CONTROL - GAME OVER!

[Cephrir]

Good evening

VOTE: Bell

[Cephrir]

Hopefully i die early and won’t be too much of an part in the upcoming madness.
I’ll also try to be more chill this game since i tend to easily lose my temper.

Did u mean to post this in ur scum thread

[Cephrir]

Just make a blind vote and be boring Norwee, when will you ever learn…

I was mostly joking chill bruh

[Cephrir]

Some of you folks are so awkward. But y.
What secrets are you hiding.

Would you care to elaborate?

[Cephrir]

Day 2

Dear D.I.A.R.Y.,

So far the mission is going according to plan. No one has figured out that I'm an alien. The earthlings are... "friendly," as they say. I have much to learn about this culture. As of yet, I have not identified any Bad Earthlings. I hope the others can assist me, as the combination of my superior deductive capabilities and Earthling knowledge of their own traditions should surely be formidable.

Yours,
Ce'phyy

P.S. I don't know what Control is actually about.

[Cephrir]

Can I help you

[Cephrir]

ah, good, we're going to have ~fun~ this game

[Cephrir]

thank you ma'am may i have another

[Cephrir]

ah, good, we're going to have ~fun~ this game

Look if you didn't want to get burned down early then you should've used your noggin before you fluffposted, now its too late and that's your problem not mine

how dare i attempt to have fun. i should be burned at the stake for this heinous crime

[Cephrir]

ah, good, we're going to have ~fun~ this game

Look if you didn't want to get burned down early then you should've used your noggin before you fluffposted, now its too late and that's your problem not mine

how dare i attempt to have fun. i should be burned at the stake for this heinous crime

Fluff isn't a crime

It's the scum poking out of it

i'd be interested in seeing you try to explain this without copying LLD's homework

[Cephrir]

This isn't a general motivation scumread Ceph.

It's a YOU read. I'm sorry if that feels shitty but I drew green and I'm kind of obligated to drink em if I got em

i mean it sucks that i'm not allowed to entertain myself according to you, yes

i don't think i would make any risky posts as scum early in this game knowing that you are playing, and i am not so dense as to think that post wouldn't draw attention to me

[Cephrir]

i don't begrudge you attempting to have reads or anything, go nuts, i just wish they were different ones

[Cephrir]

what is the harm in elaborating on that further?

i was thinking of doing this gimmick before receiving my role PM based on my vague impression of what the game is about (i have watched someone play it for exactly 5 minutes), if that helps

[Cephrir]

i have to imagine my ability to suss out what i need to do to evade a bad outcome isn't actually related to the color of my role pm, it would be my ability to execute on it that would change

[Cephrir]

i have to imagine my ability to suss out what i need to do to evade a bad outcome isn't actually related to the color of my role pm, it would be my ability to execute on it that would change

I would argue your ability to do it and your success rate goes up if you are green over red but

If you wanna bus for cred I will give you cred too. Lol

you expect me to catch scum? when have i ever done that

[Cephrir]

i have to imagine my ability to suss out what i need to do to evade a bad outcome isn't actually related to the color of my role pm, it would be my ability to execute on it that would change

I would argue your ability to do it and your success rate goes up if you are green over red but

If you wanna bus for cred I will give you cred too. Lol

you expect me to catch scum? when have i ever done that

I mean you were the only one to catch me in several different games where you were left alive because of your lack of ability to convince people and then killed as the final vote.

I believe in your ability to catch. Not your ability to push. Both are normally required hence the failure rate.

But now you have my angy firebird self at your heels and possibly willing to push something of yours to test your alignment.

So you only need to solve, not push this time.

So do the work. If you are town, i trust myself to see it. If you arent, I trust myself to kill you.

i can give that a shot i suppose

i'm not sure if my reads are actually better than random unless i put on my effort hat, i just know better than to trust you

[Cephrir]

bell is town, but i don't expect any points for that brain blast

[Cephrir]

i agree that it's at least a reasonable opinion for LLD to have and i don't suspect her for having it

[Cephrir]

Ircher why do you think I'm making any claims about Cephrir specifically and not a general statement about anyone in the circumstances Cephrir finds himself in

i don't think you have made any claims about me specifically? your case is based on a general statement?

[Cephrir]

also, we have never played mafia together before, so ????

[Cephrir]

oh, i understand your post now

[Cephrir]

i would still like a more thorough explanation of post 80 mush

if you're right and i'm scum, then i will surely have already relayed what mistake i made to my scumteam, so i don't see what the harm could be in outing your secret flavor read

[Cephrir]

This isn't a general motivation scumread Ceph.

It's a YOU read. I'm sorry if that feels shitty but I drew green and I'm kind of obligated to drink em if I got em

i mean it sucks that i'm not allowed to entertain myself according to you, yes

i don't think i would make any risky posts as scum early in this game knowing that you are playing, and i am not so dense as to think that post wouldn't draw attention to me

What?
So you make risky posts as town but not scum. Is what you’re saying?
Why make risky posts at all if you identify them as such?

i don't care if people notice me this game because i'm town

[Cephrir]

Its not a secret. Your role PM is like blatantly either Trench or Dylan full stop send tweet

that means absolutely nothing to me or to anyone else who doesn't know the flavor, so i don't consider this an explanation

[Cephrir]

I am neither trench nor dylan

Are you Cephrir though

i am also neither of those characters

[Cephrir]

@norwegian

Some of you folks are so awkward. But y.
What secrets are you hiding.

Fos three bears.
Fos ceph.

Ircher is projecting my projection into his own projection he is hiding secrets! I am joking.
But maybe not.

Oops.
I am posting. I said I wasn’t gunna do that.

No, this isn’t a crumb.

VOTE: Cephrir

Wheee

Who killed LLD and replaced her with generic good player variation #5

Cephrir’s only hang up is that he hates that people expect him to get mad when he’s town.

bell is town, but i don't expect any points for that brain blast

Nah, it's too early to make that read.

It’s true. I am fairly good at getting reflex reads as scum. It’s later on when I have ~le trobles~

i think all of these posts are +town. they read naturally and come off as being at ease and open with information. it is my belief that scum bell would not be at ease.

[Cephrir]

i find it slightly odd that bears has chosen to take issue with arcade's comment on the game pace rather than anything relevant

[Cephrir]

i'm not following the logic

weird cephy could be scum cephy but i'm not sure it is, ceph often goes into things with plans to do crazy things sometimes so i believe the "i was going to do this before i got my role PM"

ceph's also a good enough talker to probably get out of being scum read if he is scum so i'm not sure what LLD's end goal is

i don't necessarily town read cephy though i should say

This feels like a long worded fence post and not in a good way. I doubt Ceph will be exe'd due to their current posting and the wagon is only three votes. But, maybe I'm being a little harsh given how slow the game is.

Did you just call someone out for fence sitting and fence sit in the same post?

Yes.

i want to beat up this post and wear it as a sock

That is quite aggressive. Might I suggest a softer solution?

socks are soft

ur cute

my non-exhaustive observation of your games has led me to believe that you are less charismatic as town, but the intentional obtuseness and ignoring the question here does track with my internal model

is this a poor assessment?

[Cephrir]

you seem awfully concerned with discrediting this attack that hasn't even happened yet

[Cephrir]

ah, the "no u" defense

[Cephrir]

i mean rebutting an attack after it's been posted is pretty normal, idk why it merits attention right now

[Cephrir]

when did i try to preempt an attack before it was posted?

[Cephrir]

that context is helpful thank you

[Cephrir]

I should probably shut up now. As much as I love to post. I have dumped enough to coast as town for the next week or two.

Just as planned.

*ignores ircher*

if u don't have bell town yet u are streets behind

[Cephrir]

Greeting, buddy, I think you are the only one other than Ircher who doesn't get the first two parts by now, its not like I've been hiding shit this game, I gave up that conniving scheming playstyle after the fiasco of Mtn Dew Mafia. I am an open book come and read me

As for why, I'm gonna save it till you decide to accept what the entire rest of the player list has, purely because it amuses me to watch you get held up on this small simple thing

Okay, well, if you want to be read by whatever you post solely then I won't be questioning you. It's not like I can force you to respond either.

I'll leave judging what's a small simple thing to myself, and it would be a small simple thing if it wasn't part of a chain of small simple things that form a pattern.

What is your read on Mush?

While catching up with the thread their behavior struck me quite strongly with the amount of fluff they're posting. They seem to be masking it with an aggressive and trollish posting style. None of their votes seem serious, none of the things they post seem serious.

They latch to random players for what seems to me no valid reason. And yet that doesn't stop them from latching on to

Cephrir

for doing the same thing (80).

They refuse to answer to questions themselves. And yet that doesn't stop them from questioning

Dwlee99

(67).

They're deliberately making unclear statements for reasons unknown, and I don't see how any of them aid the town cause (54 among most of their posts actually).

I think that creating unnecessary confusion is a scum tell to be fair.

VOTE: MUSHSHAGANA

X

Quick skim up and only looking for my name. I am scum read after posting exactly one post. Quite an overreaction :/

Mush is scum for none of the reasons they said. I just hate the tone of every single post they've posted. It really doesn't feel like the town Mush I know. I get that it's really been a while but I don't feel like people change this much. I might do some meta to check that, we'll see. Town Mush to me is very much passionate about the game but Mush is being too passionate in a way that makes me want to actively discredit them here. It's hard to explain but essentially it feels exaggerated and it's the way to make yourself seem less "threatening". It sort of makes it so that when people try to scum read you, they question if you genuinely believe something and it gives them that little pause. I'm in a survivor mindset at the moment but it's the idea that mush is subconsciously (or purposefully) actively trying to seem less threatening. It just makes people not want to vote you.

I don't know how to explain it right now. It's purely tonal and I don't think my explanation does it any justice.

-noraa

X

[Cephrir]

But so many posts just feel unnecessary. I can't get over that.

what's wrong with unnecessary posts?

[Cephrir]

meh. that reaction didn't change my bears read at all.

how does anyone still fall for fake dayvigs, it's so old hat.

i don't know who tet is, but they seem townish.

[Cephrir]

meh. that reaction didn't change my bears read at all.

how does anyone still fall for fake dayvigs, it's so old hat.

i don't know who tet is, but they seem townish.

Even if I told you, you wouldn't know. But I'll take all the townreads so.

i got it down to 3 based on the info you're handing out like candy and i think this puts it down to 1, but i've been wrong before

[Cephrir]

On the topic of Cephy, I don't have a read but one thing I found weird was that he jumped on Mush for being defensive but then also gave my posts an 'x'. If he thought mush and i were svs, that would be weird. I'm also just all around confused on what his read on Mush is. I think though that Fenny saying that he had a decent read on Cephy makes me feel better about him.

-baby bear

i am not townreading mush, but i didn't think your reasons for scumreading mush were good

[Cephrir]

what's yucky about it?

fwiw i don't have a problem with the ircher votes, but i'm on the fence whether they come from scum or low charisma. if someone thinks they can see scum motivation there feel free to elaborate.

pedit: oh good.

[Cephrir]

they = ircher's posts, not the votes on him.

[Cephrir]

Comfy in my usual spot at the bottom of mastina's read list. Should I even bother trying to wring reasons from a stone. It's so tiresome.

Wanna turn over a new leaf this game and say why without doing that thing where you say it just feels like scum 5 different ways?

[Cephrir]

I'm just going to go to bed. I eagerly await waking up to disappointment

[Cephrir]

Tet I don't see shit buddy, how bout you explain it to me so I can LOL abt it

mastina Idk what your Deal is with the town/scum "sorting" you're doing BUUUUUUUUT I don't like it can you explain the fuckin reads you're doing please thanks in advance!!! Also what the fuck I trust LLD every game I play with her to date tbh it should be NAI LOL

First paragraph: I dont get where the confidence is coming from here. They did explain it already, and I agree with them

Second: no, she can't. If you expect logic from everyone you are not going to like mastina.

[Cephrir]

i'll just give it a go: i believe tet's point is that your initial argument against me shouldn't be mitigated by any actions i take after the fact. if you believe i've scumslipped, then it shouldn't make a difference whether my posts are good

[Cephrir]

But like its not hard to believe you might have come up with "alien imposter" shit on your own also????

considering i know this to be true, i agree!

i think people usually see scumslips as binary and if you don't that may be where the disconnect is

[Cephrir]

As promised, here are some examples of MUSH's fallacious logic.

The content of your post reads EXACTLY in theme with a specific part of Control, but its a part that wouldn't be very likely to come up in a green role PM. If you hadn't fluffposted without thinking through the consequences of your actions you might have been fine, but instead you fluffposted in a way that gave the game away, precisely because you didn't know what you were talking about. Sorry bud

According to MUSH, Cephrir is scum for 57 because it isn't likely to have come from a town role pm. Let me point out some of the various ways this argument is fallacious:

1: It presupposes that Cephrir is familiar with the source material. This is evidently false because in 57, Cephrir explicitly states he is not familiar with the source material. You may argue that it's scum indicative regardless, but there's nothing preventing someone with a town alignment who is unfamiliar with the source material from making the exact same post. While it may be true perhaps that a scum role pm may make such a post more likely (I wouldn't know as I don't know the source material), it is at best a marginal difference.

2: It also presupposes that Cephrir's role is directly related to the post at hand and that Cephrir pulled material from his role pm to make that post. There is no evidence in favor of this assumption; in fact, later posts highly suggest this is not the case as Cephrir denied MUSH's guess in 123.

The following two go together.

Ircher why do you think I'm making any claims about Cephrir specifically and not a general statement about anyone in the circumstances Cephrir finds himself in

Ceph and I have never played together, there is no meta being used here

I guess you're still scum. Great job bolstering my early hypothesis

MUSH's argument here is that I am scum at least in part because I misinterpreted one of MUSH's earlier posts as being a specific observation about Cephrir rather than a general observation. For reference, the post I misinterpreted was 63:

Look if you didn't want to get burned down early then you should've used your noggin before you fluffposted, now its too late and that's your problem not mine

I would like to point out that if you are reading chronologically (and thus haven't seen the elaboration in 80, then it is very easy to interpret this post as MUSH scum reading fluffposting in general. My assumption was since that in the general case, that does not equate scum, there must have been something specific between MUSH and Cephrir that led to Cephrir's post being scummy in MUSH's eyes. 70 does not contradict my initial assumption; in fact, it reinforced it. Finally, there was also Lady Lambdadelta's take in 71, and her take is in fact a meta read. These factors combined, my original assumption, while incorrect, was reasonable. The issue here is that MUSH is trying to twist this around and paint it as scum!me protecting scum!Cephrir. MUSH is completely ignoring the "how would town come to this assumption" and instead jumps straight to the conclusion that reinforces MUSH's own preexisting bias. The argument that I am scum for making an incorrect assumption is fallacious because it completely ignores all the other equally plausible scenario and instead picks the one that fits in the most with MUSH's narrative.

Thanks for responding.

I've also read into the whole

Cephrir

thing and I think it's missing the information on what kind of insider information did they reveal. So maybe it's not fallacious reasoning

per se

, but definitely lacking some explanation that should have been there.

And also, there is the issue of how that wagon was suddenly dropped in favour of voting out you.

I agree with what has been said in the second part of your post and that's also part of my objection with regard to

MUSHSHAGANA

's slot too. Thing is, there's a lot of strong voices in defense of this slot which involves that player's meta and it's made me more hesitant to go with that too. Which is why I dropped it.

I think this post is good enough for me to not want to vote out

Ircher

yet

after all.

i think this is town

[Cephrir]

in fact im gonna go out on a limb here and say that's the single towniest post in the thread. fight me

[Cephrir]

Like. Can you explain why's Roden scum and not bad town here LOL

i feel like he did

do you need to dunk on every idea anyone presents

[Cephrir]

Even if it were true, you're saying you'd scum read me if I stayed the course and still scum read me if I walked it back. That's a pretty dishonest way to try to read me

what's dishonest about that? if someone thinks you've performed a scummy action are they obligated to let you go if you hit the right note?

[Cephrir]

VOTE: Roden

[Cephrir]

@bell i believe we've reached the point where, in the parlance, i'm supposed to call you a towel, yes?

[Cephrir]

I'd appreciate it if you stopped trying to make yourself mis-elim bait.

ooh, threats!! my unvote is on its way now for sure!!

[Cephrir]

Even if it were true, you're saying you'd scum read me if I stayed the course and still scum read me if I walked it back. That's a pretty dishonest way to try to read me

what's dishonest about that? if someone thinks you've performed a scummy action are they obligated to let you go if you hit the right note?

That isn't what I said. Scum reading someone no matter what they say or do, and explicitly making it clear that that's what you're doing, isn't a real attempt at reading somebody.

"Scumreading you whether you walk back what you said or not"
"Scumreading you no matter what you say or do"

these aren't the same. you seem to have an issue with revisionism, friend!

[Cephrir]

You really like making your life difficult for no reason, huh?

you really think blustering is a good substitute for playing the game, huh?

[Cephrir]

nah, i just didn't see any point in continuing

[Cephrir]

I genuinely think it's honestly the best readslist I've made

lol come on. girl, you a parody of yourself.

[Cephrir]

These?

Yes, but also:

Lady Lambdadelta
The Three Bears (Titus, Flea the Magician, Noraa)
Bell
Save The Dragons
NorwegianboyEE
Tet
Roden
tictac
Malakittens

Dwlee99
Princess Elodie
Greeting

MUSHSHAGANA

T3
Toogeloo

Galron
MegAzumarill
Arcade Pals (Dunnstral, MariaR)

Ircher
Cephrir

This is, very obviously, Cephrir's scumgame. LLD was dead on the money with her accusation there. If I wasn't sheeping LLD's vote on Ircher I'd be voting Ceph to be honest because he's transparently scum and has been since page two.

This is, very obviously, not Ircher's towngame. LLD's suspicion there is dead on the money and her accusation there is good, so I am all too happy to sheep her there because she's right.

Arcade Pals instantly gave off incredibly bad vibes and while they're not as lockscum as Ircher and Cephrir are, they're still pretty damn suspect.

MegAzumarill is also pretty sketchy, although from memory I don't remember why. I can say that if I were to quote Meg's posts though it'd instantly stand out, similar to the way Arcade Pals and Galron would.

Galron just seems like obvscum here from the getgo, in a way similar to MegAzumarill and Arcade Pals, albeit my lack of familiarity with him and the comparatively minor nature of the scumness means he's higher on the list.

Toogeloo is a blank for me because they're Toog, honestly. I don't know how to read Toog. I just don't. And even if I thought I could (I know I can't), from Toog's content so far, I've got no read one way or another.

T3's content so far has been distressingly not town, but also not alarmingly scum.

Mush I can't get a read on, but I'm sheeping LLD's townread there.

Greeting is obviously town and pretty damn transparently so.
Ditto with Princess Elodie.
This is Dwlee's towngame here pretty obviously as well.

Malakittens I feel doesn't make her V/LA post in the way she did if she's scum so I think that she's town here.
tictac has made it instantly and very obvious that he's town here, from not just the claim but also play, where he's pushing, etc.
Roden, this is the town Roden I've seen before I'm like 90% sure of that.
Tet, knowing who Tet is, is very very VERY obviously town playing their towngame.
This is the towniest Norwee has ever been ever, so he's just obvtown.
StD is also the towniest he's ever been, at least if you know his meta (which by now, I do). This is NOT StD as scum, at all, whatsoever.
Bell's an open book to read. He's posting so he's town. Purely by play, this is my strongest townread.
LLD and The Three Bears are genuinely modslipped to be conftown. Even if they weren't, I think that LLD's town here and The Three Bears are quite painfully obviously town. Three Bears would probably be my second-strongest townread behind Bell (although with StD and Norwee in the running with Tet not far behind, it's a very close call since genuinely Three Bears StD Norwee Tet and Bell are all just THAT town this game), but the modslip elevates them even higher.

All of these reads I'm incredibly confident in and I legit think that this is genuinely my best D1 readslist of all time.

there is not a single reason anywhere to be found here, as per usual. put up or shut up.

also, princess elodie has 2 posts. no human could possibly genuinely think those posts are "obviously" town.

[Cephrir]

anyway, roden is in mastina's top tier, so seems like i'm on the right track c:

[Cephrir]

explain what's shit about it or shut the fuck up <3

[Cephrir]

This Roden argument is more pendantic than legal definitions defining what a search is. Let's not split hairs.

~Mama

it's not. he is straight up gaslighting to make it look that way

[Cephrir]

explain what's shit about it or shut the fuck up <3

Maybe the fact that you saw a reads list with all twenty other players in it and you got bent out of shape specifically over the town read on me?

bent out of shape? that's what one comment poking fun at mastina having bad reads is?

Or maybe the fact that your emotional investment in eliminating me is OTT and doesn't really match the little actual investment you have in trying to solve me?

i do get upset when you intentionally misrep me, yes. that also makes me very not interested in good faith engagement with you. you've done nothing to solve besides lie. it's not hard to solve that

Not to mention you haven't really had a single original take on me and have just been piggybacking what other people have said?

untrue

Your aggression in general has been completely unnecessary and came out of nowhere. It reeks of someone who's purposely trying to rile me up to shit up the thread with a dumb fight.

i'm excited that i have a read i feel good about

Also you've seen my weaknesses as scum and I honestly cannot fathom why you wouldn't try to target them if you actually scum read me.

i have played 2 scum games with you. i have no idea what your weaknesses are, and it's pretty weird to assume that everyone must play town in this calculated a manner

[Cephrir]

Also, defending yourself against an accusation isn't gaslighting.

i didn't say it was.

but you don't want to discuss this, so i won't

[Cephrir]

it is frustrating that i suck so bad at debates and narrative spinning that i won't be able to get anywhere with what sure feels to me right now like several smoking guns.

@LLD help or tell me i'm stupid?

[Cephrir]

My dude this is just a shit fight and we're getting nowhere

i mean, you sure made it look like one by using this post to say "no u" five times, sure

[Cephrir]

...............................................................................................................................

[Cephrir]

I ain't doing nothin either.

Are you scum tho

No but I keep having to check my rc because it's a weird role.

This was a weird post to make.

I missed this and it reminds me of scum galron.

[Cephrir]

skim skim skim but like t3 is being so towny. it cant be real right?

???

[Cephrir]

I'm not going to make any attempt to read mastina early on. her alignment will become obvious by day 3/4. It always does.

I see LLD has come and gone without giving me a sanity check.

[Cephrir]

i was wondering what about him is "being so towny" because i don't feel that way at all

[Cephrir]

i don't think i've played with him before

[Cephrir]

Mash feels fake to me, but I can't tell if it's legit or not.

i feel this - its tone is different and feels exaggerated but i don't know mush particularly well never mind who is fronting/etc so there's a good chance this is just how it is

[Cephrir]

Lots of people vibing with me this game.
Stop buddying me. *Sweats*

ill buddy you as much as i want and you'll like it

this is a threat

[Cephrir]

irchers always lhf. why is that ever a wagon on day 1 atp?

isn't t3 also? do you have any spicy scumreads?

[Cephrir]

irchers always lhf. why is that ever a wagon on day 1 atp?

isn't t3 also? do you have any spicy scumreads?

yeah but i still give reading him a shot because i think him as town is a little more obvi. idr if i had a good read record on him though.

is this a no to my second question? i was hoping you would suspect some higher charisma players given your take on lhf

[Cephrir]

i just don't agree that that's how wagons work, sorry

[Cephrir]

Did anyone need me? I swear I saw my name pop up a few times before I passed out

i would like you if you have a moment. have you read the interactions between roden/std/me

i feel like he's transparently scum but my tunnels are often wrong so would love an opinion

[Cephrir]

i was hoping you would suspect some higher charisma players given your take on lhf

Mmmmm i cant say much about this right now. but the answer is actually a yes. im just not the one that can answer this question.

i hope to hear what this is about later; i don't really love that my attempt to get a read on you has been passed off until your partner(s) return but as long as there is a reason

[Cephrir]

Did anyone need me? I swear I saw my name pop up a few times before I passed out

i would like you if you have a moment. have you read the interactions between roden/std/me

i feel like he's transparently scum but my tunnels are often wrong so would love an opinion

i read some of it. the walk back on the greeting/lld antialign thing?

that was the beginning, but i think he's tried to revise what his posts actually say several more times since then and is spinning a narrative to make it look like my issues with him are petty nothings to anyone who doesn't read it deeply

[Cephrir]

also, this is a new element but since someone else noticed it i'll give voice to this thought, he accused me of trying to start shit with my nothing points (they're substantial but whatever) but has himself been needling me while i try to drop it

[Cephrir]

i don't think i've played with him before

w h a t
defcon
scp upick

oh yeah

sorry

[Cephrir]

And if Noraa is town

ouchie this backtracking is going a little tooooo fast

The fuck? I’m not backtracking.
I’m expressing that my reads are never 100%. And i literally said the same thing when i first said i thought you were town. (That i could be wrong)

VOTE: norwee

why does this bother you more than roden's backtracking?

[Cephrir]

roden's backtracking

he does this a LOT as town as well as being extremely defensive.

i asked T3 a question please let him answer.

[Cephrir]

i don't have galron town yet but maybe i just like making the game hard

[Cephrir]

those don't do much for me! 872 is alright tho

[Cephrir]

makes sense

[Cephrir]

Bell/Norw/STD/LLD are never scum here.

maybe mush is scum after all. this is such a reach-y read. i dont believe that is all town and i cant imagine mush thinking that. mostly just the word 'never' makes it too extreme.

-babbie bear

this seems pretty extreme too

[Cephrir]

these quote stripes are just piles of nothing to me

[Cephrir]

I know it's in his scum range to try to target players he perceives to be LHF or easy to dominate in an argument

I dont perceive you as LHF, fyi.

I wanted to argue with these posts more bit I dont think it would be helpful

[Cephrir]

I think meg is an ok vote but my vote is better

[Cephrir]

Ok ok just one thing

I think "oh no there was nothing I could do to get you off my back" is a scum mindset.

[Cephrir]

haha

once i started lying, there was nothing i could do!

yeah no shit

[Cephrir]

i would like andante to give some depth on their reads

[Cephrir]

Also you and Ceph both beetlejuicing and attacking me back to back looks sus and organized as fuck. No idea why you're going out of your way to make yourself look as scummy as possible in pushing my mis-elim if you're scum, but if you're both town this death tunnel makes even less sense. So I have no idea what to make of it.

Either way you've been given multiple reasons and explanations for why I'm town, and not just from me but from others as well, and you've just chosen to ignore it to keep calling me scum no matter what is said. If you don't want to honestly engage with me on this then I don't particularly feel guilty engaging with you just as honestly.

Your message contains too many smilies. The maximum number of smilies allowed is 30.

[Cephrir]

@STD and Ceph:

What do you think about Ircher vs Meg?

I'm not sure there's anything particularly vs. about them.

I'd be deciding between the two of them for my vote if you didn't exist.

[Cephrir]

When did I say I think you're both mafia

Also you and Ceph both beetlejuicing and attacking me back to back looks sus and organized as fuck

[Cephrir]

So are you parking a vanity vote or are you going to rally the player list to vote me out first?

Not sure how you don't see them as competing wagons btw.

i am not much of a rallier. but i'm still holding out hope it will happen, yes

:shrug:

[Cephrir]

Me saying your posts look bad and will look bad to everyone else in hindsight after my potential mis-elim

once again, this is not what the snippet i quoted says

[Cephrir]

Why?

because your role pm is red. hope that helps!

[Cephrir]

I'm the one who wrote that post...? I know I said. Why are you trying to convince me what I wrote isn't what I wrote?

I am not trying to convince you of anything. I'm pointing out to everyone else how you continue to pretend your own posts say whatever you wish they said when challenged on their content.

[Cephrir]

I'm the one who wrote that post...? I know I said. Why are you trying to convince me what I wrote isn't what I wrote?

I am not trying to convince you of anything. I'm pointing out to everyone else how you continue to pretend your own posts say whatever you wish they said when challenged on their content.

That's not what's happening though? You're quoting a post and saying it says something it doesn't. If I'm telling you it doesn't say what you're claiming and I'm correcting you, then that means you're either misinterpreting me or misrepping me. And if what I wrote was just worded poorly, which I don't think it was, then my follow up post should be seen as a clarification.

I don't agree.

[Cephrir]

You don't get to say you don't agree.

Yes I do. I am not obligated to accept your version of events or to believe you when you say that your revisionism is "clarification."

[Cephrir]

i think you missed the point

you called us sus and organized but then got in a twist when we were like "so you think we're mafia" so I guess i'm trying to figure out what you meant by sus and organized if you didn't mean you thought we were mafia together

I'm saying it

looks

that way! I already said I don't think you're scum but your actions come off as scummy.

Surely you can admit how these two things are incredibly similar so why are we jumping down my throat for reading it this way.

[Cephrir]

i think you missed the point

you called us sus and organized but then got in a twist when we were like "so you think we're mafia" so I guess i'm trying to figure out what you meant by sus and organized if you didn't mean you thought we were mafia together

I'm saying it

looks

that way! I already said I don't think you're scum but your actions come off as scummy.

Surely you can admit how these two things are incredibly similar so why are we jumping down my throat for reading it this way.

i guess with this post i may have somewhat conceded the point on this particular one but it is interesting that this just keeps happening with only you and not anyone else.

[Cephrir]

yeah that's basically what i meant actually

[Cephrir]

oh okay i thoughtr there might be more to it

[Cephrir]

how should i know! i just figured your read seemed so strong you must have more than one or two odd posts, or be able to give more detail on why you disliked them so powerfully

[Cephrir]

iso'd them; it's not particularly exciting, that's for sure, and i'm not seeing a contiguous thought process. they don't seem to follow up on the questions they ask and appear to be both caught up and content to not do anything.

am i in the ballpark?

[Cephrir]

i mentioned him here and there

i feel like he gets elimed early a lot and i'm not sure i fully understand why everyone is so fixated on him.

i think i'm more interested in the equally boring behavior coming from a slot (arcade) that is occupied by players i think of as capable

[Cephrir]

let it be known that you responded to "cephypoo" with no complaint

fuck

[Cephrir]

i'm a little weirded out all i got was a "I don't fucking know," same with cephrir but maybe i can see that but i'm not sure how i'm floating in anyone's null space atm i can barely keep my damn mouth shut

I had the same thought; I could imagine someone thinking (particularly of me) "there is both good and bad here" but that is more substantial than "idk." I feel like there is plenty to read us on

[Cephrir]

I dont really know how to read noraa at all. Even the reasons they give for things, such as richer town because there is a wagon on him, seem to come from outer space. How do I engage that

[Cephrir]

it's so bad there's no way scum would deign to be seen with it so you're probably town lol

fun take

[Cephrir]

ircher at game start: super boring quote stripes
ircher under pressure looking like a likely lim: still super boring quote stripes

[Cephrir]

And your point is?

im not sure what that signals about your alignment if anything i just found it amusing

[Cephrir]

cephy if you could dayvig someone who wasn't me right now, who would it be

if you really have to ask this, i question whether you are reading the game.

[Cephrir]

Ceph took a pot shot at me over a read Mastina made earlier and reignited our shit fight

ah yes i too remember when i drove to your house and held a gun to your head to force you to respond to a comment that wasn't directed at you

[Cephrir]

cephy if you could dayvig someone who wasn't me right now, who would it be

if you really have to ask this, i question whether you are reading the game.

besides roden

arcade, i guess?

[Cephrir]

cephy if you could dayvig someone who wasn't me right now, who would it be

if you really have to ask this, i question whether you are reading the game.

besides roden

arcade, i guess?

besides arcade and ircher as well

at that point i would have to reread the lurkers but gun to my head, meg replacement

[Cephrir]

Ceph took a pot shot at me over a read Mastina made earlier and reignited our shit fight

ah yes i too remember when i drove to your house and held a gun to your head to force you to respond to a comment that wasn't directed at you

What is the point of posts like these if not to start another shit fight?

to defend myself against the aspersions being cast on my character

[Cephrir]

the roller coaster continues

[Cephrir]

i guess :/

[Cephrir]

VOTE: arcade

[Cephrir]

I don't have a strong read on LLD at this point, but Greeting is one of my top two townreads

Nevermind, looking again, LLD is also pretty strongly town to me. I didn't realise the significance of the mod reaction first time around.

That makes Rodens claim that LLD and Greeting are unaligned even more ???.


@Roden: Like, dude, come on. I've seen your play and coming up with a read on such absolute nonsense is just so far out of the range, I think I must be missing something.

All I want is for you to explain the thinking there. At the moment it looks like very much like you pulled it out of your arse to fit a scum agenda. I think strongly that Greeting is town here, but I understand

why

people night have said Greetings play was surface level scummy, so a fake push there looks like where I might have gone as scum.

The more you bluster around and lean on your white knights and try and shade your accusers, instead of just explaining the logic there, the more it just looks like you've been caught with your trousers down with that - but everyone is allowed a off game every now and again, I guess.

Oh no, when this person takes up the crusade I dislike it

[Cephrir]

Btw side-note, StD v Roden is pretty obviously TvT but I can't really go in as much depth as I'd prefer to there since I'm not sure I'll be able to get caught up yet alone be lucid. I'm running out of time tonight, both before I need sleep and in brain power.)

Wowee this sure seems like an example of a place where obvious scum cephrir must be different in an explainable way!!!

[Cephrir]

I will sheep mastina when the seas go dry and mountains blow in the wind like leaves.

[Cephrir]

I have no idea what mastina's alignment is. Call me on day 4.

[Cephrir]

I will sheep mastina when the seas go dry and mountains blow in the wind like leaves.

so mastina is town? I'll sheep you and dragons if yall agree on someone

I mean I think we both still want to kill roden but I want to see where this arcade wagon goes.

[Cephrir]

As a third party to this conversation I dont really think it's making andante look bad.

[Cephrir]

You're allowed to be bothered.

Idk, this push got me to iso arcade and discover that it was unimpressive, maybe you could do the same?

[Cephrir]

k

VOTE: ircher

[Cephrir]

shit i mean don't call me that agh

[Cephrir]

my norwee read is going down down down

[Cephrir]

i am certainly much further from trusting LLD than most of the thread is

i don't do unflipped associatives tho

[Cephrir]

i will think about that sort of thing if said flips come to pass ya.

but i don't get so cocky about my scumreads that anyone pushing them gets townpoints just for that

[Cephrir]

on further thought i think i'll just get the popcorn and sit this one out

[Cephrir]

lol toog

[Cephrir]

too much consensus on irch

Then what is your explanation for him not being dead yet?

[Cephrir]

Mega kept reiterating they couldn't catch up to the game due to it's length, they kept excusing themselves by that. But they were clearly reading posts as evidenced by their immediate response to me calling them out for coasting.
So why couldn't they make at least a little bit of worthwhile contributions to the recent postings at least? Or share at least a single read? I think they were just scared, they felt lost in the big scary town and couldn't keep up with the knowledge that they are a dirty dirty scum and any mistake in their posts would get them speedlimmed.

oh ok lmao

you're just scum capitalizing off a weak town player who couldn't keep up with this site large player game madness

VOTE: Norwegianboyee

Kind of a weird take from someone who was just pondering T3 as a suspect

[Cephrir]

Also I dont really like how suddenly this goes from norwe town to scum after just one post indicating he won't be an ally

[Cephrir]

aldente read

I think the people have the right to know
@andante are you fully cooked?

[Cephrir]

Lady is still town, but I'm a little wary considering that she is willing to expend creativity as scum. Makes the fake vig thing something that could be done by scum her

She has literally made this exact move as scum before so I hope no one thinks this is pit of the question

[Cephrir]

sir cakes wouldn't support a S/S gambit in thread

This is a poor assumption imo

[Cephrir]

Emotional reads are based on word flow and selection as well as tone. Frustrated peeps will use harder words, anger players use shorter words - just as a couple examples.

I think this can depend on the person

For example sometimes i experience more of a cold anger where I like, maintain intellectualism and use more logic

[Cephrir]

Also I dont really like how suddenly this goes from norwe town to scum after just one post indicating he won't be an ally

where does grendel indicate he thinks norwee is town

Maybe town is too strong a word but in 1658 he seemed to be considering it

[Cephrir]

LLD does something, Mod publically does two things, one of which SirCakez says was a bit of trolling, presumably meaning the other wasn't.

I really doubt the mod was like, "I'm gonna imply that I interfered with the game on purpose now as a fun clue"

[Cephrir]

I'm not sure I understand Cephrir. SirCakez said the locking of the thread was a bit of trolling, presumably to lend a bit of credibility to the idea LLD had legitimately dayvigged the bears. The other post wasn't mentioned, and would not do that. I assume therefore, that was legitimate and intended.

With respect to knowing that it was related to what LLD did, the short answer is that I don't know for sure, and that's what I mean by misunderstanding cause and effect, but if it wasn't, there is a big timing coincidence there.

so you think 322 is the mod intentionally telling us info about players' alignments???????????????

[Cephrir]

dear, are you just averse to using the post tag

you expect me to do work????

[Cephrir]

I think 322 was a mod response to an activated ability that prompts a public mod response, the existence of which potentially provides a clue to one or more players alignment.

You don't?

no. he was just confirming the dayvig as fake

[Cephrir]

Ceph, Dragons, Idk who I wanna vote, like, I don't think Grendel is a bad vote, I'm down to yeet Arcade too, ahhhhh

you really like to bounce around huh?

of those options i still prefer arcade

[Cephrir]

VOTE: arcade

[Cephrir]

arcade has received like 12 votes since their last post i wonder what they think about this (don't tell them it's just the 3 of us voting them 11 times)

[Cephrir]

Is there a case that's not based on activity?

why did you decide it was about activity

[Cephrir]

iso'd them; it's not particularly exciting, that's for sure, and i'm not seeing a contiguous thought process. they don't seem to follow up on the questions they ask and appear to be both caught up and content to not do anything.

am i in the ballpark?

these are my issues

[Cephrir]

What are your up to date thoughts on Norwee?

i think im pretty null on him despite his volume of posts. probably worth an iso at some point

[Cephrir]

I would like Cephy's take on this but anyways i cant be doing mafia rn. i have so much fucking hw.

i don't think different is automatically = scum. i can see that you believe that as it's pretty consistent in your takes on multiple players this game as well as defenses of yourself.

i think std is town currently, but i don't claim any particular talent for reading him

[Cephrir]

VOTE: arcade

VOTE: arcade

im telling.

VOTE: Arcade

What's the case?

Why do people keep asking about this but not asking for one on ircher.

[Cephrir]

Or grendel for that matter.

[Cephrir]

I think either of those is completely possible. I don't really believe in wagonomics. I know that one of the active votes that has not spent much time on it her is my own so I can certainly believe town players might not be rushing to vote him.

[Cephrir]

It her > there

Not sure how my phone managed that one

[Cephrir]

It does actually.

[Cephrir]

Roden of all people has finally outlined or drawn attention to at least one reason why ircher is suspicious; he is not wcumhunting. I'm more willing to vote there now.

[Cephrir]

They're the ones sitting on the side lines, not that I've checked in the last 10 pages, but we were already in molasses 10 pages ago.

Huh? I've been out in the trenches doing shit this game *more* than usual.

I feel like you're hanging onto a page 5 scumread of me even though you don't really have reason to.

UNVOTE:

Dunn has managed to give a town vibe so he is not the vote anymore. I need a VC.

[Cephrir]

They're the ones sitting on the side lines, not that I've checked in the last 10 pages, but we were already in molasses 10 pages ago.

Huh? I've been out in the trenches doing shit this game *more* than usual.

I feel like you're hanging onto a page 5 scumread of me even though you don't really have reason to.

UNVOTE:

Dunn has managed to give a town vibe so he is not the vote anymore. I need a VC.

Accurate.
Though I dunno about the town vibe. He always gets his claws out when pushed as town I'll give you that, but his reasoning still sucks this game.

By town vibe I dont mean hes jumped straight to the townread column, only that it's something as opposed to the nothing it was previously.

[Cephrir]

I'm never sure whether the right play is to give this type of claim a day. It seems like the consensus is yes so my opinion doesnt really matter.

VOTE: tictac
I'm not opposed to Val or roden either.

Elaborate on tictac?

I didn't hate his early posting, the back and forth with your slot actually. But I don't like that the contentious slots he's leaving open ended. What's specifically relevant now is his Ircher trajectory which goes :

Early ping/null with a downward trajectory because of It hers lack of posting (which didn't pick up) -> Ircher town because too many slots are scumreading them...ok -> wouldn't touch that wagon as it's about to flip.

But what really rubs me wrong is the posturing with the vote on Andante with nothing to back it up. As opposed to just riding his vanity wagon on std where he has at least pushed a case. It all comes off very fake. Even under the premise of compromise since it's just jumping from a nothing wagon to another nothing wagon.

I also did have the brief thought that tictac throwing mud at std might be important timing-wise on a red flip but I'd have to look back at who the leading wagon was. Or just a direct chainsaw for roden maybe.

VOTE: tictac

I knew I hated this slot.

[Cephrir]

Everything here is toned down and posted with the PURPOSE of making his reads softer

Could you explain how his posts are doing this with examples?

[Cephrir]

though i will say that i would not want to elim him even if he does claim he gets blocked tonight but thats a discussion for tomorrow not today.

Discussing this seems antitown

[Cephrir]

i don't really understand why we're voting andante so i'm going to ask for an explanation since i assumed the ircher wagon would generate one without my asking and it didn't

places i would be happy to vote rn: grendel, roden, val, tictac

im sure there are other places i could be sold on

[Cephrir]

also it's nice that i can mostly trust catboi since he replaced into a town slot.

[Cephrir]

Damn. Looking that over feels terrible. Full disclosure: my reads are shit because I'm too busy thinking about the girl I'm dating to care much about the game. Don't read too hard into my reads, trust Shrike's judgement, this is its game.

Agreed, your reads are shyte.

I really appreciate how committed you are to being constructive.

[Cephrir]

Seems like tictac is not going anywhere. Can I interest anyone in a val or grendel wagon? I dont think andante is playing like someone concerned about their image at all.

[Cephrir]

Although also I feel like everyone is scumreading tictac yet votes are avoiding him like the plague.

[Cephrir]

I'm not sure the phrase "avoiding like the plague" still works in an era where many people are running towards the plague, arms spread wide for a deep embrace.

[Cephrir]

tbh cephrir u are not reading what i am typing here

i keep saying! its ircher, andante, or the first doofus who thinks to defy my will. and it aint ircher, so....

will u be that doofus or will u get in line and hold ur fanciful ideas of ur immediate future for d2

I understand that you feel entitled to run the town for some reason but I do not particularly care

[Cephrir]

U could try talking to me about your andante read instead. You catch more flies with honey or whatever. Or you could try listening to my opinion!

[Cephrir]

VOTE: val

With me, all ye dubious.

[Cephrir]

ehhhhhhh @tet i dont like val but andante goes first. pls recall i said there were 3 options: ircher andante or whoever decides they can step to us

so im sorry to inform u that val is off the table for the moment



tho if u want reasons why allow me to suggst that u pls compare iso-- andante + dwlee starts badnull, gets to town, tanks nyooooooom down thru the floor 2 scumland

val is just solid scum thru n thru yeah but! V IMPORTANT t3 was THE SCUMMIEST EVER, everyone was like ??? ok thats just ur meta t3 gj. then val replacein. val slot aint as scummy as andante at the worst, theres less iso material, scummy predecessor had multi ppl trying 2 meta clear it, im not so sure on it goin redflip AND im thinking andantes a sure deal redslot

and im top shit until such time as i wreck some poor townie so andantes it for today

thank u for ur cooperation

i literally explained why andante is better pick than val tbh but ok LOL everybody just go lalala dont see it it cant hurt me im sorry 2 tell u it is real tho

This isnt really a case against andante

[Cephrir]

I just dont see the incessant votehopping as coming from someone who has to worry about their voting history getting dug up later

[Cephrir]

off wagon pushing tho... we hate 2 see it

What's wrong with it? Isn't this like... how the game progresses normally? This game is odd in that we've really never had a strong counterwagon to ircher.

[Cephrir]

one of these feels more like it could come from townie flounderin than the other u know

I mean, I agree... the paragraph you just wrote sounded like a reason to vote for val to me haha

[Cephrir]

Ceph what are yr actualy reasons for scumreading val

I dont have that on tap. I just remember disliking a few posts and I think andante is a bad vote. Oh uh, when he pushed roden that post felt slimy as hell to me and I've been like a primary advocate for roden scum.

[Cephrir]

I think being willing to against the consensus is typically a town quality. It's easy to blend in beating the same drum everyone else is beating.

[Cephrir]

Also her fixation on working with her small handful of town reads felt good to me.

[Cephrir]

I think being willing to against the consensus is typically a town quality. It's easy to blend in beating the same drum everyone else is beating.

As someone who has never played scum like this, I will say you can easily get burned thinking that way.

I mean, it's not that simple of course.

[Cephrir]

idk why easy = correct

[Cephrir]

lmao

VOTE: grendel

[Cephrir]

go for it

[Cephrir]

Good morning

[Cephrir]

VOTE: Bears

Spicy.

Need to talk with my other heads.

I also need to look at who made the last wagon and WHY dangit.


for now, VOTE: Norwee

The why really isnt much of a mystery

[Cephrir]

Replacements aren't NAI, especially when the reason is failing to keep up with the game/not caring

I wish they were

[Cephrir]

That elim goes through with or without scum votes every time. You can rev up the inquisition if you want I guess but I dont really see the point

[Cephrir]

VOTE: Ircher

[Cephrir]

Sure, I can be scum.

glad we're all on the same page!

[Cephrir]

I dont really see the point in litigating this today

[Cephrir]

Andante was fine for 3//4 of Day 1 then she took a dive when she forced a progression on Ircher. Her posting today has been more in line with what I expect from her, but it hasn't been good enough to buy back the equity she lost Day 1.

What does forced a progression mean

[Cephrir]

I can't buy a world with Andante as town, personally.

Dream a little

[Cephrir]

Then dont lol

[Cephrir]

Bears your plan doesnt really make sense

Whoever targeted you would know exactly what you're fishing for and not admit it

[Cephrir]

I think reaction tests usually involve info scum don't have, i.e. if you fake a guilty they don't know if you're really a cop or not

[Cephrir]

zzzzzz