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Post #108 (isolation #0) » Thu Apr 08, 2021 7:01 pm
Postby Andresvmb »
Hey everyone. I’ll dive deeper into the game tomorrow, I just wanted to stop by and say hi.
I’m not even sure if an RVS vote is even appropriate but since I’m playing here because of Infinity, you can imagine I have put a vote down there for now.
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Post #171 (isolation #2) » Sat Apr 10, 2021 1:44 am
Postby Andresvmb »
In post 121, Infinity 324 wrote:Andres is not posting because he's not confident in his scumgame
Or maybe I was busy around MY BIRTHDAY haha
To be honest, I think my Scum game is kind of decent. Not great, but decent. It’s a shame this is my 12th consecutive game rolling Town. What the hell man.
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Post #174 (isolation #4) » Sat Apr 10, 2021 1:54 am
Postby Andresvmb »
I have this feeling in my gut that SirCakez is overreacting to an entrance that didn’t strike me as particularly Scummy or Towny from Sha 77 to appear to be trying to solve.
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Post #179 (isolation #6) » Sat Apr 10, 2021 2:05 am
Postby Andresvmb »
In post 175, Infinity 324 wrote:I could see it. Cakez's push pinged me at first but I've had trouble reading him in the past and he feels kind of similar to when I played with town!him recently
Well I haven’t played with Cakez before so I don’t have any meta there.
Interestingly enough I’ve played with more than just you here in the past. I’ve been in games with Flea, tris, Ydrasse, and Alisae (not sure if recently, though I definitely remember an old game we played together where I lost in final 3 after incorrectly concluding they were Scum). I think my best bet at correctly guessing someone’s alignment is probably Ydrasse - I was able to figure out they were obvious Town last time around. But yeah not SirCakez.
In post 179, Andresvmb wrote:Alisae (not sure if recently, though I definitely remember an old game we played together where I lost in final 3 after incorrectly concluding they were Scum).
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Post #184 (isolation #9) » Sat Apr 10, 2021 2:24 am
Postby Andresvmb »
Alright I’m going to go out and enjoy my birthday. I’ll be back if not much later tonight, tomorrow. With the occasional checking in if I find a window of time.
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Post #429 (isolation #10) » Sun Apr 11, 2021 7:05 am
Postby Andresvmb »
I’ll be catching up as I eat lunch, so bear with me for a moment. I can obviously see we decided on the first person to heal, and we have to make a second decision. So I’ll be reading with that in mind.
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Post #439 (isolation #11) » Sun Apr 11, 2021 7:20 am
Postby Andresvmb »
In post 160, SirCakez wrote:Sha77 may legitimately be scum
Their opening was tonally weird and I hate this reaction
This just seemed too overconfident for me. Like you’re trying to get into a fight and not solve someone’s alignment. Sha said their early reads, which clearly were meant more as conversation starters than definitive pronouncements backed by multiple pages of play, weren’t actually all that serious (which again just seems reasonable to me since it’s the early part of the game). Yet you “hate” the reaction? What I would ask you is how do you not think this is a bit over the top? I skimmed through some of your more recent posts - and now you’re constructing a universe for the game where I’m Scum because I thought maybe you pushed an argument a bit too far? Please. Unfortunately there’s an aggressiveness to it that I need to figure out where exactly it’s coming from, and whether it’s Scummy or not. I wouldn’t vote to heal you, that’s for sure.
Yeah I know. I’m just trying to react to everything.
Besides it helps me after if I’m still around. When I look back, I want to be able to remember why I felt a certain way at a particular point in the game. So it’s for me as much as it’s for everyone else.
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Post #450 (isolation #15) » Sun Apr 11, 2021 7:35 am
Postby Andresvmb »
@Sha I have yet to play Scum on this forum, so you’ll have to go find some of my Scum games in the first place I started playing Mafia on. I quoted back a game with Alisae I played in this very game - you can find some Scum games from me there.
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Post #455 (isolation #16) » Sun Apr 11, 2021 7:38 am
Postby Andresvmb »
In post 451, SirCakez wrote:where did I construct a universe where you're scum? I think you are scummy but I don't think you HAVE to be.
You wrote that Alisae and I are Scummy but probably not both Scum. Alisae is actually reading me correctly, you’re not, yet we’re both Scummy. It’s completely manufactured.
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Post #467 (isolation #17) » Sun Apr 11, 2021 7:57 am
Postby Andresvmb »
In post 301, Ydrasse wrote:it's more the fact that he's spelling out the debate process to me that i dislike, thinking that he's trying to make it seem like he's thinking about things when he could have just said "i think this is anti-town behavior but i still scumread it"
This is an inaccurate way of reading what I wrote (and I’m not going to debate the reasoning for your SR which is just... yeah I don’t know what to say. That post is a real weak-ass attempt at making myself look good if that’s what I’m trying to do. Had I posted a full reads list and a pyramid where everyone is in my head, while parsing all of the posts up to that point - that would be me trying to make myself look good. I don’t have nearly that many reads so that would just be fake.)
What I was hinting at is that the obviously anti-Town behavior (I’m here, I think this game is boring basically, I’m going to sleep until something happens, and I’m not contributing [from Alisae]), seemed too obvious for Scum. Which is why I wasn’t SR’ing it.
And did you really not expect me to think about the game or posts as either alignment anyway? Would you rather I not show you my thinking process?
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Post #471 (isolation #20) » Sun Apr 11, 2021 8:13 am
Postby Andresvmb »
In post 383, Ydrasse wrote:though it'd be very funny if alisae and andres were some sort of scum faction together and i pinned them like that
This is bad. I can’t tell whether you’re misguided or Scum, but I find it fascinating that this early you think you’ve correctly figured out the Scum Team with such confidence.
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Post #478 (isolation #21) » Sun Apr 11, 2021 8:20 am
Postby Andresvmb »
In post 473, Sha 77 wrote:I don't think she expressed it with particular confidence
You may be right. I might have read some arrogance behind that post that perhaps isn’t there. Instead of it being “I believe I’ve pinned the Scum Team correctly early, and wouldn’t that be funny?”, it could be more of a “I don’t think I have it right, but if I did, that would be funny”.
Either way, it’s quite obviously wrong, and I find that deeply concerning.
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Post #479 (isolation #22) » Sun Apr 11, 2021 8:22 am
Postby Andresvmb »
I do genuinely believe that the safest play here is to vote where no interest has been shown yet. Flea is an incredibly safe choice. I don’t trust Ydrasse, and I don’t trust Sir Cakez. Sir Cakez calling Sha’s posts “gross” also seemed just overly aggressive again. I would push for consideration of a slot that hasn’t been in the conversation just yet. It’s less likely in my mind to be Scum.
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Post #481 (isolation #23) » Sun Apr 11, 2021 8:25 am
Postby Andresvmb »
And even if you find me Scummy, you can probably guess that I wouldn’t so openly push my Partner as the selection when they haven’t been close to the leading vote getter.
What do you hate about that reaction? You think those observations were serious?
Immediately dives on me to try to get me to change my mind
In post 396, Sha 77 wrote:I like the Ydrasse/tris/Sha townbloc, and honestly, I think Ali's suspicions come from a place of good faith too
really hate this attempt to declare a townblock
In post 399, Sha 77 wrote:Why is what gross, Cakez? Why aren't I just town who's happy with a townbloc that has me and someone who's likely town in it?
Immediately dives on me to try to get me to change my mind, again. I believe I'm the only one expressing suspicion of Sha too.
I don't know I can't point to many specific posts on ISO. but I just don't like the tone of many posts. it feels a little too "un-serious" in a very intentional and manufactured way. as opposed to Pooky's whose silliness I buy more.
Having said that, I understand very much where this is coming from. I can’t say I liked the Town block there either.
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Post #486 (isolation #25) » Sun Apr 11, 2021 8:33 am
Postby Andresvmb »
In post 482, Sha 77 wrote:Andres, if Flea is scum who just hasn't been feeling this game yet, do you really expect faer partner(s) to be pushing a heal onto Flea? I don't think the absence of interest makes someone more likely to be town alone
I disagree - I think it does. Beyond that, Flea actively campaigned against themselves. They’re the only player to do it. Self-voting is technically optimal right, since the only alignment you know for certain is your own. Actively campaigning against yourself is sub-optimal. But in a game with few Scum (it’s only 9 of us, 3 Scum or more seems like a ridiculous reach with powers up for grabs), eliminating yourself from contention seems like a bad idea. At least you wouldn’t rule yourself out, right? So it’s probably Town. That’s my logic.
HURT: alisae for now, mainly because I'm paranoid of em and I feel varying degrees of comfortable with everyone else on the attackers list. I'd be ok leaving out pooky or maybe andres as well
HURT: alisae for now, mainly because I'm paranoid of em and I feel varying degrees of comfortable with everyone else on the attackers list. I'd be ok leaving out pooky or maybe andres as well
I think this is Scum.
Why?
Because Alisae is Town. I’m like almost certain of it. It’s the only strong read I have. So this guarantees there will be Scum almost among the choices to be made that could end the game.
In post 570, Andresvmb wrote:Wait, only 1 player wasn’t picked by either Team? That precludes the neighborhood from forming for the rest of the game correct?
In post 583, Infinity 324 wrote:PEdit: andres idgi, if alisae is town we can still form an all-town bloc yeah?
The more obvious Town you exclude, the harder it is to win. I wouldn’t vote for a single team without Alisae in it. That’s my stand.
Now, they voted to Heal me a lot. I need to be careful and hope I’m not pocketed. I’m known to be a little loud, and I can certainly be wrong. So I will re-read. But just my gut instinct was always extremely positive on Alisae.
In post 584, Andresvmb wrote:In fact both the Attacker and the Healer Leaders picked Alisae for their respective Teams. Why is that the one choice you’re looking to exclude?
Andres I'm not sure why you're being like this. I don't think alisae is obvious town and I explained my reasoning, I also would be ok having alisae in a team this is a pretty ??? reason to think I'm scum
You wanted to exclude me, and Alisae. I’m Town, I think Alisae is Town. More often than not, that means you’re Scum. This shouldn’t be so hard to grasp.
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Post #602 (isolation #36) » Tue Apr 13, 2021 5:13 pm
Postby Andresvmb »
In post 594, tris wrote:keep in mind that all scum needs to do is include one of them. if infinity is scum, she's fine with any group that includes her. she doesn't need to exclude specific people.
And you think Scum are going to get themselves included by not offering their opinion? Of course they want to influence the outcome. Suggesting otherwise seems bad to me. They can’t argue for including themselves probably too transparent. So they have to argue for it by excluding others. They also probably know that the Town are going to go about it via process of elimination. It’s exactly how I intend to do it at least.
In post 606, Alisae wrote:I think our best bet is going with Ydra's players.
Ydra’s players minus Infinity? Is that how it would work?
Like if I voted to exclude Infinity from that Team, and a majority decided that to be the course of action, the submission would be the remaining five players?
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Post #612 (isolation #42) » Tue Apr 13, 2021 5:54 pm
Postby Andresvmb »
Meh I’m not particularly optimistic that either Team we pick will not have Scum in it. Basically the choice here is to determine whether we trust the leaders first. Because if I’m Scum, and I’m a Leader, I’m always picking my Partner in order to guarantee that I don’t lose the game right then and there. So if we don’t trust the leader, the odds of us winning basically go to 0. Having said that, if we exclude a player from a Team, and we don’t win, the odds are not that bad that the Team contains all of the Scum. That could be fascinating. And that the leader themselves is Scum.
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Post #614 (isolation #44) » Tue Apr 13, 2021 6:00 pm
Postby Andresvmb »
Well having said the above, if I’m a Leader, perhaps there’s a bias not to include the Partner since the Town picked me to make choices for them after all, and they’ll trust me. Hm. Okay anyway looking into the Leaders first still makes sense.
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Post #617 (isolation #47) » Tue Apr 13, 2021 6:17 pm
Postby Andresvmb »
In post 616, Andresvmb wrote:Okay well Sha’s inclusion of SirCakez needs to be explained for sure so I’ll wait for that. In the mean time, I need to get out of here.
This isn’t because I think SirCakez is Scum btw. Or at least I don’t think there’s any guarantee as to that being the case. I think it’s more became Sha was constantly suspicious there and put them towards the bottom of their pyramid, and SirCakez seemed generally skeptical of them. It seems like a decision that should certainly be elaborated on.
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Post #639 (isolation #48) » Wed Apr 14, 2021 8:40 am
Postby Andresvmb »
In post 637, SirCakez wrote:ex; Andres' attacks seem scum motivated because Infinity is very likely town and thus scum need to make room for well scum. Not rocket science.
This is just a flip version of my very argument.
So why is Infinity very likely Town? And why couldn’t I just be wrong and Town? You’re just basically parroting the same wrong view all game and seem to get all dismissive when challenged. Well, answer.
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Post #641 (isolation #49) » Wed Apr 14, 2021 9:03 am
Postby Andresvmb »
In post 640, SirCakez wrote:I found most of your posts day 1 to be pretty scummy.
Okay but why? I’m town and you’re wrong. So I want to understand if you’re just being insistent and Town, or actively trying to sabotage my positioning in the game.
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Post #642 (isolation #50) » Wed Apr 14, 2021 9:07 am
Postby Andresvmb »
In post 640, SirCakez wrote:Your argument calling me overconfident was nonsensical. You did very little scumhunting outside of interactions with Alisae and I.
Except you are overconfident. You make pronouncements with little in the form of actual quotes and analysis. Which is fine some players play that way and don’t provide detailed explanations I don’t necessarily care for them either to be honest. But your entire view of the game seems dependent on me being Scum and if you’re going to insist on that narrative you’re going to cost us dearly. Because I know that excluding me there is not likely to win the game quickly.
But you know, in a way, if I get excluded and the game doesn’t end, then that helps me tremendously because if I were Scum, the odds that both my Partner and I are picked by a Town Leader are not super high. More often than not there’s only 1 Scum in a pool picked by a Town player.
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Post #643 (isolation #51) » Wed Apr 14, 2021 9:08 am
Postby Andresvmb »
And why do I have to be latched onto Alisae? Why can’t I just be right about a read? You seem to think only your reads are worth considering, and everybody else’s are either bad or coming from Scum with knowledge.
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Post #644 (isolation #52) » Wed Apr 14, 2021 9:09 am
Postby Andresvmb »
I’ll point out that the minute that I made an argument for Infinity potentially being Scum, their contributions have shrunk dramatically. And now they’re hinting at Alisae being Scum without coming out and saying it. That doesn’t seem interesting to you?
Why is this directed at only me? Both Sha 77 and Ydrasse actively decided to put them in their Teams in a way that actually impacts the game. I just have a read. It’s mostly based on the fact that Alisae has read me correctly, and I agree with most of their views, and think I’ve been open. I am trying to figure out what I think about the frustration shown when they flipped out at Cakez to be honest - I think that can be easily faked. That escalation also in a way puts me in a situation where I feel like I have to defend them (since it’s against someone SR’ing me) and if Alisae is Scum, that’s a great way to maintain a pocket. But if that was the strategy it’s been the case since very early since they’ve voted to heal me for the first and the second slots, despite not getting any traction, and I don’t get what the benefit of all that was from a Scum!Alisae perspective.
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Post #648 (isolation #55) » Wed Apr 14, 2021 9:19 am
Postby Andresvmb »
I mean yeah I can be active and loud but I’ve been mostly sidelined here and none of my preferred choices or courses of action have gotten much attention. I’m very much in the fringe here.
I would also like to understand this a little more. You’re implying here that I tend to be wrong as Town, or at least hinting at that. So why is Cakez so convinced I have to be Scum if I’m wrong about you?
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Post #652 (isolation #57) » Wed Apr 14, 2021 9:30 am
Postby Andresvmb »
In post 650, Infinity 324 wrote:You seem to have felt somewhat similarly to me about ali's cakez post, so it's odd to me that you would call me scum from that.
I didn’t call you Scum for that. Alisae’s reaction happened after I had signaled I thought you were Scum based on the fact that you were trying to exclude one of Alisae or me.
I would also like to understand this a little more. You’re implying here that I tend to be wrong as Town, or at least hinting at that. So why is Cakez so convinced I have to be Scum if I’m wrong about you?
I'm not saying you're towny because you're wrong, but the push felt very town-leadery. Like you're trying to form a bloc and pushing against people who don't agree with it, which is in character for town!you I think.
So you think I could be Town for pushing you, primarily because I’m trying to sort amongst those in one of the groups to try and get a win (and btw I’m going to agree that Ydrasse is more likely to be Town than Sha so my strong preference is to pick from there). Yet Sir Cakez has the exact opposite reaction. So why do you seem to be questioning me but giving SirCakez a pass?