Epilogue! - [Endgame]

[Hectic]

[Hectic]

Isis is sneaky, I haven't written off a deepwolf game yet

[Hectic]

I've been calling up Doctor Drew but I keep going through to voicemail :[

[Hectic]

I ship Ydrasse/Isis, all other pairings are slanderous

[Hectic]

i think i found the hoctac alt!

Unbelievable, you've gotta stop outing my alts like this, Tayl0r

[Hectic]

pooookyyy

[Hectic]

deleuzional and I go way back. I remember our first toxic 1v1 we had back in 09

[Hectic]

Hectic, propose to isis and let’s see if we can make steam come out of Dunn’s ears before we reach pg4

It's probably suboptimal but I love this lol

Dance with me, Isis

[Hectic]

the scummiest gentlemen is clearly me, right

[Hectic]

Hectic, propose to isis and let’s see if we can make steam come out of Dunn’s ears before we reach pg4

It's probably suboptimal but I love this lol

Dance with me, Isis

dont accept this.

Hectic has seen a lot of dance games where town proposed to the IC and gets townread for it, and decided he'd try to copy and then say there's always wifom surrounding himself when he doesn't die

Exactly! Dunny raises a very strong point here. I think Isis should accept.

[Hectic]

Hectic, propose to isis and let’s see if we can make steam come out of Dunn’s ears before we reach pg4

It's probably suboptimal but I love this lol

Dance with me, Isis

dont accept this.

Hectic has seen a lot of dance games where town proposed to the IC and gets townread for it, and decided he'd try to copy and then say there's always wifom surrounding himself when he doesn't die

Exactly! Dunny raises a very strong point here. I think Isis should accept.

It makes it much spicier if scum leave you both alive because they think there’s enough wifom to get isis to suicide and then we roll them all lol

I mean, that's a good fill of drama and entertainment, I'd leave the game pretty satisfied with that. I think dance partners having heated 1v1s is underrated and a valuable asset to town

[Hectic]

Pooky, may I have this dance?

[Hectic]

loving this character development, people. I've already noticed a few death flags but I won't spoil it for anyone

Something to think about is whether you think you can accurately and confidently townread your partner in 6p and 4p because if you can't you will probably leave your partner.

I could probably confidently townread Hectic in endgame or accurately townread Hectic in endgame but not both lul

kind of a shame that your mod confirmation doesn't change how I'd probably read you anyway, but I'm working on it...

@Mod I'm allowed to change to Lady because I was the last one in the signups to dance with Hectic?

I sign this petition with prejudice

[Hectic]

BTW among the setup abuse +EV things I want to do this game is that I want my dance partner to prod dodge in the game thread and play in the dance PT to wifom the NK
That didn't happen in wolf dance but I want it to happen.
My dance PT will be plenty fun on its own we will play chess and twenty questions and I will bring you crossword puzzles

I'm in if there'll also be some horror stories and dramatic storytelling narratives

It's an interesting idea though. You would know how towny/scummy the person is since they'd relay all their thoughts to you, but scum wouldn't know and would have to gauge whether it's still worth killing you n1

[Hectic]

who is deleuz an alt of btw

I think it's Socrates

[Hectic]

who is deleuz an alt of btw

I think it's Socrates

Hey man shut

up

i told you that in confidence! If the elders find out I’m still alive they’re gonna totally check the poison next time and I can’t just get away with downing a mug of wine and making gargling nosies!

Sorry man, just play along with it and people will assume it's wifom. I could probably start tunneling you later on the basis you're Karl Marx playing to his scum meta, and it'll probably give you some cover.

hectic. this might be a little forward. but i think youre kinda cute and like to get to know you a little better somewhere private. you should ask me to dance.

Show me your towny heart of radiance, and I would be happy to!

[Hectic]

pedit: is making Hectic lurk in this playerlist a human rights violation tho?

In fairness, he doesn’t have to lurk just avoid posting meaningful content in main thread

I'd give fluff posting a whole another meaning...

okay, leaving the thread. I want there to be at least 4 more pairings when I get back. don't mess this up please. Pooky, find a way to propose to me, thanks.

[Hectic]

I wouldn't meme suicide, I like joking around and having fun, but that's a weird representation of my play, Oka. Where'd you get that impression of me from?

Drew has broken my heart, I don't think I can ever find love again

[Hectic]

Sigh... do I need to effort and townspew for you, Isis? I guess we can get this arc out of the way early this time.

[Hectic]

FakeGod is a monster, Pooky
If we all rebel, we could probably change his mind. Blocking pagetops, scumreading the mod, what else do we need to do?

[Hectic]

lol I'm tempted to sign this pact and do the same if you're serious about this, it sounds fun. aaaand I can see why Oka was worried about me suiciding now &_&

[Hectic]

I can feel your soul this game, Pooky. It makes me excited, I want to make up for Undertale

[Hectic]

Isis, if we're gonna pair, shouldn't I scumspew so they don't snipe our pairing N1? If you think about it, I'm really just a genius

[Hectic]

Krazy injected too much DETERMINATION into our souls, of course that was gonna give the soul masonry an overdose.

[Hectic]

soul-reading is dangerous ~.~

Hectic I trust you with my life - who should I dance with?

You must go with Isis and keep her company.

I'm kind of scared of this power...

I'm not sure yet! I think Tayl0r proposing I dance with her was towny, I'm generally very good at reading her so it's a very bold play if she's scum.

[Hectic]

I'm scared that I trust you so much after this exchange honestly

[Hectic]

I kinda skimmed btw, I'm cooking food. I'll probably give some of those godforsaken reads when I catch up properly

[Hectic]

And when you speak,
Angels sing from above...

You know in your heart what is true

Wasn't expecting the poems from you to be directed at me this game, but I'm not complaining lol

If only Norwee was here, I could perform a duet for you

[Hectic]

shelly shelly shelly

Have you started shifting your scum meta?

[Hectic]

Wasn't expecting the poems from you to be directed at me this game, but I'm not complaining lol

If only Norwee was here, I could perform a duet for you

You don't know how in pieces I was after Undertale C!

No, I understand why you had to strike me down... I blame myself for that tunnel

[Hectic]

shelly shelly shelly

Have you started shifting your scum meta?

hectic have you started shifting yours?
to answer you, i'd say yes, but im town here so it doesn't matter

Okay, I like that response.

I haven't rolled scum since Nightmare, so haven't needed to! Do you think I have a clear/readable scummeta though?

[Hectic]

No, I understand why you had to strike me down... I blame myself for that tunnel

I tunneled you first :(

The fault is mine.

I loved you too much

Maybe we can tunnel each other with love this game
I think I prefer this

[Hectic]

Why do you think early proposers/accepters are +town? I feel like scum would love to accept and feel secure early.

I've played a dance setup as scum before (it was a marathon), and my mindset was to just accept the first dance proposal I received, and pass it off as a meme. I love you, emps, but I'll never forgive you for leaving me.

[Hectic]

I think it really depends on the player though. I'm quite surprised that Drew accepted so early.

@Drew: Have you played with DrippingGoofball before? Why'd you just want to get dancing immediately?

[Hectic]

Oh wait, no ladies get left behind today. Never mind &_&

[Hectic]

You played a forum speed dance setup as scum as well, why is that worded like you've only done so once?

Oh right, I did lol

I don't know how I forgot (I'm assuming you're talking about the Masquerade?) probably because I was replaced a few days in

[Hectic]

Sooo I'm not exactly sure how I want to approach this game. It largely depends on whether or not you'll be dancing with me, Isis.

On one hand, I could start freestyling on the dance floor and perform some of my trademark double backflips, but there's no going back from that point. I'm sure everyone is aware of this, but once you've completed a full double backflip, there's just no way you can revert back to the person you were before completing said double backflip. It...

changes

you as a person.

On the OTHER HAND, you could accept my proposal and save me from my backflipping tendencies. I may still be tempted to long jump during our dance, but zero backflips would occur. I can assure everyone of this right now, and if I go back on my word, feel free to post that horrendous "giggling" emoji as a way to punishment me.

[Hectic]

But you should know that if you accept: I have a soul death pact with Pooky. We're gonna need him alive or my heart will shatter

[Hectic]

Wolf dance is the one, I didn't play in Masquerade

[Hectic]

I like dance!Dunnstral

[Hectic]

I'm slightly scared. I think Pooky would probably survive this anyway though, his soul would rise through the ashes.

And okay, I'll start giving reads/playing normally now, was just wondering if this fluff/no info plan was gonna happen.

[Hectic]

I mean, I guess

[Hectic]

-I could post stuff to notes and just fluff for now

[Hectic]

FLUFF

[Hectic]

HECTIC ARE YOU TOWN

No, I am scum and you should torture me in a pt and eventually leave me

[Hectic]

Who's Narset?

I'm not well-versed about SMB3, but I can talk all day about SMB1. Love the character creation in that game, I felt like I could perfectly self-insert

[Hectic]

Oh, you mean Hayasaka

[Hectic]

Is the plot twist that the portrait's on fire and the lady isn't?

[Hectic]

seeing as nobody knows who I am and therefore nobody really has an idea of what my scumrange is like.

L.A. Noire Doubt guy

[Hectic]

The nerve to shade Drew's avatar...

He once got a micro lobby to all change all of their avatars to various Drews

[Hectic]

[Hectic]

The accent gave you away

[Hectic]

Can I be your deputy, town hero firebringer

[Hectic]

doctor drew; i swear ur avi always makas me default into scum territory. u should change it so i stop having these preconceived notions of u.

It's so towny it hurts. I have to shield my eyes soemtimes to stop myself from blindly sheeping him whenever I see it.

[Hectic]

I'm still doing a handstand

[Hectic]

Start, Select, A, B

[Hectic]

I think Tayl0r is probably town,

hectic. this might be a little forward. but i think youre kinda cute and like to get to know you a little better somewhere private. you should ask me to dance.

This is very bold if she's scum. I have a lot of meta with her, and a pretty good readrate on her. This is making the game a lot harder for scum!her I think, if she has to fool me in a PT as well as the thread.

Taylor is probably the towniest so far

LOL

I liked this reaction.

hectic the reason i wanna dance with you is that i think we can sort each other.

Great reason for town!Tayl0r, kinda suicidal if she's scum.

Rest of the ISO is not as alignment telling, but I feel reasonably good about her being town. @leu: what were your reasons for townreading her?

shelly's playing to her townmeta so far. The lack of aggression and early tunnels is very town-indicative for her. As town, she's more open to the field, and natural. While as scum she kinda feels like she's performing, and is very blunt and aggressive. She also likes to present a healthy amount of scumreads as scum, having "too many townreads" and only a couple of scumping reads is a towntell for her.
We both know she's been trying to mix up her meta though, so this isn't as useful as it would be a couple of weeks ago.

I

think

they're probably both town, but Tayl0r is townier than shelly for me.

May I have this dance, Tayl0r?

[Hectic]

I soulread Pooky as town, so Bell right now...

I'll give him an ISO to see what my read on him actually is

[Hectic]

@taylor i really think you should pair with pooky or bell > hectic

How come?

[Hectic]

Bell, why didn't you rebold the request to Firebringer, and why did you want to dance with Tayl0r?

[Hectic]

i read the thread and feel reasonably confident to give my GTH reads on the playerlist:

DrippingGoofball - tone + early proposal is townpinging.
deleuzional - proposing in FIRST POST is a whole new level of townness than early proposal. it's a move that I think scum never make here.
Hectic - I still stand by my TR here so far, liked the poking at me.
MariaR - 308 feels lamist in a "why am I not being TR'd" way which is scummy. rest of the posts feel quite overeager in pairing up. scumlean atm.
Dunnstral - lots of mechspeak, which is easy towncred for scum. i feel like interactions with me were genuine and they even admitted that i might SR them though? torn on this slot.
Bell - I'm townreading this due to inquisitiveness. Bell has quite obvious differences in their town/scum play and I'm confident in my ability to sort here.
beeboy - not posted
OkaPoka - heavy pushing of "policy clowners + suiciders" feels like fakesolving moreso than hunting scum
PookyTheMagicalBear - I'm giving this a /pass on tone. pooky is a player that is tonally different as scum
Isis - IC
Tayl0r Swift - town by virtue of bluntness and feels more lighthearted while as scum taylor'd be more uptight/efforty
Akarin - im terrible at mech so not sure how accepting the dance invite = scum? otherwise really null
The Bulge - completely cant get my head around early posting, null.
Ydrasse - before the end of day 1 there's usually a point in town!ydrasse's posting where it becomes transparent that she's town. I think she's hit the mark for me.
shellyc - look at me im so town
Firebringer - blunt and direct, townlean but weak
Doctor Drew - early acceptance i'd say it +town, tonally like this slot as well

Too many townreads

Dunnstral is scum; too many townreads is a town tell. He is gaslighting us into calling it a scum tell.

Shelly is town.

This was probably the scummiest post in the game. It reads are fabricated and has a fake confidence kind of vibe to it.

I'm not fully caught up though, and I'm not free for like the next 24 hours. I'm sure Tayl0r can see my towny soul though. I'll probably be able to obvtown when I get some more time and can effort

[Hectic]

What you thinking, Tayl0r?

[Hectic]

I'm not enjoying this game, I wish I'd played normally from the start

[Hectic]

Would you like to dance, shellyCult?

[Hectic]

ok im deeply concerned that hectic doesnt wanna dance with me.

I thought you were rejecting me :[

[Hectic]

Yeah, sounds good. I'll drop a bunch of galaxy brain crumbs and it'll be up to you to decipher them.

[Hectic]

I'm partial to neon green

[Hectic]

Neon so I can shine bright, like I've just picked up a power star

Dunnstral is a big meanie

[Hectic]

I can't really do anything right now, sheeeelly, I am occupied/basically V/LA until a day or two

by that I mean I can talk in real-time but not really reread anything

[Hectic]

I can't believe he's trying to kill my soul mason :/

[Hectic]

dunn, scumcase hectic

I'm not seeing what is town about him

The desperation for a partner while trying to play it off feels scummy

I think he's more likely than pooky or bell

I'm pushing him because he's the best choice for elimination in my eyes. Scummier players have already paired up but there's no guarantee (it's not even likely) that all 4 have paired

I don't want to be the first person to be left behind in a dance, that would really really suck

[Hectic]

I would love to dance with you

[Hectic]

Tayl0r wants approval from Isis first, she doesn't believe in me

[Hectic]

Accept hectic

sorry swizzy. this is MINE.

i'd highly recommend doing bell

<3

[Hectic]

I actually feel somewhat betrayed lol

[Hectic]

I actually feel somewhat betrayed lol

(I don't really, Pooky.... I let myself be soulpocketed)

[Hectic]

Fine with pushing the DGB/DD pair to start. Haven't liked either.

VOTE: Drew

[Hectic]

THAT MAKES IT WORSE WTF

GRUMBLE OOGLE GRUMBLE BOOGLE

[Hectic]

you know i've only played with a snapshot of hectic from a few months ago but has he ever just spewed such townie train of thoughts everyone chuckled to themselves and thought yeah he is town.

problem is we can't know if hectic is smurfing on u cuz he is using a private PT so let us bring these conversations to the light ahh

FINE, I WILL

I'll bring out the Hoctac account and show my true potential... TOMORROW, well maybe the day after actually

[Hectic]

My hero

[Hectic]

I read back on the EoD final 3 of Pooky/Bell/Hectic stuff, and how Pooky was acting, and it's really hard to read it, and what it means for Bell's alignment, because he's not gunning to have Bell or I left behind, he's just acting defeatist and nonchalant as a tactic.

Bell wasn't particularly desperate to pair off this game though.
He proposed twice:

Firebringer.

Would, would you dance with me?

taylorswift, will you dance with me?

He didn't bother to correct the bold on the first, and the second is to Tayl0r, who had expressed interest to dance with me before this point, so Bell isn't exactly doing his best to pair with someone who's more likely to accept, makes me feel better about him.

POOKY????????

HELLO???????

WHAT IS HAPPENING

i haven’t read this game at all im so upset

I thought this reaction was very towny. It's pretty bold to "AtE" like this as scum after a partner flip, and I haven't really seen this in scum!Ydrasse's range elsewhere.

Oh, and Tayl0r is obviously probably town for slaying Pooky and picking Bell. A S-S pairing really isn't the end of the world there, especially since they were both generally being read decently.

sorry i’m just so upset pooky please can we be town together why why why

more townyspew

way pooky and hectic acted pregame makes me think they aren't a team

here is a general reads list with no notes or comments:

DrippingGoofball-Town
deleuzional-Town
Hectic-Scum
MariaR -Scum
Dunnstral- Town
Bell-NullTown
beeboy-NullScum
OkaPoka-First Mate
PookyTheMagicalBear- Scum
Isis-Queen Scum
Tayl0r Swift-LeanScum
Akarin-True Null
The Bulge-NullTown
Ydrasse-NullTown
shellyc-NullTown
Firebringer- King of the Pirates
Doctor Drew-NullScum

uh huh, what happened to that Hectic/Pooky read, Forebronger?

ALSO, I should talk about that actually. There's just no way Pooky/I both enter this game with the tactic of "let's try and partner with the IC and not propose to anyone else until we're in the final 3". For one, despite Isis being an incredibly fun person to talk to, it's very suboptimal for scum to partner with the IC. and it's especially suboptimal for both of us to run that tactic down to the ground until we're in a 3 person PoE. I also got pocketed by Pooky so it should be telling we're not SvS from our interactions...

Around about on page 58, shelly asked me about the context about my post 1430. I thought that was towny because I could see that post implying history of me using PTs to pocket, it's good paranoia.

Speaking of shelly, let's see how she talked about Pooky pre-death:

i want pooky > hectic/bell. pooky feels very unconcerned overall about everything which is scum!AI, also the tone feels really pockety like scum!him is

Accept hectic

sorry swizzy. this is MINE.

i'd highly recommend doing bell

lmao shelly really just stole taylor's man

also you guys were supposed to collaborate or something idek why im complaining i love the drama

taylor can pick bell and kill scum!pooks.

im heavily leaning towards pooky through further reads of the iso

pooky is just super pocket-y regarding hectic yet showing almost no concern towards the dance, the kick

i am regretting my impulsiveness alreadyyyyyyyy

yeah, really good reason to think shelly is town from this. Also, I just feel really good about shelly in general from what we've talked about in the PT, but I admit I have bias for her choosing to dance with me when a couple of people *cough luez and Dunny* were gunning for my death. I am charmed.

This will continue later.

[Hectic]

Isis's new avatar is very strong material. If I were FakeGod, I'd be giving that a bulletproof vest

[Hectic]

What are your qualms?

[Hectic]

maybe like half of it has been discussed in PT

[Hectic]

implying it's shelly and she loves to bus? She seemed to be actually trying to convince you to leave Pooky behind

[Hectic]

yeah, sorry am compromised again so gotta leave thread.will make this brief

I dislike DGB/Drew last I checked

also have qualms about luez/Firebringer

[Hectic]

lol

[Hectic]

Hectic whats pinging you about FB? just the pooky-hectic s/s theory?

him switching his stance on that with no progression + just general vibes

[Hectic]

I actually doubt that, Isis. I think scum!Pooky really did want to dance with you, even if he was scum. The proposal of a soul deathpact was in jest and it's kinda tinfoily to assume he was trying to put you off pairing with him by suggesting it.

The important thing is that Pooky did not propose to anyone else until he was in F3 and had to. I did the same. We've both locked ourselves into a very bad position there which we didn't have to. It's plausible if Pooky is the lone scum in the F3, it's not as dire. But it's especially bad if it's 2 scum in the F3. If we're both scum, I probably pair with shelly or Tayl0r far, far earlier, or Pooky probably actually proposes to anyone else.

[Hectic]

here's your ENGAGEMENT

[Hectic]

Yes, I am currently roasting you in the scum PT, you need to keep up with me in that 1v1

[Hectic]

soul-reading is dangerous ~.~

Hectic I trust you with my life - who should I dance with?

You must go with Isis and keep her company.

Hmm, he did make this post..

why didn't he propose to anyone else then? grumble grumble

not that I'm complaining

[Hectic]

No, I actually agree with reading back. I was mostly basing it off of him just not proposing to anyone else, but yeah, he didn't try especially hard to dance with you this game.

[Hectic]

now the question is why luez/Ydrasse is a leading wagon in the VC. A MYSTERY that will unfold as I catchup....

[Hectic]

why is hectic posting in the pt and not here

THAT MAKES IT WORSE WTF

Flashbacks to Oka worrying about Elsa posting in his PT to Nancy in Team Mafia. Other than being blinded by the flash, I like.

why is hectic posting in the pt and not here

he just told me a tinfoil about luez!scum that involved alt outing so...

oh hectic is almost assuredly town then. im glad im not the only one. still not sure who the main is tho

bit too confident for my tastes based on the logic, but it's Tayl0r so this is NAI

Anyone who had Pooky as something that wasn't Null I have questions for

sameish

now tht i think about it i think people who saying im wrong about the hectic thing. Yeahhh those interactions might be stage performance they had earlier? Idk. Like i can get their friends but it was a bit much looking back

not at all. We acted similarly during Isis's Undertale game she modded recently. people were saying they would assume it was scum theatre if not for the fact they knew only 1 scum was left alive.

I actually feel somewhat betrayed lol

(I don't really, Pooky.... I let myself be soulpocketed)

why did u btw

I eventually death tunnelled him in that same Undertale game. it derailed everything and led to both of our deaths, I felt really bad for it and wanted to believe we were both town again

dunn is town. dont beserch dunny good name and those cute cat ears.

Honestly, Dunny has done nothing that isn't in his scumrange so far.

like if me n fire bringer yeet out now - even if our deaths are inevitable, we won't see the process of people taking a stance on us and arguing what should happen. instead it'll happen and you'll have a few soundbites from the louder players but the sneaky players are chillin

NOBODY IS LEAVING ESPECIALLY NOT DAY 1 WTF

Is it bad that I townread this because these posts are just 10 seconds apart?

[Hectic]

people shouldn't even leave in dance 2, its better to have wagons on everything

leaving is something that only should happen if the game dies and we might lose to deadline

+1, +2 even

I posted this on the scum PT also but "gottem"!

Oops I meant mason pt

I meant dance PT haha

I think Isis is trying to make scum forget she's an IC so they don't kill her. Seems kinda towny.

I'm not enjoying this game, I wish I'd played normally from the start

I'm sorry, but I wanted to consider you for afk gambit but also wanted to consider every gentleman for afk gambit and even though I accepted beeboy's pitch essentially as soon as I got it, there was a lot of play before that happened :/

I'm enjoying the game again now :]

isis be honest. are you scum? because you said you have a scum PT and usually only scum have scum PTs

Astute observation, quite a nuanced take that's unlikely to come from non-Tayl0r

idk maria

i have trauma for chain suicides throwing what was quite possibly the easiest town dub in the history of town dubs in a dance game

Oka's trauma in this and surrounding posts, and general opinion on pairs leaving feels genuine

1580 leaves a hell of an impression

I don't actually get it

sell me on dgb town because that's a hot take.

Scumreading me is the actual hot take, probably comes from scum, so have a seat.

The "case" on me is that I picked a partner early and didn't spam the thread with nonsense - the whole "dgb-scum" hysteria is mindless, cult-like mobbing.

Eh post. It's not hard to see why you're being scumread, you weren't brimming with content - nonsense or not - before this point.

I’d tell you to fuck off with telling me how Mafia affects my emotions but I’ve already decided this is going to be a nice game

townish anger

The Drew signup lie thing isn't as open-and-shut to me as I think it is to some people, but it is something that kind of bugs me. And Pooky being the one pointing it out doesn't help.

@Akarin:

Why does Pooky being the one to point out the lie make it worse?

“Explaining the core of your scumread takes seconds, fabricating a good fake case takes an eternity.” — Gilles Deleuze

Quality

DGB: “leuz is really obvscum”
Isis: “can you provide any evidence to back that up?”
DGB: “uhhhh, wait, I have to have

REASONS

for thinking things!?!? I’m not doing that because blah”

I never asked DGB to back up her read (cause, like, DGB is a shoot from the hip player and it seems kind of silly and futile?)
town!you would be mixing up a confirmed player and an unconfirmed player while scum!you would be mixing up two confirmed players.
Or relying on the post of a town player when your scumpartner's same point was more salient in seek of legitimacy. So like either way it's bad.
VOTE: Ydrasse

This is really interesting and I can see that. I think scum are more likely to mix up players in this fashion.

1646 is stronk

Don't particularly agree with the logic, but it means good things for her alignment

there's not even a counterwagon to this wagon that was pre-ordained on page 2

look at yourselves

I am scum and I started the expected scum counterwagon on deleuz I will not stand for you to ignore me like this.

LOL

VOTE: deleuzional

I’m not sure if DGB is scum or not but I do think she’s playing to an outdated understanding of the game and to an outdated meta

And I think her scumread on me is mostly her inability to accurately read people who play the way I do because of that outdated meta and understanding of the game

melanque secret alting is such a shameful way to get to stop using the cute anime avatar panzer worked so hard to pick out for you

SHOTS FIRED

Hmm

Hectic I was hoping to have self-resolve by pairing him with Isis. Also, I suck at reading him but isis doesn’t and she thinks he’s scummy so

Shelly I sort of agree with dunn on that her lack of any real scumreads/pushing of them is concerning. Plus I’m waiting for her to get back to me on something but I didn’t like the way it seemed she was repositioning. I’ll say more once she’s here again to see if that arc completes

I do like the reasons you had for wanting me with Isis.

@deleuz:

You don't think shelly gunning for Pooky to die is telling for her alignment?

[Hectic]

i for one am greatly saddened that the only way i can find out about hectic's opinions is through secondary sources

Blame shelly for bewitching me, I've already joined 5 new cults during our dance

Jesus, do any if you people have a job?

Be back later.

I'm scumreading you. Does that mean you're town?

anything interesting happen while i slept?

so nothing exciting?

Smells like scum!Forebronger meta to me. Last I saw you as town was in Nightless Vanilla and the 3 scum in a PT game, where you had massive WIM and big solves.

1580 is a good post and I remember

there was another long-ish one that I really liked too but idr from who

Dislike this kind of thing, I've seen scum do the "I remember seeing something really towny but can't remember what it was thing" more and more recently. It's worse here because it's not even about a specific player, it's just "I saw a long post I liked"

whats the point of asking these questions leuz are you really going to read 200 pages of scum meta

I don’t need to read the entire games, just you in ISO

I’ve got one more for you, then that’s it: most fun towngame you’ve had?

@deluez:

Why didn't you just ask for these Oka games all at once?

Thinking about it, the way pooky treated me means that hectic may be slightly more likely to be scum because hectic is the only person who I know knew who I was from very early on, and the way pooky approached me was very in line with how he’d approach me knowing I’m town

How dare you suggest I would out you to my scum partners, I'm more decent about alt-etiquette than that. Granted I have talked about who you are to shelly, but she is my dance partner, and it's got some relevance to how I'm reading you, so felt it was important.

Okay, I hit a semi-Oka-wall on 1777 and felt the urge to skip over it, think that's a sign I should take a break. adieu

[Hectic]

Alright, leuz

[Hectic]

I genuinely wouldn't out it for alt-etiquette reasons. I'd probably say I'm 99% sure I know who you are, but not specify who. Also, I think it's worse to tell them anyway, since they then have to ignore another piece of information that they wouldn't be informed about as town.

[Hectic]

Are you colouring my name in hectic, because I’m in maf!tiger and it’s a really prettty shade of cyan

You monster... but yeah, feel like you resonate a cyan

[Hectic]

I think probably the best slots to flip scum aorn are drew and firebringer, fwiw

But DGB is town(ish) and so is oka is just town, so I don’t know if isis isn’t right that it’s better to eliminate a pair who are both null-to-scum than pairs where one member seems town and the other scum

I agree with all of this

[Hectic]

Maybe colour-reading you just comes with alt-reading you

I generally go for red in Among Us, probably has a slight subconscious effect on people reading me as Impostor, but it's on-brand

[Hectic]

Has she given any reads on me in there?

[Hectic]

Honestly, Dunny has done nothing that isn't in his scumrange so far.

shade noted

Glad you noticed

[Hectic]

@Ydrasse:

How do you read me?

[Hectic]

Yeah, sorry, leuz. I didn't realise shelly was actually just going to out you in-thread.

[Hectic]

Isis scumreading hectic also makes me feel uneasy about him

Isis has scumleaned/read me in her last 3 games where we were both town

[Hectic]

luez, how did I go from leantown to null-to-scum range for you? Purely from the alt-outing Pooky theory?

[Hectic]

luez, how did I go from leantown to null-to-scum range for you? Purely from the alt-outing Pooky theory?

I would prefer not to at this point but if you think about and look at my comments about you I think you’ll figure it out

Pooky alt-outing theory and Isis scumreading me. Am I missing anything?

[Hectic]

i have more confidence in you being made to leave than i do having you stay for a town win

Really?? Why?

where is your towny heart?

On full display during my catchup. Those are pretty much unfiltered thoughts.

[Hectic]

leuz as far as I can see wants to kill shelly for not being out if her scumrange, and me for a tinfoil alt-outing theory, and some secret reasons. It sounds more like he

needs

to place us as both scummy, and he's finding weird reasons to justify it.

I was expecting Ydrasse to townread me, she's townread me in 3/3 games in which we were both town.

[Hectic]

oh i meant mafia energy in the sense that, like, i have the energy to play the game now as a whole

Greetings! Why do you dislike me for town?

[Hectic]

DrippingGoofball, who was aligned with

Town

, has

left

in

First Dance

.

Doctor Drew, who was aligned with

Town

, has

left

in

First Dance

.

Oh lol

[Hectic]

I would follow you to the ends of the earth, Donnie...

Did you explain somewhere why leuz is town, and Dunn/Aka is scum? I would be delighted to read it.

[Hectic]

Well, are you ready to explain the secret reasons, leuz?

[Hectic]

Ydrasse, are leuz's reasons the sort of thing he would've decided on before rolling his alignment? Or does he have to be town to realistically have the same thoughts?

[Hectic]

Well, are you ready to explain the secret reasons, leuz?

no

I’ll explain them in dead thread if this town is bad enough to ever lim me here

See, that doesn't make any sense to me

[Hectic]

ydrasse leuz is one of the only plausible S-S pairs in the game which makes me very uncomfortable sending it towards endgame.

I've been thinking about this for a while, but it being such a quickly proposed/accepted pair makes it very unlikely people would actually be onboard to endgame it.

I think more realistically leuz is scum in the 2 and is aware of how capable Ydrasse is to obvtown as town in recent times. Ydrasse town/scum meta has had a decent contrast recently, she posts these really towny walls of solving as town, and she has a lot less WIM and far shorter posts as scum. I can see scum!leuz wanting to dance with Ydrasse because ofthose qualities.

[Hectic]

I want to look more closely before voting. Still think Fire is heavily playing to his scummeta.

[Hectic]

im ok with dying mainly because it seems like i disagree with what town wants so it might just be better to remove a dissenter

Is that you, Pooky?

[Hectic]

Why are Bell/Tayl0r under fire is the next question...

For now:
VOTE: Fire

Will be back to properly catchup later.

[Hectic]

I'm still nor sure about leuz frankly. Part of me thinks he wouldn't do some of the stuff he's done this game as scum. Like the instant proposal + the "secret reason to scumread" me which he refuses to explain + refusing to explain why he would instant proposal

It's all very anti-town on the surface and would attract votes, so maaaaybe he wouldn't do all this as scum

[Hectic]

It's gonna be made public post game, isn't it?

[Hectic]

I still have zero read on either of Maria or Bulge, probably should ISO them

leuz, is the "secret" that it's a policy thing because you feel you can't work with me when we're both town?

[Hectic]

I still have zero read on either of Maria or Bulge, probably should ISO them

leuz, is the "secret" that it's a policy thing because you feel you can't work with me when we're both town?

@leuz

[Hectic]

leuz as far as I can see wants to kill shelly for not being out if her scumrange, and me for a tinfoil alt-outing theory, and some secret reasons. It sounds more like he

needs

to place us as both scummy, and he's finding weird reasons to justify it.

I was expecting Ydrasse to townread me, she's townread me in 3/3 games in which we were both town.

whats your read on leuz atm hectic?

Unsure. Still think Ydrasse is town.

I wouldn't want leuz to endgame at this point, but my gut is still telling me he's town, maybe I'm a sucker for "secret reasons"... it's complicated

[Hectic]

I still think shelly is playing to her townmeta. I've yet to see a scum!shelly game like this one; one where she's not aggressively pushing her scumreads are arguing with people. Her tone is also more relaxed and casual than her scumgame, where she's very blunt and antagonising. This

could

be the game where she turns that meta all around, but I'm not betting money on it.

VOTE: maria-bulge

Neither has given me reason to think they're town.

I still think Fire is sus and his reaction to Oka didn't convince me.

[Hectic]

I personally feel Hectic's entrance was very theatrical.

I have read them both. Together in an iso

and

*drum roll*

Hectic's entrance and read on taylor right now is desperation. he told her he would dance with her if she was townie in 173 or something and then his post rn took into account 2 posts made pretty much immediately after that point and then said the rest wasn't AI.

Pookie's entire Iso is fluffy.

I do not in fact care which of them gets yeeted tho I am heartless for saying so and so I shall prolly b yeeted in turn. But them's the breaks of having an opinion'

Oh hey, Bell could be scum for this. He clearly had a preference in Hectic/Pooky EoD

[Hectic]

(he said he didn't care which of us got yeeted, but elaborated on why I was scummy a whole lot more than Pooky, which was just "fluff")

[Hectic]

i want pooky > hectic/bell. pooky feels very unconcerned overall about everything which is scum!AI, also the tone feels really pockety like scum!him is

As this nonchalant attitude continues Pooky looks worse. He's kind of playing like he's scum and also his scum partner is in the pool of 3 with him

Yeah...

[Hectic]

Neither of them is going to obvtown this game

Neither of them is ever going to get to a position where they’re a good endgame pair

We should eliminate them now

Why do you keep arguing these things. I'm still really unsatisfied with the reasons you've been giving, it's really, really tempting to OMGUS you

doesn't shelly prefer scum though

yeah, shelly would probably be efforting more as scum

Oh, this is not the most recent post

[Hectic]

I still think shelly is playing to her townmeta. I've yet to see a scum!shelly game like this one; one where she's not aggressively pushing her scumreads are arguing with people. Her tone is also more relaxed and casual than her scumgame, where she's very blunt and antagonising. This

could

be the game where she turns that meta all around, but I'm not betting money on it.

VOTE: maria-bulge

Neither has given me reason to think they're town.

I still think Fire is sus and his reaction to Oka didn't convince me.

uh, question: shelly said in 2431 that she was playing different to her meta intentionally. does that have an impact on you reading her? it feels like her outright stating that would like, nullify something like this a bit. granted she can't change it all in a single game (if she can okay then damn go off) but, yeah.

Yeah, she can say she's changing it, and do think she's making an effort to, but I'd be impressed if she were scum here and has changed as many aspects of it as she would've here.

I've seen shelly play a lot of scumgames; Death Curse, Morning Tweet's Normal, Manatee's Large, her newbie game with Noraa, and comparing any of those games with her play here is light and day. She would've had to changed a lot, that's what I mean. I've gone over the differences a few times now.

[Hectic]

she just rolls scum a lot... it's not my fault

[Hectic]

I don't get it

[Hectic]

lol I see

[Hectic]

Isis, what's your read on leuz? As far as I can tell, he's trying to push this through with pure WIM/determination, it's really weird how he's arguing for this so much when he doesn't actually, or at least hasn't made a case for shelly/I being scum.

He thought shelly scummy because nothing out of scumrange.
He though I was scummy because of the alt outing to Pooky theory, and that you scumread me.

You then thought I townslipped for that same alt outing theory, which should impact both reasons leuz had for reading me, but he has not updated or let that impact his read whatsoever

[Hectic]

I still have zero read on either of Maria or Bulge, probably should ISO them

leuz, is the "secret" that it's a policy thing because you feel you can't work with me when we're both town?

@leuz

@@leuz

[Hectic]

Isis, you’re familiar with hectic and Shelly— do either of them actually seem very interested in playing this game?

Why is this argument being used for Hectic-shelly, when MariaR-Bulge both have far fewer posts and interest in playing?

hectic-shelly (who are both null-to-scum, neither one has towntold)

If your argument is both of us haven't towntold and have little less than average motivation to play, then why is this not being applied to the other two?

It would make my top hat wither if this is scum!leuz who manages to push a miselim through with the reasons he's been giving

[Hectic]

[Hectic]

It would make my top hat wither if this is scum!leuz who manages to push a miselim through with the reasons he's been giving

Why do I bother doing this if I’m scum

Because MariaR/Bulge has a scum partner

or just because mislaunches are required to win the game

[Hectic]

Yyyydraaaaaaaaaaaasse

[Hectic]

Why do you keep evolving into new forms, Isis

should I be afraid of what you'll become by the end of this

[Hectic]

You're pushing the wrong pair if you're town, leuz. I'm town, and I'm pretty sure shelly is as well from meta + pt posting. also, you're ignoring like really important evidence which you shouldn't be. shelly gunned to kill Pooky in final 3, she asked Tayl0r to. shelly is someone who Tayl0r trusts, and that is actively going to affect Tayl0r's choice. Pooky was hard buddying me, and it's obvious to tell we're not aligned from our interactions

[Hectic]

lol

Should be channelling the same disappointment and judgemental energy your way then?

[Hectic]

*should I be

[Hectic]

Debatable, but not something you've bother to debate or explain

[Hectic]

Whadya think, Isis? does Mene go to this extent on the insults if he's scum? maybe not

[Hectic]

I still prefer

MariaR/Bulge

>

Fire

/

Oka

>

Bell

/

Tayl0r

>

leuz

/

Ydrasse

I think

weird

[Hectic]

Hope you enjoy your movie, leuz

[Hectic]

Yeah... it kind of sucks, but I think this probably just means he's town

I should go back and read your cases on Ydrasse, but I do think her reaction to Pooky flipping scum is emotion she hasn't come close to faking in any of her other scumgames, where she'll get annoyed but not fake being upset or overblown like that. Also, there is merit in what leuz has been saying about her PT posting

[Hectic]

I guess it's like achievement hunting, that's one you could've beaten Legolass to

[Hectic]

I was thinking of modding another achievement hunter game... but actually have the achievements give points based on "difficulty" or tier, and then make the points spendable on role abilities.

And then have the achievements achievable inside the scum PT, so town can't control giving all of them to specific players.

[Hectic]

what's the point of playing mafia without nonstop derailing and fluff

[Hectic]

People are being pocketed probably

At this stage though, it's just less optimal to want to kill your own pairing, given there's only 1 unknown compared to 2 in all other pairings. Unless you have a good scumread.

[Hectic]

Thought I already did

[Hectic]

I'm being curter and less filtery this game. Usually I

present

my posts in a way, like Odd Day Jester. It's easier to see I'm town if you look at my meta when I play this way though, much harder for me to fake

[Hectic]

*cough cough* tea leaves

[Hectic]

People are being pocketed probably

At this stage though, it's just less optimal to want to kill your own pairing, given there's only 1 unknown compared to 2 in all other pairings. Unless you have a good scumread.

Plz stop playing survivalistically, it's throwing me off and is very much not your town meta. It just comes off as insincere.

I'm talking about in being optimal in general for other people, not my pairing. I townread shelly.

[Hectic]

beeboy needs to post soon to dodge a prod

I want to see a good emoji

[Hectic]

Good idea. beeboy, can I get some avatar reads from you while you're at it?

Also, are you half bee-half boy? Or a third be-a third eb-a third oy?

[Hectic]

isis

leuz

oka, gamma

dunn

akarin, bell, maria, bulge

firebringer, shelly, hectic

-

there’s a lot of blurry space in this admittedly but yeah

beeboy is not real for the purposes of this

Maybe Ydrasse is scum. She has the same Intel on shelly's meta that I do... and this isn't her scum game. I've also played fairly similarly to how I usually do as town.

I don't know why scum!her would want us out in particular, but

shrug

, I don't get these reads!

This game has been frustrating, and I won't bother to fight this. Assuming shelly flips town, maybe there's an argument to BoP Dunny for 0/4.

[Hectic]

hectic me voting you actually raises your chance of living interestingly enough so please fight this one out

My scumelans are Bell and Firebringer. The Bulge is nullscum, and I have no read on MariaR.

It'd probably feel better more worthwhile to fight this if I could push somewhere, but where?!@? You and Tayl0r are towny, so I don't know what the optimal play is

[Hectic]

lol

shelly's no motivation is a massive towntell, she's never played a scumgame like this. She's said in our PT that she just lolpaired with me, and I believe it. I don't think there's some massive conspiracy where she could've had the vig shot but chose not to because she's scum with Pooky

[Hectic]

Yeah, that's why I wanted Maria/Bulge. 2 big ???s

Oka/Fire would only be for Fire. Oka radiates town

I think the leuz is town for the toxicity which sucks, but it is what it is. Ydrasse who knows now, my confidence has been shattered.

Isis has been kinda scummy, but I think scumclaiming for her is a towntell, willing to locktown this.

I liked beeboy's answer to me regarding MariaR being an anime girl irl. Fairly nuanced theory which makes him lockbeeboy.

Uh, what else. Akarin had felt pleasant and reasonable? In a way that's exactly what scum wants to do while other pairings duke it out, but I've seen things that make sense, and nothing that scumpings, so more likely she's just town.. right??

Dunny is Dunny. It's hard for me to give a read here. I've seen both sides of his dance play as either alignment, and his range is wide. Probably best way to judge him is if he catches you scum or not.

I think I talked about Bell/Firebringer/Oka. Tldr is that Bell weird posturing EoD, Pooky didn't seem to care supporting 2 scum in final 3 theory. Firebringer playing to scummeta, no solving which he'd be doing as town. Where's the GOLDEN BLOC, or whatever it was called. And Oka feels very comfortable and natural in-thread, probably my strongest townread. I would cry more than Isis if he was scum.

Not that you guys will sheep any of this obviously, but those are my departingish thoughts.

[Hectic]

Is it worth the effort to meta case you...

sigh

[Hectic]

Do you think we should leave in style, shelly

[Hectic]

I'm more of an advocate for dirttilling

[Hectic]

hectic you can metacase me maybe that will help me find motivation

That's a lot of work...

I've been going on about how this is your townmeta for a while and no one's been listening, unsure if it would change anything. I don't want to sink more effort into this game if we're going to die anyway, which I'm like 80% sure we're going to right now.

[Hectic]

@hectic im not in a tryhard enough mood to make a golden grouping or hunt super hard. Dance games are better as chill games

Did I just happen to only play with you when you're in that mode? You were like that in the game where it was Hoctac/Auro scum in a hood, and you repped in and said all the right things

[Hectic]

Hectic sir do you think I'm townreading or scumread your offer to leave the dance take wild guesses

Hmmmmmmmmm

scumread? I could've asked shelly in our dance PT instead *taps top hat*

[Hectic]

I don't want to sink more effort into this game if we're going to die anyway, which I'm like 80% sure we're going to right now.

i can try be the town version of noraa D1 in death curse

lol I don't think it's an easy feat to replicate that

That was different anyway, people had very good reason to think Noraa was scum. I think we're both being pushed because less people townread us, not that we're doing anything scummy, weirdly enough. I guess I'm voting MariaR/Bulge for the same reasons, so can't really complain there

[Hectic]

Hectic sir do you think I'm townreading or scumread your offer to leave the dance take wild guesses

Hmmmmmmmmm

scumread? I could've asked shelly in our dance PT instead *taps top hat*

And yet you chose to lamist instead

I want a redeemable token, Isis

[Hectic]

Dance PT Correspondence:

-shelly actually wants to leave after getting all her thoughts out
-we both just learned mafia win when the timer runs out
-ruleset is now being read in more detail
-shelly performed a frontflip

[Hectic]

More Correspondence (paraphrased):

shelly:

why would you tell them all that?

Hectic:

maybe they'll see it as townspew

shelly:

it just looks really lamist

Hectic:

do you think we should go for a lamiss strat instead?

shelly:

hmmmm ok let's try it

Hectic:

someone asked me to press 4 for them in the elevator, and I pressed 3 by mistake

[Hectic]

Even More Correspondence (paraphrased):

shelly:

what if i go in there and pretend some of that correspondence didn't happen?

Hectic:

Why would you do that... that'd make me a liar

shelly:

it'll make you look too scummy to be scum

Hectic:

Ohhh okay, yeah, go for it. I'm gonna be relaying this too btw

shelly:

wait doesn't that defeat the purpose

Hectic:

It's correspondence WIFOM

[Hectic]

all im saying is marathon weekend in in 3 days so we should wait 3 days to execute : )

This is the towniest thing you've said so far

I might not have to worry about that though +)

[Hectic]

I feel good about mafia again.

VOTE: Hectic

I do think Hectic just fence sat on every possible pairing.

I gave individual reads, not my fault some pairings have a scummer and a towner inside them.

[Hectic]

Ydrasse

, how much do actually think shelly/I are scum? I still can't get over the fact you have both of us bottom and lower than Bulge/MariaR in your readslist. Are you sheeping or heavily influenced by leuz's thoughts on us? I feel like you're reasonably familiar with both of us, I'm struggling to wrap my head around it.

I feel good about mafia again.

VOTE: Hectic

I do think Hectic just fence sat on every possible pairing.

I gave individual reads, not my fault

all

pairings have a scummer and a towner inside them.

Fencesitting on individual reads can be a scumtell. Your theory is that I'm lining up my reads to ensure I have 1 scum and 1 town in all pairs? what purpose does that even serve?

It isn't even true btw, it's only true of your pairing, and Oka/Fire's pairing where I have a clear town/scum in both.

[Hectic]

Feels like OMGUS tbh, rather have me out if I scumread you, right?

[Hectic]

Flexibility. Why can't you imagine that?

Not really in the position where scum!me should care about flexibility. Probably a lot easier to make up some reasons to scumread MariaR/Bulge, rather than admit I'm voting them because they're mostly null or nullscummy.

[Hectic]

I just don't think you're being genuine in your hunting.

Do you have examples?

[Hectic]

You think shelly here looks like she did in Death Curse? Her play is light and day.

Tayl0r is an obvious townread in that she opted to let Pooky die.

What's not genuine about those reads?

[Hectic]

I've been townreading shelly since day 1 before I was partnered with her. and it isn't just a single game of meta, I've reiterated this over and over, but I've played with scum!shelly 3 times, and seen her play 4 times, this isn't it.

[Hectic]

Where has she openwolfed, or "giggled inside", which would make my read disingenuous?

[Hectic]

You think shelly here looks like she did in Death Curse? Her play is light and day.

Tayl0r is an obvious townread in that she opted to let Pooky die.

What's not genuine about those reads?

but you also think Bell is scum
what's so towny about Taylor picking Bell!scum over pooky!scum?

Tayl0r is towny for that unless Bell is scum, yeah. I'm not going to preflip analyse my way into thinking Tayl0r is less towny for killing scum!Pooky, because Bell could be scum. That's something to evaluate when.. oh wait, we can never see Bell's flip before your flip, this is true, huh.

[Hectic]

Two sides of the same argument. /:

I don't get what you mean by this

My point is that meta is useful for reading her, and has been very useful to me in previous games for identifying are town/scum.

In Bus Service, I replaced in while she was a leading wagon with no counters on day 1, I immediately recognised she was town, and got the wagon to dissipate.
In Morning Tweet's Normal, I was very, very certain she was scum for a time early on, entirely due to meta and her play being very aggressive/blunt, and in bad faith.

I don't know how else to explain it, but meta is very useful for reading her until she demonstrates a game where she's completed changed it up.

[Hectic]

Yep, if you're town, Gamma's slot should have a lot of towncred for picking you over scum.

The reasons to think you could be aligned with Pooky are for different reasons irrespective of Tayl0r's play. It's you saying you didn't in care for which us would be flipped in 1220, but clearly having a preference given the reasons you listed out there. You also made 1119 before that. Pooky's ISO being "fluff" does not compare to the reasons you gave for me, why not just state you prefer me to being left behind?

[Hectic]

...Are you telling me that I don't think meta is useful for reading her?

I still don't get what you're going on about here. We were talking about why you don't think my use of meta on her is genuine.