Mini 1918: Paint Mafia Threequel! Game Over!

[aptil]

Hello !! Playing here after a long time.My main reason to play this game was the shorter deadline.Don't really understand the mechanics of this game so if anyone is around and can link to an earlier game would be great(i'm going to search myself right now).

[aptil]

ok so i read the iso of cheero on the previous two paint games, instead of reading the whole game . From what i saw and the reading the suggestions from here the day1 colour flip is the most trustworthy flip. We can believe the colour as it is and don't have to worry about the colour changing and stuff . Secondly so day1 town has a good advantage than other normal mafia games in that we get two chances of getting a scum , which usually on day1 is a very low possibility . Also even if someone flips red colour in later stages of the game , it seems like the best idea is to lynch them that day only (see Kastuki inpaint sequel ,revealed day3 , lynched day6 ).

[aptil]

Can either Gamma or jj explain the logic in that post? Maybe I'm just tired but I don't really understand his reasoning in post 22 there. And also why he didn't explain right when he listed his early townreads.

If they were scum they wouldn't want me to control the color flip that way if I'm Town and if I'm scum they wouldn't want to flip me. I didn't explain it when I first said it because I figured someone would ask.

i really don't understand what you're saying here.

[aptil]

VOTE: varsoon

I'll take wallposting so soon as a request to be the town leader. But first, he needs to go through the security check.

Plus I think varsoon's hard to read.

So you think he is town but want to pressure him ? Does this type of pressure voting help you in reading him ?

[aptil]

Nope. We're voting to reveal colour, not to lynch scum.

Why is that any different ? The colour mechanic just helps to confirm(at least on day1 if red confirmed scum) what you're reading as scum is actually right.I don't know why you would want to flip any player's colour who you don't think is scum .

[aptil]

There is no ideal result from this phase. If we get a red result later on then we're still probably lynching it, aren't we?

But there is an ideal result.

I think we should be using today's colour flip on a very null, very active slot, and just outright lynch the scummiest person rather than using the colour flip on them.

I just don't get this.

[aptil]

I would like to VOTE: jjh927 , really don't follow his logic here .

[aptil]

I am taking everyone who suggests flipping something based on 'confirmation of alignment' with a furrowed eyebrow

Is it not for day1 ? That's what i'm assuming .

[aptil]

I am taking everyone who suggests flipping something based on 'confirmation of alignment' with a furrowed eyebrow

Only works on D1

I don't like throwing out traditional logic even if the setup is not especially traditional itself

Yea, i'm saying look for the scum just like in a normal game and use it as a fail safe if we get anything other than red . Do you agree or not ?

[aptil]

I just don't get this.

I do. He's basically suggesting to use the color flip like a cop investigation. Cops don't investigate the obviously scummy they investigate null reads. Town lynches the obviously scummy people.

Not a bad idea actually

But unlike a cop we can analyse the posting and everyone's motives to flip someone . Flipping someone we find scummy is better than a random null read . That leads to inactivity in the thread , everyone will have one or two posts here and there and chill . I would like people to think like we're​ lynching scum here and go after that . Not just chill around because we're​ flipping colour flipping

[aptil]

What do you think of me infinity?

[aptil]

VOTE: Twoface
Not just because he gets a drawing, but also because I'm curious why Aristo joined and fell off after the drawing.

I was voting him bwcause he said he wasnt a nerd.

I unvoted when he accepted the facts

Ari do you have any reads?

I like Gamma for the dumb gambit for now and I'd like a Varsoon flip, as he would be an amazing conftown to have and D1 is the only time it happens! Sadly, it also shortens his lifespan if we do this.

However,
VOTE: Varsoon

Why do you think having Varsoon as a conftown outweighs the damage of losing him so early, possibly even N1?

Varsoon is a strong player and will have a short shelf life anyway, so I'd rather he be a true blue towny that we can trust! He's also a far better flip than a null, especially early game. Flipping a null can lead to apathy from them if town. Iirc it plagued West9 in the first game of this series.
Varsoon isn't the type of player to stop playing because he's conftown, making it an even better choice!

If he is a strong player he should be able to look or be town without us needing to confirm him .Why is it towny or null ? Can't you just go after someone who you find scummy .

[aptil]

Looks like you guys had a fun night!

VOTE: Twoface

That's a hammer!

you were already voting him.

[aptil]

UNVOTE:
Again i don't understand this wanting to end this so soon . Two people have hardly even been here .Looks like jj is not an option right now so i would like to .

If the options are Noface and Bomber my vote is on VOTE: Bomberman

[aptil]

Quite honestly i would like someone to unvote on noface's wagon so that we can have raya and maxwell's input before the colour flip.

[aptil]

This is a kind of a blitz game i hope people comeback for the deadline or most of them are near it . I don't want to go in the mechanics again but i'm considering this as day1 lynch .

[aptil]

iii.2) Day two and onwards, the Reveal Phase will only last for two IRL days.

I will say, it kinda sucks that

a player can just not post in the whole color phase if they want without being hard prodded

.

Max not responding to me is really making me angry, and he's probably gonna lurk out the rest of the color flip phase.

did not know that.

[aptil]

At this point i will call Frog Varsoon and Infinity as my town reads and that's about it.

[aptil]

Can either Gamma or jj explain the logic in that post? Maybe I'm just tired but I don't really understand his reasoning in post 22 there. And also why he didn't explain right when he listed his early townreads.

If they were scum they wouldn't want me to control the color flip that way if I'm Town and if I'm scum they wouldn't want to flip me. I didn't explain it when I first said it because I figured someone would ask.

i really don't understand what you're saying here.

I was taking control of the color flip and mafia wouldn't like that

IT wasn't like they were voting you seriously .

[aptil]

Infinity please explain Ari as the strongest read .

[aptil]

I don't think the colour flip matters that much today . I will go with whatever the town wants today . If you want to put some logic i think at least one of two face's partner was on his wagon . I would be okay with someone on that to be cleared via colour or as frog suggests to have max or raya colour flipped .

[aptil]

What do you think of me infinity?

Not a fan of this post

Why? At that time he was asking someone else about me without giving his own opinions , i thought that was strange that's why i asked .

[aptil]

VOTE: aptil
This guy is gut pinging me rn

pinging you of what exactly . Admittedly missed most game and then latches onto something . Piss off.

[aptil]

VOTE: aptil please pile on

[aptil]

sounds like whiney scum who thinks they are caught for the wrong reasons and then shades Gamma for "missing the game" when that's not actually a reason to refute his push.

what did he push me on exactly anyways ?

[aptil]

sounds like whiney scum who thinks they are caught for the wrong reasons and then shades Gamma for "missing the game" when that's not actually a reason to refute his push.

what did he push me on exactly anyways ?

that post where you ask now confirmed town what they think of you. It DID sound like deflecting, and also like you knew he was town and wanted his read on you so you would know what direction to take things.

you mean infinity just check the previous post . He asks Apricity about me without giving his own reads , i didn't like that . That's why i asked him . Did not know he was town at that point wtf .

[aptil]

I don't think the colour flip matters that much today . I will go with whatever the town wants today . If you want to put some logic i think at least one of two face's partner was on his wagon . I would be okay with someone on that to be cleared via colour or as frog suggests to have max or raya colour flipped .

VOTE: aptil please pile on

"I would be ok with someone on TwoFace's wagon or Max or Raya"

*Self votes*



if you're town you're playing horribly

like i said it doesn't matter to me today what colour flips , if it helps you people to clear me great . I didn't like gamma's vote on me and then you joined in so i was like let's get this done with and move on .

[aptil]

like i said it doesn't matter to me today what colour flips , if it helps you people to clear me great . I didn't like gamma's vote on me and then you joined in so i was like let's get this done with and move on .

and you don't care to find scum why?

i didn't say that. I care to find the scum obviously . What are you saying here ?

[aptil]

You know what , now that i think about it Gamma just planned this thing out, from dead infinity to pointing that post out , the coincidence was that i was just there when he posted . [votegamma][/vote] not just for colour flip i think he's one of the scum here

[aptil]

VOTE: gamma coz i can't do this right in one go.

[aptil]

Vote: TwoFace

Pile 'em on lads

I might've hammered but that's alright I hope

@Mod, please draw something funny for this happenstance of me accidentally quickhammering

I'd also like to bring this up again because like Ari I also felt it sounded fake. Thoughts?

Those eod votes at first thought i was thinking it was scummy but then i thought Two face would have hammered anyways . Any scum other than him must have joined before them . These two probably were the least scummy there.

[aptil]

Apricity asked for thoughts and then didn't respond to stuff when answered .You should first see that aparicity.

[aptil]

Apricity asked for thoughts and then didn't respond to stuff when answered .You should first see that aparicity.

What posts are you talking about? I'm not sure what you're asking.

This.

Vote: TwoFace

Pile 'em on lads

I might've hammered but that's alright I hope

@Mod, please draw something funny for this happenstance of me accidentally quickhammering

I'd also like to bring this up again because like Ari I also felt it sounded fake. Thoughts?

I answered this in #564 also bomberman also addressed this.

[aptil]

Vote: TwoFace

Pile 'em on lads

I might've hammered but that's alright I hope

@Mod, please draw something funny for this happenstance of me accidentally quickhammering

I'd also like to bring this up again because like Ari I also felt it sounded fake. Thoughts?

Those eod votes at first thought i was thinking it was scummy but then i thought Two face would have hammered anyways . Any scum other than him must have joined before them . These two probably were the least scummy there.

Twoface did hammer. Though it also occurred to me that some of those who weren't on the Twoface wagon also fall into the category of low posters, so it's possible that they may have just been inactive at the time.
Who are you referring to by "these two"? Bomber and someone else?

and Ari .Ari was the last vote .I thought you were saying Ari was also fake which i misread.

[aptil]

@Mod, please draw something funny for this happenstance of me accidentally quickhammering

You not da boss a me!

VoteCount 1.08

TwoFace [7] - Fro99er, Apricity, Havo, jjh927, Infinity 324, Varsoon, Aristophanes

Not Voting [6]:

aptil, Bomberman, Gamma Emerald, MaxwellPuckett, Raya36, TwoFace

Hammer get! Flip coming shortly.

Two face did not hammer here apricity.

[aptil]

TwoFace hammered the color flip, not the lynch

thought apricity was talking about the lynch

[aptil]

Nbd because you seem really irritating to work with, and I am not sure why you're being townread

You don't read him as town based on day1 play.In fact even today .

[aptil]

Oh yeah my bad, Ari quickhammered the actual lynch but Twoface hammered his color flip.

So you think scum would be earlier on the wagon? Even if Twoface didn't plan on self hammering?

Generally an outed scum tries to self hammer and does not want more discussion around .So any scum partner would obviously jump well before the wagon is about to end.

[aptil]

You guys are mixing up the wagons. Scum is more likely to be on TwoFace later on the color wagon, but at any point in time on the lynch wagon.

Also apricity you should answer me about gamma

I don't think the hammer comes from scum partner in the lynch wagon. That's all.

[aptil]

UNVOTE:
Again i don't understand this wanting to end this so soon . Two people have hardly even been here .Looks like jj is not an option right now so i would like to .

If the options are Noface and Bomber my vote is on VOTE: Bomberman

Quite honestly i would like someone to unvote on noface's wagon so that we can have raya and maxwell's input before the colour flip.

Although bomber might be right

aptil back in the middle pile

What are you trying to suggest with those posts ?

[aptil]

Did people just ignore the fact that Aptil

self-voted himself for a minute to feign that he didn't care about being flipped

and then backed out and went onto gamma when he 'didn't like his post'

Where would this town be if they didn't have me to speak out on controversial topics like this one

I don't care at all about being flipped .It was a pretty instant reaction hardly anytime betweeen Gamma's vote and Frog's vote . Then i actually started thinking about why Gamma is doing that and thought my vote would be better , if you want to vote for me go ahead .

[aptil]

Hey, apologies for not being here for the last few days. Been busy with interviews, work, my laptop's visual output died entirely so I had to get my desktop computer up and running for the first time in several years. On top of that, this weekend is my fiance's birthday and, for the last few days, a friend of mine has been marathoning Game of Thrones with me so I'll be ready for the premiere of Season 7 by this Sunday. I have watched three seasons of Game of Thrones within a 74 hour span. While working. I did not sleep very much.

I bring this all up because I won't be able to have the game presence that I had during D1, especially during this critical Color Reveal phase.

Here are some leads I have and notes I took before:
-Twoface self-voted on his color flip, but did NOT self-vote on his lynch. I figured he self-voted color-wise to deny town information, especially as I brought that up just before he did it. However, if he was trying to deny more info, he would have also self-voted for his actual flip, right? Checking the game rules, scum has daychat during the lynch part of the day--I find it very likely that scum may have been on TwoFace's lynch wagon (for that sickhot towncred) but not his color wagon, especially evidenced by TwoFace allowing for that lynch wagon to have more on it. This is a weak lead, but worth checking out.
-We should be most critical of people that tried to drive the wagon away from TwoFace. There were several moments where other wagons were proposed, iirc.
-I think that it's safe to say that TwoFace was very likely not bussing on D1--It is worth looking at who he voted for colorflip and why. This could give us some leads for players likely to be town.
-The kill was on Infinity; Who/what was Infinity pushing?

Was Infinity playing in a way that betrayed their role?

Having a protective role go down that early is suspect to me--scum could've gotten lucky, though, in my experience, someone on the team typically catches a crumb or has a meta-gut feeling that the player was a PR. Regardless, we should consider why Infinity was the kill. Notably, they were on the TwoFace color wagon. Why kill on-wagon rather than off?

If other players could look into these leads, I think it would help us a lot.
As of now, I do not have the time to dedicate towards them, and that, honestly, bums me right the fuck out.

What does betraying the role mean here ?

[aptil]

lol k
I mean I'll just be conftown if you colorflip me so go ahead and make me impossible to push

Reaction when i voted him.I don't care.

Fro99er, can I request a soft restart on your thoughts on me? Just back to the beginning of d2. I got confused about which wagon was posted.

Reaction when Frog's looking at him . No give me a second chance , don't flip me .

[aptil]

VOTE: JJH

But why don't you like Apricity?
Is it just the cool thing to do?

Dunno how cool it is considering how split the votes are rn

Can you give your reasons for not liking me or Apricity?

[aptil]

You guys are mixing up the wagons. Scum is more likely to be on TwoFace later on the color wagon, but at any point in time on the lynch wagon.

Also apricity you should answer me about gamma

I don't think the hammer comes from scum partner in the lynch wagon. That's all.

Why?

Outed scum will self hammer to end the day quickly .

[aptil]

Since you're here I'll talk to you about you. I'd actually rather we flipped you, but the deadline is looming closer because blitz and I'd feel icky about not voting on a larger wagon.

A couple of your votes have been either bad or wrong, but luckily not both from my perspective so you've got that going for you. Talk to me about Varsoon maybe?

Which were bad and which were wrong ?

Varsoon was one of my townreads on day1, nothing he did has changed that so far . Why do you ask about Varsoon?

[aptil]

Also even if apricity is not here , i would like to here your reasoning for that slot as well.

[aptil]

@Mod, please draw something funny for this happenstance of me accidentally quickhammering

This .

[aptil]

I really like that you just answered that question from ages ago without me having to ask it again. I'm used to people refusing to answer questions while I repeat them.

But I guess I'll ask another question-

doesn't the scum partner hammering serve exactly the same purpose

? And does 485 concern you at all?

Scum partner hammering like that would be taking a risk no . Like if someone asks them about it , the reaction to that is pretty easy to catch on .

[aptil]

UNVOTE:
Again i don't understand this wanting to end this so soon . Two people have hardly even been here .Looks like jj is not an option right now so i would like to .

If the options are Noface and Bomber my vote is on VOTE: Bomberman

This is reaaaaaaaaally off, considering all the discussion about twoface self-hammering, you acknowledging that he was on L-1, and that tbh Bomber was never really much of an option. So I'm calling this one wrong. But I can't really call it bad because at that point in time I had a fairly significant scumread on Bomberman and maybe a titchy little scumlean on Twoface.

VOTE: aptil please pile on

And this has already been discussed by other people I think, but this vote is bad. But I can't say it's wrong.

Well at the time of voting for bomber i thought we had plenty of time left , i don't know how much time was left in the day but how i play (mostly 36hour day phases and 12 hour night phases ) i thought there was plenty of time and i could vote for who i thought was the scummiest person .

The self vote yes it was an instant reaction, it was just start of day2 gamma voted me and fro joined on . I will admit if i wasn't there at same time those guys were i would have maybe reacted differently . in the moment i felt whatever if that's what you think let's clear me . Then when fro said if you are town you're playing badly even then i replied to him like whatever dude . You have to see it was all happening in a very quick time . But then i took a moment and that's when i changed the vote.

So yea i will concede that it was a bad vote. the wrong vote i don't think so , i thought day1 should be played in a manner and i did that.

[aptil]

I really like that you just answered that question from ages ago without me having to ask it again. I'm used to people refusing to answer questions while I repeat them.

But I guess I'll ask another question-

doesn't the scum partner hammering serve exactly the same purpose

? And does 485 concern you at all?

Scum partner hammering like that would be taking a risk no . Like if someone asks them about it , the reaction to that is pretty easy to catch on .

This is why I asked you about 485. To me, that post looks like a shitty attempt to emphasise to everyone that it was accidental, which immediately makes me consider that it wasn't accidental. On the other hand, that kind of shit matches Bomberman's general tone / posting vibe thus far so it's not an outlier.

I thought the tone was similar to their previous posting so it didn't feel like an over emphasis.

[aptil]

Was Infinity playing in a way that betrayed their role?

What does betraying the role mean here ?

I'm wondering if, based on his play and posts alone, there was evidence that he was PR.
In a previous game, I butted heads with Infinity and I'm a bit more used to Infinity playing in a more direct and argumentative way--I was wondering if his more reserved approach to this game could've tipped off someone who knows his meta better?

I know that when I roll a killing role, I tend to make threats to players more--like "I'll kill you" or "You're dead if you don't..." This tends to be my way of crumbing. Similarly, when I am a protective, I tend to tell my town reads to play more aggressively and not worry because I have their back. The few times I've been an investigative role, I tend to kinda sit back and try not to draw attention to myself while cultivating interactions and reads between players. Even when I don't try to do these things, I find myself trending towards them depending on my PR. I'm wondering if the kill was informed by some similar play from Infinity, and, if so, it might point to scum being someone who has some meta experience with Infinity.

Ok but i think infinity was pretty much townread by most people and wasn't getting lynched soon so it was a good kill regardless .Analysing that way might lead to wrong conclusions.

[aptil]

What's your read on Bomberman right now, aptil?

That hammer not hammer seems to clear bomberman for me.

[aptil]

Vote: TwoFace

Pile 'em on lads

I might've hammered but that's alright I hope

@Mod, please draw something funny for this happenstance of me accidentally quickhammering

I'd also like to bring this up again because like Ari I also felt it sounded fake. Thoughts?

Does any discussion come from this? I think this one's a pretty good example.


On the whole "not engaging with scumreads" thing, you're gonna have to check through her iso for that. Because I can't quote posts that aren't there.

Some discussion did come about it.

[aptil]

Can you talk about the slot outside of the hammer thing?

Outside of the hammer i would strongly suspect him based on day1 .Even day2 i don't understand not seeing fro as town and his coming back with 667 'what would this town do without me' , although going with his tone overall with the game it didn't feel good for me . I will re-examine the slot later if he continues to survive like that.

[aptil]

Can you talk about the slot outside of the hammer thing?

Outside of the hammer i would strongly suspect him based on day1 .Even day2 i don't understand not seeing fro as town and his coming back with 667 'what would this town do without me' , although going with his tone overall with the game it didn't feel good for me . I will re-examine the slot later if he continues to survive like that.

But the hammer somehow clears him of all this? You're not making sense to me here. That hammer is somewhere between NAI and scummy depending on how you look at it. Twoface was publicly confscum and thus a hammer which actually did serve to limit discussion should not make you read Bomberman as town. There is no reason scum wouldn't hammer that.

Yea but don't think the hammer comes from scum partner it has to come from outed scum itself. Scum have day chat right ? Wouldn't they be able to work it how he gets lynched. Scum would be co-ordinated and not do something like that .

[aptil]

VOTE: aptil

okay , Why ? Because i answered honestly what i was thinking here like .

[aptil]

You know that's a real bad vote .

[aptil]

Well, basically, I've been fairly clear with things here. You're arguing that the fact that Bomberman hammered, not even the way he hammered, clears him. And that is just not true by any stretch of the imagination. You're basing this off of assumptions of coordination? Why would scum make it easy for us and "be co-ordinated"?


If you flip red then it's you and Bomberman and the game is won.

Scum being co-ordinated makes it easy for us ?

Me and Bomberman are team . This is ridiculous logic right now .

[aptil]

What you're suggesting is that scum play out some kind of super-rehearsed scene if they're going to hammer. Your assumptions are highly flawed.


And yeah, you and Bomber have a massive glaring association going on here because your sole reason for townreading him rather than scumreading him is bullshit.

super-rehearsed like WTF .It will be co-ordinated as in they won't be like how Bomber played it . They would be careful in that . What's so difficult in that ?

Your reasoning for locking me seems pretty disingenuous. Very shallow reasoning here .

[aptil]

What would you expect to see in scum hammering Twoface that you don't see in the way Bomber did it? And don't say the word "coordination" or any derivative thereof.

Hey im hammering him . Don't think we need to wait he might selff hammer anyway . Let's do this . then after that they will do it . Here the reaction seems pretty real to me that they caught scum and that's why they came in and voted straight away . Later realised he might have been hammered and then made that @mod post . Do not think that comes from a partner .

I have answered your question honestly as to what i believe . I didn't try to spin anything just because you disagree with me should not be the basis of he is lock scum here .That's just bad play if you're town.

[aptil]

Why do you think there's scum in those three rather than TvT? I was actually thinking that after the recent exchanges I like jjh quite a bit more than previously.

What about jjh do you like here ?

[aptil]

See he breaks character now . I didn't really like that style of posting . I was ready to keep it on the backburner because i genuinely feel that's not how scum partner would hammer there.

[aptil]

Now, let's talk about Aptil. I really dislike how he came into the thread and unvoted just to vote me, moreso I dislike his behavior in general. I already talked about in minor detail but I think it's enough to be incriminating, so I won't repeat myself here. I can't recall the exact count in my head but I think at that point TwoFace was at L-2, so if anyone wants to speak up about Aptil's behavior being townie because of him missing an opportunity to get TownPoints for voting TwoFace, now is your chance to do it here. That's not how I feel though and I think out of these three I can see myself aligning with JJ in voting Aptil, based on general tells and what transpired before. I really feel like he was feigning on the whole 'I don't care if I'm voted' with Gamma and I think it's an easy and stupid copout. I'll tell you right now that self-voting yourself isn't good regardless of the circumstance and I never had intention to do it, which is why I was being so sarcastic about it when it was brought up.
[/i]

im gay

VOTE: Aptil

I voted for you in the colour phase not when he was about to be lynched . I have already explained the feigning the vote thing , you don't react to the explanation i provided , maybe you should see that .

[aptil]

Why do you think there's scum in those three rather than TvT? I was actually thinking that after the recent exchanges I like jjh quite a bit more than previously.

What about jjh do you like here ?

The way he articulated and then reconsidered his read on me seemed like a pretty natural evolving thought process, for starters. Originally when he voted me I thought he was just jumping onto the wagon that had the most support without acknowledging that fact (the "can we just get a wagon going" line). But when he was talking with Varsoon about it--last post on the previous page in particular--it looked genuine, and I think scum would have pushed forward in scumreading me, trying to maintain the momentum on my wagon.

I also think his concern about you was pretty valid re. Bomberman. Your contradiction in saying the quasi-hammer cleared him to saying that outside of it he's still scum was odd to me too, and I'm still not that sure about your explanation.

He thinks you do not lend stuff to discussion until this epiphany of me/Bomber team he had you as pretty much the best scum here possible .

[aptil]

Not enough for me, your flip would clear a lot of things in my head

Probably gonna fade into obscurity now

Well that's fine then.

[aptil]

I doubt you're in a team with Bomber. But that's not really the point.

Then what is . Why am i clearing him if i'm not his partner ? Bad logic in your opinion okay but how does that make one scummy ?

Also, i wanted you to comment on his analysis of your game so far .

[aptil]

VoteCount 2.04

jjh [1]

- Aristophanes

aptil [3]

- Gamma Emerald, jjh927, Bomberman

Gamma Emerald [3]

- aptil, Havo, Apricity

Apricity [2]

- MaxwellPuckett, Fro99er

jjh927 [1]

- Varsoon

Not Voting [1]:

Raya36

With 11 alive, it takes 6 votes to flip someone's colour.
You have (expired on 2017-06-17 10:00:00) to do so.

Nice wagon formation. Interesting to see who moves where .
Cheeto you got jj in two separate votes.

[aptil]

This was not what i expected when i went to sleep last night .

[aptil]

The colour of the flip is not that trustworthy as the colour was definitely changed here because scum is red and town is blue (anything other than that should be a mechanism of colour change).
So we have two things here to analyse:

1) If you believe jj was town (blue) colour changed to purple by scum last night they would need to push for his reveal . So we look for who pushed where and how .Also another possibility of town changing the colour not so sure about that role but that would be weird.

2)If you believe jj was scum(red) ) colour changed to purple by himself , he would have to somehow be eager to reveal himself and clear him by that standard . In this case he would have to act pretty damn scummy to get that flip .

[aptil]

Well I think saying or 'painting' blue as red would be bastard because it'd go against the foundation set

You need to read the first two paint games , i think that will help.

[aptil]

The colour of the flip is not that trustworthy as the colour was definitely changed here because scum is red and town is blue (anything other than that should be a mechanism of colour change).
So we have two things here to analyse:

1) If you believe jj was town (blue) colour changed to purple by scum last night they would need to push for his reveal . So we look for who pushed where and how .Also another possibility of town changing the colour not so sure about that role but that would be weird.

2)If you believe jj was scum(red) ) colour changed to purple by himself , he would have to somehow be eager to reveal himself and clear him by that standard . In this case he would have to act pretty damn scummy to get that flip .

2 would be a hell of a gambit, no?

Yea, i was just thinking what scum jj would do that's why i came up with that . Maybe he flipped colour for safety reasons like a backup if it happens it happens and not be hasty to flip himself.

[aptil]

[quote="In [url=viewtopic.php?p=9332459#p9332459]

VoteCount 2.05

jjh927 [6] - Aristophanes, Varsoon, Fro99er, MaxwellPuckett, Bomberman, jjh927

Hammer has been reached, flip incoming..

[/quote]

Here are the people voting for him.

Aristo: Basically the only thing he did in the colour phase . Voted and left.
Varsoon: Did not like jj voting for Apricity and that's why he did that . He also wasn't around after that .
Fro: He did not like that Gamma wagon had all his suspects but i'm not sure if he meant to vote here after saying that. I wasn't here when this happened but reading through it seems like this was a pressure vote . If it wasn't frog can correct me .
Max:Chooses to vote jj above gamma mostly because of meta i think , he knows gamma's game.
Bomber:He had jj/fro/me as one of the scum so he flips from me to jj .
jj:Self hammer.

[aptil]

He was painted and ipped. I say we lynch him and assume the paint ability is one shot per night. This means thay we can truse the results more as we go and dont have to worry about the wine of his flip later.

It's sound theory

Don't you want to analyse why he was flipped or anything before we do that ?

[aptil]

What if mafia had to paint someone twice to turn them red? The first attempt with the red paint would paint them purple since that's a mix of the two colours and the second time would paint them completely red?

I don't know about that Raya. Have you caught up with the thread ? Can you give your thoughts on what you happened so far ?

[aptil]

@Frog At the point of you voting for jj : Was it a pressure vote or did you want to flip him over any other person?

[aptil]

VOTE: Aristophanes

Not much analysis required there, actually.

Explain it anyways.

[aptil]

He asked whether Gamma would self-hammer, then I asked why self-hammering is beneficial. There was a discussion on it. Me asking the question seemed to make him vote me for some reason. I don't know how you're missing that.

He didn't personally tell me to self-hammer but I assume he would have done. Also we did not have 24 hours left. I believe we had 10.

Read the full discussion on self hammers if you want me to talk about it any more.




On the nightkill stuff, after flipping purple there's always gonna be this suspicion from town. Also sunken cost fallacy may be a fallacy but it's still a thing.

I was asking about the vote.

[aptil]

The entire colour flip phase, Ari had one post and it was voting me. I would say he also assumed Frog and others would be joining him. Based on the wagon, he's the most likely scum in it. TRs for Varsoon and Frog, I've reaaaally liked Maxwell's stuff from this phase, and Bomber hopped on for good reasons.

But him hoping frog would flip on to you is not the same as him trying . I think scum actively pushes that to go through if they want to flip your colour that badly . He wasn't around to do that .
Bomber may have right reasons but you thought he was in a scum team with me . He flipped from me to you. Your POV that should be scummy or has your opinion changed on that regard .

[aptil]

i) Gamma Emerald - town b*tches
ii) Aristophanes - likely town
iii) Fro99er - likely town
iv) Raya36 - iirc TwoFace was shady with this guy
v) TwoFace - dead mafia
vi) Varsoon - likely town
vii) Apricity - ?
viii) Havo - opportinistic, p scummy
ix) Bomberman - ?
x) Infinity 324 - dead town
xi) aptil - scummy
xii) jjh927 - probtown
xiii) MaxwellPuckett - iirc TwoFace was weird with this guy

My thoughts rn

Nobody asked a list from you . I get the feeling you haven't even read the whole thread just putting this out as look I'm doing some work .

[aptil]

Vopte: JJ

Are you simply not interested in any interaction in this game? I don't know what to make of this attitude.

[aptil]

Na, there's loads of interesting shit off the wagon.

You've got Gamma's vanity vote and you've got the Gamma wagon. If Gamma is scum, then I think the other scum must be on my wagon. I just don't see scum!Gamma getting bussed by his assumedly last teammate when there's a wagon on me, the guy they recoloured.

With that in mind, if Gamma is scum then he's scum with either you or Bomber. I still like Max's overall attitude to this phase and have a pretty firm TR from it. And Bomber voting me is consistent with how he was before my wagon, but it could feasibly make sense as scum. Right now, I think you're more likely, Ari.


But hey, you considered my perspective so I'll consider town!you. I'm gonna say maybe no scum are on my wagon. That means they've avoided it subtly. So in that case, alarm bells go off majorly around Raya, who could have jumped on the Gamma wagon as a non-suspicious option that didn't put her in the line of fire following my colourflip, lynch and townflip.

Thoughts?

Just checked Raya's vote came before Frog voted for you . That's when the shift happened so not so sure about subtly staying away from this wagon. For what you're suggesting to happen, the scum should be confident enough in getting you flipped and when they see it going down then they can move on to other wagons .

[aptil]

We have 20 hours to put a wagon together and I buy Ari's unvote so unless a lot more people turn up to discuss what we're doing then it's

VOTE: Gamma

I don't actually think Gamma is scum, but his flip will tell me where to look for the scum. If he's town, then both scum can be off my wagon. If he's scum, then the last scum is on my wagon.




Aptil, that's a fair point and I didn't realise that's how things went down.

Exactly what will his flip tell you?

From your POV: At least one scum has to be on your wagon ,both scum off your wagon is an absolute stretch here .The least likely scenario .You have to select one from your wagon , it's just insane that if you're town you think that your flip was a coincidence and not one scum could be on it .

[aptil]

VOTE: aptil

Is it possible to wagon this if we really try

Fuckall vote part2 .

[aptil]

I just don't understand this death tunnel on me even after me .

[aptil]

The role you're suggesting a town painter of some sort absolutely doesn't make sense . Town start Blue and if the town painter uses his power he's only making it easier for scum . This is ridiculous conclusion you have come to .

Also this changed in 24 hours i see

It's equally plausible scum would just want to soft push people in the direction they were going yesterday so as not to attract attention.


And Bomber- eh. Me calling you and Bomber a scumteam was a massive stretch and I see that now. Bomber has been playing consistently with his posts and tone this whole time and I guess he's kind of townleany right now? I saw his vote on me as being because he considered me a possible scum and was curious as to what I'd flip anyway, and I was on L-2 close to deadline. I think scum would already be on wagon by that point.

[aptil]

JJ has made this easy now . After his flip he has done this whole circle around about reactions to theories(well everybody else has) to going after his wagon analysis and then to lynching somebody else because deadline is coming closer and to go back to his thoughts before the lynch . It looked like he was waiting for some way to get it back at me now .

Most people on his wagon are considered town here so he knows can't really go after them which is pretty scummy . Only somewhat tried to go against Ari , don't see any town motivation there . I thought he would have pushed hard , re-evaluate everybody but nothing .I can't see any town mentality in that Gamma vote , that's just self preservation.

VOTE: jjh927

[aptil]

Nope. I suggested a LOYAL town painter. Painting people blue, but only successfully targeting town, would be a way for town to combat scum's repainting of town.

Show me the mixing mechanism in the previous two game that lead to this mixing of colours, which lead to you being purple .

You called me/bomber scum team a stretch now you're back to it .

[aptil]

The simple fact that jj changed his vote back to Gamma when he was about to get lynched tells me he's scum . Why does a VT care so much about being alive ? Changes only when he somehow convinces frog he's not scum.

[aptil]

The colour of the flip is not that trustworthy as the colour was definitely changed here because scum is red and town is blue (anything other than that should be a mechanism of colour change).
So we have two things here to analyse:

1) If you believe jj was town (blue) colour changed to purple by scum last night they would need to push for his reveal . So we look for who pushed where and how .Also another possibility of town changing the colour not so sure about that role but that would be weird.

2)If you believe jj was scum(red) ) colour changed to purple by himself , he would have to somehow be eager to reveal himself and clear him by that standard . In this case he would have to act pretty damn scummy to get that flip .

This makes so much sense it worries me how you came up with it tbh.

The colour of the flip is not that trustworthy as the colour was definitely changed here because scum is red and town is blue (anything other than that should be a mechanism of colour change).
So we have two things here to analyse:

1) If you believe jj was town (blue) colour changed to purple by scum last night they would need to push for his reveal . So we look for who pushed where and how .Also another possibility of town changing the colour not so sure about that role but that would be weird.

2)If you believe jj was scum(red) ) colour changed to purple by himself , he would have to somehow be eager to reveal himself and clear him by that standard . In this case he would have to act pretty damn scummy to get that flip .

2 would be a hell of a gambit, no?

aptil havo ruled out as a combo


also, havo makes a great point. And it sounds like aptil is setting up JJ in #1 as if town we should be lynching on the JJ color flip wagon, then aptil (and other scumbuddy) just stays off the JJ color flip. That would incriminate gamma/havo/raya/apricity, but I've ruled out havo and gamma there. I don't think apriciy and aptil make sense either, given something I think I read, so I need to check back on that too

How do we both avoid the colour flip? Where do I even make an attempt to colour flip this jj guy ? I have to be some evil genius to stay away from all that and still get the flip i intended . That too with scum partner raya . What i posted here is a logical conclusion if you understand basic setup.

[aptil]

The simple fact that jj changed his vote back to Gamma when he was about to get lynched tells me he's scum .

explain

Why does a VT care so much about being alive ?

because they'd rather lynch scum

Changes only when he somehow convinces frog he's not scum.

so?

I just read back when i went to sleep jj was voting me . then at some point he changes to gamma l-1 or l-2 . Why does he need to do that ? He says gamma will flip town . That's just insane . You stick to your guns if you're getting lynched why would you try to go to preservation mode that's scummy.

[aptil]

I will never resign myself to being lynched as any alignment ever.

Also once Frog unvoted me that opened up the option of lynching in my scumreads that I thought was previously closed.

Then you should have kept the vote on your scumread not on null/town whatever.

[aptil]

To suggest that i'm the scum who's off his paint wagon is just plain bad . Two scums off his wagon is also just stupid .

I didn't even start the reaction with jj before the flip , he came in all now that you're here i want to talk with you and just kept on me until he could find something to vote me . He has done this again in the lynch phase too .

[aptil]

We have 20 hours to put a wagon together and I buy Ari's unvote so unless a lot more people turn up to discuss what we're doing then it's

VOTE: Gamma

I don't actually think Gamma is scum, but his flip will tell me where to look for the scum. If he's town, then both scum can be off my wagon. If he's scum, then the last scum is on my wagon.




Aptil, that's a fair point and I didn't realise that's how things went down.

What is this ?

[aptil]

We have 20 hours to put a wagon together and I buy Ari's unvote so unless a lot more people turn up to discuss what we're doing then it's

VOTE: Gamma

I don't actually think Gamma is scum, but his flip will tell me where to look for the scum. If he's town, then both scum can be off my wagon. If he's scum, then the last scum is on my wagon.




Aptil, that's a fair point and I didn't realise that's how things went down.

Exactly what will his flip tell you?

From your POV: At least one scum has to be on your wagon ,both scum off your wagon is an absolute stretch here .The least likely scenario .You have to select one from your wagon , it's just insane that if you're town you think that your flip was a coincidence and not one scum could be on it .

This is the post in question. And it's a lovely example of echo chamber because this word

"coincidence" is being thrown around when me being recoloured and me being colour flipped are not independent events

- scum recoloured me because I was likely to be colour flipped. We would expect scum to be on the wagon which is a good reason for them not to be on the wagon. Aptil keeps misinterpreting points until he makes a new point to be used against me and then someone else like Havo ends up agreeing with it for some godawful reason

Isn't that what i was trying to get at those things are not independent . You're trying to misinterpret me .Your vote lead me to b elieve you were thinking that way.

[aptil]

"I don't think Gamma is scum" and "Gamma will flip town" are two radically different statements.

Do you have a job as a misinterpreter

Yea he's going to flip some third party right .

[aptil]

Did a really quick Iso there and says a disgusting vanity vote this flip phase while remembering their dancing around and avoiding a TwoFace flip vote.

Will support this.

VOTE: Aptil

What vanity vote?

[aptil]

aptil says: if JJ is town scum is on the jj color flip

as aptil conveniently stays off the jj color flip

One scum has to be there at least . If one scum is off the wagon and you think it's me , please tell me how i did that ? You're suggesting me/raya partner . Scum can't colour someone blue to purple and hope all the town does their work .

[aptil]

Aptil, let's play a game


if JJ is town, then who is scum?

Ari makes sense to me . They have the best understanding of the mechanics but have played it down and just coming and going in bursts . I highly doubt both of the scum are on this wagon so the second for me would be Gamma .

[aptil]

But you seem to say that as soon as the day started and did not vote jj for that reason .

[aptil]

Id much rather lynch someone that's viable and not a townread. (So anyone not in Frog/jjh/Apricity/Varsoon)

When did he have apricity as town?

[aptil]

aptil says: if JJ is town scum is on the jj color flip

as aptil conveniently stays off the jj color flip

One scum has to be there at least .

Incorrect. It could be all town on JJ

If one scum is off the wagon and you think it's me , please tell me how i did that ?

Uh...by not voting him.

You're suggesting me/raya partner . Scum can't colour someone blue to purple and hope all the town does their work .

What? Sure they can. Especially knowing I was pushing JJ at the end of the day and I had a solid townblock with Varsoon and Ari.

But some push needs to be in that direction . I didn't do anything of that sort nor did Raya(she didn't do anything)

[aptil]

But you seem to say that as soon as the day started and did not vote jj for that reason .

what?

That you're alive because scum wanted to push jj through you . You didn't do that . You went in a different direction and voted jj later on for different things.

[aptil]

But you seem to say that as soon as the day started and did not vote jj for that reason .

At which point scum going "No it's jj we should colourflip him" would probably have the townblock beating down on them before we even got to the colourflip

What are you saying here ?

[aptil]

But you seem to say that as soon as the day started and did not vote jj for that reason .

what?

That you're alive because scum wanted to push jj through you . You didn't do that . You went in a different direction and voted jj later on for different things.

right...but scum didn't know i'd go a different direction

Hmm what once the day started they knew . So wouldn't they push somewhat in that direction or just let it be ?

[aptil]

aptil what do you think about my theory that scum can't paint red or blue?

I agree. Too powerful. any other colour than red/blue flip is still making it hard for town to put all of their minds behind it .

[aptil]

Well then i might just as well claim here . I'm a one shot vig .

[aptil]

and your current color is?

Blue.

[aptil]

I never crumb. so whatever.

[aptil]

Because it's not a fake claim . That's why i was so interested in reading the previous games which most of the people who didn't participate haven't even bothered .

[aptil]

I would suggest lynching jj i still think he is scum . But if you see mechanics wise that is the best information lynch . Agree to shoot wherever town decides .

[aptil]

aptil why didn't you shoot night 1?

after Noface flip i thought i could hold my shot as we had one down and i could have a better chance at hitting later . Really thought about hitting Bomber but that's when i started thinking on the line of scum won't do something like that.

[aptil]

I would suggest lynching jj i still think he is scum . But if you see mechanics wise that is the best information lynch . Agree to shoot wherever town decides .

or we just lynch raya and vig JJ like I said if raya flips town

That is the best route to clear me i suppose . I would feel confident of hitting that shot anyways .

[aptil]

VOTE: Raya

if raya flips blue vig JJ

if raya flips red hold the vig shot

Ok

[aptil]

Ftr if Raya doesn't flip, I dont want jjh shot. Someone else would be better.

Yes.

Vig raya if we get a no lynch

If all three present here vote JJ , he would be l-1 , then we just hope for 1 more arrival . That would be better than a no lynch imo

[aptil]

Hey Max when did you have a town read on Apricity?

[aptil]

That's it

[aptil]

I shot JJ .

[aptil]

WTF Who kills jjjjh here!?!?

Also, I'll be hanging out with Cheeto at Kingsmeet, so I guess I don't have to tell him I'll be V/LA?

You're clearly not reading the thread anyways .

[aptil]

VOTE: Maxwell

[aptil]

So the only night kill is JJ, which the supposed 1 shot big claims.

If there's a town roleblocker he needs to claim and reveal who he blocked.

Otherwise not looking good for Aptil in my opinion.

Well i did what was planned . Obviously after the scum sees stuff like that in open they would counter it.

[aptil]

Since this is my third game here, I'm not familiar with the mechanics.

Is scum often allowed to not kill?

Allowed to, Yes

Or could scum have targeted JJ also, so it would look bad for Aptil.

Scum could have targeted JJ too, yes

Also, Aptil claimed he shot JJ. Would Aptil get confirmation from the Mod that his kill was successful?

Aptil wouldn't know if it was successful or not unless there was a mod rule that any x-shot abilities have a shot returned if it's roleblocked.

Aptil, was your shot returned?

What does shot returned mean ? I got the mod message saying action received . That's it .

[aptil]

It's hard for me to believe that scum is not on that jj wagon yesterday .We have Raya flipped innocent and now Gamma. The people who hopped on to me later on when Frog switched i think are the best bets for the scum team . Maxwell/Ari scum team .
VOTE: Maxwell

[aptil]

VOTE: aptil

What does shot returned mean?

[aptil]

Who the fuck is my partner now ?

[aptil]

Fuck off dude . You should have lynched me anyways yesterday .

[aptil]

Fuck off dude . You should have lynched me anyways yesterday .

then why did you not agree to it?

I don't agree to it today as well. You could have gone ahead you didn't need my permission to lynch me. You made your decision looks like you can't clear my slot with whatever flips or other information . Your whole this is townbloc is pretty much bull shit in my opinion and you will see that soon enough i guess . I'm going to make one more post to clear out why i think MAx is scum and then i'm done enjoy the game.

[aptil]

I don't have enough townreads rn.
Apricity is actually edging up there because of other slots I don't like.

Gamma: I know you're a shitposter but are you even trying here man? Where's the hunting, c'mon.
Raya's Gamma vote post bothered me too, though. Like, catching up and agreeing with something. Anything else?
My reads change every day I look at this game I swear. My TR on aptil isnt as great as it was before but I still have a hard time seeing Twoface scumpartner aptil making a post like 390

VOTE: jjh
This is fine. P sure Gamma can at least attempt to scumhunt as scum so I'm calling that null for now
That's L-2 for jjh.

Calls me town .Also has apricity creeping towards scum .

Actually no nevermind Gamma is worse than Ari, I do like Ari's reads more than Gammas even if Im not satisfied w either
VOTE: Gamma

I'm going to sleep now so won't be here for deadline. What're we doing lynch-wise, where does my vote need to be.
Can we still do Gamma? Cause I'll lend my vote to a Fr99er/jjh decision.

Thinks jjh is town by this point and votes gamma and also will wait for Frp/jjh decision while telling us he will go to sleep . So doesn't take part in decision coz he will be sleeping .

Id much rather lynch someone that's viable and not a townread. (So anyone not in Frog/jjh/Apricity/Varsoon)

VOTE: aptil
Night

IS back just after Fro has voted for me . All of sudden has apricity as his town and will vote for me . When did his stance change ? No one knows probably no one cares as i doubt half of you have read the thread .Asked him a couple of times about this but stalled to say would answer it today and still no answer . His oppurtunistic flips both on my wagon and jj's he was always ready to pounce . There is no way in hell that this guy isn't scum at this point .

[aptil]

I don't agree to it today as well. You could have gone ahead you didn't need my permission to lynch me. You made your decision looks like you can't clear my slot with whatever flips or other information . Your whole this is townbloc is pretty much bull shit in my opinion and you will see that soon enough i guess . I'm going to make one more post to clear out why i think MAx is scum and then i'm done enjoy the game.

so vote me

Why ? Because you're a bad town player ?

[aptil]

so try again

vote me

I'm voting who i think scum why should i vote you this is so dumb . Like in what world does you being scum help you to unvote jj at L-1 when there was enough doubt over other players like me/gamma . Why not just try to end it there ? Why would you try to solve the other situation from there ? Don't think you're scum so i'm not voting you.

[aptil]

Fuck off dude . You should have lynched me anyways yesterday .

then why did you not agree to it?

I don't agree to it today as well.

That's not answering my question.

If we should have lynched you yesterday, why did you not agree to it?

I don't need to agree to my lynch you could have lynched me . What i mean by saying you should have lynched me yesterday is the fact that you're not able to clear me anyways, you're helping with another mislynch .So if that was the case and you could not read me you should have cleared my slot yesterday even after my claim because you can't seem to move away from this slot .

[aptil]

VOTE: aptil

What does shot returned mean?

Can you answer this ?

[aptil]

I read up

Nothing happened

What does a shot returned mean ?

[aptil]

I was in soft-prod range!
PoE says Ari has a good shot of being scum still
VOTE: Aristophanes

You were going to explain your Apricity read today . What happened to that ?

[aptil]

To me, scum is almost certainly on the Raya wagon, out of Fro99er, aptil, MaxwellPuckett, Bomberman, and Havo.
Which makes my skin crawl that we colorflipped Penguin instead of one of those suspects, and it drives my paranoia more because fro99er lead that push for the colorflip.

Bomber and Havo came at the last minute to just put the lynch through. Max was the one who changed from Gamma to me to Raya to make sure the lynch went through.

[aptil]

I feel like there's 2 guys pushing this game in certain directions, if you read thru the thread it's sticks out like a sore thumb, but those 2 guys have been heavily TR by almost everyone.

So it's almost Taboo to bring them up.

No it's not . Why are you afraid to bring them up ?

[aptil]

I think Aptil is the best lynch at the moment.

I've never played mafia where scum could choose not to night kill, so that throws me off. So Aptil's claim is super fishy to me. Because it came to get the lynch wagon off of him.

IF I were scum I would never skip a night kill. Just like when I'm town I will never choose to No lynch. Just not in my psyche to do so. Goes against everything I know about mafia.

Aptil has been heavy read as Scummy by a lot of people, myself included, so at this time I think Aptil is the best lynch.

That's where I'm at for now.

It's not fairly uncommon for scum to hold their kill at night on this site. Tactically speaking it's not such a disadvantage for them , one more kill last night would have been just one mislynch and MyLo but with significantly lesser pool to play there , i would have been mostly cleared in that scenario and people would look elsewhere even today.
Now they have one more chance suspect in me which is keeping the game stale as we are still working out issues from yesterday and not moving on. My sense is they were betting on me getting lynched today quickly so that they one mislynch to LyLo with more paranoia and less time to play with .

[aptil]

I feel like there's 2 guys pushing this game in certain directions, if you read thru the thread it's sticks out like a sore thumb, but those 2 guys have been heavily TR by almost everyone.

So it's almost Taboo to bring them up.

No it's not . Why are you afraid to bring them up ?

I brought them up, Frog and Max.

I mean go after them or grill them.

[aptil]

I don't see Max controlling game flow that much, though I definitely see it in the case of Fro99er.
Where do you see Max pushing direction of the game a lot?

I could swing an Aptil lynch, too, since they're in my pool of suspects, though I'd kick myself in the ass forever if they flip town because scum making us lynch our own vig is definitely what they'd want if Aptil is town.

Max always comes in right behind Frog and agrees with him and basically sheeps him.

Aptil claimed 1 shot Vig, so even if he were telling the truth, he has already taken his shot.

Basically i'm a VT at this point but that doesn't mean i should be lynched as i have nothing to do in the night phase of this game.I have been pretty active to try and solve this game. If i'm your top suspect fair enough but that's because of the nightkill and which really has nothing to do with me.

If you were reading me as scum before today can you point those posts out to me ?

Pedit:@Havo: Can you at least see the Max case i put out a few pages ago

[aptil]

Aptil, you said you didn't get a shot in yes? Roleblocked of the sort? Try again. Shoot someone you think is scum because I'm not gonna direct your shot and give you something to pin the blame on in the case you're scum.

When did I say that? I didn't get a message that my shot has returned. Didn't know that can happen. Only got the message from Cheeto that my action is received and then when the day started saw my shot is dead. So I claimed the hit. As far as I know my shot is gone .

[aptil]

I've already stated my stance, which is a bit at-odds with Havo who would lead lynches away from my pool of suspects.

VOTE: Havo
I'll stand by this.

We're better off with Frog alive. Tomorrow, we color flip him and have him check someone who isn't him. If he's town, that gives us the best info, imo. If he's scum, we'll at least have associatives.

So you're saying I'm a better lynch than Apricity or April or Ari?

You'd rather lynch someone who's trying to game solve than someone who's not?

I reject the idea that I'm not trying to game solve.

[aptil]

I already have put my case out on Maxwell. No one either saw it or have seen and not react on it . It's pretty to similar to what you're saying and I reacted to your post and said why you should look at Max instead of Havo.

[aptil]

Bomber is easier.
Been townreading him since the whole d1 jjh vote thing and its gone up and down since then.

In hindsight he should actually be higher than Apricity tbh, who doesnt look as towny as I remember just as I looked through her post.

You were going to explain why you were reading Apricity as town and you look at her again and come up with this.

[aptil]

at this point I've eliminated max and bomber. If it's them it's GG town anyway I think.

I don't like this at all. This guy is giving a free pass to Max because of an assumption which at best is a reach anyways.

[aptil]

at this point I've eliminated max and bomber. If it's them it's GG town anyway I think.

I don't like this at all. This guy is giving a free pass to Max because of an assumption which at best is a reach anyways.

aptil please explain how my investigation was a reach

Wow your post about him being clear because of your investigation came later. This post was about your work on the page 62 where you did the vote analysis based on assumptions and then calling this team and saying gg already even when a few of us suspect one of the guys in that and are going after him.

Also your investigation clears him how , as far as you have claimed to know if somebody's colour is changed .So you checked Max night 1 , we all know now that scum targeted jj on that night so they must have remained unchanged from the colour they started if that is your reason to believe Max is certainly town then i don't agree with that either.

[aptil]

I have several good reasons for sheeping frog
VOTE: aptil
And while youre here can u talk about what convinced you Havo is town?

This isn't opportunistic as fuck at all you know.

[aptil]

vote : Aptil

You're scum dude.

Posts :

389/390/517/518/542/714/

lol

[aptil]

It's also becoming obvious that scum has fooled us quite well so far as no one has any solid scum reads.

So that makes me think my reads must be wrong. As is a lot of people's apparently.

I think it's too much of a coincidence for this to be the case. So scum must be pretty good.

So that makes me wonder about Varsoon and Frog that much more.

let me just have this here Havo. When i get lynched you can look back at your own comment and start re-evaluating.

[aptil]

This is just fucking sad . Fucking absolutely day2 all over again just this time i'm actually getting lynched.

[aptil]

Please vote for Max here , there is no way that guy is not scum. Promises reads and just goes away and comes back to sheep Mr Frog and he's just repeating it again today.

[aptil]

Go ahead and lynch me aristo. Please for take a look at jj wagon because that's where the scum is . You have been looking at the wrong direction all along. Good luck.

[aptil]

It's also becoming obvious that scum has fooled us quite well so far as no one has any solid scum reads.

So that makes me think my reads must be wrong. As is a lot of people's apparently.

I think it's too much of a coincidence for this to be the case. So scum must be pretty good.

So that makes me wonder about Varsoon and Frog that much more.

let me just have this here Havo. When i get lynched you can look back at your own comment and start re-evaluating.

I just spent the last 2 and a half hours reading the thread and taking notes.

I'm good. But thx.

Well what can i say i openly tried to stay away from noface wagon coz scum like to come out in open. I cleared bomber on a derp clear which is looking good as the game goes along and whatever you're calling me scum for is just nonsense.

Till the point you thought you were getting me lynched you were agreeing with me and now all of a sudden but thanks that was pretty disappointing. Do you not read max as scum ?

[aptil]

See, here's where you would be calling me scum if you were actually town.

Instead of asking my thoughts on Max.

Already lynched but not necessarily coz i have read the whole game unlike a few others.

[aptil]

Good game. I was thinking about the kill choice yesterday but in the end it worked out so that's great.

[aptil]

Almost forgot. Thanks Chetts for the game . Loved the flavour and mechanics would like to play this setup again for sure.