Fallout Mafia - Commonwealth Edition (Day 8)

[Ankamius]

Spoiler:

Okay, here's my reads and efforting.

Ankamius + Kaede Akamatsu

-

Conftown

- Duh, I know I'm town and Kaede is mod-confirmed town.

Ouroboros

-

Strong Town

- I don't see this slot being scum. My initial townread was due to having very similar thoughts through a lot of the early-mid day one, but I've been noticing that whenever RC takes a step back and analyzes without his ego getting in the way, he's still having thought processes that feel like he's trying to solve the game. I think scum-RC would have played some of these moments a bit differently and caused subtle differences in the game that would ripple into a different game state. Altogether, while he

does

have an agenda (it's fucking RC, of course he has an agenda), it doesn't feel like he's trying to run cartwheels around everybody or taking all the effort to fake his thoughts. I don't think scum-him would feel like he needs to. The only reason this isn't locktown is because I still have some lingering weird vibes from some of Ghost's posting and I wasn't altogether very impressed by our brief engagement earlier. It's not strong enough to be worth worrying about, but it's something to keep in mind if RC starts looking less town in the future. (plus I think I'm one of the people that

can

read RC accurately... when I get a read at all anyways).

Impossibear

-

Strong Town

- Similarly, I don't see this slot flipping scum either. I haven't agreed with a lot of the things ETL has said so far in the game, but I still think that her thoughts come from a town mindset rather than a scum one. Her engagements have looked really town too. Jingle is somewhat similar, anytime I get a read from anything he's stated, it's leaning towards town. This read isn't super easy to explain since a lot of it comes down to general tone and trajectories, but it's been consistent enough that I don't believe this read is going to change unless something drastic happens.

Nero Cain/projectmatt

-

Strong Town

- Nero Cain is a weird one; I think the best way for me to read Nero Cain is that the more we disagree on things, the more he's town. And... well, I disagreed on close to everything he's said. His posts have felt icky, but... not scum-motivated icky. I think the way he entered the game and engaged with my then-strongest townread would have pinged me if he was scum. projectmatt I'm more confident about; I think the two of us are similar in how we get reads, or at least it seems that way because a lot of the thoughts he has (and I'm not counting the mechanics debate posts) just makes sense to me. Plus, the way he handled the engagement with RC's case on him felt like he was engaging a townread to try to help them refine their reads rather than just remove/deflect the scumread, if that makes sense? I don't feel like his entire approach to the game comes from scum.

hebichan/OnTheMark

-

Town

- I'm willing to trust Jingle on this one, I think. His reads are still way off (like I think his scumreads are just those who resisted the dave wagon?), but that's null. If something crazy happens, I'll revisit this slot.

Alchemist21

-

Town

- I think this slot has been looking better despite the holder being relatively inactive lately; I'm willing to admit I might be wrong on the early posts being scum-indicative and there's been some posts he's had that I actually really like for town. Plus after some time and distance from the engagement we had, it doesn't look quite as bad to me as it used to. Not impossible that this is still scum but I think that's fairly unlikely right now.

Wraith

-

Town

- It doesn't show up super often, but when Wraith's posting looks town, it looks

really

town. The recent posts from him are giving me that same feeling, so I'm a lot less convinced that it was a case of strong-entrance-into-coasting-scum, just a town with a strong entrance that continues to keep up that string when he tries.

verylazy/Kokichi Oma

-

Lightly Town

- I think my reason for calling Kokichi town isn't really as strong now as I used to, but still kind of town indicative. Most of my hesitation is solely because I've only ever seen Kokichi as scum. Shrug. verylazy could have gone either way, he was null for a lot of the day for me for pretty good reason.

REALMEN ONLY JUNGLE

-

Lightly Town

/Null

- I don't really know how to judge this slot. I somewhat remember thinking this slot was town, but I can't remember any

reason

to townread this slot. Could just be null and I'd feel about the same about this slot I think. I think this can be sorted for sure later on (assuming this player stays, I'll just reset on this slot if it gets replaced)

MariaR + Dunnstral

-

Sort Later/Likely Town

- I still think Dunnstral is independently scummy, but my townread on MariaR is just strong enough to trust that her investigation is both true and accurate. Not much I want to say about this beyond it, I'll revisit if both of these slots are around for too long.

Wilky + davesaz + Tchill13/punreader

-

PoE Scumreads

- I remember very little of Wilky; a lot of his posts haven't given me vibes either way outside of his early posts looking really scummy. davesaz is always hard to read for me but I haven't seen a whole lot of reason to townread him? Overall pretty much null. Tchill13 was very scummy... but I want to see what punreader does to see if they can reverse my read.

Ramcius

-

Scum

- Consistently having scummy posts, mainly. I don't think his entire approach or play comes from town here.

In conclusion

Ramcius is my pick for scum.
Wilky is probably second pick pending other slots being resorted.
davesaz/Tchill13slot can go either way, but it's more likely the third scum is here than anywhere else.

If scum is not in that list, then it's probably REALMEN? Maybe Kokichi.

If scum is STILL not contained in the above, then I am giving someone a pass that I shouldn't. Very likely within MariaR/Dunnstral.

Ankamius

Kaede Akamatsu

Ouroboros
Impossibear

projectmatt

OnTheMark

Alchemist21

Wraith

Kokichi Oma
REALMEN ONLY JUNGLE

MariaR

Dunnstral

Wilky
davesaz
Punreader

YT#########

[Ankamius]

I'm actually a bit afraid that just about every flip since I made that list has been in my d2 townreads.

[Ankamius]

The main thing about dunn is that matt was also hardcore tunneling him until MariaR softcleared him

[Ankamius]

Who did Math block.

Honestly, likely me, given OnTheMark's last indicated posting was asking Ankamius if it would be bad to block me.

I'm going to correct this since it really confused me

OTM asked Kaede, not me.

[Ankamius]

VOTE: davesaz

[Ankamius]

nope

RC would not have tracked OTM

[Ankamius]

like ramcius is town I'm more and more sure
I'm town
Kaede is town
OTM is town - all 3 obvious
Dunnstral maybe scum but townlean

scum are not voting here. wraith is playing to survive the day phase. scum are not going to bus so if town has bad reads town is going to lose.

yup PM is scum, but we established that a while back I think.

[Ankamius]

I'm not convinced

sorry

[Ankamius]

1. onthemark is a dumb check
2. it's more believable for a miller that has no presence to be alive indefinitely than a miller with no presence and an investigative role claim
3. otm is blatantly the biggest threat to you by far after mariar's lynch

[Ankamius]

like

it was discussed a while back how it was very likely that at least one investigative claim was scum

throwing mariar and matt under the bus, both of which were heavily scumread slots, is entirely reasonable

it makes this claim of yours more believable

having two scum lynches in a row makes town more likely to be confident in the conclusion that you're conftown

it's not rocket science to see why this isn't as believable as you think it is

[Ankamius]

then why wasn't OTM checked

[Ankamius]

like

go into the neighborhood and SHOW ME what went into the projectmatt check instead of the OTM check

RC is not an idiot

if OTM was the only correct check, then RC would need a damn good reason to not go for it

[Ankamius]

Ank, Ram, and alchemist need my attention too.

I appreciate that several townies have decided that rushing to martyr me is a bad idea.

A couple days to work on these reads would be nice, please and thanks.

I can't, under any circumstance, see a scum motive behind making a statement like this. This smacks of being town to me all day, because I can't ever see scum defending several players that were on their lynch wagon as being town in one post when their back is against the wall. Why would scum ever make a statement like this?

I also can't fathom why davesaz made so many townreads when he was a lynch target. What scum motive could possibly be behind his play?

it's easy:

I'm just waiting for this game to become fun for myself again at this point.
Pedit: I don't understand that vote

Well I can't get Kokichi today, I'd rather lynch Wraith than Dave, I townread dave and tchill

Why Tchi?
Why is Wraith scum?

I don't have good reasons for Wraith, I'm just joining the wagon. Tchill's claim was towny, and I haven't seen a reason to jump at them from their play

Disagree on Tchi can you read Wraith and give me your thoughts.

Finally some god dam interaction up in here.
Pedit: It's not as black and white as you're presenting it to be Math

Yes. It is.

There is no other protective or they would claim.

If another protective exists it is scum. Too much power rule.

Since there is no other town protective then it’s literally scum shot ETL or Dave did the kill.

That is it.

I don't see dave's play as scummy or the type of player to fake claim miller he's very laid back with his play and drawing a light to himself with the miller claim is very ? I don't get why he'd do that. I don't want to throw my dave tr out the window when we don't have all the facts in play and just lynching dave is the easy play

projectmatt was also heavily pushing against the davesaz-lynch-via-mechanics push by OTM

[Ankamius]

imagine you have a scumteam of three players

one of which is a good scum player and is a sinking ship because of it on top of his predecessor's play
one of which is a claimed investigative and is also a sinking ship, also with general suspicion that there's an investigative that is scum due to setup
one of which has a pseudo-guilty and is a sinking ship

the second is put into a spot where they're very likely to be confscum
the first is unlikely to make it more than a couple days

now

assuming that davesaz is confirmed joining the neighborhood, then there's a choice

1. try to clear both davesaz and mariar
2. sacrifice mariar to clear davesaz

here's the issue

mariar is far more likely to be caught than davesaz due to the setup.
punreader is competent at setup spec, which was

proven

on day two by dead town.
punreader cannot be directly killed.

therefore, it's risky to try to clear mariar to the end of the game.

NOW

if

davesaz

is solo cleared

then his role by itself isn't scum-indicative by itself
the pseudo-guilty is vague enough to not be scum-indicative by itself
it's a lot easier to accept one mostly-scumread slot being cleared than two
it's a lot less weird that one 'conftown' reaches lylo than two

it makes sense if you really think about it

[Ankamius]

I think if projectmatt masterminded whatever happened in the neighborhood and is as competent as is claimed, then I think he would have predicted how clearing both mariar and davesaz would turn out

if anything, having a strong scum player be around for that makes it

MORE

likely that this happened, because it takes some thought to reach this play

[Ankamius]

Well there IS the fact about the double miller thing usually being 2 town millers by mod meta, this was heavily discussed day 1, but then if dave is scum he's either a true miller or is fake claiming, neither make sense with the flip of the bodyswapper. Im getting more and more confused how early play fits in all this.

what makes fakeclaim nonsensical?

[Ankamius]

That being said Ank, if you're scum you're in the same dilemma where you need to survive on your own until LyLo and disrupting potential correct town blocs forming is one way to do it.
OTOH, if you're town it makes sense for you to not want scum to be in a potential town bloc and wanna cover all your bases.

I think this day's gonna turn out more interesting than I thought.

the time to disrupt correct town blocs was 2 or 3 days ago

not now

[Ankamius]

Well there IS the fact about the double miller thing usually being 2 town millers by mod meta, this was heavily discussed day 1, but then if dave is scum he's either a true miller or is fake claiming, neither make sense with the flip of the bodyswapper. Im getting more and more confused how early play fits in all this.

what makes fakeclaim nonsensical?

Why come out of the gate fake claiming miller? there was no guarantee a 2nd miller would exist.

it was probably part of a fakeclaim the scumteam were given

it's more likely true if the roles were considered finalized among the scumteam before the game began (or at least who would have what)

[Ankamius]

That being said Ank, if you're scum you're in the same dilemma where you need to survive on your own until LyLo and disrupting potential correct town blocs forming is one way to do it.
OTOH, if you're town it makes sense for you to not want scum to be in a potential town bloc and wanna cover all your bases.

I think this day's gonna turn out more interesting than I thought.

the time to disrupt correct town blocs was 2 or 3 days ago

not now

Then what's your path to autowin?

Assume for a moment that davesaz is town, you need to ensure we eventually lynch scum by avoiding lynching town.

Assume for a moment that davesaz is town, you need to ensure we eventually lynch scum by avoiding lynching town.

Or better yet assume that davesaz was lynched and flipped town, we would be on day 6, let's say scum shot me or something to prevent having conf town around.
And proceed from there to answer the question.

can you rephrase this? I don't understand what you're asking me

[Ankamius]

kaede

that's a very difficult question for me to answer because it's very likely I'll be locktowning people as time goes on

I'm much much stronger lategame than I am early game, even if I haven't been very strong before that

[Ankamius]

I'm stepping up, aren't I?

[Ankamius]

I honestly still think that only clearing davesaz is still less risky than trying to clear mariar as well

remember, all three slots were having increased levels of suspicion on them throughout day two

something drastic has to happen if a scumteam with those players in it are going to survive

[Ankamius]

(strongman could have been used on rc night 2

[Ankamius]

huh?

[Ankamius]

thsat doesn't mean there wasn't a pseudo guilty, it means that it wasn't guilty after all

[Ankamius]

my kb is broken so I have to come back later

[Ankamius]

what

[Ankamius]

because the projectmatt action claim is the relevant part here, not whatever you did night 3

[Ankamius]

there's an easier solution.
if he's town his hood should yield correct tracks now with MariaR gone, no?

no

it's permanently compromised

[Ankamius]

Ouroboros, Deacon,

Commonwealth Limited Neighborizer Conditional Shared Tracker

, was killed Night 2.

Spoiler: Role PM

Deacon

Welcome to Fallout Mafia - Commonwealth Edition!

You are

Deacon (

Commonwealth Limited Neighborizer Conditional Shared Tracker

)

.

Master of disguise, Deacon works as a member of Railroad to free the runaway synths.

---

Abilities:

• Recruit:
  During the night, you may recruit a player to your neighborhood. You can only invite up to two members. If for any reason one of your member dies, you may recruit again up to the maximum members.
  
• Railroad:
  Recruiting a member awards you with 1-shot track for the neighborhood. This ability is a shared ability and the majority of the neighborhood must agree to a target. Recruiting the member of the
  Institute
  will permanently compromise this ability and you will get "no visit" result for all investigations, regardless of your target's actual actions.

---

Win Condition

• Eliminate all who are sided with the
  Institute

Day 3 deadline: (expired on 2018-06-09 23:05:14)

Ouroboros received a quest to help out the settlements!

[Ankamius]

UNVOTE: davesaz

fine

I'll go back to doing nothing

[Ankamius]

imagine you have a scumteam of three players

one of which is a good scum player and is a sinking ship because of it on top of his predecessor's play
one of which is a claimed investigative and is also a sinking ship, also with general suspicion that there's an investigative that is scum due to setup
one of which has a pseudo-guilty and is a sinking ship

the second is put into a spot where they're very likely to be confscum
the first is unlikely to make it more than a couple days

now

assuming that davesaz is confirmed joining the neighborhood, then there's a choice

1. try to clear both davesaz and mariar
2. sacrifice mariar to clear davesaz

here's the issue

mariar is far more likely to be caught than davesaz due to the setup.
punreader is competent at setup spec, which was

proven

on day two by dead town.
punreader cannot be directly killed.

therefore, it's risky to try to clear mariar to the end of the game.

NOW

if

davesaz

is solo cleared

then his role by itself isn't scum-indicative by itself
the pseudo-guilty is vague enough to not be scum-indicative by itself
it's a lot easier to accept one mostly-scumread slot being cleared than two
it's a lot less weird that one 'conftown' reaches lylo than two

it makes sense if you really think about it

[Ankamius]

That being said Ank, if you're scum you're in the same dilemma where you need to survive on your own until LyLo and disrupting potential correct town blocs forming is one way to do it.
OTOH, if you're town it makes sense for you to not want scum to be in a potential town bloc and wanna cover all your bases.

I think this day's gonna turn out more interesting than I thought.

the time to disrupt correct town blocs was 2 or 3 days ago

not now

Then what's your path to autowin?

kaede

I'm not good at executing scumplans, but I'm also well aware of how disgustingly powerful all-town townblocks are (look at Necromancer mini theme, that game was a near guaranteed town win on day two because of the bloc)

if my scumteam was going down, I'd be looking to solidify my position somewhere sooner rather than later

waiting three entire day phases after the rest of my scumteam goes down and THEN trying to disrupt the townblock doesn't work

[Ankamius]

Assume for a moment that davesaz is town, you need to ensure we eventually lynch scum by avoiding lynching town.

you're town
wilky is town
punreader is town (I know who pun is and I know enough about how they play to be able to state confidently that they don't have the reads they do here as scum, I'd rather not go further into this if I don't absolutely have to)

yt looks a lot better (the question to him was a test, he reacted the way I would've expected town to)
alchemist21 is a stale townread

realmen idk, the confidentish townread on me really bugs me because this game is within my scumrange
kokichi idk, I don't even remember why I was townreading that slot anymore
dunnstral idk, all I remember about this slot is that I could see it being scum with Vent back on day one

davesaz is strong scum

[Ankamius]

did I mention that my case for davesaz doesn't work if there's five scum

if not, there you go, it's mentioned

[Ankamius]

No amount of fake "evidence" is going to change the fact that I'm town.

VOTE: punreader

This is scum making a valiant last ditch effort to mislynch someone, anyone.

VOTE: davesaz

[Ankamius]

idk

the main issue for me is that other than you, all the loud voices are dead

and that leaves everyone else, who had like no presence the past few days

[Ankamius]

and me, I have a lot of posts for someone who did nothing all game

[Ankamius]

do you want me to go into more detail on why pun is town

[Ankamius]

well, technically davesaz basically scumclaimed, I just didn't mention that since I know that's not exactly convincing coming from me in this game

[Ankamius]

alright let's brainstorm then

where are your reads currently at?

[Ankamius]

your scumclaiming

like I said

[Ankamius]

Agree, and the neighborize targets ended up being useful too.

It should be pretty much beyond doubt that if I had been scum with Maria we could have announced OTM's crumbed target and both been cleared. Maria must have thought she could frame me by being the first to reveal the no result. I'm happy that the ramifications of the matt no result swayed enough people to get Maria lynched.

I agree with wanting to hear from JUNGLE before doing much. There is probably a lot of heavy lifting to get remaining scum. Do we think the team is more likely to be 4 or 5? I think it's on the line and could go either way. Possible deep scum here.

We should just lynch dave I guess? I'm not sure. I'll read and decide. Likely one scum left anyway

Only if you're a complete moron.

You know the player this implicates to me?

VOTE: davesaz.

VOTE: punreader

the way this progression happened, mainly

I remember that davesaz' reaction to being suspected for the block thing was a loooooot different than it is here

THIS is pure survivalism

davesaz here isn't coming into this trying to convince people, he's trying to strongarm it

it's a subtle thing, but very real

[Ankamius]

it would ruin the plan if matt wasn't sacrificed, kaede

[Ankamius]

I'd like to be able to finally sort him

[Ankamius]

this game still has a very distinct lack of jungling

[Ankamius]

you could show your innocence by... you know, gamesolving instead of shouting about how town you are

[Ankamius]

Rmoj what is your reads list in order of strength?

[Ankamius]

id never make the nightkills made this game so far as scum. all the named pro towns are dying. means that absolute n00bs are at the wheel and scum got a bad rand

peace out for real

I want this unpacked too

None of these kills were weird to me.

[Ankamius]

tinfoil: RMOJ' quest was legit, but gives scum powers when they're done instead of town, and that's why the information on them completely bombed after the second one.

[Ankamius]

ehhhh

yeah, that pokes a hole in my tinfoil

[Ankamius]

how many fires am I interrupting

[Ankamius]

like

a game state like this and we have two wagonees imploding

it's majestically bad

[Ankamius]

who do we and don't we have claims from even

[Ankamius]

it can't be many that are unclaimed, right?

[Ankamius]

I feel like my tinfoil was ignored

[Ankamius]

kaede is scum

clearly

[Ankamius]

I guess

[Ankamius]

if you're towning me off of me being not a n00b

then listen here buddy

[Ankamius]

if you're towning me off of me being not a n00b

then listen here buddy

nah, pretty sure you’re one of those idiots I called out in my paragraph earlier

but I thought you had enough self respect and fake misplaced ego not to label yourself a n00b

guess I was wrong in that regard

well yeah I'm an idiot

but I'm also a nob

so

[Ankamius]

pun's role is explicitly claimed not weak

[Ankamius]

you'd be surprised rmoj

[Ankamius]

objection

I don't see the part where I start crying in that plan

[Ankamius]

idc either way

[Ankamius]

Muchas gracias!

[Ankamius]

I don't remember him ever having this drastic of a response to being scumread

and I don't think I've ever seen him as scum

[Ankamius]

lo siento, no habla

[Ankamius]

That sounds like a lot of fun tbh

[Ankamius]

So are we doing a mass claim or

[Ankamius]

holy, pun

[Ankamius]

I had an idea to see if there was a possibility that the kills were made because of reads primarily and role secondar...ily, but all I've discovered so far is that Impossibear's EoD1 reads are really hard to get and that apparently their reads were similar to RC's

So much for that idea!

[Ankamius]

YT

again, that argument doesn't work because in that scenario, the entire scumteam is sinking.

[Ankamius]

Titus regularly townreads me as scum with VCA

so

[Ankamius]

I think it's just about inevitable that town will win even if davesaz is somehow town, the only real thing that needs to be kept in mind is that from now on, nightkills are huge sources of info

[Ankamius]

should've trusted me to solve the game instead too

oh wait

[Ankamius]

I don't remember seeing you making any particularly strong push for lynching your scumreads

[Ankamius]

dw kaede it was me all along

[Ankamius]

it would be wouldn't it

[Ankamius]

how much more do we need before just hammering him

[Ankamius]

I like how alchemist21 is a double voter

[Ankamius]

Assume for a moment that davesaz is town, you need to ensure we eventually lynch scum by avoiding lynching town.

you're town
wilky is town
punreader is town (I know who pun is and I know enough about how they play to be able to state confidently that they don't have the reads they do here as scum, I'd rather not go further into this if I don't absolutely have to)

yt looks a lot better (the question to him was a test, he reacted the way I would've expected town to)
alchemist21 is a stale townread

realmen idk, the confidentish townread on me really bugs me because this game is within my scumrange
kokichi idk, I don't even remember why I was townreading that slot anymore
dunnstral idk, all I remember about this slot is that I could see it being scum with Vent back on day one

davesaz is strong scum

yeah let's lynch wilky

better yet, let's follow up by killing punreader tomorrow

then let's do yt

finally alchemist

easy town win, easy

[Ankamius]

davesaz (4):

punreader, Ankamius, REALMEN ONLY JUNGLE, Kaede Akamatsu

wilky (4):

Dunnstral, Alchemist21, Kokichi Oma, YT2980

one of these wagons is more trustworthy than the other

[Ankamius]

when pun and I are both synced for independent reasons, there's a very high chance we're right

[Ankamius]

every other slot in the game has ehhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh reasons to be scum, if any

davesaz makes perfect sense as scum

[Ankamius]

wtf makes wilky make any sense as scum

[Ankamius]

cool

that makes the wagon look even worse!

[Ankamius]

because that means two scum faked investigative roles

and the setup feels really awful without at least one somewhat competent investigative role

and why does wilky claim to be getting blocked all the time when his entire scumteam is sinking, or even claim cop in the first place

shit makes no sense

[Ankamius]

why

if you're going by how useless he's been, then that applies to half the playerlist still alive, if not more

[Ankamius]

is it weird compared to what he's done in the thread beforehand? this is the kind of thing I do sometimes when I'm so apathetic that I just don't really care

[Ankamius]

when the apathy starts is the main one

[Ankamius]

It's me kaede

[Ankamius]

Any scumteam with their salt would plan a bus on me too.

Doesn't mean it happens.

[Ankamius]

Worth*

I hate this phone

[Ankamius]

Btw davesaz thanks for missing my call to TRUST ME to read Punreader. I guarantee you they will kill me before LyLo because otherwise, I'll catch their ass and deathtunnel them, which they absolutely don't want with police academy still fresh.

[Ankamius]

Can we just lynch wilky. Hes being lynched today or tomorrow anyway

Was this really a post that was made or did I dream that?

[Ankamius]

Kaede my thought process around the pjm lynch are easy to see if you look.

I'll probably explain it anyways I guess

[Ankamius]

Complacent town could lose this. It would be a tragedy to let it slip away after stomping so hard up to this point.

This made me laugh

yeah that was great

[Ankamius]

hey I'll say something really funny too

I hate it when people do nothing for most of the game and then think their reads are worth shit

hahahahahahaha

[Ankamius]

can we lynch dave now

[Ankamius]

oh good

maybe the torture is over now

[Ankamius]

joke's on me, that's L-1

the torture isn't over yet

[Ankamius]

yay it's christmas

[Ankamius]

good morning

[Ankamius]

fucked if I know

I think it's time to put the tryhard pants on

I'll reread day one sometime between today nad the end of tomorrow

[Ankamius]

is it relevant at all that the way the quest announcements are different all the time or is it just GIF being weird

[Ankamius]

or scum were confident they wouldn't be targeted

[Ankamius]

I'm okay with it, tbh I don't really care either way

[Ankamius]

<---- Moe Cronin, Vanilla

[Ankamius]

Beetlejuice is a bad tell

[Ankamius]

is it time to horrify everyone with vca yet

[Ankamius]

well tbf

I probably won't post my results here anyways so you get a free not-getting-horrified

you're welcome

[Ankamius]

so I looked at some VCs for a bit and this is already starting to stand out big time

VOTE: Kokichi Oma

[Ankamius]

YT2980, be very careful about your points early in the game about the miller claims or how to play out the game at that point

It's a very easy way for scum to pick up townpoints (this is where my initial scumread on Alchemist21 came from and how I fell for townreading MariaR early on) without actually helping the game forward since it's all stuff that

someone

will eventually throw out there.

[Ankamius]

YT2980, be very careful about your points early in the game about the miller claims or how to play out the game at that point

It's a very easy way for scum to pick up townpoints (this is where my initial scumread on Alchemist21 came from and how I fell for townreading MariaR early on) without actually helping the game forward since it's all stuff that

someone

will eventually throw out there.

or I could start using my brain

it doesn't help the game forward because it doesn't actually give concrete direction to go off of, it's just vagueness that looks good at a glance.

[Ankamius]

correct in one, YT

[Ankamius]

UNVOTE: Kokichi Oma

[Ankamius]

Because it's l-1 and the day isn't ready to be over yet

[Ankamius]

yay the ate gambit

[Ankamius]

The whole game my main reason for Townreading Ank has been early interactions with me, and lately it’s been bugging my paranoia that she’s been off everyone’s radar so much that it became a joke to say she’s last scum.

Kaede had issues with some of the things I did but never really engaged me on them when I offered to explain them

so idk

[Ankamius]

but the reason nobody's really been having me on their radar is because nobody's really been caring enough to have reads to be paranoid about

I don't think anybody's especially townreading me except YT at this point? Maaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaybe Pun?

[Ankamius]

regarding Pun, I'll need to see that analysis they're promising in order to have them resorted for the day.

I'm looking for something very specific that would confscum them to me.

[Ankamius]

Anyways

I think this game is very close to solved

I just need... I believe two more locktown reads (I currently have two) and I'll be able to PoE out the last scum.

Hindsight is giving me a lot of insight into how scum have been playing a lot of the game. I honestly might be able to pick the last scum out just from reading through the first and part of the second day, but I'm not confident enough in that yet.

I would suggest being very wary about mechanic townreads, though.

[Ankamius]

I might need help to iron the PoE reads out, it's legitimately disturbing me that four of them are anywhere between light/moderate and moderate/strong scumreads. Only one isn't, and that's a near dead null read

[Ankamius]

Although I guess on second thought, the null read wouldn't really make sense as scum with how I'm seeing the way the game played out? Not having any traceable scum trajectory with or without the other flipped scum is looking like a pretty strong towntell right now.

[Ankamius]

Yeah that vote count is pretty consistent with my reads

[Ankamius]

You shouldn't be making statements like that if you're going to make assumptions like that

[Ankamius]

Tell me this Dunn what would scum me benefit from L-1ing Dave who was definitely mislynch bait whilst saying he'd flip town? Surely a scum wilky would try push a lynch elsewhere and leave Dave for that mylo/lylo.

I'm almost wanting to locktown this because of how blatantly scummy it is

[Ankamius]

oh

I was going to ISO wilky after work

welp

[Ankamius]

are you scumclaiming

[Ankamius]

unvote before Kokichi self-hammers

[Ankamius]

I'll get to that tomorrow, sorry

Distractions

[Ankamius]

I've never seen it myself, but self-hammering as town is something I could see him doing

[Ankamius]

I'm also going to hardclaim miller here and the miller has a flavour name too so i'd like to put the question to dave on what's the flavour name of your miller role.

Until then
VOTE: Davesaz

I would totally be willing to but just to clear things up a little the only thing I want is the name given specifically to the miller part under abilities which should be the same for both of us.

I mean I brought up the flavour thing and even pointed to which part of the PM it is contained within. As scum I wouldn't know that information if everyone wants me to claim first then that's fine by me.

I was also working off the assumption that there would only be 1 miller tbh and was aiming to catch dave out already but going by what's been said 2 millers is something the mod would definitely do so i'm now beginning to believe both me and dave are millers here.

looking back, this kind of feels like the third post was the entire goal of the counterclaim in the first place. The way he goes about this claim doesn't match up across all these posts.

It's a lot stronger of a possibility if one of the other scum had a pretty significant chunk of experience with GiF setups, but it still feels off regardless.

[Ankamius]

So we're just assuming that safe claims are given now?

The tone behind this is also different from every post before this.

[Ankamius]

No I actually explicitly don't think that safe claims were given since giffles didn't last game

: I think that your role is actually miller but you're scum and that the role PM is something memey about you being a miller despite being scum.

That's also such, such, such a scummy reaction.

WE'RE LYNCHING BUGS BUNNY BOYS EASY GAME.

This makes me wonder a bit, actually.

The scumteam might not have been given full fakeclaims, only flavor fakeclaims.

This... changes things a bit.

[Ankamius]

What exactly are you saying the goal of the 3rd post was? Was it to get flavor info?

To solidify that there are two town millers.

[Ankamius]

How doesn't it?

[Ankamius]

No like I'm actually not literally 100% certain Wilky is scum. I've repeatedly asked for you to engage with me on it where I didn't for Vent because I can be persuaded here.
I made my points, asked for thoughts on it, you just got mad at me for leading the playerlist when today I've been doing so solely through strength of reasoning rather than character.

I think Wilky scum makes a shitton of sense in the gamestate particularly given Ventriloquist's approach to the slot, but like I'm open to persuading
You've made no effort to actually push Wilky scum besides to say that they're locktown because of flavor, which is... bad reasoning

And wilky, your defense keeps coming down to whether or not scum have fakeclaims and arguments that don't address the case at all so, meh.

Is it not possible Tchill has a jester role of some sort? Not suggesting an insta win but I don't see how his claim could be helpful to town otherwise.

It wouldn't surprise me if Wilky has done research and is relying on the miller claim because he realises the host has done this before, especially since he chose to highlight that it wasn't far fetched for there to be 2 millers again. As Alchemist said though, this is relying on some pretty niche assumptions so I'm not buying it just yet.

hahahahahahahaha

[Ankamius]

idk

that's not necessarily true or untrue just from that by itself, it depends on how GiF made the role PMs

[Ankamius]

I didn't really go thorugh a lot of the post-earlygame stuff since it's a bunch of fluff followed by role stuff

but based on what I looked at, it's sketchy as fuck at least

[Ankamius]

but yes 5467 was really scummy, specifically the part I quoted

[Ankamius]

Ankamius at the very least can fully vouch for my absence being known.

This is correct

[Ankamius]

Kokichi for 500 for not reading the game, please

[Ankamius]

I dreamed that it made a lot of sense for YT to be the last scum

I don't know why

[Ankamius]

I'm sorry guys

work has been brutalizing me (55 hours worked the past week and I still have quite a few days before I have a day off), so I haven't been in the mood to really put my head in the grinder and work things out.

I'll be able to do more day seven

[Ankamius]

eh

[Ankamius]

I think I need to start from scratch again

Sigh

[Ankamius]

Spoiler:

Kaede Akamatsu

MariaR

Ouroboros

Wraith

Nero Cain

hebichan
Impossibear (EspeciallyTheLies + Jingle)

Dunnstral

davesaz

REALMEN ONLY JUNGLE

Ventriloquist

verylazy

Wilky

Alchemist21

Tchill12
Ramcius

ManWithNoName

UNVOTE: Ventriloquist
VOTE: ManWithNoName

Kaede Akamatsu

MariaR

Nero Cain

Impossibear (EspeciallyTheLies + Jingle)
Ouroboros

hebichan

Ramcius
Wilky

REALMEN ONLY JUNGLE

verylazy

Wraith

Dunnstral

davesaz
Alchemist21

ManWithNoName

Ventriloquist

Tchill12

I think this is roughly where I'm at now; I'd kind of like to hammer more of these into place since this game has gotten really hard to read over the past ten or so pages.

Kaede Akamatsu

MariaR

----- Probably way lower now, I honestly don't remember where the strength came from now that I haven't seen anything of her in forever (even as far back as the last 1/3 or so of day one)

Nero Cain

projectmatt

----- Matt hasn't changed this readstrength at all, very likely town

Impossibear (EspeciallyTheLies + Jingle)

----- Still town

Ouroboros

----- Still town

hebichan

OnTheMark

----- Down a bit, some of their posting has been scummy
Ramcius ----- Scummier for early-day posting
Wilky ----- ...not sure

REALMEN ONLY JUNGLE ----- Feeling a little better about this slot? Not super confident about it

verylazy

Kokichi Oma

----- Moderate town or so

Wraith

----- idr, his early posting was very good but he's went downhill since then
Dunnstral ----- scum

davesaz

----- idk, roughly same I guess

Alchemist21

----- light town

ManWithNoName

Ventriloquist

Tchill12 ----- who the fuck

I think this is roughly where I'm at now; I'd kind of like to hammer more of these into place since this game has gotten really hard to read over the past ten or so pages.

Kaede Akamatsu

projectmatt

Impossibear
Ouroboros

Kokichi Oma

Alchemist21

REALMEN ONLY JUNGLE

MariaR

- ?

Wilky - ?

davesaz

Wraith

- ?

OnTheMark

- ?
Ramcius

Tchill12 - ?
Dunnstral

I think I can work with this. Question marks are PoIs that I'm not entirely sure about.

I'm going to need to take a long hard look at Punreader again to make sure that townread is as reasonable as it sounds.

[Ankamius]

I'll look at VCs too and see if I can find some really interesting moments that need further investigation

[Ankamius]

Naturally you should probably read through all three of the flipped scum slots if you're planning on ISOing

The early townflips barring ManWithNoName (slots like Wraith/Impossibear/Wraith/OnTheMark/Kaede/davesaz) are probably good reads too.

Day 1 was kind of a standard day one until RC (Ouroboros head) started heavy-pushing Ventriloquist until he died. ManWithNoName was the vig kill, the scumkill was very likely on Impossibear, who flipped as a one-shot bulletproof.
Day 2 was a hellish slog where we tried to confirm REALMEN's role, bitched endlessly about nothing for half the game, then made Wraith self-destruct. OnTheMark claimed to have blocked davesaz, which was a source of contention as well. Ouroboros flipped during the night probably to help mask the presence of scum in the neighborhood.
Day 3 I don't really remember much, I think it was the day we started heavily townblocking and just booted projectmatt in. The neighborhood stuff was pretty big. Impossibear was killed because obvtown + vig.
Day 4 was short, MariaR was confirmed scum via projectmatt flipping. OnTheMark was the obvious kill since the roleblock was a cop with MariaR dying.
Day 5 was kind of controversial, davesaz was eventually lynched because a few of us were pretty certain he was scum and the scumteam tried to gambit to get him to the end of the game. Kaede died because conftown and was one of the last people holding town together.
Day 6 was nobody giving a shit.

Now we're here.

[Ankamius]

btw

Wilky being a miller isn't necessarily weird; it has possible +town equity via mafia's role cop and possible +scum equity via miller

[Ankamius]

I think Alchemist was blocked once? I think day 3?

I distantly remember it being crumbed that he did that day 4 too but I don't remember offhand

[Ankamius]

davesaz
wilky
alchemist21
alchemist21

does that sound right?

[Ankamius]

He probably forgot

Out of everybody that doesn't care, I think he cares the least

[Ankamius]

You joined a game that kind of stalled out

Punreader was the only one that really cared enough to put a significant amount of effort in throughout the game, but I can vouch for them not really being around enough to continue it throughout day 6.

It's one reason I want to reset; it's not alignment indicative by itself that Pun didn't do anything yesterday, but it's still worrying enough that I don't think my townread on them should still be intact to the extent that it was before now.

[Ankamius]

good to see we're off to a roaring start to a fantastic day 7

[Ankamius]

Did you get a PM about Alchemist21 being town?

[Ankamius]

I promise I'll have stuff here at some point today.

[Ankamius]

I assume that means you changed your mind on Dunnstral?

[Ankamius]

REALMEN is town
Prof Fridays is town

wilky is... eh?

Punreader is scummy
Dunnstral is scummy

that's my contribution

[Ankamius]

I think his role claim was a gambit all along tbh

[Ankamius]

What's up?

[Ankamius]

Pun

The problem is: what part of that would you not have access to as a safe claim in your role pm

[Ankamius]

I'm going to sleep on it

I'll be back later

[Ankamius]

I would also like to emphasize that, were I pun here, I'd had to have double-bussed from the onset as projectmatt and MariaR were suspicions of mine since the moment I replaced in and I was advocating for their deaths since the moment I was a player. (You will not find a player who pushed projectmatt harder than I did; you will not find a player more adamant we lynch MariaR.) I place value on play in most situations and my play is strongly evident of me not being pun as I have a strong record of not bussing in most situations, if I am capable of avoiding it.

The things you hold suspicion of me on, of me not following through on a promise to provide more recent content, you also know to be not alignment indicative, or if indicative of alignment at all, indicative of me holding a town alignment as I am atrocious at providing followthrough to my promises.

I've taken both of these into account, Pun. I even stated before when I talked about your recent content that it's not actually indicative by itself, but I'm starting to see roughly what plan you'd have if you were scum this game.

I think it's entirely possible that you were scum this game for a few reasons:

1. On day two, the playerlist was still fairly high caliber. You needed to be able to fool not only myself who had a strong scumread on your slot, but Ouroboros/Impossibear (both of which had fairly strong reads and were strongly townread throughout the game), conftown/obvtown and active Kaede Akamatsu/OnTheMark, REALMEN ONLY JUNGLE, who is at least believably a higher tier player, and probably others that I'm not quite aware of your history with.
2. Your claim was entirely locked in when you replaced in. While I don't think it's the type of role you would want to have out there until you absolutely have to as town, it still provided a pretty convenient shield to hide behind so you could get as much towncred as possible. Without this shield, there's no way you could get away with still being alive all this way into the game.
3. This gamestate is starting to look like something you'd cook up to coast on your towncred with. All the competent correct players are dead, followed by the player with the strongest PR, then the player holding town together. The only thing that gives me pause here is that I think Alchemist21 isn't someone you'd exactly be chomping at the bit to kill night 6 (over myself and REALMEN at least, I know you are well aware I can completely solve the game out of nowhere in LyLo or the day before). So you have your shield intact along with your bussing towncred, most of the slots that could see through it are dead, and the slots that are left alive are the ones that were apathetic for most of the game and likely to go wherever the momentum of the day went, giving you options of where you want to push.
4. I've been doing my own VCA and I think your slot has the sketchiest day 1-3, along with Dunnstral. I can go into this more later, but the part that is really screwing with me regarding this is that wilky's placement via that is a massive question mark and just with raw information, he's the best lynch today. However, I don't trust that I'll still be alive tomorrow whether or not you're scum because if my deductions are mostly correct at that point, it's not that big of a stretch to come to the conclusion that I'll have the last scum caught on day 8 and the game will be harder to win for them as a result.

[Ankamius]

BTW I think the gambit strongly shows REALMEN as town, but that was already pretty close to clearly true already

I don't know what exactly he would expect to happen by throwing his neck out there like that as scum

[Ankamius]

ah jesus damnit, mastina if you're scum here you're good. i didn't actually consider alchemist dying yesterday when i gave the quest and my conftown going to waste so i have no result and no conftown today and that is sad

i retract the above, it's just a gambit, now I have doubts that punreader is scum.

however, he's still my top scumread

And you wonder why people want to lynch you.
I wish I could let them, but alas.

My goal is to lynch pun, not lynch the players who we wish were pun.

the best players aren't the ones that die early. the best players are the ones that can live till endgame without getting lynched or dying to nightkill and make a larger positive difference to the game

what's the point in being the most 'respected' and admired town player if you get n1'd every game and make a minimal impact?

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

The best town isn't the one with the best reads, the best town is the one that most furthers the town win condition, which is a lot more nuanced and easier to do the longer you stay alive. The town I would be most impressed with in a game is the one that correctly lynches scum over and over again, yet is also able to manipulate the gamestate in a way where killing them isn't the best idea until it's too late.

[Ankamius]

Ankamius

should

know all of this already.

That I wouldn't fakeclaim.
That I am town by play.
That the reasons she's suspicious for me aren't indicative of alignment because they happen literally every game. (Including in mhsmith's game; the number of promises I broke there is quite high.)

As a result, she's a candidate for being pun taking a more arbiter stance.

I should mention that I have a large bias here.

One of the main reasons Ankamius has, consistently, been the VT I've most townread is because of her play in a recent pungame, Minuet's Trio. I felt her comments there, found here and here, indicated that to be her main experience with being pun since returning from hiatus.

Additional reasoning for believing her to be town was how there was a point in the game where our reads were almost

precisely

linked, for similar and yet not identical reasoning. Her stances having been mirrors of my own was an indicator I believed pointed to her being town.

Counterbalancing this, however, is the aforementioned factors above, where she isn't treating me the way I feel she

should

be. Additionally, it did not escape my notice that near the end when projectmatt was at risk of death more seriously, she had what amounted to a flip-out and almost entire read-inversion, where she did essentially everything except advocate for his lynch in spite of previously having done so.

One of the main reasons I wish to get a (re)read of the game is to check that section out again to better define what it means.

This is my other scum game since returning from hiatus. Every other completed game is a town game. One thing I will point out is that I made a pretty elaborate case in LyLo that I don't think I've ever done before and probably never will do again. As either alignment.

[Ankamius]

But I will say this:

Additionally, it did not escape my notice that near the end when projectmatt was at risk of death more seriously, she had what amounted to a flip-out and almost entire read-inversion, where she did essentially everything except advocate for his lynch in spite of previously having done so.

You know very very well this is strong evidence for me being town this game and it's really really worrying that you think it's more scum-indicative.

[Ankamius]

But. Regarding how I've been treating you this game:

It's far more useful for me to let you do you own thing and judge it from afar without tainting your conclusions with my own thoughts. This is exactly how I eventually concluded that you were town, because in a gamestate where my reads were proven correct over and over again and where I was blindingly obvious town, you rallied around me and tried to work with me and keep me from apathying out, which is absolutely never what you would do if you were scum. Yet I gave you the freedom to make that choice yourself without pressure from me (except for when I was sheeping ETL, but that just made it more strongly town-indicative if anything.)

You know where my weaknesses are and what buttons to push to accentuate them. It's not difficult, the pieces for keeping that in place were already there. However, one thing I did misjudge is that I no longer believe that you necessarily need a plan to keep me from being a strong force in the game since the first two days without your influence was more than enough to do that itself. All you'd really need to do after getting rid of all the other strong slots that would catch you is to both engineer a gamestate where I'm unlikely to catch you and where I would be gunning for a slot that isn't you.

That's entirely doable for you.

[Ankamius]

it's a pity that

your own reasons

above for doubting ankamius are also not alignment indicative, to some extent.

Yes, which is why Ankamius has remained a townread of mine.

I am quite aware that my reasons for doubting Ankamius are, more than likely, paranoia.

It is why I haven't been sharing them until now. I do not share paranoia-based reads because if they are paranoia then it is probably worth ignoring.

But with the play in the last little while, from Ankamius prioritizing a finished game over this one to her stances once here, it was worth at least a mention of where I have been on her and why my townread isn't as strong as it once was.

She is still a townread.

She is not as strong of a townread as I had before, and thus, not as strong of a townread as I would prefer.

This isn't exactly fair; labyrinth was a game I poured a lot of time into and didn't really have an outlet to dump my thoughts into since there wasn't a dead thread. Plus I'm almost always very active in postgames of games I'm in, which you should be very well aware of.

[Ankamius]

My biggest struggle this game is that this gamestate is almost completely impossible for me to decipher between the awkwardly timed scum lynches (day one is unreadable for me, day four is useless to me, day two is mostly useless in general, and day three I was way off in my read).

This type of endgame is not exactly much to work off of since Ouroboros, Impossibear, OnTheMark, Kaede Akamatsu, and Alchemist21 are fairly universal kills that just about anyone would do. The rest of the alive slots are the ones that were in the background throughout most of the game or hardcore lurkers, in which suddenly being active and trying to lead isn't necessarily a good idea (outside of Pun, where it would be a pretty significant scumtell to actively stop, tbh). Normally I'd think my confidence throughout day 5 that I'd have this game solved would be warranted, but I kind of underestimated how broken this gamestate is, sadly.

I do strongly think that from what I remember combined with what the vote counts indicate, both REALMEN and Prof Fridays are strongly town. I really want to have wilky sorted either way because he has the weirdest locations both for where he is on the votecounts as well as the wagons on him looking like they can be indicative of either alignment.

Dunnstral had some worrying moments, but Tchill had the most moments where he made sense as the last scum, especially under a REALMEN/Fridays town scenario.

The main reason I'm still hesitating is because I don't think I'd live it down if I reasoned myself to a Punreader-scum theory and it turned out to be wrong, especially if I was killed tonight anyways.

[Ankamius]

If it's not either of you two, it's wilky

[Ankamius]

I'd honestly just go about the same process I've been doing both today and yesterday.

Look at VCs
Cross-reference what each slot is doing with the flipped scum
Find patterns
etc.
Cross-reference with what I remember having happened in the game to see if it makes sense as town or scum

[Ankamius]

That's the thing, REALMEN. Does she think that's more dangerous than you or myself randomly solving the game?

[Ankamius]

Oh, trust me

Pun pushing me as scum is suicide

[Ankamius]

Tbh I kind of believe that

[Ankamius]

I'm going to test something

[Ankamius]

VOTE: Wilky

[Ankamius]

I'll need to check a few things to make sure but I'm thinking this is the solve currently

[Ankamius]

Btw I'm doing that sometime after my house is no longer 95F

So it'll take a bit

[Ankamius]

I assumed Punreader was town and followed the logic chain

Granted I still assumed you and realmen was town, but wilky stuck out like a sore thumb immediately

[Ankamius]

Claims:

Quest Giver
Miller Slow Cop
Modified Hider
VT
VT
VT

Did I get it right or did I forget a claim somewhere?

[Ankamius]

No, I got it right.

hm

[Ankamius]

Just by logistics, wilky is a really likely scum.

RMOJ's role is confirmed.
Punreader has a point in that it's difficult to imagine they'd have some sort of blocking role thanks to Tchill's random early day one claim.

That means there's already two town that he has no angle of attack on, because any attack on either slot runs a huge risk of having that info be realized and those lynch options will go away.
Alchemist is a more likely kill for him because out of everybody here, I'd expect wilky to have the least amount of exposure to the playerlist to know how to handle it.

A wilky-scum gamestate is managing conftowns and letting town eat itself alive. That explains the Kaede kill despite her paranoia flaring, that explains the Alchemist kill despite him not being an active force in the game. He only has three possible targets and needs to get two of them lynched in order to win the game. It's a reasonable assumption that he'll manage to outlive Dunnstral, but he will need both of the other town tomorrow to vote either myself or Prof Fridays, which is very very unlikely with the strength of our townreads on each other. A path had been opened up with a Punreader lynch, but that's been closed now.

The main thing that I don't have a particular read on is what power the last scum has.

[Ankamius]

Town Innocent Child Action Passer
Town Strong Roleblocker
Town Modified Neighborizer Tracker
Town Compulsive 1-Shot Bulletproof Conditional Vigilante
Town Inventor (Weapon Vendor)
Town Miller
Town Vanilla
Town Vanilla
Town Vanilla
?
?
?
?
?

vs

Mafia Factional Ability Swapper
Mafia Rolecop
Mafia 1-Shot Bulletproof 1-Shot Strongman Reconnoisseur
?

--

Miller Slow Cop
Quest Giver
Modified Hider

[Ankamius]

This game is going to give me a migraine

ugh

[Ankamius]

The only thing that really makes sense to me as a scum power in this setup is some kind of redirection

This setup appears to be designed around the idea that the powers themselves are strongly gated separately, but when combined together has the possibility of creating a huge chain of interactions. Plus, there's a lot of indirect things that look to be there to deceive town if they try to solve the setup in this way:

1. The neighborizer tracker is probably our primary investigative role since that neighborhood can detect some of the oddball stuff that happens in the game, yet the mafia have a role to counter this, the factional ability swapper
2. The strong roleblocker appears to be mostly negative utility, since it can create indirect negatives for Ouroboros' role thanks to Kaede's role or Alchemist's multi-target invention. Plus, mafia can switch around their roles so that they can give the nightkill to whoever is least likely to be blocked and having whatever role is least important be on the most 'scummy' player.
3. REALMEN Only Jungle is our primary protective role, but it's also one that has to out itself in order to function at all.
4. Hider is in the setup to increase the chances of weird potentially incriminating results popping up without having the extra utility that a hider normally brings

This game is weird. The more I think about it, the more I think that the more non-standard roles (quest giver/neighborizer tracker/weapon vender) were meant to be town's primary power while the normally strong or intuitive roles (roleblocker/vigilante/hider) are mostly negative utility or the primary roles being countered by the scumteam, yet that also is a big bonus to town since that also will trip up the scumteam as well. It's actually pretty genius design, which also is another reason why redirector is a high possibility of showing up. Redirecting is an ability you would try to use on the roles fitting the latter; redirecting the quest just outs your role, the neighborhood can't be redirected, and the vender would also out your role.

[Ankamius]

But here's the problem

Town Innocent Child Action Passer
Town Strong Roleblocker
Town Modified Neighborizer Tracker
Town Compulsive 1-Shot Bulletproof Conditional Vigilante
Town Inventor (Weapon Vendor)
Town Modified Hider
Town Quest Giver
Town Miller Slow Cop
Town Miller
Town Vanilla
Town Vanilla
Town Vanilla
Town Vanilla
Town Vanilla

vs

Mafia Factional Ability Swapper
Mafia Rolecop
Mafia 1-Shot Bulletproof 1-Shot Strongman Reconnoisseur
Mafia Redirector (?)

This looks like a perfectly fine setup. It would suggest wilky is town.

[Ankamius]

I think I need to digest this for a while to see if I'm not missing something obvious or if there's some weird aspect I'm not considering.

[Ankamius]

It could be a fake claim since I don't think it's particularly necessary of a role here?

[Ankamius]

I don't remember all the actions so it's possible I forgot one

Shrug

[Ankamius]

Because too busy catching the rest of the scum, then too busy not caring

[Ankamius]

The dead thread must've been ecstatic about day six

I know I was

[Ankamius]

Could've been redirected to herself to hide the role perhaps

[Ankamius]

It was corrected, check again

[Ankamius]

I mean... the biggest thing I could see for redirector not being the case here is that I'm not too sure how adept wilky is at setup spec and manipulating information that town has, since redirecting the action passer to itself is not the most intuitive choice in this situation, but;

1. Two nightkills would put us onto odds
2. The choice for the second kill is to either out the fact that Kaede got redirected, or take away another viable mislynch

The other issue is... why do that in the first place. Yeah, Kaede was starting to go off the deep end in paranoia, but wilky wasn't in her paranoia list.

[Ankamius]

UNVOTE: Wilky

Something's missing here, there's too many holes that don't really make sense

[Ankamius]

Opinion on setup stuff RMOJ?

[Ankamius]

Idk

Me going into 3p lylo with my two day 2 tunnel targets would be pretty funny and sad at the same time