Mini Theme 2022: Trapped! [Gameover]
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Pine In Your Head
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Pine In Your Head
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Pine In Your Head
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Pine In Your Head
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Pine In Your Head
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Pine In Your Head
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Pine In Your Head
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Pine In Your Head
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Pine In Your Head
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Pine In Your Head
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Pine In Your Head
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Pine In Your Head
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Pine In Your Head
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Pine In Your Head
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Pine In Your Head
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Pine In Your Head
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Pine In Your Head
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Pine In Your Head
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Pine In Your Head
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Pine In Your Head
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263I'm pretty suspicious of you tbh
"Cry havoc, and let slip the wombat of war!"
Act 3, Scene 1 ofJulius Caesar, by W. Shakespeare-
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70In post 443, Chickadee wrote:
I actually did not catch your mistake when I posted a slight town read on you. What I observed at the time was you watching your counting. Probably because of the mistake you made? I'm gonna go back and look for it.In post 442, Irrelephant11 wrote:273
@ KO That's true, I can try to cold meta you later, see if that affects my read
@teacher randomidget is on VLA I think?
pedit: @chick, I'd say false. Saying I'm very careful about posts/page when I'm the only one to make a posts/page mistake is not a "weak" reason, it's false. The only way to townread me off something that isn't true is to know I'm town in the first place. I haven't really been pushing for your lynch, either, I'm just noting alignment-indicative things as I go.This is part of why I've been light on content. After early errors, I'm focused on not screwing up. Given how distracted I *already* am while managing 200 kids and 60 staff on any given day, plus running down kids for medicine and diabetes checks, I'm worried that getting too involved in the social game will screw ME specifically up. Complete the task, and then I'll be far less paranoid and more capable of looking at who was concentrating on petty nonsense instead of getting the job done. My read of the ruleset is that if we complete all the tasks, we win regardless of scum:town ratio. Finish the task.
*twitch* I double-checked this post like three times."Cry havoc, and let slip the wombat of war!"
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71
WRT teacher, this kind of insistence on multitasking is what's going to screw us up. It looks like it's what screwed Chickadee up (who I am otherwise TRing). Finish the task first.In post 593, teacher wrote:65
Also, as the last couple posts show, Im inclined to go back to spamming, calling on the followers, and using gaps at the handoff and preview edit to involve new people. Anybody disagree?"Cry havoc, and let slip the wombat of war!"
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Pine In Your Head
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Pine In Your Head
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Pine In Your Head
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Pine In Your Head
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Pine In Your Head
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Pine In Your Head
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206
Chick's error and response to it seems genuine, like she's honestly pissed at herself.In post 727, GuiltyLion wrote:199
414 is a great post, solidifying ofrhz townread. I was getting town vibes from my back and forth with teacher as well and pitching it as a TvT unprompted at this stage feels real town. Contrast to Pine and WhyMafia, who both tried to stir further shit up on the basis of my back and forth with teacher.
Townies: {Irrelephant, ofrhz, teacher, Feysal, Kokichi}
not really scummy but wouldn't cry if they flipped: {random, Mylo, Enigma}
scummy: {NK15, Pine, WhyMafia, Chickadee}
WhyMafia- do you remember the last game we played together? I don't see how I'm being any more tryhard in this one than that one.
Pine- why the TR on Chickadee?
if people aren't feeling the NK15 vote I'm down to vote Chickadee tonight since there's interest there amongst my townreads"Cry havoc, and let slip the wombat of war!"
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213
Ummmm, not really. There's not much to dig into; it's a straightforward assessment of a straightforward sequence of events. If anything, you're digging too deeply.In post 737, GuiltyLion wrote:209
can you dig deeper into this?In post 734, Pine wrote:Chick's error and response to it seems genuine, like she's honestly pissed at herself.
bc I don't see it as being hard to fake at all
Look, I've made two errors so far. I get what it feels like. Chick's response mirrors my own frustration."Cry havoc, and let slip the wombat of war!"
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256
Please stop putting words in my mouth.
This is what I actually said. Exaggerating it to act like I pronounced an unassailable lockTown read is super disingenuous. It's early game, I have a light TR for her tone. You are welcome to disagree, but I don't like being taken grossly out of context.In post 599, Pine wrote:71
WRT teacher, this kind of insistence on multitasking is what's going to screw us up.In post 593, teacher wrote:65
Also, as the last couple posts show, Im inclined to go back to spamming, calling on the followers, and using gaps at the handoff and preview edit to involve new people. Anybody disagree?It looks like it's what screwed Chickadee up (who I am otherwise TRing). Finish the task first."Cry havoc, and let slip the wombat of war!"
Act 3, Scene 1 ofJulius Caesar, by W. Shakespeare-
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258
Bolded.In post 780, GuiltyLion wrote:252
In post 760, Irrelephant11 wrote:I wish more players would comment on chickadee's mistake, kokichi oma's interrupting the spamcounting, and teacher's mistake around that time. It's definitely at least a little AI and not a lot else is, so please @everyone comment on that or point me to something more interesting to talk aboutit's hard for me to put a ton of stock either way in Chickadee's mistake, but it by no means looks unfakeably genuine to me - having a hard time understanding Pine's townread there, it feels forced. Like to the point where if Chickadee is town then I think Pine may be scum giving a tactical townread for buddying/towncred purposes.And I agree that Chickadee showing up immediately again after the second mistake also looked unusual. Plus her defense seemed to miss the point of what you were saying - she said she was busy and couldn't be monitoring/counting constantly and this wasn't AI, but your original point was that she was around to jump in again as soon as the count got reset.
Kokichi's interrupting was dangerous but I don't see it as scummy
teacher's mistake I see as likely a real mistake, I've had other posts show up with no p-edit before mine in other games
No, you didn't say "unassailably locktown", those are my words, but you're making my read into something it's not. Sure, Chick's reaction could be faked. I don't think it is.
There is literally nothing more to the statement than that. I know early on in a game you have to grasp at straws and make mountains out of molehills, but I am saying now that I don't appreciate having my simple statements blown out of proportion or context."Cry havoc, and let slip the wombat of war!"
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282
I'm really not liking GuiltyLion at this point. He's throwing everything he can at the wall to see what sticks, and moving to dismiss or discredit anyone who disagrees with him. I really dislike the bullshit cases and the attempts to stifle dissent. I feel like he's pissy that the case on Chickadee doesn't have more traction, like his plan was to jump on any mistake and push it as hostile action.
VOTE: GuiltyLion"Cry havoc, and let slip the wombat of war!"
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306
Your whole case on me revolves around my TR of Chickadee, and now you're getting Town vibes from her? Are you fucking kidding me?In post 828, GuiltyLion wrote:300
did you guys get the same loose town vibes from Chickadee that I did from her latest posts? I'm switching to Pine"Cry havoc, and let slip the wombat of war!"
Act 3, Scene 1 ofJulius Caesar, by W. Shakespeare-
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I don’t really grok the strategy of this challenge.
I misunderstood that the “How do you feel about being trapped” question was meant as a will, so I replied:Hmmm. Assuming you're asking about being trapped in RL, I'd have real concerns for my mental health. I already suffer from claustrophobia, and the notion of being confined or trapped is frankly terrifying. My chest tightened a bit just thinking about it."Cry havoc, and let slip the wombat of war!"
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GL distorts what I said again. Shocker.
I didn't mention NK15 yesterday because I didn't mention much of anything. The last week or so were rough for my activity site-wide. I also misunderstood the ruleset, and didn't realize it would be a closed, vote-by-PM setup. Then I didn't realize that our votes (and reasons) would become public.
Yeah, there was a bit of a self-serving angle to my NK15 vote. Obviously. I thought I'd have a chance after the challenge was complete to argue against you, and then when I didn't, I didn't think you'd get lynched out of nowhere. So I compromised for the most likely alternative to myself, which I knew was a bad idea. Reviewing the cases made on NK15, I came to a conclusion that I was comfortable voting there, and added my own thoughts.
If you could do us all a favor and not distort, exaggerate, or misrepresent others' opinions, I'd appreciate it. Don't presume to speak for me."Cry havoc, and let slip the wombat of war!"
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Pine In Your Head
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Dude I so do not have time in my life for this. I run a children's summer camp set to serve almost 1500 kids this year, and I barely have time to play this game once. I do NOT have time to relitigate every post or hold your hand through every point.
Examples using just your last post (PE-898): I have never suggested we lynch everyone who is a burden to the Town, it was a single point not a doctrine. Exaggeration and putting words in my mouth. "All you've contributed is snark" is discrediting, as is suggesting that I'm providing no evidence and not reading the game. As for misrepresentation, you have somehow taken my legitimate suspicion of you for your attack on Chickadee and tried to present it as some kind of character assassination.
Let's add a new one: Whataboutism. Instead of engaging my fairly detailed explanations and points in the body paragraphs of 896, you deflected attention away from my riposte and towards a different topic you wanted to press.
Seriously. I am not going to do this every time, especially with someone who has gone out of his way to single me out, particularly when I feel they're very likely scum."Cry havoc, and let slip the wombat of war!"
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His whole demeanor is sketchy, though I'll grant you his behavior regarding me is especially suspicious, and I'll further grant you a bit of implicit bias on my part.In post 950, Irrelephant11 wrote:
aside from his posts regarding you is there anything you scumread?In post 949, Pine wrote:I think you're wrong there
GL's approach to the game has been to be big, loud, and in charge. When others have offered alternative views, he has essentially flooded them out or shouted them down. He's taken care not to be especially contrary, but he's been trying to take control of the majority narrative. There's also the problem that he's far too confident. Town don't have inside information, and are inherently unsure of themselves. Good Town are always second-guessing and checking themselves for confirmation bias. True, there's a lot of bad Town out there, and even decent, experienced players can fall into that trap, but I see none of that. He backed down off of me not because of my behavior, but when general opinion was turning against his attacks on me and when I turned out to be not a lot harder target than he anticipated.
Frankly, pretty much everything GL has done is the classic "scum mayor" approach. High-key activity, squelch dissent while pissing off as few people as possible, and push your own MLs. He attacked two of the three people who fumbled the count on D1, though he oddly defended Kokichi and instead drove the ML on NK15. If GL flips scum like I think, imo Kokichi should get turbolynched D3."Cry havoc, and let slip the wombat of war!"
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Well that's another problem with the strategy GL is using. Spew as many long posts as you can, with much IIOA as you can, and see what sticks. It's easy to bury missteps in a large ISO, and easy to latch onto what works."Cry havoc, and let slip the wombat of war!"
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Further, with regards to GL's "throw everything and see what sticks" tactic, he's had nearly everyone at or near the top of his scum list at some point or another. As far as I can tell, the only people he hasn't pushed cases on are Kokichi Oma, Irrelephant, and teacher. Feysal doesn't get a case, but barely gets mentioned at all, then drops from a top TR to middle of the pack with no fanfare whatsoever. If GL and Kokichi both flip red, Feysal is where my next vote goes.
Spoiler: Evidence bolded"Cry havoc, and let slip the wombat of war!"
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Those things are not contradictory. Confidence is internally-focused, shuffling reads is external. One is how you think, the other is how you present your thoughts. Very different.In post 963, GuiltyLion wrote:like how you can you accuse me of both:
a) being too confident
b) shuffling my reads around and "throwing everything at the wall"
if I were confident I'd be tunneled on one thing and not bouncing around between reads/suspects"Cry havoc, and let slip the wombat of war!"
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No, you were very careful not to invoke the fumbles in your attacks, though you repeatedly argued that Kokichi's fumble shouldn't count against him when you defended the ever-loving shit out of him. In fact, the very fact that you didn't mention the fumbles in your attacks is weird and suspicious - it's a valid point, but you seemed afraid to use it against people you allegedly thought were scummy, as if you didn't want to establish precedent in case it got used against you.In post 962, GuiltyLion wrote:and one last point: you are absolutely wrong about me attacking people for fumbling the count and I'm getting sick of this misrep without you acknowledging my response and the fact that you're too stubborn / out of your element to admit that you're just simply wrong about it.I have literally never attacked anyone on the basis of fumbling the count.Not Chickadee, not you, not teacher, not Kokichi. If you disagree, quote the post where I did that. Otherwise quit saying it because it's objectively not true.
What's actually suspicious is thetiming. Someone fumbled, and you pounced. Chickadee messed up, and you immediately attacked her. I made a mistake, you attacked me. The fumble was implicitly, but carefully not explicitly, the subject of your attacks. Kind of clever, actually. I was all ready to quote it, but you were super careful to have an alibi."Cry havoc, and let slip the wombat of war!"
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Please refer to 956, 960, 961, 964, and 965. All of which lay out my case on GL, and are on this page.
"Cry havoc, and let slip the wombat of war!"
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Err, last page. The same page you wrote that post on, anyway.In post 975, Pine wrote:Please refer to 956, 960, 961, 964, and 965. All of which lay out my case on GL, and are on this page.
"Cry havoc, and let slip the wombat of war!"
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I've never seen the show, but the question was "You must now vote for who you think is a saboteur and why?" Further, the first posts spell out the flavor of Town/scum as unfortunates/saboteurs, so...
I'm not a big fan of strawman attacks."Cry havoc, and let slip the wombat of war!"
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Pine In Your Head
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Pine In Your Head
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Prodded. Apologies for my absence, it’s site-wide. Rough week at work, and Pinecone is sick, and Lady Pine may also be developing something. I’ll probably be fine, I have a Constitution score of like 22. Auntie Maple definitely has bronchitis, and is keeping her distance as much as possible in a family business where you work 100+ hours a week in close proximity.
Meaningful content hopefully later today."Cry havoc, and let slip the wombat of war!"
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Shocker.
"Cry havoc, and let slip the wombat of war!"
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There’s no WIFOM there. The odds are super stacked against us - I don’t recall how to do mathematical combinations, but even without the presence of bad actors, our odds of success are <40%. With a bad guess down, our odds are down to 1/9 (I think). I’m not willing to reduce those odds further by letting someone I don’t trust (in this case all of you) sink our chances further. Case in point:
Choose: 1"Cry havoc, and let slip the wombat of war!"
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Yeah fuck you. We've spent a week and a half with essentially no progress, dithering over minutiae. Something needed to give. You know why head counts for ending the day are a bad idea when a game is stuck in the doldrums? Scum don't want it to end until it's favorable to them. You were just TRing me for exactly what you're now giving me shit for, so excuse me if I take your approval, along with that of Friday and Chickadee, as tacit permission to proceed.
I grant you, I wasn't really considering day-end concerns, but rather with accomplishing the objective. With one bad number chosen, scum could end the day at will, and I'd rather be in control than let them. So. Let's talk end-of-day.
I still want Guilty Lion. I think I've made my case pretty strongly on him, and I think there's support for that lynch.I will be voting for Guilty Lion. I also think there's a solid case to be made for Kokichi, and a GL scumflip practically mandates that he go next. Given that order of operations, GL first. If there's not support for GL, I could compromise.
I'm currently TRing NSG, Prof Friday, Chickadee, and Feysal. I have no read to speak of on Enigma or ohfrz. I'm waffling on Mylo, and while I have no desire to push for Mylo's lynch, I wouldn't be sad to see it. Irrelephant was solid Town to me, but his reaction to the last page has caught me off-guard. It's probably just indignant Town still, but I can't discard the gut impression that I disrupted carefully-laid plans. I think that's everyone.
Voting GL, could be talked into a coalition against Kokichi."Cry havoc, and let slip the wombat of war!"
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I've said why. I'd do it again, though I probably ought to have consulted first. Sorry.In post 1104, northsidegal wrote:pine why
If it comes up good I'll stop."Cry havoc, and let slip the wombat of war!"
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The bolded is a gross mischaracterization of what I said. The complete 180 is confusing and suspicious.In post 1110, Irrelephant11 wrote:lol @Pine you don't get to end the day prematurely and then say "fuck you" when I get upset about it
I was townreading you for your push on Guilty and your frustration last game day.I'm certainly not townreading you for your insistence that "I'm busy so I can refuse to read the thread and do whatever I want and then say "fuck you" if anyone doesn't like it"
That's not pro-town play regardless of your alignment and I don't have time to figure out your alignment but I am as close as I have ever been to encouraging a policy lynch
Except we're at 8-3 so idk I'm trying to provide reads on as many players as possible before day end? I don't curse but you can bet I'm angrier than you
Good luck surviving tonight"Cry havoc, and let slip the wombat of war!"
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Enigma's waffling and refusal to commit to a position in those posts puts me off. It's the exact kind of middle-of-the-road, inoffensive posting I try to do as scum. Almost as if they're trying to appeal to everyone on divisive issues (my actions, Chickadee) while not pissing anyone off.
Flashwagon on Enigma?"Cry havoc, and let slip the wombat of war!"
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- In Your Head
- In Your Head
- Posts: 16763
- Joined: February 27, 2011
- Location: Upstate New York
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Pine In Your Head
- In Your Head
- In Your Head
- Posts: 16763
- Joined: February 27, 2011
- Location: Upstate New York