Open 681: Making Friends and Enemies [GAME OVER]
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Hiraki
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Hiraki
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Yuck.
Agreed (except maybe not the top TR part).In post 73, Transcend wrote:Anyways Darklyn is my top tr and the wagon on him is literal cow shit. Ask me anything.
I have a TR on Green Eyes but I think taking that wagon seriously is stupid - not scummy.
I have a bad feeling about momo and it stems to his join date but doing some quick research demonstrates that this may be abnormal. Why do this Momo?-
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Riley uses a lot of extra characters.In post 128, Korts wrote:Please don't waste the extra characters.
You know what's not chill? Acting like scum when you might not be scum. I'm defending you because the wagon structure seems too quick to be anything that leads to a scumlynch but other than that, I'd vote you in a heartbeat.In post 127, momo wrote:Yes but I have played on other sites so its chill.
To clarify, I don't think Nancy is 100% scum either. I can't tell based on her recent postings. I just think she's wrong. I'm going to stay on Transcend for the following:
In post 33, Transcend wrote:Actually no sorry scum telling in your first three posts is not gonna slide
You're GOING DOWN
VOTE: NancyCan you explain why you would call out a SR so early and then vote with it so quickly? I would call it RVS if you did not defend it multiple times.
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Read prior postings.In post 201, Rileycountant wrote:Hiraki, why do you scumread Transcend?
Yes, read prior postings.In post 211, Korts wrote:Is there anyone here who can make an actual case instead of just roleplaying madness?
I agree with Jae regarding 223.
I like ThinkBig 318 - even if I think it is too strenuous.
Re: 322 -
1) I don't think any reads on Korts are viable from a long-term perspective. I don't think he was very into this game.
2) Riley is a very pragmatic scumhunter. I understand that your wall basically states that she thinks you're scum because you're not taking the game seriously. That's her opinion - not really something that you can entangle into scumminess. I also think that Accountant's assessment in 202 is wrong. I've been following you all game and I haven't seen anything odd. I'm not sure on their alignment at the current moment.
Please stop joining games with Riley if you don't like her playstyle.In post 324, momo wrote:Can Riley, not Accountant, Riley, please explain why she can't type like a normal person.
Because typing like a hyper 5 your old girl is not genuine.
And not genuine is scum.
Do you want to explain how? Because I have a feeling I think I know what you're thinking and that is driving my SR to levelIn post 347, Transcend wrote:This is town!Accountant2-
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That's right - you want to lynch Riley and you have no care of whether she's town or scum. I'm not furthering this argument. Unless you have an argument against her words, stop trying to policy lynch Riley because it won't happen.In post 363, momo wrote:I want to lynch riley but I don't see that happening.-
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Responses:In post 189, Hiraki wrote:Can someone articulate anything that nancy has done that is actually scummy?
Anti-town, not scum.In post 191, Rileycountant wrote:YEAH!!! SHE KEEPS REFUSING TO PLAY THE GAME!!!
(Bolded for emphasis; Then proceeds to replace out)In post 192, Korts wrote:Well I have the L-3 vote on momo while calling Darklyn obvscum as a pretty fucking transparent thing that you don't do as someone who is trying to play the game -
But I don't think I have a real grip on this game
I actually didn't read the second part close enough and I want to push Rileycountant into a leaning SR but also I mentioned this fact. I also never got good feels during the JaeReed stuff, especially after skimming through the Banana Split game (might be different - it was the newbie game and not a major part of my decision but something that others may want to look into)In post 202, Rileycountant wrote:it's because of the fact that she's using fake reaction tests to essentially be able to have a read without explaining why(see: votes on Darklyn and us). This is scum blatantly pushing for whatever lynches they want without having the burden of justifying why they're doing so, and then hiding under trolly behavior to try and get away with it.
Going back to other people:
Fro99er is a holdover vote (Korts).
Wow - nothing.In post 305, Darklyn wrote:@Riley: not not really, I legit think nancy might be scum though
Transcend is probably the worst offense on the wagon for early game shenanigans.
I want Trascend/ThinkBig 10x more (later is like 2x more) but in order to get the game moving:
Vote: Rileycountant-
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It doesn't but now he has to explain his read - that's the juicy part.In post 408, ThinkBig wrote:This makes no sense at all.-
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(no explanation)In post 415, Darklyn wrote:hahahahahahaha
You can laugh but when she flips town, you're right next to Trascend.-
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How the FUCK is she supposed to defend herself ifIn post 419, Darklyn wrote:let her defend herselfIcan't even see the arguments she's supposed to defend against?
There's no OMGUS and recent ThinkBig postings confirm that.In post 421, Green Crayons wrote:Insert eyeroll emoji here. 318 is him coming back to the thread and OMGUS voting the person who had just voted him since the last time TB had visited the thread.-
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Addendum to the Hiraki tries to find nancy reasoning:
In post 265, RadiantCowbells wrote:sorry nancy but I'm obligated to bus you this game it's nothing personal I just want the sweet sweet towncred.In post 287, RadiantCowbells wrote:nancy I note taht you haven't said much to transcend about him voting you and hardpushing you: whyIn post 293, RadiantCowbells wrote:
well fuck if this isn't the spoonful of sugar in the corn flakesIn post 292, nancy wrote:
I can't answer until he does more things without influencing what he'll do.In post 287, RadiantCowbells wrote:nancy I note taht you haven't said much to transcend about him voting you and hardpushing you: why(enter nothing here)
In post 134, momo wrote:My vote remains on nancy because she just wants scum to hammer me at this point.In post 313, momo wrote:uhhhh nancy, I have so many problems with nancy's meta before this game. Her fucked up scum reading just push me past the line.
Again - I have NO problem voting nancy until someone gives me a legitimate reason to vote nancy. Until then, I am not going to vote nancy and I am sure this will result in a mislynch because it's illogical.In post 363, momo wrote:Should I put nancy at L-1 or is it too early???
Additionally, would much much much rather a Transcend wagon.
Unvote, Vote: Transcend-
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There are a lot of unreassuring things in this game and I think that focusing on one that is actually following up with what they said should be the least of your concerns rather than targeting them for actually being cohesive. ThinkBig also hasn't posted a lot. I'm just very confused that this is where your vote is. I didn't really want to look at it but your case on ThinkBig is defined as:In post 435, Green Crayons wrote:In post 426, Hiraki wrote:
There's no OMGUS and recent ThinkBig postings confirm that.In post 421, Green Crayons wrote:Insert eyeroll emoji here. 318 is him coming back to the thread and OMGUS voting the person who had just voted him since the last time TB had visited the thread.Spoiler: But See:
Also doubling down on safe vote with safe (pointing out anti-town activity) case against player he was already focused on (but not really getting attention) is not what I'd call reassuring.
TB is averysafe player. He also buddies through insults and posts in infrequently.
By the way, we're on Day 1 (specifically Page 20) and the parts where he was "off-topic" because two people were discussing the facts was when the two facts were most prevalently being discussed.
I don't think you're being intentionality bad here but I can't agree (or even understand with the buddying part) with anything that you were saying.-
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Hiraki Survivor
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I will appease you once Frogger, only because I really really really want your vote off that stupid and horrible nancy wagon that no one can identify reasons for.
Post was ignored and Trascend is on the nancy wagon for (enter reasons here)In post 136, Hiraki wrote:
To clarify, I don't think Nancy is 100% scum either. I can't tell based on her recent postings. I just think she's wrong. I'm going to stay on Transcend for the following:
In post 33, Transcend wrote:Actually no sorry scum telling in your first three posts is not gonna slide
You're GOING DOWN
VOTE: NancyCan you explain why you would call out a SR so early and then vote with it so quickly? I would call it RVS if you did not defend it multiple times.
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If this isn't safe, I would love to know what you think of what is safe.In post 421, Green Crayons wrote:Getting brownie points by calling a list--a list already questioned by another player--BS
The only thing I took out of those posts were where you said "so scum"In post 421, Green Crayons wrote:Super safe vote onto game's most popular wagon.
Which is the only thing that actually implies that you think he's scum in those statements rather than just a safe player overall.
OK but then you would question what he said in those posts, right? Because two of the things that you posted (i.e. "TB is safe" points) related to TB posting something that is safe relative to the context of the game rather than his own content.In post 473, Green Crayons wrote:- Also I don't care that TB posts infrequently in the abstract. It's what he posts when he does within the context of infrequently posting (so far, I understand he has V/LA on weekends).
I can't answer your third dash.
Riley's speech pattern was the most prevalent discussion at that time. From his Darklyn vote to the next post, there is an interval of an hour in which Momo came in and start being mad about it as he was in his earlier post. I don't think its unreasonable to talk about something relevant which I certainly believe is your point.
Now - I think if you're looking for ThinkBig to comment on the game, which is what I think you're trying to change your argument to, you'd have a lot more luck by just talking to him.
@Darklyn - YEAH FUCK US FOR ACTUALLY PLAYING THE GAME LOL-
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Either way is pretty meaningless in D1 with less than 20 pages down.In post 513, Green Crayons wrote:So I was interpreting your "safe" as in "conservative posting" (per your other comments about him not posting much), rather than in terms of him being safe in the substance of his posts (as I was using that term).
I said the latter because of your safe comments but I still don't think you're committed to that Think Big read after our current conversation.-
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I'll join you then. As a reminder, I have already called my grievances against Think Big's play (mostly as a pressure opportunity).In post 517, Green Crayons wrote:Let me know when we hit the magic number of pages that my suspicions suddenly have merit.
Are you talking about this post?In post 574, Rileycountant wrote:HIRAKI!!!! TB SAID THAT NANCY WAS YUCKY AND SHADE THROWINGSIES EARLIER!!! but he didn't follow up on that!!! in fact he hasn't talked 'bout nancy pansy at ALL!!!!! don'tcha think that's a lil scummy? I THINK IT'S BECAUSE HE WANTS TO AVOID THE SPOTLIGHT!!!!
Riley, that's not something you could ever vote on. Just because he didn't follow-up on a read doesn't mean a lot. It's the same reason why I don't agree with his reasoning on Darklyn. Now, if you want his opinions on Nancy, you could just ask him.In post 207, ThinkBig wrote:
Love the shades. This is all kinds of yuck.In post 204, nancy wrote:I like your fake hydra synchronicity though.-
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In post 434, Hiraki wrote:Addendum to the Hiraki tries to find nancy reasoning:
In post 265, RadiantCowbells wrote:sorry nancy but I'm obligated to bus you this game it's nothing personal I just want the sweet sweet towncred.In post 287, RadiantCowbells wrote:nancy I note taht you haven't said much to transcend about him voting you and hardpushing you: whyIn post 293, RadiantCowbells wrote:
well fuck if this isn't the spoonful of sugar in the corn flakesIn post 292, nancy wrote:
I can't answer until he does more things without influencing what he'll do.In post 287, RadiantCowbells wrote:nancy I note taht you haven't said much to transcend about him voting you and hardpushing you: why(enter nothing here)
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In post 409, Hiraki wrote:If you give me a solid reason to vote her, I'll join you.In post 417, Hiraki wrote:Your best bet on this wagon is that because you believe I'm defending Nancy that if she flips scum, you have a 1-2 punch. I'm not defending her if the only accusation toward her play that I can find is anti-town logic rather than actual reasons.-
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Reasons that Transcend thinks that nancy is scum:In post 623, Transcend wrote:
she's scummyIn post 620, hapahauli wrote:Can you explain why you're so confident that nancy is going to flip mafia?
Have you played in any completed games with her before??
no
In post 33, Transcend wrote:Actually no sorry scum telling in your first three posts is not gonna slide
You're GOING DOWN
VOTE: NancyIn post 34, Transcend wrote:Oh but you sigged me now i want to move my vote again
Can you honestly tell me that my sr on you is just an illusion?In post 79, Transcend wrote:She's scummy
WOW - I CAN'T BELIEVE IT. A REASON! GOOD THING WE'RE NOT ON PAGE 20!In post 99, Transcend wrote:nancy's 10 was a bad reaction to my vote
Trascend is on this wagon for a bad reaction on a FUCKING RVS VOTE.In post 623, Transcend wrote:she's scummy
I would like further explanation of this rather than a 2 sentence description of something that sounds much more complicated.In post 649, Rileycountant wrote:Hiraki: What it comes down to is that I simply don't believe nancy wrt her claims about the motivations/meaning behind some of the stuff she did, like switching from momo to Darklyn and back to momo.
Why is this a problem? I've made it very clear that I will vote nancy if someone gives a good reason. I've examined her posts multiple times and cannot find something that is worth more of a vote than the people on her wagon who are cruising on this wagon.In post 664, RadiantCowbells wrote:What you have done is discredit the scumreads on her.
If you're implying this is a meta read, can you give games? That would've been helpful 10 pages ago.In post 666, RadiantCowbells wrote:Like I know her play pretty decently and I see 0 reason to townread her.
#2 right here.
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Can we agree that Momo is not reading the game at a decent level?In post 689, hapahauli wrote:
Do you think both nancy and transcend are mafia?In post 687, momo wrote:After seeing Hiraki's full case on Transcend...just wow. I missed most of that stuff.
VOTE: Transcend-
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Plz pay.In post 786, Rileycountant wrote:Hiraki, I owe you a Transcend re-eval and explanation of why nancy is a lying scumfuck and will pay up soon.
I'm willing to believe this.In post 803, hapahauli wrote:Transcend and RileyAccountant are two mafia, go ahead and ship that.
So his flip does not influence your read in any way?In post 863, Grendel wrote:Like, only the first point was associatives with horror. The rest of the stuff was independent from that.
Good.In post 886, Grendel wrote:Oh look, the classic, "Either you scum or bad town" line.
Bad - but this is what irks me. I would really like to draw attention to 886 in comparison to Grendel's prior post.In post 886, Grendel wrote:Anybody that uses that argument to justify their reads is not good enough to discern who is and isn't a good player pal.
The second line is something created from the proofs in the first line. They might not be great but that's not the point. Grendel ignores that line and focuses on discrediting the second line about how the argument is bad based on the player rather than based off of the logic (which is OK at best).In post 886, Grendel wrote:
Oh look, the classic, "Either you scum or bad town" line.Darklyn wrote:
hapa was your second strongest scumread and he flipped town. I'm town as well and I don't think Jaereed is scum either.In post 873, Grendel wrote:I wish I got Darklyn lynched yesterday.
I can already tell that nobody is going to listen to me since hapa-guy flipped town. :/
You're either scum pushing for mislynches or you suck at reading the game.
Anybody that uses that argument to justify their reads is not good enough to discern who is and isn't a good player pal.
Comparing right back to his case on Darklyn and the associative tells, Grendel states:
How can you make that argument, where the player is not taking your entire case for granted, and then basically use a variation of that same argument against him? Glad that Frogger picked this up in 893.In post 863, Grendel wrote:Like, only the first point was associatives with horror. The rest of the stuff was independent from that.
I think a pressure wagon on Momo is literally the worst idea but I'm willing to see how it goes.
Is this based on JaeReed as a player or on JaeReed's stated intent?In post 932, Titus wrote:I am more surprised at JaeReed not pushing Grendel if he's preferred lynch.
Grendel is a coachy player.In post 976, Darklyn wrote:
Does anyone else think this post seems suspiciousIn post 146, Grendel wrote:Then don't act like lynchbait?
I think your town due to the fluidity at which you keep getting run up, but I do think you need to be more productive. Not just for your benefit, but for all of us.
In post 989, Transcend wrote:wait a minute i don't even remember if i scumread nancy this game or not
oh well
Not a fan of this in context.In post 990, JaeReed wrote:You did.
Accountant still owes me a Trascend re-eval because he didn't say what alignment Transcend was in like 10XX. I'm willing to hold off on that read because there's not a lot of confidence in that read from other players.
I think you're trying too hard to find nancyscum here from a town perspective.In post 1048, JaeReed wrote:You're not analyzing me at all, you're just flailing because you're caught and you're making blatant misreps because of it.
ThanksIn post 1071, Fro99er wrote:Neither has Hiraki
More reason to say this as town rather than scum.In post 1094, Transcend wrote:
Why would you say this if you're townIn post 1092, nancy wrote:I don't bus.
It'd be pretty sweet if she said that anywhere.In post 1099, Transcend wrote:The sentence: "i am town because i don't bus" does not make sense.
I HATE this.In post 1137, Rileycountant wrote:This could be a bus actually
Scum bad - will go over it in post-edits.In post 1151, Fro99er wrote:town or scum bad?
*very little senseIn post 1183, Fro99er wrote:that makes no fucking sense.
Momo is VI.In post 1246, Fro99er wrote:It's pretty clear momo doesn't give two shits about finding scum.
Ultimate proof that momo is the worst lynch possible.In post 1261, momo wrote:So is Nancy the day ending lynch. If so good.
If it is me. This is my deathbed post. When I flip town Vote Nancy. If I am night killed, vote Nancy.
Will come back later to discuss Riley's case on nancy/whatever else I promised. Running out of time with this wall for today.
@nancy: if u wanna stop being such a fuccboi and keep calling me scum and keep making frogger and all think you're town then maybe you should stop playing these stupid process of elimination games-
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No - that might change my opinion. Any links?In post 1268, nancy wrote:
Are you familiar with momo's scumgame?In post 1264, Hiraki wrote:Momo is VI.
Confused where you're coming from here.In post 1265, JaeReed wrote:What. That is literally one of the worst posts he could have made with masons alive. It makes no logical sense to think you'd be night killed here over myself or frogger.
VOTE: Grendel
PoE is quite alright in late-game and end-game but becomes pretty dull and not very reliable in the early game.In post 1267, nancy wrote:
PoE is how I gamesolve, sorry.In post 1264, Hiraki wrote:@nancy: if u wanna stop being such a fuccboi and keep calling me scum and keep making frogger and all think you're town then maybe you should stop playing these stupid process of elimination games-
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I'm lazy so I won't uphold my promise for today but I will 100% get to everything tomorrow. That being said, GC has solidified any doubt of a leaning SR.
Transcend/Titus/Grendel is where I'm at today tbh though the first is weakening because apparently I'm the only person who thinks he's scum at this point. I'm willing to forego that read until the end based off of crowd appeal.
Also hate the Titus vote even more because he made a huge big stink about how we have two options to play now and then threw them away a second later.-
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For example:
In post 590, Grendel wrote:Nancy has been looking a lot like last game sans that stuff that caused me to hard town read her.
These two statements are in the same post.In post 590, Grendel wrote:Early in the day I thought Nancy vs Transcend had a lot of scum-scum interactions.
Additionally, if you look at Grendel's reads-list:
Nancy is no. 6. However, before this, nancy is the player that Grendel has discussed with the most and has already claimed a pretty solid TR on. Instead of getting a green text, she's now yellow. This fits in with not making a splash more than follow-up reads.In post 602, Grendel wrote:Momo Fro99er Rileycountant Hiraki RadiantCowbells nancy ThinkBig GreenCrayons Transcend JaeReed hapahauli Darklyn
Nancyscum also makes sense given the RC death theory. Either she's being framed really well right now or there's a little bit more than coincidence here.-
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maybe he was but then he deflected it with his PR powers????????????????????????????????????///
Agreed.In post 1496, Green Crayons wrote:Wrong person to ask.
Sorry to hear that Titus, hope everything is OK!
I...unfortunately...agree with Momo about Titus and will be riding that wagon today.
Vote: Titus
I have nothing to discuss with the people who want to lynch me until they start bringing actual logic to the table instead of fallible PoE.-
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The difference is immeasurable.In post 1548, Titus wrote:
You used PoE in Double Day Unlimited.In post 1545, Hiraki wrote:I have nothing to discuss with the people who want to lynch me until they start bringing actual logic to the table instead of fallible PoE.
1) I used it when the game was at a standstill in order to propel the game (it worked)
2) My reads were extremely lucky and dead on in that game
3) I still had logic behind it - nancy hasn't talked about my play even once-
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@GC - There's no defense there of nancy there. Half of those posts ask for the reasoning for the votes and the answers I get back are inline with the ones given but more on this at the bottom (post-editing here)
Honestly, I'm a little inclined to self-vote as anti-town as it is because there's no use in me trying to actually win this game with nancy and her PoE godliness. The game is apparently already decided.
Titus' case literally boils down to:
1) I've been posting in other places and not posting here (completely false and misconstrued)
2) I've used PoE before (when I've already argued that I've used it in a completely different way)
I need to address GC's points separately because they demonstrate why I think he's town but also that he's kind of going with the flow which isn't helping anyone.
In his first post, GC states the following:
We can knock this into two comments that need further addressing:In post 1553, Green Crayons wrote:I also think Hiraki is a good lynch because he's been super noncommittal except to knock down cases which is safe scum play (oh I see he's now voting Titus based off of my comment we shouldn't follow her, which I said because she's naming really bad lynches like me and Nancy, not because she's top of the scum list. lol).
A) I've been noncomittal except to knock down cases
B) Titus comments
A - I think this is more important to identify because after posting all the stuff from my ISO (which I think is super fluff when you post all of that and then just write two sentences about it) but also because there's no reference to it in the explanation posts. So this is just fluff on me - I don't think it's scum-aligned but it's fluff.
A.2 - "Nancy defense posts"
I noted this above but you again said these were defense posts. Here are some posts that I made, in no necessary order, out of context, that you posted that were "defense" posts.
1) Can someone articulate anything that nancy has done that is actually scummy?
2) If you give me a solid reason to vote her, I'll join you.
3) How the FUCK is she supposed to defend herself if I can't even see the arguments she's supposed to defend against?
Again - someone could've quoted my posts and said "Well Hiraki, if you look at X, Y, and Z (these could be posts even - I just needed SOMETHING), this is why Nancy is scum"
But no one did that. That's my entire point. I don't think you can call asking for reasons defending as much as asking for reasons on why someone is town is scumhunting.
In hindsight, there is some defense but that's mainly due to very broad tells that usually aren't convincing (i.e. the Riley posts)
B - TB/Titus stuff
You are completely correct that I have not spoken about TB at length. It is hard to get a wagon started on someone who has 24 posts over the course of nearly 600 posts. I was pretty sure he was scum but there were other things to talk about that were more relevant. I'm not going to abandon my first SR (which everyone knew that day was Trascend) for TB. I abandoned it D2 just due to the fact that no one got on it and just no one was having it. Not to mention there was a bit of confirmation bias when both of the masons TR Transcend pretty hard.-
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Hiraki Survivor
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Hiraki Survivor
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- Posts: 12372
- Joined: September 16, 2010
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Hiraki Survivor
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- Posts: 12372
- Joined: September 16, 2010
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Hiraki
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Hiraki
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Hiraki Survivor
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- Posts: 12372
- Joined: September 16, 2010
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Hiraki Survivor
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- Posts: 12372
- Joined: September 16, 2010
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Hiraki Survivor
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That's not the problem. It's not that it's "apparently" visible it is INvisible.
I have pushed for the scumteam of you/Titus/Grendel since D2 and I have no reason to stop now. If you really want me to play by your rules, I'd vote you by now but I have no intention of doing that because my read on you is conflicted with everyone else TRing you while you have a "apparently visible" mindset that includes clear coasting. I'm not sugar coated by whatever previous experiences you have with other players here.
Nancy's case on me right now is because I didn't do X, Y, and Z - which a genuine townie would do - I am scum.-
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Hiraki Survivor
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- Joined: September 16, 2010
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