Open 856: Deputy cultists (Game over)
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Nathann He/TheyGoonHe/They
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Nathann He/TheyGoonHe/They
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Inclined to agree with Jacket that Enchant seems slightly Townie from their posting so far. Probably going to extend that feeling onto Jacket for the time being too.
Beat might be Town for 23. I disagree with the idea, but I think most Scum would be hesitant to recommend that strategy in their first post.
Let's try to VOTE: RH9.
Can I know what those reasons are?In post 25, Bellaphant wrote:I want to ask why to both of the above posts. Although tbf I am town reading cat for bad reasons.Once again today begins this farce we call a trial.-
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Nathann He/TheyGoonHe/They
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I can see the idea behind the Vengeful Townies claiming now, actually, but the Governor should definitely stay silent. They can always claim later if they get run up.In post 33, Enchant wrote:... Who even converts Vengeful which claim d1? They claim and basically never elimmed, as they are again... Not Cult Leader with quarantee.
Governor probably can be converted for power, but if we don't manage to hit CL for 3 days, we kinda deserved to suck up.
Also, Enchant is Town.Once again today begins this farce we call a trial.-
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Nathann He/TheyGoonHe/They
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Y-3*.In post 44, furtiveglance wrote:You got put at E-2 on page 1.
Is this supposed to be a serious read?Once again today begins this farce we call a trial.-
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Nathann He/TheyGoonHe/They
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It depends on how you try to rationalize that read, which was going to be my next question.In post 53, furtiveglance wrote:Which answer will you townread me for?Once again today begins this farce we call a trial.-
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Nathann He/TheyGoonHe/They
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Okay. Walk me through your thoughts on why three people voting Jacket on page 1 makes him likely not Cult Leader. (I know the answer might seem obvious, but bear with me.)In post 55, furtiveglance wrote:The short answer is yes it was a serious read, which makes more sense if you imagine it was a 9 player game (which I did).Once again today begins this farce we call a trial.-
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Nathann He/TheyGoonHe/They
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I don't think you're looking at this the right way, exactly - if it's three Townies, they just voted a person without knowing if they're Cult Leader or not. Do you think it's unlikely the three people that voted are all Town? (And this is ignoring the fact distancing would be extremely important in this setup, but y'know.)In post 59, furtiveglance wrote:I don't think Cultists would vote their Leader in RVS. So either 3 town happened to land on CL on page 1, or they aren't Cult Leader. It seems unlikely that the first scenario happened, but I suppose it is possible.
Both seem equally null to me. If iIn post 59, furtiveglance wrote:Now - I have a question for you.
What is more suspicious:
a) Beat putting Jacket on E-3 in 23
b) BBT putting Korina on E-3 in 43
c) None of the above, you're a cultist trying to distract me from......what were we talking about again?hadto pick a more suspicious post of the two, I'd go with BBT's, since they didn't offer any other thoughts, and Beat's comment along the vote is somewhat Townie.
Anything you're seeing in the Y-3 posts?Once again today begins this farce we call a trial.-
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Nathann He/TheyGoonHe/They
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I think Korina is a non-Leader Cultist. Their entrance into this game feels designed to get people angry and to vote them over it. It feels inflammatory for the sake of it. And since I feel like Korina is a better Scum player than that and wouldn't make such a stupid error, AND that they would realize it's in Cult's favour to kill non-Leader Cultists since then they can convert more.
And I'm vaguely reading Bellaphant as not aligned with Korina, so there's that.
RH9 is still my best bet for Cult Leader. His posts feel like he's genuinely trying to uphold a thread presence, but he's not actually saying anything helpful or Townie.Once again today begins this farce we call a trial.-
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Nathann He/TheyGoonHe/They
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Does anyone (other than Korina) have thoughts on whether furtiveglance's 64 is Townie or Scummy? It feels like a post Ishouldhave an opinion on, but I can't quite make it out.Once again today begins this farce we call a trial.-
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Nathann He/TheyGoonHe/They
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If it's genuine, then I agree with Jacket that he's probably Town.
If it's sarcastic, then I'm not sure if it's AI. I want to say it's Scummy for ignoring my questioning and cutting the conversation short, but I've been wrong on reads like that too many times.Once again today begins this farce we call a trial.-
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Nathann He/TheyGoonHe/They
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Nathann He/TheyGoonHe/They
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Nathann He/TheyGoonHe/They
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Do you actually believe that Korina's rageposting over having 3 random votes on them is genuine? Do you really think that Korina, who seems to have so much experience in this game, would be knocked so off their balance by three naked votes?In post 123, Bellaphant wrote:Korina is posting from their pov of someone who seems to love cults
Do you think I'm Scumreading RH9 for "lowposting"? That's not what I said.In post 123, Bellaphant wrote:rh9 also feels like a weird person to pick out, over other low content posterrs?
It's almost like I said that I wasn't certain in my read there. Which is Scummy because...?In post 123, Bellaphant wrote:He's misreading the tone of furtive so much, but then again walking back the read. None of it feels like content they are massively behind.Once again today begins this farce we call a trial.-
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Nathann He/TheyGoonHe/They
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Doesn't change my point. They got meme voted because it's a Cult game. Korina is surely used to getting meme voted in Cult games. I just don't see a world where their first reaction to seeing that is going all rage mode and screaming at everyone who voted them for it.In post 125, Bellaphant wrote:I think they were cross about a policy elim/meme, not the votes themselves? Idek, there's clearly context here that they think people know but I don't.
Fair. Can you expand on it a bit? Honestly I've not noticed then produce anything and have lumped them with Titus/bbt
It's not scummy on its own, but the third time in four posts feels very hedgey.
Make note, I don't think Korina reacts like that as Town, and I also think Scum!Korina is good enough to know that the game is most likely to find such a reaction Scummy. So it doesn't make sense they're the Cult Leader. The only scenario where it makes sense is if Korina is a Cultist (who knows it's in benefit of the Cult for Cultists to get killed so that the Leader can recruit more), ormaybethey're a Vengeful Townie trying to play a hero. My money is currently on the former.
Read Titus's and BBT's ISOs, then read RH9's. All of them have about the same amount of content. The only difference is that Titus and BBT are not pretending that they're solving anything. While RH9 has posted 8 posts, most of which are tangentially game-related (talking about the setup, etc.) but none of them actually get us anywhere. He doesn't have reads. Other than arguably Townleaning Jacket, who, IMHO, had not done anything worth unvoting at the time. RH9 and Titus/BBT all have zero content, but RH9 is the only of the three who is trying to look like he's contributing.
I mean. furtiveglance's not someone I have a great read on right now. I concluded that he is Townie in one scenario, and null in the other. I don't pretend to have strong reads on people I don't have ones, and I didn't want to leave that line of conversation without giving a conclusion.Once again today begins this farce we call a trial.-
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Nathann He/TheyGoonHe/They
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Happy? Not really. So angry they start rageposting and now claim they don't wanna play? Definitely not.In post 130, Korina wrote:how happy do you think someone would be to see that?
Where did they do this?In post 133, Enchant wrote:... Actually, you just come, not reading modpost, not reading your supposed town PM and start lecturing ppl in anti-town plan which is not gonna work.Once again today begins this farce we call a trial.-
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Nathann He/TheyGoonHe/They
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I'm moreso interested in this part - where did Korina show they didn't read their role PM? Like, none of those posts read like a slip or anything to me.In post 133, Enchant wrote:not reading modpost, not reading your supposed town PMOnce again today begins this farce we call a trial.-
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Nathann He/TheyGoonHe/They
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It seemed to me that Bellaphant thought I was going after RH9 because he was lowposting, and said she doesn't see the difference between him and Titus/BBT. I just was explaining why he's different than them, I wasn't the one trying to compare him to them.In post 143, Jacket wrote:Kind of a weird distinction to draw. Titus and BBT were both only posting during RVS, RH9 made some posts after. And I'd expect you to know that RH9 tends to make posts that are...weird.
Sure, I know his posts are weird. I think they're usually not completely devoid of content, though. Do you think he's Townie?Once again today begins this farce we call a trial.-
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Nathann He/TheyGoonHe/They
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Nathann He/TheyGoonHe/They
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Opinion that nobody asked for: I agree that Enchant's posting seems to be clearly from a Town perspective, while Cat.Jpeg's posts are more nullish. Not sure if I would call them Scummy, but they're definitely not moving anything forward. BBT's interpretations feel to be bad faith.Once again today begins this farce we call a trial.-
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Nathann He/TheyGoonHe/They
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I know, I wanted to point out how much my thoughts align with Jacket's there.In post 160, BlueBloodedToffee wrote:
I haven't said anything about Enchant regarding a read.In post 158, Nathann wrote:Opinion that nobody asked for: I agree that Enchant's posting seems to be clearly from a Town perspective, while Cat.Jpeg's posts are more nullish. Not sure if I would call them Scummy, but they're definitely not moving anything forward. BBT's interpretations feel to be bad faith.
What about my interpretations are bad faith? And if you believe this, you should probably vote me
148 feels bad faith since it seems clear to me Jacket's vote was about the quality of the discussion, not the quantity. 151 is trying to make Jacket seem like Scum by a very dumb "gotcha" as opposed to actually trying to understand what he's saying in 150. 156 is trying to force out a contradiction that doesn't actually mean anything for Jacket's alignment. And 159 feels like bad faith questioning because asking what's the "Scum motivation for posting bad posts" is a bad question. Obviously Scum wouldn't post bad posts if they thought it would get them caught. Scum posts bad posts if they're careless or don't know better. It's a loaded question.
I want to keep voting RH9 because he still feels a bit too scared to me, which I expect from a Cult Leader. I'll see how I feel later.Once again today begins this farce we call a trial.-
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Nathann He/TheyGoonHe/They
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Okay. That doesn't change the fact that it's presenting the "facts" in bad faith. If you want to be literal, then yes, both Enchant and Cat.Jpeg talked a lot about the setup. No shit, good job there. But I think it's pretty clearly implied that, if you're voting someone for being wrapped up in it, you're voting them because they're doing it in a scummy way. Enchant was driving the game forward, Cat.Jpeg wasn't. You're removing the nuance and trying to paint Jacket Scummy for it.In post 164, BlueBloodedToffee wrote:151 is flat out facts. Like, it's just facts.
What are you even referring to here?In post 164, BlueBloodedToffee wrote:Moving goalposts for reasoning on a vote isn't alignment indicative for you? Alright, noted.
This assumes that Scum is always perfect and makes every post with the intent of pushing some grand agenda. Surely I don't have to respond why that doesn't happen in practice, especially with newer players (who Cat.Jpeg seems to be). Not knowing what to do as Scum and just posting posts without content is something never Scum does very often.In post 164, BlueBloodedToffee wrote:Scum want to influence the game, no? So by arriving at a nothing conclusion it doesn't appear to do anything to forward a scum win-con.
This is, what, saying that you've never seen Scum attempt to actively lurk by putting out posts that seem like content but don't actually go anywhere? That is the entirety of my Scumread on RH9, how come you didn't attack me over it?Once again today begins this farce we call a trial.-
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Nathann He/TheyGoonHe/They
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In post 152, Bellaphant wrote:nathaan
I find it funny how my name is getting spelled progressively worse as the game goes on.In post 172, Bellaphant wrote:naarhan
Also, I do want to throw potatoes at Enchant now. Cult doesn't care about your persuasive skills if you're a Governor.Once again today begins this farce we call a trial.-
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Nathann He/TheyGoonHe/They
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Hah, don't worry about it. As I said, I just thought it was funny.In post 188, Bellaphant wrote:@nathann, sorry! It's not personal
Why did you say Venged specifically?In post 170, RH9 wrote:
Good catch.In post 167, Nathann wrote: This is, what, saying that you've never seen Scum attempt to actively lurk by putting out posts that seem like content but don't actually go anywhere? That is the entirety of my Scumread on RH9, how come you didn't attack me over it?
Do you think that BBT should be Venged?
Also, what are your reads looking like right now?Once again today begins this farce we call a trial.-
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Nathann He/TheyGoonHe/They
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Nathann He/TheyGoonHe/They
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Well, I'm kind of disappointed that BBT did not respond to my earlier post, but alright.
Also, I too claim Vengeful Townie. I'm assuming neither of Jacket and RH9 is a Townie fakeclaiming, since it's not like they can eat a bullet for a real power role in this setup. So one of them is most likely a non-Leader Cultist.Once again today begins this farce we call a trial.-
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Nathann He/TheyGoonHe/They
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I wouldn't put it past Scum!Jacket to claim Vengeful first, but I agree he's most likely Town here.
My thoughts are that, while the Cult Leader claiming Vengeful would really be a funny gambit, it gambles that the Town will never agree to start killing within the CC's. So overall, I find it unlikely.Once again today begins this farce we call a trial.-
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Nathann He/TheyGoonHe/They
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Yeah, if we eliminate a non-Leader Cultist, they get to convert someone. So if we believe that the Leader wouldn't claim Vengeful, then it's optimal to ignore the CC's and keep trying to find them.In post 244, Bellaphant wrote:I still think nathann is town.
So, our best strategy is to ignore the cc right now? As elim-ing a depury gives scum a recruit if we are wrong? I need someone to explain like im five.Once again today begins this farce we call a trial.-
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Nathann He/TheyGoonHe/They
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Er. Of course I fakeclaimed as Serial Killer. I wasn't going to just. Openly claim Serial Killer.In post 291, RH9 wrote:By the way a clarification on 279 before anybody gets misdirected.
Nathann fakeclaimed VT in Open 838 as SK but he actually acted more Town than a whole portion of the playerlist.
I think RH9 is having a very weird thought process by comparing this to my 3P game. Yes, Cult is often considered 3P, but here they're just the scumteam, while the Serial Killer is a proper 3P.
Somehow, I'm starting to think he's Town, despite the very odd thought process. BBT pointing out the "softs" kind of helped with that.Once again today begins this farce we call a trial.-
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Nathann He/TheyGoonHe/They
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Nathann He/TheyGoonHe/They
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No. I was trying to play in a way that my role wouldn't be noticeable. I didn't want the Cult to know where to recruit.In post 310, furtiveglance wrote:Nathann can you point to any softs of your own? Same question to Jacket.Once again today begins this farce we call a trial.-
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Nathann He/TheyGoonHe/They
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Nathann He/TheyGoonHe/They
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Nathann He/TheyGoonHe/They
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Nathann He/TheyGoonHe/They
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Just unnerving. I think I had a thought on my Cult isn't that likely to white knight me there in that manner. I forgot by now, but I'll trust my past self.In post 317, furtiveglance wrote:Do you think I'm sus? or just unnerving?Once again today begins this farce we call a trial.-
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Nathann He/TheyGoonHe/They
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Do you think I'm the Leader? If not, you're aware killing me as the Prime Cultist is actually what I want, right?In post 321, BlueBloodedToffee wrote:Furtive, this is your friendly reminder that Nathan is very likely cultist.
They're someone I can remember has postedIn post 322, BlueBloodedToffee wrote:Why Beat Nathan?somethingthat sounded Townie and solve-y, but I can't remember what. I feel like that's more likely to be Cult Leader behaviour than if I didn't remember their posting at all (e.g. Titus).Once again today begins this farce we call a trial.-
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Nathann He/TheyGoonHe/They
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Almost as if I don't Townread them anymore.In post 335, BlueBloodedToffee wrote:He hasn't gone for a Titus/Cat type player, or even Bella. But someone he was town reading.
What's the hmm for?
As I said, I don't really mind being eliminated, since it's better than no elimination, and I get to shoot. Though fair warning, I will likely not be shooting between the Vengeful claims.Once again today begins this farce we call a trial.-
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Nathann He/TheyGoonHe/They
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Hm. If he thought the Vengefuls would claim at some point, then it makes sense to go first. That makes it less likely he gets eliminated first, and rather likely he gets Vengekilled. Which is a double win: a confirmed Townie is out, AND the Cult gets to recruit.In post 329, BlueBloodedToffee wrote:Right, but why? Why as scum is he trying to generate content?
Or, the Vengefuls shoot each other, which is also good. You get my point.Once again today begins this farce we call a trial.-
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Nathann He/TheyGoonHe/They
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Ah yes, because me as Cult Leader would be truthfully telegraphing what I think is optimal play for Cult.In post 338, BlueBloodedToffee wrote:The hmm is you trying to steer discussion away from elimming vengeful pool and then also saying CL is unlikely to claim Vengeful and thus making it more likely that CL!Nathan claims Vengeful because he thinks it's an unlikely play.
No. I didn't think about this game much in the past few days, then earlier today I got reminded that they exist, and it made me realize they can be someone who's trying to fly under the radar. So they can get my vote for the time being.In post 339, BlueBloodedToffee wrote:Any indication of that town read disappearing?
Or has Beat done something to earn naughty points?Once again today begins this farce we call a trial.-
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Nathann He/TheyGoonHe/They
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I disagree but I don't have time right now to argue about it and I don't think it will change your read of me anyway.
I don't remember Titus looking like she's trying to look Townie, that's the difference. Cat can be a candidate for Cult Leader, sure.Once again today begins this farce we call a trial.-
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Nathann He/TheyGoonHe/They
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Bella can be Townie for not wanting to go within the CC's.
Cat has just had content that's pretty inoffensive but that made it seem like they're trying to have some sorta presence. There's not much more than that; I don't have a great case on them or anything.Once again today begins this farce we call a trial.-
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Nathann He/TheyGoonHe/They
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Nathann He/TheyGoonHe/They
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Because I think the Cult Leader is not within the Vengeful claims. So it's pro-Town to be wanting to kill outside of them.In post 383, Jacket wrote:
This is really weak, I have no idea why you'd townread someone for a purely mechanical argument.In post 345, Nathann wrote:Bella can be Townie for not wanting to go within the CC's.
Cat has just had content that's pretty inoffensive but that made it seem like they're trying to have some sorta presence. There's not much more than that; I don't have a great case on them or anything.Once again today begins this farce we call a trial.-
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Nathann He/TheyGoonHe/They
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It's almost like I later on said as such.In post 382, Jacket wrote:Worth noting: No progression or rationale on the vote, no case for why he now think Beat is cult.Once again today begins this farce we call a trial.-
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Nathann He/TheyGoonHe/They
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324 and 341.In post 404, RH9 wrote:By the way, Nathann, even though you're talking to Jacket, would you mind quoting the posts on your rationale on Beat?Once again today begins this farce we call a trial.-
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Nathann He/TheyGoonHe/They
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I wonder why.In post 412, Beat wrote:I can't find Nathann's role in cults planOnce again today begins this farce we call a trial.-
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Nathann He/TheyGoonHe/They
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I'm kind of skeptical that Cult!Beat makes 412 when it seems likely that one of the people in the solve will get eliminated. If one of the people in there were to flip Town, she would be forced to re-evaluate, and I'm not sure Scum is likely to put themselves in that position voluntarily.
UNVOTE: Beat
BBT, do you want me to be your doublevoter for the Day? I think you're Town, and I think everyone is going to freak out wherever I vote voluntarily.Once again today begins this farce we call a trial.-
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Nathann He/TheyGoonHe/They
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I don't think it's likely to be helpful. I currently think Jacket is a Cultist. I know he's a good Scum player, and since he was the one to claim Vengeful, I think he thought his posts wouldn't be incriminating for the Cult Leader if/when he dies. The only conclusion I can draw from his ISO that I'm relatively certain about is that he's not Cult with you, which is not exactly useful to me.In post 431, BlueBloodedToffee wrote:Nathan, given that you know one of Jacket/RH9 is Cult, why have you put no work in to find CL from their posts?Once again today begins this farce we call a trial.-
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Nathann He/TheyGoonHe/They
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Nathann He/TheyGoonHe/They
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I could do that. If I didn't have anything better to do today, I might would have. But it would just be analysis for analysis's sake, as I wouldn't exactly believe in it. Jacket is not a newbie.
My time might be better used arguing with you why claiming first as Cult could be beneficial.Once again today begins this farce we call a trial.-
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Nathann He/TheyGoonHe/They
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Nathann He/TheyGoonHe/They
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You're tunnelled on "this action generates discussion" when there's other benefits that would outweigh the discussion generated, the Day was not heading to a no-elimination anyway since plurality is in effect, and it was likely at least one of the Vengeful Townies was going to claim Today, which would've still generated the discussion, except Cult wouldn't have gotten any Towncred from it.Once again today begins this farce we call a trial.-
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Nathann He/TheyGoonHe/They
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The fact that there was a decent amount of talk about it and agreement that Vengefuls should be claiming.In post 443, BlueBloodedToffee wrote:What makes you think it was likely that a Vengeful would claim today?
We can agree that Cult wants at least one Vengeful claim, since otherwise the Town gets two confirmed Townies that are never getting eliminated, and that even if Culted, won't be able to use their Vengeful ability due to being confirmed not Cult Leader.In post 445, BlueBloodedToffee wrote:Can you expand on the benefits for Cult claiming Vengeful first?
So the question is, should the fakeclaiming Cultist claim first?
One obvious advantage of not going first is knowing who you will be up against. However, Jacket was decently Townread at the time of his claim, which doesn't benefit him much as a non-fakeclaiming Prime Cultist (they want to be eliminated, after all), but will massively benefit him in winning the CC battles.
People are naturally inclined to Townread the first person to do it. Especially if they do it in the name of ~ generating content ~. Which is important when you think about what Cult wants with the CC's -- they don't want to be eliminated first. While it's still a positive, it confirms the other two people as Town. So it would benefit the Cult to get the Vengefuls eliminated first, hopefully get them to shoot one another. Then you get the confirmed Townies out of the game, and the Town is forced to either kill the outed Cultist to make sure he's not the Cult Leader, or just ignore him for the rest of the game and pray he isn't.
This is a bit longer way to say "Cult wants to win the CC's, and claiming first gets them Townread".
Oh, and I would kind of disagree with "it wasn't a misdirect". If the Town agrees to be killing within the claims, then it absolutely is a misdirect, because they'll be focused on discussing which non-Cult-Leader player to kill. And Town is likely to do that, because it's natural for Townies to want to kill scum, even if they're consciously aware they shouldn't be killing non-Leader Cult. And there's always that tiny possibility that the Cult Leader did claim.Once again today begins this farce we call a trial.-
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Nathann He/TheyGoonHe/They
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Nathann He/TheyGoonHe/They
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Prime Cultists' goal is to get eliminated, so that the Cult can recruit. So Jacket's claim of "I wouldn't claim Vengeful as Cult" is, uh, bad.In post 528, BlueBloodedToffee wrote:
Why not?In post 526, Jacket wrote:Voting me is dumb. I wouldn't be claiming vengeful as cult, period.
VOTE: Bella
Might as well go back to this, I think the diversion away from her at the end of the day is pretty telling.
Enchant, do you think we should go outside of claims?
I don't want to go all game without sorting the Jacket/Nathan thing.
As long as you believe the Cult Leader isn't within the claims, you can just freeze the three of us out of the game. Since killing the Leader is the goal.
For the record, I don't think it's likely Jacket is a Cult Leader claiming Vengeful because the "not knowing who's CC'ing him" thing is much more risky once the Leader is claiming, he wasn't playing as a deepwolf/powerwolf, and he'd be betting the game on Town never eliminating the CC's. So, I'm fine with freezing us out.Once again today begins this farce we call a trial.-
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Nathann He/TheyGoonHe/They
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This is about how I see the game right now. Which, surely it's not Scum!furtiveglance copying my reads in order to pocket me, when half the game thinks I'm a Cultist within the CC's, right? Right.In post 554, furtiveglance wrote:Hey guys, BBT and RH9 are both town, add that to Enchant and that's 3. 1 in Jacket/Nathann (prob Jacket), Korina Prime Cultist is my strongest read outside of that and I can kind of see Beat as CL.Once again today begins this farce we call a trial.-
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Nathann He/TheyGoonHe/They
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Sorry for my absence, the game is just kind of... boring. In retrospect, I regret counterclaiming Vengeful, at least half the game wouldn't have been focused on that group then.
The only change in my reads recently is that Bellaphant seems Townie in the last few pages.
Does anyone mind if I just spend the Day sheeping BBT/RH9/Enchant?Once again today begins this farce we call a trial.-
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Nathann He/TheyGoonHe/They
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I am voting anyone before Jacket. You do understand why killing a Prime is going directly against Town wincon, right?In post 591, furtiveglance wrote:I haven't seen a cultist flip yet...I really want one, I don't care if it's leader!
Anyone agree and want to vote Jacket with me? Nathann? I know you think they're prime but STILL.......Once again today begins this farce we call a trial.-
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Nathann He/TheyGoonHe/They
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Nathann He/TheyGoonHe/They
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Nathann He/TheyGoonHe/They
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- Joined: March 3, 2021
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Nathann He/TheyGoonHe/They
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- Joined: March 3, 2021
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Nathann He/TheyGoonHe/They
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- Posts: 659
- Joined: March 3, 2021
- Pronoun: He/They