Newbie 1773 - Roosters (Post-Game)

[Loopdan]

@Wood-- If you get an avatar it will be much easier to follow you.

VOTE: Accountant

[Loopdan]

Loopdan: No comment on the TesXX thing? Or do you think it is NAI?

I marked it down to check his other games, but just checked and realized there aren't any.
NAI unless Tes wants to share another site where he has played.

[Loopdan]

Not Alignment Indicative = The content in question does not reveal the player's alignment (town or scum) either way.

[Loopdan]

I think he means because we are both voting you, but my vote is pure RVS.

[Loopdan]

VOTE: AceQueen

[Loopdan]

@Ace-- What do you make of Tess so far?

[Loopdan]

UNVOTE: I gtg so I will explain my reasoning asap tomorrow

Still waiting on an explanation. Although I'm not sure what you are explaining. Is it your unvote of your self-vote?

[Loopdan]

Lighthaze you are giving me the heebie-jeebies.

[Loopdan]

@Tes-- You still haven't explained what you meant here:

UNVOTE: I gtg so I will explain my reasoning asap tomorrow

Still waiting on an explanation. Although I'm not sure what you are explaining. Is it your unvote of your self-vote?

[Loopdan]

How is light haze giving you the heebie jeebies?

He's got a captain obvious thing going on and then 92 was just an echo of Accountant's 91.

[Loopdan]

That

really

looks like a scum attempt at redirection combined with LAMIST.
VOTE: Light

[Loopdan]

LAMIST =

Look at me, I'm so town

[Loopdan]

Very good entrance by GT. I can see legit thinking behind your reads. My only question is why the strong TR on Accountant?

[Loopdan]

oh and loop some response to my question from earlier would help, ty

Do you mean this?

can you re-examine falco for me?

I should be able to get to that sometime today.

[Loopdan]

I'm here. Give me a bit to catch up.

[Loopdan]

@gT-- You asked me to go re-eval Falco. 101 looks weird, and 159 is bad. His readslist in 172 is pretty null.

I really like gT's 163.

Light's 164 is more likely newbtown than newbscum. Other recent posts look town.

UNVOTE:

[Loopdan]

I'd like AJ's reads.

[Loopdan]

so overall loop are you leaning null-scum on him...?

Yes, but that's an admittedly weak read.

I wanna hear more from AJ on who he reads and why. I'm suspicious of his slot, but all this back and forth about him answering the question posed to me is distracting. I get that it was bad play, but I've done that as over-eager town myself.

[Loopdan]

I'd like GT and grey to both talk about Accountant sometime soon.

[Loopdan]

so overall loop are you leaning null-scum on him...?

Yes, but that's an admittedly weak read.

I wanna hear more from AJ on who he reads and why. I'm suspicious of his slot, but all this back and forth about him answering the question posed to me is distracting. I get that it was bad play, but I've done that as over-eager town myself.

This shit's a copout of a statement. You're suspicious of my slot but the back and forth, which is like 50-70% of my posts in the thread, are confusing to you? You're setting it up so you can move your vote whenever you feel like it, calling it 'bad play'. What a joke, ain't anything about that being bad play, just part of the R2R experience.

I didn't say your back and forth is confusing. I said it was distracting. Meaning I don't think it is revealing of your alignment either way, and the focus on that takes away from other topics of conversation that might better lead to you being sorted.

[Loopdan]

I'd like Loopdan to not pretend he didn't see the great wall that Trump built.

Yeah I saw it. You might be on to something, but I'm not content heading to night 1 with two newbies being the game's dominant scumreads in an underdeveloped game. I'd like more interactions with AJ and Acct.

[Loopdan]

Sorry for my recent low activity. Just got caught up.

VOTE: Wood
Intent to hammer was opportunistic and disavowing responsibility.
His prior read on player he intended to hammer was null (139, 143)
Reads list was risk averse.
Like Grey said there is no game-solving (or even any genuine curiosity about the game-state) evident in wood's game.

[Loopdan]

I disagree. That's less town paranoia and more stating two possibilities. I'm still not sold that light is obv newbtown.

[Loopdan]

I'm not convinced that woodboy's push on light makes him town. Even though light is townread by some, he's still low hanging fruit if you consider it's picking a fight with an inexperienced player. And I've been open that I'm not in agreement that light is obvtown.

Falco hasn't done enough at this point for me to have much confidence in a read on that slot. Given the wagon on him, it's probably the right time for Falco to post a full reads list.

I'm disappointed Accountant is a non-factor right now (yes I know the same can be said for me but at least my name has come up on the last five pages). I know we probably can't sort Accountant today, but I'd like more content from them to at least have something to look at day2.

[Loopdan]

[off-topic]
Hey Giggles, check this game: http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=51&t=69831

Another example of the validity of your signature!
[/off-topic]

Please for the love of God don't ever reference that game again. So glad I replaced out of that disaster.

[Loopdan]

UNVOTE:

[Loopdan]

@mod: requesting VC

If Woodboy is really at L-1, I

intend to hammer.

[Loopdan]

@Wood-- Claim your role now. You can write more details later. I won't hammer until you've had your say but I want a claim ASAP.

[Loopdan]

I don't really have a problem hammering this day1. I'm re-checking his iso just to be sure.

[Loopdan]

OK so on re-read it's even worse. I'm doubtful that 36 comes from a newbie with a PR role pm. There's some "scum caught for wrong reason" in 644. 722 & 727 is not a townie thought process.

If anybody has a reason why I shouldn't hammer right now, speak up, because my next post will contain a vote for woodboy.

[Loopdan]

Either Falco flips scum or there is scum in wood/AJ.

I was this || close to going back on my word and hammering woodboy in my last post.

[Loopdan]

I like Accountant as scum if Falco flips red.

[Loopdan]

Yes.

[Loopdan]

Loop's been decently passive but I see what you mean

There is a difference between quiet and passive. For whatever it's worth I was trying to draw the N1 kill. Obviously that won't happen now.

[Loopdan]

i think the big takeaway (especially if we're right about wood/light) here is that reads suck

If it ends up being woodboy/light I'd say my reads have been pretty darn good.

[Loopdan]

@AJ
Depends. Do define "powerful" as "influential" or "correct"?

[Loopdan]

@light-- If you are town, now would be a good time to make that clear by analyzing the game and finding woodboy's partner. Also you should unvote so he can't self hammer and cut the day short.

[Loopdan]

VOTE: wood

Optimal play here is to let him sit at L-1 and gamesolve/hunt for his partner until deadline. Unfortunately these two days are not good for me in terms of schedules and business, but I'll do my best.

No. Optimal play is to keep him off L-1 so he can't end the day early by self-hammering.

[Loopdan]

Caught scum self-hammers frequently. This is a textbook case of caught scum.

Yeah, why didn't Accountant consider that? That might be a great topic of conversation today.

[Loopdan]

AJ is alive because:
1) Scum is trying a very risky gambit where they leave him alive until day3 so they can lynch him ("If he was really tracker he would obviously be dead!"). They can also combine this with a cop claim with innos on grey and whoever, and then a "guilty" in day4 lylo if AJ gets lynched.
2) Scum is dumb.
3) AJ is scum.

I'm going with #1 or #2.

[Loopdan]

Accountant's #4 reason there makes the most sense.

[Loopdan]

@AJ -- I'm not sure I'm following. Did you get a PM from the mod with results of your track? If so, when?

[Loopdan]

i'm like 100% sure tes is town given woodboys scum

Why?

[Loopdan]

Alright I'm ready.

[Loopdan]

To lynch woodboy.
I'll vote tomorrow if no one objects.

[Loopdan]

@Tes-- You twice called it an alt before saying it was not an alt. What's going on here?

[Loopdan]

@AJ
Please post your final reads/thoughts.

[Loopdan]

@Tes-- You twice called it an alt before saying it was not an alt. What's going on here?

I was saying, "an alt" as in an alternate person who uses the computer
but that was a crappy way of putting it and people would think I own that account

Um, you said...

Sorry forgot to log off of my alt lol

And...

That was my alt account

[Loopdan]

@Tes-- I don't think it is somebody else's account. I think it is your alt. But I also think you lying about this is probably NAI.

[Loopdan]

Yes. Pretty sure it's light.

VOTE: Woodboy

[Loopdan]

ugh i may lynch woodboys now with everything thats against him, but im gonna think about it, gn everyone

Appearantly it ended an hour early so I'm on my way home now, Anyone know the vc on wood boys, I don't want to hammer on accident without any final thoughts and possibly cause a setback for town

For the record, If woodboys is lynched and is scum, I'm gonna be sis of grey, I feel like grey could be leading us into town's loss of the game, but i feel strongly he isn't and is a very good town

@Light-- Your only hope of not being lynched is if you post analysis of the game.

I'm not buying 1071 at all. You are "too tired to play" and resigned to death, but you somehow managed to post that appeal to emotion less than an hour after day-start.

[Loopdan]

quotes weren't meant for that post
but they are good quotes nonetheless

[Loopdan]

Code: Select all

[post]1[/post]

looks like
1

[Loopdan]

Yeah, I'm ready.

VOTE: light

[Loopdan]

If you wanna keep talking go ahead.
UNVOTE:

But I'm not buying what you are selling so far. Maybe try explaining who is town and why. At this point I'm at a loss if you are a mislynch.

[Loopdan]

actually, yes i am done if im gonna get lynched anyway, this was a waste of time then

You are going to be lynched today. There's very little chance you can avoid that. But if you are a mislynch you still win the game if town wins. So we might benefit from your thoughts if you are town and it isn't a waste of your time. You giving up here looks more scummy than townie.

[Loopdan]

we should give final thoughts since one of us will get nightkilled in case Light is inno.

The last thing I want to do if light is town is be giving out reads.

[Loopdan]

oh crap, i had forgotten about the game, some stuff came up, im at l-1, but accountant didnt bother to announce that, odd is it not?

This is a scum post. Let's end this.

VOTE: Light

[Loopdan]

Leaning towards Tes being scum. But this is Lylo with Accountant, which does not bring out of the best in me.

[Loopdan]

End of Day 1. Not at all helpful.

TesXX {0} -
Woodboys2339 {3} - TesXX, Accountant, FalcoXV
-Grey- {0} -
gigabyteTroubadour {0} -
Lighthaze1135 {0} -
Falco XV {5} - gigabyteTroubadour, Aj The Epic, Lighthaze1135, Woodboys2339, -Grey-

L Y N C H

Aj the Epic {0} -
Loopdan {0} -
Accountant {0} -

woodboy's reads. Not at all helpful.

{Light} - fulltown
{TesXX, Accountant} slight town
{grey, giggles, loop} null
{AJ} slight scum
{Falco} fullscum

Not that great at hunting, but those are my reads.

[Loopdan]

Vote Count 2.2


TesXX {0} -
Woodboys2339 {4} - Accountant, Lighthaze1135, Loopdan, Woodboys2339 L Y N C H
gigabyteTroubadour {0} -
Lighthaze1135 {0} -
Aj the Epic {0} -
Loopdan {0} -
Accountant {0} -

Not Voting (3): Aj the Epic, gigabyteTroubadour, TesXX

[Loopdan]

VOTE: wood

Optimal play here is to let him sit at L-1 and gamesolve/hunt for his partner until deadline. Unfortunately these two days are not good for me in terms of schedules and business, but I'll do my best.

No. Optimal play is to keep him off L-1 so he can't end the day early by self-hammering.

[Loopdan]

if scum kill in {accountant/loopdan} in that scenario and leave tes and me alive i just speed vote whichever of {accountant/loopdan} is alive still

i'm like 100% sure tes is town given woodboys scum

[Loopdan]

Accountant I don't really see as scum

What happened to me being scum by PoE?

only in a world where light is town but i dont see that happening at the atm moment?

[Loopdan]

i'm like 100% sure tes is town given woodboys scum

Why?

Woodboys wagon gave him what felt like new footing in the game

just like the way his tone shifted made it seem unlikely he was bussing

[Loopdan]

I'd say look out for light tomorrow. Aj, track him.

[Loopdan]

I do buy giga's explanation re:town Tes; should light flip town, my reads from towniest to scummiest are Tes > Giga > Loopdan.

[Loopdan]

I think it's TesXX or haze. IDRC which order. The real worrying factor is the fact that LH was so townread before but I'm not sure we can actually let him live at this point.

[Loopdan]

{Aj} Null

Actually claiming tracker to protect your scum teammate who is probably going to be lynched tomorrow if the other guy flips town is probably a bad idea since it will be auto win for town when you get counterclaimed later.
{Aj} Town.

This is town though ^^

How? I'm basically confirmed to die tonight.

Scum knows 100% you're town and therefore telling the truth, having to work out logic to figure out you're the tracker in the first place is something only town needs to do.

[Loopdan]

VOTE: wood

Optimal play here is to let him sit at L-1 and gamesolve/hunt for his partner until deadline. Unfortunately these two days are not good for me in terms of schedules and business, but I'll do my best.

No. Optimal play is to keep him off L-1 so he can't end the day early by self-hammering.

I don't think a scum player would do this tbh, especially not if even the IC didn't catch it.

I take this back. scum could say that to get everyone to townread them and if scum is being townread then day going on wouldn't hurt them much.

Why is this TesXX's first post of the Day 3?

[Loopdan]

I'm mainly on the fence because of the chance of a PR. Then again... you did make the point of them claiming. so fine

VOTE: TesXX L-1

Uhhhh you should vote Tes because you think there is a decent chance he is scum not because you want to play the odds. Also, barring a derphammer, 3) doesn't happen, because PRs usually claim before they die.

That's a bit soon. I mean, yeah I claimed a non existent role and joked around for a while, but isn't that part of RVS? I think this is a bit early to tell other people who to vote, that's kind of a later-in-the-game thing. I was just joking around for RVS, guys. I think putting me at L1 is a bit far since a scum player could hammer me.

Why doesn't TesXX entertain the idea that woodboy is scum here?

[Loopdan]

@Accountant- Go read the page 45 (and top of 46) light/Tes interactions and let me know what you think.

[Loopdan]

I always overthink lylo and end up voting wrong.

I'm voting one of you in 24 hours.

Right now it's probably Tes. I see no attempt at game-solving in lylo from you.

[Loopdan]

I'm not trolling. You said you'd be analyzing associations today. What happened to that?

(expired on 2017-03-05 19:13:43)

[Loopdan]

@Accountant-- If you can't see how 635 makes me town then you might just be scum here. Read that post in context and you'll realize the game was moving to a Falco lynch (I think he was at L-1), and I was arguing against the main reason given by grey for unvoting woodboy.

And you should have quoted 417 because it was pretty damn good.

Sorry for my recent low activity. Just got caught up.

VOTE: Wood
Intent to hammer was opportunistic and disavowing responsibility.
His prior read on player he intended to hammer was null (139, 143)
Reads list was risk averse.
Like Grey said there is no game-solving (or even any genuine curiosity about the game-state) evident in wood's game.

Grey started the day1 wood wagon. Tes voted soon after. I jumped onboard soon with 417. Then Accountant joined in almost immediately while stating agreement with Grey (but not referencing Tes or me).

[Loopdan]

There are a ton of Tes-woodboy interactions from day1 that don't look like SvS.

Spoiler: I think these are all the times Tes & woody Ali to or about each other day1 (and one post from day2)

starting to agree with the tess lynch. If he is so adamant about just clowning around. He won't be much help for the town. there are 3 possible outcomes of this. He 1) is scum and Yay for the town. 2) he's a VT and although it's bad, we didn't lose much or 3) he's a power role and we're terribly screwed for the rest of the game.

While he is a huge SR. I don't really know if the possibility of the 3rd option should derail us off.

I'm mainly on the fence because of the chance of a PR. Then again... you did make the point of them claiming. so fine

VOTE: TesXX L-1

Sorry about how busy I've been lately. I'll try my best to stay with the game soon when I get the chance I promise.

{Accountant} {Lighthaze} town
{giga} nulltown
{Loopdan} null
{falco} scumlean

giga has been including lots of details and seems to have been engaging in trying to find the mafia more than most of the other players, which wouldn't be entirely necessary and wouldn't be scummy not to do.
Loopdan's posts seem like they could be made by a mafia or town player.
181 seemed to just a tiny bit forced to me.

I will upload more posts with other reads soon when I get the opportunitu.

Also, I am a very indecisive person and usually don't like to push on someone unless I'm sure. As many people have provided evidence including yourself towards scumreads on Falco, I agreed with the notion and posted my intent to hammer. This still gives time for Falco to discuss topics if need be. While yes I agree my reads could come off as scummy due to the excessive amounts or BW, it is merely like that because I agree with the evidence provided.

You didn't seem too indecisive when you put me at L-1 on page 2.

Also, I am a very indecisive person and usually don't like to push on someone unless I'm sure. As many people have provided evidence including yourself towards scumreads on Falco, I agreed with the notion and posted my intent to hammer. This still gives time for Falco to discuss topics if need be. While yes I agree my reads could come off as scummy due to the excessive amounts or BW, it is merely like that because I agree with the evidence provided.

You didn't seem too indecisive when you put me at L-1 on page 2.

That is because at that time, a lot of evidence pointed to you being scum with multiple people pushing. I never said I was smart when I'm sure. I also explained thereafter that due to my times in chatroom, my decisions have been designed to pump out quickly. I have since then slowly gotten into the mindset of 14 day long days which presents my decline into complete indecisiveness.

When -Grey- first made post 376 I thought, "this evidence is actually pretty good, but woodboys' posts still seem a bit more like they could be genuine than falco's posts," but then woodboys came with 397 saying that he was an indecisive person, and then that made me think more about on page 2 when he was talking about being on the fence about voting me, and it didn't seem very real. It was almost like he wanted to act on the fence about it and

then

vote me, to seem like a townie being careful about lynching. I'll probably decide on whether I suspect woodboys or falco more overnight and vote in the morning.

Hold on,

Also, I am a very indecisive person and usually don't like to push on someone unless I'm sure. As many people have provided evidence including yourself towards scumreads on Falco, I agreed with the notion and posted my intent to hammer. This still gives time for Falco to discuss topics if need be. While yes I agree my reads could come off as scummy due to the excessive amounts or BW, it is merely like that because I agree with the evidence provided.

You didn't seem too indecisive when you put me at L-1 on page 2.

That is because at that time, a lot of evidence pointed to you being scum with multiple people pushing.

explain "a lot of evidence." What was really suspicious? Also, while Lighthaze and Accountant voted me, they weren't really

pushing

on anything.

VOTE: woody

Hold on,

Also, I am a very indecisive person and usually don't like to push on someone unless I'm sure. As many people have provided evidence including yourself towards scumreads on Falco, I agreed with the notion and posted my intent to hammer. This still gives time for Falco to discuss topics if need be. While yes I agree my reads could come off as scummy due to the excessive amounts or BW, it is merely like that because I agree with the evidence provided.

You didn't seem too indecisive when you put me at L-1 on page 2.

That is because at that time, a lot of evidence pointed to you being scum with multiple people pushing.

explain "a lot of evidence." What was really suspicious? Also, while Lighthaze and Accountant voted me, they weren't really

pushing

on anything.

The "Slayers Gambit" entrance that I have never seen and therefore didn't know how to react to besides getting an sr.

Still though, I don't see why you said they were pushing. Seems a bit like an excuse. (Also 400 wasn't the only reason I voted woody, it might've seemed like it was from the way I posted my vote)
Yes I said I was going to bed and I will now.
Probably.

UNVOTE:

What an interesting choice. Not the easiest person to try to sell as a scumread.

I don't buy your case, but I'm impressed with the fact you didn't go after an easier option.

he could easily be voting lighthaze to make people think he was town. You already said once that his read list was convenient.

UNVOTE:

What an interesting choice. Not the easiest person to try to sell as a scumread.

I don't buy your case, but I'm impressed with the fact you didn't go after an easier option.

he could easily be voting lighthaze to make people think he was town. You already said once that his read list was convenient.

So voting peoples hard town read makes me seem town? And in fact I even went against my own reads

So voting peoples hard town read makes me seem town?

Well a scum player would want to avoid the trouble of

convincing

players to lynch a townie, wouldn't they?

So voting peoples hard town read makes me seem town?

Well a scum player would want to avoid the trouble of

convincing

players to lynch a townie, wouldn't they?

Meant to say seem scum*

So voting peoples hard town read makes me seem town?

Well a scum player would want to avoid the trouble of

convincing

players to lynch a townie, wouldn't they?

Meant to say seem scum*

I didn't say it was scummy. I was just saying it wasn't necessarily towny.

Why would scum go against the flow and attract attention to themselves?

Why would scum go against the flow and attract attention to themselves?

who are you defending?

Why would scum go against the flow and attract attention to themselves?

who are you defending?

Myself.

Why would scum go against the flow and attract attention to themselves?

who are you defending?

Myself.

Wait, where did you do that, exactly?

b. the fact that that scum go against the flow D1.

I was defending against that

Why would scum go against the flow and attract attention to themselves?

who are you defending?

Myself.

Okay.

Why would scum go against the flow and attract attention to themselves?

so they could use that as an excuse.

VOTE: wood

Optimal play here is to let him sit at L-1 and gamesolve/hunt for his partner until deadline. Unfortunately these two days are not good for me in terms of schedules and business, but I'll do my best.

No. Optimal play is to keep him off L-1 so he can't end the day early by self-hammering.

Good catch
UNVOTE: woody woods yuuzstillgunadai

[Loopdan]

Spoiler: All the times Accountant & wood talked to or about each other day1 (and two posts from day2)

Is there any real reason to do it besides for fun @IC/SE's?

It gets the game going, and it forces people to take stances early on, for instance about TesXX's behavior. That's both something that moves the game along and is good to analyze and re-read in D2 or D3.

It's sub-optimal to No Lynch day 1, because the lynch is the method that town uses to acquire information. Without a lynch Day 1, we have the same information as when we started, only we're a townie down after the mafia kill. You should put your vote on someone!

Is there any real reason to do it besides for fun @IC/SE's?

It gets the game going, and it forces people to take stances early on, for instance about TesXX's behavior. That's both something that moves the game along and is good to analyze and re-read in D2 or D3.

It's sub-optimal to No Lynch day 1, because the lynch is the method that town uses to acquire information. Without a lynch Day 1, we have the same information as when we started, only we're a townie down after the mafia kill. You should put your vote on someone!

UNVOTE: No Lynch

Not gonna lynch anyone just yet

starting to agree with the tess lynch. If he is so adamant about just clowning around. He won't be much help for the town. there are 3 possible outcomes of this. He 1) is scum and Yay for the town. 2) he's a VT and although it's bad, we didn't lose much or 3) he's a power role and we're terribly screwed for the rest of the game.

While he is a huge SR. I don't really know if the possibility of the 3rd option should derail us off.

Uhhhh you should vote Tes because you think there is a decent chance he is scum not because you want to play the odds. Also, barring a derphammer, 3) doesn't happen, because PRs usually claim before they die.

Idk.. still on the fence rn

Idk.. still on the fence rn

I thought you said you were starting to agree with the Tes lynch, then you wrote down an analysis of why the Tes lynch was good. That doesn't sound on the fency to me.

I'm mainly on the fence because of the chance of a PR. Then again... you did make the point of them claiming. so fine

VOTE: TesXX L-1

Re:Falco vote, mehhhh I kinda wanted to go after Woodboy but not only is there no support there (aka vanity wagon), the reason I want to pursue is also a bit cold.

Reasoning behind you voting woodboy is cold. Falco's reasoning is not cold. Why do you prefer wood to falco?

@tesXX, care to claim?

Generally claims happen when there is declared intent to hammer.

Reads list:

[Accountant] - me
[Lighthaze] - obvtown
[gigabyte] - townlean
[TesXX, Loopdan, woodboys, AceQueen] - null
[Aj] - nullscum
[Falco] - scumlean

{Light} - fulltown
{TesXX, Accountant} slight town
{grey, giggles, loop} null
{AJ} slight scum
{Falco} fullscum

Not that great at hunting, but those are my reads.

Also, based on all the reasoning that seems quite reliable from players I deem as very experienced...

Intent To Hammer Falco

This feels bad. I can't put my thumb on why it feels bad; I'll come back to this after I get rid of my sleep deprivation, but this definitely feels pretty scummy.

{Light} - fulltown
{TesXX, Accountant} slight town
{grey, giggles, loop} null
{AJ} slight scum
{Falco} fullscum

Not that great at hunting, but those are my reads.

This is like one of the safest list of opinions I've ever seen

Grey I think I'm mindmelding with you let's hold hands and lynch woodboys together?

VOTE: Woodboys

Oh that's L-1 I think?

Alright, I'm heading back to sleep before my headache kills me. Sliiightly uncomfortable with the speed of the wood wagon but it's still an amazing wagon. I thought perhaps the most damning part was that Wood's reaction to Grey's analysis felt very irritated, like he's scum who doesn't understand why he's being wagoned and is frustrated that he's getting lynched for the wrong reasons.

I'll lynch B over A 9 times out of 10.

It honestly depends on the player. Against a super calm player like Magna/Thor I'd expect B more and would probably lynch them if they had response A

But I think the scummiest thing about woods' reaction to his wagon here was the fact that the phrasing of his question seemed very caught for wrong reasons. It was like "can you guys tell me what I did wrong?? My disguise was perfect! Why am I being killed?" more than anything. I'm also unsure why town!woods here only interacts with grey

{Light} - fulltown

wood when did you get this scumread

how did it transition

and grey why tf are you supporting this??

what wtf the fuck the fuck??¿??

dont care about woods alignment this is a bad wagon sorry

let's get falco

At the time I read this post, this reaction is more or less exactly mine.

It's hard for me this game because I was up to a pretty okay start, and then I sort of got consumed with apathy and it's making it difficult for me to play.

My thoughts:

1) Lighthaze: you seem extremely willing to jump back and forth between people and hammer basically anyone. I remember you asking if you could hammer multiple times. Why are you so eager to vote-hop rather than stick to a big scumread and push it?
2) Grey: Talk to me about your thoughts on lighthaze. Your read on him hopped so fast I'm having trouble keeping track.
3) Aj the Epic: There's probably at least one scum in Light/Woods/Falco, and I think the most likely is Woods. But I wanted to ask you why you had no response to people talking about post 427? Because I'd like to hear you talk about it.

Nice try on the bait Accountant. Unless you actually thought I was hammered

Nice try on the bait Accountant. Unless you actually thought I was hammered

???

I didn't get hammered. I don't know if you knew that but acted like i did get hammered to get my role out, or if you just genuinly thought I was hammered

the big issue i have with woods is that every bit of his attitude and mindset in terms of determining how he should act/react in situations seems to stem from a survivalist or caught-scum pov

If wood flips scum, then Aj's "this wagon is moving too fast" would ping me really hard.

VOTE: wood

Optimal play here is to let him sit at L-1 and gamesolve/hunt for his partner until deadline. Unfortunately these two days are not good for me in terms of schedules and business, but I'll do my best.

Caught scum self-hammers frequently. This is a textbook case of caught scum.

Yeah, why didn't Accountant consider that? That might be a great topic of conversation today.

Because I forgot about the possibility. That was my fault, and I admit it.

[Loopdan]

What does SvS mean again?

scum vs. scum

[Loopdan]

Spoiler: All day1 Loopdan & wood interactions, etc.

@Wood-- If you get an avatar it will be much easier to follow you.

VOTE: Accountant

{Light} - fulltown
{TesXX, Accountant} slight town
{grey, giggles, loop} null
{AJ} slight scum
{Falco} fullscum

Not that great at hunting, but those are my reads.

Sorry for my recent low activity. Just got caught up.

VOTE: Wood
Intent to hammer was opportunistic and disavowing responsibility.
His prior read on player he intended to hammer was null (139, 143)
Reads list was risk averse.
Like Grey said there is no game-solving (or even any genuine curiosity about the game-state) evident in wood's game.

I'm not convinced that woodboy's push on light makes him town. Even though light is townread by some, he's still low hanging fruit if you consider it's picking a fight with an inexperienced player. And I've been open that I'm not in agreement that light is obvtown.

Falco hasn't done enough at this point for me to have much confidence in a read on that slot. Given the wagon on him, it's probably the right time for Falco to post a full reads list.

I'm disappointed Accountant is a non-factor right now (yes I know the same can be said for me but at least my name has come up on the last five pages). I know we probably can't sort Accountant today, but I'd like more content from them to at least have something to look at day2.

UNVOTE:

Wait.. That wasn't hammer on me. Loop unvoted me. I am at L-1 now

hghg

ok with loop deciding

not ok with wood not reacting to the fake hammer

Ha! I doubled checked ad remembered loop's decision

Voting Falco after you yourself are put at L-1, Woodsy?

That's not obvious scum at aaaalllllllll

Yes I know it's not the best move in my situation. I was just simply in a state of shock and I just want to have loop decide between the two of us and not just only have one person at L-1

@mod: requesting VC

If Woodboy is really at L-1, I

intend to hammer.

Will respond for loop in a little. At school rn

@mod: requesting VC

If Woodboy is really at L-1, I

intend to hammer.

I have a post coming up after school. I would like to ask for you to not hammer that post is out

@Wood-- Claim your role now. You can write more details later. I won't hammer until you've had your say but I want a claim ASAP.

@Wood-- Claim your role now. You can write more details later. I won't hammer until you've had your say but I want a claim ASAP.

Claim OS BP

I don't really have a problem hammering this day1. I'm re-checking his iso just to be sure.

OK so on re-read it's even worse. I'm doubtful that 36 comes from a newbie with a PR role pm. There's some "scum caught for wrong reason" in 644. 722 & 727 is not a townie thought process.

If anybody has a reason why I shouldn't hammer right now, speak up, because my next post will contain a vote for woodboy.

Either Falco flips scum or there is scum in wood/AJ.

I was this || close to going back on my word and hammering woodboy in my last post.

lmaoooo

i usually only go on during fluff classes where the teacher doesnt care or during lunch
F
im a good egg

Now at lunch. But loopdan wanted a claim so I had to. I probably would've been lynched if I wasn't checking

i think the big takeaway (especially if we're right about wood/light) here is that reads suck

If it ends up being woodboy/light I'd say my reads have been pretty darn good.

[Loopdan]

@Accountant-- If you can't see how 635 makes me town then you might just be scum here.

why specifically accountant?

Accountant quoted part of it in 1183.

[Loopdan]

(expired on 2017-03-05 19:13:43)

Time's up.

VOTE: Accountant

[Loopdan]

I chose right!

I read and re-read everything I needed to make my decision. The vote was neither too early nor too late.

Tes, have you reviewed my spoilered posts above?

[Loopdan]

Yep, should've known it was Loopdan. Town has no reason to try to rush through LyLo like that, and I'm kicking myself for not seeing it earlier.

VOTE: Loopdan

Lol

Nothing was rushed. I worked through everything and you played along in non-committal ways thinking I was going to vote Tes.

[Loopdan]

@Tes-- What do you need from me?

[Loopdan]

I mean if you have questions about anything.

[Loopdan]

Basically you should be looking through the game and deciding who is more likely to be wood's partner.

[Loopdan]

Yes, and you aren't wood's partner either. If you read the end of day 1 you'll see I was gunning for a wood lynch and pushing it even when others jumped off the wagon. I even said I'd hammer wood after he claimed BP, and provided evidence that the BP claim was inconsistent with wood's early posts. While I was doing that Accountant was trying to line up a next day mislynch by saying if wood flipped scum then AJ was his buddy.

[Loopdan]

Tes, remember that time Accountant set-up woodboy to self-hammer and cut the day short?

VOTE: wood

Optimal play here is to let him sit at L-1 and gamesolve/hunt for his partner until deadline. Unfortunately these two days are not good for me in terms of schedules and business, but I'll do my best.

[Loopdan]

VOTE: wood

Optimal play here is to let him sit at L-1 and gamesolve/hunt for his partner until deadline. Unfortunately these two days are not good for me in terms of schedules and business, but I'll do my best.

No. Optimal play is to keep him off L-1 so he can't end the day early by self-hammering.

Caught scum self-hammers frequently. This is a textbook case of caught scum.

Yeah, why didn't Accountant consider that? That might be a great topic of conversation today.

Caught scum self-hammers frequently. This is a textbook case of caught scum.

Yeah, why didn't Accountant consider that? That might be a great topic of conversation today.

Because I forgot about the possibility. That was my fault, and I admit it.

Accountant did not forget about the possibility of scum self-hammering. Accountant is very experienced at mafia.

[Loopdan]

Here is proof from other Accountant games:

viewtopic.php?p=8669993#p8669993

Ps this is where "scum should self hammer and end discussion" comes up as a relevant point btw /IC hat

Unfortunately, ICs are not allowed to self vote as town. So I can't self vote! I agree that caught scum should definitely self hammer in this situation, and I have done something similar as well.

viewtopic.php?p=8335526#p8335526

@Maxx: Mafia might self hammer if they thought they would get lynched anyway and wanted to give town a last "fuck you" with their dying shot.

viewtopic.php?p=8195259#p8195259

Damn great game Accountant.

Told you that Genji self hammer was scary.

Actually I wanted him to self hammer to deny town time, I was perfectly fine with letting another player hammer too

There are more if you search Accoutant's posts for "self hammer."

[Loopdan]

Accountant's advice to scum-buddies in mafia private threads:

viewtopic.php?p=8146011#p8146011

Also if you hammer yourself it gives the other townies less chance to redeem themselves by hammering you

In other words I can go out there tmr and say our lynch pool is everyone who didn't vote genj and if you hammer yourself thst pool is bigger

viewtopic.php?p=7245270#p7245270

Forgot to add: remember to hammer yourself if you get to L-1 to cut short the day, and during the day give an intentionally bad post accusing me of being scum and hard defending Carcalilly.

[Loopdan]

It was a genuine lapse in memory - I'm an IC, but I don't always remember to factor in everything. If you really thought this was a scumslip, you'd have pushed it earlier - you're just bringing it up now in a last ditch attempt to make me look bad.

I did bring it up earlier. I'm the one that pointed it out when it happened and said it should be discussed.

This isn't a matter of not remembering "to factor in everything." You were proposing an "optimal strategy" of leaving confirmed scum at L-1 when you clearly know that is not optimal.

Optimal play here is to let him sit at L-1 and gamesolve/hunt for his partner until deadline.

[Loopdan]

I did bring it up, both when it happened and earlier Today (1163). I didn't push it hard when it happened because I believed the team was wood/light.

ICs aren't allowed to lie about optimal play. So it was a genuine mistake.

If there is anything in your mafia PT where you talk to wood about self-hammering then we will have words post-game.

[Loopdan]

@Tes-- I can point out some scummy associations between Accountant and woodboy, but honestly Accountant has played a pretty clean game. If the Accountant/Woodboy associations were really obvious I would have had a much easier time voting today (or even pushing Accountant instead of Light yesterday).

I think you are better off by trying to determine who between us is more likely town-motivated based on our play.

[Loopdan]

lol

[Loopdan]

Tes, please go re-read and ask questions. There's zero % chance Accountant falls for that kind of thing.

[Loopdan]

You kinda pitched a softball though. Like what if Accountant came in, realized it was a fake-hammer (and they would have) and then said oh noes town just lost! I'm not losing the game to a well-crafted reaction.

I want you to vote Accountant based on their play and my play this game.

[Loopdan]

@Tes-- Heads up, we have three days until deadline. If we no-lynch it's auto-lose.

[Loopdan]

@Loopdan do you have anything more to discuss?

Not really.

Except to clarify today's timer. I put a timer on it because nobody was talking. And I said I was probably going to vote you because I figured it would get you talking, and if Accountant was town they would engage and ask for reasons why I wanted to vote you. But Accountant is scum and didn't want to do anything to derail or slow down my vote on you.

[Loopdan]

You chose right Tes.

Town wins!

[Loopdan]

There was more I wanted to say about Accountant and myself that I thought might backfire if I tried to force it. I was really trying hard not to be too pushy and let you come to your own conclusion. Well done Tes.

[Loopdan]

gj town! I was pretty sure it was Accountant; the generally passive LYLO behavior seemed scummy, and then once it was a 1v1, you could really see Loopdan's WIM come out (plus, if Loop was scum, why didn't he just vote Tess and let Accountant be a +1, or for that matter just let Accountant go first)

I'm just glad I didn't screw up another lylo with scum Accountant!

What's WIM?

[Loopdan]

A couple more things to note:

When Tes fake voted Accountant I was worried that Accountant would show up and manipulate it for their benefit. But I was also worried that exposing it so that Accountant couldn't take advantage of it would look scummy.

Accountant did

not

talk to wood about self-hammering in the scum PT. Just thought that should be put here for posterity.

Thanks for modding Drixx.

GG all.

[Loopdan]

I was leaning toward loop being scum at the beginning of d4. It was not an easy decision.

I'm curious what made you change your mind.