Newbie 1726 (Game Over)

[innocentvillager]

I honestly just think fox has given up at this point

[Zorblag]

*shurgs*

It's pretty similar to how she reacted to pressure on day one.

Though I guess a lynch on me at least provides content via interactions since I've actually at least somewhat interacted with the majority of active players :/

-Zorblag R`Lyeh

[Foxbird]

Actually, I started writing my case last night at like 2 AM and was asleep until recently. I started writing this late last night, then saved the draft before sleeping, and now I just had breakfast. I do admit that WoW may have distracted me for a bit and my health is acting up. Yadda yadda.

List of things that make me think inno is scum:

- no mentions of Jaack whatsoever between D1 and relatively shortly before the lynch
- the ecane vote gamble thing still looks scummy to me
- the townread on foe was forced and I don't see any useful town motive behind it (unless inno had been a cop softing a result)
- Jaack and inno were the only ones pushing for a NL yesterday
- whenever one of the no-kills went down, inno was the one reacting strongly about it

I think that's most of it.

[Nachomamma8]

Things that concern me about Jaack/Foxbird interaction:

1) Jaack tying Foxbird to his primary suspect twice with a bonus tying her to Rach

Spoiler: examples

Foxbirds initial interaction with caston looked kind of awkward. Also didn't particularly like his doubt casting on nacho before he's really done anything.

IV-Foxbird
Foxbird was concerned with IV's predecessor D1, but unvotes IV as soon as he enters. Most of Foxbird's commentary on IV on D2 was hesitant (416 iss a good example, with foxbird kind of talking her way into a town read) Same thing with 509, calling something inno did as weird without further commentary.

IV hasn't shown much interest in foxbird until today, kind of writing her off as townish. Now, as the two of them have been generally elevated to the two most likely lynch options, they've turned on each other.

Foxbird's vote on Gratuitous (230)
This is... not my favorite to say the least. While I think that gratuitous was a vote that made sense for her at that juncture, as her other two scumreads, me and delta/IV, had no other votes on them at the time, I'm not sure I like the justification she gives when she votes for him.

@foxbird - could you elaborate on why you found this post notably scummy?
This might be in your more recent stuff that I haven't bothered to tackle yet, so in that case I'll run into it when I do that.

In terms of partnering, I could see this vote coming from foxbird+anyone, but it makes most sense paired with Rach as a scumbuddy. Rach was the leading wagon prior to this point, and the only other wagon with multiple votes on it was on foxbird herself.

So, from my experience, I've found that scum players attempting to tie their partners to townies is a bit of a way to minimize risk (and is probably where the "vote townie, FoS partner" tell came from). The advantage of this play is that it allows you to push for a mislynch, means that you can vote your partner if your partner gets any heat (so your interactions still look good), but it also means that if you end up lynching your partner early, then you also get the advantage of having a pretty solid excuse to go after that townie you were trying to mislynch a bit more fervently (look at this Foxbird/Caston connection I found!). And the fact that it's happened three times with three different people is a bit of a smoking gun to me; once is happenstance, twice is coincidence, three times is enemy action type of thought, especially since Jaack hasn't put in a lot of concerted effort in actually getting Foxbird lynched.

2) Jaack's progression on Foxbird:

Spoiler: here it is!

Was hoping to get an answer from caston before offering my take on things but whatever.

Got early scumbuzzes from caston and foxbird. Caston's 17 felt like he was trying to appease me more than anything.

Foxbirds initial interaction with caston looked kind of awkward. Also didn't particularly like his doubt casting on nacho before he's really done anything.

UNVOTE:
VOTE: caston

I could go for an early wagon to kick start this game.

Re foxbird and caston: I felt an odd tone shift between posts 18 and 20. I liked foxbird's initial question in the first post, but the way she shifted suddenly from inquisitorial to friendly and agreeable felt awkward.

As for foxbird's minor push on you, I did not like the whole 'I don't like this but it's not indicitive of scum' tone. Seemed like foxbird was trying to give rach the answer she wanted to read.

I don't like Jaack's misrep of my doubtcasting on Nacho at all. He either didn't read what I said right, or he didn't want to. This discussion about Caston and me is just silly. And he's talking a lot about me - not delta, which is where his vote is. What's up with that? Only redeeming thing is that I don't like delta's posting, either.

1. I'm not voting delta, I'm voting caston.
2. I did not misrep you at all.

Let's look at the post I've taken issue with.

What do you think about the fact that Nacho popped in but did not lay down a vote not even an RVS one?

I don't like it at all, to be honest. Most ICs I've seen at least copypaste some sort of introduction in their first post, and the RVS vote should be a given, especially considering how slow the game was going. As far as I've seen Nacho also posted in another newbie game, but not here.

Nne of that is inherently indicative of scum, though, aside from maaaybe the lurking. We'll have to see how the situation develops.

That's a lot of shade to basically say 'his absence is not alignment indicative.' Town, I feel would just say something like 'it's annoying he's not here, but doesn't really mean anything'.

You're post reads to me like this - 'I can't really justify a scumread but I'm not opposed to you scumreading them' for it. It feels like you saw race was voting nacho and tried to push her in that direction without committing to a scumread.

My mistake on the first one, then.

I assume by race you mean RachMarie? She asked me a question, I answered. Her vote was RVS (so she wasn't scumreading him in the first place), not much to push there. How is it even a "push" on my part if her vote was already on him? The most I could have pushed would have been to rile the other players up into voting him, too. If I wanted to do that, I could have just elaborated on my reasoning without adding the last sentence.
And I'm not sure why you're expecting me to have a scumread on, what, page 2? I'm not committing on page 2.

My primary issue is that you threw shade at another player while giving yourself an out. It's okay to not be confident in reads on page 2. But I take issue with how you deliberately avoided committing to the scumread before anyone took issue.

That being said I think we're mostly talking past each other at this point. Your defense has been adequate enough for now and I don't see the point in beating a dead horse.

Kind of feeling delta was more mislynch bait as opposed to scum.

UNVOTE:
VOTE: foxbird

This is a fine vote for now.

@Jaack: Why are you voting with one of your scumleans?

1. I'm more confident in my scumread onyou than my one on zorblag.
2. I'd rather be on a wagon that's going somewhere than one that's stalling.
If I'm concerned with someone's presence on your wagon it would not be zorblag's but fiddler's, since at least zorblag has reasoning to back his vote up.

@gratuitous - What are your thoughts on foxbird?

reading through the game sigh 7 pages and almost nothing at this point. I am finding it hard to really peg down several of the players and that sucks

I will be watching Inno carefully to see if he shows himself as town

Just finished a game where fox was one head of a hydra that tried to get me lynched, so I am thinking I may be giving her too much leeway as a newbie which is a bad habit I have. The fake claim gambit she and her hydra partner did then them and their scum bud who was being rather town read (Kuribo) almost lynched me then lynched Jiffy before he got back to the game.

yeah

VOTE: fox

I don't know if I'm missing something here, but how does this make foxbird scum?

Still feeling gratuitous is town. Nacho's ketchup is also pretty townie.

I do have growing scumfeels with zorblag. With both foxbird and gratuitous he moved from a scumread to a townread just as pushes on them started to get traction. While I kind of understand his reasoning behind each shift, it feels kind of jumpy to me, which doesn't quite gel with the general tone of his posts. Going to reread his is to see if I'm missing something.

Pedit-and there's three more posts of content to read and reread.

Okay, time to review zorblag, starting with the first game relevant post. I've edited out some of the conversational stuff and bolded things I find noteworthy.

OK, let's get some thoughts out there and see what we can't do to get town moving.

• We'll want fiddlercrabontheroof's thougnts on the game soon so that we've got anything to work with for that player slot as alexs left us with nothing helpful.
  
  
• delta9 left us with a bit more, and I see what people didn't like about it. There's the initial vote (fine if dull,) posts that don't help the game state and then we've got the a sort of unclear post in 65 which vaguely connects to half the game in at least one way, but which doesn't seem to be something I'd expect Gratuitous to do much with in the post he was asking about (despite the answer given later.)
  I can see how it comes across as disengaged with what appears to be an attempt to throw something out there to be a part of the conversation rather than scum hunting.
  
  
  Having said that, the "I quit" as the followup under a bit of, not even pressure, but scrutiny perhaps, largely leads me to believe that our brand of mafia just wasn't the game for him. I'm inclined to call it a null tell.
  
  
• Given that last thought, here's what we get as reactions to this: almost nothing. Foxbird at least acknowledges that the "I quit" happened in his next post (2 days later,) but then applies a vote for pressure (as an aside, calling something a pressure vote is a good way for it not to have as much pressure in general,) after saying this could be scummy behavior or apathy thus putting a player who there's some reason to believe won't be there to defend them self at L-2.
  It's pretty easy to see potential scum motivation there.
  It would have been nice to see the others who were talking about delta9 say something about the abrupt termination of at least the train of thought if not his participation in the game as well.
  
  
• Nachomamma8's play has mostly been fine if lackluster. There are clear acknowledgments that his resources are being used outside this game and that he hasn't had the energy for it so I'll live with that for now, but I'm hoping we can get more engagement in the future.
  
  
• I sort of agree with ecane in Post 99. It's a bit of a simplification, but too much of Gratuitous's play feels like responding to questions without expanding much and not obviously looking into what others have done. It's not as clear cut as my initial reaction was when I went back and looked in isolation, but there's less clear concern about finding scum than in answering questions than I'd like. This isn't to say that you shouldn't answer questions as town, but town should always be looking at motives for the game going on around them.

I'm going to stop here for now before this gets too long, but I'll post more in just a bit. I haven't finished going over everyone in isolation yet, in paricular I need to look at Jaack and Rachmarie.

Zor's initial read on me:

Having asked that, I'm actually fine with Jaack's play for today. If he's town he's poking about like he should for the most part so we can default there for now. If he's scum then he'll be alive in the later game and we can bother with that later on (much like I said about Nachomamma8.) As long as he keeps doing things that make connections for the future he's not a good day 1 lynch.

Further summary of zor's reads

@Foxbird, I could see how that could be the case for delta9. The timing bothers me a bit (your post was 2 days after his, but with the activity state in the game in general being what it was at the time that's less useful than it might otherwise be.) I'm not saying I'm sure you're scum; I'm saying that I can see good scum motive for that action. I also tend to think that you're dancing around calling people scummy a bit (Nachomamma8 and delta9,) which I don't love, but will admit that I do as well. It could be playstyle but I don't have enough information to determine that yet.

I also think that scum could easily be lurking this game (in fact they almost certainly are in that I'd say that pretty much the entire player base can count as lurking.) I don't think that I'd call lurking to the point of being replaced (alexs and possible delta9, though that I'm reading as a more intentional quit at this point,) scummy lurking so much as disengaged lurking and not so alignment indicative.

The longer fiddlercrabontheroof goes without posts now the worse he looks though, so there might be something more there.

I try to follow the pronoun preference that people have listed, but if I was one of the people who called you he I apologize. The internet is a place where assumptions get made, sometimes despite our best attempts to avoid them.

@Everyone, at this point I'd put my reads as follows:

Scummy enough to be a lynch candidate today: Foxbird, Gratuitious, RachMarie
Lurkers we could lynch and I won't be too sad based on play till now: delta9, fiddlercrabontheroof

Not worth lynching today for at least one reason: Jaack*, Nachomamma8
Probably Town: ecane

*Jaack might be closer to probably town, I need to think about it a bit. It's not as strong a town read as ecane certainly, and as I'm saying it's not a lynch I'd be at all interested in pursuing at this point.

I don't have a hugely strong scum read on anyone at this point and the biggest thing I want to see in the next 3ish days in content from everyone.

And here's his follow up to the Rach-scumread

@Foxbird, Her scum hunting. Or rather the lack of it. She's got plenty of presence and I know that she's busy, but the biggest reads she's coming up with are based on lack of activity rather than what people have done. That doesn't offend any active players (which scum usually want to avoid doing,) and doesn't feel to me like town seriously trying to figure out the game state. She's given answers to the questions I've asked, but little else to push the game forward. There's also the same vague lack of commitment to calling things scummy that I'm mentioned a bit concerning you.

That's a lot of quote junk that I probably could have cleaned up better, but I think that gets all of zor's initial thoughts on each slot.

fiddler/alex: No read on fiddler because there is nothing to read, although he does hedge that statement in favor of a scumlean, bolded in 125
delta/IV: Not really a read on delta, also due to low content, but again hedges this with a scumlean, bolded in 110
foxbird: When talking about foxbird's vote on delta he says "It's easy to see potential scum motivation here" (also bolded in 110) which is about as weasel wordy as you can describe a scumread.
nacho: townreads
jaack: almost the exact same read as he gives for nacho, although I seem to be slightly more town
ecane: unexplained townread, although basically everyone seems to be townreading ecane
gratuitous: similarly to his read on foxbird, zorblag uses a lot of hedging language to scumread gratuitous
rach: I have no really issues with this scumread in isolation.

Now the only one of his reads which I felt was incorrect in that I really disagree with the end result was gratuitous-scum, but the constant hedging and weasel words are pretty scummy.

Now that we have that out of the way, let's go through the progression of zorblag's play since then.

At the end of his ketchup, zorblag is voting foxbird.
Having been momentarily appeased with his slot, I decide to join the foxbird wagon and vote in 129.

I'm going to note here that prior to this point in the game, I had been pretty much scumreading foxbird and the caston/zorblag slot about equally, but had been voting caston/zorblag for the reasons I described in 88, which is to say, because the wagon on caston was larger. I will get back to this.

After my vote, here is zorblag's next post.

I do have good news though. It's pretty easy to get my vote off you if you want to. Just convince me that you're trying to catch scum. Like I said, my reads aren't exceptionally strong at this point so rather than spending effort defending yourself I'd recommend spending the equivalent effort showing me who else is scum instead. That helps the town more anyhow.

This quote reads more to me like zorblag wants to stop scumreading foxbird and is looking for a reason. I'm assuming that based on his vote for her, foxbird was zorblag's number one scumread, but this doesn't read at all like he's trying to push fox.

The point I'm trying to get at with this zorblag/foxbird stuff, is it feels like zorblag was manipulating me to move my vote from him to foxbird by giving me a wagon I'd obviously had some interest in for a while. Once that was accomplished, he tried to manufacture a way off the wagon to let me drive it instead. If I successfully drive the lynch I wanted, then I take the fall when foxbird flips town. (this is assuming that foxbird and zorblag are not partners, which if they are, then I officially need to just roll with the reads I get from page one and ignore the rest of the game) If the wagon sputters, then I'm distracted for another day.

tl;dr version - I feel like zorblag's initial push on foxbird was to try and get me to vote foxbird as opposed to any real scumread.

That took longer than I expected to piece together, but I want to get it out there.
UNVOTE:
VOTE: zorblag

As for foxbird, most of my icky feelings from D1 remain, and I didn't particularly like the opportunistic swing onto Rach in her recent posts. (could be either scum leaping at a mislynch or scum panic-bussing)

Okay time to finish pairing analysis

Zorblag-Rach
Sooo much interaction here, to the point that I doubt scum would talk to and about each other as much as they have in thread, particularly in a game as relatively lurky as this.

That being said, despite zorblag's scumread on rach for much of D2, they did sort of cooperate on pushing IV. There's something. Furthermore, Zorblag has pushed me and Rach as a likely scumteam. That would put him in a position to lynch me and win or lynch Rach and have the spotlight on me D4.

VERDICT: Ehh, Occam's Razor leads me to assume that two scum wouldn't occupy the thread as much as this pair has. I don't think this is the scumteam.

Zorblag-Foxbird
I might be a bit biased because I kind of want this to be the scum team because these were my first two scumreads of the game, but there's something there. Specifically D1 stuff.

In general, a lot of the interactions between these two slots seemed fishy D1, both when caston was here and once zorblag replaced in. D2, zorblag puts foxbird into his vaguely townpile and doesn't concern himself too much, although this could be because foxbird wasn't really doing much D2.

Foxbird has seemingly settled on townreading zorblag due to effort. That's not exactly something worth commenting on other than to note it exists.

VERDICT: Yeah, its doable, but most of a case on this pair relies on D1 stuff.

IV-Rach
On the one hand this seems unlikely, mainly due to Rach's play today. I doubt rach would have been so willing to bus IV in mylo. (Both early, before anyone had expressed any inkling of direction; and now, when there doesn't seem to be an inevitable lynch.

Looking back at previous days, Rach made a pretty sudden flip in the midst of Day 2 from IV-town to IV-scum. Well its not that sudden as she expressed a desire to review her town read there earlier in the day, but it was reasonably sudden.

IV voted Rach right from his replacement in, and in general has been pretty focused on rach as a lynch choice until being seemingly convinced of her townieness at the end of D2 by nacho. It's noteworthy, because this flip essentially ensured the foe lynch. With rach being a less viable option and the people who were hestitating on the foe wagon (IV, zorblag) not offering other options, foe's lynch became inevitable.

VERDICT: I kind of want to write off this possibilty due to Rach's behavoir today, but there's enough stickiness in days 1 and 2 to make this feasable.

IV-Foxbird
Foxbird was concerned with IV's predecessor D1, but unvotes IV as soon as he enters. Most of Foxbird's commentary on IV on D2 was hesitant (416 iss a good example, with foxbird kind of talking her way into a town read) Same thing with 509, calling something inno did as weird without further commentary.

IV hasn't shown much interest in foxbird until today, kind of writing her off as townish. Now, as the two of them have been generally elevated to the two most likely lynch options, they've turned on each other.

VERDICT: This works pretty good. Maybe the best

FINAL VERDICT: I'm pretty sure it's IV/foxbird. IV/Rach and Fox/Zorblag are doable, but make less sense and are more based on possibilities than actual evidence.

IV's last gasp push for a no lynch is the final nail in the coffin for me.

VOTE: innocentvillager

The things in particular that stand out to me is first, how his initial Foxbird vote evolved; he started out with her as a top suspect, he gave her a ton of lip service while pushing Caston as a primary push. Then, Zorblag replaces in, he finds his initial posting to be decently town so backs off and pushes onto Foxbird at this point, citing that the "Foxbird wagon is going places" even though the only people who were voting her at that point were Alek and Zorblag (his strongest scumread at the time). He eventually lets himself be talked out of it pretty much instantly with his case on Zorblag, which is an interaction that seems suspicious coming from Jaack as scum moving from an easy mislynch to a considerably more difficult mislynch, but I can see it as him trying to justify a move off his partner, and the fact that Foxbird is always a suspect from that point on but is always in the background is a bit of a major flag for me; at the time, Foxbird wasn't a strong townread for anyone and probably would have been a pretty strong target for a mislynch, but Jaack never pursued her as a mislynch at all except for that one shining moment D1 where he pushed her and then dropped it later, his "one of IV and Zorblag have to be scum" and using that as a reason to pursue people who weren't Rach/Foxbird seems like something that he wouldn't do as scum unless he was partnered with one of those two.

From Foxbird's side, the thing that bothers me most is probably the take on Rach today and the lack of urgency not really matching up with the rhetoric calling for us to call IV while limp-wristedly still trying to get him lynched; if I were town in this position and about to lynch and reading Rach/IV the way she was and about to get mislynched and didn't really have the drive to fight it, I'm not sure I would take such a hardline stance on IV over Rach although I can see where Foxbird as scum would think that the near-death conviction looks good.

I'm pretty ready to vote; IV's ready, Zorblag seems to be ready, Rach is ready, and Foxbird seems ready.

Vote: Foxbird

[RachMarie]

that is a vote I can get behind


but want to give her a chance to have any final words same with anyone else


so INTENT TO HAMMER

[Foxbird]

I got my reads done, so you can hammer whenever.

[RachMarie]

VOTE: foxbird

[Zaicon]

Final Vote Count - Day 4

Foxbird (3):

innocentvillager, Nachomamma8, RachMarie

RachMarie (1):

Zorblag

No Vote (1):

Foxbird

Foxbird,

Mafia Goon

, has been lynched!

innocentvillager,

Vanilla Townie

, wins the game!
Nachomamma8,

Town 1-Shot Bulletproof

, wins the game!
RachMarie,

Vanilla Townie

, wins the game!
Zorblag,

Vanilla Townie

, wins the game!
Gratuitous,

foedufafa

, and ecane also win the game.

Night 1 Actions

ecane jails Nachomamma8.

Jaack roleblocks Zorblag.
Jaack kills Nachomamma8.

Night 2 Actions

ecane jails Zorblag.

Jaack roleblocks ecane.
Foxbird kills ecane.

Night 3 Actions

Foxbird kills Nachomamma8.

Mafia Thread
Dead Thread

[Foxbird]

Ahhh well.

GG.

[RachMarie]

YES YES YES YES YES YES

DOES A HAPPY DANCE

[RachMarie]

I want to apologize to everyone for my early lack of activity I ended up in probably way too many games plus a lot going on in RL which I am still sorting some things out, but it is much better now.

[Gratuitous]

Meh, yay town.

I was too far gone to do anything by then, but damn I called out Fox/Jack out in #235. Game was just too slow compared to my usual games

[RachMarie]

Sorry for lynching you grat it took me a while to catch on especially since everyone was lurking and I was so busy

[ecane]

GG
I made some mistakes, but it's a lesson learned.
Even though the game was slow and maybe unenjoyable for some, I had a good time playing my first game with you guys!

[RachMarie]

keep on playing ecane

[Jaack]

Congratulations to town for a well deserved win.

Seems I need to work on my lategame some...

[RachMarie]

you did pretty well just had the bad luck of nacho and troll both excellent players, and even then troll almost went for me instead of you.

[innocentvillager]

Hey, sorry I have a lot of thoughts about this game, but was happy that I finally realized that it was Jaack Fox team. Got weirdly sidetracked on Zorblag--almost everything was telling me he was obvtown but I was just kind of too paranoid to admit it in-thread until later.

@Zorb I'm sorry I frustrated you so much, I really just did just want to have a reunion with you and Rach so I wanted to engage with you as much as I could, still <3 you. And you too Rach!

I think the main thing that made me latch onto the Jaack/Fox team was just how like null/slightly protown you guys were and that awkward bus at the beginning, while ecane/Zorblag/Rach were just obvtowning it up most of the time (and Nacho to an extent as well).

Overall good game, and thanks to all the newbies for playing: I highly encourage you to play more games on this site! This is probably my last one for a while because of school and stuff, but I would play more if I have time.

[RachMarie]

school is important but keep in touch inno HUGS ♥

[Zorblag]

OK, some thoughts. Let me start by thanking Ziacon for modding and letting me replace in! Also thank you everyone for playing! I was grumpier than normal this game, but despite how it might have come off I did enjoy playing it and was happy everyone was in the game.

Good work to the rest of the town. Had you listened to me there it would have taken us one extra day. Given that we had the spare mislynch I wanted to eliminate RachMarie as a dark horse just because it would have been so irritating to lose to the game she was playing. I'm glad that I was wrong and that it was Foxbird.

@RachMarie, I'm really glad to hear that you're cutting back on games. I said earlier that I'd talk about this after the game, but this was what I was thinking. I looked at your list of posts and saw so many games you were involved in that there was no way you could be doing much to help town win this one (having Nachomamma8 here to sheep probably exacerbated that.) I think that the biggest favor that you can do yourself here is to be able to concentrate more on the games that you're playing. You clearly weren't here for much of this one and not keeping up with what has happening at times and I've looked back at the games you played before your break; you are a better player than this. I still think that you're a lovely person, but if you're playing mafia games to help your team your attention to the game is the biggest thing you can do to help out (it has the added benefit of probably helping improve other areas of your play by default.) Sorry if I was on your case too hard at any point.

@innocentvillager, sorry for being so brusque with you. It was frustrating to have someone attacking every little thing that I did for reasons that I wasn't impressed by, but I used to be able to put up with that better. When you didn't like the points I was making against you and reacted in what I recognize is your style having read some of your other games I hit a tipping point far sooner than I probably should have. I will say that mostly you're playing so much better than you used to. This game despite what I think were mistakes, you were pretty easy to read as town for good play by the end of the game; four years ago I probably would have had the same read, but I wouldn't have called said it was for good play. You've grown a lot and I'm thrilled to see you're still around and helping with the newbie games! We can talk about the aspects we disagree about sometime if you wish, but we don't have to.

@Nachomamma8, thanks for playing. I sort of feel like you might be a bit over committed as well (not to the same extent as RachMarie, but this game clearly wasn't a huge priority for you at all.) Having said that, the end of day two you played just right to cement yourself as a town read for anyone who didn't already have you there (too many did too early, but that's a rant for another post,) and your read on RachMarie was better than mine throughout. It was fun playing with you again!

@ecane, I don't have much to say here other than just good job. You were great as town and used the power role just fine. You bit unfortunately hard on innocentvillager's coy play with foedufafa, but it probably didn't matter at all. Reading the scum thread it's clear that Jaack was planning on killing you even before he noticed that. If you're town in general that play is what players should strive for; it doesn't draw attention away from hunting for scum (as opposed to say mine,) and it drew a night kill (which is a bit unfortunate because you were the jailkeeper, but still means that you were looking like town which is something town doesn't always do well.)

@Gratuitous, I'm sorry that the pace of the game threw you off as it pretty clearly did. The games that I read for you prior to this one felt much smoother and more engaged. I guess I'll recommend trying to aggressively turn the game over if it comes up again, but I'll also acknowledge that it's a frustrating thing to need to do. In any case, keep at it; you've got good fundamentals which should take you far.

@foedufafa, you replaced into an awkward spot and I liked the initial effort. In this case fading towards the end of day two combined with the relationship between Nachomamma8 and RachMarie left you in an unfortunate spot that neither innocentvillager (who had a town read,) nor I (who also had a weaker town read,) chose to help you out of in large part because of the lack of another viable lynch option and the end of day timing. My biggest advice will be to get in there and post more; playing the game is the best way to both enjoy it and get better at it.

For the scum team, I'll have a bit of criticism, but let me start by saying that a lot of your play was pretty solid. Others disagreed a bit, but I thought you managed the distancing day 1 well. You had me convinced that you were unlikely partner due to the right concentration of attention and the in and out of the suspicion and votes. I don't think that you gave away the game due to being partners.

@Jaack, I don't think that it was your end game that was the biggest problem for you. The end of day one looked a lot worse than it needed to, especially after you said that you thought Gratuitous was probably a power role. You would have been much better served there by showing up towards the end of the day and pushing against the Gratuitous lynch even if it ended up being pushing a RachMarie lynch. As it was you let a lynch of someone you supported as town happen while a feasible lynch on someone you were calling scummy go through. Given that both were town in this case you probably look better if you stick your neck out and be wrong rather than hang back and let the mislynch go through. I also think that towards the end of the game you had trouble making it look like you actually cared about RachMarie's game. Even saying that you changed your mind on her because of what Jaack was saying might have helped, but you needed to sell some stronger reasoning on her a bit more it feels to me.

Mind you, I was fooled into thinking that RachMarie was your partner, so even though I found enough things that I didn't like about your play to be suspicious I'm clearly doing things wrong from my end as well.

@Foxbird, I think you played a fine game, if not an inspired one. You did a great job of talking me out of my initial suspicions and then coasting through much of the game after the day one heat died down which is what scum should be doing. At the very end I think that perhaps you needed a little more flexibility in finding someone to lynch, but it's a fine line between being to set on one particular lynch and being too eager to get just anyone lynched. In the end the game state left too many of the town out of the lynch pool for you and somehow you needed to nudge one or two things around day 2 or 3 to prevent that.

Also, you should have killed me night 3 as the safer kill, but I'm saying that mostly because I didn't really want to play that last day.

And I'll say again, thank you everyone for the game! Sorry if I was overly grumpy; it's largely a by-product of being the primary caretaker for two young children who tap the reserves patience that I used to be able to use in these games. I am happy that I played and I hope you all enjoyed it as well.

-Zorblag R`Lyeh

[Zorblag]

@Nachomamma8, I didn't want it to get lost in that last post, but could you talk about why you claimed at the start of day 3? Were I scum I would have been so happy to have that claim so that if needed I could make a safe kill the following night. On the town side, unless it gets counter-claimed it's meaningless until a Jailkeeper gets lynched. I don't think you were using it to clear yourself, but what were you gaining for town in your opinion?

-Zorblag R`Lyeh

[RachMarie]

HUGS Troll no worries and it was not just the games either. RL was a royal B*** to me I was struggling and trying to start two full businesses in one step and it was killing me and costs me some good clients too,

My biz coach got a hold of me and has streamlined my business so now I am just doing enough ghostwriting to cover bills n such and working on my own business stuff, Getting ready to launch a 30 day challenge on Oct 3rd. Today I finish up the last finishing touches to set it up. Then my coach and I will be marketing it for the next couple of weeks up to start of challenge.

I have also had some emotional ups and downs with coming back to the site but overall it has been a good experience. And I will be moving to Buffalo, NY in about a year which will be a good move for me. Getting out of the South and into a place where I can find like minded people, and be who I AM instead of hiding most of myself for fear of the neighbors would be really good. It is also the final step to completely starting a brand new life and I am so looking forward to it.

In addition to the games on my main, I have also been playing a hydra (On The Prowl) with Jiffy and have one planned with Nacho in the future to help improve my play. You were completely correct to chastise me, and the fact that I was really having trouble getting solid reads on the scum team until late in game did not help. That was why I was sheeping Nacho so much,I knew when he was here, he saw more clearly than I did.

Please do keep in touch

[Mina]

Goodbye.