I can gut read a decent amount of players in this game.In post 643, Mathdino wrote:shadpearl's ISO is pure cringe
either hardtown or scum hardfaking newbtown
@Shadpearl:Do you have any links of you playing forum mafia offsite?
nothing in lalendra's ISO suggests town
but then again nothing in lalendra's entire career suggests town
is anyone here actually capable of gutreading lalendra
Open 712: Elemental Large (Mafia win)
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Flavor Leaf Survivor
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- Location: San Francisco
CHECK OUT MY HOW TO PLAY AS SCUM GUIDE Maybe it'll help you catch me
”Yeah, the moment I realized Flavor was scum I stopped trying because I’m sure as hell not beating him.” - Clemency
”Not bragging about myself as much as I'm actually praising the Scum player of the year...and probably the decade.” - Almost50
"Just accept that FL is too good as scum, period." - Clidd-
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JaydragonKing Mafia Scum
- Mafia Scum
- Mafia Scum
- Posts: 2065
- Joined: November 21, 2017
- Location: 'Murica. Heck yeah.
If your so sure your getting killed tonight, then why ask the Tracker to waste their time on you? That just means they should be tracking someone else.In post 649, Flavor Leaf wrote:@Tracker - don’t claim, obvi, target me tonight. I guarantee you will see me target somewhere.
This confirms me as town, and if I don’t go anywhere, it confirms me as scum. Also, this adds the chance that I can die in the night thus getting rid of the problem all together.-
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Flavor Leaf Survivor
- Survivor
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- Posts: 42893
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- Location: San Francisco
Who’s the other doctor again? Is it Almost? I’ll target the doctor. 100% clears me. I’m nearly a scum good as good as conf town now.CHECK OUT MY HOW TO PLAY AS SCUM GUIDE Maybe it'll help you catch me
”Yeah, the moment I realized Flavor was scum I stopped trying because I’m sure as hell not beating him.” - Clemency
”Not bragging about myself as much as I'm actually praising the Scum player of the year...and probably the decade.” - Almost50
"Just accept that FL is too good as scum, period." - Clidd-
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Flavor Leaf Survivor
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I’m not sure I’m going to die tonight.In post 651, JaydragonKing wrote:
If your so sure your getting killed tonight, then why ask the Tracker to waste their time on you? That just means they should be tracking someone else.In post 649, Flavor Leaf wrote:@Tracker - don’t claim, obvi, target me tonight. I guarantee you will see me target somewhere.
This confirms me as town, and if I don’t go anywhere, it confirms me as scum. Also, this adds the chance that I can die in the night thus getting rid of the problem all together.
If I’m not being tracked, there’s no reason really for me to die, except that I am the doctor, but as long as there aren’t all doctors claimed, then they don’t have a major reason to kill me. They can get around my elemental doctor.
However, not gonna lie, I would claim elemental doctor as vanilla, however that is not the case here. But just saying, I would.CHECK OUT MY HOW TO PLAY AS SCUM GUIDE Maybe it'll help you catch me
”Yeah, the moment I realized Flavor was scum I stopped trying because I’m sure as hell not beating him.” - Clemency
”Not bragging about myself as much as I'm actually praising the Scum player of the year...and probably the decade.” - Almost50
"Just accept that FL is too good as scum, period." - Clidd-
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Aneninen HeVery Important PigeonHe
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Almost50 Monkey Business
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Except you can target the one you're going to kill, then the Tracker will have to out to expose you, then you claim you protected the target from X and they could have still died of Y or Z. We have 3 ways to kill the target and the Doctor has to choose to protect from just one.In post 649, Flavor Leaf wrote:@Tracker - don’t claim, obvi, target me tonight. I guarantee you will see me target somewhere.
This confirms me as town, and if I don’t go anywhere, it confirms me as scum. Also, this adds the chance that I can die in the night thus getting rid of the problem all together.
tl;dr: "I'm dead anyway, so let me live for one more night so that can both perform a kill and out the Tracker w/o the other 2 goons being at risk at all.
Nice try though.
Modded 2 Opens & 2 Large Themed games successfully.-
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Almost50 Monkey Business
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I just explained whyIn post 651, JaydragonKing wrote:If your so sure your getting killed tonight, then why ask the Tracker to waste their time on you? That just means they should be tracking someone else.
Modded 2 Opens & 2 Large Themed games successfully.-
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Almost50 Monkey Business
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Even better! "I'll even kill the Doctor while the Tracker is watching and then expose the Tracker and try to get away with it while my partners just watch in amazement."In post 652, Flavor Leaf wrote:Who’s the other doctor again? Is it Almost? I’ll target the doctor. 100% clears me. I’m nearly a scum good as good as conf town now.
Modded 2 Opens & 2 Large Themed games successfully.-
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Flavor Leaf Survivor
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Oh yeah, true.
I mean, I’m town, so...haha.
I think we should just let me by a day or twoCHECK OUT MY HOW TO PLAY AS SCUM GUIDE Maybe it'll help you catch me
”Yeah, the moment I realized Flavor was scum I stopped trying because I’m sure as hell not beating him.” - Clemency
”Not bragging about myself as much as I'm actually praising the Scum player of the year...and probably the decade.” - Almost50
"Just accept that FL is too good as scum, period." - Clidd-
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JaydragonKing Mafia Scum
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- Location: 'Murica. Heck yeah.
I've been told many times your the apitamy of "bold as hell scum", and how very few are like you in that regard. I may be one of those few, but irregardless...In post 658, Flavor Leaf wrote:Oh yeah, true.
I mean, I’m town, so...haha.
I think we should just let me by a day or two
Notice nobody here's unvoting you despite you claiming doctor. That's very telling.-
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Flavor Leaf Survivor
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Yeah, my strong scum games screw over my town game because every tinfoil theory someone can make about me very well can be true.In post 659, JaydragonKing wrote:
I've been told many times your the apitamy of "bold as hell scum", and how very few are like you in that regard. I may be one of those few, but irregardless...In post 658, Flavor Leaf wrote:Oh yeah, true.
I mean, I’m town, so...haha.
I think we should just let me by a day or two
Notice nobody here's unvoting you despite you claiming doctor. That's very telling.
I just roll town sometimes.
I did recently win a scum game where in 3p lylo where I got a miller who had been confirmed to have been rolecopped as Miller to be lynched to win the game.CHECK OUT MY HOW TO PLAY AS SCUM GUIDE Maybe it'll help you catch me
”Yeah, the moment I realized Flavor was scum I stopped trying because I’m sure as hell not beating him.” - Clemency
”Not bragging about myself as much as I'm actually praising the Scum player of the year...and probably the decade.” - Almost50
"Just accept that FL is too good as scum, period." - Clidd-
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Flavor Leaf Survivor
- Survivor
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like, I am town. Idk what to do to defend myself at this point. Haha.CHECK OUT MY HOW TO PLAY AS SCUM GUIDE Maybe it'll help you catch me
”Yeah, the moment I realized Flavor was scum I stopped trying because I’m sure as hell not beating him.” - Clemency
”Not bragging about myself as much as I'm actually praising the Scum player of the year...and probably the decade.” - Almost50
"Just accept that FL is too good as scum, period." - Clidd-
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Flavor Leaf Survivor
- Survivor
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- Posts: 42893
- Joined: July 17, 2017
- Location: San Francisco
@Almost - what would you do in my position? Just curious. I see that you see me as scum. I just know you’re wrong. So that in mind, me seeing how you are with it, knowing I’m town, what would you have me do?CHECK OUT MY HOW TO PLAY AS SCUM GUIDE Maybe it'll help you catch me
”Yeah, the moment I realized Flavor was scum I stopped trying because I’m sure as hell not beating him.” - Clemency
”Not bragging about myself as much as I'm actually praising the Scum player of the year...and probably the decade.” - Almost50
"Just accept that FL is too good as scum, period." - Clidd-
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Flavor Leaf Survivor
- Survivor
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- Posts: 42893
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It is very telling. Scum are likely taking advantage of it somewhere.In post 659, JaydragonKing wrote:
I've been told many times your the apitamy of "bold as hell scum", and how very few are like you in that regard. I may be one of those few, but irregardless...In post 658, Flavor Leaf wrote:Oh yeah, true.
I mean, I’m town, so...haha.
I think we should just let me by a day or two
Notice nobody here's unvoting you despite you claiming doctor. That's very telling.CHECK OUT MY HOW TO PLAY AS SCUM GUIDE Maybe it'll help you catch me
”Yeah, the moment I realized Flavor was scum I stopped trying because I’m sure as hell not beating him.” - Clemency
”Not bragging about myself as much as I'm actually praising the Scum player of the year...and probably the decade.” - Almost50
"Just accept that FL is too good as scum, period." - Clidd-
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Almost50 Monkey Business
- Monkey Business
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- Posts: 27276
- Joined: November 13, 2015
- Location: Right here.
1- TGP got to L-1 and didn't bother claiming or even hinting it
2- The ISO is scummier than scummy
3- Boon comes in with a plan to expose the Tracker
WHAT MORE do we want to know this is Scum??
FTR; as soon as this flips scum Jay is automatically clear here. He was the leading vote on TGP and didn't twitch when he got to L-1
Also, ftr (and I'm sorry to say this) Dino doesn't get a free pass. A leeway maybe, but that's it. I'm not sure how to say this, but if Dino is Scum and he gets his way he's going to win anyway. He could have found himself backed to the wall and was forced to bus without pre-arrangements or he could still be the SK. The leeway though is because IF he is Town he can lead the Town to a flawless victory.
@Dino: I sincerely do apologize if you're really Town here. You're just too good to be taken a face value and I'm afraid I won't have the time to sort you as I'm tonight's NK anyway. Good Luck though.
P-edit: Hypothetically speaking; if you were Town you would not have asked to be Tracked to begin with. That is just bad play (for Town). I honestly don't know what I would have said or done if I was in that hypothetical situation, but I certainly would NOT have asked the Tracker to be on me. Maybe do some ISOing and leave us notes on who is scum so we can use your reads after you flip?
Modded 2 Opens & 2 Large Themed games successfully.-
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Mathdino Survivor
- Survivor
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- Joined: February 24, 2013
- Location: Right Behind You
Sure thing. I assume you mean anti-A50wagon from me rather than a general sentiment, although I'm interested if you're paranoid of anti-A50wagon stuff in general.In post 646, Sando wrote:
Wanna actual provide some, you know, logic, for this statement?In post 642, Mathdino wrote:sando's ISO makes me want to beat my head against a wall but the twisty pretzel logic is town
The amount of anti-A50 wagon without actually addressing anything strikes me as fairly telling for later in the game.
This is basically a badpost nitpicking the semantics of something A50 is trying to get across. I had to read it like 3 goddamn times to actually grok what it's trying to say, which is basically "A50 is referring to Creature as if A50 already knows Creature is town".In post 133, Sando wrote:
This is very scummy to me, firstly you establish that Creature apparently has 2 metas:A50 wrote:Creature is OMGUSy by nature, He hate to be wagoned as either alignment and could very well SR his voters, I admit. However, his entrance was HORRIBLE. The "Town?" comment on an opening post by doom was silly enough to earn Creature a SR on it's own, even if he had to retract it soon after.Creature is GOOD as Town, and would not have commented on that post AT ALL if he was Town here. The bad play/nonesense still points to Scum!Creature, especially since that comment came while he was catching up, thus should have yet seen what I said about him (i.e. no way he OMGUS SR'd me as Town!him would still)
1: Scum!Creature lurks and gets prodded/replaced in his scum games (post 26 that creature just quoted)
2: town!Creature is OMGUS a lot but a very good town player
I would 100% agree with 1, I just finished a game a few weeks ago with him where he was scum and everything said about him applied to a T. I can see the OMGUS argument just from this thread,but to claim that he's both OMGUS-y AND a good player says that you think the OMGUS from him is not anti-town.
However, apart from the OMGUS creature has not posted anything "bad" in terms of being town that I've seen, and since you yourself basically don't think OMGUS is anti-town...why do you think he's scum? To get to him being Scum you have to completely ignore the meta that you yourself stated (because he's certainly not lurking and getting prodded), and also have not established any poor town play other than OMGUS, which you think is just "part of his nature".
UNVOTE:
VOTE: Almost50
I think scum in your situation just points it out simply instead of launching into a huge lecture that basically writes yourself into a massive tunnel on him.
Okay lemme try to sum up what you're doing here:In post 136, Sando wrote:
Is it really OMGUS at that point though? The problem with OMGUS is it muddies the water by overdoing it to everyone who looks your way, making it harder to see said scum-motivated scumreads when they occur.In post 134, Creature wrote:OMGUS is never antitown if you actually think the scumread on you is scum-motivated.
I don't think OMGUS play is particularly alignment indicative, however if you constantly do it then it risks the rest of town tuning out your legitimate scumreads on people attacking you as boy who cried wolf, which yeah is anti-town in making your scumhunting less effective.
For the moment you're well and truly outside your scum-meta, you're scumhunting, while also OMGUS-ing a lot. I'm putting you town but I'm wary of your reads due to the OMGUS nature (he says voting the person you're in an argument with).
Also my point on A50 is that he apparently agrees with you that OMGUS is not anti-town, yet also attacks you for OMGUS... I don't see any "bad play" from you apart from over-use of OMGUS, so I feel A50 is attacking you for your OMGUS while also saying that OMGUS is not anti-town.
1. If you OMGUS too much it masks your scumgames, a la RadiantCowbells.
2. OMGUSing is NAI but anti-town.
3. You're town but you OMGUS enough for me not to trust you.
4. [bad points against A50]
The only way I see #3 as scum motivated is if Creature happens to be scumreading your scumbuddies (which is a narrow situation). Occams Razor says you're pants-on-head town.
Regarding A50... do you need a towncase from me?
Like I have a 100% record of reading A50 as mafia or not mafia correctly across multiple games. I have a blind spot for his SK game, but he also doesn't fucking claim doctor if he's a serial killer.
I think A50 thinks he's better scum than he is, and the fact that he brags about that so much makes him easy ML-bait. He's good enough at scum to be successful in a lot of the playerlists he's in, but there's ALWAYS a method to his madness, and he's very easily motivation readable.
I guarantee you though that scum-A50 doesn't get wagoned on D1. He also doesn't open himself up to a town-Creature by trying to wagon him, WHILE KNOWING Creats is an OMGUSy player. Scum-A50 is much more fundamentally survivalistic than town A50 (granted, scum-A50 will make himself look NOT survivalistic, it's just that I can tell the difference ).
tl;dr: The majority of your ISO is a shitty tunnel but despite (and partly because of) that, you're town.
From your (rational) POV, either I'm literally scum with A50, or you should trust my read here. 100% record doesn't come from nothing.-
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Mathdino Survivor
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And yeah, A50 found the flaw in the standard Boon scumplan. He's better as scum lategame, and doing this essentially forces a tracker claim.
He also admitted to specifically searching for a scumslot to replace into (after I already called him on it, mind you). I think he had an initial plan for rolling scum with me, but is telling the truth in that he changed it when he found that wasn't the case.-
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Mathdino Survivor
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I actually question the idea that he'd even claim tracker as scum now that I think about it.
Consider that by claiming tracker today, he forces a tracker counterclaim today and gets lynched today.
By claiming doctor (and obviously getting tracked), he mislynches another townie, survives another day, and either:
A. Forces a tracker guilty tomorrow, getting lynched tomorrow
B. Potentially forces a doctor massclaim tomorrow which is far more valuable than a tracker claim
C. Like A50 said, he can just claim to protect the guy he's killing. Or kill someone who's obviously going to get doc'd and claim that he was the doctor that saved them.-
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Mathdino Survivor
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tbh if experience is anything to go byIn post 646, Sando wrote:
Wanna actual provide some, you know, logic, for this statement?In post 642, Mathdino wrote:sando's ISO makes me want to beat my head against a wall but the twisty pretzel logic is town
The amount of anti-A50 wagon without actually addressing anything strikes me as fairly telling for later in the game.
i have about a 40% chance of dying tonight
that goes up to like 65% since there are two kills to go around (A50 is in the exact same boat)
a lot of today is based around paradox and i think that flip will spew a lot more people as town than me nitpicking people's ISOs
i'll do a readthrough for townslips but no reads lists
if i'm actually alive tomorrow i'll do the full analysis but i'd rather just lynch scum and get shot
VOTE: Flavor Leaf
let's end it
P.S. if i die, you HAVE to lynch jay before LyLo
absolutely no exceptions
at all-
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Mathdino Survivor
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i did not mean to quote that post-
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Flavor Leaf Survivor
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This is actually false.In post 666, Mathdino wrote:And yeah, A50 found the flaw in the standard Boon scumplan. He's better as scum lategame, and doing this essentially forces a tracker claim.
He also admitted to specifically searching for a scumslot to replace into (after I already called him on it, mind you). I think he had an initial plan for rolling scum with me, but is telling the truth in that he changed it when he found that wasn't the case.
I’m actually weaker as scum late game.
I’m reverse. I’m a stronger scum player early and get weaker as game start go on, which isn’t why I like to end games early.
I’m a late game town powerhouse.CHECK OUT MY HOW TO PLAY AS SCUM GUIDE Maybe it'll help you catch me
”Yeah, the moment I realized Flavor was scum I stopped trying because I’m sure as hell not beating him.” - Clemency
”Not bragging about myself as much as I'm actually praising the Scum player of the year...and probably the decade.” - Almost50
"Just accept that FL is too good as scum, period." - Clidd-
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Flavor Leaf Survivor
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- Location: San Francisco
@A50 - no one’s accusing me of being a good town player. I’m good late game as town.
My sig on Boon is the opposite of my Flavor Leaf one.
“yes, I’m Flavor Leaf. Yes, I WOULD do that as town.”
Like, I am town. I just replaced into a slot you guys were going to lynch.CHECK OUT MY HOW TO PLAY AS SCUM GUIDE Maybe it'll help you catch me
”Yeah, the moment I realized Flavor was scum I stopped trying because I’m sure as hell not beating him.” - Clemency
”Not bragging about myself as much as I'm actually praising the Scum player of the year...and probably the decade.” - Almost50
"Just accept that FL is too good as scum, period." - Clidd-
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Flavor Leaf Survivor
- Survivor
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- Posts: 42893
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- Location: San Francisco
After my lynch, lynch one of A50/Dino, no exceptions.
I’d probably lean towards A50.
VOTE: Flavor LeafCHECK OUT MY HOW TO PLAY AS SCUM GUIDE Maybe it'll help you catch me
”Yeah, the moment I realized Flavor was scum I stopped trying because I’m sure as hell not beating him.” - Clemency
”Not bragging about myself as much as I'm actually praising the Scum player of the year...and probably the decade.” - Almost50
"Just accept that FL is too good as scum, period." - Clidd-
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Flavor Leaf Survivor
- Survivor
- Survivor
- Posts: 42893
- Joined: July 17, 2017
- Location: San Francisco
Before they call me out as town self voting, I’ve self voted as town 12+ times, I’ve self voted as scum like twice.CHECK OUT MY HOW TO PLAY AS SCUM GUIDE Maybe it'll help you catch me
”Yeah, the moment I realized Flavor was scum I stopped trying because I’m sure as hell not beating him.” - Clemency
”Not bragging about myself as much as I'm actually praising the Scum player of the year...and probably the decade.” - Almost50
"Just accept that FL is too good as scum, period." - Clidd-
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Flavor Leaf Survivor
- Survivor
- Survivor
- Posts: 42893
- Joined: July 17, 2017
- Location: San Francisco
My death proves the backup doctor too.CHECK OUT MY HOW TO PLAY AS SCUM GUIDE Maybe it'll help you catch me
”Yeah, the moment I realized Flavor was scum I stopped trying because I’m sure as hell not beating him.” - Clemency
”Not bragging about myself as much as I'm actually praising the Scum player of the year...and probably the decade.” - Almost50
"Just accept that FL is too good as scum, period." - Clidd
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