Open 682: Watchmen Wanted -- Game Over Some People Won!!

[Hawk]

Hey guys. Uzi, Ali, Lucca, Grey, and of course my favorite person in the whole wide world Aubrey. Good to see you all again.

VOTE: Aubrey

Of note random question for Uzi do you just dislike RVS and that's why you never early vote?

[Hawk]

Hey sorry guys I have guests at my house so I'm in and out.

VOTE: Alisae

Why are you sheeping an RVS wagon? who said the Grey didn't actually think it was a real wagon?

Lucca gtfo me and do actual scum hunting. You have a reason to scumread me?

[Hawk]

Why are you sheeping an RVS wagon? who said the Grey didn't actually think it was a real wagon?

Because they're fun. Also it's not really an RVS vote anymore. And I don't see why the 2nd question matters like at all.

When you voted it was the last sheep vote aside from TB's self vote. So you thought the wagon was RVS at the time. The second question is more why did you think it was RVS wagon than a serious wagon. So why was it RVS when you posted it and why is it serious now?

[Hawk]

your vote is based on me not liking the question on the end of 11. it's needed and provides no information. only there to make the post larger.

meh. it's based on fucking nothing.

love u hawk. 2 defensive.

Kay I guess that's reasonable.

Love you too Lucca. Sorry tired and a bit stressed lol. Probably came off more abrasive than I meant to.

[Hawk]

Why LUV assumed by vote was serious in general is a mystery.

it was, but, lol.

I'm more concerned with the sheep than the consideration because I thought you were serious too considering you came in asking who we're lynching.

Honestly kinda makes your push on me look like a conversation you townreading TB?

[Hawk]

Why LUV assumed by vote was serious in general is a mystery.

it was, but, lol.

I'm more concerned with the sheep than the consideration because I thought you were serious too considering you came in asking who we're lynching.

Honestly kinda makes your push on me look like a

CounterWagon

you townreading TB?

EWOP

[Hawk]

I have a read on Hawk but I want Hawk to tell me if he has a stance on TB or not before I out it.

Speed of wagon and Grey's case on TB make me think town. Looks similar to how Grey latched onto you when you made a reaction test out of fake claiming Masons Day 1 of friends and enemies. Could be scum!Grey I'm?

TB himself I don't really have a read on. I've never played with him so I don't see any tells that I could call town or scum. So he's pretty nullish by himself. I don't get the scum read everyone's seeing.

[Hawk]

I can read Grey like a fucking textbook a majority of the time. Nailed him in that game but NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO nobody believed me because I flipped scum right?
Nailed him in NY200 as well but NOOOOOOOOOOOOO nobody believed me there either. HE HAD TO GET SHOT THERE.

Right now I think you're scum due to your posturing over the grey slot and posturing over the TB slot and I got the gut feeling that you were chainsawing TB.
Not to mention your question about "who said the Grey didn't actually think it was a real wagon?" feels like you're giving me busy work so..........
VOTE: Hawk

How am I giving you busy work when I'm asking you to explain why you thought your vote was RVS then but don't think it is now? Like 4th on a wagon and you think it's RVS?

Maybe it's the wagon that's leaving RVS.

So you're saying I'm chainsawing for TB when you're the one who first brought up Grey seemed like desperate Scum? Like if that's the case my chainsaw is the same point you made but I'm not even pushing Grey I'm pushing you because I think your clarification of RVS sheeping was unnesscary and I think your vote there was a little opportunistic (same with Not Mafia and Uzi) But your comment made yours stick out more than those two.

[Hawk]

Oh holy shot, nvm you're right it's busy work then, and a misstep cause I can't read lol

You can see how if I'm thinking you said that about Grey, and still had a vote on TB, along with saying that it was RVS now saying it's not it's a bit funny right?

Alright alright nvm my bad.

UNVOTE:

[Hawk]

Okay I got a bit of time now. Is anyone else on?

@Grey can you explain your scumread on TB a bit better? I don't quite understand it. Are you scumreading him because of things said in the signups not correlating to play now?

Like what about TB's play makes him scummy?

[Hawk]

I was voting Hawk already. why switch if I wanted to blend in?

Scum claim. Basically said he knows I'm town.

VOTE: Lucca

[Hawk]

Happy birthday Math!

Posting some reads guys, I'm on mobile so give me a little while to finish this.

Here's the first few. Just going through ISO's while I catch up.

Alisae: Town for his push on me, seems genuine I misread a post of his early on and got very confused to his mindset but it makes more sense now. I like that he's keeping his reads consistent it's harder for scum to do that earnestly especially d1.

Uzi: I'm not super sure about. He's more townie than scummy for me. His questions are pretty good but not all of them. Playing a bit back is how I normally expect him to play but then again I've never played with scum!Uzi so idk if this is anything close to his scum game.

Grey: Nullish town? I do not understand the TB press. Like I understand what he's saying but I do not think it is in any way alignment indicative. That said I do like him not being afraid to go after less active players and players who are pinging him. This is more town indicative to me for Grey because from what I've played with scum Grey he usually finds one good chance to scumread someone and holds hard to that. While he isn't giving up most of his early reads he doesn't seem as tunneled as scum!Grey usually is but I've been fooled by grey before...

Aubrey: My love, my life, Probscum but it's mostly my gut and some meta. This doesn't feel that much different than Open 664. Sitting back a bit and taking neutral to slight stances rather than pushing their own agenda. Bottom part of Aubrey's ISO feels better maybe just a slow start to this game.

Lucca: Scumclaimed. Waffle waffle waffle. 62 is appeasing me after he naked votes just prior. Rest of his posts through 67 seem very easy to make. Meta read on TB with only one post they're actively disliking despite everyone else thinking TB looks scummy. pushes Alisae kinda for reasoning idk why when Ali kinda was already scumreading both the slots in question. Forgets why he was even voting Aubrey. Town reads Grey not off meta but used a metaish explanation for why TB was null/scum. 220-228 Waffle flail blind hold aubrey read self vote scumslip.

[Hawk]

Ank: I have no idea how to read this. My gut says scummy. IIoA posts, questions that generally just lead to dismissive arguments against her own case. Like I don't see much reasoning behind her votes or her read progression but I can kinda understand not having many super solid town reads this early on. I don't like the press onto me because unlike with Uzi it doesn't have reasoning behind it or at least not stated reasoning. She's calling me a sheep on Grey's wagon when clearly Lucca actually looks like fucking scum from my PoV. Uzi's reasoning kinda makes sense but Uzi's read progression doesn't always make sense to me so idk. Scummy but not as scummy as Lucca. Maybe I'm just not understanding this playstyle. NullScum

JaeReed: first half of the ISO is just bleh and sheeping Alisae. I don't like 372. It seems super forced like sheeping Alisae was the plan but when we hit Lucca it wasn't anymore. That along with the Pedit makes me think Deflection. Normally scum if they see a pedit and don't want to respond anymore they just delete. But this post let's Jae have a reason to townread Lucca and not sheep Ali there all while not actually giving a reason to townread Lucca. Scummy :/ This ontop of a really big post that just yells at Nancy cause Jae doesn't like her play just to sheep the Hawk vote bothers me a lot :/

Nancy: Ummm late entry, drops a vote on Lucca wagon no reasoning. Pushes for hammer pushes for hammer pushes for Hammer. Switches to TB? Comes up with some weird logic behind why my slot is scum by preflip associative and then declares a scumteam that no longer includes Lucca. Uhh what? Idfk but it reads scummy to me can anyone explain why Nancy is town??

VOTE: Nancy

[Hawk]

Nvm UNVOTE: Nancy

I clearly need to read some of these in thread and not in ISO.

VOTE: TB scumslip seems real. God sorry guys ignore my dumbass I can't read for shit apparently.

[Hawk]

In case you haven't realized lucca was never at L-1. TB scumtold by giving intent to hammer then scumslipped by wanting to wait for a claim.

Grey is probably just scum.

This TTH I missed this first time. I can buy that this was scum messing up.

[Hawk]

@Grey what happened to hard reading Lucca? What about TB?

[Hawk]

I mean okay so I read Nancy and I don't see a lot of town motivation for a majority of her posts. She even says confirmation bias makes her think TB Grey is SvS interaction but if she's scum why come in and make all this cocky attention drawing play for one mislynch Grey? I know her play rubs you the wrong way right not because she's clumping you with TB. Kinda rubs me wrong lumping me there too but I don't see scummy motivation behind setting up TB or whoever to scumtell like that. IDK what terminology you want to use but TB posting intent to Hammer on a wagon that wasn't L-1 and them pulling back to "wait for a claim" definitely doesn't look great.

[Hawk]

Hi, my name is Hawk and I like to push slips.
Did you just slip on a banana peel? hahaha lol xD

LMAO

Hi I'm Alisae and I like to deathtunnel conf!Bias and WIFOM based preflip associatives. :p JKJK but really hear me out.

Your case on me was that I postured on TB and Grey and chainsawed TB. Which only makes sense if me and TB are scum together. Why would I do that as Scum otherwise? If you're right on TB being scum which you might be then get your vote back over here and then lynch me tomorrow off the associative.

Also if you're making fun of me for my push on Lucca'a slio than you acknowledge the slip as real and me as town so you should move your vote off town Alibae :p.

[Hawk]

Well that feels bad :/. Maybe he's trolling?

Damnit I'm gonna get lynched tomorrow huh :/ This game sucks Grey.

pedit: holy fuck Grey why?

[Hawk]

hawk is scum then.

that hop was opportunistic.

Really Lucca -_-; please I have enough problems without your shade.

[Hawk]

Sorry TB.

It's ok. I'll probably be leaving the site soon anyway.

Good luck town.

Sorry TB :/ wishing you all the best where ever you go.

[Hawk]

hawk is scum then.

that hop was opportunistic.

Really Lucca -_-; please I have enough problems without your shade.

answer me.

What was the question?

[Hawk]

492

answer this.

Extremely bad formatting aside, yep upon my catch up and reread I saw your posts in a different light. Could I be wrong about your slip totally. Could you be town sure. Sis I think so when I voted you or made the catchup not really.

You use meta and not meta for different purposes and reads it feels awkward and forced like it only suits your agenda use meta. Like discrediting my catch up realist as not my meta so it's scummy.

Sure could be caught in conf!Bias because the slip gave me good reason to think you knew more than you did regarding me. So from my PoV our early interactions looked different. Are you implying that because I wasn't consistent with a read in early game I'm scum??

[Hawk]

492

answer this.

Extremely bad formatting aside, yep upon my catch up and reread I saw your posts in a different light. Could I be wrong about your slip totally. Could you be town sure. Did I think so when I voted you or made the catchup not really.

You use meta and not meta for different purposes and reads it feels awkward and forced like only when it suits your agenda do you use meta. Like discrediting my catch up realist as not my meta so it's scummy.

Sure I could be caught in conf!Bias because the slip gave me good reason to think you knew more than you did regarding me. So from my PoV our early interactions looked different. Are you implying that because I wasn't consistent with a read in early game I'm scum??

EBWOP

[Hawk]

The people who are complaining about toxicity here while I understand being upset you guys are over reaching a bit. It's just a game. People will call you bad and people will say some things that will hurt your feelings. Taking it so personally isn't good for your health.

Also by comparison I played league of legends for like 5 years. you want to talk about toxic this is nothing.

[Hawk]

Wait TB lives?! Cool wait TB did you think you were hammered? I did.

UNVOTE:

Fake twilight turned into a lot of nothing and people replacing out :/ I feel bad now.

[Hawk]

Dammit I missed this page. Now I look like a loony.

It's okay crazy is a good look for you

but seriously who we're you talking to me?

[Hawk]

Role PMs

Mafia Goon

Welcome, [Player Name]. You are a Mafia Goon, along with your partners, [Player Name] and [Player Name].

Abilities:

Factional communication: During the night phase you may talk with your partners here [QuickTopic link]. During the day phase this will be locked. During the confirmation phase you may talk with each other.
Factional kill: Each night phase, one of you or your partners may perform the factional kill.

Win condition:

You win when all members of the town have been eliminated or nothing can prevent this from occuring.

Town Watcher

Scum does not have daytalk. You can townread me Momo... lol

pedit: Well poop :/

[Hawk]

Wait Momo why is my 436 bad? I was doing ISO reads and when I went over Nancy's at first glance it looked horrible so I posted what I thought. Then realizing it seemed to terrible to be real I went and read it again saw the thing about the slip and was like oh... Well that makes sense... I mean I guess in hindsight looking over it my initial read was more in line with what I'm feeling now. I don't like the speed of which everything transpired and my original points still stand.

[Hawk]

Well you take your vote on Nancy whom you logically scum read and I do too.

And I mean you just said you were reading iso. Nothing specific.

Just 'cause I think Nancy is scum, you reached the correct point, and just turned around.

Kind of like you realized your points actually made a lot of sense, did not want to bus you team mate, and hid while staying with the flow.

hmmm... Well no I stopped because I thought huh that was quite clever and if TB flips town then I guess my initial inclination is right and Nancy was scum. But I guess now that TB kinda fully claimed Town in our fake twilight we can do the reverse.

VOTE: Nancy

[Hawk]

Well you take your vote on Nancy whom you logically scum read and I do too.

And I mean you just said you were reading iso. Nothing specific.

Just 'cause I think Nancy is scum, you reached the correct point, and just turned around.

Kind of like you realized your points actually made a lot of sense, did not want to bus you team mate, and hid while staying with the flow.

hmmm... Well no I stopped because I thought huh that was quite clever and if TB flips town then I guess my initial inclination is right and Nancy was scum. But I guess now that TB kinda fully claimed Town in our fake twilight we can do the reverse.

VOTE: Nancy

This is scum, this is a false dichotomy.

I mean you're not wrong Jae. They could both be town or they could both be scum too those are possibilities. I don't think that whole interaction is TvT but I guess it could be.

[Hawk]

p.14/15

Nancy looks a little to eager to lynch. Prob scum going for the mislynch.

Except I just executed a fucking flawless fake hammer twilight.

LAMIST

[Hawk]

Nancy why would town you come in and create complete and utter chaos setting up TB or anyone else to give intent to Hammer on a wagon that wasn't there, and then brag about executing a "perfect" fake hammer twilight? Like seriously you have absolutely nothing to be proud of. You essentially just pushed in with your own agenda named yourself town leader and created an entire explosion of Wifom arguments for why People did this that or the other.

Grey could be frustrated town or scum not counting votes.
You could be scum or town the arguments for why you'd do what you "say" you have done are WIFOM.
TB could still be scum and just smart enough to know he was never really hammered and fake some AtE in your twilight.

So please tell me how and why your reads are so godlike and you think continuously creating chaos is pro town :/.

3 people replaced because of what happened here. One was force replaced due to aggressive behavior spurned on by your "perfectly executed fake twilight".

Scumread on Nancy, Lucca and possibly Grey.

If Nancy is town well fuck me for disliking everything that has happened from her entrance.

[Hawk]

*sigh* Give me a bit I'm at work woke up to more votes on my wagon for going back to what I was thinking in my ISO reads. let me go over Lucca' s catchup and over some of the other people.

Little weird now since I have to go and reread slots rather than reread players with all these replaces. I'm not very good at that lol

[Hawk]

Sorry about that MB I won't talk about the replacements. Anymore.

[Hawk]

TB could still be scum and just smart enough to know he was never really hammered and fake some AtE in your twilight.

Literally impossible given his reactions. If I had a dayvig I would shoot his guy.

To be clear: LYNCH ME IF THIS DOESN'T FLIP MAFIA AND SHEEP ME ON THIS READ.

Jesus ducking christ. Why am I so bad at this game?

I leave, turn around and am hammered.

Luca/Grey probably scum

Aw TB

You're not bad.

This is like the 7th game in a row being lynched d1. Each time was town. I like have no idea what I'm doing wrong

Only other wagon in the game had like 2 votes.

pedit ffs are you seriously Town

Yup.

And I seriously knew when I hammered that he was.

You knew I was town yet you hammered anyway? Please lynch this tomorrow.

Scum is in {Grey, Hawk, Lucca}

I don't want any of these anywhere near MyLo

I have strong TRs on Nancy, JaeReed and Not_Madia

Because these emotion filled responses to his hammer couldn't be faked as scum who knows he isn't actually hammered but sees everyone else believes it?

Yeah TB's alignment is far from confirmed. Do I think he's town now? Eh probably. I thought he was hammered so I too feel like these were genuine and we have reason to look elsewhere.

Still at work just checking in to see if anything progressed I'll give more insight on Lucca and everyone else when I can.

[Hawk]

Fucks sake really can't even wait for me to get off work NM :/

Fuck

Don't go crazy like today guys focus and reset. Reread and reevaluate the game tomorrow!

Sorry I couldn't be more help town, I'll try and scramble together a final readlist before twilight lock.

[Hawk]

This is just off the top of my head

Town:
TB
Jae
Alisae
Uzi
TTH
Ank
Aubrey
NM
Nancy
Lucca
Grey
Scum:

[Hawk]

Idk that's where I had Jae before I haven't had a good grasp on the game. From what I can remember they seemed thoughtful about their vote despite sheeping Alisae the whole time early game. The emotion earlier seemed genuine and I understand the frustration with my comment before especially if she thought my post felt fake :/

[Hawk]

(╯°□°）╯︵ ┻━┻

I'm a bit annoyed now....

I'll reevaluate Jae, but I don't think the sheeping was bad. They didn't sheep the ones they personally disagreed with but I suppose I can see why that could be scummy. I'll have better reads shortly.

[Hawk]

About to get off work.

Grey was replaced with Darklyn Momo.. so your double scum lean is Dark lol

[Hawk]

Spoiler: Why Lucca is scum from my PoV

VOTE: Hawk

your vote is based on me not liking the question on the end of 11. it's needed and provides no information. only there to make the post larger.

meh. it's based on fucking nothing.

love u hawk. 2 defensive.

- you were trying to create content. on your push on ThinkBig, you were trying to engage with him, trying to feel his alignment. scum wouldn't be concerned with that. scum would be confortable leaving the game on a blank state. and I think that's towny independent of meta.

Bullshit.

I wasn't creating content. I was pushing a lynch I advertised before the game even began. That is the very definition of null, because my motives preempted my role pm.

your lynch created a lot of reads from different players.

Alisae townread you.
LUV scumread TB.
it created Ankamius scumread of LUV.

so it clearly created early content. I would say it's what ended RVS, even if is a lynch that you advertised before the game began.

358: @tb, this is so fake. you have no reason stated to suspect me, line up Nancy lynch "in case I flip town" and say that you want a claim for me before hammering.
this is fake.
tell me, how a claim in this setup would impact your decision to lynch me?

361: @luv, if you were concerned with nancy, tb, what do you think of this?

tb is scum. he is concerned about nancy pushing him to lynch me, but offers nothing on LUV telling him to do the right thing.

372: @jae, what do you think of my wagon composition?

374: @grey, good post by grey though. a bit opportunistic, but good anyway.

377: @tb, yeah, this is scum. defensiveness and a fake careless attitude, with only two votes I think on him.

I like ank for town.

382: @anka, what do you see on TTH so far?

and that's hammer, right?

lol with 11 days left?

hawk is scum then.

that hop was opportunistic.

Quotes are in the spoiler.

1. First two quotes are his entrance after RVS. Initially I read the naked vote as without reason and got defensive because of personal reasons. Follow up seems appeasing in hindsight at the time I felt bad and apologized as well because I think I overreacted. Thing that bothers me here is that he seems to back off rather quickly never states a reason for the actual vote that isn't BS even from his PoV and then says it was serious a few posts later.

2. The problem with the next quote is the same problem I think Grey had with it. It makes no sense to townread Grey for this. Even if go by the stretchy logic that Grey created that content it was started by a pre game states tunnel. So Grey's content created is not alignment indicative and this feels like it's just kinda fabricated to give reason for TRing Grey's slot.

3. Third quote stood out most to me from Luccas follow up. All the comments towards TB just feel like he's trying to push back a counter wagon that way. The part where he says what changes by a claim I think indicates Lucca isn't even thinking about the fact that there is one PR and without counter claim basically locks as an IC in this format. To me that's a scummy mindset.

All of this is occurring while TB is being ran up I think I just checked ISO but forgive me if I'm wrong here that just makes it worse.

4. Last three quotes feel like he bought the fake hammer. Didn't care because he wasn't lynched and then the push back on me seemed like a good way to deflect off the wagon we had on him previous to TB.

[Hawk]

Fakehammers are my life

A lot of excitement followed by a big let down that nothing actually happened?

[Hawk]

I'm having flashbacks to Open 666 but it's not the mods fault this time.

[Hawk]

I'm not budging off Lucca.

Sorry, I don't get distracted from scum lynches by shiny things.

Alright nancy

let's go

VOTE: JaeReed

come on, this isn't town me. I hardclaim scum. Lynch me.

you're fucking trash tier.

So why wouldn't you take out the trash instead of yourself?

There's scum motivation in shitting up the game with this garbage she's spouting.

Like, I'm so smart and shit, right? Bit she caught me so hard and fast, right?

Fucking bullshit.

VOTE: nancy

Luca/Grey probably scum

Totally.

pedit ffs are you seriously Town

Yes, he's town.

And I seriously knew when I hammered that he was.

UNVOTE: Nancy

So I really want to vote Darklyn aka Grey's slot. But I'll wait cause we have a decent amount of day left and don't want a random lol hammer.

Grey says he's not Budging off of Lucca. Lucca posts nothing in fact all that happened between his wagon on Lucca and a flip to Nancy is Nancy coming in and baiting TB along with Jae getting very angry with Nancy's attitude in general. It's funny because I don't see a reason if Grey is so confident in his Lucca wagon for him to jump off here unless he wants to be apart of whatever Nancy is pushing. So I'm thinking this whole interaction and flip to Nancy is just a way to move off of Lucca who isn't doing himself any small favors.

The subsequent hammer and admission that he knew it was town when Nancy was so convinced TB was scum makes me think Grey is trying to setup narrative that Nancy is scum and not himself. Also further pushing Lucca out of limelight.

I maybe misreading this situation but I'm feeling pretty certain Grey is scum. So yeah I'm thinking this is a good place to go. It doesn't help that Darklyn came in voted Jae and then immediately Sheeped Momo on the Lucca vote which is very odd to me. It makes me wary to lynch the slot but I'm feeling more confident when I consider I don't like Lucca either so I'm just gonna say one scum in the two. My guts making me feel like Grey slot is more likely, but I could see it being Lucca if not Grey.

Momo any thoughts on this?

[Hawk]

When I look at the game time and think we still have time but this seems as good a lynch as any.

Intent to hammer.

Unless Darklyn gives me a really good reason or one of town reads stops me.

[Hawk]

I'm just kidding. He's on his own damn wagon are you people really calling for a hammer here!?!?

[Hawk]

You can hammer Hawk lel, my slip wasn't a scum one though, anyone can see on the front page the role pms, I just consider myself a vt because I have the same powers (but yeah it was a poor choice of words)

btw ThinkBig is butthurt because I embarrassed him another game, he holds grudges and isn't a very good player so don't trust him

Wut...

[Hawk]

Do you think there is scum on your wagon at all then?

[Hawk]

Third times a charm

VOTE: Darklyn

9 days left. Fucking christ. Okay so if this doesn't flip scum looking at Titus and NM.

[Hawk]

VOTE: Hawk

Have a seat.

VOTE: Titus Sure thing sugarcube let's go.

I didn't even get to finish my point by the way when fire said I asked if I could hammer. Literally a few minutes later after going over the wagon composition. I see Darklyn is voting himself and I'm just dumbfounded asking why and wtf are y'all asking for a god damn lynch for, WITH 9 FUCKING DAYS LEFT AND A FUCKING SELF VOTE ON THE WAGON!

[Hawk]

Literally if Town hadn't been so fucking bad at EoD Jae would be alive because scum would be too fucking scared to kill either of us at the risk of getting seen doing it.

It wasn't even end of day it was still the middle of the day! We had 9 FUCKING DAYS left.

Why are you so confident they wouldn't have gone after either of you? That's a whole lot of WIFOM, that suggests a watcher wasn't someone like Momo or TwoFace who thought you could be Scum :/

[Hawk]

Yeah I don't think Nancy is scum here. I'd wager it's probably on or near the end of the wagon.

Dark said Titus, Momo, and TwoFace seemed most likely scum. And I don't really disagree with that. There was probably at least one if not two scum on that wagon.

I find it odd Lucca was basically hard townreading Grey's slot tho and then Titus replaces in and puts the slot to l-1.

I need to reread and see what happened there :/

Pedit: I don't like the idea of discussing the watcher leads either gives information to scum team. The watcher won't be effective if people keep screaming I'm fucking town watcher would be on me or Jae 100% of the time because it's WIFOM.

[Hawk]

I want to lynch him but there's insufficient support behind the push to do it atm.

Is this in reference to Uzi why do you want Uzi?

[Hawk]

I don't TR LUV no.

Titus is scum motivated because she's a valuable player late game as Town. Scum want to ML her if she's Town to save a NK.

That was to Hawk.

I don't agree with the below statement.

@ Nancy unless of course the slot is scum right that's an extremely meta based read assuming Titus is town. :/

Hmm LUV no but i haven't really paid to much attention to his slot. I'll have to review I think I had him pretty null which is odd I'm usually more aware of Uzi's town play :/

Pedit: We should get off of Nancy, and back to looking at who was on the wagon. :/

[Hawk]

Momo why is Nancy scummy tho? Like that logic is a bit reaching. Why kill Jae if Jae is like 100% townreading Nancy's slot. Like it makes no sense even if Jae was breathing down a partners slot why kill there.

Pedit: WAS THAT A FUCKING HAMMER 14 DAYS OUT WTF IS THIS GAME?!?!

[Hawk]

I'll hammer of NM confirms it's a guilty, but I thought for sure his day one play was drawing a NK with all the Watch puns...

[Hawk]

That's stretched than my stretch armstrong and his arms stretch forever.

Pedit: Too obvious. But in case he was being obvious then maybe real watcher would look there to get a guilty since scum might be watcher hunting d1.

[Hawk]

Why would scum be watcher hunting.

D1? Cause it gives at least one clean kill?

I mean it's just one possible start based off setup not that it matters.

Pedit: I'll just let NM say his peace...

[Hawk]

Hmmmm idk it's all Wifom where the watcher should have been just wait for NM. Also if this is your logic TB announcing it instead of letting NM claim himself when need be is terrible considering it just trades town for scum here for no reason. You could have tried persuading one of us that Nancy was scum. Tho if she is my heart says Aubrey and Fire are probably her partners. I doubt anyone's bussing her right now if she is scum.

[Hawk]

Who's even on the wagon?

Assuming it's L-1 Like they say everyone but you me fire Nancy and aubrey?

If it's only L-2 idk...

[Hawk]

Tho if she is my heart says Aubrey and Fire are probably her partners.

What makes you say Aubrey and Fire?

Fire because Anks slot was super weird D1 for me.
Aubrey is kinda guttish over Uzi but either one could be scum. Both of their play hasn't been remarkable. The fact that Uzi is even acknowledging this possible crumb to a guilty makes me think he might be more town especially if you were scum.

But it's literally mostly PoE Nancy. I know I'm green, I don't know why scum would be on your wagon right now bussing you. So last two scum kinda should be in Uzi, Fire, Aubrey.

If there is a scum on your wagon bussing you well fucking done scum team on covering your bases but that's playing with fire.

Pedit:
Yeah I thought that was stretchy.

[Hawk]

Why are you voting TB?

I think he's scum and no one seems interested in Titus.

I'm more inclined to stay on Titus. Besides the slightly opportunistic hop onto Nancy's wagon why else is TB scum?

[Hawk]

Yeah I know my play has been lackluster, I've sorted just tuned out with all the replacements. Ali and Ank replacing out did it for me.

Yeah I know what you mean I'm not used to reading slots so so many people replacing out makes it hard for me to read some people. Especially ssomeone like Titus... Like the fact that Lucca was town reading Grey so confidently when Grey didn't even think he had a reason to and then Titus coming in and flipping that read throws me off because I have to rationalize why the slot would do that. Not necessarily why one player would... it sucks because I would basically be calling Lucca conf!scum because of that read swap into Grey's slot flipping town.

Pedit: post #'s I'll go have a look but I want to know what you saw if I don't see it.

[Hawk]

Because I'm scum

FTFY

lynch meeeeeeee

Tbh Fire I am not very invested in this game cos I replaced in yesterday and I was hoping to roll scum or a juicy PR but yeah, Grey's slot is just a vt, sorry to disappoint

Scum slip. You're either a watcher or universal backup if you are town. The fact that you don't know this shows that you are scum

Someone please hammer Darklyn. He is going on my black list.

These?? I mean the first two are meh. The third I can get tho. That's not only a bit stretchy but also a big shade throw when you look at those surrounding posts. It's literally nitpicking semantics.

pedit:

Alright I can buy it. I'd rather us be looking at Titus but I'll vote here. VOTE: ThinkBig

[Hawk]

Tho if she is my heart says Aubrey and Fire are probably her partners.

What makes you say Aubrey and Fire?

Fire because Anks slot was super weird D1 for me.
Aubrey is kinda guttish over Uzi but either one could be scum. Both of their play hasn't been remarkable. The fact that Uzi is even acknowledging this possible crumb to a guilty makes me think he might be more town especially if you were scum.

But it's literally mostly PoE Nancy. I know I'm green, I don't know why scum would be on your wagon right now bussing you. So last two scum kinda should be in Uzi, Fire, Aubrey.

If there is a scum on your wagon bussing you well fucking done scum team on covering your bases but that's playing with fire.

Pedit:
Yeah I thought that was stretchy.

LUV is very capable of faking the play he's showed here. Bussing me wouldn't be playing with fire if there was a guilty, to the contrary, scum would want to be on that wagon in a flash.

While this is true about the bussing thing that assumes scum think you got caught by a guilty. NM was the last vote one you so even if he was crumbling like TB thought no one had time to be on your wagon before him. Basically if you were scum I don't buy that your buddies are Momo, Titus, TB or TwoFace.


maaaaayyyybee TwoFace but only because of how buddied up Alisae was to Jae D1.

[Hawk]

I won't lynch Nancy's slot today, let alone with so much of the day left. Give Fitz time to catchup.

Pedit: Momo: Why does Nancy kill JaeReed. Like seriously think about that shit for a second you give me a logical reason that is simple and I'll consider the slots lynch.

Second who are her partners if you think Nancy is 100% flipping scum because that would make me, aubrey, fire, or Uzi her partners unless someone got on that wagon hella early to buds. This lynch makes no sense compositionally.

[Hawk]

nancy and Drake are scumbuddies, third is in Titus Hawk and TwoFace

So you're saying Titus is leading a counter wagon on a scumbuddy?? Or that TwoFace jumped on this wagon because it would buy towncred or I am posturing to try and save a scumbuddy?

I mean the last one makes sense but the other two... eh idk.

Okay let me go over Nancy again. I still want to give Fitz time to catch up and post, we have plenty of time in the day rushing this lynch is a bad idea.

Pedit: See Titus NM makes sense to me as scum but Nancy still sticks out as odd and idk why.

[Hawk]

Wait are you both claiming Watcher??

[Hawk]

I would prefer you unvoting the town watcher

I would prefer you unvoting the town watcher

I counter claim Not Mafia

Lynch all liars.

[Hawk]

Wait for TB to come back, he will retract his CC

I retract my CC.

I didn't believe you were the watcher but was scum trying to draw a CC. I CC'd so I could get NKd and he real watcher watch me tonight. Obviously didn't work out as planned

This makes a hella of a lot of assumptions about people that I don't see how town could come to this conclusion. Why not just let an actual Watcher CC if you think NM is scum? If you were wrong you just royally fuck town. You were convinced not to long ago that NM was watcher then when he claims you CC wtf is this town mindset?

No this is scum who was trying to get a clean 1 for 1.

[Hawk]

yeah, it wouldn't be a clean 1 for 1 and now hawk moves up the scum list

Why is it not a clean 1v1. It actually netrualizes the watcher role for an entire night phase.

Yeah TB gets NM lynched and then is gonna get lynched tomorrow but it also gets rid of a watcher action at ight because you just have TB do the NK.

Like it does clean trade 1v1. Just not in the traditional sense.

I mean I guess in this setup it's not as optimal. I just don't want people to dismiss this as entirely town :/

[Hawk]

the wiki for this setup says AS SOON AS THE WATCHER DIES, a backup takes it's place so why would scum risk outting themselves to lynch a watcher only to have one immediately take over and essentially making them conf. scum?

1 for 1 and gets them an town mislynch and a night kill where they don't have to worry about being caught by the watcher.

So

TB CC's NM.
NM gets lynched flips watcher.
TB performs NK without worrying about being caught.
TB pleads case next day.

1 of 4 things happens.
We lynch TB he flips scum, lowest gain for scum net neutral.
TB convinces us he was saying what he was saying is town since y'all seem to believe this could be fucking town attitude. Scum gets a clean NK and mislynch
or either one of those happen kinda except the new watcher outs a guilty onto TB and sets himself up for target the next night.

I'm not saying that TB has to be absolutely scum because of his CC I'm just saying don't fall into some fallacy logic that scum wouldn't do this?

[Hawk]

Also that entire process assuming scum manage the second Watcher claim to ensure TB's lynch puts the game into 2v4 MYLO where the watcher dies at night.

Yeah fuck off with the scum wouldn't do this shit.

Pedit: Yep but if that watcher outs himself it gives scum a clear night going into MYLO.

[Hawk]

You realize if TB had held fast to his CC we go into tomorrow as lylo wanting to lynch TB. If he is town we can sleep and then if TB is still alive he is prime mislynch. The play was horrible as town and horrible for town.

[Hawk]

You realize if TB had held fast to his CC we go into tomorrow as

MYLO

wanting to lynch TB. If he is town we can sleep and then if TB is still alive he is prime mislynch. The play was horrible as town and horrible for town.

EBWOP

Pedit: I have no idea but I'm a little pissed at this gamestate now.

[Hawk]

Watcher just chooses not to out if they caught TB. There is no way we don't lynch TB if we lynch NM here.

Right in which case If TB is telling the truth and is town here we lose in MYLO if NM is really watcher. Cause mislynch today outs us into MYLO tomorrow right? it's 7v3 right now we go to 5v3 tomorrow.

[Hawk]

Watcher just chooses not to out if they caught TB. There is no way we don't lynch TB if we lynch NM here.

Right in which case If TB is telling the truth and is town here we lose in MYLO if NM is really watcher. Cause mislynch today outs us into MYLO tomorrow right? it's 7v3 right now we go to 5v3 tomorrow

with a mislynch

today .

EBWOP

[Hawk]

I'm pretty sure Titus is scum though maybe we can wing it?

I think so too but now I'm fucking paranoid about TB...

My lunch break is over I'll be back later.

[Hawk]

I think nancy is scum but I don't feel comfortable with L minus 1.

UNVOTE: nancy

I'd be ok with a Titus lynch but fitz isn't doing anything and Nancy was scummyAF

I would def prefer a fitz lynch. Replaces into pressured scum slot and has no idea how to defend himself.

Considering titus replaced lucca....eh. Feel better with a fitz lynch.

Fitz lynch is bad. I wouldn't have gotten panick voted if Fitz lynch was good.

Hey Titus why does Nancy's slot go from scum to town/bad lynch in 200ish irrelevant posts and a replacement. Like I'm not sure I'm seeing where the flip in read happens for you especially considering you started the Nancy wagon as a CounterWagon to 3 people voting you early on in this day.

Also nice catchup Fitz but I think you tunneled a bit too hard on that one post of mine and its jaded your outlook. I'm not scum. You know my town game isn't that great.

Can you explain why you're scumreading Aubrey? Also why you're townreading Titus? Concisely please I just need reference.

Pedit: I thought you said you weren't going to defend Nancy's rationale since you don't know what she was thinking?

[Hawk]

I think nancy is scum but I don't feel comfortable with L minus 1.

UNVOTE: nancy

I'd be ok with a Titus lynch but fitz isn't doing anything and Nancy was scummyAF

I would def prefer a fitz lynch. Replaces into pressured scum slot and has no idea how to defend himself.

Considering titus replaced lucca....eh. Feel better with a fitz lynch.

Fitz lynch is bad. I wouldn't have gotten panick voted if Fitz lynch was good.

Hey Titus why does Nancy's slot go from scum to town/bad lynch in 200ish irrelevant posts and a replacement. Like I'm not sure I'm seeing where the flip in read happens for you especially considering you started the Nancy wagon as a CounterWagon to 3 people voting you early on in this day.

Also nice catchup Fitz but I think you tunneled a bit too hard on that one post of mine and its jaded your outlook. I'm not scum. You know my town game isn't that great.

Can you explain why you're scumreading Aubrey? Also why you're townreading Titus? Concisely please I just need reference.

Pedit: I thought you said you weren't going to defend Nancy's rationale since you don't know what she was thinking?

Ok, I can't tell what if any of this is directed at me...

Hey Titus why does Nancy's slot go from scum to town/bad lynch in 200ish irrelevant posts and a replacement? Like I'm not sure I'm seeing where the flip in read happens for you especially considering you started the Nancy wagon as a CounterWagon to 3 people voting you early on in this day.

This part. There's really only one question there. Why do you townread Nancy's slot all of a sudden?

[Hawk]

Hmmm okay I guess that makes sense.

I am a little concerned cause after we started talking about claims and counterclaims I realized that Fitz wagon stalling out like that is really odd. Any decent scum player in Me Aubrey Uzi or Fire should have fast hammered. Even if they get SR to Hell tomorrow it would have brought the game to MYLO. So why didn't that happen??

[Hawk]

Too many vanity wagons right now. Hop on the Titus wagon.

Sure makes sense.

VOTE: Titus

[Hawk]

Vote Count 2.7

havingfitz(4):

TwoFace 966,

Not_Mafia

985,

momo

1375,

ThinkBig

1439

Town -

momo

,

ThinkBig

and

NM

smh....

Titus at one point was voting you too.

If you're town like I think then it's pretty easy to see that me Aubrey fire and Uzi are more likely town than not. Maybe one of us was scum and just missed the fast hammer to MYLO path but I don't think multiple scum would have missed that.

Meaning scum should be in Momo, TB, Titus, NM, and 2F right? Unless you're scum. If Titus flips town well... it doesn't look good for you unless Momo and TB are both scum since I expect NM to die tonight if he really is watcher.

I mean I could also be wrong this just makes the most logical sense to me right now :/

[Hawk]

Titus at one point was voting you too.

At one point everyone but Aubrey and LUV have voted this slot. What's your point? My point was just pointing out what I view as a sad, annoying irony.

Today. Today the 4 i listed have not voted your slot even when your slot was at l-1. If you are town and scum is in that 4 why do scum not hammer to go to MYLO.

My point is i know my card is green I think your card is green. I think it's a safer assumption to make that the four of us are town if you are town meaning 5 town, 6 if you count NM claim. Yes I'm banking a lot on you being town. If you are town you should agree with this no? If you don't please lay out logically where this is a less likely scenario than something else.

Right now I stand here.

Locktown:
Me
NM
Fitz.

Probably town.
Uzi
Aubrey
Fire

Scum maybe
2Face
Momo

Most likely scum
TB
Titus.

[Hawk]

Can fitz just die please?

Can we lynch Titus tomorrow if he flips town?

[Hawk]

It's bullshit but that's just at a glance I'll go over it now but I still think Titus is the best lynch today. If these dumbos would pull their heads out of their asses maybe it would make more sense to them.

That's just at a glance I liked it better when that slot was Ali.

Pedit: It was a joke NM we really should not lynch Fitz today. His lynch would be informative but I'm pretty convinced it puts us in MYLO. But if I'm really bad at this game and Fitz does flip scum at some point yeah I'll lynch Aubrey.

Ppedit: -_-;; My entire argument is based on me firmly believing your slot is town and that scum should have fast hammered you at L-1, don't glare at me Fitz I've been wrong before as town ask Aubrey.

[Hawk]

VOTE: nancy

Namely, your comments about the watcher. You insisted the watcher should be on one of you two and implied the watcher wasn't on you or JaeReed, which doesn't make a lick of sense. If you're town watcher, you would have seen JaeReed's killer and thus not be angry. Otherwise, you have no way of knowing if JaeReed was watched or not.

This is Titus forming a counter wagon on Nancy. Note that this also serves as a semi rolefish. Nancy is mad because she thought that her and Jae were the most obvious and universally townread slots and should have been watched but no one did because Nancy assumed if watcher had been a guilty would have come out super quick. The second part of the statement that says if you're town watcher, is a rolefish.

Despite all this Titus heavily scumreads Nancy's slot up until a replacement then magically Fitz is town again.

NO NO NO.

Besides Lucca's scummy play d1, Titus was also the L-1 vote for Darklyn d1 despite Lucca heavily townreading that slot. Which is extremely odd. Titus hasn't even caught up with the game a few posts prior but votes the leading wagon despite the slot before trying to scrape by some evidence that Grey was town and they had a reason to TR that slot.

So yeah Titus is scum. I am at work. I'll have more later.

[Hawk]

Not_Mafia and Aubrey being force replaced. Do not discuss until after postgame.

Is there a notification thing here? I meant to ping.

Gonna be waiting if you wanted something from NM Fire.

Titus why Aubrey? Also did you ask me a question earlier and I miss it? I'll answer whatever it was now if you'll point me to it. I got some time.

Pedit: I'll admit that Trio is basically impossible I think but mostly because I believe NM claim.

[Hawk]

Hawk, who are your scum-reads right now? If im being honest I feel like I haven't seen it enough from you.

If I'm right bout Fitz which I think I am. Titus, TB, one of 2f or Momo.

More confident in the Titus and TB reads than my 3rd read.

I have explanations in my ISO.


Pedit: So you voting Aubrey and then Uzi voting you back made it more likely Aubrey is scum?
Who do you scumread??

[Hawk]

Hawk, who are your scum-reads right now? If im being honest I feel like I haven't seen it enough from you.

If I'm right bout Fitz which I think I am. Titus, TB, one of 2f or Momo.

More confident in the Titus and TB reads than my 3rd read.

I have explanations in my ISO.

Who do you scumread??

Pedit: So you voting Aubrey and then Uzi voting you back made it more likely Aubrey is scum?

EBWOP

Some how I wrote my pedit before that last line and got things out of order.

[Hawk]

@Titus I know I just messed up my post lol my bad. That question was aimed at fire.

Okay so we don't have any overlap but maybe Momo... hmmm..

[Hawk]

Fitz are you townreading Lucca and Titus's slot still?? Why am I wrong about Titus :/ Cause I really don't feel like I am....

[Hawk]

Wait... Titus why wouldn't scum hammer Fitz? Especially if 2 scum are off the wagon?

Like I know you don't think scum would be so bold as to fast hammer but here me out.

This assumes you're right in your scum trio or at least in that Fitz isn't scum and Aubrey is.

You think Aubrey is scum.
Scum!Aubrey hammers Fitz - Fitz flips town
Aubrey NK's someone
Town lynched Aubrey next day for obvious Lolhammer/scummy intent or sleeps and then does so to move out of MYLO.

Either way we end up in 5v3 MYLO then if Aubrey is scum 4v2 MYLO or 3v2 Lylo if we sleep.

That seems pretty good for scum team to trade 1 for 1 to move into mylo/Lylo scenario. Am I wrong?

[Hawk]

Titus objectively who is the most scummy between LUV Momo and Aubrey for you.

[Hawk]

Titus objectively who is the most scummy between LUV Momo and Aubrey for you.

Aubrey and momo. Sheepy, avoiding comment. Trying to sneak places.
LUV is the most anti-town, but could be town lying to himself in rare instances.

Kay I see it now. Went and Iso'd Momos slot, I just wanted to hear what you had to say before I said anything.

I'll give it a chance. Do we want to wait for Aubreys replacement?

UNVOTE:

[Hawk]

We don't have a cop.

We have a watcher and even then if NM wasn't lying it'll be useless come tomorrow because that slot probably dies tonight.

[Hawk]

Also I haven't had a lot of time to delve in since we got our replacements real life stuff and all I'll try and make some good posts tonight.

Welcome Elena and Severa tho.

[Hawk]

Jesus christ. I need to catch up.

Severa: Why am I scum? Why is Titus locktown? Explain those reads a bit more in depth I'm not sure I see reasoning for those.

@Fire Why are you voting Creature??

Momo: Get in here and weigh in on Aubrey replacement.

Also I saw it earlier asked by someone but NM said he watched TB.

[Hawk]

Alright sure let's do this.

VOTE: Several You and me RC right here right now.

[Hawk]

Fucking auto correct I'm trying to be intimidating.

VOTE: Severa

[Hawk]

Is RC's cockiness AI??

[Hawk]

Cool only reason to townread you is bunk then.

After RC's slot flips scum lynch Creature.

Pedit: I can't read him for shit but his fucking arguments are baseless, he put his whole case on me onto 3 "oppurtunistic" votes I had early d1 that amounted to much of bunk.

He's using preflip associative like he already has this case figured out when no scum have flipped and all 2 of 3 people he's pointing at didn't hammer Fitz earlier in the day. it's just fucking insane logic.

[Hawk]

{Titus, Elena Fisher, Momo}
{Fitz}
{MysteriousFire}
{TwoFace, Lil Uzi Vert}
{ThinkBig}
{Hawk}

Titus is definitely town.
Elena is uncced Watcher.
There's a 0% chance that TTH was scum this game.

I'm pretty sure that nancy was town. Fitz is also towny independently. Wagon on them was really dumb.

I super townread Ankamius's replace out at the time and I still think that Firebringer's probably town.

LUV is more likely to be scum than not and I really don't like how it feels like he's playing like he is intentionally to avoid having to back down on obviously town emotional reactions.
TwoFace I can't really point anything to but I read again and there's a bunch of shit that gut pings me.

TB's complete brick wall thing that they're doing this game where they refuse to engage with anything is a massive scumtell for them and they've done nothing towny to make me reconsider.

I

read 76 the first time and I was just like yeah this slot is obvious scum. 241 was fucking awful. 434 was just like how is this guy still alive. Hawk is scum and they are getting lynched today.

Yes you did. :p

[Hawk]

I'm going back to Titus.

VOTE: Titus

I'm less confident with Severa despite not giving great explanations which RC isn't known for doing anyway as far as I can see I still hard townread Fitz/Nancy.

Titus makes a lot of sense to me still.

[Hawk]

VOTE: Hawk

Whatever Severa busses today. I don't really care to out yell Severa when I have no time for this.

:/ It makes more sense to me that scum was on Fitz wagon earlier.

I was a townread of yours I understand not wanting to get lynched but voting me when I'm voting you with the rationale that your top scumread is voting me because I'm his partner is bad logic.

Pedit: Momo, Fitz/Titus doesn't make sense. I can understand Severa Fitz but not Fitz Titus. Where is the associative there?

Why would Titus push his partner to L-1 as a counterwagon?

If Titus flips scum partners are probably TB's slot and 2f's slot. If Titus flips town it's clearly Fitz, Severa and Fire.

[Hawk]

Titus scum flip doesn't make me scum. Learn to play n00b

Probably =/= 100% confirmation either.

I'd be more inclined to believe that Fitz's wagon meeting resistance earlier in the day meant at least 2 scum on the wagon if not 3. I guess it's possible that Titus is scum and no one else on that wagon was scum but we will cross that bridge if that becomes the case.

For now tho I totally understand if you don't want to vote Titus, but if Titus flips scum you look bad for not wanting to hammer here, at least from what I'm seeing.

[Hawk]

Hawk, think about our interactions in other games. How did you want us to work as a team???

Circumstantially 3 things

1. I'm going to assume you're talking about C9++ thats still ongoing so I won't talk about it.

2. That was my first/second scum game take my play with a grain of salt. Also that situation was very different from this one.

3. How does that apply to this? Each player will play scum differently. Titus I don't think forms a counter wagon to Fitz/Nancy when he's being run up and then gets hard townread after words by the slot. Either way I'm voting Titus if he flips scum I'm less inclined to believe Fitz is scum because that seems like weak play to me. Just like how I think that Fitz wagon meeting resistance in this situation means he is probably town compounded ontop of some towny things I saw from Nancy and Fitz being independently not scummy this game.

@Fitz I mean it doesn't lock you guys there but you and Severa both pushing me while fire sits on the opposing wagon feels scummy.

Titus scumread your slot at some point or at least thought Nancy was scummy enough to counter wagon when she was being run up and now hard townreads it. Like that doesn't bother you?

It's just my PoV and PoE Fitz. I've been very wrong about alignments before and to be honest I'm not totally confident in this lynch. You hard townreading Titus makes me very wary, but I think flipping Titus here might give me the best information to move forward. Luccas slot was scummy to me d1. She was the l-1 vote on Grey's slot. You were her counter wagon of choice and now she townreads you? It bothers me a lot. I promise you but I want Titus flip and am more confident that this will flip scum and give me insight to the rest of the game.

Pedit:
Was that hammer???

[Hawk]

Omg Severa this is ridiculous, Titus was scummy. Lucca was scummy and it made more fucking sense than anything else that if I was right about Fitz/Nancy being town that fucking Titus was scum. We had 3 votes on him at the start of the day and he flips to Fitz and his whole wagon disappeared. I guess I was wrong and it is scum!Fitz. But more importantly if that's true you and Fire are fucking caught scum.

I see you trying to lump me with fire when it's obvious that the resistance to Fitz wagon was you and Fire refusing to bias.

VOTE: Fitz

I guess I was wrong 2f. I'm sorry :/

[Hawk]

I said yesterday that if Titus flipped scum it was obvious it was Fitz Severa +1. You make more sense than Momo or Uzi. 2f seems pretty obvious town to me we weren't exactly on the same page yesterday but d1 I townread Alisae.

[Hawk]

Omg Severa this is ridiculous, Titus was scummy. Lucca was scummy and it made more fucking sense than anything else that if I was right about Fitz/Nancy being town that fucking Titus was scum. We had 3 votes on him at the start of the day and he flips to Fitz and his whole wagon disappeared. I guess I was wrong and it is scum!Fitz. But more importantly if that's true you and Fire are fucking caught scum.

I see you trying to lump me with fire when it's obvious that the resistance to Fitz wagon was you and Fire refusing to bias.

VOTE: Fitz

I guess I was wrong 2f. I'm sorry :/

That's a scumclaim btw

Nice fail coordinating a quickhammer.

Hawk being scum assumes all of TwoFace, momo and havingfitz are town.

The fuck are you on about Creature? How is that a scum claim?? Where are you getting these fucking assumptions?!?

[Hawk]

Why did you carelessly put havingfitz to L-2?

Because PoE says to me that unless entire scumteam was Momo, You, and 2f then Fitz has to be scum.

You're suggesting that all 3 of them were town meaning that of the 4 not voting Fitz yesterday when he went to l-1 three were scum? Uzi Aubrey and Fire all missed a chance to hammer fitz send us into MYLO kill a claimed watcher with apparently no way to No lynch. Yeah no that's just bad scum play creature. Open your eyes if you're town. This is basically Lylo.

Was I a bit fast to vote yeah but I am convinced that there is no way Fitz was town yesterday and avoided that lynch. I thought maybe, just maybe 2-3 scum were on Fitz yesterday and the last scum didnt lol hammer.

It just seems unlikely that Titus flipped into a town and Elena was watcher that the other three votes on him at the time were scum.

What 2f said to me at the end of the day yesterday made a lot of sense to me and its more likely to me that 2 of fire, uzi, and Severa were scum not bussing their buddy so early in the day.

[Hawk]

Fuck.

UNVOTE:

I'm still fairly certain but I'm seeing something else that might make some sense.

Of note Momo and Uzi were on both Mislynches....

Creature give me your reads, and explain how Fitz could possibly be town?

[Hawk]

You're calling me confirmed scum for townreading and defending obvtown the last two days. Titus was town, I'm sure you recently realized that Fitz was town as well by Momo/Hawk piling on.
I get that sometimes as a bad player it's hard to understand what good players are doing and so you think that they're scummy but this really needs to stop.

This is bullshit. You can't possibly think that in lylo situation needing 5 to lynch that me and Momo recklessly throw our votes on Fitz as scum together piling in.

VOTE: Severa
I don't care which of Severa and Fitz we lynch but their is no way they are town.

[Hawk]

Bullshit that literally makes no fucking sense with the scum three you put togrther. Who was the hammer? your 3 is me Momo and Fire. Momo was already on the wagon and my vote made 3. If that scumteam even worked we would have needed one more town on the wagon. Your logic is bad. You are seriously slipping RC.

Pedit: The fuck? Why is fire scum for not understanding the setup. I thought we could no lynch too. I even said so yesterday in trying to explain why risking the lol hammer on Fitz made sense

[Hawk]

Right sorry I was implying that and you didn't say that Creature did. Still it doesn't make sense what does two people piling onto a single person provide while one talks about a no lynch it's ridiculous.

@2f Right but keeping the watcher secret doesn't help anyone if we lynch incorrectly today. Outing the watcher makes this more like a regular Lylo scenario since right now it's 5v3. With the Watcher at least we'd have some chance of never lynching incorrectly.

That being said, normally I'd want the watcher to claim if he felt like he was going to be lynched. This being a MYLO scenario I can see how it might be hard to wait till then.

I'd say leave it up to the watcher if they want to out but only if they're feeling pressure from the town.

[Hawk]

But Fitz is scum, so is Severa. You think Severa is scum vote him them fire!

[Hawk]

Fire talk to me why do you think Fitz is town Severa gives out nothing on the reason you surely have something.

[Hawk]

Why is Lil Uzi Vert town by the way?

I've been asking myself this for a minute now. He was on both mislynch wagons, townread Fitz, and came in sheeping Severa. Either lynchbait or scum probably....

I kinda actually like Uzi's reads earlier they made a lot of sense especially the Lucca/Titus read even if it didn't turn out right.

Creature aside from me where are you because my lynch is game over.

[Hawk]

Vote Count 2.7

havingfitz(4):

TwoFace 966,

Not_Mafia

985,

momo

1375,

ThinkBig

1439

Town -

momo

,

ThinkBig

and

NM

smh....

Titus at one point was voting you too.

If you're town like I think then it's pretty easy to see that me Aubrey fire and Uzi are more likely town than not. Maybe one of us was scum and just missed the fast hammer to MYLO path but I don't think multiple scum would have missed that.

Meaning scum should be in Momo, TB, Titus, NM, and 2F right? Unless you're scum. If Titus flips town well... it doesn't look good for you unless Momo and TB are both scum since I expect NM to die tonight if he really is watcher.

I mean I could also be wrong this just makes the most logical sense to me right now :/

Titus at one point was voting you too.

At one point everyone but Aubrey and LUV have voted this slot. What's your point? My point was just pointing out what I view as a sad, annoying irony.

Titus at one point was voting you too.

At one point everyone but Aubrey and LUV have voted this slot. What's your point? My point was just pointing out what I view as a sad, annoying irony.

Today. Today the 4 i listed have not voted your slot even when your slot was at l-1. If you are town and scum is in that 4 why do scum not hammer to go to MYLO.

My point is i know my card is green I think your card is green. I think it's a safer assumption to make that the four of us are town if you are town meaning 5 town, 6 if you count NM claim. Yes I'm banking a lot on you being town. If you are town you should agree with this no? If you don't please lay out logically where this is a less likely scenario than something else.

Right now I stand here.

Locktown:
Me
NM
Fitz.

Probably town.
Uzi
Aubrey
Fire

Scum maybe
2Face
Momo

Most likely scum
TB
Titus.

Titus at one point was voting you too.

At one point everyone but Aubrey and LUV have voted this slot. What's your point? My point was just pointing out what I view as a sad, annoying irony.

Today. Today the 4 i listed have not voted your slot even when your slot was at l-1. If you are town and scum is in that 4 why do scum not hammer to go to MYLO.

My point is i know my card is green I think your card is green. I think it's a safer assumption to make that the four of us are town if you are town meaning 5 town, 6 if you count NM claim. Yes I'm banking a lot on you being town. If you are town you should agree with this no? If you don't please lay out logically where this is a less likely scenario than something else.

Right now I stand here.

Locktown:
Me
NM
Fitz.

Probably town.
Uzi
Aubrey
Fire

Scum maybe
2Face
Momo

Most likely scum
TB
Titus.

Your points are logical. Scum can be logical too but I'll look back over my suspicions. It's certainly reasonable to think AL LEAST 1 scum was not on my L-1 wagon to avoid the mislynch for towncred. And two is still possible however slightly.

UNVOTE: Hawk

@Hawk...what are your thoughts on my points on TwoFace's reasoning so far?

I just want to go back to this.

My argument made a lot of sense to me because I believed Nancy was town and still felt Titus was scum. Notice how Fitz reacts to my conclusions, calls them logical, turns and votes off the wagon onto a person I thought was confirmed town (Aubrey) By my logic that Fitz was town that he was agreeing with it would have made more sense for town Fitz to vote onto the wagon right, or at least Analyze those players rather than vote someone off the wagon. When that Wagon starts to gain some traction, Aubrey gets replaced by Severa and immediately comes in spouting the similar crap as Fitz as to why Im scum and votes me. Fitz then unvotes Severa and revotes me after I flip onto Severa for coming in with weak reads scummy logic and lies.

I'm sorry but at this point I made a mistake I should have listened better to 2f and Momo that Fitz was scum because at this point the movement of votes makes much more sense to come from scum than town and Fitz was scum yesterday.

The simplest conclusion to make after this when Titus flips town for sure and NM was town as well is that Fitz is scum and the people off his wagon (aside from myself) are scum. From what was said and how he moved onto Aubrey then off of Aubrey back onto me, Severas inability to give an actual reason to townread Fitz they are partners and we need to lynch one of them today the other tomorrow and hope by the day after we can solve for the third.

Come on guys it's not hard.

Pedit: That sounds fine but wouldn't it just make more sense to have everyone mass claim then? Like I like that your idea puts no one at risk to get quickhammered by scum but why not just have the scummiest players by order claim you know like in lylo but with claims instead of votes.

We collectively come up with a ranking of town to scum and then claim in reverse order. This hopefully ranks people in such a way that scum is near the bottom and can't counter claim the actual Watcher and create Wifom

[Hawk]

So if the evidence is clear, can you people join me on Fitz. I know I have 2F with me but I still need 3 more people.

Sure it doesn't matter which of the two we lynch. Fitz and Severa are caught scum. Lynch one today lynch the other tomorrow.

VOTE: Fitz

2f, Creature, Uzi, Fire whichever of y'all aren't scum you have to get on here. It's 5V3 we need all of town to lynch successfully if scum doesn't bus.

[Hawk]

VOTE: Severa one or the other idc. Fitz and Severa are both fine lynches for the day.

pedit: Creature it's Fitz. I could buy it being Momo and he's hard pushing this lynch and ignoring Severa as distancing but I'm pretty solid that Fitz and Severa are scum together. But I am town, you got to believe me or town loses, I know I haven't looked the best here and that I'm not the best player in MyLo/LyLo positions but you've seen me make mistakes before. I've voted Fitz and he didn't get quick hammered like in Near Vanilla, I got it right this time as one of the scummier players. Fitz is scum, I was wrong yesterday on my read of Titus and it blinded me to this scenario I was convinced Fitz should be town because Nancy didn't seem like she was causing Chaos for Chaos's sake d1 and when JaeReed died and she AtE'd I felt like it was authentic and towny. But the rather lacking play Fitz has shown lines up with scum. Nancy could have used D1 and the JaeReed kill to create loads of WIFOM. Fitz voted Aubrey then unvotes at the slightest reason to "revaluate" very similar to how he voted and backed off Hapa in Duck duck goose.

FITZ IS SCUM CREATURE!! If you're town its gonna take all 5 town players to lynch him in this situation they don't have to bus.

I'm going to stick with Momo and 2f. If you're town creature you should be voting with us. Fitz or Severa. If you're determined it's Fitz or me please vote Fitz. I am a mislynch.

[Hawk]

note that absence of quickhammer which is going to give another scumpool of {TwoFace / Hawk}

Or me and 2f have been on 2 confirmed scum and the rest of town just isn't voting.... -_-; don't try and Wifom this up RC

[Hawk]

OMG FITZ IS SO SCUM

VOTES SEVERA

DON'T TRY TO WIFOM THIS UP!!!

I'VE BEEN ON YOU SINCE THE BEGINNING OF THE DAY TOO YOU AND FITZ ARE SCUM!

Jesus Christ let's just lynch this so I don't have to listen to it anymore. Please guys come on Severa has done nothing meaningful since replacing in that slot besides give crappy readslist and hard defend Fitz's slot and Titus's slot as town!

Not only that you hammered your Hard townread wtf does that make any sense at all??

[Hawk]

Hey scumbuddies, let's coordinate a quickhammer on Severa.

-_-;; I have plenty of sunglasses tyvm.

I said before I could do Fitz or Severa doesn't bother me which one.

[Hawk]

Lynch Severa then lynch Fitz tomorrow. GG2EZ.

Vice versa works too if Momo and Uzi won't vote Severa.

[Hawk]

What players think about momo again?

I'm unsold... kinda hoping he dies in the night so I don't have to think about whether this is fire bussing or town fire.

Could also be Uzi I honestly have no idea who 3rd scum is but I was leaning fire until he voted Severa. Now I'm not sure. I didn't think he's vote so early if he was planning to bus :/

Pedit: wait why just lynch Severa Fitz can come tomorrow??

[Hawk]

Hawk are you like trying to get revenge

No I think you're scum.

[Hawk]

Won't oppose a Severa lynch anymore.

VOTE: havingfitz

momo and me on the wagon

Creature what are you doing??

[Hawk]

Hawk, there's one scum between {you, momo, havingfitz}, remember?

Why can't there be two? Momo was a potential 3rd for me... I just thought fire would be more likely till he voted Severa

[Hawk]

I get gut feeling he is town.

-Fire

Why?? Also Severa Momo creature???

[Hawk]

There may be two, but there can't be zero.

If there's a possible two than you're sure Momo is town or I'm town because otherwise you're risking quick hammer...

pedit: That's some crazy theatre

[Hawk]

Or sure that Fitz is scum.

[Hawk]

I think you're probably town... I'm not sure about momo... 2f thoughts??

[Hawk]

VOTE: fitz

[Hawk]

Nice.

[Hawk]

Whew sweating bullets. Playing with fire there Creature

[Hawk]

Yeah holy shit UZI god damnit we got lucky

[Hawk]

♡♡♡ Severa, when Aubrey got replaced I was sad but this was the best replacement I could have asked for.

[Hawk]

I had it prepped waiting for Uzi to come back online as soon as Severa said lol I voted.

[Hawk]

Creature did you townread me at all when we were talking??

[Hawk]

Well, We weren't going to win anyways....

People were way too stubborn towards Nancy.

This helped us sooooooo muuuuucccchhhh.

Creature: I'm still really newish so don't meta me too much I'm really trying to grow better as both town and scum. My scum game is bad lol

pedit: Its okay. Fire MVP OF THE SCUMTEAM

Creature is hard. I can't read creature for shit unless I know he's town cause I'm scum.

[Hawk]

I'm the easiest player to read in the site. As long you don't play the stubborn way, you'll correctly read me most of the games.

I think I'm getting better at it but I need some first hand experience in scum games with you.

Also omg Momo. ♡♡♡ you man. you and 2f making life easy. I think me and Uzi were gonna be okay if we had to bus Severa cause the Wifom hopefully ensured Fitz was getting lynched tomorrow.

[Hawk]

I'm not sure why you were trying to bus me over lynching Fitz but given my history I can't be mad about it

I made no hard cases RC. I was just regurgitating 2f. I was trying to buy enough towncred so if Uzi voted Fitz we had breathing room. I was never gonna hard bus you but you kept pushing me I had to push back.

[Hawk]

Also we did pretty good on that quick hammer RC considering we didn't talk at all about it in mafia chat.

[Hawk]

You can release Mafia PT I'm good.

AUBREY WE DID IT ♡♡♡♡♡

Also I think the setup was fine. Just add one more town backup and I think it works out alright. Idk it might be too Town sided at that point but one more town makes us have to go through one more day.

I feel bad that Nancy left. And all the Grey stuff was just unfortunate .

[Hawk]

Uzi where did I start summing it up and how long did you actually suspect me??

I feel a bit out of the loop it's just a game guys I can't imagine not liking playing with someone so much that I would blacklist them. RC is pretty Abrasive but that's just how it is sometimes.

Ali once again pleasure playing with you. You make me a better player everytime I play with you.

I enjoyed playing with everyone this game

And thanks so much for math for hosting. except for some small things great job.

[Hawk]

Hey guys if any of you want to I'm probably going to In for stacked deck. I'd love to play with any of you again if possible, so if you guys want that's the next game I'm joining.

[Hawk]

Oh okay yeah that makes sense. My scum game is still very rough so it's not surprising I'm not very good at maintaining town appearance and probably fall into some bad habits.

Aubrey was town in that duck duck goose game. I think the difference between that and something like Tit for Tat is night and day.

[Hawk]

I swear early on here he looked different from Tit and Tat.

Little bit but I don't think it looked townie but then again I knew lol I'd have to read it again later with some less jaded eyes.