Open 762: CK9++ [Over!]

[gobbledygook]

Hello!

[gobbledygook]

I have played mafia on a site called smash boards but that was a long time ago in a galaxy far far away

[gobbledygook]

The Fish is town.

[gobbledygook]

The Fish is town.

Why?

Wanting a list from everyone is very town.

[gobbledygook]

I feel like The Fish could be my dad.

[gobbledygook]

That's... an awkward reason to townread someone who has many more reasons to be townread.

I do not understand your logic here.

[gobbledygook]

That's... an awkward reason to townread someone who has many more reasons to be townread.

It's a really awkward reason to focus on for explaining your TR.

Is it though? Explain to me why it’s awkward

for me

to use that as a basis to townread a player.

[gobbledygook]

I feel like The Fish could be my dad.

I did once have a fling with a turkey, is your mom Gobble Gobgobble Gob?

So you do know her!

[gobbledygook]

That's... an awkward reason to townread someone who has many more reasons to be townread.

It's a really awkward reason to focus on for explaining your TR.

Is it though? Explain to me why it’s awkward

for me

to use that as a basis to townread a player.

First of all it seems you're ignoring everything else Fish has posted.
Second have you never seen scum ask for reads lists?

1) I just joined this game. Did you expect me to have read 30 pages of a game that quickly? I find your questioning of my read suspicious. You admit that there are multiple reasons to think that The Fish is town, but then find my reason "awkward" when there is very little likelihood that I would have read enough of the game to see any of the other reasons.
2) I have, but The Fish seems to be going through ISOs before asking for specific read lists. He appears to be crosschecking previously stated reads with the current read lists that people are posting. That is town. What has The Fish done that is more town?

I will begin reading this game from the beginning.

[gobbledygook]

Any other opinions on anyone, gobble?

Not at this time.

[gobbledygook]

Up to page 10. Initial thoughts are that everyone needs to learn to when to use parentheses, my goodness.

[gobbledygook]

Pretty sure my heart ripped in two when I realized The Jackal is The Fish's predecessor.

[gobbledygook]

Thanksgiving sides > Jive Turkeys
Skygazer
The Fish
Implosion
Phillammon
James Brafin
Gamma Emerald
Persivul
Thespio
Sakura Hana
Chemist1422
Doctor Drew

VOTE: Doctor Drew

My work here is done.

[gobbledygook]

No it’s not
Would you like to explain any of that?

Not really, but if any read in particular strikes your fancy you can ask. You in particular I thought had a really good beginning, but you've tapered off a lot. Someone said that Thespio started to coast after getting some town reads, but I think that actually applies to you.

[gobbledygook]

It is a couple of reasons. I felt like Drew blew Persivul’s anger out of proportion. I also like Drew is facesitting on a lot of major wagons and parking his vote until a better opportunity presents itself. He is being too cautious with his vote. I also think that a Drew flip will help me get better reads on Sakura and Persivul. Drew is oddly fixated on those two.

Can you explain the overall case on Thespio? I feel like he is suffering from the same thing Phil suffered from - weird ways of communicating his feelings.

[gobbledygook]

And honestly, Mr. Turkey seems to be about the same here. Very little content, lots of fluff, won’t explain reads. And then there’s this jab at me, that reads almost like a chainsaw/white knight attempt via Thespio. Because honestly, if your problem is with my participation level, Thespio deserves a hard look here, bud.

Why did you call it a jab when you agreed with it? Like I said, if you want to know my reads, you can ask about specific players.

[gobbledygook]

I actually really strongly dislike Skellen's two posts so far. It reads like scum who opened the thread, saw James's question and said "oh sure, I can answer that", then continued reading the thread looking for something to respond to, saw my post with my random-ass townreads, and went "oh sure, I can give a response to this."

Push that and I'll fight you to the end.

Interesting, why

Because skellen's the fucking IC.

Okay I'm fucking stupid.

Wtf is this from Persivul?

I missed the IC reveal at the beginning of the game, no offense to mod but it wasn't blatantly obvious. Your reaction to someone, who clearly didn't see the reveal, was way way too aggressive instead of just 'Hey dude, you know he is mod confirmed IC right?'

I find this reaction to Persivul to be embellishing Persivul's tone. I did not find Persivul's reaction to be aggressive. He may have used aggressive or more blunt language, but Persivul did not

feel

aggressive to me when I read this exchange. This post is not problematic in its own right, but this post essentially becomes a crutch that Drew leans on for a few days.

VOTE: Persivul

You say it's a reaction to someone who didn't see the reveal
But I feel like I'm getting pedantic here so w/e

Well, tbf, I didn't realize you did acknowledge it in your second post until you mentioned. So to that point I was incorrect.

But, the greater point was Persivul's reaction to someone wanting to put pressure on the IC when they didn't realize said person was the IC.

Like a somewhat buddying of the only confirmed townie.

I disagree completely with the notion that what Persivul did is "buddying the only confirmed townie". I think Persivul's reaction is to someone wasting their effort in scumhunting by going after an IC. To me, it looked like Persivul was more attacking those who did not know Skellen was the IC and less defending Skellen.

In other news I wish Persivul didn't spill the beans so soon about our Innocent Child. Should of let more information and hilarity ensue.

^ Person with a sense of humor.

Lol sick burn bro.

What good motivation is there is letting it drag on 'for hilarity' though? Or even for making the post? There was nothing there to help the game move forward or to help town find scum.

Bah, still rubbing me the wrong way....but now for different reasons.

I do not like this post at all. Persivul is not gaining any traction at this point and the tone from this looks like Drew is upset that no one else is talking about this I do not like the last line of the first sentence either. That line reads to me as holier-than-thou like Drew wants to look like an advocate for the gamestate/scumhunting.

Didn't say it did. I'm asking a question. Is there any way that it comes from a town mindset? How is this a town-aligned way to approach the game?

I agree with you, and as I think about it I dislike 151 more and more.

But, if it isn't town aligned it's.....

This, if I remember correctly, was before Thespio had garnered any votes. However, several people had aroused suspicion and dislike for Thespio. I think this is Drew waiting for others to move onto the wagon so that he has his own basis for jumping onto the wagon later.

[gobbledygook]

@Mod: my name's Sakura Hana not Sakura Hara

Also
VOTE: Thesp
didn't realize we were so close to deadline already.

I feel like we have different definitions of close to deadline.

[gobbledygook]

I would like everyone to a) explain their read on Drew, and b) explain their read on Sakura.

[gobbledygook]

Why 4 days? Seems arbitrary.

__

I would like everyone to a) explain their read on Drew, and b) explain their read on Sakura.

Drew could be scum, Hana is someone I wait to sort because their d1 play doesn't elicit much for me to read off of.

What do you think about the lack of a Phil wagon?

[gobbledygook]

It is a couple of reasons. I felt like Drew blew Persivul’s anger out of proportion. I also like Drew is facesitting on a lot of major wagons and parking his vote until a better opportunity presents itself. He is being too cautious with his vote. I also think that a Drew flip will help me get better reads on Sakura and Persivul. Drew is oddly fixated on those two.

Can you explain the overall case on Thespio? I feel like he is suffering from the same thing Phil suffered from - weird ways of communicating his feelings.

Lol, I really hope you mean fencesitting......I ain't that freaky.

I did blow Persivul's anger out of proportion, and I already conceded it was a bad vote/reaction. But I am keeping my vote on him and not voted anyone else partially because I haven't been active enough to make an informed vote(though I was very close to voting your slot before you replaced in) and keeping it on Persivul wasn't putting him in any sort of danger, so why remove it until I decide.

And why say I am fixated on pers and Sakura? I was trying to get thespio to explain 151 for the longest......if anything I was the most fixated on that.

Oh c’mon. Facesitting isn’t freaky. But I was wondering if you’d catch that.

[gobbledygook]

In fact, fuck it. Shit or get off the face is what I say.

You are trying to deflect off thespio turkey man.....I think this is a scum v scum wagon, ie thespio and turkey are both scum.

VOTE: gobbledygook

I’m interested why you chose me and not Thespio who has more general ill-will hanging around his neck so he is more likely to get lynched. I particularly don’t like you calling this scum v scum. It seems like you are waiting for Thesp’s flip to drag me down with him. I would wager that if Thesp flips scum or if you flip scum, the other will flip scum accordingly.

[gobbledygook]

I didn’t ignore you, Drewbydoobydoo. I will quote what I thought was fixation after work when I am home.

[gobbledygook]

So Drew thinks Gob and Thesp is SvS
and Gob thinks Drew and Thesp is SvS

Yet you both are voting each other.

This is incorrect.

[gobbledygook]

A hail mary.

[gobbledygook]

So Phillammom, you seem odd... your ISO isnt the best

Still catching up, not sure why i cant get in a a groove here, but I went through Phil's iso.......what did you find so odd.

Also, from skimming the game I was not liking James, but his interactions do seem town sided to meUNVOTE:

Why thespio though

did you *see* post 151???

I directly asked him about 151, hoping to hear some reasoning momentarily.

Drew, what do you feel is off with 151?

I mean, not that I'm objecting.

I disliked it initially for laziness and feigning interaction and I wanted of an explanation which I never got(did notice he is close to a prod though, maybe he is busy or something).

But, pers brings up a great point in 214 which really gets me thinking. That coupled with the hole being an ass thing.

I hope he comes back, none of this really gets sorted out with a replacement.

I feel like you guys are too scared to do this
VOTE: Thespio

I would prefer to wait for his response/potential replacement to respond.

Dry fits 303 looks worse than his vote imo.

I would still like to here from thespio before I decide who to vote though, and tbh I really don't like the thespio wagon.

These are your 4 posts concerning Thespio. Let me know if this list is incorrect.

---

I actually really strongly dislike Skellen's two posts so far. It reads like scum who opened the thread, saw James's question and said "oh sure, I can answer that", then continued reading the thread looking for something to respond to, saw my post with my random-ass townreads, and went "oh sure, I can give a response to this."

Push that and I'll fight you to the end.

Interesting, why

Because skellen's the fucking IC.

Okay I'm fucking stupid.

Wtf is this from Persivul?

I missed the IC reveal at the beginning of the game, no offense to mod but it wasn't blatantly obvious. Your reaction to someone, who clearly didn't see the reveal, was way way too aggressive instead of just 'Hey dude, you know he is mod confirmed IC right?'

1.x

VOTE: Persivul

2.x

Can people start doing more AI stuff.

More of a reactionary sort of player?

1.y

I actually really strongly dislike Skellen's two posts so far. It reads like scum who opened the thread, saw James's question and said "oh sure, I can answer that", then continued reading the thread looking for something to respond to, saw my post with my random-ass townreads, and went "oh sure, I can give a response to this."

Push that and I'll fight you to the end.

Interesting, why

Because skellen's the fucking IC.

Okay I'm fucking stupid.

Wtf is this from Persivul?

I missed the IC reveal at the beginning of the game, no offense to mod but it wasn't blatantly obvious. Your reaction to someone, who clearly didn't see the reveal, was way way too aggressive instead of just 'Hey dude, you know he is mod confirmed IC right?'

But I did see it, my second post acknowledged it
I just didn't pay attention the the "who"

Isn't that basically what I just said? Let me rephrase, you were not aware of who the IC was whereas I(and Implosion I believe?) was not aware of the reveal.

Either way, point still stands about Persivul.

3.x

You say it's a reaction to someone who didn't see the reveal
But I feel like I'm getting pedantic here so w/e

Well, tbf, I didn't realize you did acknowledge it in your second post until you mentioned. So to that point I was incorrect.

But, the greater point was Persivul's reaction to someone wanting to put pressure on the IC when they didn't realize said person was the IC.

Like a somewhat buddying of the only confirmed townie.

4.x

In other news I wish Persivul didn't spill the beans so soon about our Innocent Child. Should of let more information and hilarity ensue.

^ Person with a sense of humor.

Lol sick burn bro.

What good motivation is there is letting it drag on 'for hilarity' though? Or even for making the post? There was nothing there to help the game move forward or to help town find scum.

Bah, still rubbing me the wrong way....but now for different reasons.

5.x

I need to step away from Persivul for a bit.

I think implosion's town tho, even if their reads are the complete opposite of mine.

Sakura, while talking reads......what do you think of per and myself?

2.y

Can people start doing more AI stuff.

More of a reactionary sort of player?

Also Sakura, can you answer this por favor.

3.y

Why must it come from a scum mindset?

Maybe I am thinking of my own meta, but I am way more likely to as town to scum slip vs being scum and scum slip. Imo, getting people angry just mislynches town.

6.x

These are the posts that I think are you focusing on Persivul and Sakura. During the same period you were questioning Thespio, you also made these posts. There are 6 posts focused on Persivul (denoted by "[number].x" )and 3 posts (denoted by "[number].y") focused on Sakura. That is 4 more than the ones directed at Thespio. These are the posts that made me think you had a fixation on Persivul and Sakura.

I personally think that this type of behavior shows you were trying to keep your options open to join a Thespio wagon. The Thespio quotes in the first half of this post look like you are gearing up for a vote based off him not answering your first question. That makes me suspicious of you.

Oddly enough, until your vote on me, I did not think you had enough conviction in your beliefs/actions/votes. Your recent play is making me feel better about you, but I am having trouble understanding why your play now is only becoming townier after I made a case against you.

[gobbledygook]

James, I think that scum benefit more from tunnels. It allows them to have a lot of content without actually doing anything. In my opinion, it also allows scum to act wantonly around claim/hammer time since they can act more brazenly when believing a claim or not. Tunnels are distracting and sap the town of energy, time, and focus.

[gobbledygook]

Thespio, what policy do you think James is pursuing against you?

[gobbledygook]

Also eh, i may have been wrong on gob.

Honestly starting to feel that way about most of my reads. I would probably bet my farm that Skygazer is town though. Thought her reaction to my predecessor was really town.

[gobbledygook]

Nothing that I can see in the iso for James says that he is going after you for activity.

[gobbledygook]

@Gamma
OH
I misunderstood then. There is a spreadsheet with the information in it, but effectively I’m doing a study on RQS. The information may or may not prove valuable after my next question.

Okay, it's a multi game thing, would've liked to have that be more clear earlier. I still feel beyond that you do lack follow up in general, so what I'd suggest you do is just go through your ISO and see what questions are unanswered or have been answered but not resolved
FYI you're in my null pile now

Why is James null?

[gobbledygook]

@Gamma
OH
I misunderstood then. There is a spreadsheet with the information in it, but effectively I’m doing a study on RQS. The information may or may not prove valuable after my next question.

Okay, it's a multi game thing, would've liked to have that be more clear earlier. I still feel beyond that you do lack follow up in general, so what I'd suggest you do is just go through your ISO and see what questions are unanswered or have been answered but not resolved
FYI you're in my null pile now

Why is James null?

@Gamma

[gobbledygook]

Oh, and James is my top town read ftr.

Town. I put him lower than other town reads because it looked like he was coasting after getting good will but I would put him as top 3 now.

[gobbledygook]

I think Drew is right about Chemist

[gobbledygook]

I kind of want to be a bad turkey right now...

[gobbledygook]

Because I was thinking he wasn't following through on anything which made him feel scummy but he seemed to respond to the pressure from me decently and he explained the RQS thing

He did all of those things and now he is just null?

[gobbledygook]

You guys aren’t fun

[gobbledygook]

And that’s not true, The Fish. I don’t want to kill a PR if he is a PR.

[gobbledygook]

wut

[gobbledygook]

I’m not scum, so if it’s subconscious seeping it’s the multiverse

[gobbledygook]

[gobbledygook]

I’m gonna do it

[gobbledygook]

Please be scum

[gobbledygook]

VOTE: Gobbledygook

[gobbledygook]

Ah that felt good to be bad

[gobbledygook]

Oh shhhhiiiiiiiii

[gobbledygook]

VOTE: Thespio

Im a bad turkey!! I’m sorry if you’re town Thespio ;_;

[gobbledygook]

I am having a crisis of faith because I mostly agree with The Doctor about The Fish.

I am sorry Thesp

[gobbledygook]

hi I'm the 1-shot tracker, got a no visits result last night on Sakura

k bye

Why would you claim this?

[gobbledygook]

I need to reread.

[gobbledygook]

I can talk normally too.

No, don't. Or do, but keep up the notes as well. I'm digging them. In fact:
VOTE: Drew

Why vote Drew?

[gobbledygook]

So you think that's why implosion died?

I was going at him hard for his defense of phil. No one wanted to follow me onto either one of those so I peeled off in search of common ground. Imp dying was 100% intended to jam me up, and you kinda played right into that by voting me like that and Drew and Gamma jumped at it without much provocation needed.

Why else leave a confirmed town alive last night?

I mainly don’t like the strong focus on The Splosion kill being to frame The Fish. It seems odd to believe that view so unconditionally.

I think if The Fish is town, Drew and Gamma are more likely to be town. Scum would know if that guilty is fake or not.
I think if The Fish is scum, Sakura’s analysis on Drew is probably correct.

I think scum in general are less willing to sheep votes onto “guilties” due to potential fallout.

[gobbledygook]

That said I do find The Fish’s actions to try to obfuscate his reads to be a pretty townie mindset. Why does this have to be so hard.

[gobbledygook]

Oh god the paranoia is setting in

[gobbledygook]

Well I just said a fair bit about Sakura’s gambit on this page so...

[gobbledygook]

VOTE: Persivul

[gobbledygook]

In fact, fuck it.

Shit or get off the face is what I say.

You are trying to deflect off thespio turkey man.....I think this is a scum v scum wagon, ie thespio and turkey are both scum.

VOTE: gobbledygook

OH MY GOD. HOW DID I MISS THIS EPIC JOKE
Drew you are a legend

[gobbledygook]

Yes, because I basically just explained away one of Sakuras reasons to vote me.

IOW, you've demonstrated that you're able to respond to them without me repeating them.

Feel free to continue rebuttals of Sakura.

I find it odd that, when I clearly make a sheep vote, you try to get into conversation with me rather than the originator.

What? How would you have preferred Drew to address your vote?

[gobbledygook]

I have super secret reasons to trust Sakura

Cool. Then she shouldnt be afraid to out her secret info. Cause I know what I am and what I can do, I doubt she does and is taking a shot in the dark. A shot that Drew was more than happy to drive full behind.

One thing I am trying to get, is why would you push my lynch d1. Obviously you weren't protecting thes, and I get a feeling turkey may actually be town.

Help me out here, something is off for me......I kind of want a reason to unvote.

What was feeling off?
What did you mean you wanted a reason to unvote?

[gobbledygook]

Persivul, to answer you, I do not have an issue seeing the problems with Drew’s votes.

[gobbledygook]

I am getting over a pretty bad cold, I will try to get to this tonight. Welcome to this game Mr. Dalton

[gobbledygook]

I had a fever dream last night. In that dream I was arrested. That was not good. Not good at all.

[gobbledygook]

Does Gamma Emerald normally just sheep all his votes? Will address any questions addressed to me later today. Stayed home from work

[gobbledygook]

One thing I am trying to get, is why would you push my lynch d1.

What was confusing about his push on you, Drew?

[gobbledygook]

The Fish, did you ever get all of the reads' lists that you wanted? I think you only got about half the town before you stopped asking for them.

Drew, looking back at the end of the day yesterday, why did you vote me over Thespio exactly?

[gobbledygook]

Oh good, the relevant parties are here. I will post something shortly

[gobbledygook]

The Fish, you are an odd player to me. I find what you're saying to be town, but how you say it to be scummy. I think you also misrepresented the situation when Drew voted you because you said "it is very possible that Drew did not see the secret reasons post" when he most likely

should have

seen it. Drew votes at xx:39, but Sakura posted her "secret reasons" at xx:37. If he just came to the thread, he would have seen it. If it took him multiple minutes to post that one liner, he should have gotten a Preview Edit notification. What is even more weird is that Drew never noticed this himself? Or addressed it? Drew, would you please address this? Even with your attempts at explaining everything you seem to mainly be preoccupied with the "nvm Fish scum" post that potentially had a preview edit notification.

The Fish - Why did it take you several minutes to vote Drew despite how yesterday ended? I really disliked how you voted Thespio yesterday and rereading that has only unfortunately reinforced that opinion. It sapped the Drew wagon completely. I find your, quite frankly, obsession, with Implosion's death to be really, really weird and scummy. You keep talking about how his death totally implicates you, but he would be the last person to kill as scum. That seems very WIFOM like you're trying to create a dust cloud. I also find it hard for you to believe that genuinely considered the question you posited in 1041. I don't know how you play scum, but I feel like even as scum you would not shoot the confirmed town IC. I don't think I have seen an IC die the first night, ever.

--

When seeing some of your posts, including your inner monologue stuff, I doubted myself a bit about your intention and wanted to get Fish to give me more evidence that you were lying(and to clarify, that you were lying scum) and I should trust him over you.

This is the major reason I did not like your interactions surrounding the vote. What would Fish have been able to say that would prove to you Sakura was lying? heck, what would The Fish have been able to say to give you more evidence that Sakura was lying?

--

The Fish, did you ever get all of the reads' lists that you wanted? I think you only got about half the town before you stopped asking for them.

I got all but Drew, Spang, Chem and you. And I stopped asking because the day ended.

Hmm. I must have missed Thespio's.

[gobbledygook]

Side note - I think Chemist is probably scum.

[gobbledygook]

Hey, Turkeylad, can we get your view on Rick Dalton’s method of catching up, as well as Drew’s read on you?

If

Dick

Rick plays like this on his normal account, he could be mislynched 100 times as town and I don't think I would ever say it was a bad move for the town to make. I think he is probably town for the reasons he actually stated. I also had a townread on Phil that I alluded to when I explained my initial thought on Thespio.

I think Drew's read on me actually reads town. I am such a sucker for emotion, but his crisis of conscious on all of his top scum reads is really hitting home to me. I am currently having one myself about The Fish and Drew.

[gobbledygook]

Sakura town
Gamma probably town. To answer your earlier question Gamma, I only played a few games with Ranmaru.

I think Implosion might have been killed by a scum team that was mason hunting. It is possible they saw Implosion's strong defense of Phil as a mason defending his other mason.

[gobbledygook]

Why did you not immediately clarify that when Fish said you most likely didn't see it?

[gobbledygook]

Note:

Doctor drew sheeps without asking why, or is possible he saw my second post and didnt bother asking

VOTE: Fish

Why

VOTE: Fish

I am on board with this VOTE: Fish

I find it doubtful that Drew saw your secret reasons post,

i mean I wasnt unclear about not wanting Thes dead and wanting to see a Drew lynch, so of course Drew would be gunning for my head.

[gobbledygook]

Ok I am confused, I saw Gamma mentioning trusting Sakura because of 'super secret reasons'

I need to go back. Everybody hold on.

I am asking you why didn't you correct Formerfish, unless Formerfish was correct in that you didn't see Sakura say it explicitly? Just so I have this straight.

[gobbledygook]

Hey, Turkeylad, can we get your view on Rick Dalton’s method of catching up, as well as Drew’s read on you?

If

Dick

Rick plays like this on his normal account, he could be mislynched 100 times as town and I don't think I would ever say it was a bad move for the town to make. I think he is probably town for the reasons he actually stated. I also had a townread on Phil that I alluded to when I explained my initial thought on Thespio.

I think Drew's read on me actually reads town. I am such a sucker for emotion, but his crisis of conscious on all of his top scum reads is really hitting home to me. I am currently having one myself about The Fish and Drew.

This is likely a heavy discredit attempt on me to keep the position of me seeming like a useless townie, when in actuality, I’ve been showing up and commenting through me replacing in.

This is scummy. While I understand the “town reasoning” for saying it, it makes it all the more likely to come from scum. This entire post reeks of political positioning.

You were being an ass by wordsmithing Formerfish and being obstinate about not catching up. You can catch all the scum in the world, but I would still want you to catch rope, bullet - whatever - for how you acted when you came into this game. This wasn't an attempt to discredit you at all. It was a commentary on your playstyle philosophy.

[gobbledygook]

Im not hiding behind anything. I am not policy lynching you, I am townreading you. I think you are antagonistic for no reason and that’s really not fun to play with in a game that is meant to be played for fun.

[gobbledygook]

You wrote that all in two minutes?

[gobbledygook]

How are my reads political?

[gobbledygook]

I reckon I need to catch up and glance over my lines.

I’ll be off book shortly. Anyone have any notes?

I figured by direct interaction I’d eventually be able to piece things together.

I said Hello.

I announced my presence.

I got a Hi back. I’m not leaning left, right, up, down on anyone, but I’ve been keeping up since I replaced in. I think it’s fair to not totally have a grasp on this game thus far.

I also saw the setup, and having a difficult time grasping it.

I know the setups it is referring to, but that’s giving me pause.

I reckon I need to catch up and glance over my lines.

I’ll be off book shortly. Anyone have any notes?

I specifically said I reckon that I need to, not that I was going to. And this is still relevant, I am piecing things together, and seeing how things go prior to me getting into the mix. I also asked if anyone had anything, and got ignored, so I had to get a grasp on things to help when I look back.

I’m here now, ain’t i

This was all antagonistic in a smart ass sort of way in my opinion.

[gobbledygook]

If anything, I’m being protagonistic.

Your reads are political because your stating reads to make the gamestate happy with and being the “control type”. It protects you.

You specifically town reading me is a way of you to discredit me by saying I’m just “incorrect bad town”.

You are literally putting words in my mouth and projecting.
What reads am I stating to make the game state happy? The scum read on a claimed tracker? The reduced town read on The Fish who just went to hell or high water with Implosion? The town read on Sakura who does whatever she wants when she wants and seems mostly unaffected by anything anyone says? The town read on Gamma who is the same way as Sakura? The vote and scum read on a Persivul who is yet another person seemingly unaffected by anything? The scum read on Drew who immediately OMGUS’d me (that’s real happy)? The reduced scum read on Drew who is now confused as shit because I’m confused as shit?

Please tell me which of those reads are designed to make the game state happy considering at least 3 of them are unique reads to me that others have not strongly supported.

[gobbledygook]

Rick. From what i remember I wasn’t the only player to feel like you were being a smart ass with your Reckon shit.

[gobbledygook]

I really don’t know what got into me. I try not to curse but Rick literally triggered something fierce in me. Good night.

[gobbledygook]

I’m not scum and I had this problem with you before you even addressed me. I called you a dick in response to spangle, but keep down that tunnel of seeing what you want to see.

[gobbledygook]

I could go for a Drew/Gob team.

What happened to this since it is now James, Pers, Me?

[gobbledygook]

Thats not a misrep. There is a way that he might not have seen the post. If he was catching up and was a page behind the current page when he quoted from 971 in 978 977 could have already been posted and wouldnt show up in his pedit screen, it would show up at the bottom, but i never look there and wouldnt expect anyone to. If he saw the post about secret reasons why not quote that one and vote with it?

Thats not how my preview edit works. Whenever I go to post anything if I have been taking a while to post it will show me the posts that have been made.

Also, that’s the question I have about Drew.

I felt the nk was strange and I saw a narrative growing that was pushing towards me being a suspect

What do you mean? I didn’t see any sort of narrative pushing or growing.

[gobbledygook]

Sakura town
Gamma probably town. To answer your earlier question Gamma, I only played a few games with Ranmaru.

I think Implosion might have been killed by a scum team that was mason hunting. It is possible they saw Implosion's strong defense of Phil as a mason defending his other mason.

What gives you that read on Gamma?

I find most of his iso to be scumhunting something and trying to apply pressure. That said, no one answered if he just sheeps all his votes which is what he’s been doing this game. No one corrected me either, including Gamma, which I found strange.

[gobbledygook]

Maybe drew’s a partner

Or trying to go against the grain for town cred if Drew flips town.

Damned if you do, damned if you don’t. You want to amend your statement about this not being a tunnel?

[gobbledygook]

Today he is mad at me for pulling off the Drew wagon, but he votes Pers and doesnt pursue Drew at even even though there was Hanas gambit to evaluate.

I did evaluate it. I thought Drew made good points about you, which caused me to be completely disoriented about you and Drew when I felt sure yesterday. I said as much as soon as I came into the thread in 1056.

[gobbledygook]

After looking at the setup, maybe Chemist is town. If we have a Neapolitan or a Gunsmith, then he is automatically confScum though.

[gobbledygook]

Also, my good Turkey, reiterate for me why you're voting Persivul, please?

I don’t like his general lack of efforting. I felt like his vote on Drew was taking advantage of the situation and he wanted to be absolved if his vote by having Drew talk to sakura rather than himself (Persivul).

[gobbledygook]

I am curious why Rick feels so strongly about Sky. She’s one of my stronger townreads.

[gobbledygook]

I had a strong town read on him D1, but he has swayed that time almost a scum read for me. But, as I said, things he has said are getting him scum read......but other people are getting a free pass for it. Which then brings me back to him as town

Who are the people getting a free pass?

[gobbledygook]

I’m excited for the impending onslaught.

[gobbledygook]

I am curious why Rick feels so strongly about Sky. She’s one of my stronger townreads.

I don’t believe I’be ever pushed any kind of strong read on Sky.

If anything, it’s the opposite, as she’s been fluctuating left and right, up and down.

One of James/Sky is likely scum

I am curious how putting two players into that dichotomy is not a strong read.

[gobbledygook]

Still wondering where the Sky scum reads are coming from

[gobbledygook]

Sky

can be

tentative

town

maybe

not sure

, am tired

Git em Sky!

yes

What, no more than just ‘yes’?
No reaction to being called out on an entirely natural habit of humans?

It was an acknowledgement of the fact that that post was really hedgy and I’m bad

But nothing else really

Whose post was really hedgy?

[gobbledygook]

I’m glad I wasn’t the only one who thought that post 1463 was odd. It seems uncharacteristic of Rick given how aggressive he is about me.

[gobbledygook]

And maybe parroting a bit, but what did you think about her 'in the moment'?

Her..?

[gobbledygook]

Have you been reading?

[gobbledygook]

Drew are you scumreading anyone?

[gobbledygook]

Oh damn. Maybe I was right

[gobbledygook]

Why would you vote Sakura?

[gobbledygook]

I’m sorry my sweet prince

[gobbledygook]

VOTE: Drew

[gobbledygook]

This seems awfully orchestrated. Drew you are not hammered.

[gobbledygook]

I wish I had, but I did not. I wouldn’t have voted you at all if I had.

[gobbledygook]

that was p gross of you to point out but w/e

i don't like drew's reaction, feels forced; reminds me of when i got fakehammered as scum and i forced an "oh no!" type reaction in psyches miller game

???

[gobbledygook]

UNVOTE:

[gobbledygook]

Those are either brilliant crumbs or awful crumbs. VOTE: Persivul

[gobbledygook]

Yeah you chose a good target to protect I would say

[gobbledygook]

Those are either brilliant crumbs or awful crumbs. VOTE: Persivul

Why are you voting Persivul?
Please, please explain this to me.

Gut mainly. For me, it stems from the feeling that I do not think he is scumhunting. He made a read list with two scum reads (Thespio, Phil), but he barely interacted with them or tried to sort them. He voted Thespio and then... waited for his death. Coming into today, he has said nothing about Phil/Rick, which was his second strongest scumread according to yesterday. More importantly, I think, are his two big votes. His major votes this game (Thespio, Drew) seem to use other people's logic? If that makes sense. I quoted the two posts below.

Can anyone actually articulate what is wrong with 151

I feel like it's just poor timing and a genuine read, not sure it is actually a problem

This post is scummy, is following along with a popular sentiment mindlessly like a #metoo post

You articulated it yourself. But for some reason, you see it in Phil, but claim not to see the same thing in Thespio.

VOTE: Thespio

I can talk normally too.

No, don't. Or do, but keep up the notes as well. I'm digging them. In fact:
VOTE: Drew

Why vote Drew?

As suggested above, because I think Sak's notes posts on Drew are pretty damning. What do you think of those posts?

I think he is voting this way to distance himself from the votes if things go south. I also thought it was odd that Persivul unvoted Drew when Persivul went V/LA.

[gobbledygook]

Wondering why Gamma came in and left without unvoting despite seeing the crumb

[gobbledygook]

NEVER MIND IM BLIND

[gobbledygook]

When myself or Turkey pressed Persivul, he was just dismissive and defensive.

Turkey hasn't pressed me at all. He's put up a couple votes, but no case, no real attempts to interact with me.

You've hardly been here. How am I supposed to interact with you if you've hardly been here? My vote was rotting on your wagon because of your extended V/LA so it was doing nothing. I voted Drew to avoid a stalling game, but once I was satisfied with his claim I moved it back to you.

How does Drew self resolve?

I don't want to speak for her, but she was probably thinking he self resolves through the NK.

First, note that you've barely interacted with me or tried to sort me. Second, I purposely sheep better players than myself in the early game, because I suck at tone reads.

I will reiterate that you have not been here much so there really has not been much for me to interact with. And how am I supposed to know that you sheep?

[gobbledygook]

The name Cliff Booth has been taken, but I can’t message them, so I guess that means they haven’t activated the account

Your avatar fits perfectly with this sentence

[gobbledygook]

intent to hammer drew

Where is this coming from town?
A claimed doc, and you’re like

Spoiler:

Talk to me about this please Sky.

I don't believe the doc claim. It's an easy claim for scum to make in this setup and hard to disprove. I think their crumbs coming later on rather than earlier leads me to believe they realized they need to be setting up a claim since they've felt a lot of pressure so far. I also don't feel like doctors don't want to leave any traces that they're doctors; crumbing is pretty opposite to the whole "hiding from scum" play that most doctors would be playing like. they also hadn't pointed out any of their crumbs or claimed who they targeted when i declared intent, so declaring intent put some pressure on them to complete their claim as quick as possible without any chance to coordinate it.

Normally, I would agree that Doctor is a convenient thing for scum to claim, the thing is that scum almost never claim it. I think I was reading a mafia discussion post and a player named Radiant Cowbells made the same assertion (or maybe he refuted, can’t remember), but in Normals at least, Town doctors have been lynched at higher rates than scum fakeclaiming Doctors. Granted, I think the sample size was small (3 town doctors to 1 scum fakeclaiming).

I also think you’re misremembering the order of events. Drew said “you saved me from getting my crumbs” when he was under the assumption of being hammered. That implied to me that he wasn’t going to get the crumbs because he was dead anyway and “screw the town” out of spite. That seems townie to me. He didn’t get the crumbs u til after I said you’re not hammered. He even acknowledged he was getting his crumbs simultaneously as you declared intent. I don’t think your intent is what got him to claim that stuff. I truly believe what got him to claim was the fact that he didn’t think he was hammered. But the good thing is... we can just ask him.

Drew is my retelling of events accurate?

That all said, I do agree that it is suspicious his crumbs came later in the game days but it is possible that he didn’t think of crumbing until much later. When i started playing mafia again, i know i forgot that crumbing was probably important. I think his cadecus or whatever crumb is townie in itself. The timing not the greatest but overall the manner of his crumbs I think make him town. I think as scum he would want to have rock solid crumbs and the fact that they are sloppy is somewhat more townie.

I do think it is odd that you are scumreading Drew for his crumbs, but then also saying he is scummy for not playing like a doctor normally does by crumbing. Correct me if I’m wrong with that interpretation.

I noticed I never answered why I townread you, Sky. It is for a simple reason really. You have original thoughts and are actively trying to parse the game. I think that’s townie. Your push on me yesterday is what first made me think about it. When i was catching up, i paid attention to see why you thought Dry fit vote was opportunistic, and I agree with you. It looks super opportunistic. No one else really seemed to have that opinion about it but you’ve stuck with it. That makes me think you’re town. Now your opinions about the crumbs just further reinforce that you are actively thinking about this game and trying to solve it which I can’t say for a lot of players recently.

I also think it is a little ridiculous to start down that path that Drew and Gob are scum together. It would be incredibly bad play for me as scum to push a buddy day 1, then back down from it day 2. If either of us flipped scum that is seriously bad news for the two slots. As scum too I wouldn’t do that because it just attracts so much attention. Not that it matters, but as scum I lurk because I don’t like being scum.

[gobbledygook]

I think Sakura is pretty town too with the gambit thing but she’s just sleeping and it makes me sad. :/

[gobbledygook]

Sheeping

[gobbledygook]

I am less sure about Gamma, but I do think Gamma is more likely to be town than not. I really think that gambits like the one Sakura did don’t produce the results that people think they do.

[gobbledygook]

I would like it if everyone could comment on my Persivul case.

[gobbledygook]

The posts you’re quoting ARE me interacting with you Persivul. Why don’t you see that? I can’t interact with a wall. You hadn’t responded by the time I asked for other people’s opinions on it so I asked for further attention on the case with the hopes that it would help increase activity and also get people to examine you because I really feel like you’re flying under the radar.

What makes you think I am getting defensive? My use of And to start that last sentence?

No, I can’t really see how you see it as disingenuous. Other than the IC stuff this is the first time I’ve felt like you are genuinely interacting and contributing to the game and it’s only coming after I started to put pressure on you.

[gobbledygook]

Like, what happened to your Philammon (Rick Dalton) scum read?

At the end of yesterDay, he was your second strongest scum read behind Thespio. You have completely ignored that slot toDay. Are you still scum reading him, are you not scum reading him? Why haven't you said anything about him, to him, or generally tried to even sort him?

I went through your posts to see what your activity flow has been and it is pretty weird. There is a marked decrease ebb and flow pattern to it. You post a lot then will mostly disappear for a day or so and then post a lot and then go back to lurking. It looks and more importantly

feels

like you're just trying to show your face rather than contribute.

I even did a quick chart to show it since you don't have very many posts.



Y axis is the number of posts, X axis is the days. It isn't perfect, but I've included the data below so you can verify for yourself. I included the 1 post you had on the 4th.

Spoiler: Data

July 18 -- 9 posts
July 19 -- 2 posts
July 20 -- 14 posts
July 21 -- 3 posts
July 22 -- 1 post
July 23 -- 0 posts
July 24 -- 9 posts
July 25 -- 3 posts
July 26 -- 2 posts
July 27 to 29 Night
July 30 -- 7 posts
Aug 1 -- 1 post
Aug 1 to 4 VLA (you did have 1 post promising content on Aug 4)
August 5 -- 0 posts
August 6 -- 12 posts

[gobbledygook]

Wait, Turkey.......you voted me because you thought the game was stalling? And what did you mean when you said 'guess I was right' before you voted me?

In general, if a wagon has trouble getting to L-1 or L-0 it is because it might be scum not bussing. That was what I was referencing with "guess I was right". The game was stalling so I put you at L-1 so we would at least have new information in your claim to evaluate.

[gobbledygook]

I know you're probably all thinking

Holy shirtballs! The Turkey can do excel!?"

, but 1606 is directed at Persivul in case it wasn't obvious.

[gobbledygook]

It is actually worse than I thought because I forgot that July 27 had some day in it before Thespio was strung up and that July is a month with 31 days in it.

Spoiler: Revised Persivul Data

July 18 -- 9 posts
July 19 -- 2 posts
July 20 -- 14 posts
July 21 -- 3 posts
July 22 -- 1 post
July 23 -- 0 posts
July 24 -- 9 posts
July 25 -- 3 posts
July 26 -- 2 posts
July 27 -- 0 posts
July 27 to 29 Night
July 30 -- 7 posts
July 31 -- 0 posts
Aug 1 -- 1 post
Aug 1 to 4 VLA (you did have 1 post promising content on Aug 4)
Aug 5 -- 0 posts
Aug 6 -- 12 posts

[gobbledygook]

I will respond to this later today. I would like time to do that

[gobbledygook]

I'm not tunneling on you, nor am I scum. You're misrepping a lot in 1629 and 1625.

[gobbledygook]

Yes and I would rather lose the doctor to a NK than to a mislynch. I think what I did there is the correct play 100 times over since everyone seemed to give up and just want his death.

Pedit:

This is the first time I've done an activity chart, I wanted something to visualize what I was feeling about you. I've done one other player in this game (not Sakura). I even put a trend line in that one. It has deemed that player a lurker, which is very true from looking at the data.

[gobbledygook]

It's

Turkey Time

™

[gobbledygook]

Sakura since you asked nicely here is yours



I included the trendline to see how your activity is generally trending. The bulk of your posts come from the end of Day 1 Thespio wagon and your gambit with Fish and Drew.

Spoiler: Sakura Data

July 17 -- 2 posts
July 18 -- 8 posts
July 19 -- 5 posts
July 20 -- 5 posts
July 21 -- 3 posts
July 22 -- 8 posts
July 23 -- 6 posts
July 24 -- 13 posts
July 25 -- 24 posts
July 26 -- 14 posts
July 27 -- 22 posts
July 28 -- 2 posts
July 30 -- 28 posts
July 31 -- 9 posts
Aug 1 -- 2 posts
Aug 2 -- 24 posts
Aug 3 -- 0 posts
Aug 4 -- 3 posts
Aug 5 -- 11 posts
Aug 6 -- 4 posts

[gobbledygook]

I’ve already said I think Gobb/doc is scum.

I still agree with my town block. Persivul can even step back in to sample the party.

You really need to reevaluate this.

[gobbledygook]

i'd also like to point out that gobble has acted to remove pressure from drew;

fake-hammer gambit -> oh don't worry you weren't hammered!
i declare intent to try and put some imminent pressure for drew to actually complete their claim w crumbs/their target -> immediate unvote

This might be a thing

You need to reevaluate too.

Normally, I would agree that Doctor is a convenient thing for scum to claim, the thing is that scum almost never claim it. I think I was reading a mafia discussion post and a player named Radiant Cowbells made the same assertion (or maybe he refuted, can’t remember), but in Normals at least, Town doctors have been lynched at higher rates than scum fakeclaiming Doctors. Granted, I think the sample size was small (3 town doctors to 1 scum fakeclaiming).

Link the post please

I can't find it, but if I do I will let you know. Honestly my time is better spent elsewhere. You either believe the crumbs or you don't at this point.

Speaking of, Fish, I take it you do not believe the crumbs?

[gobbledygook]

You're right, I hadn't been putting much time into this game. I explained why a long time ago. You can check the first two things yourself as the games are now complete. I pay a lot more attention to the game where I'm scum in a difficult lylo, than to a game where I'm town on D1/D2. Also go look at Mini 2091 The Purge. I modded that game. Over a couple days I had: one player urging others to post from a mason thread into game thread; one player posting the HOME TOWN of another player in the game thread; and one player SENDING A PM to another player. It was a shit show and took a lot of my time to straighten out. It's all in the game if you don't believe me.

So, now you think I'm "genuinely interacting and contributing to the game," and you know why that I'm only doing so now.

I will concede that you had other things going on which has affected your activity, but the crux of my original case against you still stands. You are not scumhutning. Heck, your vote on me is purely reactive. You're not being proactive. The only thing you're being proactive is against me and that is very survivalistic. You have barely gone outside of interacting with me since your other distractions have calmed down. Who are your scum reads outside of me?

Second...Rick replaced in, and so far he's pretty obvtown. Do you disagree? Do you think he's a high priority sort at the moment? I think you and your interactions with Drew are much higher priority at this point.

I do disagree that he is being "obvtown". I think he is being town, but calling it "obvtown" is a stretch. Again, if that really was the case, why not say something about him? Say anything about him at all? The only interaction with him that you have for the entirety of toDay is two joke posts that do nothing to imply you think he is obvtown. What makes you say that Rick is obvtown? Would you say that Sakura is obvtown?

Yeah, I talk about activity levels when I'm scum, too. Fact is that other games and real life happen. There's a reason we have long phases and 2-day activity timers here. Sometimes inactivity/catchups works for people's schedules.

VOTE: gobble

Activity is one of the reasons that I am suspecting you. If you notice, in my original case against you in 1538 I do not use the word activity once. What I said still applies just because you're sheeping other people. Sheeping by definition is essentially not attempting to sort.

Except he wouldn't have been in imminent danger of a mislynch if you hadn't put him at L-1 in the first place. The wagon might have dissolved, and the presumed doc wouldn't be outed.

I disagree with this completely. This day was stalling. It was a week to deadline and pretty much everyone in the game stopped trying. Which is a real shame. I put him at L-1 because I feared that his wagon stalling meant scum was not bussing. At the very least, I thought, we would get his claim and could evaluate it from there. The fact that he is outted I think saves the town a lot of heartache. Do you disagree that it is better to mislynch a doctor than it is for a doctor to get nightkilled?

And if you're town that's conf bias, aka tunneling. For scum, activity levels are always an easy push. Now that I'm here, you know you don't have that going forward, so you just cast shade by showing...I'm not even sure what you think you're showing, actually. Since you've never done it before, you have no idea if that pattern is scummy in general, or for me in particular. If you had come in and said you'd done the same for my past 10 games, there's a clear difference between my town and scum games, and this is my scum pattern, that might have been something. Or if you had done it for many people over a number of games and found it to generally be a scum pattern, that would be weaker, but still something. But coming in and doing it once, for a player who had previously noted that he had outside issues preventing him from posting as much as he would like? That's scum under pressure trying anything to build a counter wagon to his own.

You're latching on to this activity thing, but like I said, you're not trying to parse this game. I've said that from the beginning. The activity thing was just another thing that I noted when I looked deeper into your play. The fact that you are latching onto the activity is interesting to me. I think you're going hard at this angle when it wasn't a core component of my original read because you think you can easily refute it.

I don't know what type of time you think I have to go through your games and make a chart for each one, but I do not have that time. If your wiki was updated, maybe, but it isn't, so I would waste even more time trying to find games you've played in. I might be able to do it over 2-3 real life nights, but I'm not even sure you're going to give me that much time.

That said, you acknowledge that if I did this across games to get a general pattern, you could believe in it, so you

do

think there is merit to activity. Do you disagree with this statement: Scum are more likely to be less active. If so, why?

[gobbledygook]

I also ask to not be lolhammered before I claim.

[gobbledygook]

Quite frankly Sakura, you suck.

[gobbledygook]

At mafia the game

[gobbledygook]

Please someone unvote. I will claim at L-2 but I am at work

[gobbledygook]

At mafia the game

why did you feel the need to clarify “the game”?

I didn’t want her to take it as me saying she’s a person that sucks but a player that sucks.

[gobbledygook]

At mafia the game

why did you feel the need to clarify “the game”?

Cause he knows she's town and just slipped.

VOTE: Gob

How is that a slip?

[gobbledygook]

Fish if you’re town please unvote

[gobbledygook]

How am I disproving my own points?

[gobbledygook]

In that post you said that sheeping by definition is not attempting to sort, i said i was sheeping rick on you beforehand, and your response to me is to say i suck at mafia.
It's quite interesting.

Yes. I fail to see how saying you suck at mafia the game in a fit of rage for your incorrect sheep vote is incompatible with my thoughts that sheeping is not sorting.

[gobbledygook]

In that post you said that sheeping by definition is not attempting to sort, i said i was sheeping rick on you beforehand, and your response to me is to say i suck at mafia.
It's quite interesting.

Yes. I fail to see how saying you suck at mafia the game in a fit of rage for your incorrect sheep vote is incompatible with my thoughts that sheeping is not sorting.

It means you shouldn't be thinking im town, but somehow you do, i wonder why.

I've been townreading you for a long time, so I don't see why that is confusing to you and Fish

[gobbledygook]

Long time = since the gambit so I guess not that long

[gobbledygook]

Also wait, why did ur reaction to my sheep vote take so long then.

Because I am more concerned with people that I think are scum. Although, that was foolish of me to even do in the first place. Why would I waste time arguing with scum, I don't even know. I will say that your vote set us down that path and I am annoyed with you for that. If this all goes to crap, I do want you to feel guilt for this town loss.

Also, what post about Rick do you mean with Persivul, I'm not seeing what you're seeing in 1639 unless you mean where he says "Rick is obvtown" after I asked him about a Rick, which is my point entirely. It took me, the first person in the friggin game mind you, to ask Persivul about that read. He did not freely offer that up.

[gobbledygook]

[gobbledygook]

I am the vigilante. I did not crumb because I considered any of my shots would be proof in themselves. I did not shoot last night because I did not have a strong enough feel about anyone in the game. I will be shooting tonight, if I am able. I probably should have crumbed now that I am going to get roleblocked until I die.

Anyway, since I am a vigilante that means we are at least on II // KK // with the possibility for II // KK // P? // M? // ? given the claims. I personally think that we are on a 0 T game because if we had one T that would mean there is a serial killer in the game and I doubt that the serial killer

also

no killed last night. It is possible that they shot James Brafin, but I'm not entirely sure. Additionally, it could be that we have a jailkeeper who stopped things. But again, I am not sure.

It is also possible that Drew is lying and we do not have any Doctor or any P which would probably make sense, but I believe Drew and if I am as right as I think I am then, we do not need to sort him until much later.

Given this revelation, I think I have narrowed down are scumspect pool considerably... This is the solve that I began to formulate after Drew claimed.

Doctor Drew
Gamma Emerald
Skygazer
James Braffin
Sakura Hana
Persivul
Chemist1422
Rick Dalton
Formerfish

---

These are the currently alive players minus Spangled because mantises are really

tiny

and minus me because Turkeys. Why else would America eat them every year? Based off this, there are 3 scum in those 9 players.

From my perspective, Sakura Hana can only be scum with Chemist, or if she is the Mafia JOAT who used the Ninja kill the first night which would be so highly unlikely. Additionally, Chemist can only be scum if we are not on II. Based off the day play from both of those players, I do not think that they are scum.

Additionally, Drew has claimed to be Doctor. While his play has been super suspect, I do believe the claim and he can be town now.

---

Gamma Emerald
Skygazer
James Braffin
Persivul
Rick Dalton
Formerfish

That means there are 3 scum in these 7 people. That's pretty crazy odds for me to hit scum from my perspective. Of course, if Drew is lying the odds are still 3 out of 8, but still. That's nearly 50%.

Based off day play, I think that Skygazer is probably town because she has been genuine and original thoughts on a couple of different things in the game. I do not think that scum would be as dogged about me and my slot or as original with those reads concerning me and Drew. She seems like a lurky type player in that regard. That said, she did say something about an SK which implied SK hunting which is always a scumtell. I have no idea how to read Gamma, but based on his play so far, I think he is more likely to be town than not. With this list, I am going to look through Implosion's ISO to see who he suspects the most.

As it stands though this is my reads list

Town to Scum:

Spangled
Chemist1422
Sakura
Drew
Skygazer
Gamma
Rick Dalton
James Braffin
Formerfish
Persivul

Knowing my luck, I will be wrong about all of this. I think I am right that the scum are in {Persivul, Formerfish, James Braffin}. I began looking into those three specifically together and I feel I am right because all of their lists have each other as either null or a slight read on way or another which I think is to keep the option open for bussing

For example, James Braffin posts this reads list...

Chemist is pinging me. So is Pers, who doesn't seem toe really be adding anything to the gamestate
Implosion strikes me as town-ish, in a "using other's content bot not generating a lot of my own" kinda way. But he's been super active and building off several other players, which I expect from town, not scum.
Jackal I can't sort yet. Not enough info.
Korina and The Worst are both obviously scum.
Arch is... odd. I'd like to see vote reasoning here, but I can't say he's super scummy without it. VERY slight scumread,
Dr. doesn't have enough, but Dry-fit has me concerned. He feels like he's coasting, which I don't feel like is a town thing.
Gamma is fluff-posting, which I find scummy as frick. Speaking of, yes, I prefer RQS.
Phil is maybe town, considering his posts, and Sakura as well. I feel like as scum they both would have pushed harder against me for my bad reasoning, but they didn't try to build that case and that strikes me as townish.

@mod V/LA for two days

Noted.
-Kor

but before I go..
viewtopic.php?f=51&t=80331&user_select[]=33000
VOTE: Persivul

@mod V/LA got cut short so im back

Noted.
-Kor

So he got a slight scum read on this, but somehow can't form a read on this

VOTE: Gamma
For using a color that's impossible to read on the dark boards theme. I literally had to open a quote-reply to see what that post said.

@Mod

Please note I'm officially V/LA until next Friday (the 26th) due to a billing/payment issue with my home internet. It should not cause activity issues though, as I can post via my phone which has unlimited data.

Noted.
-Kor

Not really. More like this, with no particular order within groups::

{Skygazer, James, Sakura}
{Everyone else, for various reasons}
{Phil}
{Thespio}

Town:

Spang
FF
Hana
Thes
Dry

EP
Chem
JB

Gamma
Pers

Drew

Imp
Phil
:

Scum

Of course, I could be totally wrong about all of this and it is what it is, but based off how Fish and Persivul reacted to me pressuring Persivul, I think I am right. I wanted to post an encrypted message saying that Fish would vote me, but then I realized I would probably be modkilled for it. Which honestly at this point, doesn't sound too bad to be freed from a town that 1) isn't playing and 2) isn't reading.

Now that I've claimed though, I won't be able to prove myself until the RB is dead but at that point I'll probably be dead too so, thanks Sakura? Your gambit got the Doctor and the Vigilante to claim. A+ town play right there. If you're mafia, honestly you deserve to win just based off that fact.

I think given the specific setup that I think we have a mass claim today probably wins us the game. We still have a vengeful/pgo and a full cop or tracker out there. I think the PGO should claim, but the vengeful should not (honestly though, vengeful by itself is such a stupid role. It is like a jester and encourages anti-town play despite being a town aligned role).

The full cop or tracker is confirmed town though due to setup spec, again unless, Chemist is mafia, but I don't see it. If we are on PP that other role also becomes conftown. If we have an A that role is also conftown. Really in my mind, we would just start to play this with a bunch of named townies and the moment we hit the roleblocker we probably bulldoze.

Sakura, you can unvote now and vote Persivul.

[gobbledygook]

Thinking about it I do feel strongly about mass claim but towns are usually like lynch that with fire. I think that scum also would not have had enough time to crumb a specific role so I think we are more likely to catch them off guard

Pgo/vengeful + cop/tracker + Spangled + Chemist + me + Drew + Sakura leaves very little room for scum to fakeclaim or even maneuver. Although if Drew is scum this whole plan is shot to more risky, but I think he is more likely to be town

[gobbledygook]

At this point moving forward if you are not the Pgo/vengeful cop/tracker and one of the above mentioned people you're just dying - straight up. Would prefer we go through my list of Persivul, Fish, and JB, but I don't have enough energy in me to fight anymore

[gobbledygook]

oof, another self resolving claim. ok
VOTE: persivul

What is actually your opinion of my case on Persivul now that you know not to misread it and now that I have narrowed our focus?

[gobbledygook]

Also JB was the lurker person I graphed last night that I mentioned yesterday



The dotted line is the trend line. As you can see and probably got the feeling from JB, he has trended into a

LURKER

Spoiler: JB Activity Flow Data

July 18 -- 18 posts
July 19 -- 3 posts
July 20 -- 3 posts
July 21 -- 2 posts
July 22 -- 0 post
July 23 -- 3 posts
July 24 -- 8 posts
July 25 -- 2 posts
July 26 -- 6 posts
July 27 -- 5 posts
July 27 to 29 Night
July 30 -- 9 posts
July 31 -- 3 posts
Aug 1 -- 1 post
Aug 2 -- 0 posts
Aug 3 -- 0 posts
Aug 5 -- 0 posts
Aug 6 -- 1 post

[gobbledygook]

Why do you play mafia

[gobbledygook]

Ok you’re just a whimsical player then this all makes sense

[gobbledygook]

You thought I was a cop this entire time and still voted me?

[gobbledygook]

Your play makes no sense from any town perspective. You lambast me for putting Drew at L-1, then this entire time think that I am a cop and still vote me. Yeah no.

[gobbledygook]

I take back the mass claim idea. Persivul just claimed scum with that logic. I was worried he was a PR but he isn’t based off that reaction.

[gobbledygook]

Nah. Cop is even less confirmable than vigilante, I don’t know why you would somehow believe cop more than a vig.

[gobbledygook]

Sky you should vote Persivul who is now clearly role fishing. Persivul who are your scum reads besides maybe me? I don’t even know at this point

[gobbledygook]

You’re freaking out if I am SK or not which mafia are more concerned about than town

[gobbledygook]

Pretty sure you just don’t want to use your RB on me if you have to

[gobbledygook]

I took it back because I don’t want the cop or tracker to claim and claiming the vengeful or PGO narrows that pool down even more plus can actually freely allow mafia to RB hunt for it without the downside of the potential PGO

[gobbledygook]

I took back after I was done being in a white hot rage and i thought about the implications. I really don’t see how people see you as town or haven’t voted you. It is pretty amazing watching you openly claim scum

[gobbledygook]

It does significant damage to the cop and if we have a PGO entirely invalidates that role. So yes I would say significant damage

[gobbledygook]

I can be confirmed by my shot or by your red flip, but keep saying that

[gobbledygook]

And hell, if they don’t believe it down the road they can string me but not before you buddy boy

[gobbledygook]

What’s weird is you haven’t really denied being scum

[gobbledygook]

Literal scum claim

So they can string me up after I really don’t care. As long as they flip your mafia behind they can do whatever they want with me regardless of whether or not they believe my claim. I will at least have done my job and set them down the right path.

Persivul, is it still called tunneling if a townie does it to a mafia?

[gobbledygook]

1. I thought your unvote was disingenuous after I told Fish to unvote if he was town
2. You never said don’t claim, or anything like that, even after I had said I would be claiming a L-2
3. Your half hearted attempt at defusing by going after Sakura felt forced because you had no problem with it at the time she made it

Anyway off to work. Get me, get Persivul, I don’t really care anymore. This town refuses to work with people and this game has become a chore and frustrating

[gobbledygook]

I’m SK and I shit Implosion, Scum shot me and i lost my BP. Persivul is scum for going hard at this and not scumhunting else where i think my analysis still checks out for {JB, Fish, Persivul} with outside chance of Drew. I am happy to shoot them dead for town and then get strung myself.

Discuss.

[gobbledygook]

Cop/tracker is Gamma by the way

[gobbledygook]

Like I'm not confirming or denying it but it's anti town so to do that after your "confession" makes no sense if you're trying to townside in your last efforts.

Fine I’ll townside even more. Sky is scum and I was lying about 1 of the three

[gobbledygook]

L-2

[gobbledygook]

I don’t get you Drew. Why wouldn’t you vote even if I was L-1 if you’re ok hammering

[gobbledygook]

I am SK and that’s how I know we are T/II/M/P/? Or TTT/II/M/P

That’s also how I was able to parse Sakura conftown (unless scum with Chemist or Ninja Joat)

[gobbledygook]

Like I said I am more than happy to leash and generally make scum’s lives miserable

[gobbledygook]

VOTE: Gobbledygook

[gobbledygook]

I would have shot anyone and scum definitely shot me because I’m not BP anymore. That’s why I scumread Pers

[gobbledygook]

Fish still scum

[gobbledygook]

Yeah

[gobbledygook]

I only wish I was town to reap the benefits of my perfect solve. ;_;

[gobbledygook]

It’s gobble, James, and Persivul

I technically had a perfect solve here too, before we knew there was SK.

Close but no cigar.

[gobbledygook]

I only wish I was town to reap the benefits of my perfect solve. ;_;

Solve, shmolve. Town won. Scum lost. You lost. Solves are meaningless if you can't get the right kills.

SKs are just misunderstood vigilantes