Mini Normal 2024 - Endgame

[Tchill13]

VOTE: mumble

And so begins the conquest of known lurkers.

Bbt. Be town. Light the way.

[Tchill13]

Btw, I've got a way to find out who's town and who's scum d1.

Listen, everyone
quote this if you're town

Spoiler:

this if you're mafia

Spoiler:

and this if you're a neutral or some other non town role

Spoiler:

This will work, believe me.

Loophole.

[Tchill13]

I said TChill might be scum now I'm wondering why everyone hasn't voted for him.

Maybe you guys missed it? I think TChill could be scum.

i think BBT could be scum.

(ok now everyone vote him)

BBT BB better please.

[Tchill13]

i have no idea who is scum given this is page 2.

[Tchill13]

Partially because he ignored my question and partially for reactions. I'll leave my vote until he answers my question

Twain, why didn't you just ask about it?

You're gonna vote me for not answering a question about a silly rvs post? Hmm. Keep it there I guess.

[Tchill13]

he explains

Lol. Dr.dolittle knows what's up.

No explanation is better than a poor explanation.

[Tchill13]

Is there scum reason to ignore you? How so? Where's the book that says there's no town reason to ignore you?

[Tchill13]

I don't have a read on irrelephant, I was just trying to get a sense of his play style.

[Tchill13]

I don't have a read on irrelephant, I was just trying to get a sense of his play style.

what have you learned?

I usually but heads with ppl that tend to throw around the saying "no town motivation" due to the fact everyone plays town differently.

hopefully we get along though.

[Tchill13]

I usually assume that votes in the first 5 pages aren't making it to an actual lynch =P

(and, as it follows, is a vote to stir shit up. That vote on you is at least as responsible for the content generated as yours was.)

except votes on mumble. Those votes make it to a lynch. lets start there.

[Tchill13]

Nausci its been awhile nice to see you.

ignore irrelephant most of the stuff he says is... irrelevant, I got jokes. I like his effort though. Hopefully that keeps up.

[Tchill13]

I said TChill might be scum now I'm wondering why everyone hasn't voted for him.

Maybe you guys missed it? I think TChill could be scum.

i think BBT could be scum.

(ok now everyone vote him)

BBT BB better please.

oh this joke felt forced? gotta work on the delivery I guess.

I don't feel like I play carefully. I feel like i'm pretty wreckless as either alignment. Nauci may have played one of my first games with me.

as for not doing anything... I agree. I'm not going to until I have something I CAN do something with.

[Tchill13]

UNVOTE: Rei
VOTE: Irrelephant for not explaining his vote

VOTE: twain
grasping at straws much?

to be fair twain could be eager town. I mean that looks like someone voting to vote for a reason rather than a random vote

(yes, its a bad reason, but a reason.)

[Tchill13]

oh dammit I missed RVS

VOTE: tchill serious vote

hi nauci

y

RVS isn't the first 10 posts sheesh lol.

like even twain voting for a reason as miniscule as it was is still RVS. If you're gonna go to that length to find a reason then you'll just make a reason.

[Tchill13]

Dr. Do Little are you a tone reader? You seem to be pushing that.

[Tchill13]

thats fair. I'm a terrible tone reader. You're not alone lol. I'm also very unaware of my own tone due to that.

[Tchill13]

well if he wants to tone read me thats fine, but he'll just be aggravated at me for not making any sense tonally at the end of the game. I'd think my tone changes with effort levels. So maybe he is a good tone reader lol.

[Tchill13]

nope. I don't want to but you force me to...

seriously though you play well when you post more... so... I'm gonna push you if i don't see that. Not tunnel (i hate tunnels) but I'll advocate for your lynch while hunting multiple scum.

[Tchill13]

i know a few of those names. I guess thats fair. I'm just saying im usually trying to evolve my game for the better so i don't think meta is the way to go with me.

As for the mumbler, maybe his mumble is a speech impediment. Maybe he mumbles because he's not confident. I'd like to get him to come out of his shell though. Even if he calls me mean names like a vomit poster. Since I do clog the thread (with good intentions) from time to time.

[Tchill13]

nope. I don't want to but you force me to...

seriously though you play well when you post more... so... I'm gonna push you if i don't see that. Not tunnel (i hate tunnels) but I'll advocate for your lynch while hunting multiple scum.

btw, you are careful. This ^ is a good example of that. You don't attack people right away when you have an opinion and wait/warn them/explain your actions instead.
That's why I asked, it can be a scumtell sometimes. Idrk about this one though.

OK. I'm careful in the since that I don't create a toxic atmosphere for the game

[Tchill13]

Scum CAN NOT be caught from single rvs post. That's just ridiculous.

That's something prideful people come up with to brag about when they randomly pick out scum on their first try. Give me a break. Can't catch scum from one single post. Rvs is pointless when it comes to reads imo.

[Tchill13]

Is that you still dodging the question TChill?

I'm not dodging anything. Except balls I dodge balls.

[Tchill13]

Then why haven't you answered it?

Mostly to watch you make a big deal out of nothing.

[Tchill13]

nope. I don't want to but you force me to...

seriously though you play well when you post more... so... I'm gonna push you if i don't see that. Not tunnel (i hate tunnels) but I'll advocate for your lynch while hunting multiple scum.

btw, you are careful. This ^ is a good example of that. You don't attack people right away when you have an opinion and wait/warn them/explain your actions instead.
That's why I asked, it can be a scumtell sometimes. Idrk about this one though.

OK. I'm careful in the since that I don't create a toxic atmosphere for the game

That’s bullshit, you don’t need to insult the other players to push your scum reads. If you wanted to create pressure while being nice to people, you’d see it’s not even that hard.
If you’re anxious to push reads without much content, think that you’re unfair or sth, then just say so.
Right now you’re just making excuses.

Scum CAN NOT be caught from single rvs post. That's just ridiculous.

That's something prideful people come up with to brag about when they randomly pick out scum on their first try. Give me a break. Can't catch scum from one single post. Rvs is pointless when it comes to reads imo.

That was in reference to what?

Whats BS exactly? That I'm nice? That I'm careful I'm how I treat people?...

Cool. I never said you had to insult to push. I simply said I'm careful not to insult.

[Tchill13]

Quick look up of the 3 players with 1 post only:

-NSG I've already talked about
-Lalendra seems to always be lynchbait (I mean, she's even got quotes about her in her profile on that) and doesn't post much (1x/day at most), with very little activity in the last few weeks
-Kop is slightly more active than Lalendra but also pretty quiet, and of few words

So that's disappointing.

We could lynch lalendra instead of mumble

[Tchill13]

Re: that question

tchill I mostly wanted to know what experience you have with bbt that would make you say he should "light the way" for town. I'm still a little lost why you wouldn't want to answer the question as town. I would love to have answer to both of those.

Honestly I think my vote is still best on nsg, given her known tendency to lurk as scum. her only post was a prodge. kop you should join me, make it a wagon

ok ok fine.

BBT played scum in a way I really enjoyed and was excited about the chance to play town with him.

Not answering was mostly reactionary. To see who would and who wouldnt make a big deal out of it. Then to see who made a big deal out of it with bad reasoning.

[Tchill13]

you know what happens to lynchbait? they make it to lylo. Scum and town chit chat for a bit. "i guess so and so wasn't lynchbait, theyre actually scum" Town gets lynched. Scum win.

Let me be very clear. If you can't clear "lynchbait" players as town for any reason other than meta then GTFO OF HERE AND STOP USING THE WORD "LYNCHBAIT".

that is all.

[Tchill13]

Quick look up of the 3 players with 1 post only:

-NSG I've already talked about
-Lalendra seems to always be lynchbait (I mean, she's even got quotes about her in her profile on that) and doesn't post much (1x/day at most), with very little activity in the last few weeks
-Kop is slightly more active than Lalendra but also pretty quiet, and of few words

So that's disappointing.

We could lynch lalendra instead of mumble

Why do you want to lynch lynchbait??

Because it's perfect for scum to chase. So for that, he's in my scum pile.

no. Scum want those types of players in lylo.

Scum SHOULD do what they can to surround themselves with the easiest group to win in lylo. You can NK town leaders, lynch middle of the pack players... for me though. I want lurkers in lylo if im scum.

It's actually the opposite of perfect for scum to chase. Its the worst lynch for scum to chase.

[Tchill13]

what point are you trying to make?

I dont want ppl to be cleared as town because of their meta. That doesn't hold up as much as in game contributions in lylo.

[Tchill13]

like scum have multiple ppl. So for a scum team to have to lynch a lurker d1, especially on this site, then they'd just be lazy really. Or have no real plan for winning the game.

[Tchill13]

what point are you trying to make?

I dont want ppl to be cleared as town because of their meta. That doesn't hold up as much as in game contributions in lylo.

...just meta in general, or meta specifically for lynchbait-y players?

I mean if we could throw meta out altogether that'd be great but im mainly referring to the players that are "lynchbaity"

[Tchill13]

because "mislynchbait" players have created an environment where they do not contribute much to town, are highly TR'd in any game they're in due to meta and easily win as scum with little to no contributions and one or two good posts the entire game.

I've seen it enough from some players to almost call them out for holding back their town play to make their scum play easier.

[Tchill13]

the way "mislynch" players play... Means when lynching them there is an equal chance they flip scum or town in any given game.

[Tchill13]

I think a scum hunting tool should be thrown away if used wrong more than right on a consistent basis.

[Tchill13]

To see who would and who wouldnt make a big deal out of it.

What’s the difference between these 2 to you and why are both different than “big deal with bad reasoning”?

you can find eager town and scum trying to push lynches early.

[Tchill13]

To see who would and who wouldnt make a big deal out of it.

What’s the difference between these 2 to you and why are both different than “big deal with bad reasoning”?

you can find eager town and scum trying to push lynches early.

But how would are you determining the difference between eager Town and eager scum?

ah. thats the question. I feel i've become better at it here recently.

I'm not explaining that process though.

[Tchill13]

VOTE: mumble

do it, do it, do it.

[Tchill13]

Choo Choo

[Tchill13]

im lock towning Rei.

right after she votes mumble.

[Tchill13]

I'm not gonna share my every thought day 1. I COULD be bullshitting. Quite an unneeded spectacle just to BS though. I did get something out of it. I also think it's up to you to decide if I'm BS'ing or telling the truth

@alchemist

[Tchill13]

@irrelephant you can't vote mumble and ask if the scum team doesn't involve him lol. That's not how it works.

Mumble can actually be scum here

[Tchill13]

So let's finish that mumble lynch up and move on to day 2 shall we?

Ohhhhh sorry for missing the joke lol. That's funny though.

[Tchill13]

that mumble wagon is losing focus.

[Tchill13]

Tchill is a townread.

Nauci is a scumread.

not sure how you could even come up with this for starters.

[Tchill13]

Mumble's iso shows no effort in solving or generating content. Only states reads.

I halfway expect him to fake claim at intent.

[Tchill13]

Tchill is a townread.

Nauci is a scumread.

not sure how you could even come up with this for starters.

You wouldn't push for my lynch as scum. You would tunnel me as town.

Nauci's 117 is bad. No reason for her to interject in a comment I made to you. But, even though she gave her support for your, she didn't act on it at all. Bad.

Not an adequate way to TR me btw because I'm well aware everyone would know this.

[Tchill13]

Are you so determined to lynch all lurkers or whatever reasons you have for going after only mumble

He wants to policy me in pretty much every game we ever play just because I lurked out once (about a year ago) and won as scum due to people not understand power role mechanics.

It's a annoying and I want to scream f-bombs at him, but it pretty much lock towns him for me.

I appreciate you too mumble.

[Tchill13]

I lock Towned you because you said you'd scum read anyone who TR'd you without any reason.

And I did so without reason... Then you town read me for that... Little odd.

Maybe I'm doing too much reaction testing.

[Tchill13]

So yall all know mumble is town? How's that?

[Tchill13]

It's a annoying and I want to scream f-bombs at him, but it pretty much lock towns him for me.

i'm not sure i've ever seen town you pass up the opportunity to be snarky at someone who's wrong

although your being more engaged makes me doubt my scumread

Activity is NAI right? Or is that a meta read?

[Tchill13]

it's a meta read

So if mumble is active he's automatically not scum?

[Tchill13]

I can get behind BBT's train of thought.

[Tchill13]

I'm pointing out why he needs to be lynched.

[Tchill13]

VOTE: lalendra

I can't vote Kopp and lalendra at the same time...

[Tchill13]

nope. I don't want to but you force me to...

seriously though you play well when you post more... so... I'm gonna push you if i don't see that. Not tunnel (i hate tunnels) but I'll advocate for your lynch while hunting multiple scum.

btw, you are careful. This ^ is a good example of that. You don't attack people right away when you have an opinion and wait/warn them/explain your actions instead. That's why I asked, it can be a scumtell sometimes. Idrk about this one though.

OK. I'm careful in the since that I don't create a toxic atmosphere for the game

That’s bullshit, you don’t need to insult the other players to push your scum reads. If you wanted to create pressure while being nice to people, you’d see it’s not even that hard. If you’re anxious to push reads without much content, think that you’re unfair or sth, then just say so. Right now you’re just making excuses.

Whats BS exactly? That I'm nice? That I'm careful I'm how I treat people?...
Cool. I never said you had to insult to push. I simply said I'm careful not to insult.

You are misconstruing my post.
I said that

“You warned your SRs instead of actually pushing them and bothered to explain “how exactly will you do it”, so you’re being careful.”

And you answered that

“you’re careful because you don’t want the game to become toxic”.

IF you wanted to pressure people and had no other reasons not to, being nice would NOT hinder you.
That answer very much felt like an excuse. Or like you wanted to say sth that would put you in a better light and screwed up while doing that.

I mean, I guess you have been playing normally lately and I didn’t really get the feeling you were forcing yourself to do stuff, but just what the fuck?

Seriously,
what
the fuck?

I don't understand why you're making a huge deal out of this. If you want to see an excuse then so be it.

[Tchill13]

Lynch scumble or lynch lalendra.

[Tchill13]

Lalendra what are your townreads

Tchill why do you want to lynch Lalendra

Why don't you want to lynch lalendra?

[Tchill13]

OK we can just sit here then. Anything else you'd like to talk about?

[Tchill13]

Same as my reasoning with mumble.

Did you really think it'd be any different?

[Tchill13]

I think kop is putting in effort.

Even though his reads are super weird and I don't agree with them I could see them coming from a "tryhard" town so to speak.

[Tchill13]

Yeah kop is weird. Doesn't make him scum.

[Tchill13]

He has provided more content in his post than mumble or lalendra.

[Tchill13]

If scum isn't in those 3 players I GAURANTEE they'd rather lynch kop than mumble or lalendra.

[Tchill13]

I don't buy the reasoning. I already said why mumble's reasoning was bad for his read on me.

[Tchill13]

tbh im not seeing lalendra scum

Why?

[Tchill13]

VOTE: kop

Since other people pushed him first maybe he'll actually get lynched.

[Tchill13]

yeah my read changed from null to he's scum.

[Tchill13]

No. I was never TR'ing him. If one of mumble and lalendra don't get lynched today I doubt they ever get lynched. That's why I didn't want to vote kop.

Now I'm wanting to vote kop because others have actually voted him. He's lurky enough to fall into the category with mumble and lalendra at this point. So I have no problem lynching him.

[Tchill13]

I don't understand why people are trying to lynch nauci atm. Doesn't seem like scum to me.

[Tchill13]

cant wait for that explanation.

[Tchill13]

Your reads on certain things not necessarily reads on players.

[Tchill13]

There could be. I don't see why they would be. You're obviously not a danger to them atm. You're not trying to do much.

Hell you even said you never give reads, Which scum could take advantage of.

So why scum would choose to lynch you when they have other options is beyond me.

Scum SHOULDNT lynch just to achieve a lynch. Sometimes they do though.

[Tchill13]

What if Tchill’s just scum and all of Mumble, Nauci, and Kop are Town?

VOTE: Tchill

What if tchills just town and all three of those are scum?

I have as much basis for my statement as you do. None.

[Tchill13]

TChill, you need to talk about that Kop read because what you just said sounds like BS.

It not really a read. What's he got? 5-10 post? Not too much content. Lots of fluff and babbling.

You're telling me you're not OK with lynching that?

[Tchill13]

I'm not game solving. I'm not scum.

You can figure the game out in day 1?

Very wow. Much impressed.

[Tchill13]

Kop hasn't given reads of players. He has given reads, or opinions, of other information.

[Tchill13]

Happy birthday.

[Tchill13]

Very interesting group of players we got here lol. BBT and Alchemist voting me. Irrelephant try harding. Then there's like 3 lurkers mixed in.

Mumble should we lynch a low content player or an early, almost too aggressive due to the lack of low content player?

[Tchill13]

Quick look up of the 3 players with 1 post only:

-NSG I've already talked about
-Lalendra seems to always be lynchbait (I mean, she's even got quotes about her in her profile on that) and doesn't post much (1x/day at most), with very little activity in the last few weeks
-Kop is slightly more active than Lalendra but also pretty quiet, and of few words

So that's disappointing.

We could lynch lalendra instead of mumble

Lynching a lurker doesn't always work, or have it's benefits. If she flips town, what exactly is it going to give us? It's a easy avenue for scum to push because it won't get much resistance, and it also doesn't look bad for them when trying to justify there actions the next day.

Lynch Lalendra as a last resort if we can't get anything done before deadline.

Quick look up of the 3 players with 1 post only:

-NSG I've already talked about
-Lalendra seems to always be lynchbait (I mean, she's even got quotes about her in her profile on that) and doesn't post much (1x/day at most), with very little activity in the last few weeks
-Kop is slightly more active than Lalendra but also pretty quiet, and of few words

So that's disappointing.

We could lynch lalendra instead of mumble

Why do you want to lynch lynchbait??

Because it's perfect for scum to chase. So for that, he's in my scum pile.

i mean, i guess. nauci saying that lalendra is lynchbait doesn't mean she has to be town here or anything...

being lynchbait also doesn't mean you can't be scum. it just struck me as a weird reaction reading through - to be paranoid for a second, kind of like you're talking like you already know that lalendra is town and as such lynchbait and not scum. i would think that town would respond differently to what tchill said there.

I understand what you are saying, I'm not saying lalendra is town or scum. But from my experience, she isn't a high poster and comes off a lot as lynchbait. But I wouldn't go as far as wanting to lynch her ahead of anyone else based on one post. She will have to post and offer an input and if not there's a chance she will be replaced then we go from there. And the input she does put in will determine the path to take, I'm not lynching Someone who's known as lynchbait and has only made one post because that's too easy, anyone pushing that is coming off as false scum hunting imo.

Kop now that you're back nearly 6 pages later

Do you have updated reads

I don't generally do reads, especially on day one. You can go and review a lot of my other games that I've played on here and you'll see that I don't do reads often. I prefer to play the game by using conversations with people that gives me reads that I generally keep to myself.

I also don't use meta as a tool, I don't use any tools to help me scum read someone or find scum, as in general I always believe in evolving. People will try to change there meta to become harder to read so I don't use it. I've often been lynched because I generally get a bit busy with real life in times so don't post much, and simply because my scum games I've been quiet, so they assume I'm scum because they meta read me and I've flipped town in those games that I've been misread in because of meta. But I do use meta as a guidance but I don't base any of my reads on meta, I base it on the game.

(I'm aware that this makes it a bit hypocritical because of my defence on Lalendra but I am going off reputation. And my slight concern that I've pushed Lalendra before and learned that it's a common thing with Lalendra. So I wasn't going to be drawn in again.)

you know what happens to lynchbait? they make it to lylo. Scum and town chit chat for a bit. "i guess so and so wasn't lynchbait, theyre actually scum" Town gets lynched. Scum win.

Let me be very clear. If you can't clear "lynchbait" players as town for any reason other than meta then GTFO OF HERE AND STOP USING THE WORD "LYNCHBAIT".

that is all.

I understand that lynchbait do make it to LYLO and that's what scum want. But scum can afford to get rid of one lynchbait, especially on day one because in general scum want to get through to the first night and hope that they created some suspicions on other town on day one, then they can pretty much plan there kill and next path to take on day two and hope to ride on the confusion made on day one, or diverting suspicion to others based on there kill.

Some of it also rides on the experience of the scum team also. I've seen some baffling kills before that just didn't make any sense, and it just created a lot of confusion.

in any given post he takes a stance on some sort of situation whether it be in this game currently, past game, or just a general idea. He's providing thoughts on certain concepts. Weird thoughts imo.

[Tchill13]

Kop hasn't given reads of players. He has given reads, or opinions, of other information.

Show me what reads

also if your town, I think you are (wasn't expecting your town play to look like this) your game changes quite drastically depending upon alignment.

[Tchill13]

Kop hasn't given reads of players. He has given reads, or opinions, of other information.

Reads or opinions of other information.

[Tchill13]

What if Tchill’s just scum and all of Mumble, Nauci, and Kop are Town?

VOTE: Tchill

What if tchills just town and all three of those are scum?

I have as much basis for my statement as you do. None.

Scumslip? If you knew your role PM was green you'd have at least SOME basis for that statement. Also really not feeling that progression on Kop, or the hard press on the lurkers.

VOTE: Tchill

Very important. How serious are you about the scum slip statement?

[Tchill13]

Messy town with no clear purpose? That's what I'm coming off as?

That's reasonable.

[Tchill13]

Irrelephant are you an alt? How long have you played mafia?

[Tchill13]

Alright if you're town, I think you are, I like your play. Very active and aggressive.

How do you feel about the fact we have 3 lurkish players and one who's been prodded?

How do you feel about the fact one has accused me of a scum slip (which almost aren't real because they hardly ever happen)?

Do you believe that meta will hold up in lylo to town clear someone if the game comes down to a lurker?

[Tchill13]

OK so now that we agree that lurkers are bad.

You think it's OK to give a lurker a chance to show townyness through later day phases. I disagree. I believe they have their opportunity until they're lynched. They have failed to take that opportunity now and since the game began.

What if we let a lurker live d2 and 3 and they've failed to show townyness? What if, say town isn't doing well and we've mislynched d1 and d2 and kop, mumble, lalendra are still in the game d3. Surely scum won't nk them if they're town. But townies wouldn't know they're town short of a night action correct?

[Tchill13]

my issue is:

scum will do what they have to to keep those beneficial to them in the game. If we don't lynch a lurker d1 then when is a good time to do so? d2? What if the majority of town believes we find scum and we are wrong d2, mislynch and still have the lurker on the board? So now we're on d3 right? Well we've got 3 lurkers that are probtown due to meta (thatd be the argument). WE can't lynch all of them? Say we lynch mumble, say its a mislynch. You're in lylo with lalendra and Kop.

Are you gonna believe you'd still think lalendra or kop is town based solely on meta with little to nothing to back that read with from this game in particular?

[Tchill13]

if you refuse to plan ahead thats a decent answer i guess.

[Tchill13]

if you prepare for the worst you never have to deal with the worst.

[Tchill13]

Thank you rei. "What if I was town"

I guess people don't think scum are that careful. Of course they don't have to be. They can just lurk.

[Tchill13]

yeah my read changed from null to he's scum.

Why has it changed?

Bump.
I do want to hear your answer here btw

Because people voted him.

[Tchill13]

I’ll lynch anyone under “null” in my reads. Right now Kop is the bigger wagon, is all

Can you answer my question about why you liked the lalendra post?

Yeah my b I missed it

What if Tchill’s just scum and all of Mumble, Nauci, and Kop are Town?

VOTE: Tchill

What if tchills just town and all three of those are scum?

I have as much basis for my statement as you do. None.

Scumslip? If you knew your role PM was green you'd have at least SOME basis for that statement. Also really not feeling that progression on Kop, or the hard press on the lurkers.

VOTE: Tchill

So here's her post. I actually see the scumslip - "what if tchill's town and [any combination of words]? I have no basis for that" suggests he doesn't believe himself to be town. Like I said I don't know if this really is one, but I enjoy when people call out scumslips, because as I mentioned I caught scum on them before. That's why I like the post. It also certainly suggests Lalendra/tchill is never S/S.

Just because you do something successfully once or twice doesn't mean it'll work every time. Scum slips rarely happen in the form people think they are. I can't ask someone to assume I'm town from their pov? Seeing how they won't know I'm town. Only ik I'm town.

"Let's assume I'm town"

Let US. US. YOU AND ME. YOU HAVE TO ASSUME I'M TOWN UNLESS YOU'RE SCUM.

See the logic?

[Tchill13]

Also I'm talking in 3rd person. Treating tchill as a different entity in my own speech. Treating him as a separate entity from myself.

[Tchill13]

Alchemist is probably scum btw. I do finally have a reason to scum push someone.

[Tchill13]

VOTE: alchemist

I'm about to go into work. I'll explain later tonight.

Yall can see if you see what I see though. It's an objective vote. Not OMGUS.

Good luck.

[Tchill13]

A few of yall don't understand the way I play d1. Yes I come off very scummy. Yes I do things with little to no reason (because there is little to no info).

And honestly I wouldn't even say that if I wasn't worried about deadline. I don't think I'm lynched unless scum pushes this through right before deadline. Seeing how some town refuse to lynch people who don't participate and would rather lynch someone who is actively trying to create content....

Just think of my d1 as a huge reaction test. I kinda see it that way.

[Tchill13]

How about look at what alchemist is doing and see if you see what I see.

Also. There's 5 low content posters... Gonna wait until d3 to lynch them all at once?

Or would you rather risk mislynching a player that's contributing. Because both contributer and lurker have equal chance of flipping town d1.

[Tchill13]

Because I will always policy until I have a reason with substance to lynch someone else who provides content instead of lynching someone that scum will never kill.

[Tchill13]

Why share all my raisins exactly?why let scum know if I'm on them and why I'm on them?

[Tchill13]

okay but like, what's the test?

Also agreed with whoever said Nauci is sadly low content lately
As is NSG who I would happily wagon atm

I don't see a case on alchemist so please do elaborate

The test is creating actions and reactions, content on day 1.

[Tchill13]

Irrelephant what's your stance on players that scum can use to make it easier for them to win? Do you not feel that those players are tools for scum to use? Essentially a lesser form of a PR for scum.

Can we at least agree that if you were scum you'd want lurkers in lylo?

Why am I scum exactly? Because I'd like to push an easy lynch on a lurker day 1?

Answer all those in order please.

[Tchill13]

Just because I don't give reads that I have doesn't mean I don't have reads.

If you refuse to deal with lurkers then you're giving scum an easy out.

You way why are they scum. What's scummy about them. That's bad reasoning. Why are they town? What's towny about them? The same can be said.

[Tchill13]

Having a debate with you isn't for you only. Others voting me can read that and have their own thoughts.

[Tchill13]

To catch scum you have to ask yourself what scum would do or want. They'd usually prefer a group that would allow them to win lylo. Lining up lurkers just to achieve a lynch when you already have a group of players working towards a lynch on your scum team is a lazy and bad idea. So I'd have to say that's not what you're more likely to do as scum in that scenario.

You can't just nk good townies all the time due to protective roles or watcher roles. So that argument is invalid. It wouldn't work like that all the time.

Ik you're newer and I can tell you play with ambition. I'm just trying to show you why you lynch lurkers early. Of course it's not agreed on this site. Actually the opposite is agreed on site wide. I've yet to see a good argument for it though.

Only reason I'm discussing this is because half the game is lurking. Which tells me scum is statistically lurking. Which tells me we will never lynch all scum if we refuse to lynch lurkers because they're not scummy. What If I refuse to vote anyone else other than a lurker because lurkers are not towny? It's the same idea.

[Tchill13]

Anyways I'm bogging the thread down. Just trying to show you why I play DAY ONE. THE DAY WITH THE LEAST INFO WE HAVE the way I do.

[Tchill13]

No any player is just as likely to be town as a lurker that's the damn point, unless your reads are correct 100 percent of the time ON DAY ONE. Site meta is shit. That's why town suck here.

I do have reads. Idc if you believe me.

Rei what's your relation to boris? Like is it actually cousin or what? Lol.

[Tchill13]

The masses believe it so it must be true.

[Tchill13]

OK I like that player lol. So I was jw.

[Tchill13]

It doesn't help town read me correctly. My goal is to find scum and to not be lynched or NK'D.

I haven't been lynched, I'm in no immediate danger of being lynched. I'm scummy so scum shouldn't nk me if I make it past d1 due to my mislynchability. I'm doing my best to set up days 2 and 3, days where we have a higher statistical chance to lynch scum, to be as easy as possible to lynch scum due to eliminating baggage day 1 THAT IS JUST AS LIKELY TO BE TOWN OR SCUM AS THE NEXT PERSON DUE TO A MAJOR LACK OF INFORMATION DAY 1.

Say what you will. Think what you will. I use day 1 to lynch what could be scum tools, not cleared townies these people can actually be scum still. Seems their lurkyness conf towns them. That's how they're treated site wide which is a joke. "Let them show towny essential" they hardly ever do and you're left with too many problems if you haven't been nailing scum.

[Tchill13]

You don't have to argue game theory with me. The way I play is based on it though. If you disagree with that theory and you're voting me because of it then you're only voting me because of a disagreement in play style. Not because you believe I'm scum.

Do you believe I'm just gonna push lurkers the whole game? Honest question.

[Tchill13]

If you come into the discussion believing my intent is to deflect or misguide it's not gonna be a fruitful discussion.

[Tchill13]

I'm not trying to find town or scum as much as you are this day phase. I definitely don't want to be lynched. I definitely don't care what you're thoughts, or anyone else's, are about my play other than for the reason to work with you... Because it's a team game.

And if you're expecting a lawyer like, iron clad case against alchemist when you already don't agree on some of my views you're gonna have a bad time.

[Tchill13]

So alchemist has pushed me and nauci for a majority of the time with a little kop sprinkled in there correct?

Does nauci completely disappear as scum when she's Wagoned?

[Tchill13]

I don't think holding back all information is a good idea.

It's day 1 though. Which is vastly different than day 2 or 3 or 4.

I like that case alchemist. I'm still suspicious so I'm not Unvoting. I see where you're coming from though. It's reasonable.

[Tchill13]

I could get behind creature. I think kop is a good lynch. Fluff mcfluffington needs to go

[Tchill13]

1) Creature TWAIN *
2) BlueBloodedToffee *
3) Mumble *
4) Alchemist21
5) Nauci *
6) ejjinami **
7) northsidegal **
8) Lalendra *
9) Tchill13
10) Kop **
11) DrDolittle
12) Rei **
13) Irrelephant11


Wow, just noticed so many prods

Whoa buddy. Don't mention activity. We don't do that here

[Tchill13]

I'm for creature.

[Tchill13]

Lurkers are not more likely to be town or scum. They're equally likely. It's a slot with no content. Treat each lurker as it's their first game and you have no way to read them. The way meta is used on this site is more by the player using it to their advantage versus those trying to use it to read other players.

[Tchill13]

Lynch bait doesn't hold up in lylo.

[Tchill13]

Irrelephant, why should I townread you?

Because I’m town

Why ask me this?

Can scum say they're town?

[Tchill13]

Do you think the people that pushed nauci were scum or town?

[Tchill13]

I think those that pushed players providing content over, or even in the defense of, low content creators could be scum.

[Tchill13]

I think those that pushed players providing content over, or even in the defense of, low content creators could be scum.

who would you say could be scum in that bunch

alchemist.

[Tchill13]

Paranoia hour: I probably have at least one scum in my town reads

no thats not paranoia thats being self aware.

I'm debating switching to Kop or BBT.

[Tchill13]

I'm honestly super fucking baffled at what's going on. Alchemist + BBT both voted Kop and then immediately after like 20 posts Alchemist switches to tchill and BBT gets ready for a Tchill push
Can you guys both elaborate what the fuck is going on?
Like between your lasts votes and your previous post what has changed.

Also can we get more votes on irrelephant? Please?

yeah this is town.

[Tchill13]

If mumble posts 5 times are you automatically gonna unvote?

[Tchill13]

I'm somewhat comfortable townreading Creature

@tchill what's the difference between alchemist wanting to lynch a talkative player and you wanting to lynch alchemist?

I never said I voted him because he's talkative. I said I had reasons. Which imo look like he's working with scum motivation.

You're working on getting wagoned pretty hard ain't ya irrelephant?

[Tchill13]

It could be town.

It could be scum looking for an avenue to push back on a townie? I didn't like TChill's read at all though. If we could, I would lynch TChill or DDL over Kop.

I'm not getting lynched today buddy Boi. Sad you only play the style I like one game and now this is totally different lol.

Doesn't mean your not scum just because you were scum last time.

[Tchill13]

It could be town.

It could be scum looking for an avenue to push back on a townie? I didn't like TChill's read at all though. If we could, I would lynch TChill or DDL over Kop.

I TR ddl, nauci.

I Sr kop, lalendra, alchemist, Bbt, mumble. Probably in that order.

[Tchill13]

VOTE: kop

[Tchill13]

I can't decide what irrelephant is. Probably my strongest null.

I'd lynch Bbt or kop today. Have a feeling Bbt is gonna push me the whole game.

Alchemist and irrelephant are actually doing things. Bbt is flop flopping a little too much for my liking.

Kop is total fluff. Could easily be scum. Of course if he's town scum wouldn't want to lynch that slot. If he's scum the same goes. So that lynch will probably be town driven regardless.

I'd rather not lynch good contributer yet. I'd like to take another day to sort irrelephant and NSG.

Lalendra can definitely be scum here from my familiarity with her.

[Tchill13]

Why so sad irrelephant? Is this not a game that requires multiple days? Don't decide to hate me just yet. You can do that after the game.

[Tchill13]

Bbt is a good player. It's alarming to me that not only does he want me lynched but also ddl. My only STRONG TR. I TR nauci just not as much.

Bbt hasn't really poked and prodded too much. Not trying to solve from what I can tell. Blames his play on lack of time so he's already making excuses.

He obviously understands how my play this day can come from town. He played in a similar way as scum d1 last game (he wouldn't have if he didn't believe it could come from town or he'd stick out as scum).

He wants to lynch tchill (an active, content generating player who disagrees with him) and kop (fluff).he says that anyway.

We've already gathered he says a lot of things.

[Tchill13]

Tchill

How does Lalendra and kop stack up for you?

Based off familiarity with lalendra and no familiarity with kop I'd be willing to say there's more of a chance lalendra flips scum.

Lalendra hasn't read too much into anything yet. You can argue the scum slip. That comes off as a reason to vote me though. Not necessarily something she's looking too much into. Which she does a lot early game as town.

Kop is all fluff. Foot in mouth, circular conversation. I've been wrong about lalendra and she's hard to read. I'd recommend personally a night action be used on lalendra and mumble. We lynch kop or Bbt today.

[Tchill13]

but also ddl. My only STRONG TR.

???

Look man my reads are shit early. I'm sticking by it but I could very well be wrong.

[Tchill13]

We need to lynch kop today. Half the game says he is scum.

[Tchill13]

Before we lynch kop people need to decide who's more likely to be town. Mumble or lalendra. Should be very clear who each player thinks is more likely to be town once kop flips scum.

[Tchill13]

Alchemist what do you think about BBT's play regardless of how much you like him? You think it's odd he made an excuse when I brought up his play style this game?

[Tchill13]

It's not about the chance to contribute. It's about what kop had contributed vs what lalendra has.

It's both scum piles of crap. BUT kops looks more like content for the sake of content. Words with no meaning. Then he has just disappeared when pressure was applied.

Lalendra is an odd player. Very easy to be mislynched even when she provides content. So kop get the nod imo.

[Tchill13]

Alchemist what do you think about BBT's play regardless of how much you like him? You think it's odd he made an excuse when I brought up his play style this game?

I remember him being fairly active as both alignments so if he says he’s busy I believe it.

Yeah but scum are the first to make excuses for their play. Also you didn't touch on his play. Just the excuse. I'm more worried about his content this far and your thoughts of it.

[Tchill13]

I can't understand why you wouldn't want to lynch someone who's actually contributing. It's irrelevant to whether you've made a hundred posts or 10 you both have the same chance of flipping scum on day one to anyone who doesn't know your alignment. You could easily be scum dictating and trying to lead town just by contributing a lot.

If everyone makes 100 posts there is a great to be played. If everyone makes 5 there's no game. No fun. Would you agree with that? Would you agree it's more difficult to post 100 times and be scum vs posting 2 times and being scum? Would you agree that you're content rule only applies on day one?

[Tchill13]

Day one you go for someone who will provide legwork for day two rather than lynch a Lurker and just go with the attitude we will sort other slots out on day two. Your going to have the same problem when your targeting yet another lurker.

Why would I target a lurker day 2? I have more information to look at. I have a night kill. A lynch and a VCA.

So why would I only focus on lynching a lurker when I have actual information to digest?

[Tchill13]

Eh. Let alch and Bbt live. Those players will sort themselves eventually.

As for kop, bring me your torch. The tribe has spoken.

[Tchill13]

I would lynch within DDL, Lalendra and NSG personally. I don't have concrete reads, a lot of my reads are generally shit on day one, I tend to start to get better reading of players on day two when I have more information in front of me, that can give me a better view of things. Day one is just plain guesswork in terms of getting reads.

But those 3 I think is where I'd go. Call it gut feelings.

Whenever were those 3 picked and why?

[Tchill13]

To be clear I DO NOT town read people based on content alone. I only scum read people for that.

[Tchill13]

DDL, lalendra and kop have been thrown around A LOT.

There's at least one scum in that group for sure.

[Tchill13]

Can someone tell me what the difference is in lalendra and mumble?

[Tchill13]

Kop clearly regurgitated what he's seen.

We might actually lynch scum day 1.

[Tchill13]

You must really TR mumble to put lalendra ahead of mumble in the lynch list due to "well lalendra has to be scum eventually"

Why do you TR mumble?

[Tchill13]

That's my issue. You pointed out 3 sr's. One of which "is due to flip scum eventually"

So you must at least have a reason to TR everyone else or else you could scum read anyone for "they've gotta flip scum eventually".

[Tchill13]

Call me scum, whatever, going for the easy route to claim say it I know you want too, but I never lie. I'm just a VT.

Sigh. This claim comes across as town...

I wasn't even gonna ask him to claim tbh and I disagree with your assessment.

[Tchill13]

Doesn't change the fact there's at least one scum in lalendra, DDL and kop and I intend to lynch in that today.

I'll have to re iso ddl. It could easily be lalendra though.

[Tchill13]

Well it's fine if you don't scum read the claim but it shouldn't matter imo.

Obviously scum are gonna claim in the towniest way possible. I avoid using claims to try and read someone unless that claim can be confirmed. Obviously VT is the easiest fake claim to make.

[Tchill13]

Kop is saying what he's gotta say so he doesn't get lynched.

My biggest issue is he regurgitated the 3 most popular sr's then had little to no reason for having lalendra ahead of mumble. Even claimed he had no good TR's (which I understand but when a reason for pushing someone is "they'll flip scum eventually" that's pretty suspect".

[Tchill13]

Yeah I feel atm.

There's one scum in lalendra, DDL, kop.

There's one town that scum want to mislynch.

Then there's just someone thrown in there because it's convenient for both town and scum to throw in there.

[Tchill13]

I'm not saying there can't be 2 scum in there I'm just saying that's unlkely.

I doubt an irrelephant lynch happens today.

[Tchill13]

You disagree that scum try to do things in the towniest way? OK then.

[Tchill13]

Yeah the purpose of scum is to be towny. That's their first and foremost driving factor. The purpose of town is to lynch scum but be towny enough not to be lynched.

Ik not about to get into game theory again. I'm just saying appearing towny through a claim is very,very easy.

[Tchill13]

I'm glad you're willing to take a bullet so valiantly kop. You will be missed.

[Tchill13]

This lynch is too easy? 15 hours from dead line lol.

Kop is getting lynched. If he flips red you're in trouble.

You just started a vanity wagon based on lurkism which we've had a 5 page discussion about. You would have been better off pushing DDL.

[Tchill13]

not what i expected

[Tchill13]

VOTE: alchemist

[Tchill13]

I think it's off Bbt didn't open up with a push on me

Irrelephant was an easy nk for scum. I think only one person was worried about him being scum.

[Tchill13]

Why is DDL scummier than me?

[Tchill13]

DDL was on a townie but he wasn't on the lynch.

Idk if that makes him more likely to be scum or not.

[Tchill13]

VOTE: alchemist

I think it's off Bbt didn't open up with a push on me

Irrelephant was an easy nk for scum. I think only one person was worried about him being scum.

Why do you think I would make the push I did on Irrelephant as scum?

Frees up nk options if you can lynch a generally TR or town lead player.

[Tchill13]

I honestly, truly feel like one of ddl and lalendra is scum due to how much they were being thrown around.

Which one is the question.

[Tchill13]

TChill is scum.

And one of DDL/Lalendra is a buddy. Probably DDL.

Doesn't make sense to go after probably scum when you know someone is scum.

[Tchill13]

VOTE: drdolittle

Let's see where this goes.

[Tchill13]

To see where it goes.

Plus I think I said there's one scum in lalendra,DDL and kop several times.

[Tchill13]

Any reason for thinking DDL is scum?

Over half the game is fos'ing him and lalendra.

One is probably town one is probably scum due to that.

If like 80 percent say one thing usually it's true.

[Tchill13]

Irrelephant was kinda obv town imo though. Not just top poster.

[Tchill13]

Who was sussing him day 1?

[Tchill13]

Don't go trying to figure out how talented scum is here. Doesn't matter.

Killing ambitious town is always a good thing.

[Tchill13]

Scum really had 5 options at most considering how many ppl aren't playing.

Assuming some scum is actually playing you're looking at 3 to 4 active townies.

Me and irrelephant are the most active townies from Scums pov. Obviously I'm much easier to lynch than irrelephant if you look solely at day 1.

I can almost guarantee you there's at least one scum in Bbt/alchemist and lalendra/DDL

[Tchill13]

There's really no reason to throw shade at your scum partner this early due to the game state. Sajj won't be an upgrade in activity from lalendra.

So I can see active scum distancing from a lurker slot but not from an active slot atm.

If DDL flips town I'm pushing Bbt and lalendra. Of course if we could I'd rather lynch one of those 2 before ddl but I doubt we can which is why I'm voting ddl

[Tchill13]

BBT's stance is odd from a town pov. He's fos'd me the whole game and opened up on ddl. Once I voted ddl he questions it so I can't easily bus with no reason from his pov. My issue is he's more confident in his SR of me than ddl. Instead of voting me he fos's other slots.

Scum won't be able to easily lynch me. Bbt knows this. I hardly ever get mislynched as town. If it wasn't for a rush while I was gone the last game Bbt was scum against me he knows I wouldn't have been lynched. So from my pov it'll be easier for him to sus rather than push me.

[Tchill13]

if we can lynch BBT instead of DDL i'd appreciate it.

If I HAVE to lynch DDL to move on then so be it, but if DDL were to actually flip scum that'd be great too.

[Tchill13]

I wouldn't vote DDL if i had concrete reason to TR him and he hadn't been thrown around so much as scum.

[Tchill13]

BBT's stance is odd from a town pov. He's fos'd me the whole game and opened up on ddl. Once I voted ddl he questions it so I can't easily bus with no reason from his pov. My issue is he's more confident in his SR of me than ddl. Instead of voting me he fos's other slots.

Scum won't be able to easily lynch me. Bbt knows this. I hardly ever get mislynched as town. If it wasn't for a rush while I was gone the last game Bbt was scum against me he knows I wouldn't have been lynched. So from my pov it'll be easier for him to sus rather than push me.

This entire post is completely moot when you consider DDL was my first scum read in this game.

No its not. You said I'm scum you said ddl is probably scum. Big difference.

[Tchill13]

TChill is scum.

And one of DDL/Lalendra is a buddy. Probably DDL.

[Tchill13]

(expired on 2018-08-20 18:37:00)

If you have nothing by the end of this countdown I'm permavoting you.

This is lalendras slot. Sajj won't be a pick up from activity. Fine with lynching it.

[Tchill13]

Also more talk about the timer than the game.

[Tchill13]

VOTE: scioness sajj

[Tchill13]

You're not dead weight. Your slot has been prob scum to a majority of the game.

[Tchill13]

Then it's NAI and you shouldn't try to make anything out of it.

Thoughts on the game not the timer please.

[Tchill13]

No there is if you give thoughts on the game. So far you've not added any in game conversation to lalendras slot.

[Tchill13]

TChill is scum.

And one of DDL/Lalendra is a buddy. Probably DDL.

Well please make that more obvious next time Bbt. I didn't do that on purpose, even if I find that to be a shady excuse

[Tchill13]

TChill is scum.

And one of DDL/Lalendra is a buddy. Probably DDL.

From my pov this is you distancing from a scum partner and blaming me once that Scum partner flips.

You've pushed DDL all game.

You're gonna be insta lynched when sajj flips scum.

[Tchill13]

i think if we lynch all lurkers we hit 1 if not 2 scum. I'd guess 2.

[Tchill13]

ML DDL, Lynch LALendra, ML me.. 3 other town nk'd. so thats 5 townies BBT would have taken out right there.

[Tchill13]

if there's no reason to SR them and theres no reason to TR them... You can't lock town them.

[Tchill13]

VOTE: BlueBloodedToffee

idc which is lynched first, they're connected. and if yall wont lynch the low content im fine with lynching the player that has some content of the two.

[Tchill13]

If DDL is scum without BBT and Lalendra then thats a perfect stance to take. Not SR'ing lalendra, making sure she never flips so it doesn't incriminate you if she's town.

[Tchill13]

good job town.