Mini Theme 2161: Undertale C Open - Chara's Folly

Morning Tweet · Post Post #27 (isolation #0) » Wed Sep 02, 2020 5:36 pm

ヽ(^∀^)ﾉ

hi Hectic hi Chara hi Puppy ! and hi everyone!

HEAL: Puppy

Morning Tweet · Post Post #64 (isolation #1) » Thu Sep 03, 2020 6:59 am

If we can be very very sure of our townreads, surely sparing is possible?

9:3 -> spare 1, 1 dies
7:3 -> spare 1, 1 dies, chara dies
5:2 -> spare 1, 1 dies
3:2 -> spare 1 and win

but if we make a mistake, we won't lose as long as it's not Chara on d1/d2. We can spare 1 mafia and then we like do an extra spare on d4 and go to

4:1 -> vote on mafia or lose

Wait so if we spare 4 people correctly but spare 1 mafia along the way we get a single chance to win or lose the game by figuring out who that person is?

Okay, nevermind this route is kinda trash. I wanted to play by sparing!!!

has anyone figured out the merit of the 1-3 spared players plan, or is genocide just objectively better too

Morning Tweet · Post Post #72 (isolation #2) » Thu Sep 03, 2020 8:02 am

In post 69, PookyTheMagicalBear wrote:
its only trash if we spare the bad guys

if we only spare obvtown players we will win ez

yes but we aren't given feedback about whether or not the spare was correct, so like if we spare the 4(5) most obvtown players, and we don't win the game, then what!?!

Morning Tweet · Post Post #75 (isolation #3) » Thu Sep 03, 2020 8:34 am

I think it's somewhat safe to assume if we have to spare 4 (5) people and 3 of our most / second most obvtown players are getting killed at night and thus cant be spared, and mafia controls all the way up to 2/5ths of the votes towards the end..

we are probably sparing one mafia best case

And we also introduce the risk of accidentally sparing Chara in the first two days

whereas if we fight and miss, chara dies so it kind of forgives us for one miselim anyway

Mafia *doesn't* want us to fight Chara, right?

Morning Tweet · Post Post #85 (isolation #4) » Thu Sep 03, 2020 9:49 am

While the chance of getting a spare right on each day individually is pretty high, what are the odds we get it right 4/5 times in a row, and we can't use the 3 townies who get nightkilled?

9/12, 7/10, 5/7, and 3/5 are good odds on their own -- but we have to pass every single one. Surely the odds there aren't the greatest?

That being said I love townhunting so if sparing can be at least equally valid to fighting, I would choose spare just because im way more comfortable finding town than scum

you have valid points like how we can't use Chara to our advantage if we don't spare people, because then we can't use her flip as bonus info since her partners wont have treated her specially

Morning Tweet · Post Post #163 (isolation #5) » Thu Sep 03, 2020 2:57 pm

Mech talk is totally losing me. I could give out townreads to people doing the math (for the effort or something) but like, SO many people did and I don't think it's something outside of what scum would do. It's objective stuff i assume, there's a right and wrong, it's NAI

I like Chara though. This is a really good point

In post 126, Chara wrote:but if we spare today? sure, mafia wants Chara to be spared, but if they feel it won't happen they aren't backed into a corner like that.

Picture this:

Several people are like "Ahh we should spare and stuff cause scumChara's flip will help us know who their buddies are cause their buddies want them to be spared"

*2 spares later and scumChara dies*

And then those same people point the blame at everyone who wanted scumChara spared, when in reality the actual scum just ignored scumChara afterall because of course they knew that'd happen. Scum uses this misinformation to win the game

So at least Chara is conscious of that and points it out rather than trying to (potentially) abuse it

i also somewhat like that it is getting scumpings from Elements so early and has a serious vote on him

Morning Tweet · Post Post #179 (isolation #6) » Thu Sep 03, 2020 6:24 pm

In post 166, redtea wrote:Oh my god. MorningTweet just stole my post intro. I should just post what I have if I can't drudge up anything else:

I am so sorry for being utterly useless. Statistics make my brain melt.
I would say I have reads but what ones I made out were counterbalanced from what I could understand of setup talk.
All I got is: The quick estimate Pooky gave I do no give out town points for (regardless ty for your contribution) and the ones who went the extra mile (catboi, Prism). Maf wouldn't fuckin bother, or think to, anyway. Esp. with how "focusing on game mechanics" is looked at.

Tbh not a bad point that mafia might be aware of how solely focusing on mechanics can be perceived as NAI, so that would be somewhat of a dissuader from even bothering

Idk, it's tough. I'd like to just be like "oo shiny spreadsheet" on catboi and whoever else made the walls on mech im not reading

I think what i was getting at in my original post was like, if a ton of people (say, 1/3rd) do a bunch of mechanical discussion, surely at least one scum bothers (or theres at least a decent chance one does)? And then can I really know who it is since they're all basically talking about mechanically/objectively right or wrong stuff?

Sure, maybe just whoever efforted the most as you said, I guess. hmmm

What reads did you have that got counterbalanced by the mech talk?

Morning Tweet · Post Post #180 (isolation #7) » Thu Sep 03, 2020 6:31 pm

In post 170, catboi wrote:
In post 166, redtea wrote:All I got is: The quick estimate Pooky gave I do no give out town points for (regardless ty for your contribution) and the ones who went the extra mile (catboi, Prism). Maf wouldn't fuckin bother, or think to, anyway. Esp. with how "focusing on game mechanics" is looked at.
（ΦωΦ）For the record, I ran those numbers pregame and you should absolutely not townread effort in that vein, but the difference in EV is so significant that I wouldn't have bothered outing it as mafia because I'd be torpedoing my own team's chances

I hate the massives amounts of WIFOM this post emanates. Not like in a scummy way but just in a "Damn i hate you if you're scum saying this" kind of way.

But yeah..... you're right. im gonna give u your due townpoints because you earned them (¬ω¬)

I suppose the WIFOM is negated by how you're not trying to trick us into sparing you thru towniness. You're advocating for the FIGHT route, which means you getting spewed as town (if you're scum) is way less useful as compared to us doing the SPARE route where you either end our game instantly or just cause us to basically lose upon getting spared

Yeah, okay i will accept this townread

Morning Tweet · Post Post #181 (isolation #8) » Thu Sep 03, 2020 6:34 pm

In post 172, Tayl0r Swift wrote:im also in the boat of i dont really care about the mech talk or evs. i think theyre silly and good play and the human element matters more than whats going on on paper. depending on the lobby different strats will work better or worse. none of these strats appear to break the game.

anyway, HEAL: Morning
that avatar has me pocketed.

Mmmmmmmm agreeing mech is not fun, healing me, and complimenting my bat all in the same post

Yup, my judgment for your alignment is now completely out of wack, and it only took the one post

In post 174, PookyTheMagicalBear wrote:it is a pretty cute avatar

AcK!

Morning Tweet · Post Post #186 (isolation #9) » Thu Sep 03, 2020 7:02 pm

redtea wrote:Not only NAI, but people are quick to point out mechanics-talk as a maf content padding tactic.

Oh yeah, I'm not saying maf won't partake in ANY mechanics discussion, but they ARE much more likely to leave it open-ended, be non-committal, etc. It's only the lengths catboi and Prism went that are in any way AI. Usually there's no point making heads for tails of it, unless someone is obviously leading mechanics-apathetic town astray.

Yeah, i think your take on it is good.

I still don't feel like actually trying to figure out the mechanical stuff for myself -ω-

I will let catboi and whoever probably figure it out and then go with whatever is best. I'm sure i'll feel like looking into it more another time.

I really wanted to spare people! or be spared.

PookyTheMagicalBear wrote:I think it will be more challenging to win the game via pacifism but I have faith in the goodness of our hearts shining through bright and beautiful

If we reached a day where there were no consensus townreads, would you then be open to swapping to FIGHTing, or would you force a pacifist route anyway?

I suppose what I'm curious about is what are your motivations are here. Is the only thing that matters to you sticking to way of pacifism? Mafia aren't going to show such mercy to us in return

Morning Tweet · Post Post #230 (isolation #10) » Fri Sep 04, 2020 8:26 am

i have a positive read on Chara/catboi/Prism and probably a slight one on Puppy/Tanner. Puppy moreso than Tanner. Also maybe redtea. So like catboi>Chara>Prism>Puppy>Tanner>redtea

Undecided so far on {Hectic, Lavender, Pooky, taylor, and Elements}

HEAL: catboi
HURT: Elements

I have no idea how Elements got Puppy changing his tune from 193. also sheeping Chara

Spoiler: this post span

Elements should have known the context for puppys post, he was just talking to Hectic about it 2 posts above it! I am curious as to what the intent of pointing this out really was

Morning Tweet · Post Post #232 (isolation #11) » Fri Sep 04, 2020 8:41 am

In post 231, Tanner wrote:
In post 230, Morning Tweet wrote:Puppy moreso than Tanner.
is this because his avatar is cuter than mine? (つ﹏<。)

i'm sorry i have a bias!! (>﹏<)

I think i like your post on Lavender, i like you being negative towards the spare route (like pointing out its flaws that weren't brought up til then)

im not sold yet tho. cute animal in avatar might have pushed you over the edge but alas

Morning Tweet · Post Post #235 (isolation #12) » Fri Sep 04, 2020 8:58 am

Tanner wrote:i think our reads are ~more-or-less similar. i take that as a good sign? also can you talk about the Prism townread, is there anything other than mech-effort?

HURT: elements

My reads came after yours though (or at least after most people agreed those few are town), I think they're mostly consensus-y so far tbh. The mech talk is making this a bit tricky for me but I already went over that. I don't have great confidence in my reads as of yet

Prism's last few posts felt especially genuine to me

Spoiler: here

Unsure he pulls out the "No I don't have reads on them, I'm not happy about it, I'm working on it but I wanted to be honest" as scum

Yeah he could have but i'm leaning against it

Also this falls under the mech talk point, but somebody mentioned Prism did the numbers without even showing his work, so therefore he wasn't too concerned with looking good, he just wanted to have the right conclusion. I think that reflects well on him too

Morning Tweet · Post Post #276 (isolation #13) » Sat Sep 05, 2020 9:25 am

In post 247, PookyTheMagicalBear wrote:each day only one contestant "nominates" themselves to be judged by the collective town - placing his fate in the hands of his peers.

He shall write a long post detailing why he is worthy of being spared and healed.

Then all players will vote on this person's candidacy - either heal or hurt and the day will end with his healing or hurting.

so only those of us with the most pure of hearts should try this :)

Maybe this could work later in the game but like A.) tons of ppl are going to nominate themselves rn and B.) there isn't a whole lot of tangible reasons for a lot of people

Like if say taylor nominated herself (which she did). Then what. I dont have a read on taylor. i seriously doubt she can present some kind of self towncase at this point that would help me much

So then I just have the act itself to judge off of I guess. I would nominate myself as either alignment just because of the sheer unlikeliness of the plan working and it'll look sort of good on me if im scum.

Morning Tweet · Post Post #277 (isolation #14) » Sat Sep 05, 2020 9:35 am

In post 263, Prism wrote:Here are some starter questions:

-Hectic pushed for a spare whose EV is objectively terrible. Earlier, you seemed to think mafia will use EV trickery to push things to their advantage. How do you interpret this? He seemed to make a lot of less concrete arguments for it.
-A lot of people are townreading me/catboi just for trying the numbers. Do you agree with those, or think they're junk?
-Chara's been giving plenty of reads. How do you feel about them, or do you agree with those reads?

Literally the possibilities are endless here. The entire point of catboi's question was for you to explain what you're looking for or
presently thinking about the players
, or at the very least invite you to think how the figurative sausage of reads get made rather than assume that someday they'll pop from thin air

mmmmm this is an insightful post. Agree taylor could use her "EV will be used to deceive" stance to her benefit here -- but I'm not sure if she's or just town who doesn't want to pore through the mechanical talk.

I think you are in the right that she has lots of stuff to talk about if she puts her mind to it, and it's somewhat concerning that she is taking more of a "Game starts when mech talk ends" stance -- but I can sort of sympathize i guess

Oh also let me explain my level of certainty on catboi a bit more-- sure he put a lot of effort in and it looks nice, but this in particular i am *inclined* to believe:

In post 170, catboi wrote:
In post 166, redtea wrote:All I got is: The quick estimate Pooky gave I do no give out town points for (regardless ty for your contribution) and the ones who went the extra mile (catboi, Prism). Maf wouldn't fuckin bother, or think to, anyway. Esp. with how "focusing on game mechanics" is looked at.
（ΦωΦ）For the record, I ran those numbers pregame and you should absolutely not townread effort in that vein, but the difference in EV is so significant that I wouldn't have bothered outing it as mafia because I'd be torpedoing my own team's chances

And not just this -- there's something more

If catboi had arrived to the conclusion that sparing is the better EV for town by far, and then said this comment, I'd trust it less. After all, even if catboi is hurting his team EV-wise by revealing the correct town strategy, if he can grab that spare, it's huge for them.

But he's not. He's telling us to fight. Which is helping town EV by far. If catboi is scum, the towncred he is grabbing here is useless-- he's not going to get spared, and now he's going to have to explain why he never gets nightkilled

Morning Tweet · Post Post #279 (isolation #15) » Sat Sep 05, 2020 9:40 am

In post 266, redtea wrote:
In post 230, Morning Tweet wrote:I have no idea how Elements got Puppy changing his tune from 193. also sheeping Chara

Spoiler: this post span
In post 190, Hectic wrote:
makes me sad but i know when i'm beat, 4 SPARES is a no go
any of ya gonna work out the numbers for 1 to 3 SPARES?

anyway, Prism town because he did the math and was accurate before catboi revealed his spreadsheets
he made the effort but showed no working or proof to try and make it look impressive or get any towncred from it

i believe catboi when he says he wouldn’t reveal the EV working if he was mafia
only because he decided to out his info right after I made a huge case on 4 SPARES, where there was some uncertainty where town would go, and it wasn’t just guaranteed to be genocide anyway

In post 191, Elements wrote:mechanically 4 spares is sub-optimal but if we don't spare we're basically just playing normal mafia

In post 192, Hectic wrote:
yeah bud, that's honestly my main issue
hopefully we can make a 1-3 SPARE route work if the EV for that is acceptable

In post 193, CantHateAPuppy wrote:hectic who would you spare right now

In post 194, Elements wrote:
In post 193, CantHateAPuppy wrote:hectic who would you spare right now
changing your tune a bit

Elements should have known the context for puppys post, he was just talking to Hectic about it 2 posts above it! I am curious as to what the intent of pointing this out really was
Puppy,
was
clearly humoring Pooky,
but

I saw it as Elements being wary about puppy making an inquiry in order to refer back to it if he makes a change of opinion on fighting/sparing down the line. Like, yeah it can be posed as "just humoring him" now, but later Puppy could reframe it as "no I was actually curious and after hearing his opinion I thought fuck it sure". imo i would've let it play out before pointing fingers in order to catch him in the act. Though uh. Puppy may... be going on with the act right now.
My brain isn't supplying sentences to me easily right now, hope that makes sense.

In post 235, Morning Tweet wrote:Unsure
[Prism]
pulls out the "No I don't have reads on them, I'm not happy about it, I'm working on it but I wanted to be honest" as scum

Yeah he could have but i'm leaning against it
the wording seems to be implying it, but to be sure, this is based off of meta? I haven't played any games with him (iirc) so.

Hm, okay. Maybe I'm just overreacting because the comically large span of posts they dragged it out made it seem more serious than it was.

I was a little worried about that but also Chara having an earlier scumread on Elements tipped me over the edge

And nah it's not meta on Prism. More of a soul thing, i guess. Basically i just felt like he was being genuine in his lost-ness as opposed to acting it out

Morning Tweet · Post Post #305 (isolation #16) » Sat Sep 05, 2020 1:06 pm

In post 304, Chara wrote:you're comparing catboi's decision here to a hypothetical that would never occur. the EV is in favour of fighting here, catboi can't change that.
i understand the part about it being beneficial for scum not to out this math (provided no townie wouldn't do the same math), but comparing it to a scenario where the EV says to spare and catboi tells us to spare (and therefore this universe's version of catboi is even townier) doesn't work when that scenario doesn't exist.

and your last point about the towncred being useless... towncred isn't useless for scum in normal games, so why is it useless just because we're not sparing today?

i cannot think of a better way to word this, haha. in fact, this was so hard to work through in my head that if you still disagree with me after reading this i'd rather shake on it and agree to disagree than go down the rabbit hole of logical argument that exists in a possible future.

also, i do like catboi for town, just not for this specific thing.

Well yes-- if we were in that hypothetical scenario and catboi were to have made the same "I wouldn't point this out as scum" comment, then I wouldn't have townread it nearly as much. I more just meant that "I wouldn't townread you for this if sparing were the actual route, but it isn't so here".

Catboi getting townread in this fighting strategy is vastly less useful for scum than it'd be in the sparing strategy. I think the sparing route would easily justify sacrificing knowledge since scum benefits huge from just 1 person in heaven

sure, I guess towncred is always helpful. i just don't *think* catboi sacrifices the chance of us going down the spare route (there was a decent chunk of people who wanted that after all) to gain it. I suppose he could have, though, since still getting townread is still beneficial to his team. it's tough!

Morning Tweet · Post Post #312 (isolation #17) » Sat Sep 05, 2020 1:33 pm

Why'd you hurt redtea first, Hectic?

Morning Tweet · Post Post #381 (isolation #18) » Sun Sep 06, 2020 4:26 pm

i'm really sorry i haven't been playing very actively yet

I'll dedicate time to reading n probably just posting general thoughts on monday or maybe late tonight if i feel like doing that rather than sleeping

Morning Tweet · Post Post #414 (isolation #19) » Mon Sep 07, 2020 8:42 am

In post 410, Elements wrote:
In post 297, Chara wrote:my first thought upon reading this post was "alright, now to try and emulate my town self that Prism is recognizing so i can keep getting townread."
Undertale S ruined me.
Rlly Hectic?
This is so slimy. It's like a hagfish after tying itself in a knot.
It's autological and I don't like it.

Really? my first thought would be that post is hard to come up with on the spot as scum

Morning Tweet · Post Post #415 (isolation #20) » Mon Sep 07, 2020 8:47 am

Spoiler: reads

Spoiler: disorganized notes

I do sort of feel like I'm in my usual trap of "More content" -> "More opportunities to towntell". However, I think if I have a townread incorrect, maybe they're scumChara or maybe scumChara's flip helps me find them. That's the hope anyway. Since we're not sparing, scumChara really isn't going to hurt us much, is she? Scum has to avoid fighting her and we get her flip anyway in a couple of days if we don't fight her.

Morning Tweet · Post Post #416 (isolation #21) » Mon Sep 07, 2020 8:49 am

Chara should be one tier higher, forgot to change that

If i could send 4 people to heaven without nightkills I'd go catboi -> Puppy -> Chara -> ..... Tanner or Prism maybe tossup but probably Prism

Morning Tweet · Post Post #417 (isolation #22) » Mon Sep 07, 2020 8:51 am

Would probably stress over the spares a lot harder though because then scumChara poses a threat and I usually have at least one TR wrong

I think I know how to evaluate Lavender down the line probably and there is little info to be gained if we misfight them

Elements had like 1 or 2 posts that gave me pause about him.

Pooky I think is engaging in a heavily losing strategy if he's scum

VOTE: Taylor

Morning Tweet · Post Post #418 (isolation #23) » Mon Sep 07, 2020 8:51 am

HURT: Taylor

Morning Tweet · Post Post #420 (isolation #24) » Mon Sep 07, 2020 9:04 am

FUCK i forgot to use the post tags in my post. I don't always use them but i was gonna do it this time

you know what

you know WHAT

In post 415, Morning Tweet wrote:
Spoiler: reads
High town, fuck it //

catboi

Town Lean //

CantLynchAPuppy
Prism

Town Incline //

Tanner
Chara

Upper Null //

Hectic
Redtea

Lower Null //

PookyTheMagicalBear
Tayl0r Swift
Elements
Lavender

Spoiler: disorganized notes
I like Puppy’s questionnaire entrance to the mod. I like that he reached the conclusion that fighting is better for us (and found it to be very poetic!). I like Puppy’s “this is town af x2” comments to Tanner. Still generally tone towning on Puppy as i read through (such as 239 242 and so on).

45 is very good by catboi (wanting to hold off and see who would try to get us to spare before sharing analysis). 67 reveals a little nuance that maybe we wouldn’t have talked about if catboi didn’t bring it up, that a spare in 3v2 Xylo is good.

370 - Yes to Pooky/Lavender having a decent chance. I think catboi saying taylor is too antagonistic for scum is a fair enough point but I don’t think i share it. Hm, it’s tough. I think he’s arguing that in good faith

Don’t know what to make of Pooky so far. I think his strategy is wrong but if he’s scum here I don’t think he realistically thinks he has a chance of persuading the players using facts and logic whereas he’s doing *feelings*. It could be a facade so he doesn’t have to play, but if that is so, I don’t think it’s a wise one for pooky!scum. I almost want to think it’s genuine (212).

243 is a fair post from town!Pooky if he’s seriously trying to go through with his sparing strategy -- wouldn’t want the nightkills to ruin it. But also gives him an excuse not to post game-related content sooo.

Again though Chara is right (359) that we shouldn’t narrow our focus to make it harder for scum to NK, they’ll be able to figure out decent kills probably anyway and our cooperation will be hurt severely. I still don’t know if Pooky is being genuine here. It’s a somewhat easy facade to hide behind, he doesn’t have to give reads or anything!

I forgot to write stuff on Prism up til 263 somehow but i think i touched on him in thread already. 263 again I objectively think taylor comes off scummy, he gives her points she should be talking about but isn’t. It’’s a good post.

344 feels extremely genuine to me *i think*. Something about it

Sort of slightly want to townread Tanner for the pocketing comments but I love being paranoid of pocketing as scum personally. Hm hm hm!

I just spent a good 30 seconds staring at 226 by Tanner. I sort of like it but also sort of don’t. 3/4 of his lines have a really noncommittal tone “even though i think i shouldn't be giving townpoints for 146, i still kinda do?” , “i'm lowkey feeling nervous (abt Pooky) due to the push for spares”, and “puppy is feeling different than he did in that game, so guess i'm townreading him!”. I’m not sure if this means anything or not for Tanner but I’m keeping an eye on it.

I made a post that sort of just mirrored consensus townreads for the most part, and Tanner TR me off it since our reads were similar. I do feel like that’s not enough to townread me but I am unsure if that’s towny that Tanner is quick to townread me, or if it’s not. Ugh -- I think I like Tanner

I think I objectively agree with Tanner HURTing taylor after her “ill play when you all start.” post. If taylor is town here though i probably don’t award nearly as many points -- I think she’s objectively scummy there, an easily justifiable vote for both sides.

347 - I think taylor/Pooky/lavender is a viable scumteam but it’s also probably way too easy. I still agree with the idea here though (He words it as a “what if, unless?”)

I can relate to calling something towny but then when asked to explain it, having no reason whatsoever (chara 77). I’m probably more likely to ensure I have reasoning as scum but that’s just personal experience. 126 is objectively correct by Chara I talked about it somewhere else why i like it.

297 is a really smart post if Chara is scum. It comes off as really towny don’t it. (Hectic points this out).

Think Chara was probably more correct than I was about my catboi townread-- i do like that it went out of its way to engage with me on a read that it already shared with me anyway

I agree with Chara that Prism is probably oversuspecting Hectic so far.

HECTIC. I think he has somewhat decent-looking reasons for wanting to take the spare route, but when you take everything into account, it’s a worse route. Most of the points look good (#80) although actually the 5th point is a little forced. I think in the pacifism route, if we spare 4 and game doesn’t end, we are in super dire straits. I feel like Hectic downplays how screwed we are in that scenario but again I’m not sure if that’s forcing the spare route on us or just really wantinfg to do the spare route and focusing on all the bright sides.

Hectic’s #94 ignores that if we screw up 3 fights in a row, we’re probably not going to attempt a 4th fight (##IMPORTANT: Am I understanding the strategy right here?). Yes, we lose if we fail 4 fights, but we don’t lose if we do 3 misfights and then correctly spare.

I think Hectic’s point on Prism!town in 190 is good. There are a lot of points in my notes where I'm copying Hectic's townreads for people, either after the fact or he points out something i noticed as well (like that Chara post Elements finds scummy just above)

118 is super bold by scum!Elements (he suggests we spare Elements, hectic, and Pooky). Hm.

I relate heavily to redtea so far this game but I do not assign townpoints from the opening probably NAI. I think their response to my confusion on Elements was probably the correct side of that debate. I think they are correct in that Pooky’s nomination scheme won’t work well.

Think i lean town on their contributions on page 16

Taylor is sort of going for the “I don’t care about the mech talk call me later”, I am unsure as to whether it’s genuine or scum dodging having to participate. I feel like i’ve seen this sort of unwillingness to play act from scum before but i can’t quite remember where.

Lavender no opinion on. I have looked at Crossfire which has town them in it, I noticed they almost got eliminated early but didn’t. They seemed to have difficulty getting into it, so probably NAI at least. 291 they ask for us to not expect too much and say “Baddie lavender doesn’t exist”. Nothing making me feel particularly better about them yet

I do sort of feel like I'm in my usual trap of "More content" -> "More opportunities to towntell". However, I think if I have a townread incorrect, maybe they're scumChara or maybe scumChara's flip helps me find them. That's the hope anyway. Since we're not sparing, scumChara really isn't going to hurt us much, is she? Scum has to avoid fighting her and we get her flip anyway in a couple of days if we don't fight her.

There if you wanna dive into it, you can now. I don't know if it's worth ppl's time because my reads are always very wonky but if you want to discuss anything I will probably be able to remember what it is since i wrote it down. Writing helps me remember

Morning Tweet · Post Post #423 (isolation #25) » Mon Sep 07, 2020 10:52 am

Overall I ended up town leaning you but it might not be reflected perfectly in the notes, I kinda just commented on things that stood out to me as I went along. i can say I didnt find it outright scummy to townread me when I didnt think there was enough yet -- I give out townreads like candy myself personally

i can try to quantify why I like you more when i get access to a pc again proly

-

Effort for me is NAI, bordering on slightly scummy. I have made a giant reads note post at least one time as scum in both my scum games this year, whereas I do it maybe 1/2 - 2/3rds the time as town. sometimes as town i just say fuck it and follow my heart without doing heavy backtrack reading

in this case I felt like I was falling behind this game, even when I made posts I wasnt really retaining information from what i was reading and i spent a lot of energy on marathon games lol

Morning Tweet · Post Post #432 (isolation #26) » Mon Sep 07, 2020 1:14 pm

Now i'm really interested in Puppy cause I liked him super early and then stopped writing notes on him other than general town toning or smth. Maybe im wrong on that

Morning Tweet · Post Post #481 (isolation #27) » Mon Sep 07, 2020 8:00 pm

Spoiler: Tanner in Isolation

Morning Tweet · Post Post #484 (isolation #28) » Mon Sep 07, 2020 8:05 pm

In post 451, catboi wrote:
In post 423, Morning Tweet wrote:Effort for me is NAI, bordering on slightly scummy. I have made a giant reads note post at least one time as scum in both my scum games this year, whereas I do it maybe 1/2 - 2/3rds the time as town. sometimes as town i just say fuck it and follow my heart without doing heavy backtrack reading
I have heard of the fabled scum notedump from you, but I noticed in the example I could find those notes were heavy on the play-by-play but here your notes trend mostly toward analysis.

Yeah that sounds about right actually lol

Flavour Leaf noted it was somewhat information over analysis and nearly caught me for it

Being scum can make me more indecisive about what stances I need to take. It's more about demonstrating the effort was made than the actual content!

Morning Tweet · Post Post #486 (isolation #29) » Mon Sep 07, 2020 8:09 pm

It's harder for me to tell whether pooky is being genuine or not when I seriously disagree w him. I think, even though our individual chances each day of getting a townread correct is high, doing it 4 times in a row will not be a walk in the park with nightkills

So yeah basically what Tanner has been saying

i just.. Pooky, your strategy is positively benefitted from hiding many of your reads, yes? And that's what youre planning on doing until a wagon is nearly fought, right?

But seeing as 95% of the game isnt partaking in your strategy, what is the point of hiding your own thoughts anymore? You're just one part of the town so really you may as well share since the NK will likely remain unchanged anyway at this point

and i apologize if I have it wrong and you have been sharing reads n stuff I have just been glossing over a lot of your posts due to not really digging the pacifism argument

Morning Tweet · Post Post #488 (isolation #30) » Mon Sep 07, 2020 8:11 pm

In post 485, PookyTheMagicalBear wrote:you know what we could do if you guys are all super convinced Tanner = good?

we could like totally spare him and give peace a chance.

Is there a point to doing that though? (if we arent going 4 spares)

Like does having Tanner in heaven somehow help us down the line, assuming we go neutral route after that

Morning Tweet · Post Post #499 (isolation #31) » Mon Sep 07, 2020 8:21 pm

In post 490, PookyTheMagicalBear wrote:
In post 486, Morning Tweet wrote:doing it 4 times in a row will not be a walk in the park with nightkills
I don't think I ever presented it as "easy"

but I do believe it will be a worthy goal and an amazing win if we can pull it off :)

Why go out of our way to do something that we can demonstrate will be harder and has like 20% to 25%ish less odds of town winning?

Tayl0r Swift wrote:to be fair pooky's insistence on sparing probably makes pooky town. sticking out like a sore thumb in the rear end is not what scum wants to do.

I guess that has some merit but i can kind of see scum!pooky going like "My strategy is to fight tooth and nail for sparing even if the whole thread opposes me. and then I get townread for it!!"

But actually hold that thought cause i thought i saw a thing or two that felt like Pooky really believes in what he's saying. so maybe not, cause if he's playing a bit like that, then he is definitely not taking it seriously and would be faking it

Morning Tweet · Post Post #505 (isolation #32) » Mon Sep 07, 2020 8:28 pm

i think what I was thinking of was how Pooky points out our odds go up immensely if days 1 and 2 are slamdunk townread winners guaranteed. I guess i can find it somewhat more believable that he believes in his plan, if that makes sense.

I was also going to say I liked his "I always do this every game with mechanics, I always try to break the setup" but on other pass ehh maybe not as much i dont think its AI

Morning Tweet · Post Post #508 (isolation #33) » Mon Sep 07, 2020 8:30 pm

In post 504, PookyTheMagicalBear wrote:I don't really have a preference. I am ok with tanner, I think Tweet made good points about him and when he was conversing with me I felt he was doing so in good faith like he really wanted to see my side/convince me to turn away from a path of peace.

Am I like 100% sure he's locktown- nope but he's probably been the nicest to me so far :)

if you're not 100% sure then why would we spare rather than fight?!

Morning Tweet · Post Post #510 (isolation #34) » Mon Sep 07, 2020 8:31 pm

In post 506, PookyTheMagicalBear wrote:I guess I just find it way easier to find town than find mafia

This I can agree with. Maybe partially because there are way more town, but i am way more comfortable townlocking ppl than condemning them

But not enough to overcome the obstacles the setup has with the spare route

Morning Tweet · Post Post #514 (isolation #35) » Mon Sep 07, 2020 8:34 pm

Yeah but it's not nearly as bad misfighting as missparing is.

Like missparing not only do we have no idea we screwed up (So our perception going forward is screwed thinking that a scum is town), but we have to do a really difficult Xylo where we play spot the deepwolf in the 4 spared

If we even get there, cause the aforementioned misspared player might already have dealt enough damage to us thinking they were town or we just spared Chara and lost anyway

Morning Tweet · Post Post #515 (isolation #36) » Mon Sep 07, 2020 8:35 pm

err, Not Chara

Morning Tweet · Post Post #518 (isolation #37) » Mon Sep 07, 2020 8:41 pm

If we're not gonna spare 4 people which we very likely arent then we should just let Not Chara eat her flowers or whatever before entertaining sparing. free scum death!

I bet Chara and Tanner and prolly several ppl have made that point every 5 seconds but here I am rehashing it in the vain hopes it makes it clear to Pooky that we're taking the game on the path to murder and destruction and he needs to hop on board for now whether he agrees with it or not

let not chara die!!

Morning Tweet · Post Post #558 (isolation #38) » Tue Sep 08, 2020 1:55 pm

Hectic wrote:
-that i'm confident she's town. She's hard towntelling this game and I'd bet the game on her being town
(i have a towntell on her which has so far been very accurate - i'm not going to reveal what it is because it is too valuable)

HEAL: Morning Tweet

wtf already?

(¬ω¬) hmmmm

Morning Tweet · Post Post #563 (isolation #39) » Tue Sep 08, 2020 2:04 pm

Redtea feels town, i like the post where they say his reads on catboi's townblock -- they feel Prism should replace them, and they have unique thoughts on everyone in the block (cat - town, tanner - neutral, me - tl)

In post 527, Elements wrote:
Spoiler:
In post 43, CantHateAPuppy wrote:thanks isis! sorryr for not bolding

so genocide is just better right? at least to start? sparing has a 1/12 chance of just plain losing the game, fighting has a 1/12 chance of hitting the vengeful but that would help in the Zero spare route and even if we hit town we'll still be setting up more cop clears in the 1-3 route.

In post 44, CantHateAPuppy wrote:yeah, pretty sure killing is just better here. is that a meta-commentary on the game of mafia? we could chose to work together but always end up fighting instead. we could be loving and kind and caring, but... killing is just better anyways. uh, neat. kill on!

In post 65, CantHateAPuppy wrote:
In post 1, Isis wrote:One to three : The mafia must choose an unspared player to be publicly investigated for each living mafia. Skip night 4. Return spared players to the game thread. If mafia was spared, the mafia immediately wins if two of its players survive the day 5 decision.
Zero : The mafia must choose two players to be publicly investigated. If Chara was fought, the mafia must choose everyone. Skip night 4.
I think 1-3 could be better in one or two cases. 0 is better if chara gets fought, but 1-3 is better if no scum get eliminated (though that would depend on chara living which is unlikely?) Hm, maybe 0 spares straight up is better

In post 95, CantHateAPuppy wrote:i kind of really want sparing to work, but i just don't think it does

how do you figure that sparing works best in the first two days? that's also when we could spare chara and that's an autoloss. if you spare early you also increase the risk of the chara surviving

also though

In post 193, CantHateAPuppy wrote:hectic who would you spare right now

In post 248, CantHateAPuppy wrote:hm. how would we agree on who gets nominated?

In post 445, CantHateAPuppy wrote:also i was thinking about spares again. i forgot why we gave up on them. i know it's unlikely that we'll spare correctly 4 times in a row, but is the 4 spare ending really that bad? say there's one scum in finale, wouldn't that be pretty good odds with strong town players? or would paranoia + no flips be too much to overcome?

Anyone want to apologise for hurting me for saying puppy was changing their tune?

I think only that last post really qualifies. i'll give u a half apology if that helps

im half sorry

also because I don't exactly TR you

In post 529, Elements wrote:wow, I feel like my reads are completely the opposite to everyone elses

Maybe this is a towny post. maybe, maybe

@ Elements read post

Why is Tanner scum in your eyes? Also isn't Pooky being Chara sort of a cop out guess. I don't know how to explain it but if Pooky is Chara that just seems like a really bad way of going about it lol

Morning Tweet · Post Post #565 (isolation #40) » Tue Sep 08, 2020 2:06 pm

In post 543, PookyTheMagicalBear wrote:
In post 118, Elements wrote:one of them should be pooky
one of them should be me
one of them should be hectic
btw this post is why i think elements is chara.

he very conveniently puts himself in the middle of the order - he can't be last because he'd die on D3 - so it's a sneaky middle of the pack insert - he doesn't put himself first because he's a very sneaky chara.

This is like conspiracy theory level reasoning in my opinion

NotChara Elements would like, need to convince us that he's towny somehow. Simply asking to be heavened is a terrible strategy.

If he put himself second with the purpose of subliminally suggesting we spare him second, that means he actually believes that saying "one of them should be me" gives him a greater chance of being heavened or somehow helps him get to heaven. doesnt really make that much sense to me

Morning Tweet · Post Post #570 (isolation #41) » Tue Sep 08, 2020 2:12 pm

In post 545, Tayl0r Swift wrote:
In post 537, CantHateAPuppy wrote:Also I think taylor still talking spares is null, maybe she's just stubborn? There are a few players I'd like to see reads from more than setup spec (looking at you pooky :( ) and you're maybe tunneling on them tbh?
in case it wasnt clear, i was advocating that we fight

Okay, so who--

In post 546, Tanner wrote: ok, who do you want to fight?

In post 549, Tayl0r Swift wrote:my lame take is that lavender is scummy for lurking. my spicy take is that puppy might be a good candidate to fight.

I believe some other people (cat) have been considering Puppy recently, so maybe your reasons are similar to theirs. but i'll ask anyway.

Are you interested in explaining more details of why you think Puppy is a good fight, or at least perhaps voting for Puppy?

Another reminder for myself to actually read thru puppys posts

Morning Tweet · Post Post #613 (isolation #42) » Wed Sep 09, 2020 7:58 pm

what the fuck

Morning Tweet · Post Post #619 (isolation #43) » Wed Sep 09, 2020 8:14 pm

They didn't say pushing for 4 spare is scummy. They said the 4-spare plan is one that benefits scum. And you were pushing it.

Scum wouldn't start the game knowing by default that pushing for 4 spare is scummy. They might know secretly that it helps scum the most, but that doesn't mean they aren't going to try and push it for ulterior motives

now im not saying thats what you're doing, idk. and tbh it's going to be a whole ordeal figuring that out when i dive into the whole catboi v pooky thing

I will say that I can very conceivably see you pushing for 4 spare, knowing fully well it is suboptimal, as town, just for the 'fun' factor

Morning Tweet · Post Post #668 (isolation #44) » Thu Sep 10, 2020 8:54 am

tbh i totally forgot about that clause cause i just simplified it to "Not Chara dies if we fight a townie"

Morning Tweet · Post Post #678 (isolation #45) » Thu Sep 10, 2020 1:24 pm

If Hectic is town he knows i am town 99%

it doesn't surprise me that I'd be his most confident spare

Morning Tweet · Post Post #680 (isolation #46) » Thu Sep 10, 2020 1:32 pm

In post 675, Isis wrote:
"Hmm... I guess it'd be bad if I let you burn up the whole studio?" Nahdia mused. They tilted their head, seeming surprisingly open to that possibility.
"A storm rained on the travelers, which changed their journey!!" Nahdia announced. They snapped, and the sprinklers turned on, letting catboi slip from Hectic's grip as catboi instinctually hid from the water.
The same rain pattered onto Morning Tweet's wings, making the novice flier start to tumble. Hectic saw, and caught her because he saw something moving and wanted to grab it.
"YIP!"
His next instinct was to bury her and keep her forever, so he set her on the ground in his shadow, which was dry since his huge body so effectively blocked the sprinklers. But then he realized he didn't have any paws, so digging would be difficult.

thanks but-- please don't bury me alive !! (-ω-)

In post 659, Tayl0r Swift wrote:catboi is my top scumread fwiw. i also dislike hectic for pushing a spare today, after everything else we've talked about re sparing/fighting.

In post 663, Tayl0r Swift wrote:i kinda think it would be hard to forget after fucking 25 pages of this nonsense. but its not a sure thing, so you get a scumpoint but im not voting for you. also heya

This is new! Is it Pooky's scumcase on cat, something to do with the earlier mech talk, or something else entirely that makes you suspect him?

Kinda already touched on this, but Hectic was saying we spare 1 -> fight 3. He forgot the order we'd do it in though (we need to fight before sparing). It's not something as major as forgetting that we aren't doing 4 spares. i myself forgot that Chara doesn't die if there are spared players cause it's just sort of a random detail

Morning Tweet · Post Post #681 (isolation #47) » Thu Sep 10, 2020 1:36 pm

In post 679, Prism wrote:That's great. He also knows you're town 100% of the time as mafia.

I have seen literally zero redeeming play of his in my eyes. This is in stark contrast to the last two games I played with him, where in the first he was a universal townread who played very crisply, and the second was a universal TR who I took specific steps to mislead as scum, and I decided to shoot him since the chance of him getting voted was zero.

Reads are bad. Pushes are bad. Tone is bad. Progression is bad. Like ???

Well sure. I was replying to this:

In post 671, Prism wrote:You haven't made the case for Morning town. You've said that you have a reliable towntell on them that you aren't going to out because it's too valuable. You haven't cited anything else that you would be willing to share.

There's no real attempt to get others to come around to Morning town and jump on this spare. The result is that this feels performative. I really don't like you this game.

I wouldn't hold your breath on a case, it's very secret stuff. But it is accurate. What you're interpreting as performative-- isn't.

i am willing to look more into the "reads are bad, pushes are bad, tone is bad" claim though

Morning Tweet · Post Post #690 (isolation #48) » Thu Sep 10, 2020 1:46 pm

I haven't read a catboi/Pooky post in probably over 2 days. Does anyone have any advice for me on how to read them?

Prism wrote:My point isn't that he has zero reason to townread you. I'm sure even if he's scum he's got something waiting for that.

My point is that the entire way he approached sparing you was performative, because he wasn't trying to persuade others to come around (and there are probably many not-so-secretive towntells) and he did not seem to give thought to alternative spares

The "this is the play" highlighted by arrows suggests to me that the mech was a framing for the vote to spare you, rather than the vote being an lazy add-on to mechanical thinking that he claims

This is where my performative claim comes from. Zero interest in actually making the spare on you happen, just making his stance on you clear.

Aight, be back later

I know. My point is that there is no case to be made, I don't.. really think he can persuade other people without actually explaining the tell.

I think you make a fair point that he probably wasn't going to make the spare on me happen (Even if the mech allowed us to spare rn). However, on the other hand, if he is town, he does know that I am town now. But.. why point it out then I suppose?

So why'd you point out your towntell for me so early, Hectic? Did you think people would follow you on it (back when you misunderstood the mech)? Most of this playerlist isn't familar with this tell thing, I don't think.

Pedit: well hectic is sort of already responding but yeah ima still post this

Morning Tweet · Post Post #694 (isolation #49) » Thu Sep 10, 2020 1:50 pm

I wish you had waited until tomorrow to make that post

Morning Tweet · Post Post #702 (isolation #50) » Thu Sep 10, 2020 2:06 pm

Yeah so Hectic probably isn't scum, don't really see why he goes out of his way to call all that attention to himself.

Note that he has failed to be cognizant of the game setup before as scum (In werewolf, warlock, vampire he sort of forgot scum had a nightkill), but that was during RVS, not after 28 pages of literally half of which was mech talk.

If he truly believes that 1 spare / 3 fights is better than 4 fights (I cannot be fucked to check if that's the case but he seems to think so), combine that with knowing I am 99% town, it just kind of makes sense to advocate for sparing me

I can see why Prism interpreted it as performative, but i think if you insert yourself into Hectic's mindset there it'd make sense. His mindset being "We need 1 spare and 3 fights in no particular order, Morning is town so there's the first correct decision off the bat"

whereas if Hectic is scum, i don't see why the hell he'd start advocating for a spare. WITHOUT ANY CASE or flashy reasoning to be seen. Especially considering that spares are always met with suspicion thus far. And I think it's vastly unlikely scum!Hectic is like "Oh I'm going to pretend to misinterpret the setup and start advocating a spare without giving a case for it because people will interpret that as too scummy to be scum". cause we won't. Not a single time has someone advocating for spares been met with positive feedback to my knowledge

i think it just makes more sense that town Hectic doesn't care about how he's interpreted and he justs posts that, thinking it to be the best strategy possible at the time. clearly mistakes were made

Morning Tweet · Post Post #703 (isolation #51) » Thu Sep 10, 2020 2:09 pm

Also pointing out I'm 100% town and then getting me spared seems like a pretty pointless move, bordering on just a plain negative play for scum!Hectic. I can see the argument being made that his intention was never to actually get me spared and he's just doing it because I guess he's.. trying to do... what exactly? I'm not actually sure what he gains from pretending to want me spared either

Morning Tweet · Post Post #705 (isolation #52) » Thu Sep 10, 2020 2:10 pm

Oh maybe pocket me. It's a fantastic way to pocket me.

But pocketing isn't very useful if you get eliminated immediately after

Morning Tweet · Post Post #717 (isolation #53) » Thu Sep 10, 2020 3:59 pm

i asked that too but haven't gotten a response yet i dont think (・`ω´・)

Morning Tweet · Post Post #719 (isolation #54) » Thu Sep 10, 2020 4:09 pm

(¬‿¬) it's a bold strategy, let's see if it pays off

Morning Tweet · Post Post #722 (isolation #55) » Thu Sep 10, 2020 4:15 pm

ヽ(・о・)ﾉ

that was your top scumread! what happened?!

Morning Tweet · Post Post #834 (isolation #56) » Fri Sep 11, 2020 2:58 pm

beeboy wrote:To some degree I want to town read MT for Hectic's "Top secret meta read", since good players tend to not say that without a real reason to do so.
But I also think I could probably read her on my own since I am fairly experienced playing with her, and she did perceive herself to be scum in one game even if she was town and could have thought it was multiball.

I originally wanted to question Hectic because I never heard of this tell before!!! But the 3 games that the 3 of us touched were 2 games modded by hectic and 1 modded by MT.
For the amount I've played with both Hectic and MT I am genuinely suprised this is the first time the 3 of us have played together. I don't want to count the dance game since it was an anon game.

Yeah that was a textbook scum game of mine for one day. Look no further than the difference between how i sounded D1 vs. the rest of the days in that game to decipher the difference between how i play

oh yeah I guess that's true, huh? This tell is a reoccurring theme that i haven't been able to break out of for... hm... like around, 13 games now

Morning Tweet · Post Post #837 (isolation #57) » Fri Sep 11, 2020 3:04 pm

Just because im aware of it does not make me capable of breaking free from it, not for very long

i mean-- um.mm..

I have no idea what im like as scum, I hardly ever roll it anyway. i've all but forgotten what i act like

Morning Tweet · Post Post #838 (isolation #58) » Fri Sep 11, 2020 3:05 pm

In post 836, Hectic wrote:Don't tell anyone, beeboy, but it's actually the way Morning flaps her ears. She flaps them slightly faster when she's town.

flipflapflipflapflipflapflipflapflipflapflipflapflipflapflipflapflipflapflipflapflipflapflipflapflipflapflipflap

(人・ω･)

Morning Tweet · Post Post #844 (isolation #59) » Fri Sep 11, 2020 3:09 pm

Do I have emoji indicative tells im not aware of? (¬ω¬)

Morning Tweet · Post Post #914 (isolation #60) » Sat Sep 12, 2020 4:18 pm

In post 855, PookyTheMagicalBear wrote:spares are more serious than hurts imo because 4 town-spare votes on a chara is auto-lose

While this is true that Spares should theoretically be deadly serious due to that, i wouldn't really have thought of that while casting a spare

In post 857, Tayl0r Swift wrote:hectic - probably town. stop being a goof though, and while i agree that deciding lavender is town rather than scum is passing on an opportunity for opportunism, it feels like a weak read
elements - beeboy hasnt really done anything to make me townread that slot (yet)
chara - am i the only one thinking chara might be scum here? chara let themself be talked into scumreading me pretty easily, and seems to float around the popular opinions a lot but never do much scumhunting
prism - prolly just town
pooky - definitely town
catboi - i still have misgivings
morning - those ears could never be scum
lavender - needs more content, in PoE
redtea - i dont remember any posts from this slot. i guess at some point i should read the iso but its not a good sign if they arent doing anything worth remembering. could just be the awolness that made me forget
tanner - prolly just town
puppy - hasnt really done much townie recently, but was a townread earlier

so that makes my PoE chara, lavender, redtea, puppy. out of those i want to HURT: chara

I don't hate this. Although i seriously dont get the catboi thing lol

I see the wagon of the day is beeboy maybe ill think abt that

Morning Tweet · Post Post #915 (isolation #61) » Sat Sep 12, 2020 4:25 pm

In post 877, catboi wrote:
In post 840, PookyTheMagicalBear wrote:2) Catboi

I find it strange that he would pursue the path of attacking me and claim that he expected me to bury him in a giant wall and then back off the way he did.

If this is what you expect me to do when you attack then why would you even attack in the first place if you were just going to walk away? The behavior is strange and I'm not sure if it is AI.
I am weak. But really, it was a combination of not quite being able to keep pace with the game for a few days and the feeling of "is this really the direction I want to go in?" and I kind of lost conviction somewhere along the way.

i like this explanation

In post 900, CantHateAPuppy wrote:feeling like it doesn't matter who we flip, because if we flip town we get the chara anyways. so we should flip a slot that is hard for us to resolve. feeling like that isn't hectic rn, also my reason for voting there wasn't really there, im not really sure who i scumread except for elements (was scumread? do scumread? not sure.)

Yeah it's making putting effort in kind of hard, it feels like there's no pressure when scum dies anyway if we choose wrong

I think flipping a slot that is hard to resolve/solve is a fair enough way of going about it.

I'm probably okay going Elements too though. Although maybe should try to read beeboy first

Morning Tweet · Post Post #916 (isolation #62) » Sat Sep 12, 2020 4:38 pm

I think I'm just going to try and use the Not Chara flip to get me back into the swing of solving maybe, then I'll have something to focus on

Going off of pure vibes alone I'd go something like:

Spoiler: vibes

If this game's gonna be easy then there's like 2/3 scum in that bottom 4-5ish and we are going to win this no problem I think

However, if it's not, then maybe Not Chara's flip will either A.) take out the deepwolf because they are Not Chara lol or B.) help me locate the deepwolf

So I'm probably good sniping elements-beeboy and seeing what happens

HURT: Beeboy X-2 i *think*

Morning Tweet · Post Post #918 (isolation #63) » Sat Sep 12, 2020 4:55 pm

Yeah I do think i remembered that hitting Not Chara specifically will technically make the game easier for us -- but I don't know if we can realistically pick out Chara specifically using just a D1. Or at least, i dont think i could anyway

I guess trying hard to find scum gives a 1/3rd chance of that happening by default though. MM yup, i'm definitely just lazy! Sorry abt that

Morning Tweet · Post Post #920 (isolation #64) » Sat Sep 12, 2020 5:04 pm

am i part of the problem? ╥﹏╥

That's true though about getting our reads out before the Not Chara death and looking into that stuff is kind of what i want to do after the Not Chara flip

I will probably do a nice D1 master reads list with some actual reasoning behind it in a little bit. I believe there are a couple days left, yes?

Morning Tweet · Post Post #933 (isolation #65) » Sun Sep 13, 2020 9:47 am

In post 930, Tanner wrote:
In post 916, Morning Tweet wrote:I think I'm just going to try and use the Not Chara flip to get me back into the swing of solving maybe, then I'll have something to focus on
i relate to this on a spiritual level

on the surface level i like the idea behind "everyone puts out readslists so we can hunt associates post-flip" but like... (1) that's effort and (2) when you phrase it like that, scum knows we're gonna be looking into it tomorrow and will probably make it so getting info from it is harder and stuff.

I thought about this too actually. But like, it's giving reads. Scum already would have known and played as if we're going to look into the reads of dead scum -- there's nothing special about this proposal or this game

Except that it reminds people to hurry up and state their reads. Cause for one Not Chara, they may be out of time and we wanna milk it before we lose them

I guess they're going to be even more conscious of their reads than usual but tbh fine with me

Morning Tweet · Post Post #934 (isolation #66) » Sun Sep 13, 2020 9:49 am

UNVOTE:

no getting out of this one easy Not Chara (>ω<)

Morning Tweet · Post Post #936 (isolation #67) » Sun Sep 13, 2020 10:14 am

HURT: Isis

i knew that

Morning Tweet · Post Post #1005 (isolation #68) » Mon Sep 14, 2020 8:29 am

In post 1002, Tayl0r Swift wrote:why is it that everyone featured in the flavor looks super scummy in the flavor? like how is beeboy not evil in this flavor? and how was i not evil in the last one?

I believe it's related to who we FIGHT:

also, NOT COOL beeboy. i barely know how to use these wings! (>﹏<)

Morning Tweet · Post Post #1023 (isolation #69) » Mon Sep 14, 2020 3:11 pm

i like how everyone i was considering in the reads post a while back (except for pooky) has just remained relevant (Tayl0r, Lavender, beeboy-Elements). I half thought i was just gonna vote park on tayl0r all day and then get a decent shot at eliminating scum with almost no effort

Tayl0r occasionally posts stuff that makes me reconsider though. Somebody already pointed out the post where she questions people turning around on her, agree that's sort of a weird scum move

i see what beeboy is talking about -- the progression on her reads is crazy. Did you see the catboi read?!

But I don't really wanna say it makes her scum, it's possible scum!beeboy is grasping at straws here. Or maybe a town!beeboy comes to the conclusion she's scummy for it too, i'm sure it's possible esp when he's been busy lately and tayl0r kind of sticks out

Still my preferred wagon is beeboy as of rn

Morning Tweet · Post Post #1027 (isolation #70) » Mon Sep 14, 2020 4:57 pm

a remarkable showing of optimism by pooky

Morning Tweet · Post Post #1037 (isolation #71) » Mon Sep 14, 2020 8:38 pm

I would be comfortable sparing (in a more peaceful alternate universe) Prism, Pooky, catboi, and surprisingly tayl0r as well.

I know catboi and Pooky had that big 1v1 but i didnt read it for the most part. I'll check it later if it's important

I thought about pausing catboi just below the spare line pending a reevaluation but i think his "shot in the dark" post onto Lavender probably comes from town

Here's the breakdown after my reread:

Prism
Pooky
Tayl0r
Catboi
-------- SPARE LINE --------
Hectic
Redtea
Chara
-------------------------------
Tanner
Puppy
-------------------------------
Lavender
Elements-beeboy

Doesn't seem like Puppy and Elements would be scum together. want to say Puppy shoots up into town area after an Elements red flip

I'm going to feel really stupid for reversing on Tayl0r if she's scum

i need to prepare for the scenario where Lavender is town more -- I think my plan of attack would be checking through Hectic/Redtea/Chara first, Puppy too if Elements is town.

I actually don't feel too bad about the odds on this one though HURT: beeboy

Morning Tweet · Post Post #1047 (isolation #72) » Tue Sep 15, 2020 4:59 am

In post 1045, catboi wrote:F-1, btw

I don't really feel great on this or the game in general. Hoping maybe the flips cause a refocusing but actually feel kind of grim, tbh. •(◐﹏◐)•

oh ye of little faith

this is a scumflip

Morning Tweet · Post Post #1066 (isolation #73) » Thu Sep 17, 2020 9:41 am

So we win either by fighting Not Chara, or by fighting a townie -> Not Chara suicides -> fighting the last mafia. And if we do genocide then we get a boost in Xylo. Is that correct?

Morning Tweet · Post Post #1067 (isolation #74) » Thu Sep 17, 2020 9:42 am

HURT: Sujimichi

Morning Tweet · Post Post #1070 (isolation #75) » Thu Sep 17, 2020 9:47 am

time to go on a rampage!

Morning Tweet · Post Post #1073 (isolation #76) » Thu Sep 17, 2020 9:51 am

In post 1072, Chara wrote:
In post 1048, Prism wrote:HURT: beeboy

see ya nerds

xoxo love chara
i hope Prism appreciates the terror i felt upon reading this when beeboy was still unflipped.

I was scared for a split moment but then i realized that going as high effort as he did would be an odd play for a Not Chara who knew they were about to die

Morning Tweet · Thu Sep 17, 2020 10:10 am

i will adopt one of catboi's faces in his honour. maybe.. this one!

(^人^)

Morning Tweet · Thu Sep 17, 2020 11:01 am

I thought about pointing my finger at Tanner but i decided against it because i like his start of today

I'm somewhat gambling that Lavender is town but Hectic seems to think she is so sure maybe she is whatever. In any case that's a lame first vote, redtea is very possibly mafia or Not Chara from my recollection -- will look more over it another time though

Morning Tweet · Thu Sep 17, 2020 11:18 am

In post 1091, Tanner wrote:
In post 1037, Morning Tweet wrote:Here's the breakdown after my reread:

Prism
Pooky
Tayl0r
Catboi
-------- SPARE LINE --------
Hectic

Redtea

Chara
-------------------------------
Tanner
Puppy
-------------------------------
Lavender
Elements-beeboy
i don't necessarily disagree with you, but how did you get from here to there?

The process was probably something like..

0. Beeboy-elements scum, catboi town
1. Puppy up twice
2. Tanner up
3. Lavender may be town I really dunno, check the next tier where {Chara, Hectic, Tanner, Redtea} are. Most likely scum in there is Redtea, move them down

Prism
Pooky
Tayl0r

Catboi

-------- SPARE LINE --------
Puppy
-------------------------------
Chara
Hectic
Tanner
-------------------------------
Lavender
Redtea

Elements-beeboy

Morning Tweet · Thu Sep 17, 2020 11:22 am

In post 1099, Chara wrote:thinking we can definitively find 3+ town based off one scum elimination is folly...
and not mine.

I think we could but it doesn't make sense to do that over just sniping 1 scum

Morning Tweet · Thu Sep 17, 2020 11:23 am

In post 1102, Chara wrote:scum either bussed or just sat back and did nothing while we killed beeboy. do you really think
all
of them did the latter?
also, i find Tweet's lack of faith in me... disturbing.

(¬ω¬)

Lack of faith?

Morning Tweet · Thu Sep 17, 2020 11:35 am

Maybe that method of showing reads is unclear -- they're all comparative

Hectic and Chara didn't go down, Puppy went above them

Morning Tweet · Thu Sep 17, 2020 11:44 am

In post 1115, Hectic wrote:I mean, why didn't Hectic and Chara go up by virtue of pushing Ele, but Puppy did?

Cause I remember Puppy doing it better in my mind and i remember it being very early

I haven't reread yet because i've been bit doing that in advance in the past. Off the bat though I feel pretty good about a Sujimiji fight

Morning Tweet · Thu Sep 17, 2020 11:47 am

In post 1120, Morning Tweet wrote:
In post 1115, Hectic wrote:I mean, why didn't Hectic and Chara go up by virtue of pushing Ele, but Puppy did?
Cause I remember Puppy doing it better in my mind and i remember it being very early

I haven't reread yet because i've been bit doing that in advance in the past. Off the bat though I feel pretty good about a Sujimiji fight

Oh also I'm sure not all 3 scum are going to be as simple as the elements-beeboy fight was, and if I had to guess there's probably one of them who doesn't look terrible rn. So Elements-beeboy + Suji (or Lavender, maybe..) + that person

My guess would be that person has a good interaction with the elements-beeboy wagon, and I'm guessing its not Puppy or my Spare bloc

Morning Tweet · Thu Sep 17, 2020 11:55 am

LOL i need to explain that tayl0r thing at some point it's probably going to make me sound insane

No I don't remember why i put her there but I felt very strongly about it when i did

Morning Tweet · Post Post #1154 (isolation #86) » Thu Sep 17, 2020 6:21 pm

In post 1148, Tayl0r Swift wrote:yesterday i was unsure about catboi and elements, but agreed with the rest of the readlist. actually im not quite sure why im so high up, but im not gonna question it too too much. i prolly just pocketed you by flopping your ears. i propose that we move hectic up in the readlist, and chara down. i really really feel like chara is chara.

hey!! my ears are my weak spot >﹏<

I might move Hectic up. I disagree with your full assessment of Chara, it has been scumhunting? And certainly not mostly fluff.. am I just remembering very poorly?

Morning Tweet · Post Post #1224 (isolation #87) » Fri Sep 18, 2020 2:08 pm

Okay, I am definitely rereading thru the night phase from now on. Maybe. I'm starting to remember why i do that. i get distracted

Let me check over tayl0r and see where we're at on her and maybe remember why I spared her. Note that I spared her BEFORE the Elements flip. While I did feel uncharacteristically confident that elements was going to flip scum which also would lead to tayl0r being town, i dont think her interactions with them are why i spared her. I'll talk about those anyway though

Spoiler: taylor thoughts

Early game distaste towards mech talk came off as avoiding the thread under the pretense of "it's all mech talk so i can't read it", even though that wasn't the case. We're past that now and I don't believe it's scummy anymore

In post 497, Tayl0r Swift wrote:is elements normally this quiet as town?

LOL this came out of nowhere. Hectic, Elements, and Pooky were the main points of debate at the time and she decided to townlean Pooky just a bit before this post and continues to heavily townread. So a pretty decent bus of Elements here

She does put Hectic in her pool of suspects but she removes him later

In post 659, Tayl0r Swift wrote:catboi is my top scumread fwiw. i also dislike hectic for pushing a spare today, after everything else we've talked about re sparing/fighting.

In post 720, Tayl0r Swift wrote:hmm i reread the iso and im not sure what i was seeing. its possible that the avatar just set me off? on rereading youre more null-town

In post 723, Tayl0r Swift wrote:i dunno! at the time i didnt like that catboi wont lay off pooky. pooky feels like lhf and kinda obvtown. but catboi overall i think is just overeager town.

In post 861, Tayl0r Swift wrote:i dont know if i could really articulate my read on catboi. actually ive kinda proven that i cant. theres just something there i dont like.

i guess catboi and beeboy are also in PoE.

This catboi progression is so fucking funny to me for some reason

In post 857, Tayl0r Swift wrote:hectic - probably town. stop being a goof though, and while i agree that deciding lavender is town rather than scum is passing on an opportunity for opportunism, it feels like a weak read
elements - beeboy hasnt really done anything to make me townread that slot (yet)
chara - am i the only one thinking chara might be scum here? chara let themself be talked into scumreading me pretty easily, and seems to float around the popular opinions a lot but never do much scumhunting
prism - prolly just town
pooky - definitely town
catboi - i still have misgivings
morning - those ears could never be scum
lavender - needs more content, in PoE
redtea - i dont remember any posts from this slot. i guess at some point i should read the iso but its not a good sign if they arent doing anything worth remembering. could just be the awolness that made me forget
tanner - prolly just town
puppy - hasnt really done much townie recently, but was a townread earlier

so that makes my PoE chara, lavender, redtea, puppy. out of those i want to HURT: chara

She totally forgets to put Elements and catboi in her PoE at the end of the post. Maybe confirm biased but I feel like she'd be more aware of how she interacts with partners than that.

In post 869, Tayl0r Swift wrote:im down for a beeboy wagon

Also 5 seconds later she says this so she definitely had misgivings towards Elements-beeboy but just didn't list their name for some reason

In post 923, Tayl0r Swift wrote:i read beeboy's iso to decide whether it was a worthwhile wagon, but this is the only post with AI content (except the post advocating spares, which is scummy and was done twice in two different ways: spare at least one, and the spare route is good), and the AI content here is meh. dunno if its just because of catchup or what. beeboy needs more content but im not ready to lunch there yet.

more putting the hurt on beeboy

In post 1002, Tayl0r Swift wrote:why is it that everyone featured in the flavor looks super scummy in the flavor? like how is beeboy not evil in this flavor? and how was i not evil in the last one?

In post 1024, Tayl0r Swift wrote:i think the word for my catboi read is gut.

THESE BLEED TOWN TO ME AND I DON'T KNOW HOW TO EXPLAIN WHY

I guarantee 1002 was part of what set off my sudden townlocking of tayl0r. There's not even a good reason that I can think of to explain why only town!tayl0r makes that post but I adamantly believe it

In post 1148, Tayl0r Swift wrote:actually im not quite sure why im so high up, but im not gonna question it too too much. i prolly just pocketed you by flopping your ears.

i love this phrase

ok scum is probably whoever early on was ignoring Elements but I'm sure some of these last pages are discussing D1 and figuring that out already

There hasn't been anything to disprove redtea-Sujimiji yet has there? Actually i can just stop being lazy and look myself

Spoiler: redtea notes

Not much for the first 10 posts but then we get to a wall. redtea defends Elements in it and calls a take of Hectic's bad.

Has a post questioning catboi on why he thinks Hectic is legitimately evaluating people

In post 383, redtea wrote:
In post 303, Chara wrote:258 sucks, but that's old news now i guess. AI non-mech talk has been happening for a whie since before that post.

redtea: re: 266, what sort of act do you think Puppy is playing right now? also, what's your read on Elements?
I wanna see Puppy talk some more first.
Elements I'll have to get back to you on. I've amassed a bunch of shit to post and he slipped my mind considering he's.. not here.......
.-.

Stays null on Elements

a lot of redtea's posts are like, calling Pooky crazy. Which I mean, granted

In post 427, redtea wrote:lol @ elements walkin in like he never left
In post 410, Elements wrote:
In post 297, Chara wrote:my first thought upon reading this post was "alright, now to try and emulate my town self that Prism is recognizing so i can keep getting townread."
Undertale S ruined me.
Rlly Hectic?
This is so slimy. It's like a hagfish after tying itself in a knot.
It's autological and I don't like it.
Okay, I wasn't going to give my 2 cents on this but looks like I will
The first line: easily faked.
The second line: very natural addition.
Conclusion: NAI.

Keeps Elements in null -- I don't see scum trying to fake a townread on Elements since he hasn't given much material yet.

Also that Elements post looks decent for Hectic

In post 429, redtea wrote:actually
wanna share what you have against 419 taylor

Starting to feel like redtea wanted Tayl0r or Hectic -- but not Elements

In post 595, redtea wrote:
@MorningTweet
#563 I- I don't know if having 'unique reads' in the block is. Is a reason to tr me?
Cause like, I suppose if you ally with that many people, and you find them all explicitly town- like, one should know there's probably maf among them, so in that way, I could see having 'unique reads' translating to 'having people they're comfortable dealing with over a bunch of hard town-reads/leans which may or may not be influenced by the fact they play better'. But I don't know if that's what you were feeling there? Not to mention I would absolutely have both of my hard trs in there.
Maybe it's just that I personally get suspicious when there's 'one of everything' within a group, so it's not something I'd gut-town over. Idk.
Whatever, I'm supposed to be trusting you for now, anyway.

Also, does Elements's linked posts not show a very deliberate progression from Puppy?
verifying genocide is better -> confirms it is better -> mentions scenarios where 1-3 could be better (as did catboi) but continues with geno -> "wants sparing to work", but concedes that sparing for the
first two days
wouldn't work out (which leaves open to possibility for 1-3) -> humours hectic/pooky -> advocates 4-spare.
In other words G->G->G/N->N->N/P->P. Like that's a
perfect
progression. [G=genocide, N=neutral, P=pacifism]

In post 549, Tayl0r Swift wrote:my lame take is that lavender is scummy for lurking. my spicy take is that puppy might be a good candidate to fight.
I can't say I like the fact that you and Elements are the only ones other than me getting tricksy vibes from the puppy but. What are your reasons?

lol @puppy no questions just wanted you to make the exact posts you ended up doing

This is a pretty lengthy elaboration defending one of Elements' points i wasn't getting. I wonder if it's too over the top and scum would be aware of that, however, it wasn't clear that Elements was going to get ejected at this point. He had only 2 votes, tied for biggest wagon. If redtea is his scumpartner wanting to defend him and give him as much of the benefit of the doubt as possible, this would probably be how you do it I suppose. Mostly nullreads but enough to not prefer Elements

Redtea wasn't around for the day's conclusion so it actually stops here, oh

idk if I really saw anything suggesting redtea can't be partnered with Elements. Nothing too crazy town in the ISO. I guess i could see switching to a few other choices if i have to but i'm fine sitting here for now

Morning Tweet · Post Post #1237 (isolation #88) » Sat Sep 19, 2020 8:19 pm

In post 1225, CantHateAPuppy wrote:Mostly just a prod dodge cause I'm going to be busy all day

Still think we should spare. I think the math is actually slightly better because we can save two town and get a cop check, instead of only 2 cop checks at the end. Can write up a case on this later if anyone wants or not if everyone's sick of it

No strong opinions on the other issues. Redtea / suji is a hard lurker slot that has given me 0 to work with, tanner I still have as lean town from yesterday, his prickly paranoid conspiracy today fits what I'd expect from him although I really don't know much else about him

Shouldn't we just start sparing after Chara is dead if that is the case? Is there any reason to do it now rather than later?

Morning Tweet · Post Post #1287 (isolation #89) » Mon Sep 21, 2020 3:04 pm

cute animal alliance!!!!! !

Morning Tweet · Post Post #1288 (isolation #90) » Mon Sep 21, 2020 3:05 pm

i admire Prism's determination

Morning Tweet · Post Post #1355 (isolation #91) » Tue Sep 22, 2020 2:00 pm

Is Sujimiji dead yet? No? oh

Morning Tweet · Post Post #1391 (isolation #92) » Tue Sep 22, 2020 9:07 pm

In post 1386, Tanner wrote:
In post 1374, PookyTheMagicalBear wrote:If it really is just Suji and we're losing sleep over nothing I guess Isis is laughing at us?
i am very tempted to just go down this path.

i dove headfirst down this path at day start

The main person I'm interested in hearing from is Sujimichi. But it doesn't seem that they've had much of anything to say, isn't that right?

In post 1364, Prism wrote:I think the worst part is that me going to bat this hard for the Sujimichi slot means we might just have to flip it regardless.

I feel really comfortable with Hectic atm, and have just kind of slotted Puppy as town for the Elements interactions. It didn't read SvS to me.

765, giving the slot a chance w/ a new player, is the only problem, and they joined me on Hectic. This is really consistent with 692, and they jump back to beeboy eventually.

I feel bad I haven't been considering arguments against fighting Sujimichi as much as I probably should have. However I do notice you're usuallly coming to conclusions I generally agreed with back when I was reading actively, which again makes me feel pretty comfortable knocking out Suji

You are doing a great job analyzing the thread though Prism right or wrong, you have quite a lot of conviction lol

Morning Tweet · Post Post #1399 (isolation #93) » Tue Sep 22, 2020 9:37 pm

Who's you guys' overall best guess at Suji's partner? personally I anticipate it being the person we least expect and would've never gotten due to some kind of great interaction with Elements or what not. Just my guess though

That's probably another reason I'm not stressing over it too hard. I want to say tayl0r is town and I don't really have a reason but I'd like it to be more mindblowing than Lavender being scum as well

but it could just be lavender though ya

Morning Tweet · Post Post #1401 (isolation #94) » Tue Sep 22, 2020 9:42 pm

Morning Tweet · Post Post #1404 (isolation #95) » Tue Sep 22, 2020 9:46 pm

If we lose it's definitely not gonna be on you Prism

Morning Tweet · Post Post #1407 (isolation #96) » Tue Sep 22, 2020 9:48 pm

Prism wrote:I mean if we lost after I crusade to flip the vote off of Suji that would 100% be on me lmao

I am lliterally the only person here actively trying to avoid scum autoloss w/ Suji slot. Pooky could be letting me handle his work for him but that's it. Something is wrong with this picture to me

It's the thought that counts!

Morning Tweet · Post Post #1410 (isolation #97) » Tue Sep 22, 2020 9:53 pm

PookyTheMagicalBear wrote:like if Suji is scum, he has a scum partner, and that scum partner seems like ok with them just losing the game on a Suji-flip ? Like that's kind of wierd.

Unless they r purposefully not resisting in order to make us think this and wifom.

But I mean like who would play like that? Or maybe they just feel discouraged.

Fair enough, I am not really considering partners

From off the top of my head, tayl0r and Lavender probably would feel unable to sway it, Puppy would be doing some last ditch spare attempt thing, and you would be pointing out the very thing you're pretending to be paranoid of

Am I missing any reasonable sounding partners?

Morning Tweet · Post Post #1451 (isolation #98) » Wed Sep 23, 2020 2:34 pm

In post 1446, CantHateAPuppy wrote:
In post 1437, Tayl0r Swift wrote:puppy is coasting and not engaged. whens the last time you saw a post from puppy that wasnt fluff?
who are you

lol (>∀<)

Morning Tweet · Post Post #1453 (isolation #99) » Wed Sep 23, 2020 5:49 pm

The jig is up Krazy. We already know you're Chara.

Morning Tweet · Thu Sep 24, 2020 8:47 am

you should be more excited, we're winning the game in only 2 Days!

Morning Tweet · Thu Sep 24, 2020 4:55 pm

In post 1514, Tayl0r Swift wrote:dont trust people who only come out at night

In post 1515, Tayl0r Swift wrote:also dont trust people who live in caves

hmph (¬ω¬)

Morning Tweet · Thu Sep 24, 2020 5:08 pm

In post 1521, Lavender wrote:Wait Morning Tweet's avatar isn't a puppy? o.O

baby flying fox!

Morning Tweet · Thu Sep 24, 2020 5:30 pm

Krazy wrote:batwoman what are your reads right now?

Let me find the last time I posted reads and they'll be the same probably

Spoiler: start of day

Hm maybe not exactly.

Prism still good on.

Pooky still good on, maybe there's some chance he's tricking me and that why he's hesistant to vote you.

I might bend to the will of the crowd and move tayl0r down. I had crazy, somewhat conspiracy level reasons to trust her though.

Puppy I think has been a massive subject of debate recently and I haven't really been following it but I think he's probably town for the hard bus

Chara, Hectic, and Tanner all do townie things that makes me like them. Hectic in particular is probably town. Chara good chance but I had like some slight paranoia from what I can recall

There's no real great reason to think Lavender is town.

Redtea/Sujimichi are probably just scum

Spoiler: right now

I swear I'll make a serious effort to read if Sujimichi is not scum. The Chara flip will probably give me a ton of motivation. Right now it's like, even if we get it wrong, we still kill scum.

And from where I stand atm, I wouldn't let the Redtea slot even approach endgame. So may as well knock that out real quick

Morning Tweet · Thu Sep 24, 2020 5:48 pm

didn't he adamantly advocate for eliminating Elements earlier and stronger than everyone else?

I checked and, somewhat yes. He sort of switcherooed onto Hectic, not sure what I make of that. Prism said he "Never really got the Element votes" in 750 and puppy then swapped to Hectic in 765. Wagons were about even.

In post 913, CantHateAPuppy wrote:guess i can get behind this

HURT: beeboy

@chara: point taken! but im not gonna sit here agonizing about it, gonna get some nice flips no matter what do so im gonna be positive about it

Would kind of expect scum!Puppy to use stronger wording than "Guess I can get behind this" when rejoining the wagon he advocated so strongly for earlier

The towncred!!! he's squandering the towncred!!!!!

Morning Tweet · Thu Sep 24, 2020 5:58 pm

Hmmm.... well I decently townread 50% of the game. Out of the rest, your slot has no good interactions with Elements.

In fact, if you ctrl-F elements in redtea's ISO, their only mentions of Elements are two separate defenses of him. 266 and 595. Neither are huge defenses, just kind of "give him the benefit of the doubt" kinda things.

Morning Tweet · Thu Sep 24, 2020 6:24 pm

In post 1531, Tayl0r Swift wrote:i think we should give elements the benefit of the doubt here.

In post 1532, Krazy wrote:agreed

huh

Morning Tweet · Thu Sep 24, 2020 6:48 pm

ok but im keeping an eye on u guys

Morning Tweet · Thu Sep 24, 2020 7:33 pm

In post 1538, PookyTheMagicalBear wrote:I agree with everything here except here's the thing:

If Krazy isn't scum - our odds of winning decrease with a mis-elim today right?

Right now we hit 2/10 scum we will win - if it goes to 1/8 our odds tomorrow get worse.

I agree me and Prism might be paranoid/overthinking it but our best chance of winning outright is to nail a bad guy today so I'm having trouble getting to where Hectic is - which is this massive certainty that Krazy flips scum here.

I hope we're wrong and Krazy just flips scum here but my paranoia is creeping in hard right now.

Well yes, our odds of immediately winning go down. Let's assume Not Chara slips thru the cracks and we miselim today

8 town v 2 mafia
miselim, NC suicide, N2 NK ->
6 town v 1 mafia
miselim, N3 NK ->
4 town v 1 mafia
miselim, route bonus of confirming two town ->
2 confirmed town w/ 1 unconfirmed town v. 1 mafia

We can miss today, get a mafia literally confirmed to us, miss D3, miss D4, and then we get a 1v1 for the game on D5. So many chances, we get to kill more 4 people one of which is a 1v1 and we know who Chara is after today

Morning Tweet · Thu Sep 24, 2020 8:06 pm

Like leaning me for being scum? Do I get to be Not Chara or is that reserved for daddy

Morning Tweet · Thu Sep 24, 2020 8:08 pm

Don't worry I wasn't even sure who he was referring to

Morning Tweet · Thu Sep 24, 2020 8:12 pm

In post 1551, Krazy wrote:I don't have a strong enough conception of the setup to differentiate between different types of scum at this point

basically Not Chara really wants to get spared and really doesn't want to get fought. Moreso than the other regular mafia

Morning Tweet · Thu Sep 24, 2020 8:13 pm

That being said I've been in this game the whole way through and I feel that the Not Chara probably doesn't have very distinguishable characteristics especially at this point.

Sparing was never really on the table and mafia in general really have to keep each other alive regardless of Not Chara status

Morning Tweet · Thu Sep 24, 2020 8:15 pm

Oh I'm forgetting though. Not Chara is going to suicide. So I guess they need to be more careful with their reads to not expose their partner.

Morning Tweet · Thu Sep 24, 2020 10:46 pm

In post 1558, Hectic wrote:Morning, help, they're forcing me to do stuff when the game will probably be over in a couple of days anyway.

Please just let us kill Sujimichi!! I promise I will go over all the paranoia analysis on D3 if necessary, starting with the player who got NKed's posts

ill carry your torch or whatever

I feel pretty decent about that not happening but if it does, i got u

i will also continue to carry on this face for catboi

(^人^)

Morning Tweet · Thu Sep 24, 2020 10:48 pm

In post 1547, Krazy wrote:leaning daddy and batgirl at the moment but still sorting some slots

The daddy thing got me distracted earlier (very clever of you), but now im starting to realize you're implicating me as the mafia. was it something from our interactions?

Morning Tweet · Fri Sep 25, 2020 8:43 am

Well redtea's reaction to Elements-beeboy gettin killed was more like, ghosting out than anything.

Morning Tweet · Fri Sep 25, 2020 9:20 am

In post 1581, Prism wrote:The only game they flipped scum was in 2019, and as they note in SIN they really didn't do too hot. They basically fencesat that whole game minus a readlist with...one real read The amount of confidence they would have had this game as scum would be very impressive, given their experience with catboi playing extremely well in SIN. Buddying is plausible, but subsequently really going after catboi for leaving me out of his TRs would be very bold.

holy shit that iso tho

Can you be sure that redtea would play that low volume again? You could argue this is a less extreme version of that game. Eh, it is pretty different though ig yeah

siiiiighhhhh maybe we can chuck Tayl0r for funsies. I'll think abt it more later today

Morning Tweet · Fri Sep 25, 2020 10:50 am

In post 1637, CantHateAPuppy wrote:Oh oh I bet nobody can guess what animal I'm thinking of

Morning Tweet · Fri Sep 25, 2020 11:40 am

i wish sparing was a thing this game. I'd bet the game on me being town too

(and other ppl)

Morning Tweet · Fri Sep 25, 2020 11:54 am

In post 1649, Tanner wrote:
In post 938, catboi wrote:Σ(-᷅_-᷄๑) trying to figure out who would actually make sense as being teamed with the elements slot and it's, like...lavender, taylor, redtea, or
I guess
Prism and that's it. Hrm.
this was killed.

i've been thinking about this post as a "maybe i *am* overthinking it too much?"

Pretty sure we kill all those slots besides Prism and win.

Unless we miss -> one of them suicides as Not Chara -> last scum alive is the deepwolf not inside of there

Then we'd have to tryhard

Morning Tweet · Fri Sep 25, 2020 4:34 pm

Prism I will make u a deal -- if we flip Krazy and it's a miselim, and then Tayl0r or Hectic suicides, I will wagon whichever one survives

I also might decide to go after Tayl0r regardless D3 anyway

Morning Tweet · Fri Sep 25, 2020 4:39 pm

In post 1762, Prism wrote:Can I ask you why you think it's Krazy over Tayl0r, first?

In post 1529, Krazy wrote:What's the source of your confidence in my slot again?

In post 1530, Morning Tweet wrote:Hmmm.... well I decently townread 50% of the game. Out of the rest, your slot has no good interactions with Elements.

In fact, if you ctrl-F elements in redtea's ISO, their only mentions of Elements are two separate defenses of him. 266 and 595. Neither are huge defenses, just kind of "give him the benefit of the doubt" kinda things.

I see absolutely no reason it isn't Krazy and I had like, tinfoil reads on Tayl0r

I think the meta you brought up is a fair point but probably not enough to make me change. Somebody pointed out it is 2 years old

Morning Tweet · Fri Sep 25, 2020 4:43 pm

Why is Hectic more likely to be scum than Krazy

Morning Tweet · Fri Sep 25, 2020 5:06 pm

Quick, someone vote me. Krazy? You know you want to

Morning Tweet · Fri Sep 25, 2020 6:18 pm

If redtea is Not Chara, does it really matter if catboi townread them? I'd think they really need to keep whoever the other mafia is alive, and if it's tayl0r/puppy/lavender, gotta shoot em dead. Especially if it's tayl0r

if I were scum, I'd say the NK was probably between catboi/Prism. I'd just shoot whichever one was the biggest threat to the non-chara's safety

I know it's probably getting old listening to me ignore everyone's reasons for not wanting redtea but yeah i dont have a lot of time rn to do big review (-ω-；)

Morning Tweet · Fri Sep 25, 2020 6:31 pm

i will be vv happy for u if that is the exact solve

I like meta but like half the time i use it, it fucks me. It definitely can work (see: Hectic's impenetrable meta tell on me), but it's just really finicky and I'm not super good at it

I would say tayl0r is, idk, trying in that game? I agree it's very different. But does "Tayl0r tries hard as town in this particular game" translate into "Tayl0r wouldn't try as scum"? Is it possible that some other circumstance related to this game is influencing it?

Morning Tweet · Fri Sep 25, 2020 6:40 pm

Hmmmm maybe. Or maybe she just doesn't care as much abt this game. (´･ω･`)

That's why meta is annoying on a low sample size

If there is a good reason to believe Krazy would be the non-Chara member of his team, I could do tayl0r first I suppose since that would suggest she is the one about to escape, though

Morning Tweet · Fri Sep 25, 2020 7:08 pm

I don't really think they can afford to worry about the short-term just surviving this one day, they kinda needs that specific non-chara player to survive like 4-5 eliminations.

I guess you're right that they might focus on saving Not Chara if they're in a bad spot but I would be thinking about the nonChara

Morning Tweet · Fri Sep 25, 2020 9:34 pm

It doesn't count in that format but i appreciate the gesture nonetheless!

i finally finished my paper. But its 4 am. So that's awkward. Maybe the vote will give me motivation tomorrow. somehow i just don't think itll be the same as Prism grilling Hectic though

Morning Tweet · Sat Sep 26, 2020 8:03 am

In post 1875, CantHateAPuppy wrote:Feel like I haven't talked with morning tweet enough

Was rereading early game and realized we'd played a game together before though tbh off hand I don't remember which one (:shame:)

We've played multiple games (>ω<)

Revelations is the one you're thinking of though. I didn't like that one, which is a first for me in over like 20 games

what do u wanna talk about?

In post 1873, CantHateAPuppy wrote:This game is weird because there's no wagon development. Like we sat on one fight yesterday and are sitting on one fight today

Not sure what that implies but I'm going to think about it

Feels like scum doesn't care to raise their voices terribly much and are just letting town call the shots on consensus-ish scumread slots, while some other town stress over it maybe being wrong

I think scum is probably in Krazy, the quiet ppl, and potentially people talking abt other options -- even if Krazy is town. If I'm scum and Krazy is town, I'd probably start paranoia on some other suspects in advance, after all I gotta get 4-5 miseliminations and pushing Krazy while not helping out much isn't really helping me achieve that.

Morning Tweet · Sat Sep 26, 2020 9:40 am

God I wish I was Chara. Preferably in a version of this setup where spares are possible. I'd try so hard

I am a fair pick for Chara if you ignore that Hectic confirm town'd me though

Morning Tweet · Sat Sep 26, 2020 9:48 am

Well okay -- I thought I was doing okay at giving opinions on other slots. Not as much as I could, cause the odds of this game ending quick without my intervention are really high and I'm somewhat of a busy bat recently

If I were Chara I'd probably work double time in order to somehow conceivably make my partner seem like town. Not really sure how I'd go about that, it'd probably depend on the player. One prerequisite would be that I need to be very active, because it'd be weird if I singled out one person.

See there's the lame way to play Chara rn where you just peace out and stop talking, then there's the risk-taking way where you try to help your partner by going tryhard and somehow spewing them as town. Okay, when i put it like that though maybe I wouldn't do that and I'd just be too scared to do so and I'd just eat the suicide. After all there's probably no way I could somehow "townspew" a partner through 4-5 miselims post-mortem.

Why am I speculating about myself being Chara again?

Oh yeah. You're scumreading me. And I'm on ur wagon just chilling out cause I don't need towncred since I would suicide. EHhhhhhhhmmmmmmmmmmmm I guess I can buy you thinking that as town. But it's not me and honestly the only scum on ur wagon I'd entertain is Tayl0r

Morning Tweet · Sat Sep 26, 2020 10:59 am

In post 1891, Krazy wrote:
In post 1534, Morning Tweet wrote:
In post 1531, Tayl0r Swift wrote:i think we should give elements the benefit of the doubt here.
In post 1532, Krazy wrote:agreed
huh
Based on tweet kinda willfully not getting the joke here I guess I could see something like a tweet/tayl0r team. I think tweet would be more likely to latch on to this post if she'd been lowkey ignoring what tal0r was doing on previous page which would match an s/s dynamic. Or tayl0r is town and she was just trying to shade both of us.

also I don't get why she thinks she's evaluating the game when all I see from the last half if her iso is that she wants to only talk about me, I don't think any other slot has done this little reevaluation of the gamestate. If she thinks she is actively commenting on more of the game than she is she could have cogdis due to deleting posts because she was happy with gamestate

hey!!!! i just didn't get the joke!!!!!

I was talking about scumreading you in that post, it wasn't really related to Elements, so i got confused about if she meant you. And then you agreed just making me more confused lol. I get that I mentioned redtea giving Elements the benefit of the doubt in the previous post but I was serious abt that being scummy

Krazy, aren't you curious why no one in the thread thinks it's me? I already got solved a while ago. Me not getting a joke by tayl0r isn't going to overturn that, I don't think (´･ω･`)

Also with regards to that -- I'm not actively commenting on the game much. But I did give my 2 cents on every slot and why I don't really care to do anything other than FIGHT u atm. It was just a bit ago!

Morning Tweet · Sat Sep 26, 2020 11:01 am

I am giving some thought to eliminating tayl0r first just for the possibility she's Chara and I would be upset if tayl0r!Chara escapes

but i'd only do that if I had reason to think redtea/Suji/Krazy is the non-Chara. Cause I'd be even more upset if I let them get away!

Morning Tweet · Sat Sep 26, 2020 11:58 am

(´-ω-`)

Morning Tweet · Sat Sep 26, 2020 12:03 pm

i only eat fruits. technically pollen sometimes too but not the flower itself

Morning Tweet · Sat Sep 26, 2020 12:21 pm

ok I think Puppy is safe

Morning Tweet · Sat Sep 26, 2020 12:31 pm

i dont eat buttercups!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

why would Chara either, actually??????????

if I'm Chara, what was the point of bussing Elements? Shouldn't elements bus me?

I guess the slot was super dead towards end of d1, but still, my life wouldn't be very important I may as well not spend it helping screw my buddy over (especially early-mid d1).

Also tiny self meta thing, but I'd never be like "Yeah this slot is flipping scum" confident on a bus or really any exile I don't think. If scum!me were thinking about how to emulate town!me, confidence is almost never in my playstyle

Morning Tweet · Sat Sep 26, 2020 12:40 pm

Wait aren't I scum with tayl0r? So I voted for both my partners as my main votes? I'm trolling if I'm Chara rn LOL

Morning Tweet · Sat Sep 26, 2020 12:43 pm

Fair enough i am not one to really play with a precise agenda as scum. I can see me making massive blunders left n right sure. I didn't cause im not scum, but I am capable of it

Morning Tweet · Sat Sep 26, 2020 12:45 pm

Krazy, if I'm not scum with Hectic, and Hectic is town as you say, how do you explain this?

In post 556, Hectic wrote:
-that i'm confident she's town. She's hard towntelling this game and I'd bet the game on her being town
(i have a towntell on her which has so far been very accurate - i'm not going to reveal what it is because it is too valuable)

HEAL: Morning Tweet

I have not once managed to avoid doing whatever it is Hectic notices I do as town. And he won't tell me what it is either :C

Morning Tweet · Sat Sep 26, 2020 12:47 pm

In post 1910, CantHateAPuppy wrote:
In post 1907, Morning Tweet wrote:Wait aren't I scum with tayl0r? So I voted for both my partners as my main votes? I'm trolling if I'm Chara rn LOL
tbh if u're not trolling me rn what are u even doing w/ ur life

I guess I'm entertaining the idea that I'm scum this game..... hmm you make a good point. Maybe it's to figure out if Krazy is reading me in good faith? Maybe it's for fun. The used tissue and cheese diet was really funny to me lol

Morning Tweet · Sat Sep 26, 2020 2:01 pm

In post 1913, Krazy wrote:who's your scumbuddy then? :3

Can it really be anyone other than Hectic? If I'm scum he wouldn't be 100% sure I'm town. At worst, I might half-towntell. but this is a full one

If we're going to ignore Hectic's read on me, hmmmmmmmm

Not Hectic cause ignoring him, not Prism cause obvtown, not tayl0r -- im too willing to kill her, not Krazy (・ω・),

What's the pool.. Pooky/Puppy/Chara/Tanner/Lavender now?

It could be Lavender, there's nothing for me to defend about her but I have never really bothered pushing her -- I like the other options more.

Tanner I made some big posts about being town early game but haven't talked abt him recently much. I was considering him for scum but from his play today I took him off the table.

Puppy I am nearly locktowning. Mayyyyybe the bus on Element went awry and I'm trying to salvage it by pushing Puppy as conftown? That's WIFOM-y though, would I make my partner a really high townread? And is Puppy really viable scum?

Pooky I considered earlygame but as it went on I decided against him being scum. I even locktowned him end of D1. Same as Puppy then

Chara I really like just probably a tad less than others, maybe. I like its posting recently.

So like, I think the sweetspot for my partner might be around the Chara/Tanner area. After I suicide, I recommend looking within those two.

Of course, Lavender can be paired with anyone including me with ease. And if I feel like locktowning my partner and you think there was a hard bus on Elements, then Puppy/Pooky I guess

Morning Tweet · Sat Sep 26, 2020 2:02 pm

There, if I'm Not Chara and i wasn't throwing before, I definitely am now lol

Morning Tweet · Sat Sep 26, 2020 2:43 pm

In post 1919, CantHateAPuppy wrote:
In post 1916, Morning Tweet wrote:There, if I'm Not Chara and i wasn't throwing before, I definitely am now lol
hm. is MT the kind of player who would just announce her whole scum plan and expect to get away with it via wifom?

if calling me locktown is a way to pocket me out of this suspicion it might work

As much as I would love to say yes, no I am not. Scum makes me insanely stressed out -- it grinds my posting rate down to a halt and I carefully read everything I post and think heavily about how it is interpreted

i wrote that speculation post in a few minutes and I didn't even reread it

However you could make the argument that I stopped caring because I know I'm about to suicide. However HOWEVER, I would feel really bad if my scumpartner gets screwed by that speculation post (even if it's by accident). I really wouldn't want to hurt their chances (again even if its by accident)

But i don't have a partner so I can't do that (>ω<)

Morning Tweet · Sat Sep 26, 2020 2:53 pm

PookyTheMagicalBear wrote:MT how confident are you that Krazy flips scum here?

Like using how sure you were about elements as a baseline - are we talking like 50% of that level or 70%?

Beeboy I felt uncharacteristically good about. This is probably like.......... 50% of that.

2/9 of you are scum, but I put like 3-4 off the table completely, if I can be confident of those, then I'm at around 2/6 of you. Though even with the people I'm not lock-towning I like significantly more than Krazy's slot. there are a few rogue elements left over though, if i could be sure that Lavender/tayl0r are good that would make me way more confident

It's still possible Krazy is town and we're instead dealing with a rogue element + a deepwolf, and im entertaining that a bit.

I will sheep Prism if their tayl0r wagon gets traction but otherwise im stayin put.

Morning Tweet · Sat Sep 26, 2020 2:59 pm

I can't very well vote for my partner, can I?

No I wouldn't join a tanner wagon I'd just circle back to u

Morning Tweet · Sat Sep 26, 2020 3:28 pm

In post 1931, Krazy wrote:This exchange kinda makes me want Tweet like, a lot more lol

Prism there's no way I'm selling you on Tweet today?

really now? (¬ω¬)

Do you have an explanation for Hectic locktowning me yet?

Morning Tweet · Sat Sep 26, 2020 3:42 pm

In post 1943, Krazy wrote:
In post 1941, Morning Tweet wrote:really now? (¬ω¬)

Do you have an explanation for Hectic locktowning me yet?
these two things go hand in hand. Your use of Hectic's read to shield yourself seems kinda scummy tbh

i feel like you're starting with the conclusion of me being scum more than you're trying to read me in good faith.

Hectic has never falsely townread me -- wouldn't you say that's a valid defense?

Morning Tweet · Sat Sep 26, 2020 4:21 pm

In post 1951, Prism wrote:Morning, I get that regardless of what Hectic is this read is going to be trustable FYPOV, but I'm with Krazy here in that I refuse to trust reads that I can't see the reasoning for myself. Hectic refuses to out it so to me it might as well be worthless even if he flips.

This is secondary, and I haven't tried to pick a fight over it, but refusing to out it is imo horrible for both of you as players and for the health of the games you play, period.

Fair enough about not trusting others' reads if they can't explain them outright. It is beyond obvious to me that I can't be scum at this point but I should keep in mind it isn't to others

I am aware of the differences between my town and scum game -- it's black and white to me and if you play against me long enough I can only imagine it would start to become pretty noticeable. It's really different because I have a strong dislike for playing scum. That kind of thing is difficult to hide!

The specific thing he picks up on, I do not know. It doesn't exactly matter when I can't emulate my town self well at all as scum anyway. I feel a bit bad I'm not able to be a harder solve than that but ya

Morning Tweet · Sat Sep 26, 2020 4:49 pm

In post 1956, Prism wrote:Morning, it looks like you never really explained why you gained more confidence in the Elements vote as time went on. Can you discuss your progression on that slot a bit more?

230 is by far your best statement of a case on Elements. 279 you dial it back a bit and explain why. In 415 they take your second lowest slot, but the only statement in your notes seems to have them as +town. 563 you seem to be coming around to him as more null/town. You flip your vote to Tayl0r from Elements somewhere in the 400s, but never really explained it. You pull back after their readslist. In 916 Elements/beeboy are back on the bottom with no explanation, and you vote beeboy to make it X-2. 1023 agrees with beeboy on Tayl0r, but by 1037 you're back to voting beeboy and having them at the bottom of your list.

Can you explain more around your two votes+the unvote between of beeboy, why you felt better and better about fighting that slot over time, and what made them perennially at the bottom of the list for you?

As a sidenote, I'm also curious because you made a point for redtea town that is a big part of why I townread the slot in 563. What do you think of it now?

I recall reading stuff of tayl0rs that made me spontaneously throw her into my spare pile. Additionally I came around to Pooky somewhere along the line. So that left, what was it.. Lavender/beeboy/maybe Puppy in the pile?

And then I looked at that and thought "Well Puppy is town if beeboy is scum". I liked Puppy more than Elements/beeboy, so just like that, I was pretty much locked in if I wasn't going to switch to lavender. I decided against switching to Lavender cause that'd be boring and also somebody mentioned a reason she could be town for meta.

Beeboy's entrance didn't really do anything for me. I actually played a game (Treestump Express) where he got consensus townlocked after replacing into a hard-null slot in Xylo. Wasn't really feeling that this time (and I was reinforced by Chara/Hectic not feeling it either).

Really I was at the point where no one but Beeboy was my favourite scum, barring Lavender maybe. Very exciting, because usually I townread the entire game and get frustrated!

Ehm, let me address your points more specifically though. I voted Elements initially because of an interaction with Puppy I didn't like. I unvoted because of a certain post I thought "Eh maybe scum doesn't say that", allow me to find it

In post 529, Elements wrote:wow, I feel like my reads are completely the opposite to everyone elses

Yeah this one gave me pause I believe. I tend to associate scum with going with the flow, not being against it I guess? I do not think at any point was I elevating Element much on his reads. That saved him from my 417 vote but didn't do much else for him. He was hard stuck in null, I just found some of his stuff sort of surprising for scum I suppose. His replace-out certainly didn't help

So tldr I think the turning point where I went from "Where's the towny?" to "Yeah this is scum" is when I flipped on tayl0r to having her town yesterday. I probably just got generally more confident cause I had finally sat down and reaffirmed I believed in everything I had. That'd be in 1037. Felt nice

--

Mmmmm I did like that post by redtea. Lemme pull it up

In post 524, redtea wrote:
In post 462, catboi wrote:Okay I'm proposing an alliance between me, Tanner, Morning Tweet, and redtea. Just need to find one more person there I'm comfy with.
okay catboi how did I get in here and not Prism. That isn't a thing that happens.
For real though, did you like, forget them?

I'll go ahead and make it clear here that my reads of that list is [town, neutral, town-lean]. Not trying to kick Tanner out or anything; for all Intents and Purposes I may as well consider him an ally, as I wouldn't fight him today and he doesn't seem to have the formidable-scary-maf reputation Chara does.

It's a good post. I like how they had reads of their own on everybody in our little town block thingy. And they are all confused why catboi would put them in the townblock over Prism.

Yeah I like this vibes this post gives off. Are they enough though?

Morning Tweet · Sat Sep 26, 2020 4:53 pm

In post 1958, Prism wrote:I'm not too inclined to go read a game from scratch but your [Morning's] reads/interactions this game seem to have significantly more depth to them here than in the first scumgame of yours I found, Mini Normal 2132. Simultaneously it seems like Hectic wrongly townread you all game so I really can't say this sparks a new personal confidence in him.

That was a fun one! Kidding, sort of. I hated playing it the whole way through up until the end. What a stressful game that was.

To be fair he had no idea what my scum game was like at the time. That was my first scum game since 2016 after all. I have to actually play a scum game first before there can be differences

Morning Tweet · Sat Sep 26, 2020 5:04 pm

Thank u tayl0r

Morning Tweet · Sat Sep 26, 2020 5:05 pm

i wrote it quickly and my emoji browser tab wasn't open (;﹏;)

Morning Tweet · Sat Sep 26, 2020 5:10 pm

Is scum more likely to trust that Hectic is reading me genuinely, or would they instead try to discredit it? Well I know what my snap reaction is but I'll think on it more carefully

Pedit: Wait your bet is on Hectic over tayl0r? Hmmm I didn't realize that given the vote. I'll def reread him and your points on him

Morning Tweet · Sat Sep 26, 2020 5:30 pm

In post 1968, Prism wrote:I am a bit skeptical of MT's progression on Ele and redtea, but I'm still inclined to slot them as town. They don't really get anything from buddying me/catboi early, and coming to Tayl0r's defense seems really strange from scum-MT here unless the team is exactly those two. I also agree with catboi that their analysis in their earlygame readwall was solid, and I do think MT's reaction about my criticism of Hectic was solid. Maybe MT is capitalizing on a wrong Hectic read here but ? iuno

I kind of doubt I'd do that because I'd be aware it looks like I'm trying to use it as a shield. But since I'm town I'm just telling it like it is regardless of how it looks.

But maybe if I get into a scumgame, I'd evolve past that and try to emulate what I'd do as --- WHY do I keep making these pointless WIFOMy self meta posts? I'm going to try and cut that out now

PookyTheMagicalBear wrote:
In post 1924, Prism wrote:Pooky, I'm curious as to some stances from you. You've been cautious about the Krazy wagon and seem to be conflicted-heart says yes, mind says no, here are some bad things about Taylor. Bits and pieces of your other reads might be found elsewhere but a collection/overview of where you're at with the game overall.

You haven't voted, so I'm wondering if that is all trying to figure out Krazy v. Taylor, or if there's some other reason you're waiting/other party you're looking at.
I liked redtea at beginning of the day - I've been susp of his slot from D1 - however the lack of resistance to the wagon felt off to me.

After I re-read catboi's ISO I think the NK would fit more with redtea being town than scum and taylor being scum so now I'm leaning the other way. I don't really see why redtea-scum shoots catboi when catboi is one of the few people who are town-reading him and then are more lock-town players in the game who pushed elements harder.

I have a massive amount of respect for MT/Hectic and their insistence that redtea is the clear and obv choice is making my conviction waver about what I think about redtea being scum.

Uhh if you're seeing things that make you doubt redtea!scum, don't let me override that. I've been not super into the game, certainly not as much as I'd like to be.

Agree with Hectic having generally great reads though. Me though? No mate!

Morning Tweet · Sat Sep 26, 2020 5:42 pm

PookyTheMagicalBear wrote:i mean you were super confident about ele flipping scum and were spot on the money about that so I kinda assign you a lot of cred

Eh. Sometimes townreading a bunch of people and voting whoever is left works. Sometimes it doesn't. I think it's putting the ball more in scum's court than in my own, because if scum plays really good I'm just gonna townread them falsely

(((Okay I guess that's kind of the point of the game but still)))

What I'm saying is I get lucky at times. It's not like I could exactly explain why I thought that was going to be a scumflip. I guess beeboy felt different -- but then again, he was dealing with stuff at the time. And Elements didn't do him many favours.

I would credit that one much more to, say, Puppy, who had it right on Elements nice and early. I also reviewed a bit and saw Hectic had some nice points (Something like Elements altering his playstyle to overcompensate for how he played in his last game or something)

Morning Tweet · Sat Sep 26, 2020 5:48 pm

In post 1980, PookyTheMagicalBear wrote:Like here's some of what catboi was saying about redtea-

In post 711, catboi wrote:Strongly feel that redtea is town

In post 789, catboi wrote:review of redtea shows he moves his vote very little as town, true of his recent game and our older games so I'm not as worried about that.

In post 901, catboi wrote:redtea I still think is town although I wish he'd be more proactive.

In post 924, catboi wrote:town: tanner, prism, chara, redtea
I don't see why redtea-scum would kill catboi given how much catboi thinks redtea is town?

the kill makes more sense with taylor being baddie.

Fair fair fair

If redtea is Chara I feel that would matter somewhat less. Still -- I was expecting Prism to die, not catboi! There must have been a purpose, unless maybe I was reading the game poorly. Catboi was very consensused town, I suppose. But yeah you do get the feeling they go somewhere else

I suppose.... if Redtea is scum, their partner would have had much more agency in the kill, since redtea replaced during the night phase. They might not have been thinking too much about it and just went with the most obvtown player they saw.

But that would somewhat imply a tayl0r / lavender partner who isn't super invested. And of course catboi scumread tayl0r hard

>-> i just wish we were past this day. this is becoming a whole ordeal, isnt it?

Morning Tweet · Sat Sep 26, 2020 6:04 pm

That scum game was crazy different i will give u that. If it were more recent I might even join based on that alone

Wouldn't watching catboi have a strong performance in SIN validate the possiblity of scum!redtea killing him? Eh, I don't think the kill was decided by redtea even if they are scum, probably. Your other points are pretty logical too.

Mmmm I'm quite conflicted now. I hope you're happy!! (^ω^)

Morning Tweet · Sat Sep 26, 2020 6:13 pm

That is even earlier than I remember -- yeah no question there really.

HURT: Isis

Hm hm HMMMM

Morning Tweet · Sat Sep 26, 2020 6:57 pm

In post 1989, Tayl0r Swift wrote:
In post 1983, Morning Tweet wrote:Fair fair fair

If redtea is Chara I feel that would matter somewhat less. Still -- I was expecting Prism to die, not catboi! There must have been a purpose, unless maybe I was reading the game poorly. Catboi was very consensused town, I suppose. But yeah you do get the feeling they go somewhere else

I suppose.... if Redtea is scum, their partner would have had much more agency in the kill, since redtea replaced during the night phase. They might not have been thinking too much about it and just went with the most obvtown player they saw.

But that would somewhat imply a tayl0r / lavender partner who isn't super invested. And of course catboi scumread tayl0r hard

>-> i just wish we were past this day. this is becoming a whole ordeal, isnt it?
is this true? isnt the reverse more true, that i scumread catboi?

hmm... id really expect morning to reciprocate my firm townread here, but instead she is getting more and more insistent on pushing me as pressure grows on her.

I'm not really thinking about your read on catboi, I'm thinking about his reads of you and redtea. He had redtea as strong town and you as strong scum

I'm confused what your point is about your scumread on catboi.

Do tell me, why do you expect town!Morning to reciprocate a townread on you, but scum!Morning to not? I'm being more open-minded. I feel like Prism probably deserves that if he's gonna go and put all this effort in (and Krazy deserves it too ofc if he's town).

Really, characterizing it as bending to pressure on

me

seems a bit.. inaccurate. I'm not considering swapping off of Krazy for fear of being exiled.

Morning Tweet · Sat Sep 26, 2020 8:43 pm

Yo i may be thinking totally irrationally rn or whatever but i am totally down for eliminating lavender

based on having second thoughts abt tayl0r or Krazy being scum

Also if Lavender is scum, she is probably the Chara no? That would explain why she's having so much difficulty making any content. That could also implicate her as just being scum in general too. I thought for sure she had more posts than this in the one game of hers I followed a lil while back -- crossfire.

Her partner could be a lot of ppl, but didnt Tanner try to swap the wagon off Elements to Lavender D1? Am I misremembering? I swear someone wanted us to swap to Lav but idk who.

ok that's my last input 4 tonight ty for reading

Morning Tweet · Sun Sep 27, 2020 9:48 am

In post 2070, Chara wrote:Krazy doesn't have the votes? i think they do in a situation where it's Krazy vs. no elim.

If there's anything I've learned so far, it's that the thread is generally very opposed to eliminating Krazy

Prism wrote:
In post 2065, Chara wrote:(if you seriously want me to stop, i will stop.)

the three Tanner listed are the only slots i'd be alright flipping today. my preference is towards Taylor, i think, but it's not because of Prism's solve, and it depends on what i think of the Krazy read.
I would really, really hate to see a Krazy vote.

But I can't make people read SIN and see what catboi and I saw. If there's no one else, and you think Taylor is more town than them on reread, just flip them.

Taylor has a decent chance of town flipping imo. But she also has a very good (>50% imo) chance of flipping scum. I can't say the same for Krazy.

what's Lavender's chances of flipping scum compared to Tayl0r

Morning Tweet · Sun Sep 27, 2020 9:54 am

i will leave it to you then Prism!!

Morning Tweet · Sun Sep 27, 2020 10:00 am

In post 2080, CantHateAPuppy wrote:
In post 2076, Prism wrote:but just picturing them flipping town-and we learn basically nothing from it, only from the Chara flip- is soulsucking
honestly this just sounds really unhealthy. we get a scum flip today no matter what and you're already looking foward to complaining about how it could have been more optimal.

reminder if you just flip ur perspective rn this could be us:

Spoiler:

I'm going to have to agree -- we get a scumflip today no matter what and then there's also bonus odds of winning which is more of an icing on the cake thing for me

Somebody asked me about how I said for Lavender we don't learn anything from flipping her if she's town -- yeah, but... we get a Chara flip anyway if Lav is town. Guess it makes me not sweat it as much. Going to have to kill Lav at some point no?

Morning Tweet · Sun Sep 27, 2020 10:06 am

In post 2088, Prism wrote:I think Lavender is a much better Day 3 flip, when our odds for hitting scum are at their worst point (1/7)

Like obviously they're a great fight if they're scum but I just don't feel it and want Taylor

BUT WHAT IF LAV IS CHARA AND SUICIDEESSSSSS

(I am willing to follow you to tayl0r but I'm slightly more favourable to Lav cause I had a crackpot townread on tayl0r and am having some second thoughts abt voting her)

At least with Lav there's like no way I'm having second thoughts about eliminating her

Morning Tweet · Sun Sep 27, 2020 10:55 am

In post 2114, Chara wrote:i god, if we don't win today i have to watch Prism die.

oh no i didn't think of it like that

Tanner wrote:who is opposing voting taylor? except maybe morning tweet? did i miss something?

ok sorry i'll stop you can go get some test dear dictator

Maybe like, slightly. But she's still around my 3rd pick and if she is what Prisms desires I will not stop them

Morning Tweet · Sun Sep 27, 2020 2:10 pm

So did Hectic just feel like bussing Elements then? Which would make him the Not Chara in any case

Morning Tweet · Sun Sep 27, 2020 2:23 pm

Correct. That's why Lav is a good pick because she can be scum with anyone

...at least, that's how I justify it

Morning Tweet · Sun Sep 27, 2020 5:27 pm

HURT: Lavender

Morning Tweet · Sun Sep 27, 2020 5:38 pm

In post 2159, Krazy wrote:I feel like you two need hugs tbh

ya really (>﹏<)

Morning Tweet · Sun Sep 27, 2020 6:12 pm

we're in the lowest stakes shit, like, ever

at least for me I feel like never been quite so disinterested in who we pick as I am in this game right now

Lavender >>> Krazy > Tayl0r > others

Maybe

Morning Tweet · Sun Sep 27, 2020 6:13 pm

I know that we technically have the highest(?) odds of hitting a mafia today while there's 2 of them

But like we're gonna get a Chara flip to compensate for that on later days anyway

Morning Tweet · Sun Sep 27, 2020 6:23 pm

I'm certain we have a townread wrong, and people can lie about their willingness to chop the lav/tayl0r/krazy slots anyway. I am inclined to believe we're overthinking it here

Morning Tweet · Sun Sep 27, 2020 6:23 pm

ostly certain anyway

Morning Tweet · Sun Sep 27, 2020 6:30 pm

:(

i wanted to be the hammer vote and do a whole faking being Not Chara bit (super original ik)

oh weeellllll

Morning Tweet · Sun Sep 27, 2020 6:32 pm

I will be absolutely livid

Morning Tweet · Sun Sep 27, 2020 6:34 pm

Do you prefer Hectic or Tayl0r atm? Ik it was hectic earlier but is it still

Morning Tweet · Sun Sep 27, 2020 6:37 pm

Krazy have mercy

Morning Tweet · Sun Sep 27, 2020 6:40 pm

In post 2187, Prism wrote:Lavender is spectating this game anyway and while I've been a workhorse it is time to take me out behind the barn before I get anymore insane

hahahahaha

Well you made the most of your time that's for sure!

Morning Tweet · Sun Sep 27, 2020 6:44 pm

ty krazy

Morning Tweet · Mon Sep 28, 2020 8:13 am

In post 2199, Tanner wrote:- @morningtweet please respond to the bottom of my 2041

In post 2084, Morning Tweet wrote:Somebody asked me about how I said for Lavender we don't learn anything from flipping her if she's town -- yeah, but... we get a Chara flip anyway if Lav is town. Guess it makes me not sweat it as much. Going to have to kill Lav at some point no?

basically I'm in purge mode.

Morning Tweet · Tue Sep 29, 2020 1:55 pm

In post 2250, Isis wrote:
When Morning Tweet saw Lavender getting bowled over, she grinned at the opportunity.

"Finally!"

Morning Tweet's senses were displeased with Lavender too, but not her hearing. Lavender's bright, glowing orbs had been keeping the cave from having its evening appropriate lighting. It seemed entirely wrong. Wasn't bed time soon? When everyone eats Nice Cream they will become sleepy!
When Lavender was knocked over, she lost control of her orbs. Morning Tweet flew over and picked them up, then found some bits of damp black construction paper that had blown onto the cavern floor. With a grin on her hidden face, she tucked the orbs beneath the construction paper. The lighting in the cavern grew dimmer right away. The fluttering knight celebrated by flying up to a stalactice and grabbing onto it with her greave-clad legs to hang upside down, feeling one with the darkness.

Yay for dark sleepy time! \(≧∀≦)/

I'm gonna keep voting Lav but i will read through the Tanner stuff when i can

Morning Tweet · Tue Sep 29, 2020 7:31 pm

In post 2256, Lavender wrote:I’ve spent 10 minutes reading their ISO and coming up with
Nothing substantial.
They feel like Basic Baby Town, what that means is what I said.
Is this a good thing?
Yesn’t

You read my ISO for 10 minutes?

hm hm hmm

Morning Tweet · Tue Sep 29, 2020 7:48 pm

In post 2260, Krazy wrote:
In post 2256, Lavender wrote:MTweet:
Their reasoning for voting me is a tad iffy but not unbelievable.
To be quite honest I don’t have a good understanding of them well enough.
I mean I don’t really understand anyone else that well, but MTweet is at the top of the list!

I’ve spent 10 minutes reading their ISO and coming up with
Nothing substantial.
They feel like Basic Baby Town, what that means is what I said.
Is this a good thing?
Yesn’t
I have no idea what any of this means but I'm for it

Anyway, if I'm following your reads correctly, you're leaning toward fighting tayl0r over tanner?

ya me neither

At first I felt like "Well, I'm unsure scum Lavender would come up with the idea to say she spent 10 minutes reading my ISO without being able to think of anything"

Then I was like "Well scum kind of has to make reads too, so she genuinely might have read it for 10 minutes and came up with nothing"

so now im ???

I sort of like my vote on her less and it's prompting to me to reread. Spoilers: I currently have Prism/Chara as locktown, Puppy/Pooky as heavy town (pending my reread a bit), Hectic is sort of a lean town, it really felt like he went hard on Elements in some spots. PoE: Tanner/Tayl0r/Lav/Krazy. Completely unsure who to fire at in the PoE

Morning Tweet · Tue Sep 29, 2020 8:12 pm

In post 324, Hectic wrote:

His approach on me this game is vastly different to how he's ever treated me. The last ~5 games I've played with him he's scumread me. He was town in 4 of those, and scum in 1. My last game with him is the one he was scum in, and in that he mentioned in the scumchat that he knew how to manipulate me by playing to his townmeta, and proceeded to scumread me as usual... the FOOL, that won't ever work on me again.
So, this is very new to me. He doesn't even have a reason to townread me, he's doing it in a memey "Hectic is always town" way. I think there's a chance he's polarising his approach from his last scumgame so that I think he's town here, but he's overdoing it.

Oh yeah here's that Hectic post I was thinking of

That is exactly what Elements was doing. Hectic pointed it out. Does he do that if he's Elements partner? Certainly not if he's Chara at least -- that'd be suicide surely? You don't know if the second mafia will be a deepwolf or not on page 13.

Elements was at 3 votes at the time. Hectic voted for redtea, and then Pooky before making this post.

In post 326, Hectic wrote:

He does note that it is possible Elements is town just a bit later after prompted by Prism.

Now he does some healing me stuff, questions Pooky a bit, and then next he goes after Elements. So he never tried to attack elsewhere from Elements much at all here. The most he did was call Pooky "strange".

In post 641, Hectic wrote:Launchy's explanation that he wanted to ask who I'd like to SPARE since I wasn't actively pushing for anyone is perfectly reasonable. Why did you, FIGHT him anyway, Ele? Plus, what's scummy about him changing his tune in the first place?

HURT: Elements

Elements kind of peaces out after this. So I guess it's no surprise Hectic keeps him at the bottom of his reads. He does not want to FIGHT anyone but Elements from this point on.

However, Hectic has one other push that he focuses on.. he wants to SPARE me. He tries to get me spared twice on D1. Now, what would be a brilliant plan is to pretend I've townspewed so hard he has no choice but to advocate for my spare, all fights be damned. But.. I'm not really sure that does much to help Elements. Buy time I guess?

The only reason I'm considering this is because he called it out so early. This doesn't really happen. It usually takes a decent body of work, and he'll be like "Looking at your ISO this game, it seems somewhat/decently likely you're town." For sure he's very accurate when he says that, but he doesn't always get there. Totally locktowning me on the 23rd page? That's highly unusual. He couldn't tell for sure if I was town even after like 120 pages of another game we played (i was town). He has such confidence in this game!

In post 772, Hectic wrote:Isis
Morning Tweet
Prism
Lavender
catboi
redtea
Chara
Tanner
PookyTheMagicalBear
Tayl0r Swift
CantLynchAPuppy
Elements

Lavender is town because of the stream of consciousness and free flowing kind of posting in her read list. It's why I wanted to get one out of her. As scum, her reads are rigid with little turns in the middle. As town, she changes her mind while she's even writing out the read. See her recent Nightless Vanilla towngame and the readslist in that, and then compare it to the readslist in her scumgame to see what I mean.

In post 927, Hectic wrote:Tbf I don't think beeboy is terribly difficult to read, he's capable of being very obvtown at times. I just want to FIGHT him because Ele did a good amount of scum-indicative stuff.

In post 945, Hectic wrote:Meh, beeboy hasn't done anything to change my mind on the slot and I think my reasons on Ele are solid.

Anyway Hectic was very clear for the majority of the day he wasn't budging on that fight. The only possible escape for Elements would have been getting me spared.

I think it's extremely unlikely for Hectic to be Not Chara but Prism has kinda already covered that. Chances of being the mafia? I don't think he is, but now I'm harbouring a bit of paranoia over his townread on me. I think my tier at "slight town" is a good pick

pedit: heyy what a coincidence it just so happens ive been ISOing hectic for the past 15 min

Morning Tweet · Tue Sep 29, 2020 8:13 pm

Oh also lengthy defense of Lav is kind of odd for scum!Hectic

Morning Tweet · Tue Sep 29, 2020 8:29 pm

Tayl0r seems to mostly suspect Hectic/catboi early, and she likes Pooky. She makes one comment on Elements:

In post 497, Tayl0r Swift wrote:is elements normally this quiet as town?

uuuugghhh i wish this weren't here so I could scumread her more easily. It's not even really anything much. She doesn't make any other suspecting Element posts though other than this one shade. She really just scumreads catboi hard. She drops the Hectic scumread after a bit.

.....did tayl0r kill catboi so she could be like "Why would I kill my strongest scumread?" today? That'd be funny

In post 720, Tayl0r Swift wrote:hmm i reread the iso and im not sure what i was seeing. its possible that the avatar just set me off? on rereading youre more null-town

hahahahaahaha i forgot about this one

In post 857, Tayl0r Swift wrote:hectic - probably town. stop being a goof though, and while i agree that deciding lavender is town rather than scum is passing on an opportunity for opportunism, it feels like a weak read
elements - beeboy hasnt really done anything to make me townread that slot (yet)
chara - am i the only one thinking chara might be scum here? chara let themself be talked into scumreading me pretty easily, and seems to float around the popular opinions a lot but never do much scumhunting
prism - prolly just town
pooky - definitely town
catboi - i still have misgivings
morning - those ears could never be scum
lavender - needs more content, in PoE
redtea - i dont remember any posts from this slot. i guess at some point i should read the iso but its not a good sign if they arent doing anything worth remembering. could just be the awolness that made me forget
tanner - prolly just town
puppy - hasnt really done much townie recently, but was a townread earlier

so that makes my PoE chara, lavender, redtea, puppy. out of those i want to HURT: chara

She forgets to include catboi and beeboy-Elements in her PoE here for some reason. the Chara vote is completely out of left field.

In post 869, Tayl0r Swift wrote:im down for a beeboy wagon

Tayl0r states just a bit after the readslist that she is down for the beeboy wagon though.

Here is the VC around that vote and readslist, for context: (this is about 100 posts later)

In post 960, Isis wrote:
Fight Votecount 1.8
Hectic--------------------------
(1) Prism

beeboy-----------------------
(4) Chara, Hectic, catboi , CantLynchAPuppy

Chara---------------------------
(2) redtea, Tayl0r Swift,

Prism --------------------------

PookyTheMagicalBear -------

catboi--------------------------

Morning Tweet----------------

Tayl0r Swift -------------------
(1) catboi

Lavender ----------------------
(1) Tanner

redtea --------------------------

Tanner -------------------------

CantLynchAPuppy-------------

Not Fighting:
- (3) PookyTheMagicalBear, Lavender, beeboy

That doesn't look very good. She didn't end up voting beeboy

side note, did my vote vanish in the VC?

In post 923, Tayl0r Swift wrote:
In post 830, beeboy wrote:Prism's read list had a set of takes that I think come from town.
His read on MT although consistent of him saying a bunch of MT traits and calling them scum indicative.
I also really liked that read in particular.

To some degree I want to town read MT for Hectic's "Top secret meta read", since good players tend to not say that without a real reason to do so.
But I also think I could probably read her on my own since I am fairly experienced playing with her, and she did perceive herself to be scum in one game even if she was town and could have thought it was multiball.

I originally wanted to question Hectic because I never heard of this tell before!!! But the 3 games that the 3 of us touched were 2 games modded by hectic and 1 modded by MT.
For the amount I've played with both Hectic and MT I am genuinely suprised this is the first time the 3 of us have played together. I don't want to count the dance game since it was an anon game.
i read beeboy's iso to decide whether it was a worthwhile wagon, but this is the only post with AI content (except the post advocating spares, which is scummy and was done twice in two different ways: spare at least one, and the spare route is good), and the AI content here is meh. dunno if its just because of catchup or what. beeboy needs more content but im not ready to lunch there yet.

She is definitely willing to give him a chance. Is that scummy? she wasn't around for the execution so I do not know if she would've ended up voting. She certainly was never interested in pursuing Elements-beeboy during the large majority of the day at the very least

Morning Tweet · Tue Sep 29, 2020 8:54 pm

pedit: night prism!!

In post 230, Morning Tweet wrote:i have a positive read on Chara/catboi/Prism and probably a slight one on Puppy/Tanner. Puppy moreso than Tanner. Also maybe redtea. So like catboi>Chara>Prism>Puppy>Tanner>redtea

Undecided so far on {Hectic, Lavender, Pooky, taylor, and Elements}

HEAL: catboi
HURT: Elements

Wow I've had quite the static reads huh. Or maybe you all just exhibit unchanging amounts of towniness.

In post 233, Tanner wrote:i think our reads are ~more-or-less similar. i take that as a good sign? also can you talk about the Prism townread, is there anything other than mech-effort?

HURT: elements

Early elements vote nice

In post 259, Tanner wrote:HURT: taylor

In post 347, Tanner wrote:
In post 306, catboi wrote:
In post 294, Tanner wrote:i didn't think i'd ever have the urge to vig 1/3rd of the players in a given game, but it's actually happened.
Well, 25% of the players in the game right now are scum, but it's probably not all the non-contributors. It's never that easy...usually.
what if... the scumteam was... exactly taylor/lavender/pooky .. aha ha, just kidding.. unless.. ?

i feel like i'm going back and forth on hectic. i really liked 302 (as it's almost the exact same thought i had upon seeing it) and the fact he's pressuring pooky, but then one person that seems to have experience with him says he's suspicious, then the other person that has experience with him says that's the hectic they wanted to see and sigh. wish
i
knew how to read hectic.

@hectic, do you have a read on me yet?

i hate that at this point i want to townread people (e.g. chara and prism with pooky on this page) just for telling people to
play the damn game
.

well that didn't last very long

In post 460, Tanner wrote:
In post 450, catboi wrote:
In post 419, Tanner wrote:
In post 407, catboi wrote:Lavender:
already said I think there's a chance she could just be scum who doesn't know how to fake it. I actually really dislike the tone of 373. However, I feel as though she'd be a waste of a vote today. evaluate on day 2.
why would she be a waste of a vote on day one? do you think it's gonna get *easier* to evaluate a nothing slot on day two?
have a theory that she might open up some if she's town or at least give us more to work with if not.
is this theory based on experience...?

oh hey look a serious wagon for once?
HURT: pooky

Seriously willing to kill Pooky it seems

He argues with Pooky quite a bit on the mechanics of sparing versus not sparing. Tanner is correct of course -- but was this just an easyish thing to scumread?

In post 546, Tanner wrote:elements's pooky/puppy/tanner team is a... spicy take.

little Elements shade here

In post 597, Tanner wrote:ugh, okay. it's already way past 3am here and i'm pretty tired and this game is uninspiring, so. i was hoping that elements would be back to elaborate on his reads or that lavender would be back to do
something
since those are the two things that interest me the most at the moment but alas.

In post 547, PookyTheMagicalBear wrote:
In post 546, Tanner wrote:i mean, define productive. imo getting people onto the highest EV path is productive. getting everyone to start talking reads is productive, because i will have a very hard time caring about this game if there's 3 people ~doing nothing~. am i succeeding in what i'm doing? debateable.
you know it probably would've been way easier to get AI-reads on the scum team if we had at least pretended to be down with the 4-spare strategy for a few days to give the incentive for scum to try to get a chara-spare win rather than just being like hell no there's no way we r giving chara a chance to win early.
is that what you were doing?

i'm seeing people starting to get suspicious of puppy and at some point i did start wondering if he's been pocketing me and if he starts looking like a plausible day one fight i will look into it.

my Spicy Hot Take(tm) of the night is that lavender (confidering how difficult they seem to be to wagon) is chara who's trying to leave out the fewest associates possible for after they flip. this may or may not be the sleep deprevation mixed with unhealthy tunnelling speaking. i'll decide in the morning.
HURT: lavender

i swear i will give this more attention (or like, a proper readthrough of ISOS or something) once i get some sleep

am probably around for the next ~half an hour if someone needs me

Was willing to kill Pooky, is voting Lav, is willing to look into Puppy as well. Anyone but Elements so far.

In post 996, Tanner wrote:hello i'm here earlier than usual since the deadline is in ~24 hours and i'm feeling dead tired today and will soon disappear back into the void for another 12 hours

my room-temperature bad-VCA take is that beeboy is prob town for how "fast" the wagon was there but also that i'd be willing to vote there if really necessary

i actually *don't* feel that strong of an urge to vote taylor anymore? i dunno. would definitely still fight lavender.

chara, i think you asked me about catboi? this is me acknowledging that i read that, but just... N/A. my brain is fried. the closest thing i got is that his townread on me felt ~weird~.

Ah yes here we are. The soft defense of beeboy-Elements. Seems like an unwise move for scum. What was the VC at?

In post 960, Isis wrote:
Fight Votecount 1.8
Hectic--------------------------
(1) Prism

beeboy-----------------------
(4) Chara, Hectic, catboi , CantLynchAPuppy

Chara---------------------------
(2) redtea, Tayl0r Swift,

Prism --------------------------

PookyTheMagicalBear -------

catboi--------------------------

Morning Tweet----------------

Tayl0r Swift -------------------
(1) catboi

Lavender ----------------------
(1) Tanner

redtea --------------------------

Tanner -------------------------

CantLynchAPuppy-------------

Not Fighting:
- (3) PookyTheMagicalBear, Lavender, beeboy

I do kind of feel that Tanner is town who just was off-wagon. Is there a situation for one of the scum where it's a good idea to defend their buddy who's going down? I guess Not Chara could do it, but it'll look pretty bad after the suicide.

Hm hm hm maybe it's kill Tayl0r time. But then who will be around to flop around my ears? It's really fun ;﹏;

Morning Tweet · Wed Sep 30, 2020 11:34 am

Not Chara Krazy's scumpartner would have to be in pretty good decision if he thinks he can mosey around trying to make other slots look bad / get them killed or whatever. For example, if he's buddied with tayl0r, that might have been a mistake.

And surely he's not partnered with Tanner.

And if he's partnered with Lav then lol i guess

idk I guess I'm kind of drifting away from considering Krazy a bit

Morning Tweet · Wed Sep 30, 2020 12:00 pm

Yesssss nap time

Morning Tweet · Wed Sep 30, 2020 12:04 pm

In post 2273, Krazy wrote:For the record, I would be perfectly happy to flop your ears

In post 2275, Tayl0r Swift wrote:no. thats my job. you stay away from her ears.

In post 2276, Tayl0r Swift wrote:i want to ensure that no one flops morning's ears for the remainder of the game as punishment for mislunching me when all i was doing was flopping her ears.

(>﹏<)

Now I'm all conflicted. my ears depend heavily on the outcome of this next fight

Morning Tweet · Wed Sep 30, 2020 4:37 pm

ya i think i prolly answered that twice now

Basically I see enough town and I'm past being worried about not learning anything from a misflip. Cuz we do -- there's 2 flipped scum tomorrow even if Lav is town. And Lav I probably wouldnt be comfortable sparing ever

pedit: ohhhhhhhhh i forgot that part

I think my plan was to just use their meta from marksman or something lol. I felt like there was a good chance Lav plays significantly different as scum

Morning Tweet · Wed Sep 30, 2020 4:38 pm

not marksman, crossfire

Morning Tweet · Wed Sep 30, 2020 8:16 pm

Morning Tweet · Wed Sep 30, 2020 8:30 pm

Tayl0r why are you asking to be eliminated in 2 of your last 3 posts?

(¬ω¬)

Morning Tweet · Thu Oct 01, 2020 10:11 am

In post 2428, Tanner wrote:oh yeah when i saw tweet comment on taylor asking for herself to get fought i had a thought of "huh that kinda sounds like chara reverse-psychologying us into not flipping her today" but i don't know anymore

yeah that's what i was gettin at

Guis I'm probably down to just tayl0r/Lavender today, with Krazy/Hectic in the weaker scumpool

I'm really feeling my Prism/Chara/Puppy/Pooky townpool with a soulvibe on Krazy and Tanner being town maybe

I might go so far as to guess the team might be tayl0r/Lav + Hectic. But I'd never do Hectic today cause he's not Not Chara

Morning Tweet · Thu Oct 01, 2020 10:13 am

It's tough though because I still like several bussing posts by Hectic. If he's scum he genuinely went to town on Elements.

His couple of tries to get me spared could mayyyybe be a diversion but I'm still not sure how that would help in the long run

Morning Tweet · Thu Oct 01, 2020 2:03 pm

Right, unless they're Not Chara which Krazy isn't