Undertale Mafia (Endgame):

[RadiantCowbells]

Mercy is currently at 7 .[/color] Undertale Mafia Votecount 1.10: Skygazer (4): Wiisp, Brown Eyes, Shiidaji, Sofa King Hot Lightning (2): Dannflor, nomnomnom Game of Throws (1): Skygazer Sofa King (1): Hot Lightning Team RWBY (1): Game of Throws Dannflor (1): Vedith Vedith (1): Papyrus Pink Ball (1): Team RWBY Wiisp (0): Shining Dreamers (0): Reasonably Clever (0): Shiidaji (0): Something_Smart (0): NeenieKit (0): nomnomnom (0): Brown Eyes (0): Papyrus (0): Not Voting: Shining Dreamers, Reasonably Clever, Pink Ball, Something_Smart, NeenieKit With 17 alive it's 9 to lynch. The day ends (expired on 2019-04-21 00:00:00).

[Dannflor]

VOTE: GoT

yay I have a lotta town reads

Is this a random vote? Multiple people are jumping on GoT on the first 2 pages, but I don't understand why. They had 1 post that was a gif.

-m

I was no longer happy with my vote on Wiisp and wanted to pressure GoT/help build a wagon.

[Hot Lightning]

What makes you say that?

simplistic entrances tend to come from town

Yeah, this is an over-generalization. I'm not a fan of Wiisp as of pages 1-3.

-m

[Dannflor]

I second guess myself on Vedith a lot.

I do this too. I've seen enough variance in both Vedith's town and scum games that I'm not confident in saying anything he's said so far is AI for him. I'm waiting for him to take some real stances on things before fully assessing my read on him.

[Hot Lightning]

I am not understanding where you got that she has TMI

its almost like opinions are subjective, how fascinating, I don't feel like instantiating that read,

This post is just... bad. He's not putting you down for your opinion; clearly, him and others (myself) don't understand it. You not feeling like instantiating it is problematic because I'd like to know other than "tone" what is so bad about Sky's post? Sky could be still be scum, but regardless I think you're trying too hard to read into the post.

-m

[Hot Lightning]

Wiisp is town even though I don't agree that opening with a gif means town GoT

-WS

Why is Wiisp town here?

-m

[Hot Lightning]

wiisp can be town even if i havent agreed with anything theyve said so far

:l

You too? Why?

-m

[Wiisp]

Him claiming to be miller, doesnt mean he is, or isnt, and yes the optimal player for a miller claim is to claim day 1... likewise, if a miller is in a game, then some version of a cop is 99% of the time in the game, since the point of a miller is lost if not

how many god damn hydras are in this game...

[Hot Lightning]

This is a really bad way to discredit a townread. Not because of Whips reasoning because sure, townreading a gif opening is NAI. But no one in that hydra has even close to enough games with me to make a read like that. Along with the fact that it's a blatantly false statement

It still wasn't a meta argument, I don't think in general it's a good idea to give someone a townread for posting a gif as an opening when that is not a particularly AI behavior.

Arguing that "Maria often opens with gifs as scum" is a "blantantly false statement" is a pretty "blatantly false statement" -- because she does.

VOTE: Game of Throws

-WS

We're not mindmelding at all right now, but I feel like this deserves a slight townread.

-m

[Wiisp]

This is a really bad way to discredit a townread. Not because of Whips reasoning because sure, townreading a gif opening is NAI. But no one in that hydra has even close to enough games with me to make a read like that. Along with the fact that it's a blatantly false statement

It still wasn't a meta argument, I don't think in general it's a good idea to give someone a townread for posting a gif as an opening when that is not a particularly AI behavior.

Arguing that "Maria often opens with gifs as scum" is a "blantantly false statement" is a pretty "blatantly false statement" -- because she does.

VOTE: Game of Throws

-WS

We're not mindmelding at all right now, but I feel like this deserves a slight townread.

-m

why?

[Team RWBY]

Hi! I'm just checking in!

VOTE: Pink Ball

-Blake

Why?

I want pink ball to notice me

-Blake

[RadiantCowbells]

Rosterfoster replaces Sofa King.

[Team RWBY]

Him claiming to be miller, doesnt mean he is, or isnt, and yes the optimal player for a miller claim is to claim day 1... likewise, if a miller is in a game, then some version of a cop is 99% of the time in the game, since the point of a miller is lost if not

how many god damn hydras are in this game...

Under the Sea had many millers and no cop (instead a town rolecop), and Anime U-Pick, unless I'm mistaken, only had one cop and it was also a rolecop.

I assume there is some sort of investigative in the game but I'm not certain there is a pure alignment cop.

-WS

[Vedith]

Rosterfoster replaces Sofa King.

They had a falling out :<

[Wiisp]

Him claiming to be miller, doesnt mean he is, or isnt, and yes the optimal player for a miller claim is to claim day 1... likewise, if a miller is in a game, then some version of a cop is 99% of the time in the game, since the point of a miller is lost if not

how many god damn hydras are in this game...

Under the Sea had many millers and no cop (instead a town rolecop), and Anime U-Pick, unless I'm mistaken, only had one cop and it was also a rolecop.

I assume there is some sort of investigative in the game but I'm not certain there is a pure alignment cop.

-WS

I guess a miller could be in the game just for wifom... ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

[Reasonably Clever]

Welcome to the world of Nancy posting!

In Story Revisited he had a 1-shot parity cop gated behind a role whose only job was to enable the parity cop.

So I wouldn't say he goes really heavy on early cop actions as a rule, but we have no way of knowing the overall power level of the game this time.

In other news, what did you think of 12, Cerb?

-Weiss

The conclusion of "early miller claim is likely town" is reasonable enough? I don't agree with it in any role madness/theme type game. but the basic theory is sound. The mechanical observation that a miller claim being true is more likely than not is a fairly obvious one to make. I appreciate that they were the first person to actually respond to what was probably the most significant thing stated that far, but the actual content was underwhelming.

I...don't think I've played with skygazer enough to say if they're someone who tends to state the obvious. Anyone who knows her should weigh in on that.

@miller claim, whoever you were: elaborate on your millerness, is it just cop checks, do you get tracked to the kill, if there's some other thing to check to be determined effectively guilty(say a gunsmith type role) do you show as guilty to that too, etc.

-Cerb

Pedit:

"...miller claim being true is more likely than not if a cop exists..."

-Cerb

Disagree. How would a Miller know there's a cop before claiming? Obviously, optimal play for a Miller is to claim straight away. They'd have no knowledge of cops at that time.

-m

Mechanically speaking, if we were to come to mass claim day, and zero cops claim, it's likely that any "cop only" miller claims are untrue. Therefore, if a cop DOES exist, it makes it *more* likely that said miller claim is true.

And speaking of optimal plays, now is the time to remind everyone that if you have ANY NU thst could fuck over the town, it's better to claim it now and not risk investigative targeting ascetics, or docs target PGOs, etc, than to try to leverage said ability into something that will hurt scum, because there are approximately 3x as many town who could be hurt by you than there are scum.

Ank, engage with me. Your other heads are fine, but you're the one I expect to solve the game if you're town. What are your thoughts on, well, everything?

-Cerb

[Team RWBY]

I'm not all that great at direct scumhunting unless I already have a basis of what I'm looking for or already know the person I'm trying to read well enough to be able to judge their play relative to what I know about them

the majority of what's here so far is mostly null on that front and there isn't enough activity from enough slots to warrant any attempts at sorting people indirectly and/or relative to each other

so I'm just shitposting atm because why not

-Blake

[RadiantCowbells]

[Shining Dreamers]

Role PM received and we are all ready to go!

[Team RWBY]

Mechanically speaking, if we were to come to mass claim day, and zero cops claim, it's likely that any "cop only" miller claims are untrue. Therefore, if a cop DOES exist, it makes it *more* likely that said miller claim is true.

Didn't one of FakeGod's games have like 5 millers but no cops but a bunch of desperados that failed on millers? Like, if there were a bunch of millers, I would expect *some* sort of mechanical interaction, cop or not. But so far I see no reason to think our role isn't just wifom negative utility. I don't see our role as making alignment cops more plausible frankly. One mercy-conditional miller in a game this large isn't enough interaction to make a cop a lot more certain. I'm thinking of Children of Hurin here where town had a Seer that learned there was a Godfather, in a game with no alignment cop (which was gamewinning for the scum godfather that happened to fakeclaim cop). That sort of "well if the game has this then it needs to have this" sort of logic is a great way to lose games.

-WS

[Team RWBY]

Role PM received and we are all ready to go!

I'm still very slightly confused why it was easier to make a post complaining about not getting a PM on your main than it was to just log into the hydra but whatever floats your boat

-WS

[Shining Dreamers]

Hi my name is Wisp, I am a very cocky player, tell me a little about yourselves?

Prankster. Jokester. Generally a bit annoying. Pathological half-truth teller. (For instance, 'a bit' is an understatement. )

[Team RWBY]

Your other heads are fine, but you're the one I expect to solve the game if you're town

and here I thought we'd come so far together Cerb

-WS

[Shining Dreamers]

I’d like 16 players to write an essay about why I’m the greatest. Please & thank you.

Is there a paragraph limit in place?

[Shining Dreamers]

RWBY's miller claim more likely town than not, esp if it can be confirmed with a cop

Skygazer thinking this in an RC setup's more likely scum than not.