Mini Normal 2085: Colors (Game Over)

[Persivul]

VOTE: Tchill

History

[Persivul]

Hi everybody. I’m excited to play with some of you again. I promise l’ll behave this game.

What did you do last game? Inquiring minds want to know.

[Persivul]

Not last game. Every game.

Death tunnel. Rude, cursing, basically being an asshole.

I think I even fake claimed as a VT.

I pissed of tchill I know that. Since returning I’m not doing so well. I’m at the beach so now I’m in relax mode. Plus pot is legal where I live so I may be high a lot

Just checked your ISO in Newbie 1931. It was underwhelming as far as assholishness goes.

[Persivul]

Rob, vote Rhash too!

Why didn't you ask me?

[Persivul]

Is this post supposed to be serious?

Surely it isn't serious.

[Persivul]

Is this post supposed to be serious?

Surely it isn't serious.

He said it was.

I tossed a softball and you totally whiffed.

[Persivul]

Spoiler:

oh dear

do my eyes deceive me or

do i see a self voter

Is this post supposed to be serious?

yes

ive always wondered why people self vote

ahem this is where you come in

Look up RVS on the wiki.

Self-voting is not RVS. RVS is not "randomly vote anyone"; it's "come up with a random reason to vote someone besides yourself."

This post is strangely serious. I thought it was obvious he was joking around.

[Persivul]

VOTE: Ircher

[Persivul]

And what is thy point such that thou shalt pointeth this out?

It's awkward and feels forced, like you feel obligated to participate but aren't sure how to.

[Persivul]

And yet
If we arteth for realsies
Is what I've doneth indicative
Of scummy motivations
Or art thou too quicketh
To jumpeth the gunneth?

What the fucketh
Doest thou expecteth
On page the third?

[Persivul]

The wiki page doesn't say either way, but I doubt they're considered normal.

[Persivul]

I can post in verse too:

Roses are red
Violets are blue
Sugar is sweet
Fuck you Ircher

It's admittedly a work in progress

[Persivul]

Is this post supposed to be serious?

Surely it isn't serious.

Don’t call him Shirley

Thank you!

[Persivul]

So all jokes aside, why are y'all voting me. Have I done anything wrong? Perhaps, perhaps indeed. But focus not on the wrong for that is a slippery slope to take. Scum will use this as an excuse to score a free "town" mistake.

If you had started out joking around in verse, I would think:
- unlikely for scum to call attention like that, BUT a very confident scum who likes gambits would - check his meta
- possibly town purposely acting strange to see who jumps on it - watch to see if he actually uses people's reactions to sort them
- or just NAI goofing around - probably won't last

But you didn't start out that way. You started out normally. It was only when you were pressured by rhaz and me on page 3 that you started that shtick. That could be scum trying to use humor to defuse early pressure, or it could be NAI goofing around. I really don't see a town purpose for the switch in persona at that point.

[Persivul]

Too much fluff.

I don't think ircher suicides like this.

There's no suicide. The early D1 wagons rarely end up being the lynch, and he might know that.

But I think rhazh might be cognitive dissonancing

WTF does that mean?

[Persivul]

fast wagons

Point of this comment was?

[Persivul]

why are people sheeping me

Got very quiet all of a sudden

I don’t have bad feels about anyone on this wagon in particular but I think the gamestate overall is a little jumpy.

UNVOTE: oka

I usually don't point out towniness on D1 but these two posts stood out to me as town for some reason.

[Persivul]

Ah, but are you confirmable?

If the answer is no, please don't be useless like you were in the micro.

That's how we caught scum!you.

How long did it take to catch him?

[Persivul]

i don't purposely play to have a tell that confirms me as town

It's not about specific tells. You're not doing anything to sort.

[Persivul]

Chaos in a bottle is under order until it gets release tho

Mafiascum getting philosophisophical...I like it.

[Persivul]

fast wagons

Point of this comment was?

I thought that was pretty self-explanatory.

OK. The self-evident explanation to me was that you thought you should post, didn't know what to say, so made a pointless NSS observation.

[Persivul]

I see you’re new. An l-1 wagon in rvs still isn’t serious. You’ll learn as you play more.

I don't see any newbies in her history. More likely an alt.

[Persivul]

not an alt

Why did you skip newbies?

[Persivul]

nm already answered

[Persivul]

So all jokes aside, why are y'all voting me. Have I done anything wrong? Perhaps, perhaps indeed. But focus not on the wrong for that is a slippery slope to take. Scum will use this as an excuse to score a free "town" mistake.

If you had started out joking around in verse, I would think:
- unlikely for scum to call attention like that, BUT a very confident scum who likes gambits would - check his meta
- possibly town purposely acting strange to see who jumps on it - watch to see if he actually uses people's reactions to sort them
- or just NAI goofing around - probably won't last

But you didn't start out that way. You started out normally. It was only when you were pressured by rhaz and me on page 3 that you started that shtick. That could be scum trying to use humor to defuse early pressure, or it could be NAI goofing around. I really don't see a town purpose for the switch in persona at that point.

VOTE: Persivul
Are you seriously going to paint it that way?

Yes. It was accurate at that point. You look much better since.

[Persivul]

ill do tchill next:

three posts but

he's firmly null because although i dont like him voting me, it makes sense if my previous experience with him still holds true even if he doesnt want to talk about it. he hates d1 and wants to move past it as fast as possible and accelerating the game through wagons is one way of doing it.

I scummed with Tchill not too long ago. I thought he was awkward as hell the first day or so. By the end of the game he was smooth as silk. His scum game improves as the game progresses.

[Persivul]

{pisskop, Tchill13}

{Persivul, Chemist1422}

{Robbnva}

{tris}

{Ircher, RhazhBash}

{nomnomnom}

{u r a person 2, painindarse}

{OkaPoka}

Obligatory

why is the mod in the list

response.

[Persivul]

Yeah.

@Penguin tris is the mod????

LMAO

[Persivul]

OkaPoka voters: Ircher, RhazhBash Tchill13 Robbnva penguinpower

i think these are correct?

Yep, and aside from Tchill, that's a pretty good wagon.

[Persivul]

the pp i know never gives reads

But he does give Rainbow Reads. I've seen it IIRC.

[Persivul]

Also, if you read Lady Lambdadelta's post about playing scum, one thing that was suggested was being unpredictable so people can't really establish a baseline on you.

I hate that strategy. It's sacrificing town games in order to improve scum win rate.

[Persivul]

pp without you expressing your reasoning it looks like you slapped together a bunch of names and colored them

Yeah, that's what Rainbow Reads are.

[Persivul]

which begs the question of why are you being townread for your readlist in which only two are of any significance whatsoever?

Is he being town read for his reads list?

IMO he's being town read more for actively advancing the game and (eventually) reacting well to pressure.

[Persivul]

very INTERESTING that you saw long post and jumped to "TOWN TELL" when this post says pretty much nothing at all? all nullish reads, v wishy washy on persivul read, chemist and oka reads are v unsubstantive

In context I read that as

attempting

to town tell, i.e. pressuring rather than giving a town read.

[Persivul]

so ircher

are you doing these type of readslist every game or is this you town telling

Looking back at it now, not sure which interpretation is correct.

Oka, were you giving a town read to ircher in this post?

[Persivul]

Slots comes into the game with drive-by posts trying to seed doubt on a few people and make them look bad and joins a wagon "because it's the biggest one"
That's honestly a scummy approach to the game.

Also note that he comes in late, then criticizes people for vote reasoning in the first few pages, when reasoning is necessarily stretched due to lack of content.

[Persivul]

so im not allowed to not like a vote because it came early? i dont think i have to elaborate on why this is a horrible take.

Do you agree that it's more difficult to make a meaningful vote in the early pages of the game when there's little content to go on?

Do you agree that votes are still useful to town in the early pages of the game in order to generate content?

[Persivul]

I'm gonna say yes even though I ignored the thread for a day and forgot a lot of my thoughts.

When my thoughts are genuine - i.e. a result of town thinking/analysis - I tend to remember them even after a day away.

It's only when I'm scum and making up reads that I need to go back to remember what I previously said.

[Persivul]

VOTE: Niko

I'm assuming that's for the hammer. In my experience that hammer is usually town. You can argue that it's bad town, but it's probably not scum.

[Persivul]

What are informed usually informed of?

I had it once and was informed of the number of scum (4 in a mini). I immediately put it out. He should have told us when he claimed.

[Persivul]

And I disagree Penguin.

No point in waiting the entire day to push people when you feel confident. Granted, we were wrong in this case, but at least we kept the game state moving. Long days brew town apathy, which causes town losses.

You don't have to wait the entire phase, but you can at least go 5 or 6 days, no? I'm not ticked about it but let's not justify it and repeat it.

[Persivul]

D1 is one of the most useful to refer back to when trying to make associations after information has flipped and that was limited. For you to think that's a good thing is asinine.

Doesn't mean it's useless. Do you think a lynch this fast is more or less likely to be scum driven than the usual EOD lynch?

[Persivul]

You can check his iso, all it has is a naked Rhaz vote. That's why. Nothing else he talked about was about Rhazh or discussing various topics about him. Nothing.

That's not true. They interacted in 382. Although that post seems like Omo setting himself up to vote whomever he likes regardless of past pressure.

[Persivul]

otoh its titus, and she has been known to do this as town.
otoh its titus, and this is exactly what scum titus does as an oldschool player.

Claiming titus doesn't mean it's titus. We'll see.

[Persivul]

Oh, and if i had to guess, the protective protected chemist, what means that he is prob town.

I don't think there was another consensus town read besides him, and i'm skeptical of believing that it was just a coincidence.

He barely posted and was null to me. How was Chemist consensus town?

[Persivul]

i don't want to be lynchbaity anymore

This feels off. You weren't lynchbaity before. The main argument against you was the quickhammer, and you immediately tried to defuse that. So why are you trying to portray yourself as lynchbaity?

[Persivul]

mastina didn't design it. schadd did.

I played a schadd/mastina game earlier this year and IIRC it was pretty town-sided. My guess is there's either two decently powered scum, or three weak ones and plenty of town power.

[Persivul]

When someone uses three absolutes about a point, and they're wrong, it pings me. Why the misrep?

[Persivul]

Why the misrep?

That referred to nom, not ircher.

[Persivul]

VOTE: omo

[Persivul]

Not sure what to make of Omo's change in attitude.

[Persivul]

awww crap persi is here. i dont havea read on them?

What do you think of omo? Got pressured and got really angry. I joined the wagon and he took a break and came back all civil. I've only skimmed the recent pages but I think he stil hasn't given reasons for his vote, which is what the pressure was mostly about.

[Persivul]

VOTE: Niko

[Persivul]

I don't have time to read all this rn. Does Robb have a result on Niko or not?

[Persivul]

mod, VLA through the weekend

[Persivul]

Not. I never hinted cop.

You hinted something. If that's off the table, Niko looks town. I don't see scum making that hammer.
UNVOTE:

[Persivul]

And with flavor here I’m definitely going to post less.

Why, some history there?

[Persivul]

Yes since you haven’t read yet, I hinted doc who saved you. Nikko was doc searching which is why I want him lynched.

OK I'll review that when I get back.

[Persivul]

Not. I never hinted cop.

You hinted something. If that's off the table, Niko looks town. I don't see scum making that hammer.
UNVOTE:

@mod, looks like you missed this unvote

Looks like Flavor missed it too. Sheeping a mod error...

Fixed.

OTOH, I know we're not supposed to read into replacements, but there wasn't anything nasty happening with niko. Could be scum caught for the wrong reasons.

[Persivul]

1) Who is a person of interest I should focus on?

Ircher. I town read him but several people scum read him.

[Persivul]

RhazhBash (7): OkaPoka 34, PenguinPower 288, nomnomnom 402, Omochao 409, Robbnva 514, Ircher 543, Niko 583 LYNCH!

Wagonomics experts...what can we learn from this?

I typically focus on slots 3 - 6 of a 7-person D1 wagon. Out of those:
Robb - town
Ircher - I have as town but I'm concerned due to the number of scum reads on him
nomnom - hasn't pinged me, but looking at the ISO I see an awful lot of talk, less real content
Omo - already a scum lean for me

[Persivul]

I replaced in in order to not play.

WTF I'll hammer this if nomnom doesn't. Anyone opposed speak now...

[Persivul]

I replaced in 2 days ago.....

And made 7 posts. What's your point?

[Persivul]

Are you trying to anger me here?

If that's to me - no...but you've angered me. Replacements coming in and not playing is the thing lately. But when I'm interested in really playing a game rn, I can't, because the replacements have all been snagged. I'm getting tired of it.

[Persivul]

IF YOU HAMMER AND FIRE FLIPS TOWN, THAT'S A SCUM CLAIM.

FUCK YOU. YOU DON'T KNOW ME VERY WELL IF YOU THINK I RESPOND WELL TO COMMANDS.

[Persivul]

Go ahead.

UNVOTE:

What changed?

[Persivul]

He said he was going to give reads. I'd like for him to.

No, he specifically said he's

not

going to give reads out of spite for being run up. He said he has written notes. Assuming they're typed, he could copy, paste and edit in a few minutes. He's apparently well enough to come in and pull some AtE when in danger.

[Persivul]

The lack of conviction on this wagon is very telling, just saying that much.

Yeah but what exactly does it tell? That's what I'm struggling with.

[Persivul]

Fire Assasin (5): Robbnva 676, Flavor Leaf 1371, Ircher 1518, PenguinPower 1551, pisskop 1552 (L-1)

Before fire pulled the AtE I wasn't into this lynch because I think the Niko hammer is usually town. But, the wagon itself was pretty good. I had Robb and pisskop as town, Ircher and PP as town leans, Flavor as null since his slot hasn't done a damn thing.

[Persivul]

The lack of conviction on this wagon is very telling, just saying that much.

What lack of conviction?

Seriously dude?

[Persivul]

Unvoting because someone MAY provide reads LATER is a lack of conviction. And that's OK in and of itself. But when you then refuse to own it, and now say you think he'll flip scum, I personally get a bad feeling.

[Persivul]

Unvoting because someone MAY provide reads LATER is a lack of conviction. And that's OK in and of itself. But when you then refuse to own it, and now say you think he'll flip scum, I personally get a bad feeling.

This implies I believe there is an extremely high chance (>95%) that Fire flips scum. That has never been the case.

I have no idea where you're getting 95% from, but you said "I don't think Fire is going to flip town."

[Persivul]

bruh when was the last time you actually saw scum lamist with hammer mechanics

Yeah as I think on it more that's where I'm going, for the first one off at least. Second one could be lamist. I need to check the order.

[Persivul]

i dont understand this sentence

Between Ircher and PP, the first unvote probably isn't a scum lamist move. The second one - when the wagon's already been derailed - could be a lamist move.

[Persivul]

1564 - Fire pulls the AtE
1565 - I give intent
1566 - PP says "Go ahead."
1570 - Ircher unvotes
1573 - nomnom votes, puts it back to L-1
1580/1581 - Ircher demands 24 hours for Fire
1583 - PP unvotes

So, no, that theory doesn't tell us anything because nomnom voted in between them. Both were defusing an L-1 wagon with intent.

[Persivul]

Except that nom took it back to L-1 after Ircher unvoted...

Yeah, noted.

[Persivul]

Omochao - High chance of scum.

Why has this wagon never made it? Open question, not just to you.

[Persivul]

ill take a read from robb and persivul as well on flavor

I liked him at first. He did more than I remembered. But then he sheeped an obsolete vote of mine (and someone else, forget who) and disappeared. Could be a

make a good first impression then cruise

scum strategy.

[Persivul]

VOTE: Omo

[Persivul]

why do you leave out that you wanted fire caught up in 48 hours and then got mad when he didn't want to?

Because I know my own alignment and so I'm not analyzing myself, obviously.

also the weird "I don't take commands" bullshit when you didn't even hammer? wtf was that supposed to mean?

It means I prefer when someone tries to work with me rather than barking commands like they're conftown or something.

[Persivul]

VOTE: Fire

[Persivul]

@mod: VLA for two days, my wife is in the hospital. Thanks.

[Persivul]

So that was like 30 pages of setup spec that just makes reads harder.

This designer/reviewer team makes town sided setups. The claimed town power is not excessive for them, especially if this started 9:3. Also there hasn't been a nk yet, so nomnom's position that there's too many protective doesn't make sense. I hate her push on prs and will vote her later. I suck at tags on the phone.

I can confirm that flavor tends to play hard as scum. But eventually he's going to use that meta to play light as scum. I don't see that here though.

Can we stop all the useless spec and actually scum hunt?

[Persivul]

Ircher seems to be town - bad selfish town, but town.

[Persivul]

I consider it useless because as scum I've gone from l-1 on d1 to cruising to victory just by making a plausible fake claim.

I'm vt.

[Persivul]

Not quite Persivul. Claim please.

Then we'll stop assuming your claim isn't unusual.

You're willing to lynch a cop in order to clear yourself. I believe that you believe he's a cop, so yeah, that makes you bad selfish town.

[Persivul]

Why is there a wagon on the cop claim?

[Persivul]

That reminds me...
VOTE: nomnom

[Persivul]

Yep. In my experience setup spec in a closed is usually bad for town.

OTOH, as I think more about it, the spec is usually bad for town, but it's usually DONE by town, so need to reevaluate my vote on yo.

[Persivul]

How is it bad to realize that Cop JK Doc 1-shot Babysitter is not possible especially with the events that unfolded so far?

It's bad because it's completely possible, but could lead to a PR lynch. Whether or not you or I feel that the above is overpowered doesn't matter. The fact is that games like that are indeed being played on this site.

[Persivul]

I refuse to believe this goes through NRG. Plain and simple.

Well, you're scum then. You can't have an absolute opinion of balance without knowing the scum roles. Saying that scum would surely have a strongman or RB shot(s), and surely would have used such by now, is simplistic.

[Persivul]

Here we go again.

No, I'm done. I'm not going through another 30 pages of that shit.

[Persivul]

pisskop (4): Ircher 2186, Sakura Hana 2189, OkaPoka 2195, nomnomnom 2227

Not Voting:pisskop, Flavor Leaf, Persivul, Omochao, PenguinPower, Chemist1422 1842

Apparently not...

[Persivul]

Persi starts striking me as a possible scum avoiding the conversation.

Which conversation is that?

Oh yeah, the

which claimed PR do we lynch today?

conversation.

Yes, I'm avoiding that one.

[Persivul]

Well the people that supposedly want to sort outside of the claims are not doing any sorting so.
I think that Persi being scum is increasingly more likely with this dissonant attitude.

You claim I'm scum because you're scum and I'm pushing you.

If you were really concerned about the people who aren't sorting, you wouldn't name me - you'd name one of the five people who don't have a vote up.

[Persivul]

OK. You're scum for pushing to lynch in the PRs.

[Persivul]

You want to sort outside the PRs and avoid a discussion about the PRs entirely but you actually have not discussed about anything outside of that. This is dissonant behavior.

Speaking of dissonance - you claimed a PR, I'm voting you...yet you say I'm sorting outside the PRs.

[Persivul]

How in the world does your role fit into the setup?

[Persivul]

Since you're not interested about judging on mechanical play can I get your thoughts on the 3 PR slots then?

I'm interested in mechanical factors. I just don't agree with your analysis. You're like

this is impossible, let's throw a dart and lynch a PR

.

I see no reason for scum!pisskop to fakeclaim cop and clear Ircher. What do you think his motivation would be to do that?

[Persivul]

What adv to we get from ending day

If you're scum you probably get a dead cop as the VC stands now.

[Persivul]

PK does a lot of weird stuff in general and I thought he was lolclaiming and not actually serious in the first place.

That would be more likely town than scum, don't you think?

Could be to try and attract a nightkill given the doc in the open,

That's a town motivation.

could be scum trying to get Sakura to protect them during the night to be able to nightkill.

OK, I suppose that's at least a little bit possible.

It could be a lot of things. In the back of my mind there's still a possibility he's town lolclaiming lmao

And this is where you set up a reason to change your vote now that the wagon's getting some pushback.

[Persivul]

nomnom spends many pages pushing a lynch in the PRs.

I say that the PRs are plausible and she's sus. She scum reads me for it.

2454 FL says that he thinks the PRs are town

2456 Now nomnom accepts town PRs with zero pushback

Happy with my vote where it is.

[Persivul]

It's almost like my read has evolved!

No, it's nothing like your read has involved. Your read flipped 180 degrees. That's not normal town progression.

[Persivul]

Hypo - I flip town. Who’s scum?

Wow I hate that defense. Always pings me, maybe because I used it before I got lynched in my first scum game here.

[Persivul]

Like - this is scum!FL beyond a doubt to me and I want to see if he can do anything redeeming.

Beyond a doubt? I played scum with him once and he was much more active/aggressive.

[Persivul]

What happened to "that's funny nom PP was also my highest scumread!"

It’s almost like his reads evolved.

[Persivul]

my scum game changes quite often,

So your appeals to your own meta are worthless?

[Persivul]

I don’t really have any social allies this game.

When I’m scum, I have social allies for days, generally in a T/S pairing.

But doesn't your scum game change frequently?

That's a dig, not shade. Pretty sure this is town FL - throwing out multiple scum teams on a Saturday night, afterward if any one of them was close he'll pat himself on the back for his sick reads.

[Persivul]

Persivul/Pisskop are likely both on me,

Oops!

[Persivul]

Methinks my zeal towards Persivul is cold, and that I love him not as I was won’t.

Uh...yeah...right.

[Persivul]

Damn, i just got hard pocketed

Bwaaahahahaha

[Persivul]

3.5 days to go, 3 weak wagons.

pisskop:
- kudos to oka for finding the schadd link about not using cops anymore
- more importantly, just before oka posted that link, piss was playing the

I don't really care about this game

bit. Just after the link, piss started taking the game much more seriously. Looks like caught scum who feels a need to step up his game
- I liked his initial claim. I didn't like the piecemeal nature of it though, i.e. later adding the N2 modifier. If I'm N2 cop, I'm coming out and giving my full role and result at the beginning of D3, or keeping it quiet in order to make some pushes to look for associatives. Either way, once I claim cop, I'm including the modifier. I don't see town reason not too. The addition of the modifier could have been scum thinking

crap, I need an excuse not to create more conftowns

- aside from his claim, his play is overall null to me, and an old rule of thumb is that if by D3 you have a hard null on a slot, they're scum.
BUT, there are some serious considerations in the other direction
- I need to go back and check the gamestate, but I don't recall piss being under pressure when he made the claim, so what's his scum motivation for doing so? Assuming piss/ircher aren't S/S making a bold gambit, an inno result creates a conftown, and as noted that sucks for scum. The only scum motivation I see is if he didn't want to spend time on this game (which seems to be true), and thought the claim would let him coast the rest of the game. But that's not a real strong motivation for someone not under pressure.
- One more point below

nomnom
- TBH I have difficulty spotting very high post count scum. But in this case, I think the push on mechanics and lynching in the PRs, plus the sudden reversal from that position, is very likely to be scum
- her wagon stalled at 3. This seems to me like scum think they're in a good position and don't want to bus
- piss and ircher are on the wagon with me. I find it highly unlikely that scum!piss gave a false inno on scum!ircher, and they're both on the same wagon back to back. This makes it highly likely that ircher is town, and is a plus to the town!piss case.

penguin
- I always have difficulty reading PP on content. See the point above about hard nulls on D3.
- He was on the razh mislynch D1. He's not on the final Fire Assassin mislynch D2, but that's becuase he unvoted to avoid a lolhammer, and I hammered before he got the chance.
- For me he would be a compromise lynch relative to nomnom. In general compromise lynches on D3 are bad for town, but: we have some leeway due to the lack of NKs, and I know I wouldn't want to be in lylo with him.

[Persivul]

You're not helping yourself by having a vanity vote on FL at this point in the phase.

[Persivul]

VOTE: Penguin

[Persivul]

why is FL a vanity vote still? every time I see him post he's denying reality, talking about his scum game, or like making up words?

So why aren't you voting him?

[Persivul]

I love how we cant even get someone to L-1 with a lil over 3 days until deadline.

I think the nom and penguin wagons in the VC were both town. Scum are in the other wagons/nonvoters and were just waiting for one of them to appear to be inevitable. I switched to even up the wagons and force people to make a choice.

[Persivul]

VOTE: nom

only voting cause top wagon, would prefer any of {persi, chem, fl, oka}

No, prior to your vote nom and penguin were even. I specifically said I evened them up so people couldn't pull shit like this.

[Persivul]

By my count that's L-2. I'd go back but I'd prefer to be the hammer. If someone puts it to L-1 I'm giving 24 hours then hammering.

[Persivul]

I believe that's L-1.

I have Piss Irch Peng Saku, 4 votes, 6 to lynch.

[Persivul]

Ah, you are correct.

Yeah I got excited at the Sak vote and thought it was L-1, but Omo dropped off earlier.

[Persivul]

Penguin is clearly scum here. Just remember that for when I’m no longer around.

How sure are you on this?

[Persivul]

WTF 9 pages overnight?

[Persivul]

I’m getting night killed and nobody will listen to me.

STFU already about being NK'd. Doubtful your reads are so divine that scum go for you over a PR.

[Persivul]

pedit: the thread got locked so quickly then unlocked I didn't have time to post this lmao

I have no idea what you're talking about.

Was the thread locked or not?

[Persivul]

Okay, I'll tell you what:

Get one more person to vote penguin with the caveat we autolynch nomnomnom tomorrow on a scumflip, and I will hammer Penguin.
I'm not voting Penguin otherwise.

That's a pretty good plan, but I'm already on Penguin, so I can't help.

[Persivul]

VOTE: nomnom

Should have stuck to my read and done this yesterday.

[Persivul]

gonna LOSE it if scum actually do have no nightkill

Pretty sure scum have to have a nightkill in a normal.

[Persivul]

So I guess same plan as yesterday?

Sakura heals Omochao.
Omochao jails someone besides Sakura.

I missed this plan. If this was out there, how is Sakura still alive?

[Persivul]

Omochao said he didn't jail anyone. So Sakura presumably saved Omochao.

Point being that if it was known that Sakura was going to save Omo, scum wouldn't have targeted Omo.

[Persivul]

FL suggested i do 50/50 between omo, someone else and omo did 50/50 between me and someone else.
I wonder if he was trying to increase the chances of a shot on either of us succeeding. Or rather a shot on omo.

OK that makes sense.

[Persivul]

N1:
Sakura doctors Persivul.
Omochao jails Chemist.
??? kills ??? -> Failed!

N2:
Sakura doctors Chemist.
nomnomnom sends Chemist fruit.
Omochao jails Chemist.
pisskop investigates Ircher --> Innocent.
??? kills ??? -> Failed!

N3:
Sakura protects Omochao.
Omochao does nothing.
??? kills ??? -> Failed!

Possibly:
Chemist tries to kill N1 and is blocked.
Scum make wifom move and have chemist kill again N2, blocked.
Scum are sick of JK and target him N3, protected.

Question - can someone receive fruit when they're jailed?

[Persivul]

Yeah one way or the other chemist flip needs to happen

I think it’s dangerous to bring me into lylo, though. But I guess it is what it is at this point.

Didn't think it would take you long to back pedal.

[Persivul]

Oh, I don't know if it helps, but nomnomnom could not have performed the kill night 2. (If nomnomnom did perform the kill, then Chemist would be lying about receiving fruit.)

Now, does Town Informed 1-Shot Babysitter + Town Doctor + Town Jailkeeper + Town N2 Cop + 5 VTs versus Mafia Goon + Mafia Goon + Mafia N2 Fruit Vendor seem balanced?
Or does Town Informed 1-Shot Babysitter + Town Doctor + Town Jailkeeper + 6 VTs versus Mafia Goon + Mafia Informed (There are no cops in this setup.) + Mafia N2 Fruit Vendor seem more likely?

How did you even come up with Mafia Informed?

[Persivul]

That does rely on you believing that pisskop and I are not both scum.

You’re town regardless of PK’s alignment I’d say.

This. Highly unlikely that scum!piss puts a fake clear on a buddy.

[Persivul]

I already offered myself up too.

[Persivul]

I'm assuming a piss/ircher s/s gambit is highly unlikely. If they did that, they can have it. So, Ircher is town. That leaves the possibilities:

piss/FL
piss/oka
FL/oka

Top of the head ranking - scummiest first -

FL/oka - because piss didn't really need a fakeclaim
piss/FL - an unnecessary fakeclaim is something these two might pull off for laughs
piss/oka

FYI I'll be on VLA from Thu. afternoon until sometime Sun.

[Persivul]

N1:
Sakura doctors Persivul.
Omochao jails Chemist.
??? kills ??? -> Failed!

This is a primary key to the game.

Me being scum requires that scum targeted chemist for the N1 kill. Chemist barely plays - he poses no threat to scum, and he's an easy mislynch when the time comes, which was proven yesterday. That scenario makes absolutely no sense. It's obvious that there was no kill N1 because I was the target, but I was protected.

[Persivul]

I’ve been pushing Okapoka as scum since Day 2, Pk.

Day 2 ended 7.10. This is from 7.22:

I think PK is town, so is Sakura, so is Ircher.

I’m semi paranoid about Omochao lately.

Scum are hopping on where the cop and cop inno are.

Nomnom probably is town.

Okapoka probably town,

PenguinPower, Omochao, Chemist is what i’m Feeling like it is right now

Persivul/Oka could be there instead of Chemist, but

I think persi/Oka have both been genuine

.

[Persivul]

Essentially what Persivul was hinting at earlier?

We aren’t in a 1v1, we’re in a 2v2.

Except...that was my second choice, after you and oka.

[Persivul]

Again, Im restating that persi is the obvscum here, and any ambiguity is between flavor and oka

I would think in LYLO town!you would be voting your strongest read, rather than risking the game on ambiguity. Rather, you supposedly risk the game now while setting me up as tomorrow's mislynch.

[Persivul]

That's something I can go for.

VOTE: Flavor

[Persivul]

A very satisfying win! Since Flavor is so full of himself, it's especially fun to outplay him in the end. He made a rookie sales mistake, but that's no shock since he's an actor, not a salesman.

Really enjoyed playing with nom and oka. Not an easy setup for scum. We had no real power at all.

[Persivul]

Feels bad. I legit solved this game Day 2.

Solves are OK I guess...but I prefer

wins

.

[Persivul]

They were specifically waiting for you to vote me

Yep. I was anyway...it wasn't coordinated.

[Persivul]

anyway, it really was too hard to decide this game.

I thought FL/PK's lylo solves were good, but looking at the dead thread, it apparently wasn't so clear.

[Persivul]

Besides getting stuck on Penguin, I had a near perfect game.

Yeah, the way you didn't lynch any scum, and actually led a counter wagon when I was busing nomnom, was brilliant town play.

[Persivul]

You know, i felt like we were on our way to victory tbh

You were. You had it in your hand.

[Persivul]

And Never Lynch FL

It worked out OK for me...

[Persivul]

Idk, I really felt we had it that final day, which is where it mattered the most, but that second of doubt in Ircher mixed with Persivul active lurking got it.

You had me at 3742/3743, but then you sold through the close, which I was counting on. But the way Ircher was sticking to his Oka read, it might not have mattered anyway.

[Persivul]

That "limited investigative" is deceptively powerful in that it creates two clears on D3. IIRC after that claim there were 7 town, 4 of them with clears by claim. The clears aren't rock solid of course, but they're pretty good.

[Persivul]

How the hell did u get lynched anyway.

I was lol-playing for more than half the game

until i came to the point of "oh i see oka/nom are scum" but

everyone ignored my cases

on them and kept voting omo, chemist and me, so i decided that this game was beyond saving and rage quitted

i wasn't wrong...

Er, don't you see the cause and effect between the bolded?

[Persivul]

i think me fooling around for most of the game has a lot to do with it

Never mind, you see it!