Open 724 - Pick Your Power X/Y [Endgame]

[Eddie Cane]

ego

[Eddie Cane]

hey

[Eddie Cane]

never replaced into a scum slot, never going to

(except once. oops.)

[Eddie Cane]

sorry i'm reading the setup wiki etc because i'm a bit confused i'll get to the game later

[Eddie Cane]

(except once. oops.)

THIS ISN'T NOW RIGHT

ok good I was gonna verify that was a you thing

lol

it was some random normal on this site a long time ago i honestly don't even remember the game LOL i just remember i think i fucked up once

anyways i think i get the setup

so iconeum is conf!pr

the janitor and mathdino pick after saske but before beefster and taly

if there's a fruit vendor there can't be a neighbourizer

ya?

[Eddie Cane]

someone gimme an answer and i'll start setup breaking and catching up

[Eddie Cane]

okay i get it this seems like a really fun setup

[Eddie Cane]

page by page time

First round draft results:

1. Iconeum 1
   
2. the worst 3
   
3. Lalendra 5
   
4. Ircher 11
   
5. SaskeIsMyYaoiKismesis 413
   
6. Mathdino 2
   
7. The Janitor 2
   
8. Beefster 4
   
9. Taly 4
   
10. Almost50 8
    
11. mutantdevle 8
    
12. Ausuka 6
    
13. Lovebird 6
    
14. brassherald 6

Deadline to send in your role picks - (expired on 2018-05-03 17:00:00)

I agree with Mathdino's post below that scum didn't CC, so max of 1 scum in {Lovebird, Ausuka}, {Beef, Taly}, {Math, Jan}, {mutant, a50}. Its like night killing "for wifom!" - retarded and not something that ever happens in practice. Not a perfect example because there are niche situations where killing for wifom is optimal but never pregame anyways so irrelevant. Basically, yes. I understand setups a lot better than most people too. This seems quite townsided but a really cool design, I'd probably tweak a couple of things to help scum (limit cop, probably limit rolecop) but overall like a solid setup and I don't think its unplayable by any means. Surprised I've never played it, I've seen people talking about it before.

Btw, I asked a friend if I should pick 6 or 7. I thought 7, but she said 6. Annoying.

Out of game!

i picked 2 not because i actually wanted a power role but because i wanted to fuck over scum

i see that did not work unless janitor is scum

anyway, every game, someone asks "what if scum WIFOM'd the draft???"
and every game, it turns out that no, scum actually does want power roles, they did not WIFOM the draft and pick the same numbers
the only person in this game i think would do that is A50

so anyway

saske is town by the draft imo

scum possibilities:
Iconeum
Janitor
the worst
{Beefster, Taly}
Lalendra
{Ausuka, Lovebird, brass}
{Almost50, mutantdevle}
Ircher (going for that guaranteed PR)

wishful thinking says hitting scum in the bottom half of the bracket will confirm other townies
VOTE: Beefster

Edit: when i started typing this post i was the first one here
so jinx guys

I don't get why Saske is town off this. Wouldn't picking a high number guarantee to beat ties, aka more likely to get a PR?

lovebird is town

townbloc: {Mathdino, Lovebird, Saske}

idgi also

i picked 2 not because i actually wanted a power role but because i wanted to fuck over scum

i see that did not work unless janitor is scum

anyway, every game, someone asks "what if scum WIFOM'd the draft???"
and every game, it turns out that no, scum actually does want power roles, they did not WIFOM the draft and pick the same numbers
the only person in this game i think would do that is A50

so anyway

saske is town by the draft imo

scum possibilities:
Iconeum
Janitor
the worst
{Beefster, Taly}
Lalendra
{Ausuka, Lovebird, brass}
{Almost50, mutantdevle}
Ircher (going for that guaranteed PR)

wishful thinking says hitting scum in the bottom half of the bracket will confirm other townies
VOTE: Beefster

Edit: when i started typing this post i was the first one here
so jinx guys

I picked tracker and came back VT.

Is that what you're looking for?

VOTE: Mathdino
TBH, this looks like role fishing.

lol

I townread this

Cop OR 1-Shot Redirector: we hypoclaim cop targets tomorrow, remember to actually act like you have an inno

Also, redirector is a scum claim.

VOTE: Iconeum

1 is actually very scummy to pick for starters. I think scum are within the lowest picked #s (1,2,3,4,5) but no 2 scums would have picked the same #.

Agreed. The worst case with 1 is you nuke any townie who picked 1 and still go first out of the round 2s and the best case is guaranteed first choice (either Cop or RB/Doctor depending how you wanna play).

Masons and Monks: "OMGUS, but I don't care."
Stack the Deck: "Mathdino's posts strike me as IIOA mixed with lurkscum opportunism"

Pick Your Power X/Y: "TBH, this looks like role fishing." *claims*

yeah policy lynch this shit

just quoting this to say hahahahaha ikr "you rolefisher! i'm vt you aren't fishing a pr from me!!!"

[Eddie Cane]

Masons and Monks: "OMGUS, but I don't care."
Stack the Deck: "Mathdino's posts strike me as IIOA mixed with lurkscum opportunism"

Pick Your Power X/Y: "TBH, this looks like role fishing." *claims*

yeah policy lynch this shit

Ya think??

[v[Beefster[/v]

Let's see if it turns to be like Masons & Monks.

Disappointed in you and Mathdinkle though. Beef's post seems really genuine. Stupid as fucking hell, but genuine.

Konnichiwa minnasan! o((*^▽^*))o

VOTE: Almost50

I PERESONALLY believe that the Beefster wagon is SILLY on principle - scum would be FOOLISH to immediately claim that they picked a slot with a ROLEBLOCKING role in it considering how IMPROTANT that is to scum ( ⚆ _ ⚆ )

We shouldn't be POLICY lynching people UNTIL we have good reason to scumread them and as far as I am COGNIZANT we only possess reason to believe that Beefster is ALIGNED WITH the TOWN ヾ(｡･ω･)ｼ

goodpost

question

does mathdino know? yes or no. you'll know what i'm talking about.

Anyone feel like spoonfeeding me why any of the setup spec p1 makes sense?

nothing better to talk about. its like how in team mafia early game was spent discussing who would pick what. it leads into natural discussion.

In my history with Beefster I have seen

- town Beefster take the time to process Math's INTENSE LOGIC EXPLOSIONS and generally correctly conclude that he's coming from the right angle
- scum Beefster not take the time to process Math's INTENSE LOGIC EXPLOSIONS and suggest he's scum for them

Actual read progression/flip flopping in Earthbound is the only transgression I can think of

So my firsr impeession of Beef is lolscum, what makes you townread him?

oh so this is the policy math's talking about

can u link these games (specifically beefster's part)?

[Eddie Cane]

Scum rb overrated

Agreed. Lets the rolecop guilty you. If scum gets that slot taking Doc still confirms town doesn't have doc so they can just NK any PRs instead of RBing them (bar the watcher shot).

SIMYK can you familiarise yourself with Beefster's scum meta pls

specifically Masons & Monks, Stack the Deck, and Clownspiracy (in which he literally claimed scum in a neighbourhood)

I'll take links.

Ask Beefster himself, and I think he will tell you that he is bad at scum (he's learning the ways still though, so there's potential for him on the future).

But let's

assume (for the sake of argument)

that Beefster is town here. So? Why is a wagon on him bad? Wagons are good for getting reads, right?

You see, I don't mind your vote on me. What I do have a problem with is you throwing all your weight behind "Town!Beef" without even knowing the player that well. That feels a bit odd for my little brain to grasp.

He's probably the only player I have as town at this point, so the worst option for a wagon. That and Simyk a bit.

[Eddie Cane]

interestingly, FMPOV, while everyone would've had a 3/13 (or 23.1%) chance of being scum

due to the draft ruling out a bunch of scumteams, each of the singletons (this includes janitor FMPOV) actually has a 26.2% chance of being scum

the probability of someone in a duplet being scum is 21.9%

the probability of one of the triplets being scum is only 18.5%

scum is straight up more likely to be in the top half than the bottom half in this setup, and i'm guessing i can prove it using past results

so the risk early on is lynching potential PRs

Something I hadn't thought of, neat. Too lazy to adjust my numbers but yea its probably optimal to lynch a singleton.

i disagree with this, i think scum usually goes for 2 lower numbers and 1 larger one (to get a "guaranteed" singleton)

Wait.... what? Saske is lock town for picking a large number but scum picks a large number for a guaranteed singleton?

What's objectively bad about my posts ?

I don't think a mafia player should follow a set plan or scum/townhunt in a certain way... Maybe I play differently than you but if something bothers me, why wouldn't I question it?

I'm an alt yes

Of who?

You don't need to answer but I'm meta intensive and it makes my life easier :shrug:

hi, i'm town
VOTE: Beefster

AUSUKA-CHAN!!!!!!! ヾ(｡･ω･)ｼ

It has been a while since I last espied thou!

HOWEVER with that vote you arent realy convincing me of that (⊙△⊙✿)

hi!

the vote on beefster is because he's openly giving up his role for basically no reason while accusing math of rolefishing. doesn't seem like a real thought to me. "Hey, this person voted me based on draft analysis. They must be scum rolefishing me! Also, I'll claim, because that makes a lot of sense as a thing to do in this scenario."

On an unrelated note, I ?think? I know who janitor is.

what's the scum motivation to that? bad play is not interchangeable with scum play.

@Ausuka: i feel like i've seen that line before

@Iconeum: It doesn't make it easier for scum to get PRs if one scum picks 2 (and if another townie picks 2). I picked the number I most thought scum would pick.

@165: PRs are NAI in this setup. My scumdar/PRdar mixup doesn't count here. This is actually one of few setups where I actively PR hunt as town in order to gamebreak.

@A50: No, it's just that you've made just one townish post so far. I'm paranoid of everyone and then I start crossing names off lists (or gradually fade names off lists). You're also mathematically less likely to be scum so w/e.
But yeah I'm not particularly paranoid of scum-you. But you have been posting within your scum meta. Still early, things may change.

Iconeum seems townish enough I guess. I agree that it's self-resolving.

We should lynch the Janitor. The Janitor is likely the low-number scum.

I townread Iconeum off this page, I'm hesitant on mathdinkle but I'll town lean him for having almost identical reads to mine.

[Eddie Cane]

Yeah I need to comment on the rest but that particular thing bothered me and I told you I'd get to the rest whenever I'm on my laptop.

Feels interesting that Math wants to lynch me now since iirc right after my question. Why, Math? Can't I ask about it?

Bleh

In other words: Let's make it a personal thing. Got it.

That isn't a personal thing.

competitive

giggle snort

H-honto ni?? ( ꒪Д꒪)

I'd like to know the IDENTITY of this GUESS personally...

pedit: （ ಠωಠ）

Alisae? Is that you?

hahaha

snip

I don't like you pushing someone who seems pretty blatantly town. The rest of the post is pretty alright so shrug. I was told you're quite good as town, high expectations.

Mathdino's role speculation always throws me for a loop. I should know by now that it's NAI.

the worst is being goofy. He's a lot more serious as scum. Town

Janitor/Saske are a possible scum team IMO

VOTE: The Janitor

Meh post. But good segway for me to say the worst is a town lean too. What associations are there between the two?

Page 10: townread of Mutant. I've metadived him recently anyways and this feels like his town game, plus generally good content.

[Eddie Cane]

seriously

what has mutant done that's particularly townish

a page long entrance of meh to good stuff with good reads and a good vote

:thonkang:

Ok, ausuka is scum. Maybe ico too. Think janitor is town

This isn't how you played before.

Why is Ausuka scum? And Ico? And you townread a scummy slot. Hng. Fos Lovebird.

Almost50 (3) - SaskeIsMyYaoiKismesis, brassherald

@Mod: I know SaskeIsMyYaoiKismesis looks like half the player list in one word, but they still count as one vote.

Oops! fixed.

lol

Town: Lovebird, TW

Probtown: Beefster, SIMYK

Unlikely scum by draft: Ausuka, brassherald, Taly
Unlikely scum in general: Iconeum

To sort: Ircher, Lalendra

Probscum: Janitor, one of {A50, mutant}

Why one of A50 Mutant specifically rather than the pairs as a whole?

Probscum: Janitor, one of {

A50, mutant

}

Ser-bloody-iously!! And I guess Jay was town in Masons and Monks too!

...what?

your scumgame is not exclusively "i have a plan for how to deal with every player"

i don't know what you're asking me to see

Fine. You do you and I'll do me, then.

Just ftr, I won't vote outside Iconeum/The Janitor until they both flip.

Seriously?

also why no interest in the 4s and 5s?

That would be because you're not reading what I'm typing, perhaps?

But I don't know the answer either, and I'm reading from the beginnig so the thread is fresh in my mind.

[Eddie Cane]

that is SOME SERIOUSLY SUPER thinking SASKE ヾ(〃^∇^)ﾉ

I want to lynch mutant a liiiittle bit

Again, why?

i'm not invested enough in no longer threatening him with a policy lynch

to actually defend the fact that i'm slightly townreading him

I could use an explanation please. Helps me sort you, not Beef.

-
I townread Ircher so far, so

I townread Saske for their reads, not the draft. I feel that picking a high number helps ensure you don’t conflict with someone else, so I wouldn’t rule out Saske scum.

"I townread SIMYK but their draft number would be pro-scum"

nothing means anything, gg

...oh wait never mind you CAN game this setup and it's been done in the past

How do you know SIMYK is an alt when they keep denying it?

because everyone knows they're an alt? do you think secret alts all go and admit that they're alts?

why do you care?

scum is {Janitor, Ircher, {mutant, A50}}

The fuck Mathdinkle?

oops sorry missed the dayvig button

VOTE: Ircher

The fuck duckhead?

346 is meh

Yeah, stop with all the setup speccing please.

This triggers me so much.

Eh. Ircher dropped off for me a fair bit after his next string of posts, but I still think its VI more than scum.

Observation: Math seems a little more aggressive than usual?

This seems pretty much like Math's town meta to me.

Where do you see him being more aggressive?

I was about to ask you for his scum meta differences and I realized I'm you. Lol.

-

My predecessor is hilariously town lol if I see any votes on him I'm probably fosing them

Page 17. Skimmed a fair bit of this. I think Ausuka and Ircher has a scum probably, definitely not SvS though.

[Eddie Cane]

because it's lazy and seems to be intended to enhance an ongoing conflict between me/ircher

no analysis or nuance behind it

like yeah i make "one of {x, y} are scum" posts but my example in this game is based on "A50 is playing to his scum meta, is unlikely scum with mutant, and mutant hasn't towntold yet which has a lot of scum equity for him"

mutant's post doesn't really make sense

Don't like this angleshoot.

However...

Ircher's sliding a lot as of page 18.

The Janitor (5) - Mathdino, Almost50, Iconeum, Beefster, mutantdevle

in that case, going from what i know of something_smart's lynchbait tendencies

(even if it's not S_S i think we can apply similar meta of "how people treat behaviour like that")

if janitor is town, i think there's guaranteed scum on this wagon.

The whole wagon is you, 3 of my townreads, and A50...

The Janitor (5) - Mathdino,

.+:｡Almost50｡:+.

, Iconeum, Beefster, mutantdevle

Hmm, it appears that will be a DIFFICULT task to ACCOMPLISH, if ONLY we had some insight that LEAD us to the CORRECT direction (ʃ⌣́,⌣́ƪ)

lol.

Aren't you supposed to be able to read A50 as we saw in TM? What is his slot here? Solves a lot of stuff. Also, why is there guaranteed scum on the wagon? Past the mathematical likelyhood idgi.

FWIW i agree that A50 is much more likely scum than not here

but i will always disagree with lynching A50 on D1

if we're both town we'll figure it out (and one of us probably gets NK'd lol)

wat

I am more conservative about giving super confident reads.

Didn't you give way more reads in 1900? I'll need to pull that up I think. viewtopic.php?t=71319&f=53&st=0&sk=t&sd ... er_sort=Go
Actually no you didn't, viewtopic.php?p=9069739#p9069739 however... your iso there is still way townier for the completely seperate reason that you're actually solving. lol. Also, where's stuff like viewtopic.php?p=9071168#p9071168 here? That's the equivalent of a reads list with "confident" reads.

i have this strange voice in my head saying it's a50.......

Alright then. Let's ruin this game because I'm playing with a bunch of nutters.

I DID NOT LAND MY PICK

. I went for Neighborizer.

I don't think Scum!Dino would go for that over most any other combination (Vengeful is a powerful tool for scum. RB and/or JK, or maybe RB+Tracker/Role Cop.. etc).

So, someone is a Neighborizer or a Fruit Vendor.

And I was just trying the

bloody infamous A50 gambit

, so

that

is why I'm being iiretated by being overly SR, and especially so by the

MATHDINO

<< i.e. The one person in this game that knows exactly what I'm talking about AND should very well have seen it coming from a mile away.

Are you all happy now?

I don't get it. What gambit were you doing and how was this supposed to help twn.......?

Dino can tell you I actually self-hammered on D1 as Town (I think mutant was in that game too? You were on the scum team, mutant. Right?)

Don't fucking brag about gamethrowing.

-

Is this page of AtE town from A50 people who know him?

[Eddie Cane]

Bored of posting so just gonna keep reading.

[Eddie Cane]

I just don't like to stall the game out pressuring a lurker
I could end the day lynching lalendra, sure, but it feels like there's more that could be done

A50 slot is town btw

Edit: I'm not making a point, I'm presenting IIOA

Level of confidence?

[Eddie Cane]

Sadly there isn't enough Beef content to have much of a strong read but current feel is that slot might be town

I'm waffling. How much does he dislike scum if you know or can find a quote of him talking about it?

[Eddie Cane]

Iso'd mutantdevle. Overuse of setup spec discussison can lead to telling scum what they need to fakeclaim or who they need to kill.
I will argue against misinformation and misuse of basically correct spec if I see it but otherwise would prefer to leave enough intact to solve later.

Hmm I read this as a scumread.
That's one point off dave but *shrug*

That was gently yelling at mutantdevle to lay off the heavy setup stuff.

Eddie, same goes for you, it's good for you to figure out things for yourself but bad to help scum figure out who has which pr.

Anything I'm speccing has nothing to do with my role PM and is therefore info scum likely has already. 3 heads are smarter than 1.

[Eddie Cane]

people don't seem to realise that scum has 3 times the brain trust that any individual townie has when it comes to figuring out the setup

it's not like saying factually true things (like oh i guess we have a tracker/jailkeeper above beefster) makes scum think OH SHIT I HADNT THOUGHT OF THAT or THANKS FOR DOING THE WORK FOR US MATHDINO/EDDIE CANE/MUTANT

like, if we didn't do it, 1 scum would take a minute out of their time to do it themselves. there's probably a bookkeeper in the PT keeping track of all that unless scum is totally incompetent

so while claiming is shit, setup spec is pro-town
it takes the info that the few likely already have and disseminates it to the many

ye

[Eddie Cane]

{Eddie}
{Simyk}
{Mutant}
{The Worst, Iconeum}
confident above^ are all town, leaving a PoE of {Mathdino, Ausuka, Davesaz, Lalendra, Myloninja13, The Janitor, Lovebird, Taly, Ircher}

Isn't Taly supposed to be a great player? I think she had 2 posts lmao. I have no clue what to do with mathdinkle I flip flopped a lot on reading him. I'll go townie side. Ausuka meh scummy. Dave slot meh scummy. Mylo meh townie. Janitor scummy. Lovebird scummy. Ircher scummy.

[Eddie Cane]

I'm more interested in questions that lead toward an actionable plan than questions that sort me by dredging up things from 20 pages ago. When you're caught up list all the questions that you're still interested in me answering.

I wouldn't have asked them if I didn't want answers. Short ones are fine (ie a sentence).

[Eddie Cane]

Never mind, Taly goes with Worst and Iconeum. Townie as fuck.

[Eddie Cane]

can i get you to work for it

what work?

[Eddie Cane]

Wait.... what? Saske is lock town for picking a large number but scum picks a large number for a guaranteed singleton?

does mathdino know? yes or no. you'll know what i'm talking about.

I could use an explanation please. Helps me sort you, not Beef.

Aren't you supposed to be able to read A50 as we saw in TM? What is his slot here? Solves a lot of stuff. Also, why is there guaranteed scum on the wagon? Past the mathematical likelyhood idgi.

Level of confidence?

[Eddie Cane]

{Eddie}
{Simyk}
{Mutant}
{The Worst, Iconeum}
confident above^ are all town, leaving a PoE of {Mathdino, Ausuka, Davesaz, Lalendra, Myloninja13, The Janitor, Lovebird, Taly, Ircher}

Does anybody disagree with this?

[Eddie Cane]

Sadly there isn't enough Beef content to have much of a strong read but current feel is that slot might be town

I'm waffling. How much does he dislike scum if you know or can find a quote of him talking about it?

Lemme check GTKAS. We havent actually spoken about preferred alignment but I actually think his town game has a bit of potential, scum game needs more work

pedit: yes I am Eddietier town

Psychologically speaking people are more likely to flake when scum if they hate scum, etc. I was really excited to play with Beef too

But I'm okay with it being his towngame I still townread his entrance lmao

pedit: cool. don't know what that talk about him hating scum i remember reading was, but he can be town then.

[Eddie Cane]

VC 1.12

With 14 alive, it takes 8 to lynch

Lalendra (5) -

the worst, Taly, Ircher, SaskeIsMyYaoiKismesis, Ausuka

Ircher (2) -

Mathdino, mutantdevle

Ausuka (2) -

Lovebird, Eddie Cane

The Janitor (1) -

Iconeum

Iconeum (1) -

davesaz

Not voting

- Lalendra, The Janitor, Myloninja13

Day 1 ends in (expired on 2018-05-15 20:00:00)

Why is Lalendra the big wagon? I don't remember them giving much of any impression.

VOTE: Ircher

[Eddie Cane]

I did before posting that, there's 7 posts and I don't see anything overly AI. That could mean something in itself, is this a pressure wagon?

[Eddie Cane]

ah dat cool

what reactions?

[Eddie Cane]

1. scum almost always coordinates the numbers they send in. i find it unlikely someone would assign SIMYK to pick 413.

I dont get it

[Eddie Cane]

2. are you asking if i know who SIMYK is? cuz i've said i do a bunch of times

I was, I wasnt aware of that the time but now yea. Should've filtered that out sorry.

[Eddie Cane]

2 in particular from memory but one more than the other
Did any irk you?

I wasnt looking for them so no.

[Eddie Cane]

4. you saw me tunnel A50 for half the day in TM followed by eventually townreading him. i always leave A50 alive for a day so i can sort him. if i have no reasons to townread him by the end of D1, he's scum.
in this case, yeah he's town.
if janitor is town that messes with a lot of the PoE i have going on. janitor is the kind of player that tends to draw scum votes (specifically relating him to something_smart).
regardless, that's kind of an outdated read. if you're totally sure on mutant, the scum onwagon if janitor is town is probably iconeum.

Yes, this is blatantly town Mutant. I still think Iconeums town though so either its an all town wagon or hes xcum (much more likely)

[Eddie Cane]

mr cane i feel bamboozled

you spent a bunch of posts talking about how you don't like my feather-soft defence of lalendra (which basically consists of "i don't like wagoning lurkers, we have scumreads available, lalendra is basically null")

and now you're arguing the same thing i did

I dont rhink I spend a bunch of quotes doing that or even once mentioned Lalendra in my catchup?

[Eddie Cane]

I wouldn't nuke the worst but with mathdino recent posting I could amend dave town maybe. Not a big deal to me anyways daves a readable player so itll come out.

[Eddie Cane]

I dont understand your list

[Eddie Cane]

okay I'll vig ausuka if I'm vig

ircher is a better lynch than lalendra

[Eddie Cane]

oh ya if irchers scum and the lynch we dont vig ausuka

[Eddie Cane]

oops meant for mathdino but I see the confusion

[Eddie Cane]

are you caught up lovebird?
mathdino, have you rolled scum with a50 before?

[Eddie Cane]

can u un stop?

[Eddie Cane]

well

I think regardless of your alignment a50 slot is town because I dont rhink that's how youd interact as svs

but regardless I townread you atp so it's not really relevant I trust your read there

[Eddie Cane]

{Mathdino, Ausuka, Lalendra, Myloninja13, The Janitor, Lovebird, Ircher}

3 scum in here. Mathdino is probably not one of them.

[Eddie Cane]

Yes, your starting posts weren't bad and are about as awkward as I'd expect from you.

Ausukas push on you doesnt feel like buddies. You're both individually scummy slots. You're scummier. Not sure what needs an explanation there.

Where did I say something was wrong with the wagon?

[Eddie Cane]

nah saskes a good player that's just their way of saying they fos Dave, they wouldn't do an anti town hero vig

[Eddie Cane]

I mean, you questioned why the wagon was so big...

Pedit: ??? (Although, doesn't the draft already tell you such with a high degree of confidence?)

Pedit2: No comment.

I asked why it was the wagon because it was the only big wagon and I had no clue why it happened...

[Eddie Cane]

probably janitor I guess even though in my last game we mislynched prs twice and still won . Is it optimal to get claims in this setup?

[Eddie Cane]

{Mathdino, Ausuka, Lalendra, Myloninja13, The Janitor, Lovebird, Ircher}

notable that ausuka and lovebird cannot be scum together

removing myself from this list that creates

scum in {Ausuka/Lovebird, Lalendra, Myloninja, Janitor, Ircher}

only 5 slots for scum feels wrong

these are ally uncharismatic lurky lynchbaity players

who's deepwolfing

I usually get 2 scum in these PoE pools and the other rbecomes obvious through associations. Ausuka and Ircher also cant ve xcum together idt. I dont rhink any of them besides Lalendra and Mylo are lurkers though, the janitor ircher ausuka and kind of lovebird were pretty consistently arounc

[Eddie Cane]

I mean like

do you disagree with any of my townreads?

[Eddie Cane]

I also didnt notice that one FTR. Dave probably did though with his age, education, and experience.

[Eddie Cane]

This isn't how you played before.

Why is Ausuka scum? And Ico? And you townread a scummy slot. Hng. Fos Lovebird.

Played before when?

Boon game.

[Eddie Cane]

Taly is one of the most obnoxious people ive seen lmao what the fuck

It's like that kid who tells the teacher you came in 30 seconds late or rattles on you for shoving Jimmy

[Eddie Cane]

This isn't how you played before.

Why is Ausuka scum? And Ico? And you townread a scummy slot. Hng. Fos Lovebird.

Played before when?

Boon game.

Oh yeah. Idk what difference you see. My games are too much reading now, though.

You were a much more relevant presence there from memory. You also correctly sorted my slot and generally gave me the impression you're a decent player. Here you have done jack ehit and your reads are almost backwards from mine.

Also yes, taly, you're scumreading playstyle.

[Eddie Cane]

Scum
Lovebird - Slight Scumread - Literally posts "this is town" and "this is scum" without giving reasons and then disappears. Unhelpful, and I question how genuine their reads are.

Lol.

Yeah responses like these aren't changing my mind in the slighest.

You really think those things you said had to do with if I'm scum?

Yeah I do, you're making definitive statements without going in full depth about your reasons or questions, and your responses thus far have been vague.

Your posts serve to generate a dichotomy or a discredit because you've also kept your vote on

Ausuka

since 273 without going into depth on why she's scum to you. I'd like you to elaborate on your thoughts in full.

Taly is one of the most obnoxious people ive seen lmao what the fuck

It's like that kid who tells the teacher you came in 30 seconds late or rattles on you for shoving Jimmy

Respond to my question on your

Janitor, Lovebird, Dave and Ircher

reads and maybe I'll entertain you.

Hmm.. Dunno, try reading my catchup? I talked about my reads on all of these except Dave who is a townread via Mathdinkle. Dont ask me stupid shit.

[Eddie Cane]

This isn't how you played before.

Why is Ausuka scum? And Ico? And you townread a scummy slot. Hng. Fos Lovebird.

Played before when?

Boon game.

Oh yeah. Idk what difference you see. My games are too much reading now, though.

You were a much more relevant presence there from memory. You also correctly sorted my slot and generally gave me the impression you're a decent player. Here you have done jack ehit and your reads are almost backwards from mine.

Also yes, taly, you're scumreading playstyle.

This game is faster. Or maybe I just have less time.

Maybe you're scum. Or maybe I'm just dense.

I'll look back on that game when I'm on a computer and get back to you.

[Eddie Cane]

nitpicking kverprivelegaed generally annoying to talk to or coexist with

I gave an analogy because I dont wnat to be toxic

[Eddie Cane]

yes the random caps and bold are annoying

but actually simyk is the one who told me taly is a really good player, so maybe we should look at her reads. What's wrong with Mutant? Ircher has 4 or 5 votes now including from some of your townreads (Mathdino particularly). Uou pointed nothing scummy out other than that. Also, trust me, I know Simyk very well and they're town. One of the people I can easiest read on site.

[Eddie Cane]

nitpicking kverprivelegaed generally annoying to talk to or coexist with

I gave an analogy because I dont wnat to be toxic

How do you deduce percentages of someone being scum FROM RANDOMIZED NUMBERS?

i just wanna quote/pagebottom this for emphasis on hilarity:

taly seems to think that the draft numbers are randomized

Yeah, I put up content

SOLELY

to get shit on.

OKAY your posts are

good

I'm

SORRY

[Eddie Cane]

The answer to 917 is no by the way.

[Eddie Cane]

But

Mutant

is

posting more than about Ircher

?

Explain my other reads in depth?

WHO

do you know that explains every read they give in depth? If a

townread

of mine gets

wagoned

I'll

defend

them. If I get confident in a

SCUMREAD

of mine I'll push them. I'm not writing a

fucking analysis

for why random people are town in a game I just spent

hours

reading today and I think its

ridiculous!!!

you need that. My pPROGRESSION is easy to

follow

because of how I chose to

catch

up, and I did it that way specifically because I don't want to

wallpost

itg.

Dave

is town because

Mathdinkle

. That is the only thing that's CHANGEDfrom my

CATCHUP

. If you aren't going to go back and

read!!!

, I'm not going to waste my time with

shit

town.

[Eddie Cane]

How confident are you in town!Janitor, Simyk?

[Eddie Cane]

i expected you to laugh at 931 mathdinkle

[Eddie Cane]

I would say he feels like the TOWN lynchbait here, he just seems like he's GENUINELY slow to form reads. His later catchups have been a lot better in showing his thought process in my opinion and I think he should STOP spoilering his posts, people intrinsically skip over posts like that and it does NOT help his case ੧(❛▿❛✿)

Perehaps I will explain better after I finish my post to Taly~!

can you quote some of the better stuff from him? I''m gonna go look over his iso again, i can't remember anything i liked from my catchup though and it seemed every time i thought something he posted the opposite. generally bleh. I want to know his alt because he looks familiar but whatever.

[Eddie Cane]

I mean how much of a dick move would it be if I tried to reveal lol

If people tell me who they're an alt of and ask, I keep it secret. If they don't I'm open with my guesses. That's my mindset.

[Eddie Cane]

Ignoring reads we never lynch Iconeum, Worst, or Lalendra d1. Correct. I townread the first two regardless.

[Eddie Cane]

Taly and Eddie-kun need to MAKE UP STILL

He has

anger

issues apparently but I'm

happy

[Eddie Cane]

Lovebird is gettin shady I'm probably w you SIMYK. Last few posts feel intentionally slippery and hard to read into, for Lovebird.

Explain?

Your last few posts have felt less easy to read.
Like you're trying to be slipperier.
This feels unlike my experiences with you >:

This isn't how you played before.

but idk what slipperier means either lol

gn

[Eddie Cane]

VOTE: Janitor

[Eddie Cane]

well that lasted long

[Eddie Cane]

VOTE: Ircher
back to l1 you go

[Eddie Cane]

No, that wasn't hammer.

should've waited. better for reactions.

[Eddie Cane]

it's a policy eat policy world

[Eddie Cane]

Oh, and Eddie waiting until immediately after to vote, like...? Couldn't you've voted me way earlier? (Like before I self-voted?) What made you suddenly decide to vote me?

Disgusting self vote

[Eddie Cane]

followed about this length of time later with a vote on someone else

[Eddie Cane]

huh?

[Eddie Cane]

about par for the course

[Eddie Cane]

That was L-2, and it was an obvious parody of one of Ausuka's earlier posts.

have you even been reading my posts

i'm getting vigged anyway and once I get vigged nobody will care about my reads so i'm not inclined to spend a lot of time and effort detailing them

You still felt your vote on me was worthwhile even after this? I mean, if you have other reasons, then that's fine, but then that raises the question as to why you waited until the self-vote biz was finished and done to vote me.

I dont understand why it's related ? I voted after because I didnt feel like lolhammering.

[Eddie Cane]

I havent been on all day besides random 10 second phone checks I was teaching for 8 hours and serving for 5 lol

[Eddie Cane]

VOTE: Janitor

gonna do this tomorrow sry

[Eddie Cane]

ayo

[Eddie Cane]

I want to hear why Ircher is a more worthy lynch than Lalendra, he's been more active and provided a lot of content.

Tbh I town lean Ircher atp. I so so badly want to lynch him on principle but unfortunately I'm too competitive for that

Okay, the Lalendra and Lovebird wagons need to consolidate into one wagon... I don't care if it is Lalendra or Lovebird that much, but I think I prefer the Lalendra wagon better tbh.

...why?

I honestly don't believe this.

I was too fwiw.

don't really like 931 either.

don't really like you but this is mafia not happily ever after... but,

I think ircher is probs town
Discuss???

VOTE: lalendra

yea, agreed. Pretty okay reads list. Good conclusion cause I wrote the above before reading your post.

Caught up to end of 41. Taly looks town. Long name with lots of complicated ascii art and random words in CAPS looks town.

Lmao

Kinda eddie I think?

I am desperate to see the Lalen flip like. My sanity this game is starting to hinge on it

excuse me?

Caught up, don't know how much I'll remember tomorrow after the cold meds wear off.
I have not had enough time to devote to actual reads other than the gut towns.
I'll place my vote where it seems to be useful for generating material to read from.
VOTE: The Janitor

How can you be caught up but not have reads/opinions? This post is the weakes excuse ever to sheep somewhere and appear active.

FOS davesav

hahaa newbie surface level reads are the best

Haha, I REALLY don't know where I quoted that from... I was only reading the last 3 pages so I wasn't even near that timestamp... Ignore it completely plz. Lovebird went south after that, so I don't mind the tr at that point.

So eh, wanna hop on the Lovebird wagon? I hear it's awesome this time of year

can relate

I finially caught up and I think I've got some basic townreads here?

I think The Worst, Math and A50/dave are all town, and I town lean Saske and Eddie. They've all made good contributions to the game.

I don't know if the good contributions applies to a50 slot but yea its a townie slot.

Thats... Not great reasoning but you picked a good set of people!!

this haha

also the current gamestate bores me

which is sad because this is gonna be the only game i'm in for a while

welcome to playing mafia on a site with retardedly long deadlines and a stupid playerbase that doesn't understand hammering someone after a couple days is better for town in the long run

I'm liking the janitor more now.

Can't relate. why?

[Eddie Cane]

there's a lot of shit town slots tbh

not too many overtly scummy ones

feels too easy

:/

[Eddie Cane]

haha

[Eddie Cane]

best scum role is role cop

[Eddie Cane]

Still waiting for the reasons behind this.

Well you see, I had a long day and I was tired so I wanted to sleep. It might be hard to understand this as a robot, but for us humans sleep is a naturally recurring state of mind and body, characterized by altered consciousness, relatively inhibited sensory activity, inhibition of nearly all voluntary muscles, and reduced interactions with surroundings.

[Eddie Cane]

Mutant, what are your confident reads rn?

[Eddie Cane]

I want to lynch Janitor or Lovebird today.

[Eddie Cane]

Why do you townread Dave?

[Eddie Cane]

Math's good as town. He's slightly worse but pretty good as scum.

[Eddie Cane]

worst is janitor or lovebird a better lynch

[Eddie Cane]

I dont gwt how lalendra could be anything worse than nullscum

[Eddie Cane]

The fact she is actively trying to play a nullgame has me really wound up

but she hasn't even finished catching up. I think you're scumreaidng her playstyle and if she's scum that'll be by luck.

[Eddie Cane]

that's not a point??

[Eddie Cane]

its a conclusion but semantics w.e okay

[Eddie Cane]

sorry I'm stressed
where do u rate janitor and lovebird saske uchih

[Eddie Cane]

The fact she is actively trying to play a nullgame has me really wound up

but she hasn't even finished catching up. I think you're scumreaidng her playstyle and if she's scum that'll be by luck.

She's still catching up? Lol

that's what I got from her posts

[Eddie Cane]

VOTE: Lovebird

[Eddie Cane]

The fact she is actively trying to play a nullgame has me really wound up

but she hasn't even finished catching up. I think you're scumreaidng her playstyle and if she's scum that'll be by luck.

She's still catching up? Lol

that's what I got from her posts

She replied to like 1200 or so from MD shes just ignoring everything important

fair enough. I'll vote her if it doenst improve past null, theres a lot of townie people anyways.

[Eddie Cane]

I'm going to do a tryhard post later.

Can everyone please post their confident reads in either direction? I dont need explanations

[Eddie Cane]

mumble?

[Eddie Cane]

jack be numble

[Eddie Cane]

answer my question please lovebird and dave

[Eddie Cane]

Still need answers from: Lovebird, Mathdino, Saske, Ausuka, Myloninja, Janitor, Iconeum, Taly, Ircher

from memory

[Eddie Cane]

Still need answers from: Lovebird, Mathdino, Ausuka, Myloninja, Janitor, Iconeum, Taly, from memory

Never mind, have Saske and Ircher.

[Eddie Cane]

(Not addressed to me, but...) I personally think at this point that Lalendra is a better lynch compared to Lovebird.:

Fair enough but so does The Worst, the point of the question was basically implying those are who I'm considering lynching which do you think is better. I'll need to properly look at Lalendra's recent when I am not on a 15 minute recess.

[Eddie Cane]

lalendra, do you think theres any major differences in your alignments?

[Eddie Cane]

Still need answers from: Lovebird, Mathdino, Ausuka, Myloninja, Janitor, Iconeum, Taly, from memory

Never mind, have Saske and Ircher.

[Eddie Cane]

lalendra, do you think theres any major differences in your alignments?

Whose alignments?

your town and scum game

[Eddie Cane]

Still need answers from: Lovebird, Mathdino, Ausuka, Myloninja, Janitor, Iconeum, Taly, from memory

Never mind, have Saske and Ircher.

still need mathdino, ausuka, mylo, ico

I'll post later regardless but it won't work properly if everyone doesnt participate

also, this is getting apathetic we need a lunch soon.

[Eddie Cane]

vote someone who is more likely to be scum?

I guess. Voting lalendra doesn't feel good. People sure she's not just lynchbaity?

I think I and we have been very clear she is lynchbaity. Lol.

[Eddie Cane]

Yeah, I don't see how you came to that conclusion when you saw Ausuka explaining herself... What does "scummy way of talking" mean? If you're referring to syntax then there's no way that is AI.

Totally wrong

Some people are just awkward as scum. Can't deal with being informed. Idk how you could even disagree with that.

This is true.

[Eddie Cane]

she's definitely just lynchbaity

ircher your defence is terrible because policy lynches are good and intimidate scum into not doing openly anti-town things

Also true. More people need to policy lynch. And quick lynch.

[Eddie Cane]

Only taking out eddie and mutant because I think ausuka is scum.

I don't get the correlation?

[Eddie Cane]

I guess eddie can't be scum if ausuka is scum.

Same as above.

[Eddie Cane]

lovebird i REMEMBER you answering my question but i've read the last 5 pages and your iso like 5 times and can't find it

what are your confident reads?

[Eddie Cane]

Mylo, Lovebird, and Iconeum are the last ones. Going to just try and extract the info from their ISOs though it may be a bit outdated its better than nothing.

[Eddie Cane]

I have no idea what Iconeum is confident in. That's not a good thing.

[Eddie Cane]

EVERYTHING in this post in meant to be read by EVERYONE.

wow. its almost like we are playing a group game.

-

I read half-most of the post. Honestly Taly, I would recommend you go back into your games and check how accurate your reads are because to me it looks like you're the type of super logical player that will never be anything above meh because every one of your 50 microanalyses is surface level. I'm VI reading you tbqh. Your scumreads aren't awful, but I don't really care for your stuff in general.

[Eddie Cane]

You and ausuka both picked six. So, don't townread you, but if ausuka is scum then you'd be town. Think mutant is scum if you're scum, if you're town then your read probably right on him

forgot, mb. not being in early game makes it really confusing. makes sense. is mutant because i meta hard town them then?

Math town. Dave town. Ausuka scum.

roger. prodging my post till tomorrow.

uh

please don't expect AMAZING things

but its a logic solve i've been wanting to try for a while and this is a good group of players to use as a testing ground

[Eddie Cane]

i somehow missed the second sentence of your post and didnt see the mutant part LOL im way too tired gn

[Eddie Cane]

me?

[Eddie Cane]

scum love their vanity wagons

[Eddie Cane]

I just spent about 2 hours on a post and my internet went out and killed it so I'm about done with this game rn

[Eddie Cane]

the basic jist is

i'm doing wholistic solving

using other people's reads to try and gather real AI info that's factual and not whimsical

its really time consuming though and i am not spending another hour doing busy work so i'm just going to post the last saved draft (from an hour and a half ago) and work off that later. warning: said draft has no actual info from it, i wasn't even done with the busy work never mind the solving..... (

[Eddie Cane]

no solving in here yet

Spoiler:

SaskeIsMyYaoiKismesis
Ausuka
davesaz
Eddie Cane
Myloninja13
Taly
?? Ircher

Lovebird
Lalendra

ヽ(〃･ω･)ﾉ TOWN ヾ(･ω･｡)ｼ
Ahiru-tan
Eddie-kun
Math-sensei
Taly
Ausuka-chan

( ≧Д≦) SCUM (≧Д≦ )
Lovebird
Ircher
davesaz

Town reads on Ircher and Taly.
Weak town lean on Beefster.
Wanna look closely at people on Ircher wagon.
The Janitor possible scum.

Long name with lots of complicated ascii art and random words in CAPS looks town

Current readslist, since multiple people have asked:

Town:
Mathdino - His play is a little different than what I am used to here, but I think it's largely due to him not being super confident on who's scum. Usually he picks someone and runs them over like a truck, and while he's not doing that here, it still strikes me as town!Math.
Mutantdevle - Feeling pretty confident in town!Mutant here, largely because I agree with his reasoning and like the way he is presenting his thoughts. Seems like he's actively trying to gamesolve.
Simyk - I don't have any meta experience with Simyk, but they seem invested in gamesolving, are trying to advance the gamestate, and their tone is very towny.

Townlean:
davesaz - I wasn't sure how I felt about A50 but davesaz has moved this slot from null to townlean for me. Not as confident as I am with the townbloc above, but good vibes.
Eddie Cane - Again, not confident enough to say town for certain, but good vibes.
Myloninja13 - There really hasn't been enough from this slot to say for certain, but I'm feeling town.
Iconeum - I like what I've seen from them but need to see more active participation.
Taly - This seems like town!Taly from my meta experience.

Null:
the worst - Honestly not sure about this slot, I want to say town but feel like I can't make an unbiased opinion. Their tunneling of me could be town-motivated but I'm not crazy about the reasoning behind it; then again, I could just be mad they're tunneling me. I can't be impartial enough to figure it out yet.
The Janitor - I don't hate their posting but I'm having trouble determining whether it's a playstyle thing or actual scumminess.
Lovebird - I can't make sense of this slot either way.

Scumlean:
Ausuka - Nothing I've seen from Ausuka has struck me as particularly towny, especially the waffling/soft defense of Ircher and the defensiveness in their tone.

Scum:
Ircher - For the reasons I outlined in my last few posts.

This is only a vague list of my more solid townreads and scumreads.

Everything

NOT

in here is either some form of conflicted, null, or read I'm working to sort.

Town - Top To Bottom In Confidence

Mathdino
SIMYK
Ausuka
Ircher
Eddie
Janitor
TW (Still Relatively Confident Even At Bottom)

Scum - Bottom To Top In Confidence

Lalendra (Most Fragile)
Lovebird

high town: Taly, SIMYK, TW

likely town: Eddie Cane, davesaz, mutant (sheeping)

nulltown: Myloninja, Lovebird, Ircher

everyone else: Ausuka, Iconeum, Lalendra, Janitor

Town:
davesaz
Eddie Cane
SaskeIsMyYaoiKismesis


Town lean:
Iconeum
the worst


Null:
Lalendra
Myloninja13
Lovebird
Taly


Scum Lean:
Mathdino
Ausuka
The Janitor
Ircher

SaskeIsMyYaoiKismesis (+72%) - Really like this slot's contributions in general. (I mean, I could probably point out some specifics, but is that really necessary?)
The Worst (+61%) - I didn't like this slot's contributions too much early on, but I am starting to lean town here after looking at the worst's interactions with the Janitor. Lots of fluff-filled posts, but not necessarily in a scum way; there is info buried within. Yeah, definitely a bunch of good observations from this slot.
Beefster Myloninja13 (-50%) - I am not a big fan of 16 (role fishing? really?). Then we have 220. It is not necessarily a bad post, but the first line kinda confuses me (on an analysis level), and I'm not sure where Beefster is getting a Janitor/SIMYK scum team from in that post. After noticing only 3 posts though, I am not as confident in this read.
Lalendra (-50%) - Has a few posts spanning 221 to 224. Seems to have some kind of townread on SIMYK as of 223, but hasn't given anything substantial in terms of reads yet. I like The Worst's case against this slot in 635. I don't like their catchup posts (1081 for instance), and I feel that some of their interpretations are out-of-context or unfair.
The Janitor (-56%) - First two posts of his really don't register well with me (105 and 111). Subsequent posts continue to not really be good. I don't like the wagon progression on this slot, so that is a plus for The Janitor.

duck, Taly, SIMYK, mutant town and lalendra and lovebird I find scummy. Have concerns with Dino that I voiced. Ircher is also wacky but lovebird and LAL are less active atm. Ausuka light suspicion

Math town. Dave town. Ausuka scum.

I'm not including my own reads, and I'm not including reads on myself. This leaves us with:

I think ircher, simyk, math, tw, dave, taly, and maybe eddie are town.
I think lalendra and lovebird are scum.

The Worst, Math and A50/dave are all town, and I town lean Saske and Eddie.

So. The definitions of "confident" are arbitrary and I can't see what's going on in people's eyes, but this is a rough attempt at a future article I'm going to write on a scumhunting style called holistic scumhunting.

Let's start with town.

SaskeIsMyYaoiKismesis
Ausuka
davesaz
Eddie Cane
Myloninja13
Taly

Ahiru-tan
Eddie-kun
Math-sensei
Taly
Ausuka-chan

Town reads on Ircher and Taly.

Math
Mutant
Simyk


ircher, simyk, math, tw, dave, taly, and maybe eddie are town.

The Worst, Math and A50/dave are all town

Math town. Dave town.

duck, Taly, SIMYK, mutant

Saske
The Worst

davesaz
Eddie Cane
SaskeIsMyYaoiKismesis

Taly, SIMYK, TW, Eddie Cane, davesaz, mutant (sheeping)

[Eddie Cane]

u r the worst, iconeum

[Eddie Cane]

if the day's still going, i'll write my post again tomorrow hopefully. work went too late today don't really feel it.

[Eddie Cane]

How about you explain your thoughts and analysis instead of shading mine? Again, I don't know why I'm treated like a dumbass in this thread.

i think i've explained my thoughts plenty~

[Eddie Cane]

This game state is exactly why we need a lynch.

Also, I know Lalendra is on V/LA (and they'll think I'm jerk a for stating this), but I would rather

not

wait til Monday (with 1-2 days before deadline left) to decide on a lynch.

I know its shitty to hate but I hate the timing of her VLA.
actually really really keen to lynch this. none of my townreads have come in and told me I'm being dumb since I cased her so

shrug

shrug

i half called you dumb

[Eddie Cane]

Won't You Be My Neighbor is the one where she tricked me.

I meta'd her and successfully found a towntell/scumtell, and then royally fucked up the execution not realising that she'd dropped the scumtell.

Then I outed the tell

I told you, that game is pure luck

[Eddie Cane]

math those are some rly bad tr reasons lol

[Eddie Cane]

2 is one of the scummiest numbers in this setup, this was a valid question to ask. I can see this as scum if scum with Janitor (chainsaw defending his draft pick) but then we should probably fucking flip Janitor (the scummier player) first, no?

lol

The scumteam coordinated the draft picks. They've done so in every iteration of this setup. Lovebird as scum would not be the one to coordinate everything.

I don't think Lovebird out of the blue comes up with a great idea to lie about where she got her number from. She was the first one to do this, and this is why she was town originally.

that's a great lie? seriously?

There's no argument here or effort to push Ausuka (despite Ausuka having a lot of scum equity).

Unexplained gutreads are fucking townish, people. You just don't like how she plays.

...no, they're fucking nai. i don't mind how she plays, she had pretty good reads in boon's game and was kinda influencing the thread.

And Lovebird did have reasons the whole time. Scum-Lovebird makes an effort to actually show that she's doing work instead of just plopping a vote on someone. If Lovebird were scum, you would be townreading her.

And ffs she dismantled my townread of her by bragging about having tricked me, which is something that I never brought up. (key: she tricked me by just acting like powertown)

Me dropping the ball on defending her is part of why she's in this position. This is literally an anti-scum move if she's scum.

can you show me this being AI for Lovebird? that would be a valid reason to TR. no, i don't want to see a "mafia" game with 1 scum and like 5 pages, that's just SK vs town there's no uninformed minority there's uninformed individual. lol.

This was after I suggested policyvigging Lovebird.

Dying is worse for your alignment as scum than it is as town. Lovebird-scum is entirely capable of towning it up, instead she gives up.

The reason the "woe is me" doesn't fly with me usually is because scum use it for AtE. The question is whether Lovebird in particular just gives up on the game WITH A DAYTALK SCUMTEAM.

No, she fucking doesn't. She's town who doesn't give a shit.

again, is this AI for

lovebird

? cite that and i'll call this a good reason to tr. i've definitely faked apathy as scum, and i've seen tons do it as well. also, scum can be apathetic, and also, lurking is a valid way to completely dispel a wagon on you in a lot of cases. not a way i do or like, but a way lots do.

Proof that Lovebird is fully aware of how to be townread in a game like this.

lol. and?

These votes are suicidal. Lovebird is practically asking to be lynched here. If she were a Vengeful, then sure, but she wouldn't be demotivated about me asking her to be vigged if she were literally the vig/vengeful.

lol. suicide is letting a town bloc that actually is all town run the game, so from a scum!bird perspective she probably thought she could dismantle Taly's case and so went for Taly? there's also the option she's town tilted she's being scumread but I digress.

This is nuanced reasoning and it actually makes sense from her POV. But again, she didn't make a show of it like she does as scum. She's holding her cards close.

Lovebird is town. I will only accept her death on an Ausuka townflip.

...what? we already discussed that earlier, yourself and I and you and others, lol. i don't see any nuanced reasoning.

[Eddie Cane]

I mean VALID but I really DO think I have a tell on NEWER players that says Janitor is TOWN ┐(‘～`；)┌

blanket tells r the best Kappa

[Eddie Cane]

i said i don't think you're TvS. I really don't see it with how you treated him with your reads. stand by it.

[Eddie Cane]

i said i don't think you're TvS. I really don't see it with how you treated him with your reads. stand by it.

err
SvS*

[Eddie Cane]

Data

SaskeIsMyYaoiKismesis
Ausuka
davesaz
Eddie Cane
Myloninja13
Taly
?? Ircher

Lovebird
Lalendra

ヽ(〃･ω･)ﾉ TOWN ヾ(･ω･｡)ｼ
Ahiru-tan
Eddie-kun
Math-sensei
Taly
Ausuka-chan

( ≧Д≦) SCUM (≧Д≦ )
Lovebird
Ircher
davesaz

Town reads on Ircher and Taly.
Weak town lean on Beefster.
Wanna look closely at people on Ircher wagon.
The Janitor possible scum.

Long name with lots of complicated ascii art and random words in CAPS looks town

Current readslist, since multiple people have asked:

Town:
Mathdino - His play is a little different than what I am used to here, but I think it's largely due to him not being super confident on who's scum. Usually he picks someone and runs them over like a truck, and while he's not doing that here, it still strikes me as town!Math.
Mutantdevle - Feeling pretty confident in town!Mutant here, largely because I agree with his reasoning and like the way he is presenting his thoughts. Seems like he's actively trying to gamesolve.
Simyk - I don't have any meta experience with Simyk, but they seem invested in gamesolving, are trying to advance the gamestate, and their tone is very towny.

Townlean:
davesaz - I wasn't sure how I felt about A50 but davesaz has moved this slot from null to townlean for me. Not as confident as I am with the townbloc above, but good vibes.
Eddie Cane - Again, not confident enough to say town for certain, but good vibes.
Myloninja13 - There really hasn't been enough from this slot to say for certain, but I'm feeling town.
Iconeum - I like what I've seen from them but need to see more active participation.
Taly - This seems like town!Taly from my meta experience.

Null:
the worst - Honestly not sure about this slot, I want to say town but feel like I can't make an unbiased opinion. Their tunneling of me could be town-motivated but I'm not crazy about the reasoning behind it; then again, I could just be mad they're tunneling me. I can't be impartial enough to figure it out yet.
The Janitor - I don't hate their posting but I'm having trouble determining whether it's a playstyle thing or actual scumminess.
Lovebird - I can't make sense of this slot either way.

Scumlean:
Ausuka - Nothing I've seen from Ausuka has struck me as particularly towny, especially the waffling/soft defense of Ircher and the defensiveness in their tone.

Scum:
Ircher - For the reasons I outlined in my last few posts.

This is only a vague list of my more solid townreads and scumreads.

Everything

NOT

in here is either some form of conflicted, null, or read I'm working to sort.

Town - Top To Bottom In Confidence

Mathdino
SIMYK
Ausuka
Ircher
Eddie
Janitor
TW (Still Relatively Confident Even At Bottom)

Scum - Bottom To Top In Confidence

Lalendra (Most Fragile)
Lovebird

high town: Taly, SIMYK, TW

likely town: Eddie Cane, davesaz, mutant (sheeping)

nulltown: Myloninja, Lovebird, Ircher

everyone else: Ausuka, Iconeum, Lalendra, Janitor

Town:
davesaz
Eddie Cane
SaskeIsMyYaoiKismesis


Town lean:
Iconeum
the worst


Null:
Lalendra
Myloninja13
Lovebird
Taly


Scum Lean:
Mathdino
Ausuka
The Janitor
Ircher

SaskeIsMyYaoiKismesis (+72%) - Really like this slot's contributions in general. (I mean, I could probably point out some specifics, but is that really necessary?)
The Worst (+61%) - I didn't like this slot's contributions too much early on, but I am starting to lean town here after looking at the worst's interactions with the Janitor. Lots of fluff-filled posts, but not necessarily in a scum way; there is info buried within. Yeah, definitely a bunch of good observations from this slot.
Beefster Myloninja13 (-50%) - I am not a big fan of 16 (role fishing? really?). Then we have 220. It is not necessarily a bad post, but the first line kinda confuses me (on an analysis level), and I'm not sure where Beefster is getting a Janitor/SIMYK scum team from in that post. After noticing only 3 posts though, I am not as confident in this read.
Lalendra (-50%) - Has a few posts spanning 221 to 224. Seems to have some kind of townread on SIMYK as of 223, but hasn't given anything substantial in terms of reads yet. I like The Worst's case against this slot in 635. I don't like their catchup posts (1081 for instance), and I feel that some of their interpretations are out-of-context or unfair.
The Janitor (-56%) - First two posts of his really don't register well with me (105 and 111). Subsequent posts continue to not really be good. I don't like the wagon progression on this slot, so that is a plus for The Janitor.

duck, Taly, SIMYK, mutant town and lalendra and lovebird I find scummy. Have concerns with Dino that I voiced. Ircher is also wacky but lovebird and LAL are less active atm. Ausuka light suspicion

Math town. Dave town. Ausuka scum.

I'm not including my own reads, and I'm not including reads on myself. This leaves us with:

I think ircher, simyk, math, tw, dave, taly, and maybe eddie are town.
I think lalendra and lovebird are scum.

The Worst, Math and A50/dave are all town, and I town lean Saske and Eddie.

So. The definitions of "confident" are arbitrary and I can't see what's going on in people's eyes, but this is a rough attempt at a future article I'm going to write on a scumhunting style called holistic scumhunting.

Let's start with town.

SaskeIsMyYaoiKismesis
Ausuka
davesaz
Eddie Cane
Myloninja13
Taly

Ahiru-tan
Eddie-kun
Math-sensei
Taly
Ausuka-chan

Town reads on Ircher and Taly.

Math
Mutant
Simyk


ircher, simyk, math, tw, dave, taly, and maybe eddie are town.

The Worst, Math and A50/dave are all town

Math town. Dave town.

duck, Taly, SIMYK, mutant

Saske
The Worst

davesaz
Eddie Cane
SaskeIsMyYaoiKismesis

Taly, SIMYK, TW, Eddie Cane, davesaz, mutant (sheeping)

And scum:

Lovebird
Lalendra

Lovebird
Ircher
davesaz

Ausuka
Ircher

Ausuka
Iconeum
Lalendra
Janitor

Lovebird
Lalendra

Mathdino
Ausuka
The Janitor
Ircher

Mylo
Lalendra
Janitor

Lalendra
Lovebird

Ausuka

Lalendra
Lovebird

So, in the town side:
SIMYK: 7
Taly: 6
Dave: 5
Math: 5
Worst: 5
Mutant: 3
Ircher: 2
Ausuka: 2
Mylo: 1
Lalendra: 0
Lovebird: 0

And scum:
Lalendra: 6
Lovebird: 5
Ausuka: 4
Ircher: 3
Janitor: 3
Dave: 1
Mylo: 1
Iconeum: 1
SIMYK: 0
The Worst: 0
Taly: 0
Mutant: 0
Math: 0

And overall:
SIMYK: 7
Ausuka: 6
Dave: 6
Taly: 6
Lalendra: 6
Math: 5
Worst: 5
Ircher: 5
Lovebird: 5
Mutant: 3
Mylo: 2


So this is going to be much more useful in future games, when I can look back in post game here and see what the actual correlation is. This is the theory run, so I'm more just going to be guessing and using my predictions to try and get good reads. As a result, I'll weight this into my reads lower than I will in the future.

So the important thing here is that people are generally smarter than random, but only by a little, and town win rates are lower because of other things.

Simyk, Taly, Dave, Worst and Math are the closest things to global townreads. Really though, 6 is half the game (we aren't counting myself remember) and a third of it could be scum tring their partner. 5 is less. Over half the game TRs SIMYK, and to boot they have no SR points, so SIMYK is town off of this. Keep in mind, scum pocket people, they don't just push mislynches and ignore the rest of the game. If someone's a global TR like SIMYK (and really I wish 7 was 8 or 9 but ah well) it means scum is pocketing them and in addition town townreads them, because otherwise they'd almost always receive pressure and SIMYK has received almost none this game. SIMYK!town, but probably with meh to bad reads hence wanting to pocket.

There isn't much to note about town other than that - its the low info section because of the massive difference in how some scum play wrt each other. However, this setup is strongly anti bussing so the scum side will be strong. The only other things about town side is that its town indicative of Taly, Dave, Math, and Worst. Also, a bit of an angle shoot but I think its very slightly indicative of town!mylo because scum wouldn't take a partner everyone is FoSing and have one of them tr them and the other ignore idt. That's a weird angle.

In scum, the forerunners are Lalendra and Lovebird, followed by Ausuka, Ircher, and Janitor. The rest are all pretty irrelevant. One thing this is great for regardless of how accurate my results turn out is that it always shows who the true high info flips are if you're aiming for info flips - we'll get to that though. This is scum indicative of all parties involved I believe because scum are disincentivized to bus, and while I don't think they NEVER bus here, I don't think it'd be often and if they do it wouldn't be more than 1 of their 2 partners anyways. However, if they're town it is likely 1-2 scum are pushing them. So to average it out, about 4.5 townies are FoSing Lalendra, 3.5 on Lovebird, 2.5 on Ausuka, and the averages are pretty useless for numbers as low as 3 but its around 2.

There will always be more TRs then SRs because, well, there's more people with a green role pm and its easier to find town. I will note there's 24 scumreads out of what should be an average of 36 (3 x 12), or in other words people are having trouble pinning down scum in this game. Ideally it would be 3 of the above 5, but you can't win by just hoping everything is ideal.

The last point of data is pretty useful - the overall. You get to see how many people are talking about things. Unfortunately, however, there's no mathematically controversial slots for the most part - there's very little crossover between the lists, and thus any parallels I wanted to draw are nixed. I wish this was a game with more numerous reads, but I digress. Ircher appears in both lists multiple times, Ausuka appears in both lists multiple times, those are either scum driven mislynches OR they're scum. Town!Ircher = FoS Simyk, Lalendra, Mutant, Janitor. Town!Ausuka = FoS Lalendra, Math, Mutant, Lovebird.

This is all stuff that's a lot useful looking back on late game. For now, it means little, but later and especially once we have a scum flip there's a ton more we can take. I had a fair bit more but whatever this covers the important bases.

[Eddie Cane]

hopefully this livens up the next bit of the game so yall arent apathetic and dead

[Eddie Cane]

i don't agree, its stalled. there's been very few posts recently. are you going to do the lovebird meta stuff, or no? i can unvote if you are, but if not your first "case" was highly unconvincing.

you can also do the alternate route of showing me why i should vote janitor

[Eddie Cane]

... its been stalled for like 72 hours iirc. way before you said they're town in big letters

janitor's scummy, i don't see why he's scummier than lovebird. i don't see why he's a better lynch. do you have nothing else to say to my post? you love data-ey stuff.

[Eddie Cane]

Basically I'm more interested in proving its inconsistent with her scum ability than consistent with 1 or 2 towngames

its not consistent at all with the only completed game i have for her though, and taly push looks like scum unhappy with the gamestate.

The fact that you asked the question at all may help with ISOs later I guess

exactly. regardless of my conclusions, you still get useful data from it. that's why i posted the stuff and not just results. it also forces people to take stances, and lets you fos people who ignore you (Iconeum)

I have no clue why simyk is hard defending Ausuka tbh
How confident are you in simyk btw

...moderately. i hate reading the posting style, but still generally consistent with what i look for in their towngame. i mostly soul read them, because their scum game is better than their town game despite them arguing differently and hating scum.

[Eddie Cane]

I just asked

Math

the same thing, and

Math

declined. What does

wholistic reading

have to do with

Math

's scumread?

[Eddie Cane]

Cases are bullshit, I have no case that can't be rebutted by someone of equal debating skills to me
Ultimately were gonna have to accept the fact that 1 or 2 scum is being hard townread by SOMEONE
Part of why I'm only allowing rock solid meta reads and sheeped soulreads into the townbloc

mutant is a complete meta read if i didnt make that obvious. he's capable as scum and in isolation wouldn't be a townread in this game.

-

I think I prove cases aren't bullshit (although some people ignore them and impulse lynch even in lylo), but yes, of course scum have people pocketed. I don't want a full case though, just tell me why he's scum. Your Lovebird stuff hasn't convinced anyone which should tell you its not good.


pedit: very confident. i spent a long time doing it recently. its not really specific posts, more just the general tone of his posts and how he did his first page of posts.

[Eddie Cane]

https://gyazo.com/3701991b8d5afb35b4b07c758e362a5c

this spelling looks better aesthetically.

[Eddie Cane]

THERE DO NOT EXIST GOOD SCUMCASES IN THIS GAME, YOU GUYS AREN'T UNDERSTANDING THAT. That's the problem. There will not exist good scumcases until we get a scumflip or a guilty.

i get it. which is why i think you're way more confident on janitor than you have any right to be and that's either scum with a fake read (less likely) or town who confbiased janitor to be scum and by result is calling the other wagons town (more likely).

The vast majority of scumcases thus far amount to "this person has an annoying scumfuck playstyle". This is true of Lalendra, Lovebird, A50/davesaz, Ircher, Janitor, Myloninja.

I think annoying playstlye covers half+ of the game. Ircher, Taly, Ico, Love, Janitor, Mylo, Lalendra, Dave, Ausuka, SIMYK.

[Eddie Cane]

(and if Ausuka or Lovebird is town then Eddie is for sure town)

wat

Eddie Cane-scum would be ballsy enough to hard-defend a scumbuddy off meta I think.

of course i would.

ive played with irch, love, dave once or twice and lalen / beef i have minorly read. fun fact: best i've ever seen dave play was as an ic. he wasn't lynchbaity (well lol but even in isolation), he had good reads, he was a good presence. idk why it took rolling IC for dave to be a good player.

[Eddie Cane]

Lalendra I just don't feel like lynching, especially if Lal is a PR. I will claim intent if it results in a claim, but that's it.

and this is why i haven't entertained a lalendra wagon

A large part of me also thinks Lovebird is getting retaliatorily wagoned for being right on Ausuka (remember that correct people get wagoned more than they get NK'd).

i mean, eh. i scumread ausuka literally every game so i'm trying to avoid that slot for now. this is a possibility.

- No good reasons to townread Janitor, therefore he remains in the lynchpool

also valid.

- The fact that Mathdino AND Eddie Cane were on it for a long period of time and it picked up 0 steam or sheeps, while equally lynchbaity players picked up L-1 wagons

this is true. i don't get why our cult following didn't amass on janitor.

- Awful first 1/3 of the game

see i thoguht his early game was bad but i can't really pinpoint why. just felt generally scummy.

[Eddie Cane]

Honestly it's just fucking ridiculous how many players in this game are just nonchalantly not playing to wincon.

Bad play is often because they're scum not playing to the same wincon as you, lol. I've seen a lot of people write things off as bad town that they really shouldn't. That said, obviously the 6-7 people listed below aren't all scum.

- Janitor, Ircher, and Taly collectively deciding that any draft-based reasoning is bullshit, and managed to avoid commenting on actual alignment-indicative things in the first 15 pages by doing little but complain about the 30% of my posts that were setup spec

And draft based reasoning DEFINITELY isn't bullshit, its just something we can't really do anything about until later in the game with flips.

[Eddie Cane]

prodge

[Eddie Cane]

wow iconeum = out of town bloc

[Eddie Cane]

why didnt you comply with my request? why are your recent posts so bad? why are you not commenting on the major wagons or the third proposed wagon, janitor? i havent really read the last few pages so maybe you answered some of this already

[Eddie Cane]

its almost like hammering a week into a day instead of constantly rehashing stuff increases town ev and doesn't leave the game an apathetic mess!

[Eddie Cane]

Janitor, place a vote somewhere. It is antitown to not be voting. Same with SIMYK, but you haven't been voting most of the game iirc so.

[Eddie Cane]

what the fuck is it with your slot continually discrediting me by referencing one game

that one game i personally led lynches on 3/4 scum

jay was a fucking scum mason in a scumsided setup that afforded us only one mislynch

like if you want to measure reads accuracy i can throw potshots at people all day

the point davesaz is that we have literally a day until the deadline and lalendra is a massive liability right now

remember how lock town cheeky was until you misvoted in lylo

[Eddie Cane]

sigh

VOTE: lalendra

[Eddie Cane]

UNVOTE:

Rolecop is the optimal pick for town, you can get a few guilties and UB is swingy. I don't town clear it but we aren't lynching there.

[Eddie Cane]

VOTE: Lovebird

24 hours. If you want a different lynch speak now.

[Eddie Cane]

Are you kidding me?
VOTE: No Lynch

We seem quite intent on a No Lynch it seems.

We aren't no lynching................

I'll hammer Lalen over a no lynch. Their content wasn't "scummy" to begin with, and they claimed one of the best PRs, so I don't want a lynch that's 40% (generous - only cause of the amount of obvtowns) likely to hit scum and 60% likely to mislynch a strong PR.

Ircher, can you trim that down to the points towards scum? I haven't read most of the last few pages in depth.

[Eddie Cane]

secondly, why does scum bus their role cop?

the question is why role cop and not universal backup

i'm actually trying to wrap my brain around why scum would choose role cop in this setup tbh

scum have the advantage in PR hunting :/

Ok humour me. Why does a townie pick role cop in this setup?

Deny to scum?

WHY ARE PEOPLE SO BAD AT SETUP SPEC IN EVERY GAME AHH

1) you bus your rolecop because

you know who the likely prs are and even more likely the strong prs are anyways

2)

SCUM

picks it to deny

TOWN

it. Its good for town. Guilties the Vengeful. Guilties the PGO probably. Guitlies the Roleblocker (biggest one). Guilties the Redirector (other big one). But moreover, denies town UB which is a huge +ev role because its much less obvious than the likely cop and other strong roles and it lets that new strong role hide.

Sigh. UB benefits town a bit more, but RC is still good and Lalendra is newb so I buy it enough to not lynch there unless I see better reasons for why they aren't null.

[Eddie Cane]

Try 18, 19, and 35 for starters.

19 is something. Rest are bleh.

[Eddie Cane]

that's not MY point

I don't think Role Cop is a suboptimal pick for either alignment by a large margin and Lalendra is new enough I don't fault it. I don't think she's lying about her role, and I don't think that role makes her scum. Do you disagree?

[Eddie Cane]

so my question is why scum would ever pick role cop over universal backup

UB doesn't really benefit them, hunting the PRs (as in the threatening ones to get a priority list and the less likely one)

I haven't played this setup before

but as sc um I probably do RC over ub

[Eddie Cane]

@Eddie --> Thoughts on Ausuka?

Scummy ish.

That said, I've scumread him hard in our last two games and been wrong so I've been avoiding commenting on him. He told me he was easy to read I still don't get how to though. I'll vote it over a no lynch for sure.

[Eddie Cane]

I don't think Tracker needs to bother. Lalendra will get a Cop / Redirector result, which is a guilty in the latter case, and if its the former then as scum they couldn't do anything bad with their action anyways (aside from performing the nightkill I guess). So, Tracker can track either if they think they'll perform the kill but nothing special vs any other player IMO.

[Eddie Cane]

They can stop one of the two but not both, and we probably have a bunch of other PRs anyways to do shit.

[Eddie Cane]

VOTE: Lovebird

coo

[Eddie Cane]

VOTE: ausuka

oops

[Eddie Cane]

mathdino

[Eddie Cane]

@Eddie: bad call, i'm just confirmed scum if i'm alive in lylo due to my placement in the draft and my activity/lategamesolving
it's not unlikely i get killed literally tonight

{Eddie Cane, Ircher, The Janitor} would be better picks i think

problem is that if the cop is scum with one of them, they could just lie

I'm a more likely kill, and st best you could argue its equal. what makes me a good cop check and you a bad one?

[Eddie Cane]

but you're not overly likely to be a pr anyways so that isn't a huge point anyways?

i'd rather a janitor cop over ircher

[Eddie Cane]

Saske who should we lynch over Ausuka?

[Eddie Cane]

i agree to the point their lynch is off the table ime.

pedit: @ that being a townish post from lalen

[Eddie Cane]

hi worst

VOTE: Lovebird

thoughts?

[Eddie Cane]

A$AP

[Eddie Cane]

u are the best

[Eddie Cane]

the 6 voters are cleared on a scum flip, so this game is basically over.

[Eddie Cane]

scum loves avoiding eod

and the only people posting today are mostly obv town

[Eddie Cane]

<===== not sober

Cop should flip a coin between Eddie/SIMYK and someone else regsrdlesss of flip imo

Vig should shoot Ausuka on a townflip and idk who on a scumflip

pedit: reading now

waste of a cop

[Eddie Cane]

we should cop janotor

[Eddie Cane]

if the cop checks janitor and gets anything other than a definitive guilty, i'm lynching the cop straight up

there's no reason for the cop to subject themselves to that from their standpoint

to get rid of a likely mislynch?

[Eddie Cane]

like the best case is a guilty

worst case we dont waste a lynch

I dont see what makes ircher better

[Eddie Cane]

maybe don't make a game plan as black and white as if you dont gwt a guilty I'm lynching you?

athena point of PoE is you townhunted a bunch of people. Aiming for a guilty in a PoE is better than an inno, because you either succeed and get a confscum lynch or fail and get to take a scummier slot out of the PoE.

math, why do you keep assuming love is greening?

we are starting d2 with a red flip in general in all likelihood so nbd either way in that aspect.


... pedit okay sure so we let ico decide outside of a pool of bonviable targets

[Eddie Cane]

VOTE: Lalendra

[Eddie Cane]

dinkle, is Janitor a role guilty or just a he's scum i'm sure "guilty"

[Eddie Cane]

@mod; if a player sent in two roles, such as Cop/1-shot Redirector, without choosing one of the roles in that slot, what would you do?

Mod: Force them to choose one role.

because my vote is a mechanical guilty

[Eddie Cane]

I messaged the mod requesting to be either role cop or universal backup, thinking that the mod was supposed to choose which of those roles you receive. I received the role cop.

[Eddie Cane]

Mod: Force them to choose one role.

[Eddie Cane]

if a mod always answers inline they can't just change it for an important question that would be mod influence

rereading during the night helps folks!

[Eddie Cane]

leaving confirmed scum alive is how town loses games.

[Eddie Cane]

unless iconeum (or someone) claims a guilty, my vote isnt moving

[Eddie Cane]

I saw Mathdino claim a guilty, and then claim a vig.

I'm not literally claiming a mechanical guilty.

1-shot vig is a great scum choice to try to look town and win at endgame.
Problem is, Mathdino claims to have shot Myloninja because of making friends & enemies, which would be ironic since that's the game I was scumreading Myloninja and Mathdino was townreading him.

It was an unsortable useless slot that hurt us in MF&E by not doing shit all game. Beefster played his scumgame and Mylo played what seemed like a parody of his towngame.

I spent all day yesterday laying out the pool of valid vig targets, and NOW you're giving me shit for it?

Didn't we say that was town meta for him and Beef was townie? Regardless, yes, he was in the vig pool. Why would copping you have been bad exactly? You were a 1 shot PR used night 1 o.o

[Eddie Cane]

I also don't really know why you just claimed, but I was gonna question you anyways because I thought you were JK and Worst flipped that

[Eddie Cane]

okay mylo was a fine vig and I'm not going to press that

and I think you and ausuka are not scumbuddies ever as well

but i am firm on lalendra being the optimal lynch, n3 vig can vig whoever they need to on n3

[Eddie Cane]

it might not even be optimal for them to shoot because its odd numbers unless we get a successful doc, but if they DONT shoot they could be vengeful and the rolecop is scum so never mind

[Eddie Cane]

I'll do more later going to second work now

[Eddie Cane]

q

do you pick the pairing first and then decide if you receive it

or pick initially

[Eddie Cane]

yea, and it would allow them to pick things like venge and redirector safely

[Eddie Cane]

VOTE: Mutant

Invalid vote. Try again.

[Eddie Cane]

And realistically, no, I don't have 100% confidence in the Mutant read. I wish he was around more. But that is probably the last slot I vote today except SIMYK and maybe Taly.

[Eddie Cane]

{Mutant, Saske, Taly}
-
{Lalendra}

Ausuka
davesaz
The Janitor
Iconeum
Ircher
Mathdino

so the other 2 scum are in here. 1 is probably Janitor or Dino for his godawful Lalendra associatives. I would guess the former. Iconeum should plow through this list quickly, so if she's scum she's kinda boned. Ausuka is meh, I want to see his history with accurately reading Ircher because if it exists then Ircher is just town due to never being an Ausuka partner. Dave needs to stop being a useless lurkfuck. NAI for him, just annoying. Lets see BTM Dave, not educated lively experienced Dave please. There's 11 alive and a cop at the least. If cops town, lynch today flips a townie and cop flips a townie, and tomorrow we start with 9. Then 7. Then 5p LyLo if we haven't found the second scum by then. So, we can flip 6 more people

before

lylo, and there's only 6 besides the cop in the PoE (including Lalendra because we do need to flip them) (not including myself but add me if you want lol). There's also hopefully at least 2 of Watcher, Doc, Vig town aligned, so yea. Basically autowin. If cops scum its more complicated mechanically but there are other PRs. I think this game is a town win pretty solidly.