Open 654 | Surrealism - Game over

[Ümläüt]

hold the fuck up

Since I'm more free and more inclined to post here now I'll get into that

For the record I don't like this wagon right now and if anything want Dunnstral to post his reads. It's not that he's a scum impossibility to me, but that the lynch Gamma crowd has suddenly had a convenient revelation that would prompt the wagon switch at the same time and no one is addressing that. Oh, oh, because there's no opposition to the lynch it's so opportunistic and suddenly all of you want to switch?

w o w

, how convenient!

Does no one care? Or are you not caring on purpose? Quite fucking obviously there are strings being pulled.

That is the main factor. The other one is I don't actually have a game with Scum Dunnstral, well technically, but I'm very certain he plays very similar as both alignments. This is key. And there's lynches I'd much rather prefer.

Gamma

himself

hopped on his fucking counterwagon with no shame.

I don't know why people are giving me shit about still wanting to lynch my probably top scumread. Like he should have stopped being scum to me or something. Get the fuck out of here. Sorry guys, I don't fucking make up SRs when convenient to me. I felt strongly about Mimikyu when I voted him. I still feel strongly about it now. If you don't care then say so.

I'm not eyeing you for being opportunistic, I'm eyeing you because I have trouble crediting your misgivings about Aubrey's post as genuine.

Yeah Umlaut, we should just have the same opinions and feel the same way at the same time all the time so everything can be fine? Of what I post, what is the deductive method that allows you to determine what is genuine or not?

I'm actually starting to dislike Zach in #590. He's blamed Dunn for tunnelling him but all he does at this point is talk about Dunn and use it as an excuse not to talk about other stuff. But then he follows with a pretty good point on BTD in #593 so I don't know.

What you're not familiar with is that the norm for myself and Funnstral is to argue for a fuckton of pages and have people bitch at us. I tried to detract from that this game but eventually gave in to the relentless stream of shit. It's my fragile human soul. I can only take so much.

Of the people on Gamma's wagon, if I had to name someone suspicious, it's Jester based on that catch-up, but I'll wait for him to finish it to say what I have to say. The whole Aubrey situation is fucking bizarre because when I state an opinion based on my perception and not even attack or push, I'm in the wrong.


It might be that Fix-it Felix avatar that has my emotions going haywire, but I don't see the fuss about S_S. It looks like he's been shooting straight to me from here.

Yakko's been getting a free pass for not doing shit simply because "I'm scum", which is just dandy, isn't it?. I'm not too fond of when people say I'm scum and don't present their bullshit argument so I can go into precisely how bullshit it is. Please provide me with that common courtesy. Are you gonna say it's a gut read, bud? It doesn't make it any less obvious to anyone if you don't.

If you guys are fine with that I'm not gonna say shit because it's a testament to the amount of fuckery people condone this game. I'd definitely lynch there, though as opposed to these fucking options. BTD does not, to me, give the appearance of that scum who's under pressure. I think in his situation, scum that was trying to slide by would opt to acquiesce and attempt to post heavy content rather than still not doing that and still saying they'll be inactive. That's not someone who's deceiving us IMO.


Vax himself I need to get accustomed to his posts. However MeowMix was a very strong TR of mine and I liked his posts a lot.

What does this mean for your read on me?

This is something really special.

VOTE: Gamma Emerald

[Ümläüt]

Bad news: I am unable to use the computer my reads list is on right now, so it will have to wait. Sorry for the inconvenience.
@Vax: I'm pretty much the lynch du jour at this point.

Not only were you no longer the leading wagon (and Creature had just posted a vote count making this obvious), no one was even talking about you u til you jumped in to get hyperdefensive over one throwaway line of a post that wasn't really about you.

[Aubrey]

I'm just saying I didn't "jump on my own counterwagon".

^

I'd like to hear some opinions on this, because I've been agonizing over it. Gamma had three votes on him, and was under some fire before he voted Dunn alongside me. At first glance, one could say this is him trying to get attention off of himself by sheeping a vote that had some backing to it, but on the flip side, Gamma does enter the "bandwagon" with a observation/point of his own. Technically he is right when he says he didn't just

jump

onto his opposing bandwagon.

--

What I don't like is that he just tried to insinuate that he was the main pusher of Dunn. Was this just a bad communication error though?

I don't like when he dropped Dunn for Umlaut, the reasoning for it, and had to reconsider a vote that he was on initially after I went deeper into his own observation and brought it up to him directly. Is this just a newer player who has also overbooked himself in to many games? (Yes gamma, I know your playing more than this game. What are you in, like 3-4?)

I also don't like that multiple times, people have told him/reminded him that he needs to stop parroting, yet he would continue to do it at times. Most notably in posts 525 & 526. There have been a few other small things that have happened that made me crinkle my eyebrows as well such as forgetfulness (thought i'm guilty of that too) and a few outlandish posts.

--

Overall I can't make heads or tails out of him, and that is a major concern to me.

Bad news: I am unable to use the computer my reads list is on right now, so it will have to wait. Sorry for the inconvenience.
@Vax: I'm pretty much the lynch du jour at this point.

Not only were you no longer the leading wagon (and Creature had just posted a vote count making this obvious), no one was even talking about you u til you jumped in to get hyperdefensive over one throwaway line of a post that wasn't really about you.

I can see either alignment attempting to correct something, no matter how small, if they feel like it misrepresents them.

[Gamma Emerald]

I said that thing because I didn't feel it had actually become a counterwagon at that point; everyone was pretty much off voting wherever or on me. I guess the problems came from me not specifying that.

[Ümläüt]

I said that thing because I didn't feel it had actually become a counterwagon at that point; everyone was pretty much off voting wherever or on me.

There were two votes on you and five on Dunn. That's not even a counterwagon, that's the wagon.

Thinking two votes on you puts you closer to a lynch than five on someone else puts them is the most fundamental of all scumtells.

[Ümläüt]

I can see either alignment attempting to correct something, no matter how small, if they feel like it misrepresents them.

Fair enough, but that was also the

only

thing he brought up from that post. Combined with basically asking Zach "But you still townread me, right, bro?" it seems his only concern with reading the game is to make sure he responds to anything that might look bad for him.

[Aristophanes]

Thinking two votes on you puts you closer to a lynch than five on someone else puts them is the most fundamental of all scumtells.

Uhh...no?

But it was odd.

[Zachstralkita]

@Dunn 868 I kinda feel the same but did you not diss me for still voting Mimikyu

[Creature]

Votecount 1.13

[0] BTD6_Maker
[1] Mimikyu - Zachstralkita
[0] Something_Smart
[0] Vaxkiller
[0] Aubrey

[5] Gamma Emerald - BTD6_Maker, Dunnstral, BlackStar, Aubrey, Ümläüt [L-2]

[0] hi im Yakko
[0] BlackStar
[1] Zachstralkita - hi im Yakko
[3] Dunnstral - The_Jester, Gamma Emerald, Something_Smart
[1] The_Jester - Vaxkiller
[1] Ümläüt - Mimikyu
[0] Aristophanes

[0] Nolynch

Not voting: Aristophanes

There are 13 players alive, 7 votes is the majority.

Deadline: (expired on 2016-09-27 13:00:00)

[Aristophanes]

Call me crazy, but
VOTE: Dunn

Not against a Gamma lynch, but I've stopped ignoring this slot and have a scumlean.

[The_Jester]

Ok I'm pretty sure Ari's scum. More thoughts in a few hours.

[Aubrey]

Quickly writing this up before work.

I can see either alignment attempting to correct something, no matter how small, if they feel like it misrepresents them.

Fair enough, but that was also the

only

thing he brought up from that post. Combined with basically asking Zach "But you still townread me, right, bro?" it seems his only concern with reading the game is to make sure he responds to anything that might look bad for him.

Even I was a bit weirded out when Zach mentioned Gamma in that one liner. If that is such an issue for Zach, why is he still a town lean for him? He's going to call out a scummy action, but keep him in a town lean?

Also if he thinks Dun has a scum possibility, why go into such a frenzy over the wagon? Furthermore he used Blackstar's reasoning for dropping the bandwagon on everybody. That was Blackstar's reasoning, not everybody else's.

I don't care if he still thinks Mimikyu is scum. Keep at it! The fact of the matter is Mimiyku isn't here, and its hard for me to validate a vote and lynch for them at this time.

I'm still confused on his issue with my reasoning for SS and Black being good town leans for me. I'm kinda tired of people trying to say "Oh its worded weird so its scummy" Like, really? That is like piss poor reasoning, especially when you don't pick at where you think it sounds weird.

He's basically tried to derail both bandwagons.

I think the Dunn bandwagon reeked based on how it formed

.

I don't think Gamma is scum either

, and I assume would rather us not lynch him based on what he posted immediately afterwards. Then highlights BTD again, but keeps his vote on Mimiyku.

One giant Ugh.

--

Fuck I'm about to run late. Dunn is a scum lean for me. Gamma is a huge ass "I don't know", nor do I think I'll ever know. The idea of shrugging off some of his questionable plays as newbie moves makes me sick. I hate putting faith in such things like that. Shame we can't lynch both.

[Ümläüt]

Does a Zach/Dunn scumteam ping for anyone?

It seems like a stretch based on surface activity, but it somehow makes sense to me. Dunn tunnels Zach because he always tunnels Zach, but doesn't seem interested in actually convincing anyone to follow along. Zach calls out Dunn because he always calls out Dunn, but doesn't seem to know where to place himself with regard to the wagon---says it's a bad wagon but won't say he's townreading or even null on its target. (Surely lynching scum is more valuable than forming wagons in the most virtuous manner?) Zach has been disdaining the Gamma wagon, but when the alternative is Dunn that pisses him off even more. This could be scum looking for a way to save his buddy after inadvertently closing off his two most viable means (pushing a townread on Dunn, or pushing a scumread on his counterwagon).

I'm more spitballing here than saying "this is what's going on," but I find it compelling enough that I'd like to bounce it off y'all.

[BlackStar]

Does a Zach/Dunn scumteam ping for anyone?

It seems like a stretch based on surface activity, but it somehow makes sense to me. Dunn tunnels Zach because he always tunnels Zach, but doesn't seem interested in actually convincing anyone to follow along. Zach calls out Dunn because he always calls out Dunn, but doesn't seem to know where to place himself with regard to the wagon---says it's a bad wagon but won't say he's townreading or even null on its target. (Surely lynching scum is more valuable than forming wagons in the most virtuous manner?) Zach has been disdaining the Gamma wagon, but when the alternative is Dunn that pisses him off even more. This could be scum looking for a way to save his buddy after inadvertently closing off his two most viable means (pushing a townread on Dunn, or pushing a scumread on his counterwagon).

I'm more spitballing here than saying "this is what's going on," but I find it compelling enough that I'd like to bounce it off y'all.

I guess its possible. I don't think zach is scum though. And its better to talk about stuff like this after we've already flipped someone who is scum

[Aubrey]

Eh, I find Zach's responses and annoyed tone regarding Dun genuine. I have my doubts of them being a scum team.

[Zachstralkita]

Does a Zach/Dunn scumteam ping for anyone?

It seems like a stretch based on surface activity, but it somehow makes sense to me. Dunn tunnels Zach because he always tunnels Zach, but doesn't seem interested in actually convincing anyone to follow along. Zach calls out Dunn because he always calls out Dunn, but doesn't seem to know where to place himself with regard to the wagon---says it's a bad wagon but won't say he's townreading or even null on its target. (Surely lynching scum is more valuable than forming wagons in the most virtuous manner?) Zach has been disdaining the Gamma wagon, but when the alternative is Dunn that pisses him off even more. This could be scum looking for a way to save his buddy after inadvertently closing off his two most viable means (pushing a townread on Dunn, or pushing a scumread on his counterwagon).

I'm more spitballing here than saying "this is what's going on," but I find it compelling enough that I'd like to bounce it off y'all.

I don't acquiesce to shitty wagons just because they're the only ones people support.

Even I was a bit weirded out when Zach mentioned Gamma in that one liner. If that is such an issue for Zach, why is he still a town lean for him? He's going to call out a scummy action, but keep him in a town lean?

Were you not here for the part where I never wanted to lynch Gamma?


I don't know if you guys think that just because you townread someone, they can't do scummy shit and you can't call them out for it.


Umlaut, why are you looking to me now? Where was this suspicion before?



For fuck's sake.

[Zachstralkita]

Seriously, the main wagon flopped back to Gamma at the exact same time by the exact same people after I say something?

I must be in the fucking Twilight Zone.

[BlackStar]

It was because of Gamma, not because of you

[Aubrey]

Were you not here for the part where I never wanted to lynch Gamma?


I don't know if you guys think that just because you townread someone, they can't do scummy shit and you can't call them out for it.

Exactly, which is why I'm not as bothered by Gamma asking you how you felt about him afterwards. This seems like a natural reaction for him to ask. Umlaut however differs. That is now two reasons Umlaut has voted for Gamma that doesn't exactly sit well with me. Umlaut has been fine for me most of the game, but those two reasons for the recent Gamma vote have me a little concerned.

It was because of Gamma, not because of you

preach.

[Gamma Emerald]

FYI: my list will probably be up late afternoon/evening today.

[The_Jester]

Ok this part of the catch-up will be brief cause at this rate I'm not gonna make it before DL.
I'll try to omit Ari cause I wanna make a separate case on him.

Spoiler:

p26:

Gamma/Ari posting fluff, Gamma sees that and tries to question Ari, although in a low-effort manner.
Aubrey calls out Dunn but his response makes sense.
Blackstar doesn't think Dunn or Ari are scummy at this point, SS shames Gamma.

p27:

Aubrey continues pushing Dunn and honestly they're both right in most aspects but seem to perceive things differently.
BTD states neither Ari nor Gamma look town.
Dunn wants to lynch BTD and I don't blame him but I think it's too early.
SS agrees with BTD and unvotes Meow after not really achieving anything (but btf the guy has been absent)
Dunn states Gamma's scummy and switches his vote to him. He also states Aubrey retracting from his push is scummy but I imo it was the reasonable thing to do.
Gamma with some pointless metagame talk.

p28:

SS and Ari join him.
Gamma tries to take initiative but it's pretty dire.
Yakko enters the game.
Aubrey changes his vote to Gamma (although he's not convinced), Ari follows with an opportunistic vote.
Blackstar/Gamma argue semantics. Meh.

p29:

Zach defends Gamma.
Yakko catches up but I'm not gonna repeat after him. I'll sort out this slot tomorrow. Although I found his statement of being ready to lynch SS on the sole basis of him not voting pretty dumb.
SS buddies him.
Ari does too and explains his scumread on Skold. I'll address that later.

p30:

Gamma jumps in and tries to put suspicion on Yakko on account of Skold doing some kind of a scumtell in another game. AND he says "I don't wanna suspect Yakko for this". Ugh.
BTD townreads Yakko after scumreading Skold previously.
Umlaut townreads Yakko too. He states he didn't suspect Skold and that's true.
Yakko explans why he thinks not using votes looks scummy to him and it pretty much explains his earlier assault on SS.

p31:

Blackstar jumps off the Gamma wagon again. If I didn't townread Blackstar, I'd read it as trying to derail the wagon by scumpartner.
Blackstar's reasoning in #757 reminds me why he's my strongest townread.
Ari and Aubrey dislike Blackstar's vote on SS.
Vaxkiller enters.
Blackstar explains he didn't like that SS parked his vote on Meow and didn't do anything about it. Fair enough.

p32:

Aubrey defends SS and both him and Blackstar have some good points.
Gamma with another portion of fluff.
Dunn makes a good point in #798.

p33:

Umlaut townreads SS.
Zach jumps on Aubrey but I don't think it's justified. Dunn instantly follows up with the vote. I wanna say I like it but at the same time it's weird he'd sheep Zach whom he's been scumreading.
Agree with Umlaut's #816.
Vaxkiller catches up and I can't say I agree with his vote on me but I may be biased.
Ari looks dead set on Gamma.
Vax doesn't find Gamma scummy but would like to see Dunn lynched cause he finds him what? Coasting?. That's pretty bullshit imo.
Zach still wants to lynch Mimikyu even though he sees it's NOT GONNA HAPPEN WITH THE DUDE BEING ABSENT. Sigh.

p34:

Vax seems to scumread me for lurking. Mkay.
Looks like Dunn heavily scumreads people who change their reads often and sheep popular wagons. I can see why. He switches back to Gamma.
Gamma brings up OMGUS like it's some kind of a magic word that invalidates Dunn's vote on him. I hate when people do that.
Umlaut calls Dunn opportunistic but votes him in an even more opportunistic manner. Eww.
SS deems counterwagons pointless but doesn't seem to have a solid reason to scumread Gamma or Dunn. This is very disappointing. That's not the SS I know.
Zach hardcore defends Dunn but I agree with him that this wagon's pretty shit.

p35:

Gamma tries to take the credit for Dunn's push which is absolutely ridiculous.
I have no idea what Dunn meant in #864. Help?
Dunn states town's performance is subpar but I'm not surprised, with 3 opposing factions.
Vax makes a good observation about Gamma being very self-conscious.

p36:

Umlaut votes Gamma again in an opportunistic manner.
Aubrey has trouble reading Gamma and I can see why.
Umlaut continues questioning Gamma based on Vax's observation which seems like faking being useful.
Ari votes Dunn which is a cherry on top of his game. An utterly ugly and disgusting cherry.
Umlaut comes up with his brilliant theory on Zach/Dunn scumteam which is just stupid at this point, as Blackstar pointed out.

Caught up.

UNVOTE:

I don't think Dunn's a viable lynch today and I don't like how people jumped on the wagon with little to none justification.
I could lynch Gamma but the lack of counterwagons bothers me.
I'm gonna ISO Ari and make a case on him and decide whether he's as scummy as it appears to me right now cause I think he may be a good counterwagon. Then I'll decide on my vote.

[Zachstralkita]

It was because of Gamma, not because of you

The logic that follows to me is that Gamma's moves are apparently so scummy that they warranted a wagon on him in the first place by you all.


it is not a new revelation when he continues to act in such fashion.

[BlackStar]

Nobody said it was a new revelation. I just didn't want to ignore it anymore so I decided that it was better to lynch him

[Dunnstral]

I have no idea what Dunn meant in #864. Help?

Everyone switched from Gamma to me over seemingly nothing; BTD6 is also ignoring everything

[Dunnstral]

Does a Zach/Dunn scumteam ping for anyone?

Why would I be pushing him if it's multiball anyway and the distancing doesn't matter

Also uh, I'm town too so