Mini Normal 2214 || Game Over!

[NotAHecticAlt]

Hello all! Not Hectic here, hope everyone is having a good time.

Let's wagon this: VOTE: Anya

[NotAHecticAlt]

Hey I'm here I completely forgot about this game.

[NotAHecticAlt]

UNVOTE:

[NotAHecticAlt]

To be honewt I was going make up some read so i could reread later but I honestly don't have any reads on skim yet - based on this page I would sort Dwlee as town though.

[NotAHecticAlt]

Monkey is town. Their posts have depth that you would not see typically from mafia.
I am not interested in that slot.

[NotAHecticAlt]

I would like some explainations from people on the monkey wagon why they are voting there

[NotAHecticAlt]

I think this is a good vote: VOTE: Jake

[NotAHecticAlt]

alright i think monkey man is scummy trying to analyze a 5-man wagon with not even more than 400 posts.

VOTE: humaneatingmonkey

jake/monkey could honestly be some great theater. im still a little pissed nobody sees that read.

This is town, albeit wrong.

[NotAHecticAlt]

Hi hectic

I'm not Hectic.

[NotAHecticAlt]

Just got back from the laundromat.

Hey Naha! How are you? Could you read the entire game and get back to me with your thoughts?

Why don't you start with explaining why you think monkey is a good wagon? I'm currently not available so it might help if the side with free time can respond first

[NotAHecticAlt]

Just got back from the laundromat.

Hey Naha! How are you? Could you read the entire game and get back to me with your thoughts?

Why don't you start with explaining why you think monkey is a good wagon? I'm currently not available so it might help if the side with free time can respond first

At first I wanted to apply pressure to monkey because the read I had on him was based upon a shared belief that Sigmund was scum (not very convincing to me) and because they were being voted by other players so pressuring them was easy.

Over the course of our interaction, I liked less and less of what I saw, so I reconsidered by townlean on him, and now I think he is a scumlean.

Personally, I don't care whether Sigmund or Monkey goes today, because in my eyes one solves the other.

What makes the interaction SvT to you?

[NotAHecticAlt]

This is blatant pagetop theivery!

monkey might be town. Hectic idk,I don't have a good readon him by tone yet.

No need to read my tone, just read for intent.

[NotAHecticAlt]

Hi Sigmund, what's your view on the game at the moment?

[NotAHecticAlt]

Oh Signmund started the wagon? That leans town.
I don't see how that means they're SvT however.

[NotAHecticAlt]

So you don't actually scumread either of them?

[NotAHecticAlt]

Just got back from the laundromat.

Hey Naha! How are you? Could you read the entire game and get back to me with your thoughts?

Why don't you start with explaining why you think monkey is a good wagon? I'm currently not available so it might help if the side with free time can respond first

At first I wanted to apply pressure to monkey because the read I had on him was based upon a shared belief that Sigmund was scum (not very convincing to me) and because they were being voted by other players so pressuring them was easy.

Over the course of our interaction, I liked less and less of what I saw, so I reconsidered by townlean on him, and now I think he is a scumlean.

Personally, I don't care whether Sigmund or Monkey goes today, because in my eyes one solves the other.

Ok so what does the end of this sentence mean? Because I think Monkey is town.

[NotAHecticAlt]

Link to VC on page.

I'm sorry if you are town, but I'm now scumleaning you.

show your progression

[NotAHecticAlt]

@Sigmund, just read your ISO - you seem focused on only a select few slots, can I get your thoughts about some people who you haven't expressed reads on? In particular I'd like you to comment on Jake v. monkey+you - as well and perhaps explain why you wish to push eliminations early here.

[NotAHecticAlt]

I don't think any of your reasons are particularly good reasons to scumread someone. In fact I'd go as far as to say the posts you linked actually lean more town, other than the last one which is NAI at worst.

[NotAHecticAlt]

Yeah I think I'm comfortable with my vote here at this point. I'd like to talk to some other players if possible, but I think this conversation has reached it's usefulness unless you are planning on towntelling or perhaps spewing some partners.

[NotAHecticAlt]

Just to sorta elaborate on why I think Jake is scum here - The way they are treating Sigmund, vs how they are treating monkey is very indicative of a scum who has to fake reasons to scumread people and be uncharitable in that regard.

When monkey was refuting Jake's push on them, pointing out that Jake was saying they scumread Sigmund, and that it made no sense for them to sheep onto Sigmund in the way he hid, shows a doublethink in Jake's progression. It makes no sense to try to say that monkey is scum for it as monkey is correct in their rebuke against the push on hem.
Jake is quite blatantly trying to set up back to back lims here based on how they are also treating Sigmund slot(or there's a chance that these are 2 scumbuddies, but I lean not for now.) Absolve responsibility of a monkey town flip by pointing it at the person starting the wagon looks to be Jake's goal at the moment. Scum don't think too far ahead and this is a pretty cut and dry plan that would make sense from a scum perspective.

In my wagon:

→ Sigmund, whose current activities include desperately pushing for a quickhammer before page 10 on a slot he doesn't have a read yet, throwing meaningless votes, and going for an OMGUS wagon for bogus reasons.
→ Johnny, who agrees that my thought process is "fake af", but hasn't really demonstrated why. (You really think my thought process is fake, in contrast to Sigmund here?)
→ Anne, who thinks Sigmund is "moving the game forward and causing people to make positive statements." (How??)
→ Jake, who thinks I was town because I pushed Sigmund but still puts his vote on my wagon anyway despite that it's Sigmund that started it. This guy even actively tries to stop people from discussing Sigmund, the loudest player on this game, for no apparent reason. (Why are you even doing that?)

Yeah. I'm SURE this is a town-motivated wagon. I have no idea why people think Sigmund is town for how he's playing here.

this post here is very towny - it's rife with town frustration that no one is looking at the motivations of why people are voting here, as well as providing analysis on slots who are voting them.


If Jake is really scumleaning Sigmund, why are they not more suspicious of any wagons they start on another player?
It makes no sense to me from a town perspective. Him trying to turn it around on monkey for pointing it out is just way out of pocket.

[NotAHecticAlt]

Not to pre-flip associative, but I don't see myself living to day 2 at this point in a Jake scum world - so I'd also bin T3 as scum alongside Jake.

[NotAHecticAlt]

Okay sigmund is town.

Okay sigmund is town.

Could you elaborate on this?

Okay sigmund is town.

Could you elaborate on this?

It's the deliberate attention grabbing stuff scum usually want to avoid early game.

Okay sigmund is town.

Could you elaborate on this?

It's the deliberate attention grabbing stuff scum usually want to avoid early game.

Do you think this is a usual game?

Sigmund seems to be acting consistently here. Without knowing what their main is (if they are an alt), I can't conclusively say for sure if this is for this one game, or if they have any completed games that I can drool over.

I checked to see if he had a wiki page, but he didn't.

I doubt Sigmund just gives up his main account here.

sigmund could be town but i have no clue what his goal is with his flopping around on the ground like a fish

Do you have any thoughts about the game, not regarding Sigmund?

these interactions feel partnery

[NotAHecticAlt]

I think jake is town but less sure on that one.

I townread sigmund and idk about Jake.

[NotAHecticAlt]

I'm also more 50/50 now about Sigmund being unpartnered in this case after reread - but I would venture to say that its a bad tinfoil from experience and that the game is never that easy.

[NotAHecticAlt]

no

[NotAHecticAlt]

My tentative gun to head solve is Rae/T3/Jake at the moment. Rae has also displayed a similar level of uncharitableness. I initially put them as town earlier, based on 2 posts but after reading their entire ISO, and reading the rest of the players and trying to sort them, Rae ended up above T3+Jake. I'd say there's a good chance I'm wrong on this read and I'm misreading someone higher in my reads but I like this as a starting point for a solve/PoE.
Johnny is also on my radar low on my list, and could slot into that team as well.

However I don't believe the whole scumteam piles onto a townie this early very often, so I'm a bit noncommittal to this solve.
Dwlee + Shiki + monkey are my town pile
Anya + Messy Anne are right below in townleans
Sigmund I would put at a leantown null here.
Opposites slot hasn't spoken - could be PoE'd however
Rae and Johnny are below null. Not quite scummy but there were some posts that said "yeah this could be town actually".
Jake + T3 are firmly in my scumread at this point. T3 moreso because of the associative with Jake here. I've explained already these 2.

[NotAHecticAlt]

Naha, do you think Sigmund is Scum or not?

I'm also more 50/50 now about Sigmund being unpartnered in this case after reread - but I would venture to say that its a bad tinfoil from experience and that the game is never that easy.

[NotAHecticAlt]

I think Sigmund's alignment will become very obvious as the game goes on FWIW. They seem like a very emotion driven player and that from experience reads fairly easy.

[NotAHecticAlt]

Wait a second Naha, You seemed surprised when you learned that Sigmund started a wagon on Monkey, which you townread them for it. But you later admitted that you thought Monkey was town. How does that track?

It tracks because I have the ability to know that townies can be wrong.

[NotAHecticAlt]

There are 4 players currently voting monkey, there are only 3 confirmed scum. There is 1 minimum townie voting there - so granted I am correct about monkey being town it should be obvious even within this game that this is a proven fact.

[NotAHecticAlt]

Wait a second Naha, You seemed surprised when you learned that Sigmund started a wagon on Monkey, which you townread them for it. But you later admitted that you thought Monkey was town. How does that track?

It tracks because I have the ability to know that townies can be wrong.

Then why- for a reason other than I am always scum *eyeroll*- do you not give me the same charity?

It is the way you approached the wagon and the progression being unreasonable.

You joined the wagon later on when it started getting hotter, defying a read on a player that started that very same wagon.

This is why you are being suspected - NOT because you voted someone I townread, but because of the circumstances surrounding that vote and the reasoning being inconsistent and explained in a way that is uncharitable to the points monkey made.

There is a difference in approach here. And I won't be tolerating any manipulation of what I am pointing out with any "gotcha!" with situation that clearly have different levels of nuance to them.

[NotAHecticAlt]

Man, I feel like forgetting about this game for like 2 days straight and coming back to this content gave me replace-in clarity and it feels good.

[NotAHecticAlt]

Dwlee, what are your thoughts on the discussion these past couple of pages?

[NotAHecticAlt]

Wait a second Naha, You seemed surprised when you learned that Sigmund started a wagon on Monkey, which you townread them for it. But you later admitted that you thought Monkey was town. How does that track?

It tracks because I have the ability to know that townies can be wrong.

Then why- for a reason other than I am always scum *eyeroll*- do you not give me the same charity?

It is the way you approached the wagon and the progression being unreasonable.

You joined the wagon later on when it started getting hotter, defying a read on a player that started that very same wagon.

This is why you are being suspected - NOT because you voted someone I townread, but because of the circumstances surrounding that vote and the reasoning being inconsistent and explained in a way that is uncharitable to the points monkey made.

There is a difference in approach here. And I won't be tolerating any manipulation of what I am pointing out with any "gotcha!" with situation that clearly have different levels of nuance to them.

If you based your entire read of someone off of "Well they think like me, so they're +town", would you want to take the first reasonable chance to get more from them?

I may have scumread Sigmund, but that is irrelevant because I came into this game from the get go with a "I am fallible, I make mistakes, I should try to re-evaluate my reads from time to time" mindset which meant in that time doing something to make it easier to re-evaluate Sigmund later (getting a better grip on what Monkey's alignment is.)

I will admit that my execution was shit, terrible, god-awful, and that I took mental shortcuts, and almost gave up the mindset I game into this game with when I dealt with Monkey, and for that I apologize for not being a better player.

However

, what I did was in earnest investigation of Monkey's alignment.

I'm not interested in Gotchas. They bore me, because they almost always shut down any reasonable conversation, which devolves into pre-written scripts about how the other side bad and whatnot. That discourse is boring, pointless, and very draining.

You're going to have to find me a scum if you wish to make me change my mind on you because as far as I am concerned you intention slipped with your treatment of monkey thus far.

ayy lmao it only took 3 days to alt slip.

[NotAHecticAlt]

(that was me btw i mainslipped)

[NotAHecticAlt]

not that it wasn't obvious from typing style/posting times but was hoping to hide it out for a little longer lol

[NotAHecticAlt]

VOTE: JakeTheWolfie Yes finally

Any other thoughts?

[NotAHecticAlt]

also gotem

[NotAHecticAlt]

Thanks for the thoughts monkey, much appreciated.

[NotAHecticAlt]

monkey is this overarching style of play just ur thing or what. i can't gather why you feel so jam so many words into ur fucking posts. i thought it was scummy before and i think it's scummy now.

Why is it scummy?

[NotAHecticAlt]

Rae is weird for voting me because I didn't think that was a good reason, but I'm not sure if it's a made-up reason. Messy Anne feels like they were trying to put their vote on something productive, but I have no idea what's on their head.

Accurate! Messy Anne wants to help and do good, but is bad at game and doesn't have a lot of time. Johnny and Sigmund felt good at the time so I sheeped.

Can people go into their Johnny read? People seem to be scum reading him but he feels the most town to me other than Sigmund. Maybe tied with Anya

If anybody (Jake) thinks my sigmund read is off base I'll give it a second look later but I'm pretty sure of this one still

I don't think Johnny has done/said anything that is close to the edges of his scumrange yet. We're still well within it and thats reason for concern for me

[NotAHecticAlt]

Jake feels like the kind of player who would post a lot less and with fewer words as wolf be more cagey

idk he feels injectionbaity and those kind of players usually are

So what about my points against them? Do you have any comment on that? Because this is an assumption about play of a player you don't know vs more standard scumplay(inconsistent words to actions, uncharitableness towards certain slots, etc.) scum stuff.

[NotAHecticAlt]

holy fuck this game is just full of people I want to murder-rate but none of them will die

Why did you vote T3 over Jake?

[NotAHecticAlt]

Anyone around?

[NotAHecticAlt]

What are your thoughts as a member of the not!Hectic PoE club

[NotAHecticAlt]

I'm actually crossfaded but I just need some back and forth to help my view on this game at this point.

[NotAHecticAlt]

im fairly set on Jake based on their treatement on monkey. can you talk about your shiki scumread? I find that slot to be fairly towny when reading it.

[NotAHecticAlt]

I'll be honest - I forgot.

I need to reread to figure out what pinged me so heavily town.

[NotAHecticAlt]

OK I don't know why past me thought shiki was towny - I am a big dummy.
Idk if pressure towards that slot will help with sorting but also I don't like the idea of letting go of the Jake wagon

[NotAHecticAlt]

mmm yes yes dwlee you can be town as well.

this good post

mmm yes yes dwlee you can be town as well.

this good post

assuming it is the wanting results thing unless you see something else guess i should have asked that first

i think dwlee really thought they could catch someone out with a fake lolhammer. it's town spirit. does that answer u shiki

yes! it is the wanting results thing!

dwlee takes an action (in this case e-2 already on wagon fakehammer) > dwlee wants said action to have netted results > dwlee is likely town (or

knows

but eh)

this is a very transparent and logical sorting process that's very hard to fake as scum

Oh this is like what i did townread I remember now.

But I think their lack of votes/pushes is a bad anti-town gimmick that is designed to make them unreadable early game

[NotAHecticAlt]

Everytime monkey posts the more like I think they are town.

[NotAHecticAlt]

Request: please don't spam dots to get page tops, it makes the game harder to read when looking back as well as looking at the ISO for votecounts.

We're all fine if the vote counts aren't a page top :/

And it influences the game by pushing to a new page extra early and potentially hiding stuff from people.

[NotAHecticAlt]

You can go back and look/requote things if you want, for fear of them getting lost.

Waiting to hear back on a sub-in for Opposit3s.

I disagree with this but it's a post game discussion to have and it's been impacting my reading thus far and has influenced me in this game alone.

Just stating it was bothering me here.

[NotAHecticAlt]

i have been reading and i dont think the monkey is town. i buy into the theater so im at we can kill both of them.

other collage of thoughts

• shiki is very town and anyone who doesn't see that is an idiot. i defend this read with my life. and it's just because art.
  
  
• johnny is brownie townie. his posts don't feel laced with any agenda or needing to worry about partner.
  
  
• anya was town earlier but then she dropped off. i dont have a deeper reason beyond it right now.
  
  
• sigmund sits null but possibly more north. his sword swining stopped once he got all the attention.
  
  
• i liked dwlee a bit earlier but he has an opposite effect of sigmund in a way. sigmund spends his time hackin and slashin while dwlee comes in with a calculated katana strike on one person. but then he's back to the shadows. anya im stealing your gig please rate 5-10 thanks.

no thoughts on the others im not paying attention to ur posts brain empty.

Really? No opinion on me?

Why is monkey scum though?

[NotAHecticAlt]

you have never explained your read on me other than the length of my posts.

that is my read on u bub. townies don't need to spend time makin curated bullshit. idk if it's your style but if it is damn son it's scummy. your explanations are all dialed up to 11 and for what? overreacting.

I don't think monkey overreacted.

[NotAHecticAlt]

I don't even need a claim whoever hammers it gets free towncred

[NotAHecticAlt]

not even not hectic wants to explain 471 to me

It is a string of posts that feel as though they are partners talking in thread, I'm not sure what there is to explain, I provided my analysis on it.

[NotAHecticAlt]

The ending of it is an awkward shift to "ok enough interacting with partner let me move elsewhere".

[NotAHecticAlt]

My tentative gun to head solve is Rae/T3/Jake at the moment. Rae has also displayed a similar level of uncharitableness. I initially put them as town earlier, based on 2 posts but after reading their entire ISO, and reading the rest of the players and trying to sort them, Rae ended up above T3+Jake. I'd say there's a good chance I'm wrong on this read and I'm misreading someone higher in my reads but I like this as a starting point for a solve/PoE.
Johnny is also on my radar low on my list, and could slot into that team as well.

However I don't believe the whole scumteam piles onto a townie this early very often, so I'm a bit noncommittal to this solve.
Dwlee + Shiki + monkey are my town pile
Anya + Messy Anne are right below in townleans

Sigmund I would put at a leantown null here.

Opposites slot hasn't spoken - could be PoE'd however
Rae and Johnny are below null. Not quite scummy but there were some posts that said "yeah this could be town actually".
Jake + T3 are firmly in my scumread at this point. T3 moreso because of the associative with Jake here. I've explained already these 2.

[NotAHecticAlt]

What's your point shiki?

Do you have any stances this game btw?

Minus townreading jake clearly

[NotAHecticAlt]

shiki what do you think of Jake?

seems townier than most of the wagon

Names.

[NotAHecticAlt]

Its that they literally like go at each other then immediately split off elsewhere.
It's awkward. It's not natural.

[NotAHecticAlt]

shiki what do you think of Jake?

seems townier than most of the wagon

Names.

you johnny t3

What's scummy about me?

[NotAHecticAlt]

do you just not read my posts?

Yeah the vast majority are just questions and then the rest looks like discrediting.

[NotAHecticAlt]

If you think Jake is town - then you're doing a poor time trying to diffuse his wagon here, don't you agree?

[NotAHecticAlt]

What's scummy about me?

still having trouble seeing how that post was made, though need to look at it more with what you said, the way you said i was town then discussed with johnny then said forgot then remembered when monkey pointed out what he thought was towny seemed pretty ??? to me, interactions with johnny awkward,

Is this how you normally talk or are you having trouble making bullshit up about my slot?

[NotAHecticAlt]

Are you preflip associating me with a scumread?

[NotAHecticAlt]

Rhetorical question because the answer is, yes you are. And I'm currently browsing your previous games to see what your voting habits actually are.

[NotAHecticAlt]

Are you preflip associating me with a scumread?

yes? your stance on t3/jake doesn't make sense as you say t3 more likely scum but keep only pushing jake and johnny hard committed to 'not t3' so the positioning makes sense when i squint

I never said t3 more likely scum

[NotAHecticAlt]

shiki, what are you doing? you are misframing me. i think you are potentially jake's partner because you have omitted some critical things about his wagon from your read on him that you have not made a comment on, and now i'm forcing you to comment on it and I didn't think I had to.

At this point i'm not as sure and feel as though shiki could be scum that is trying to take advantage of Jake suspicion and is scum themselves and trying to distance away from the wagon and get towncred from it and then push people such as myself later to chain mislims.

[NotAHecticAlt]

I'd say that Jake misrepresenting monkey and their uncharitableness towards the slot counts as critical information, especially when it's been brought up at least twice now.

[NotAHecticAlt]

UNVOTE:

no quickhammers on my watch

[NotAHecticAlt]

At this point i'm not as sure and feel as though shiki could be scum that is trying to take advantage of Jake suspicion and is scum themselves and trying to distance away from the wagon and get towncred from it and then push people such as myself later to chain mislims.

ah yes have you tried applying the thing you applied to johnny for some reason to me

the uh 'scumrange'

Are you outside of your own scumrange?

Can you clarify if you think this is the case?

[NotAHecticAlt]

it means that my T3 read is more of a preflip read rather than independently scummy.

[NotAHecticAlt]

I don't know Shiki's meta, thus I cannot make that assertion, however if Jake flips green it certainly feels this is what they are trying to do subtly, that is until I called it out.

[NotAHecticAlt]

I don't know Shiki's meta, thus I cannot make that assertion, however if Jake flips green it certainly feels this is what they are trying to do subtly, that is until I called it out.

you've played with me as mafia but it would be unfair for me to cite that as a typical game due to the circumstances of it

Avalon?

[NotAHecticAlt]

OH its you

nvm shiki town lol

[NotAHecticAlt]

VOTE: Jake

[NotAHecticAlt]

Never fear, for I am here!

Scum entrance

[NotAHecticAlt]

i think dwlee really thought they could catch someone out with a fake lolhammer. it's town spirit. does that answer u shiki

yes! it is the wanting results thing!

dwlee takes an action (in this case e-2 already on wagon fakehammer) > dwlee wants said action to have netted results > dwlee is likely town (or

knows

but eh)

I like this logic

Shiki/Rae/dwlee is my current townblock

Rae?

[NotAHecticAlt]

Off of a tone read?

[NotAHecticAlt]

progressing the game isnt alignment indicative lol what

[NotAHecticAlt]

progressing the game isnt alignment indicative lol what

I’m not debating that point
I’m saying from my point of view, Jake has actually done more despite my disdain for his contributions in practice
So by that token, Messy Anne should be townreading Jake as well

ok fair


also why did you have to towntell, I was hoping you would scum tell and make this game easier

[NotAHecticAlt]

NAHA, you haven't told me about the shiki metaread first

[NotAHecticAlt]

You're not the first one to say it, I don't understand why people think that.

[NotAHecticAlt]

Um..mafia have daytalk

[NotAHecticAlt]

Mafia have daytalk.
Mafia are multitasking.
The alignment distribution is 9:3.

SAMPLE ROLE PM

You are a

Vanilla Townie

.
You have no abilities.

You win when there are no mafia aligned players alive and there is at least one town aligned player still alive. Please confirm by summarizing your role to the moderator.

Game thread can be found here.

[NotAHecticAlt]

i still think monkey is town and sorry i should have taken off the accelerator on jake because he did towntell at the end and I let myself confbias.

[NotAHecticAlt]

i still think monkey is town and sorry i should have taken off the accelerator on jake because he did towntell at the end and I let myself confbias.

putting vote back on after saying 'not going to allow a quickhammer' is !!! !!! !!!

I had confbiased my way back into a scumread and thats my b

[NotAHecticAlt]

Quickhammerers are always a good starting place for suspecrs on wagon though: VOTE: Sigmund

[NotAHecticAlt]

What makes me scum Sigmund?

[NotAHecticAlt]

Why did you quickhammer onto Jake?

[NotAHecticAlt]

You still wanted the monkey hammer earlier that day - what changed your mind to Jake?

And no I don't give as shit how big your ego is, you're not god's gift to mankind, and you lowkey give me banned user vibes so don't fuck with me.

[NotAHecticAlt]

DAY ONE

VOTECOUNT 1.10 - FINAL

[7] Jake the Wolfie:

Dwlee99, humaneatingmonkey, JohnnyFarrar,

T3, Rae

, NotAHecticAlt,

Sigmund

—

HAMMERED

[2] T3:

Anya, Messy Anne

[3] Not Voting:

Gamma Emerald, shiki, Jake the Wolfie

With 12 alive, it takes 7 to eliminate.

The deadline is in (expired on 2021-06-03 22:52:36).

MOD NOTES

• Please let me know if there are any errors, doing this by hand.

• Joined mod ISO

•

there is 100% scum within this range here - people who just were pushing the wagon up further btw

[NotAHecticAlt]

(bolded)

[NotAHecticAlt]

there is 100% scum within this range here - people who just were pushing the wagon up further btw

have you checked overlap with those pushing up other wagons (anya/jake)?

I wanna more check overlap between monkey/jake

[NotAHecticAlt]

Also softing this here but someone here should have potentially gotten a message from me, this will potentially be useful info down the line based on what the result is.

[NotAHecticAlt]

Honestly gun to head on those 3 I bet Rae, but I like a vote on non hectic, Anne, or maybe monkey

I don't see how any of these make too much sense fmpov.

[NotAHecticAlt]

Honestly gun to head on those 3 I bet Rae, but I like a vote on non hectic, Anne, or maybe monkey

Actually this post made me gain a read that I think gave me better clarity that explains my weird feeling of this gamestate, which I can confirm later if I'm right and pretend I never said anything if I'm wrong.

[NotAHecticAlt]

Let's just say it leans Johnny town for ~reasons~.

[NotAHecticAlt]

these are some very interesting vote counts that combined with the flip votecount should be able to give us some info.

Spoiler: votecounts

DAY ONE

VOTECOUNT 1.1

[4] Anya:

Sigmund, NotAHecticAlt, Anya, JohnnyFarrar

[1] Shiki:

humaneatingmonkey

[1] Messy Anne:

Rae

[1] humaneatingmonkey:

Dwlee99

[1] Rae:

Messy Anne

[1] NotAHecticAlt:

Jake the Wolfie

[3] Not Voting:

T3, Opposit3s, shiki

With 12 alive, it takes 7 to eliminate.

The deadline is in (expired on 2021-06-03 22:52:36).

MOD NOTES

• You little shits, I was waiting for that pagetop >:[

• Messy Anne has arrived and does not need to worry about being replaced... for now, muahahaha.

• Votecount errors? What votecount errors? (Thanks, Shiki.)

• Joined mod ISO

DAY ONE

VOTECOUNT 1.2

[6] Anya:

Sigmund, NotAHecticAlt, Anya, JohnnyFarrar, Dwlee99, Messy Anne

E-1

[1] Shiki:

humaneatingmonkey

[1] Messy Anne:

Rae

[1] NotAHecticAlt:

Jake the Wolfie

[3] Not Voting:

T3, Opposit3s, shiki

With 12 alive, it takes 7 to eliminate.

The deadline is in (expired on 2021-06-03 22:52:36).

MOD NOTES

• Menalque pagetops: 1 | Sigmund pagetops: 0

• Moderation would like to remind the players of the following proverb: "all's fair in love and war". In this case, the War of the Pagetops.

• Joined mod ISO

•

DAY ONE

VOTECOUNT 1.3

[3] Anya:

NotAHecticAlt, JohnnyFarrar, Messy Anne

[3] Sigmund:

Jake the Wolfie, Anya, humaneatingmonkey

[2]Jake The Wolfie:

Dwlee99, Rae

[1]Rae:

Sigmund

[3] Not Voting:

T3, Opposit3s, shiki

With 12 alive, it takes 7 to eliminate.

The deadline is in (expired on 2021-06-03 22:52:36).

MOD NOTES

• Menalque pagetops: 2 | Sigmund pagetops: 0

• Joined mod ISO

•

DAY ONE

VOTECOUNT 1.4

[5] humaneatingmonkey:

JohnnyFarrar, Messy Anne, Dwlee99, Jake the Wolfie, T3

[2] JohnnyFarrar:

Anya, Sigmund

[1] Anya:

NotAHecticAlt

[1] Sigmund:

humaneatingmonkey

[1] Jake The Wolfie:

Rae

[2] Not Voting:

Opposit3s, shiki

With 12 alive, it takes 7 to eliminate.

The deadline is in (expired on 2021-06-03 22:52:36).

MOD NOTES

• Menalque pagetops: 2 | Sigmund pagetops: 2

• Joined mod ISO

•

Opposit3s

is being prodded. He has 24 hours to respond or he will be replaced. (expired on 2021-05-30 09:54:00)

•

NotAHecticAlt

is receiving a courtesy prod. If they respond within the next 7 hours, this will not count as an official prod. (expired on 2021-05-29 16:54:00)

•

[NotAHecticAlt]

Let's just say it leans Johnny town for ~reasons~.

ehhh liking this approach less and less compared to

okay mass claim time

No need for massclaim, if we miss today then tomorrow we should.



Although first person to claim vig gets a TR from me because of the way setup is built

[NotAHecticAlt]

I can sense your thought process and if I already didn't townread you based on meta I would townread you here

[NotAHecticAlt]

Why did you quickhammer onto Jake?

I was bored

cool. stay voted.

[NotAHecticAlt]

cool. stay voted.

ok scumtic

If this is your town game, you wouldn't be able to find scum even if the moderator told you the whole team.

[NotAHecticAlt]

UNVOTE: hem
This seems pretty towny assessing the wagon.

VOTE: Jake.
I reread their iso and didn't like the behavior aroundthe Anya wagon at all. Like it almost felt like a fakrsolve to get towncred.

twice they've changed their mind bc it's convenient and cited previous things that they already read and reacted to

they first thought hem's assessment was fish flailing

VOTE: humaneatingmonkey
Absolutely terrible rebuttal.

and they first thought jake was town after he was doing his analysii

I think jake is town but less sure on that one.

ok I'm convinced
VOTE: T3

[NotAHecticAlt]

i wanna say if I had a vig shot i would 100% use it on sigmund and wouldn't care what they flipped because it would be a benefit to town either way

[NotAHecticAlt]

If this is your town game, you wouldn't be able to find scum even if the moderator told you the whole team.

that's funny coming from the dude who just shitpushed a townie out the game yesterday and is voting another one today.

I'm sure the game will go real well following you around killing good guy after good guy.

You're either mafia or the worst scum hunter i've ever met

My guy you literally quickhammered yesterday's wagon - you should not speak.
You have no genuine reads and its obvious with how you were flailing about d1 only caring about quickhammering someone - multiple times you expressed this sentiment.

There were at least 3 other townies on that wagon and not a single viable counterwagon - dude dug their own hole by the way they treated monkey.

[NotAHecticAlt]

If you want to prove your town, do it by actually finding a scum instead of OMGUSing and pushing whatever wagon is the hot commodity at the time.

Like if you're town this is "voting every slot so I can say I voted all scum at one point" kind of embarrassing play for you.

[NotAHecticAlt]

Who are your townreads?

[NotAHecticAlt]

Yup - anything outside of that?

[NotAHecticAlt]

Stop being a fucking creep.

[NotAHecticAlt]

Flirty alt? Pooky confirmed

nah this is way too much of a dickhead to be pooky.

[NotAHecticAlt]

You were pushing Anya as scum at the start of the game - What changed?

[NotAHecticAlt]

useless

[NotAHecticAlt]

VOTE: sigmund

wagon this

[NotAHecticAlt]

this feels like a tn5421 alt, smells like the same easy to read scumgame I experienced last year.

[NotAHecticAlt]

nvm feels more like Marquis - I mixed them up because they had the same scumgame when I played against them.

[NotAHecticAlt]

It's either stockholm syndrome or I'm an idiot but I'm thinking Sigmund town

its openwolfing and its the same brazen shit that gets scum to endgame lol

[NotAHecticAlt]

quickhammers with no explaination - trying to rush day phases - no actual reads


literally a checklist of scum behavior.


I don't let people get away with quickhammering without good reasons - because every time I do it leads to scum making to endgame.

[NotAHecticAlt]

I used to think that but if he's scum, who is he scum with?

Who is scum outside of him if he's town?

[NotAHecticAlt]

I'm becoming concerned that this is performance on one or both your parts

no I assure you I don't give this kind of vitriol towards scum partners if I'm scum.

[NotAHecticAlt]

You're not LHF

[NotAHecticAlt]

You're easy in the sense that you basically openly admitted your scum intentions lmao

[NotAHecticAlt]

I don't care how much you push it should be implausible to be blatant like this.

Offer some depth to your reads and pushes and maybe I'll change my mind.

[NotAHecticAlt]

I think Sigmund is extremely shallow in his posting. They had no town intentions when hammering Jake. They have no reads or progression at all, such as pushing hard on Anya then when the wagon dissipates he townread her out of convenience.

And when I start pushing on him, instantly its a vote back and discred.a

[NotAHecticAlt]

you're telling me you're reading my responses to you

and you decided the only possible explanation is.

Sigmund has decided to confess he is a dirtbag scum,

I've caught him redhanded.

and it's time to execute him.

You want me to believe you believe this?

Like really?

I have trouble believing town!you actually thinks this way cuz it's some wild shit.

Lemme get my evil villain mustache on and we can do act 2 after I wake up or some shit.

That's cool. This still offers 0 depth to you. Just because a behavior is obvious doesn't mean it isn't scummy.

[NotAHecticAlt]

The only point for Sigmund here is that he is unaware that I'm not actually Hectic although that may more be a feature of a scumteam who did not catch my mainslip.

[NotAHecticAlt]

I saw shiki shade and I'm here to reiterate that shiki is a townlock and they are not going to be eligible to be limmed as long as my slot is alive.

[NotAHecticAlt]

My progression is that I've played as scum with shiki and they'd have had to undergo an evolution in order to be scum here.

[NotAHecticAlt]

My progression is that I've played as scum with shiki and they'd have had to undergo an evolution in order to be scum here.

I was scum with shiki as well so maybe you can share your reasons with me. I want to sort her properly.

Do you believe they are in scumrange? If yes, please provide an example

[NotAHecticAlt]

@anya what is your read on Sigmund

[NotAHecticAlt]

I have not much skill in parsing metainformation and applying it to the game, but I have used mood-based meta to sort shiki early game. Anxiety was palpable in her postings in the scum game I was with her. In this game, she is much looser in the early game. Later, when we were talking about Jake, she was snarky and obviously under pressure — but I didn't know why. I could read that as anxiety or my natural effect on people but I was really trying to be gentle with her. What I'm concerned about was her unnatural defense of Jake The Wolfie, and I still am now. Plus, she suggested a massclaim when there's really no reason to do it and a net loss on town's position if ever it was done but maybe I can buy that this is the way she is used to solving the game.

If you can tell me what you have about shiki, I can consider it in reading her.

I asked you to link games

[NotAHecticAlt]

I saw. What do you think about notahectic?

town

[NotAHecticAlt]

Ayo - lets not let apathy set in btw - the worst thing for us rn is to lose motivation and end up in a losing position because of it.

we got this, just focus and help contribute to the conversation and give your thoughts and such and help us dialogue.

I know day 1 was messy and we messed up but we should make sure we have the energy as if we are steamrolling the scumteam going into here so we can actually get to steamrolling them - fake it till you make it, eh?

It's why I don't tolerate low effort kind of play from people like Sigmund because it doesn't help town at all.

I'd like to see a lot more participation from all of you, Johnny, shiki, and humaneatingmonkey are lowkey exceptions based on their posting thus far today.

[NotAHecticAlt]

There's 3 competing wagons with only 2 votes each

[NotAHecticAlt]

Yea

They're either power wolfing this game or just bad town

no i think my analysis of the lack of depth coming from your slot is accurate and youre flailing scum

[NotAHecticAlt]

a lot of sheeple in this game

big fat power vacuum for them to run their mouth

Provide some real analysis or shut the fuck up lmao

[NotAHecticAlt]

Saying others are running their mouth when you're the small one in the corner doing just that

[NotAHecticAlt]

Poor you. Any analysis yet though?

[NotAHecticAlt]

Sure. Who's your main?

[NotAHecticAlt]

There's 3 bad people and 1 is probably a traitor so yeah its totally plausible.

[NotAHecticAlt]

This is the most depth/analysis you've shown so far btw keep it up.

[NotAHecticAlt]

1 is probably a traitor

why's that

3:9 with 3 groupscum would be evil

[NotAHecticAlt]

3:9 with 3 groupscum would be evil

only 2/18 traitor games in the dataset, but it is noteworthy to me that you bring up traitor after i asked t3 if they were a traitor

Not that interesting since it was my natural assumption based on the distribution.

[NotAHecticAlt]

@anya what is your read on Sigmund

[NotAHecticAlt]

Yea. It feels unreasonable. Could be stupid or scum who knows. ANYWAY, I think Anne is evil so please vote them.

???
Ellaborate on this.

Why is it "stupid or scum who knows".

I

[NotAHecticAlt]

the lack of things happening in the game is making me snooze.

somehow a handful of players who voted for jake, who was trying to move the game and get the less involved players involved, are now all saying 'someone should do something' or 'don't let game stagnate'

it's like, multiple people also say hm, 'wonder why gamma emerald died', who was also quite active in his limited time with us, while not actually looking into why that might be

mafia probably angling for this situation yes? does that seem an unreasonable conclusion from the wagon and nightkill?

Am i trying to move the game forward in your view?

[NotAHecticAlt]

Also Sigmund's playstyle abrasive blabla but that doesn't make him scum. Anne's ISO is bad imo just go read it.

why arent they scum?

[NotAHecticAlt]

I'm really just feeling unreasonably confident about it based on something I read in their ISO like two days ago. They also have done nothing day 2 and that's enough to yeet them imo. At least Monkey was doing

something

today. Sigmund's clip would provide us with basically no info and is again at least trying today. The hood has some weird claim thing brewing so we kinda need to see what happens with that. I have some paranoia that the entire hood is evil but also I am townreading NH and Johnny anyway.

Yea. It feels unreasonable. Could be stupid or scum who knows. ANYWAY, I think Anne is evil so please vote them.

???
Ellaborate on this.

Why is it "stupid or scum who knows".

I

"Stupid or scum, who knows?"
As in, T3 and Sigmund just missed the altslip ("stupid") or are trying to pretend they did ("scum"). I say stupid in the least offensive way possible btw, I miss posts too.

Ok i thought you were talking about me with that. Try to be more clear and concise in your wording please

[NotAHecticAlt]

Last time T3 played with my main I was an extremely active poster. I don't see how they could have thought that I was Anne here and this sort of ignorance feels weird to me.

[NotAHecticAlt]

You also played against a scum me that posted just as much

[NotAHecticAlt]

The only point for Sigmund here is that he is unaware that I'm not actually Hectic although that may more be a feature of a scumteam who did not catch my mainslip.

[NotAHecticAlt]

I don't care how much you push it should be implausible to be blatant like this.

Offer some depth to your reads and pushes and maybe I'll change my mind.

you're supposed to be good at this game right?

I have trouble believing town!you actually thinks this way cuz it's some wild shit.

Lemme get my evil villain mustache on and we can do act 2 after I wake up or some shit.

These 2 posts gave me the impression sigmund thought i was actually hectic

[NotAHecticAlt]

T3 is obviously in either a hood or masonry just leave them alone and let them do their play- it will be clear if its town or not later.

[NotAHecticAlt]

Why are you seeking validation for that @dwlee?

[NotAHecticAlt]

I watched some interesting videos last night on a specific subject matter im hoping to apply to my reading and see if it works within mafia games - I'll explain after i reread and make my conclusions and push the info i need to be confident enough with what i find

[NotAHecticAlt]

by noted I mean I'm going to murder-rate you tommorrow dont nightkill me coward

VOTE: Anya

wait when you put anya at E-1 you thought we were still in RVS?

Ya, Anya wasn't scummy at that point. Somebody said that wagons are good for reads so I wagoned.

If I'm scummy to you, you need your reads meter checked. Chill out playa, it's day 1 and I've posted like 3 times.

T3 can I assume that y'all are town for a VCA?

You are seeking validation here

[NotAHecticAlt]

"Is it ok if i townread you t3?"

This is seeking validation.

[NotAHecticAlt]

Why aren't you scum?

[NotAHecticAlt]

T3 is obviously in either a hood or masonry just leave them alone and let them do their play- it will be clear if its town or not later.

everyone's alignment will be clear at end of game i am fairly confident

What's wrong about my point?

[NotAHecticAlt]

We're not rushing the elimination onto a slot that can give us a fresh perspective

[NotAHecticAlt]

...also I never kill Gamma if I'm evil here

...

Do you disagree?

your awareness of the quoted post by gamma emerald and you immediately reaching for it to towncase yourself kinda takes its weight away

it doesn't really.

I do the same thing as town so its at worst NAI

[NotAHecticAlt]

I don't rush ever.

Rushing is pro-scum.

[NotAHecticAlt]

I don't rush ever.

Rushing is pro-scum.

short memory is probably good

impatience is bad.

[NotAHecticAlt]

the more evidence overall you have to incriminate scum the better. the longer drawn out days are, the more scum have chances to show their true colors by mistake.

[NotAHecticAlt]

Rushing is pro-scum.

Counterpoint: no

Prove it.

[NotAHecticAlt]

I'll show you several games I won as scum by rushing and several I won as town because town didn't rush.

[NotAHecticAlt]

If you think the game is stalling maybe actually ask the people who are static why they're static there's a brainwave.

[NotAHecticAlt]

Fake Hectic has literally not answered a single question put to him and continues to talk about mafia theory/other irrelevant nonsense.

Prove it.

[NotAHecticAlt]

Messy Anne is due for a prod

[NotAHecticAlt]

I don't understand why people want to rush elim a slot that can't even defend itself right now like wouldn't you rather have more info later by having a person replace into it first? Like speaking from an objective standpoint and the fact that i believe there's town voting there.

[NotAHecticAlt]

@rae can you explain why you're voteparked on anne?

And whats your current view of the game?

[NotAHecticAlt]

Scum is scum whether it is being replaced or not. Realistically though I tried to push Anne ig and got nowhere, really feeling like the entire scum team or at least 2 is in the list of people who have hardly posted today.

You're avoiding the elephant in the room:

Do you think it would be useful or not for a replacement to speak and provide their own perspective if town or potentially even spew partners if they are indeed scum?

Answer that.

[NotAHecticAlt]

I'm not happening

[NotAHecticAlt]

Shiki, what makes you think this is my scum game?

[NotAHecticAlt]

Feeling like I should have just said yes to asking if I had a guilty on Anne so something would happen.

You keep making posts like these that cement my belief you are town and its reassuring.

I had a tinfoil earlier on you based on a bad faith thing i saw and also post misreading you in tic tac toe but now i feel more condident youre town since youre continuing to towntell over an extended perios of time

[NotAHecticAlt]

It had something to do with me thats all i can remember off the top of my head

[NotAHecticAlt]

the more evidence overall you have to incriminate scum the better. the longer drawn out days are, the more scum have chances to show their true colors by mistake.

and you feel you had no part in rushing yesterday? that's what i meant by short memory

Just saw this - this is disgenuine because i was the first vote on that wagon and i even unvoted to prevent a quickhammer. You see my intentions are clearly not to let day end early. I even show extreme disdain that sigmund quickhammered it. I wanted to let the pressure simmer. However i do concede my ego let me be less careful and revote.
Unless you think my partner is sigmund(absurd) then the theory that i am scum who is contradicting intentions is laughable.
Nothing is black and white.
Literally ask me anything on this and i can answer wirh depth about my true intentions.
I still have that glimmer of my townread on you based on the meta we played in our game together. Let's not let a potential strong townblock be unattainable due to a stubborn wagon over semantics.

[NotAHecticAlt]

Ok - but like would clarification on anything help your perspective.

[NotAHecticAlt]

I think t3 slot resolves itself through nightplay, would you not agree?

[NotAHecticAlt]

Do you think sigmund is town?

[NotAHecticAlt]

What is the reason you wont push sigmund over me?

[NotAHecticAlt]

The team would need to be exactly dwlee, t3, and I to be scum then, and 2 of those slots are obv town and 1 is self resolving.

[NotAHecticAlt]

You know my read on you was genuine, i didnt hesitate and leave open room for "but unless". You told me who you were and i immediately was like "yeah can't be scum based on how we played in council.

Like i was trying to coach you the whole time that game and that's clearly a much different vibe here.

[NotAHecticAlt]

When im scum i hate ceding a push like that. Thats a place i would unwittingly slip my intentions if scum.

[NotAHecticAlt]

I think a poe of rae/sigmund/messy anne even like is very plausible

Also i think we are potentially feeling uneasy with reads because of the traitor thing and hood stuff messing with dayplay

[NotAHecticAlt]

I have this worry that t3 is in a masonry and not a hood so

[NotAHecticAlt]

VOTE: messy anne

[NotAHecticAlt]

Game mods have aimed for more dayplay focused setups with red herring elements that are meant to abuse expectations and punish assumptions

[NotAHecticAlt]

not mafia is easy to read and he also doesnt hammer his townreads

[NotAHecticAlt]

I got what should never have been a perfect scum sweep in a setup because town players made bad assumptions about setup design

[NotAHecticAlt]

VOTE: messy anne

Anyways back to this- i believe Dwlee's case and itching to vote sigmund makes sigmumd a bad wagon over this.

But in addition i was always thinking sigmund was the traitor based on how brazen and suicidal their play is so theres that. I would not be surprised to see that slot flip traitor after a messy anne groupscum flip

[NotAHecticAlt]

not mafia is easy to read

maybe for the enlightened among us

sus

[NotAHecticAlt]

not mafia is easy to read

maybe for the enlightened among us

sus

? i was simply saying that you might find not mafia easy to read but a) i put a massive amount of effort into trying to do so once and b) i got it wrong

U said amogus

[NotAHecticAlt]

Is all it took me quoting three(?) posts. Oml, I wish the sob emoji worked on this forum.

They were already solidly in my poe so

But lets see if they get replaced before pushing to eliminate

[NotAHecticAlt]

they see the writing on the wall and know that they have to anti spew and hard focus me or lose

[NotAHecticAlt]

Fake Hectic is openwolfing and LARPing as a town player

Tell us more. Is this "openwolfing" in the room with us right now?

[NotAHecticAlt]

praying for a paused deadline