Open 712: Elemental Large (Mafia win)
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Creature Solve This Game
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Taly he/him, she/herSurvivorhe/him, she/her
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I definitely can see scum hammering though, especially one without any intent or given warning. Even more specifically, an SK.In post 1125, Creature wrote:tbh I'm townreading Shadpearl because I don't think scum would've hammered yesterday.
A flip ofShadpearlwould greatly help confirm the validity ofprofii'sclaim.
However, the only reality whereShadpearlwould be rightfully tracked through targetingAneninen, but not killing him, is because he's a doc and failed to use the element the scum used to killAneninen.
Which is extremely, extremely unlikely and would assume thatAlmost50fakeclaimed, which we do not have the adequate information to deduce that.
Scum probably would not claim given the possibility of being speedlynched the dayphase after for not being truthful.
Town, especially noobtown to my understanding, would probbaly not have hammered in the manner thatShadpearlhas. He asked no questions of his own, or much thoughts beyond hammering just to hammerJimmy."Taly is going to be a hot mess all game and I am entertained" ~ Gammagooey
"The human race is bad at reading Taly." ~the worst
"Taly I knew your slot was scum and I still struggled to find arguments to SR your play lol" ~Infinity 324
"Taly wins for the most fence-sitty reads in a game ever" ~Battle Mage-
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Creature Solve This Game
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texcat Mafia Scum
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VOTE: ShadPearl
But Profii, I thought you said you thought I was the SK earlier?
When I originally said that a counterclaim was possible, I was thinking that A50 was a doc, and that if we didn't have a counterclaim that would confirm him. When he immediately told the real doc not to counterclaim, it looked to me like he was saying that his doc claim was fake. And PS that second quote is not from me.Taly wrote: Can you tell me specifically what your view ofAlmost50'sclaim is?
Or rather, a better question, what makes you thinkIn post 1024, texcat wrote:Sigh. Yep I agree that the doc should not counterclaim, since you've essentially just admitted that your claim was fake.Almost50fakeclaimed? Also,
If you don't think a counterclaim is good, then why did you point out the possibility of it?texcat wrote:Why is a counterclaim good with 11 people still alive....?
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profii Jack of All Trades
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Taly he/him, she/herSurvivorhe/him, she/her
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Regardless ofIn post 1127, Creature wrote:Oh right...Shadpearl'salignment, his flip would give very valuable information. Though, I do believe he is scum or the SK.
, then that 100% proves thatIf Shadpearl's a VTprofiilied about the claim, and is thus, almost certainly scum.In this event, looking at his wagon progression today would be very telling of who could or could not be a partner who potentially bussed, or how people have readprofiiif here were hypothetically the SK.
, then that would immediately disproveIf Shadpearl's a DoctorAlmost50'sclaim, and also indicate that he's likely scum.In this event, we have 3 dayphases of information regardingAlmost50'sinteractions and how people viewed his claim, and the wagons he pushed.
,If Shadpearl somehow IS, in fact, the Trackerprofiiis being speedlynched D4 and almost certainly flip scum. If he flips town though, I will be absolutely floored because I genuinely believe this is near-impossible in this scenario.I'm not entertaining this scenario unless it happens.
, thenIf Shadpearl's an SKprofiiis completely truthful about the claim, andAlmost50gains validity in his own claim.This both eliminates a killer to the town, and solidifies town within itself.
, then not only isIf Shadpearl's scumprofiitruthful andAlmost50is more likely to be truthful, then the mixed interactions withShadpearlthis entire game so far could be very telling of the rest of the scumteam. SinceJaydragonKingis confscum dead, then town can use interactions with between the two of them to help locate the final scum, and potentially the SK itself.This eliminates a scum player, and will most likely give town an extra day before MYLO.
In no situation, does this seem unfavorable for the town in the long-run.
People can bicker and waffle for the rest of this dayphase, but if there's anyway the town can be united in one form for once in this game, it is to vote withprofii, and greatly push to help gamesolve.
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P-Edit
Shit, sorrytexcat, I messed up with the quoting there, the question was from me."Taly is going to be a hot mess all game and I am entertained" ~ Gammagooey
"The human race is bad at reading Taly." ~the worst
"Taly I knew your slot was scum and I still struggled to find arguments to SR your play lol" ~Infinity 324
"Taly wins for the most fence-sitty reads in a game ever" ~Battle Mage-
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Creature Solve This Game
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Sando Mafia Scum
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Your analysis is off there Taly:
Anything other than a Doc Shad townflip confirms Profii is scum. How does VT prove he lied and thus scum not translate into Tracker proving he lied and thus scum.
SK doesn't prove the claim, it says either Profii is a scum and got lucky, or is the tracker.
Scumflip yeah, proves the tracker claim. I'm assuming an SK doesn't fakeclaim Tracker with the massive target that they're guaranteed to get.
Absolutely not. The claim is no more believable than A50s, especially since it tracks a flipped doc and gives a guilty of SK.People can bicker and waffle for the rest of this dayphase, but if there's anyway the town can be united in one form for once in this game, it is to vote with profii, and greatly push to help gamesolve.
Why on earth assume SK?In post 1120, profii wrote:The n-2 I tracked Shadpearl who went for Anen so I am guessing he is the serial killer. Again tracked the lol hammer. You’ll note I wasn’t on the lynch of jimmy during this day
Also, you got a confirmed Doc who subsequently got lynched after 2 doc deaths...surely you at least breadcrumbed this?
In post 979, profii wrote:Jimmy - potential SK for similar reasons to Tex, particularly with that lynch but I know there can only be one.
That's the extent of your D2 Jimmy talk...Jimmy seems like an easy player to pick on, if he flips non-scum, I think we would need to look at his wagon - but I think he could very likely flip scum.
I'm happy not killing Profii today, there's (almost) zero way he survives the night anyway as Tracker.
UNVOTE:
I'm not happy voting Shad (lolwat?), there's no need to prove/disprove the tracker claim even with a CC, we're not lynching a potential scum-bait just to prove a claim who then dies.-
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Almost50 Monkey Business
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Survivalism is NOT scummy. Fitzz' maybe, but not for that.In post 1117, Kopherald wrote:It's nothing but a survivalist vote. Scummy.
I am also starting to have second thoughts about Shad despite it all. "Profii is dead" followed by profii saying "GL town" strikes me as a planned theatrical move to try and give an impression profii is town.
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Almost50 Monkey Business
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??? And it never occurred to you to track me? That is odd. But I guess I'd understand
ifyou TR'd me anyway.
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Almost50 Monkey Business
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OK.. I'm slow, but others (Taly) may have interpreted what profii said better than myself so..
VOTE: shadpearl
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Sando Mafia Scum
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Interesting votes from A50 and Fitz there to force the L-1 and claim, out of ze blue.
So assuming Profii isn't SK:
Scum-Profii probably does not have scum on his wagon.- Fitz pretty much conftown here
A50 close to conftown, I don't believe A50 busses here, leaves him solo-scum with at least one person, maybe 2, promising to seriously look at lynching him at that point, I think he relies on his doc claim for now. Ok fine A50 can be conftown in this world.
Scum probably don't put both in the same wagon, Kop and Creature get town-points
Leaves Aus, Tex, Shad uninvolved in either wagon <- scum in here.
Shad isn't scumpartner with Profii
Leaves Aus/Tex as scum
- Taly/LUV/Sando main protagonists
Fitz puts L-2 and A50 puts L-1
L-2 vote most scummy, although with Shad in the game could be baiting the quickhammer from A50 (semi-joking only)
I still don't believe Taly and/or LUV are scum.
Fitz very likely scum, Shad is scum/SK, A50 further muddies the water and inexplicably survives the night
Left-over = Creature/Kopherald/Aus/Tex <--- Scum in here
Kopherald has pushed hard for anti-Profii wagon, townpoints here
Creature isthat guy
Aus/Tex have sidelined themselves, scumpoints here
Scum!Profii = Aus/Tex as scumbuddy
Tracker!Profii = Fitz+Shad, A50 just itching for a lynch, but inexplicably survives yet another night. Aus/Tex again to my mind most likely scum partners.
I'm going withAus/Tex+Fitz orAus/Tex+Profii for scumteam, with either Shad or NFI as SK.
Aus has run the anti-train on Kopherald who is pushing the Fitz train, so Aus+Fitz makes sense in a Tracker-Profii world.
I don't believe any of the claims though, so:
VOTE: Texcat-
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Almost50 Monkey Business
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My brain isn't working at it's full capacity still, so somebody look at Sando's post here and see if it makes sense for him to vote texcat at this time.
Also, I'm wondering who believes I'm a Doctor and who believes I'm a VT now. A least two people referred to me as the Doctor recently, which IS indeed odd for me to be still alive in that case.
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Sando Mafia Scum
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Can we not abrogate our responsibilities Day3 please? We've lynched two docs and gotten SFA from the wagons because of votes exactly like this.In post 1135, Almost50 wrote:OK.. I'm slow, but others (Taly) may have interpreted what profii said better than myself so..
VOTE: shadpearl
Taly is at least providing reasoning, it's poor, but it's at least reasoning. Everyone else is just lazy and anti-town at this point. When you get a claim with a guilty, you don't just lynch the guilty with the sole intention of getting a read on the claim, that's just lazy and stupid.-
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Sando Mafia Scum
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Yeah, and read my posts you'll see exactly why I stopped pushing Shad. I said, multiple times, that it's pretty clear town are just going to buy the noob-town schtick. 969 outlines why I voted Profii originally, I stand by all of that.In post 1121, Taly wrote:But here's a slightly off-topic question; you seemed willing to vote Shadpearl and place a case on them in D2, but especially after his random hammer, you've pushed your attention onto profii, why? Is it mostly to find an associative-tell?-
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texcat Mafia Scum
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Almost50 Monkey Business
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Excuse you! In my world, a guilty is a guilty unless CC'd. Do you CC profii??In post 1138, Sando wrote:
Can we not abrogate our responsibilities Day3 please? We've lynched two docs and gotten SFA from the wagons because of votes exactly like this.In post 1135, Almost50 wrote:OK.. I'm slow, but others (Taly) may have interpreted what profii said better than myself so..
VOTE: shadpearl
Taly is at least providing reasoning, it's poor, but it's at least reasoning. Everyone else is just lazy and anti-town at this point. When you get a claim with a guilty, you don't just lynch the guilty with the sole intention of getting a read on the claim, that's just lazy and stupid.
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Sando Mafia Scum
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Profii is either town or scum. Shad is either town or SK.In post 1140, texcat wrote:You stand by all of that and yet you're voting for me? Why don't you think we need to resolve the Profii/Shadpearl situation?
Profii!scum gets CC'd today, or later, via an actual CC or a tracker-flip elsewhere, either way, as scum he's pretty royally screwed. He can hope he hits the SK on Taly and win the CC war with the real tracker, otherwise he's pretty deadsies as scum.
Or he's tracker, he dies tonight and has given us a guilty for tomorrow, easy peasy.
The only reason to lynch Shad right now is as Taly says, to stop us having 2 NKs. However:
a) Why did Profii immediately jump to SK conclusion?
b) Profii!scum knows his only hope of surviving is hitting SK/scum on Shad.
So it's a dodgy claim that also happens to be the only way that the claim holds up long term.
If Profii is scum we have plenty of opportunity to lynch him. If he's tracker we have plenty of opportunity to lynch Shad.
Also:
a) If we lynch Shad and get a town-flip, we now have a confscum Profii, who the SK is most definitely not going to kill since it's tomorrow's lynch.
b) If we lynch Shad and get a scum/SK-flip, our tracker is killed.
c) If we don't lynch either and play patiently, SK has to basically kill Profii since he's either scum or tracker, and real Tracker lays low. Also scum!Profii tracker NKing results in his own death anyway. Hell if they want to leave Profii!tracker up and risk another guilty, then we'd have two guilties and have already lynched today within the rest of the pool.
So what does lynching either of them gain us today? The track results are still going to be there tomorrow and there's at least 1, almost definitely 2 baddies outside of those two.-
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Sando Mafia Scum
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No-one should CC Profii today, as per my last post. If you'd like to disagree feel free to pull apart my logic, but you're just making excuses for being lazy to my mind. Given you're the one person who we know definitely won't CC, your input would actually be very welcome here as well. Again, stop abrogating responsibility. There's a 99% chance of there being 2 anti-town players outside of Profii/Shad, much like lynching you is a terrible idea today, lynching within them today when we can look elsewhere for zero cost is also a terrible idea.In post 1141, Almost50 wrote:Excuse you! In my world, a guilty is a guilty unless CC'd. Do you CC profii??-
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Sando Mafia Scum
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texcat Mafia Scum
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A scum. And some confirmed information that we can use tomorrow.In post 1142, Sando wrote:So what does lynching either of them gain us today?-
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Almost50 Monkey Business
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UNVOTE:
OK. Going to wait for profii to explain why SK and not Mafia, and also wait for Shad to post.
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Sando Mafia Scum
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We already have one (scum or SK or both), we just don't know which one it is, we have a very good chance of getting that confirmed for us without a potential mislynch. The benefit is potentially stopping the SK kill, which the SK already needs to use to get rid of the tracker...In post 1145, texcat wrote:
A scum. And some confirmed information that we can use tomorrow.In post 1142, Sando wrote:So what does lynching either of them gain us today?
We have scum and SK in a very difficult position right now, regardless of Profii's claims veracity, throwing that difficulty away by lynching Shad is the cost, for what I think would be negligible gain, given above.
@Texcat Profii and Taly are both on the Shad!SK boat, but you say we've caught scum. Why do you think it's scum and not SK? What do you think of Profii and Taly assuming SK?-
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profii Jack of All Trades
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Phone posting rn but Shad did the opposite of OMGUS with a town read placed on me because He thought I TR him
That as a piece of a larger puzzle seems to me to be someone who wants to keep Reciprocated TRs around to see him through the later stages of the game
Could be wrong - just fits better in my world-
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davesaz HeSurvivorHe
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Official Vote Count 3.3
Shadpearl (3) - Taly, profii, texcat
havingfitz (2) - Creature, Kopherald
profii (2) - Lil Uzi Vert, havingfitz
Kopherald (1) - Ausuka
texcat (1) - Sando
Not Voting (2) - Shadpearl, Almost50
With 11 alive it takes 6 to lynch.
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