity is probably, for the most part, meaningless (so is everything else you mentioned).

Wifom self meta ahoyhoy.

So, VOTE: Northsidegal

wasn't really meant to be self-meta, was more meant of an example of what i think scum would have done and how i don't think llamarble's tells really mean anything.

[Thestatusquo]

a) your points to wgeurts were in no way responsive to my argument.

b) isn't "what I think scum would have done as a defense for why those saying that me doing the opposite is scummy" like LITERALLY the definition of wifomy self meta?

[northsidegal]

Reads:
Llamarble somewhat misguided town, his scumread on Postie is p silly, but I feel like he's right on the money with Marqius, could also be right about Dunnstral's vote on Marquis being a bus
VOTE: Marquis

what would indicate to you that he could be right about dunnstral bussing marquis? do you have a read on dunnstral from his one post / did something about it look like bussing to you? i'm not convinced you actually have anything here.

This shows your bias towards how you generally see these players in relation to what alignment they could be and nothing more. That said, you are all over the place and I can see where this would come from Scum trying to WIFOM Town into oblivion.

you realize that the entire middle block of what you quoted was just the playerlist as it appears in-order, right?

So are these TRs or SRs of these players?

i haven't played with postie before and haven't really read any of the games she's been in in-depth, so i don't really have anything to compare her play this game to – with that being said, i think her forced line of questioning is more likely to come from scum than town, so she's a scumlean for now. marquis i think is more likely to be town as of now, although i'd like to wait a bit to see how things develop before elaborating on that.

[ActionDan]

Pretty confident on Eddie Fenix and lq being town

[northsidegal]

-cracks knuckles- So here's where I sit. I really don't like the fact that Lycanfire just walks in, drops a vote and then walks out without so much as a "hi, bye, I'm caught up," nothing. So you can insert the grandpa from the Simpsons entering and exiting the building gif here and I'll need some clarification on that vote at some point, Lycan. Marquis is going in my null section for now. I'll do a double over later tonight and get with my team on things for business going forward. ActionDan has town vibes. Marble is on my town list for now.

dunnstral did the exact same thing – did you not notice or is there something different about the two to you?

a) your points to wgeurts were in no way responsive to my argument.

b) isn't "what I think scum would have done as a defense for why those saying that me doing the opposite is scummy" like LITERALLY the definition of wifomy self meta?

a) i disagree in that it's best to exit rvs as quickly as possible – if done unnaturally i think it could very likely lead to a stagnant game, as i said. it seemed to me like you were both making the point in that rvs should be exited as quickly as possible.

b) it wasn't a defense of

myself

– it was actually a defense of postie. llamarble wasn't pushing me as being scum for being in the thread early (to my memory), he was saying that postie's comments about being early to the thread were likely to make her scum. it really wasn't meant to be about me at all.

[Tchill13]

Pretty confident on Eddie Fenix and lq being town

other than the fact he made a big post what is it about Eddie?

[ActionDan]

I won't lie I came into this game thinking there was a 99.9% chance Eddie took a town role pm. I don't care much about his post but I think his reads are decent. That's enough

[Tchill13]

oh my...

i hope "most" reads are based on in game content versus "team mafia theories"

or this is gonna be a long game.

[Llamarble]

I mean, I died N1 last team mafia whiteflag; the other major candidate for N1 death (Regfan) was scum.
With no powerroles in this game, somebody in some scum's team topic is going to have said "dude, you need to kill llamarble night 1"

I continue to feel good about this wagon.

You're still laying it on and contributing to a much stronger null-because-i-want-it-to-be-null-read now.

I suppose this is the Marquis thing I'm currently most curious about. Want to explain to me where this desire comes from?

I like Eddie and Gamma for town now, with ActionDan getting a couple townpoints too
I don't know how good at scum Postie is. She has mostly towntells at this point, but when I try to meta her I keep reading GD threads.