micro 816-II: pokemon go (open game) (gambe over)

[Kokichi Oma]

Nico is your biggest townread? LLOOLL

[stungun0404]

@koki: yes, that’s where i am leaning atm.

looking at things, shoshin had a

very

strong townread on maria, therefore if we trust shoshin is accurate with her strong townreads, then it’s a good bet maria is town. she went so far as to say she would never lynch maria.

overall, it seemed like both creature and shoshin were relatively toward nulltown on kokichi. aronis said he didn’t want to shoot kokichi, so maybe slight town there.

nicorobin was in the scumpool of both aronis and creature. that’s concerning :-X
but i don’t think nico was really anywhere in shoshin’s

all three players expressed serious concerns about profii.

[Kokichi Oma]

Looks like NSG is gone again. :/

[stungun0404]

stungun0404 (3): profii, GirlInFreezer, Shoshin

Yah, get off

creature must have felt quite strongly about me being town btw nsg to make this comment. if you trust his reads, you should therefore trust this one along with the fact that he never once considered me as scum to my memory, even after i scumread him.

[stungun0404]

Looks like NSG is gone again. :/

i’m disappointed by townplay in general here, and yes i’ll absolutely include myself in that mix

shoshin was obvtown. nsg looked like obvtown to me. but everyone else has done super scummy things, and some town things that can just as easily be brushed off as scummy things, so it makes it very hard to discern who here is town

[stungun0404]

if profii is scum actually, nico is pretty much definitely scum

i see anti-associatives with both koki and maria regarding profii

[stungun0404]

gamma flipped vanilla

so koki either got vanilla or scum. that proves a lot!

probably raises the chance of koki!scum because gamma does not like scum as much as town, and kokichi got the pm rejected by gamma

[northsidegal]

I'm not voting Maria, she's lock town by meta.

So that isn't happening.

is there any chance you could elaborate on that, as well as your history in reading maria such that you can say that (not to imply anything)

@nsg, if you have found nothing i have done to have been that much of a towntell, then why not ever question any of the flipped town’s townreads on me? all aronis, shoshin, and creature had unqualified townreads on me from what i recall. heck, even aronis and creature both sheeped me on a read, and i terribly regret allowing myself to be convinced lynching either of them honestly, and especially for taking a leading role on the creature mislynch (though tbf, he made a few comments that were exactly like the ones i seen him make in his heroes wanted game which just finished and was his scum game, and that scumpinged me hard).

outside of you saying that i should trust any of those reads because of the people who made them, i'm not sure what point you're trying to make when shoshin is the only one who was nightkilled and not lynched. anyways, creature had a strong townread on you? could you quote that?

creature did not have that many strong reads in this game.

are you sure about that? admittedly my viewpoint might be biased, but it seems to me like he pretty plainly scumread maria.

Spoiler:

I'm fine doing any of Maria, Kokichi or Nico.

MariaR, Kokichi, Nico is like 1/3 chance of lynching town

MariaR is likely scum but likely no one will do anything about it, so 1/2 chance of lynching town

MariaR is likely scum but likely no one will do anything about it, so 1/2 chance of lynching town

Why is Maria scum? Her posts seem towny as fuck to me. The conversations with RC don't feel faked at all, and

RC wouldn't be weighing in to that extent on this game if he were scum.

Not to mention that RC was towny as fuck throughout his posting in the early points of this game, and everything Maria's doing is pretty much how she plays?

Are you sure?

we gotta find the scum between Kokichi and Nico then

maybe Maria will then be jailed and we'll finally end this game

The fact profii and me are still being pushed means town is like stalking their own tail.

You're simply being pocketed with potentially strong scum, like MariaR.

with 3 votes that have never truly been on profii out of 6, there’s a lower chance he gets lynched with the shoshin kill, because nobody outside of shoshin has constantly remained on him

okay

you've described to me why it would make sense for profii as scum to have killed shoshin, but not why i should specifically believe that that's the case over any other potential explanation

[northsidegal]

nico —> to be fair, the fact that she’s the only player that has not casted an angle thinking i might be scum and we’re in MYLO kinda seems town suggestive to me.

i really think thinking like this is a horrible, horrible mistake

[northsidegal]

looking at things, shoshin had a very strong townread on maria, therefore if we trust shoshin is accurate with her strong townreads, then it’s a good bet maria is town. she went so far as to say she would never lynch maria.

???

is this within the context of shoshin being the nightkill or are you just making this statement in general, knowing that shoshin is town? the distinction is pretty important, but either way i think it's a bad idea.

[northsidegal]

(you don't have to answer the thing about quoting where creature was townreading you, i see it now. i made 2557 before the other posts and just didn't get to post it for a little bit)

[stungun0404]

#	in this game	not in this game
1	NicoRobin	the worst
2	MariaR GuyInFreezer	RadiantCowbells
3	profii	Flavor Leaf
4	Kokichi Oma	Gamma Emerald
5	Shoshin	Irrelephant11
6	northsidegal	mutantdevle northsidestory
7	stungun0404	geminitwin12
8	Aronis	Prof Fridays
9	Creature	Ircher

geez, can any red flips happen in either game?

NicoRobin —> did not claim, so (?); the worst —> vanilla townie
maria —> claimed vanilla townie; rc —> ?
profii —> claimed vanilla townie; flavor leaf —> ?
Kokichi Oma —> claimed vanilla townie; gamma emerald —> vanilla townie
Shoshin —> vanilla townie; Irrelephant —> ?
northsidegal —> did not claim, so (?); mutantdevle —> ?
stungun0404 —> claimed vanilla townie; geminitwin12 —> ?
Aronis —> vanilla townie; Prof Fridays —> town odd-night watcher
Creature —> vanilla townie; Ircher —> vanilla townie



i’d like to see if anyone can deduce anything from these flips


as if this isn’t panic enough, scum is 2-0 so far in friemds mafia games. i really hope we can steal a victory in one of these 2 games



now i think we’d be smart to await any further flips from the other game before lynching today, but still to try and determine who we want lynched in the meantime.

[stungun0404]

Fight me

K

VOTE: creature

this is the weakest votepark i have seen from a player actually engaging with this game

your votepark on aronis was super weak too

[stungun0404]

Aronis needs to claim.

Meh

VOTE: Aronis

We should lynch Aronis and JK GIF

VOTE: Aronis

Erm

I will do it

VOTE: Aronis

other than your L-2 vote on aronis d1 which was similarly weak, these were your other 2 votes on aronis, and they don’t look very convinced of a scumflip of aronis and yet you are more than happy lynching there, as indicated by how you put him at L-2 twice and L-1 on another occasion. you would think somebody doung that would be pretty convinced someone is scum

[northsidegal]

oh yeah, flavor leaf would probably take scum over profii. i think that's one of the reasons i was townreading him.

it's also strange because i would imagine that the ducky would take scum over nicorobin - that being said, i only know the ducky's abilities when it comes to scum, not really his preference. i think maybe he prefers town? don't really remember.

[stungun0404]

it depends on who got first choice in every pair too


can everyone claim that, from maria/rc, to nico/tw, to profii/fl? possibly we can use the other game to figure out if anyone is lying between maria/profii

i took first choice over gemini, fwiw.

[stungun0404]

oh yeah, flavor leaf would probably take scum over profii. i think that's one of the reasons i was townreading him.

it's also strange because i would imagine that the ducky would take scum over nicorobin - that being said, i only know the ducky's abilities when it comes to scum, not really his preference. i think maybe he prefers town? don't really remember.

here’s the primary problem there: we can’t completely townread someone on variables regarding the game setup, as people can definitely manipulate that aspect as scum.

so what i am seeing with your townread of profii is it is completely based off game mechanics —> as in profii likely isn’t scum because of the shots/lack of shots that went down, his partner being more likely to take scum. both those are things we cannot prove, and very well can be confbiased off our experiences with a given player. just when you think you know somebody, you don’t. for example, consider player a is really good at scum, but prefers playing as town. then why wouldn’t they take town over scum, and let their partner take the scum role? that’s where the problem lies right now — if the main thing you are townreading him for is game mechanics right now that is not enough when we are sitting in MYLO with a player and that player could have manipulated every single aspect you are looking into;


in fact i think you said early on in this game you have read profii wrong in every game you have been in. if you are reading entirely based off mechanics, what makes this the exception to the rule?

shoshin asked you in specific three times i see about your profii townread and could not see the chain of logic. she is now proven town, so if you believe profii!town you will need more to support it than just strictly game mechanics in MYLO.

[stungun0404]

not to mention if both players get scum roles, obviously they both are required to take scum

[northsidegal]

both those are things we cannot prove, and very well can be confbiased off our experiences with a given player.

are you trying to say that reading people based off of their content is any different for this, or indeed any

less

of these? because i would argue the exact opposite.

if the main thing you are townreading him for is game mechanics right now that is not enough when we are sitting in MYLO with a player and that player could have manipulated every single aspect you are looking into;

we know as an almost certainty that scum did not anticipate us finding out about the deliberate lack of a kill night one - that is something that cannot have been manipulated.

in fact i think you said early on in this game you have read profii wrong in every game you have been in. if you are reading entirely based off mechanics, what makes this the exception to the rule?

no, i never said that.

in a previous game with profii i

believe

(speaking strictly from memory) that i scumread him for his content, and then eventually i figured out he was town through mechanics. what makes this game different is that i'm focusing mainly on the mechanics (the thing that got me the correct answer), and not the content (which i know has historically gotten profii to be lynchbait in previous games)

[stungun0404]

here’s the problem with profii!town

scum likes to give information instead of analysis —> i have been caught doing this in transformers mafia by ircher. titus!scum in heroes wanted mafia did this with a VCA, and eventually we lynched there correctly. profii’s list posts read in such a manner, like when he looked at the votes of every player, he did not draw any real conclusions from that.

scum likes to favor possibility over probability, rather going with the improbable stance regarding the game. profii has done that.

scum will opportunistically join lynchwagons. this can be seen in several instances from profii’s votes on D1, and concerning both of the lynchwagons that formed that he joined —> both town btw —> aronis and creature.

scum will disregard someone sticking up for themselves if said player is town —> of course you would have to trust that i am town here to see this.

scum would probably doubtcast as many players as they possibly can, profii apparently did not have trust in any of shoshin, creature or aronis in spite of giving shoshin a town badge early d1 but then retracting it later.

scum would post a list of their partner’s reads upholding theirs, but not give any details in their thought processes. profii did this with flavor’s reads. and guess what, lolol flavor said maria and shoshin “could be scum” - that was the hardest scum stance there. idk how both of them could have scumread shoshin, especially if they have had experience with her. it’s super clear if you have even played one game with her. notice how i never once wavered on that read.

scum would mess around and not give solid reads directly when they are a possible lynch profii —> profii did this d1.

scum would distract away from their lynch by asking questions about who their partner would be. profii did this d1, as his lynchwagon was forming.

[stungun0404]

is this something i can townread profii off of? historically i think i'm pretty bad at reading profii so i don't think i'm really one to ask when it comes to sorting his slot but reading through i felt like having the theories was a towntell (even though that was something i got falsely townread for as scum in my first scumgame). eh.

this is what i was talking about d1 btw.

[stungun0404]

if profii is lynchbait, how come he has only been mislynched as town once?

[stungun0404]

are you trying to say that reading people based off of their content is any different for this, or indeed any less of these? because i would argue the exact opposite.

it can be good for a townlean perhaps depending on the situation, but a townread over mechanics is often too strong

mathblade and nancydrew manipulated the heck out of this aspect of the game in heroes wanted mafia.

[stungun0404]

play is more important than mechanics, and should be emphasized, unless a player is mechanically confirmed town by some evidence

[Kokichi Oma]

if profii is scum actually, nico is pretty much definitely scum

i see anti-associatives with both koki and maria regarding profii

then wouldn't it be better to lynch nico here?