Sid Meier's Civilization 5 UPick Mafia (GAME OVER)

[Joey_]

wait I just realized I have a broken logic chain

Looks like the egg, err, coffee, is on my face
I'd said Klazam was probably not scum with Varsoon earlier but in my logic chain I ended putting them together.

Start again and includes nero as town

[Chara]

ok, i do have a question. why is my pushing of the Elbirn guilty on you neither slimy nor opportunistic?

[Titus]

Titus, what are you even talking about. Nothing you say makes sense.

Well it would if you had any human empathy rather than solely seeking power. It wouldn't surprise me if you and Shaz bussed Creature for power.

Now, I have to go. If you want my trust, stop seeking to control things. I never trust those who want power rather than town interests.

I'm doing what's in town's interest. You're trying to take credit for a lynch you didn't support and a

resolution you didn't want to put 1st

The outright falsehood here is why I cannot trust you. You have been shown this over and over again.

Second, there are ways to lead without seeking power. That's what I try to do early and what you should do as well if you are town aligned.

[Almost50]

Also I think Dunk was a vig shot. No way any sane mafia kills dunk n1

^^^^^^^^ I'm glad someone shares the sentiment!

[Gamma Emerald]

Ranmaru is a good town read... Can we make him one of the hosts?

HEAL: ranmaru
HEAL: ranmaru

Eh I don't like this autovote when brass is still an option

brass suggested ran for the host, then came around to himself as host and ran as runner-up. See the quote? I was following brass himself after I had asked him for advice.

Why not vote brass tho

[Joey_]

Ranmaru is a good town read... Can we make him one of the hosts?

HEAL: ranmaru
HEAL: ranmaru

Eh I don't like this autovote when brass is still an option

brass suggested ran for the host, then came around to himself as host and ran as runner-up. See the quote? I was following brass himself after I had asked him for advice.

Why not vote brass tho

Why dont you ask me why im not voting brass?

[Titus]

The list of resolutions is in, I asked the mod for confirmation of whether I am allowed to discuss the contents as I do not want to be modkilled for violating rules.

Correct. I do think there's one I think I should do to you but it may backfire if I misunderstand it. Do you see what I see?

For your edification Koichi. This is the first mention of jailkeeping Brass.

[Gamma Emerald]

wait I just realized I have a broken logic chain

Looks like the egg, err, coffee, is on my face
I'd said Klazam was probably not scum with Varsoon earlier but in my logic chain I ended putting them together.

Start again and includes nero as town

I mean that's honestly what I'm thinking though that mean Kokichi isn't conftown
UNVOTE:
While I get things fixed up read wise

[Chara]

i think there are plenty of situations where leading and seeking power are both in town's interest. if someone knows they're conftown to themself, and trusts themself to lead, why not go for power? it's what i would do if i thought the game needed it. and it worked out the last time i tried. several grains of salt (entire bag) as

that

was a non-theme micro.

[Almost50]

Why not ? Dunk teamtold with creature pretty heavily and it would be even easier to find creature's partners if you have 3+ known slot by being part of the orange team

Joey, have you ever played scum in multiball? In short, you shoot TOWN and you LYNCH the other scum. You wnat to weaken the Town (and hunt down the PRs) at night while still looking good and appear like you're scum hunting by day. You also need the other Mafia team to help downsize the Town.

[Joey_]

Why not ? Dunk teamtold with creature pretty heavily and it would be even easier to find creature's partners if you have 3+ known slot by being part of the orange team

Joey, have you ever played scum in multiball? In short, you shoot TOWN and you LYNCH the other scum. You wnat to weaken the Town (and hunt down the PRs) at night while still looking good and appear like you're scum hunting by day. You also need the other Mafia team to help downsize the Town.

I did actually! But i got instant shot because i replaced-in a scummy slot. Tbh i was just trying to lynch the other scum team and i don't doubt i mightve not have played the optimal way

[Almost50]

Then who did Elbrin visit then? It is possible Gamma is town but there are more possibilities than what you said vigs, roleblockers bulletproofs

You're about this close of going straight to my lynch pool. Elbrin DID target Gamma, but he dies of a direct shot from the Orange Mafia PRECISELY TO FRAME GAMMA. He was a BODYGUARD not a Hider, so he would still die from direct shots.

So, Orange shot Elbrin to frame Gamma
Red shot Varsoon because they though he was an alignment Cop
And TOWN VIG shot Dunkers

These are the most logical NK sources in my mind

[Joey_]

Red shot Varsoon because they though he was an alignment Cop

Nah, i think Varsoon was red killed because he claimed scum to scum thirty times, he also said something about "red color team" implying he was the other team etc.

[Almost50]

Also I think Dunk was a vig shot. No way any sane mafia kills dunk n1

Disagreed. Even if i personnaly misread Dunk he did affiliate himself pretty hard with the slot

I misread him too (until I did a reread during the night), but even if he was CLAIMED SCUM the other team would not have shot him because he would have been a very good lynch target today (thus ensuring none of them gets lynched today). Don't forget Orange "did not exist" before we saw Varsoon's flip. If we didn't have that we would have been still debating whether it's two Mafia teams or one Mafia team and a Serial Killer, and pushing Dunker would have been quite easy and serves two purposes: Orange members pushing him look like scum hunting Townies, and none of them gets lynched today because Dunker is.

You're either Town who really has no idea how multi-ball play goes or are a member of the Orange team setting up Gamma for the lynch so hard it hurts.

[Joey_]

Also I think Dunk was a vig shot. No way any sane mafia kills dunk n1

Disagreed. Even if i personnaly misread Dunk he did affiliate himself pretty hard with the slot

I misread him too (until I did a reread during the night), but even if he was CLAIMED SCUM the other team would not have shot him because he would have been a very good lynch target today (thus ensuring none of them gets lynched today). Don't forget Orange "did not exist" before we saw Varsoon's flip. If we didn't have that we would have been still debating whether it's two Mafia teams or one Mafia team and a Serial Killer, and pushing Dunker would have been quite easy and serves two purposes: Orange members pushing him look like scum hunting Townies, and none of them gets lynched today because Dunker is.

You're either Town who really has no idea how multi-ball play goes or are a member of the Orange team setting up Gamma for the lynch so hard it hurts.

I think the theory about the Elbirn being Orange shot to inculpate gamma is a stretch but the rest of your logic is sound

[Almost50]

I can accept #1 with a grain of salt, but #2 is tricky because Scum do NOT want to eliminate each other at the start of the game. They want to deplete the town first before they turn on each other. No way Orange Scum shoot Dunker on N1.

i do agree with you about that in a vacuum. however, without seeing the full setup or the scum thought process, it's hard to say. they could have been townreading dunker, or thought he was a safe kill. Elbirn is also, in my opinion, not the most likely of scum kills either. the way he worded that post, i believe it was deliberate.

though it was Varsoon who was strongly townreading Elbirn specifically.

1- Read the last line if your own post. Now remember I said ORANGE did it?
2- Elbrin was no shot because he was a TR. he was shot to implicate Gamma
3- Don't you dare argue with me about how Scum would go in multi-ball. You ARE better than me in the tone-reading department, and I fully concede to that, but >I< am superior to you in game mechanics AND -and this is more important- scum strategy. I know what scum would do and why they'd do it.

[Klazam]

Varsoon

- Was the one who gave a big presentation on the game being multiball, which now that he has flipped a different mafia than someone else was most likely signalling!

His scumread on Klazam based on his multiball speculation was very likely to be genuine, as such it is logical to conlude that Klazam and Varsoon are not aligned on the same scumteam!

Klazam

- I feel like his pushing of the Elbirn pseudo-guilty on me is the most slimy and opportunistic! Given specific wagon interactions with BuJaber I saw in Day 1 analysis I think

Klazam is the opposite team, making him orange scum!

lol

also depending on unflipped assocative tells is slimy when you have flips to analyze. youre using your scumread on a unflipped slot to justify reads on other slots.

Kokichi Oma

- From interactions across both day I see that Kokichi is not alinged with BuJaber and Nero Cain in certain ways. BuJaber went after Kokichi pretty fervently Day 1, and Nero's recent context-mangling ende up spewing the fact Nero honestly believed Kokichi to be town.

This is a example of using unflipped assocatives to justify reads.

Elbirn - Died Night 1, flipped some sort of permanent bodyguard. Part of his role mentions a weak targeting power which has people in a frenzy about what it could mean for who he targeted!

Sounds WAY too sarcastic, considering that you are the primary person we think he targeted.

-------

Ah you caught your error lol.

You're still scum

[Almost50]

Why not vote brass tho

he was getting enough votes and I asked him who he wanted and he said ranmaru for the host (that was when I voted) and then went back and said ranmaru for runner up (I read that after I voted, but it wouldn't have changed a thing because brass was already getting enough votes)

[Gamma Emerald]

Kokichi Oma

- From interactions across both day I see that Kokichi is not alinged with BuJaber and Nero Cain in certain ways. BuJaber went after Kokichi pretty fervently Day 1, and Nero's recent context-mangling ende up spewing the fact Nero honestly believed Kokichi to be town.

This is a example of using unflipped assocatives to justify reads.

Why shouldn't I? If I'm feeling right on both of them, which I was really, before my error, why shouldn't I try to make judgements based off that?

Elbirn - Died Night 1, flipped some sort of permanent bodyguard. Part of his role mentions a weak targeting power which has people in a frenzy about what it could mean for who he targeted!

Sounds WAY too sarcastic, considering that you are the primary person we think he targeted.

Try "impartial". I was summing up what the general reaction to it was. Did you see the word "I" in there? No? Then it's not me making a subjective personal judgement but an objective overall judgment.

[Gamma Emerald]

Also I love that "you actually fixed a problem in you're reads, still scum tho #sorrynotsorry #alsonotgoingtoreconsiderthiseverapparently"

[Gamma Emerald]

Why not vote brass tho

he was getting enough votes and I asked him who he wanted and he said ranmaru for the host (that was when I voted) and then went back and said ranmaru for runner up (I read that after I voted, but it wouldn't have changed a thing because brass was already getting enough votes)

ah ok then

[Chara]

1- Read the last line if your own post. Now remember I said ORANGE did it?
2- Elbrin was no shot because he was a TR. he was shot to implicate Gamma
3- Don't you dare argue with me about how Scum would go in multi-ball. You ARE better than me in the tone-reading department, and I fully concede to that, but >I< am superior to you in game mechanics AND -and this is more important- scum strategy. I know what scum would do and why they'd do it.

the last line was me considering your point. i suppose i should have been more clear.

as for point 2, it implies scum knew he would flip hider. though on a reads basis i could see your point. and i'm not arguing with you about what scum would do (you're certainly better than me at that), but i do think we don't know everything, so such conclusions are more difficult to draw.
i'll give it another look. i do think your Bujaber case might be something.

[Chara]

ok, i do have a question. why is my pushing of the Elbirn guilty on you neither slimy nor opportunistic?

Gamma, this was for you.

[Chara]

You're either Town who really has no idea how multi-ball play goes or are a member of the Orange team setting up Gamma for the lynch so hard it hurts.

Joey's town, promise. that one i'm pretty sure about. Maki in U-pick sure. even if i was wrong later.

[Klazam]

Try "impartial". I was summing up what the general reaction to it was. Did you see the word "I" in there? No? Then it's not me making a subjective personal judgement but an objective overall judgment.

I... dont think that you make sense here.

Youre justifying unflipped assocatives based on YOUR reads, then made a impartial observation that carefully avoided mentioning that youre the one who looks potentially scummy. Thats two different approaches in your reads list.