Large Normal 223 | New Beginnings | GAME OVER

[Elements]

This is one of my first forum games so I'm quite excited!

Welcome Hectic.
I'm sure you'll find this game as addicting and enjoyable as the rest of us do when you have some experience under your belt.
The rest of us will help you through this Goliath of a game.
Normally we start by voting for people randomly as there is nothing to go off of at the start of day 1 - although I'm sure you know that having memorised the wiki.
That being said VOTE: YouAreGreat

[Elements]

Ah, OK, that makes sense, but I think my serious vote on roster is also good, right?

From where I'm standing the logic is flawless. Just remember it's a early vote so people night take it seriously. Other then self-voting - a ridiculous thing to do in almost any scenario - the first vote made by someone is almost never a talking point.

Anyway, I had another look at my role PM and apparently I'm a "Survivor Miller", not a "Miller Survivor". Not sure if the order of the words matter but thought I better bring it up anyway

In the case of your role, I don't think the order matters it's just convention to put modifiers before the role name eg loved watcher rather than watcher that is loved

[Elements]

You're a survivor (what), you're not gon' give up (what)
You're not gon' stop (what), You're gon' work harder (what)
You're a survivor (what), You're gonna make it (what)
You're will survive (what), keep on survivin' (what)

Unless this is a song reference, what?

[Elements]

Thanks for the help btw, Elements.
There's a term on the wiki for people like you. IC I think it was.

I may not be a good IC. The wiki does say to be a good IC you should "Be friendly, be helpful, and don't do stupid things" the latter is one I may not conform to as you will most likely discover.

[Elements]

that's an interesting way of spelling entire

[Elements]

oo 21 players now this is something new. Never been a game with over 15 players before. A stark difference from the days of playig mafia in warring factions side forum for forum games

was a struggle at times to get a game with 10 players of which 2-4 would be turbo lurkers. Think a game with so low activity that it could have its days extended to a hoel month

I think this is a MyLo situation, correct?

I think he's referring to players being inactive with the "turbo-lurkers" label rather than implying a 4v6 mylo situation.

[Elements]

Who claimed survivor.

Miller Survivor, and Hectic

[Elements]

whoops forgot to sign that post, sorry.

-Hop

Please explain

[Elements]

I'm thinking you're the -1%

[Elements]

I'm thinking you're the -1%

-3%
I can do maths

[Elements]

'Important note: A recent study jointly authored by Mastina and Radiant Cowbells has proven that 86% of gimmick users were town. 17% of the rest were survivor millers.'

[Elements]

and your post signing

[Elements]

and your post signing

'Important note: A recent study jointly authored by Mastina and Radiant Cowbells has proven that 86% of gimmick users were town. 17% of the rest were survivor millers.'

[Elements]

https://wiki.mafiascum.net/index.php?title=Flailing
IC, please help me out here. Hopkirk is OMGUSing me.

The table clearly state the 28.75% of the time players accused of flailing are scum.

[Elements]

[quote="In post 49, Hopkirk"That's 17% of the remaining 14% which is 2.38%.[/quote]
You're 2.38% confirmed scum then

[Elements]

https://wiki.mafiascum.net/index.php?title=Flailing
IC, please help me out here. Hopkirk is OMGUSing me.

The table clearly state the 28.75% of the time players accused of flailing are scum.

28.71%

[Elements]

more on the terms of "just because you're a hydra doesn't mean it excludes you from being scumy ad"

Doesn't that go without saying though? If I'm 'a regular player pretending to be a hydra' then I'm still just 'a regular player' so why would you treat me 'like a hydra'?

-Hop

I agree with hop here. Surely the only way Hydræ are treated differently is there's two lots of meta you can look at?

[Elements]

Elements - Done nothing wrong and had been active, but his play is oddly regular.

Is this in comparison to my more erratic behaviour in other games?

[Elements]

Elements - Done nothing wrong and had been active, but his play is oddly regular.

Is this in comparison to my more erratic behaviour in other games?

The wiki tells me that we shouldn't talk about ongoing games.
Your helpful entrance here does parallel your undertale game. So you're a nulltown for me due to paranoia.

I was referring to the pick your power game

[Elements]

who?

[Elements]

Elements - Done nothing wrong and had been active, but his play is oddly regular.

Is this in comparison to my more erratic behaviour in other games?

The wiki tells me that we shouldn't talk about ongoing games.
Your helpful entrance here does parallel your undertale game. So you're a nulltown for me due to paranoia.

I was referring to the pick your power game

Ignore that actually. I wasn't that erratic in that one.

[Elements]

I'm starting to realise my game play is heavily influenced by my mood.

[Elements]

Did I tell you I am THE LAW yet?

Fuck you

[Elements]

I recognise no authority other than the mod

[Elements]

I'm starting to realise my game play is heavily influenced by my mood.

I'm may have been to hasty here

[Elements]

I am a firm believer in democracy

, so I'm going to make this clear: Anyone who recognizes my authority and superiority shall live.

Anyone who doesn't will die

. No exceptions.

The choice is yours.

(SHIT! I keep referring to OTHER epic movies I am not on).

Democracy in action folks.

[Elements]

I forgot to unbold "the choice is yours" ignore that boldness

[Elements]

VOTE: JJD

[Elements]

I offer an alternative to JJD's tyranny. Don't accept him and play this game as you have been, free from oppression.

[Elements]

"I don't see any sensible option except ending democracy in favor of the Judge" - Hopkirk
"Elements is so good at mafia he caught me before I read my role pm" - Hopkirk
"Tchill is so town I'm reading him as a city" - Hopkirk

If anyone wants sig quotes feel free to ask.

The second two are great quotes. I want more.

[Elements]

I have one of my own, and it concludes that 99% of the stats posted in this thread are made up BS.

There are yet to be 100 stats in this thread so you have called your own stat made up thus creating a looping paradox of it being made up then not made up then made up then not made up....

[Elements]

I'm starting to realise my game play is heavily influenced by my mood.

this happens to me too. it is an emotional game tbh

so what mood are you in now then

Im in the mood to vote some up.

VOTE: Eve

why would you vote an gathering of cute animals in touch with their feelings over a tyrant willing to kill any who oppose them??

[Elements]

that's an interesting way of spelling entire

P sure he meant whole

that was the joke

[Elements]

elements how the fuck do you already have 33 posts

I think I'm turning into a hyper poster

[Elements]

I have one of my own, and it concludes that 99% of the stats posted in this thread are made up BS.

There are yet to be 100 stats in this thread so you have called your own stat made up thus creating a looping paradox of it being made up then not made up then made up then not made up....

Good catch! Now can you recognize this:

Pilgrim, can you handle this?
Dalton, can you handle this?
Gamma, can you handle this?
I don't think they can handle this
My boy Fish, can you handle this?
My girl Carca, can you handle this?
davesaz, can you handle this?
YouAreGreat, you can't handle this

I'm going to guess it's a Destiny Child some rehashed using players in this game.

[Elements]

is hectic an alt

no

[Elements]

is hectic an alt of an old user or a genuinely new player? because that's gonna drastically impact how i'm reading them

I'd say alt.

You'd be wrong

[Elements]

is hectic an alt

no

Is this a serious answer.

Yes

[Elements]

I was just going to say we had a YAG Carca Hopkirk TOWNBLOCK. I like the way you think Hectic. That might mean we need to lynch you before you use your dastardly charisma to infiltrate it and play us like suckers.

Have you ever been wrong about someone in a town block?

[Elements]

I'm town reading hopkirk. I've never experienced them forming a town block as not town

[Elements]

I'm town reading hopkirk. I've never experienced them forming a town block as not town

In forum games or IRL?
(IRL means In Real Life)

irl. Unless you know to the contrary?

[Elements]

Hectic. Name 5 or more normal/non-bastard roles. all but one of which aren't your role, and one that is. Randomize the order. I want to see if I'm right about you.

what a stupid thing to ask

[Elements]

Hectic. Name 5 or more normal/non-bastard roles. all but one of which aren't your role, and one that is. Randomize the order. I want to see if I'm right about you.

what a stupid thing to ask

What a stupid thing to say

Fight me. I'll gladiate you

[Elements]

Don't like Elements so far. He is one of the top posters here which makes him look quite active but most his posts feel hollow/don't contribute much at all.

That's 'cause I don't like or respect day 1

[Elements]

Hmm you may be the first to really do that to elements.

First to do what to me?

[Elements]

I like Tchill's entrance. I'll put you down on the town pile for now

[Elements]

Just looking through the roll list and sorting people into 1 of three categories this is what I come up with

Town - Cliff, Rick, Hectic, Eevee, Gamma, Hop, carca, profii
Null - Kop, Billy, Fish, garmr, dave, bob, skellen, youare
Scum - Sharon, JJD, roster, Tchill

[Elements]

Just looking through the roll list and sorting people into 1 of three categories this is what I come up with

Town - Cliff, Rick, Hectic, Eevee, Gamma, Hop, carca, profii
Null - Kop, Billy, Fish, garmr, dave, bob, skellen, youare
Scum - Sharon, JJD, roster, Tchill

Idk why Tchill is in the scum bit there. Should be in the town. Probably because I don't like your name

[Elements]

I'm town reading hopkirk. I've never experienced them forming a town block as not town

There's no way this can be true. How many games would you say we've player together?

A vast quantity. I cannot think of a time you've formed a town block when scum. I definitely remember you forming them when I'm scum and not including me when I've tried to wiggle my way in. Just not you being scum when you've instigated one.

[Elements]

Just clear this up- within about 1hour you've gone
Chill town -> scum -> town
I'm guessing you made a mistake but explain your thinking here

'Twas a mistake. It was a brain dump post. I was looking through the player list. For people I couldn't remember anything about I went off how much I liked their name. When I re-read it after I posted I noticed the mistake. I tend to post now, ask questions later.

There's no way this can be right can there? Do circles of trust count as townblocks?

No. Specifically when you've gone "ah nice a town block" and then gestured with your arms. Or something along those lines. Not circles of trust.

[Elements]

He hasn't even self-voted for himself, let alone claimed serial killer yet.

As soon as there's some form of evidence pointing to the existence of a serial killer I will do so. Until then I can't be sure if my claim would be truthful.

[Elements]

No scum masons! Oh wow

[Elements]

^upon a quick iso

you're definitely missing something, either a large obvious piece of text or a joke involving the elements and a serial killer.

-Hop

Oh... The serial killer is (ayyyeeeaaaahhhhh) dancing in September. Is that it? Is that the joke?

I cannot tell if this is serious or not

[Elements]

This is serious... Seriously painful.

I do apologise, but it's not something I can change. It just doesn't sit well with me.

[Elements]

We should be lynching Elements before dawn.

You what? Where did this come from?

[Elements]

Hope your eyes aren't bleeding yet.

My eyes are bleeding green

[Elements]

Sharon, JJD, roster

Pls talk about these

Sharron and roster for lack of activity
JJD because I didn't like his entrance

[Elements]

pffft elements I might be starting to agree with you on the jjd thing for a different reason

care to elaborate?

[Elements]

JJD because I didn't like his entrance

I forgot the lubricant! SORRY! My bad.

Remember it next time or expect people to be sore

[Elements]

pffft elements I might be starting to agree with you on the jjd thing for a different reason

Stay focused. A reputable Judge like myself would NEVER break the LAW. I ENFORCE the law. I AM THE LAW.

I'm agreeing with whomever said JJD is hiding behind his gimmick to not play the game

[Elements]

Don't tell me... are you hiding behind your gimmick to not play the game?

I am

playing the bloody game. You're just not seeing it because you have your bloody shades on. However, there are many experts in this game who would tell you that I -at least- am playing (as in sorting) as we speak. They may not all be able to tell my alignment yet (except those who rolled scum, of course) and may not even know what exactly I'm doing, but they know I'm playing the game of Mafia as we speak.

Can any of these so called experts confirm this?

[Elements]

I'm effectively treating JJD s 'I am the law' equivalent to 'I am town

[Elements]

I'm effectively treating JJD s 'I am the law' equivalent to 'I am town

Nah, it's just going in character. Have you seen / heard of the movie?

Neither

[Elements]

Also FYI

JJD has town slipped

Explain

[Elements]

Also FYI

JJD has town slipped

Explain

After the game but in my mind hes town now for sure

Why would you not explain? This is a massive game and I think he's currently the biggest wagon. There's also a fair few low activity players. That means well want to decide on a lunch relatively early so they can defend and we can get the votes.

[Elements]

He also doesn’t seem to actively try to make sure that i town read him here, which i feel at this point he just kind of has to if he rolls scum against me.

This seem wifom y

[Elements]

Rant mode /off. Thank you for your time and attention

I prefer rant mode to normal mode. can you keep it on?

[Elements]

UNVOTE:
JJD's change has improved my view of them. I'm still not going to support their dictatorship though.
VOTE: roster
Stop hiding and come out to play roster.

[Elements]

"ooh that's gotta be town because who would do that as scum" mentality.

AKA WIFOM

[Elements]

"ooh that's gotta be town because who would do that as scum" mentality.

AKA WIFOM

was that really necessary

I like pointing it out. For some reason people take a stronger stance when it's called out

[Elements]

Doesn't large balance do with either prs or more scum?
I'm not talking about lousy things like godfather or rolecop though.

Are we talking about setup now?
I was thinking something like 4 mafs - 2 or 3 power roles maybe rolecop and roleblocker maybe an x shot strongman, an SK or other anti-town third party, 3 -5 town power roles based on strength - 1 or 2 investigative roles (watcher and tracker would be a fun combo) maybe a protective role like doc or bg, possibly 2 or 3 masons. With 3 though, I'd expect one to be mafia for funness.
So maybe something like:
1/2 invest, 1 protective, 1/2 utility - Town
1 invest, 1/2 utility - Mafia
Third party - maybe bulletproof of some description

[Elements]

"ooh that's gotta be town because who would do that as scum" mentality.

AKA WIFOM

was that really necessary

I like pointing it out. For some reason people take a stronger stance when it's called out

Exactly what do you think you're pointing out?

It's more putting a label on it then pointing it out.

[Elements]

It's more putting a label on it then pointing it out.

What are you putting the label on?

the "ooh that's gotta be town because who would do that as scum" mentality.

[Elements]

I don't buy your claim pal

I think the more pertinent question is, does anyone?

[Elements]

It's more putting a label on it then pointing it out.

What are you putting the label on?

the "ooh that's gotta be town because who would do that as scum" mentality.

Nope, that's not wifom. That's healthy skepticism.

ngl, I've never fully understood the definition of wifom. I've always used it as "that's such a bad play scum would never do that"

[Elements]

That's essentially what it is. It's that logic in layers, like you could also guess they're scum who planned to get that reaction

So it's the whole cycle of "they wouldn't do that so they would do that so they wouldn't do that..."

[Elements]

That's essentially what it is. It's that logic in layers, like you could also guess they're scum who planned to get that reaction

So it's the whole cycle of "they wouldn't do that so they would do that so they wouldn't do that..."

Exactly. I am actually pretty good at cutting through that btw.

I think the best strategy it to just ignore it

[Elements]

Just looking through the roll list and sorting people into 1 of three categories this is what I come up with

Town - Cliff, Rick, Hectic, Eevee, Gamma, Hop, carca, profii
Null - Kop, Billy, Fish, garmr, dave, bob, skellen, youare
Scum - Sharon, JJD, roster, Tchill

After our interactions so far I can't say I understand why I'm the first thing that comes to mind for "town". But I'm flattered.

@elements in case this wasn't apparent I want to know why I'm the first thing you thought of as town

The reason you're first is because your name in the first in the player list on page one that I think is probably town.
It's not an ordered list. Just a quick gut sorting into piles.

[Elements]

im not liking the fact your speculating on the set up this early.

Is it early to start speculating? I just quite like doing it.

Im hoping for a third game were my initial impressions turn out to be right

Sorry to disappoint

[Elements]

I'm liking JJD more every post now

[Elements]

I've been thinking about it since the start of the game. I started with a "what would I do" line of thinking then thought about balance and fun. General rule of thumb 1/4 of the players scum. SK is my favourite role so throw that in there leaving 4 spots for mafia.

[Elements]

Sorry, I forgot this was a thing. I was busy all week so I didn’t have a chance to post.

Leonard liked this

[Elements]

Yup, idk what's caused it

[Elements]

Because it is kinda weird that he used watcher/tracker combo as the investigative options when there's potential for others like cop or hider. Kinda like it's tmi.

Watcher/tracker is like an opposite duo. Can you think of another?

[Elements]

Why would we predict the NK? and why are you implying there will only be one

how..... would there be more than one

SK

[Elements]

I feel like any form of cop should check these miller claims

[Elements]

Because it is kinda weird that he used watcher/tracker combo as the investigative options when there's potential for others like cop or hider. Kinda like it's tmi.

Watcher/tracker is like an opposite duo. Can you think of another?

Why would there be a duo investigative role like tracker/watcher none of the roles have been revealed?

it was an example of two investigative roles. I picked those two because they fit together. It was only to illustrate the point there might be 2 investigative roles.

[Elements]

I'm struggling to see the point behind your line of questioning

[Elements]

Miller is a joke, man

Or its that what they want you to think...

[Elements]

I'm not sure Hectic does?? For one. In fact, I dunno how well Hopkirk, Hectic, bob, Elements, Billy, YAG, Sharon, ELA or Skellen know Rick Dalton. Some of them may, but I don't know that. Some of them I don't even know myself.

Hectic probably knows more then I do. And I don't.

[Elements]

Really? Well I dunno about the modifier and I dunno about the # of scum, but I am informed that there are no informed roles in this game! How 'bout that?

That could only be a neutral role

[Elements]

I think all the miller claims are fake and if they're investigated as mafia, they are mafia. Those are my two cents.
I also cannot remember who I'm voting for currently.

[Elements]

Ok it's on roster. yea that's fine

[Elements]

I want roster

[Elements]

-Hectic "Hectic" Hectic

I think you're bleeding through here

[Elements]

So if someone's first post is "hey guys I'm a bulletproof JOAT survivor with a loyal Miller modifier" it's a-fuckin-ok to talk about it.

What's a Loyal Miller Modifier?

A made up rant thing

[Elements]

Haven't really gone to deep in elements read list just yet. But I want to see how things play out.

There's not much deep thought in that list. It was mostly gut.

AS although yu have 90-100 post there just doesnt feel like that much meat in them

I'm much more if an impulse poster then an analytical poster.

[Elements]

bob, who's your current vote on and would you be willing to join us on roster?

[Elements]

Oh, your vote's on me bob, didn't realise, my bad.

[Elements]

bob, who's your current vote on and would you be willing to join us on roster?

I think the rooster wagon is just a bad wagon. Cant see any justification for it even gettign to 3 votes let alone 5. Or how you tried to push it 6.

This is a 21 player game. A wagon of 5 is not pressure.

[Elements]

this roster wagon is such ass

In the 1/21 chance that he IS scum that's completely up to mother luck.

It's not 1 in 21

[Elements]

I'm happy to change my vote to another wagon, but there doesn't seem to be another one atm

[Elements]

VOTE: elements
Look! a wagon is beginning to form! and it's on an active player! Quick join it so it has some significance!

[Elements]

I just want a wagon

[Elements]

I mean, seriously.. games are lost because of letting lurkers be and concentrating on the active posters.

Ik, but there's just soooo much resistance to voting roster

[Elements]

Hectic, join us
VOTE: roster

[Elements]

I enjoy my Elements vote even more now

I was enjoying it to until people still didn't want to join in.

[Elements]

Point 3 has convinced me you're town

[Elements]

the lack of a wagon is starting to crush me

[Elements]

VOTE: elements
Look! a wagon is beginning to form! and it's on an active player! Quick join it so it has some significance!

Oh, you know we're going to be voting you soon so you vote yourself in a silly looking way to paint anyone who does the same thing as an idiot eh? Well I'm on to your little game.

What are you on about here

[Elements]

I'm down to lynch elements or hopkirk so far. My gut tells me I want to lynch Gamma but that's why I don't want to lynch gamma. I could compromise on kop

A few votes have been made on others with reasoning that could easily also be applied to me. That makes me think that maybe people think I'm something that I'm not?

Ooh, let me guess. People think you're town but you're not?
VOTE: Cliff Booth

BTW that's not just a joke vote. I happen to agree that the reasoning [not scumhunting] applies to you. Prove me wrong.

I'm not ready to scumhunt yet. But it was really easy to bait you into voting me. I'm gonna enjoy the feeling for awhile.

Btw your votes look really weird in a vacuum

A few votes have been made on others with reasoning that could easily also be applied to me. That makes me think that maybe people think I'm something that I'm not?

I can dig it.

I don't like any of theses posts
VOTE: cliff

[Elements]

A few votes have been made on others with reasoning that could easily also be applied to me. That makes me think that maybe people think I'm something that I'm not?

Ooh, let me guess. People think you're town but you're not?
VOTE: Cliff Booth

BTW that's not just a joke vote. I happen to agree that the reasoning [not scumhunting] applies to you. Prove me wrong.

I'm not ready to scumhunt yet. But it was really easy to bait you into voting me. I'm gonna enjoy the feeling for awhile.

Btw your votes look really weird in a vacuum

or this one

[Elements]

Yeah, this is a mislynch.

L-7 halfway through the day IS NOT A MISLYNCH

[Elements]

Hectic, we're trying to move onto a Cliff wagon given so many people don't want to vote roster

[Elements]

I take over.

That's not happening. We took JJD down, we'll take you down again.

[Elements]

I take over.

That's not happening. We took JJD down, we'll take you down again.

Again = too

[Elements]

I take over.

That's not happening. We took JJD down, we'll take you down again.

Good luck.

I'm active enough to out shout you

[Elements]

I take over.

That's not happening. We took JJD down, we'll take you down again.

Good luck.

I'm active enough to out shout you

My demeanor doesn’t warrant out shouting, and silences shouts.

Even when I speak of nothing, as I am now, you’re being overrun and worked up.

I don't get worked up. I just act like I do.

[Elements]

I take over.

That's not happening. We took JJD down, we'll take you down again.

Good luck.

I'm active enough to out shout you

My demeanor doesn’t warrant out shouting, and silences shouts.

Even when I speak of nothing, as I am now, you’re being overrun and worked up.

I don't get worked up. I just act like I do.

You gonna have a lot of circular irrelevant filler talk such as this?

Day 1 yes. Onwards, we'll see

[Elements]

I take over.

That's not happening. We took JJD down, we'll take you down again.

Good luck.

I'm active enough to out shout you

My demeanor doesn’t warrant out shouting, and silences shouts.

Even when I speak of nothing, as I am now, you’re being overrun and worked up.

I don't get worked up. I just act like I do.

You gonna have a lot of circular irrelevant filler talk such as this?

Day 1 yes. Onwards, we'll see

[Elements]

I think we should 1v1.

I think that's a bad idea given we're both town

[Elements]

I think we should 1v1.

I think that's a bad idea given we're both town

Why is that bad?

Don’t you wanna dance?

I only dance when I've consumed alcohol

[Elements]

Don’t you wanna dance?

I have no problem with you at the current time. If you decide to take control of the town I will.

[Elements]

I feel you underestimate me, young axolotl.

Quite possibly. I just don't like being controlled.

[Elements]

Seems like you’re afraid of a change in game state.

My play will most likely change drastically on day 2

[Elements]

Not sure why I quoted you there

[Elements]

Don’t you wanna dance?

I have no problem with you at the current time. If you decide to take control of the town I will.

Why would a town read being in control of town be a problem? Depending on the nature of the game, some townies will be better leaders than others. For instance, I am 100% weaker in early game in mountainous but stronger in late game.

I don't like being controlled

[Elements]

is there a case on elements being scum that i missed?

If there is, I've missed it too

[Elements]

I hate d1.

The feeling is mutual

[Elements]

Spoiler:

Here are examples.

1.

Other then self-voting - a ridiculous thing to do in almost any scenario - the first vote made by someone is almost never a talking point.

VOTE: elements
Look! a wagon is beginning to form! and it's on an active player! Quick join it so it has some significance!

Spoiler:

2.
After making a ton of posts that really made zero impact on the game he posts

Sharon, JJD, roster

Pls talk about these

Sharron and roster for lack of activity
JJD because I didn't like his entrance

This blatant example of looking for LHF to lynch. His readslist in 421 was also quite awkward and I see no reason why I was the first thing he considered to be town, let alone over players like dave, YAG, or JJD.

It's honestly astounding how you and garmr continue to misunderstand me despite me explaining. I'll spell it out simply for you. The "100% bonafide" "read" list was a gut reaction post where I went through the player list on page one and sorted people quickly. If you look at the page one order, you will see that you are player name 3 below two people I put in the null pile. Hence, you were the first name I wrote in the town section. The read list was not ordered.

3.

pffft elements I might be starting to agree with you on the jjd thing for a different reason

Stay focused. A reputable Judge like myself would NEVER break the LAW. I ENFORCE the law. I AM THE LAW.

I'm agreeing with whomever said JJD is hiding behind his gimmick to not play the game

Why doesn't this apply to me or Rick? We were townbinned for seemingly no reason. He also shaded JJD a lot. Also shaded rick a bit after calling him town.

The "read" list was a gut thing that maybe applies truly for the rest of the page it was posted. It was not mean not be taken this seriously. Most of your "reasons" for me being scum involve, what was meant to be, a throw away post to boost discussion with instant gut reads.

4.
After saying that I am town and then never mentioning me again I am suddenly scum to him when the LHF roster wagon clearly has no promise (see 1140) , and once I advocate for his lynch. He didn't seem to mind me doing what he originally scumread JJD for, until I actually pushed a lynch on him. I would argue that I'm the 2nd best LHF option in the game as of 1075

Idk if you'd noticed how annoyed I was there was no wagons forming. If you didn't you must be blind or deliberately not reading my posts. Again, this point as about the "read" list.

5.

I think we should 1v1.

I think that's a bad idea given we're both town

still weird given his past views

His extremely high posts with basically 0 game progressing content outside of the occasional post that feels more like "trying to look like game progression" also doesn't sit right with me.

I play day 1 to survive night 1. I play day one to get interactions between people so day two we have, at least, 2 flips and lots of intereactions to go off. Again "given his past views" referring to the "read" list

[Elements]

Dame here. I just want Elements to define the "elements" on which he bases his reads though before I commit to it.

Gut
I'll say it again, I don't like day 1. I'll tell you now, whoever we decide to lynch I will say we should switch wagons because the vast likelihood is that player is town.

[Elements]

It's honestly astounding how you and garmr continue to misunderstand me despite me explaining. I'll spell it out simply for you.

1. I thought the last thing I said regards to your alignment was you might be town so are you saying I'm wrong on that.

2. the last thing I said on your reads was I haven't gave it any thought

Have you read my posts?

It's referring to you constantly saying I think watcher and tracker are both in the game. Should've made that more clear.

[Elements]

Deadline:

(expired on 2019-09-20 07:28:35)

[Elements]

I haven't done a single thing that any thinking town should see as scummy. Ever.

This is the very definition of what town should do.

Are these meant to sound narcissistic?

[Elements]

And I'm pretty sure, in plain terms, the self-vote was an attempt to draw attention back to the game during a dry time/standstill.

Well to me it looked more like him trying to make the wagon and the people on it look stupid. It was a gambit, nothing more than that. To say that it was this attempt to breathe life back into the game is BS

why are you so close minded?

[Elements]

The only thing I've been "going after" is a wagon. At no point have I said I wanted to lynch roster.

[Elements]

And I'm pretty sure, in plain terms, the self-vote was an attempt to draw attention back to the game during a dry time/standstill.

Well to me it looked more like him trying to make the wagon and the people on it look stupid. It was a gambit, nothing more than that. To say that it was this attempt to breathe life back into the game is BS

I thought of a 3rd option, which I won't explain.
Between options 1 and 2, I'd lean towards 2.

Which option is which? And why aren't you explaining option 3?

[Elements]

if he's town then I'm a50's uncle

wow you're old

[Elements]

Elements, have you directly explained your actual reason for self voting?

idk, I'll have a look later today

[Elements]

The sky

[Elements]

kinda feels like my reads are at a stalemate until i see a flip

Isn't that just day 1?

[Elements]

With that in mind, Elements, Billy, and let's say Profii are

confirmed scum

to me here.

Yet you're voting cliff.
How are we "confirmed scum". It's impossible for anyone to be confirmed anything to anyone unless the play saying they have confirmed reads are themselves scum.
And don't say "it was a prodge so I didn't think it through" because that would be a blatant lie. In fact, do say that. Then we can all lynch scum day 1.

[Elements]

Elements, have you directly explained your actual reason for self voting?

I've said I wanted a wagon many times. That's about it.
I wanted a wagon so I tried to shake the game up a bit by self voting. If that resulted in a wagon on me, great, then we have a wagon.

[Elements]

It didn't work particularly well

[Elements]

The reader is led to infer that I've decided on the scumread at that moment but am 100% sure of it

I did infer that until I noticed "confirmed scum " was in bold.

[Elements]

That was the bit that pinged me

[Elements]

Town: Hectic, Carcalilly, Gamma, JJD, Bob, Garmr, Dave, RFD, Kop/Cliff
Have you posted: Rooster/Sharon Tate/Titus
Various degrees of ew: Elements/Billy Pilgrim/Tchill/AaronFrost/Profii/Eevee/YouAreGreat

VOTE: Elements

-Hopkirk

Do you think I'm playing more the way I play town or scum?

[Elements]

Can you remind me if you've got a town game I've seen? For your irl game it's neither.

There's Leader's royal, but my play isn't recognisable from then. Other then that none. I do think my play is dissimilar from my only scum game.

Why did you think I said that?

Idk. I didn't like it.

[Elements]

That's a good question. I'll do one now.

[Elements]

In not particular order

Town - Kop, Hectic, Eevee, Gamma, carcalillly, JJD, dave, profli
Middle - Billy, Titus, Hopkirk, roster, garmr, bob, Aaron, YAG
Scum - Cliff, Rick, Sharon, tchill
SK - Elements

[Elements]

Right now I want to vote between Sharon Tate & AaronFrost. Is there a wagon on either of them?

I don't think, but I'll join whichever one you want to start

[Elements]

Haven't read that one.

It's here if you want to.

[Elements]

I don't think

so.

Although, quite often I don't think either.

[Elements]

In not particular order

Town - Kop, Hectic, Eevee, Gamma, carcalillly, JJD, dave, profli
Middle - Billy, Titus, Hopkirk, roster, garmr, bob, Aaron, YAG
Scum - Cliff, Rick, Sharon, tchill
SK - Elements

are you really so if so can you kill tchill for me?

We could always lynch him today

[Elements]

Is that individually or as a group.

Individually.
My reads are "The scum players are in the null and town sections, but the ones in scum are more likely to be scum"

[Elements]

I think elements just hates d1 and does stupid things during d1 because of it.

I play day 1 to survive night 1.
I claim SK because it's my favourite role and become a bit of a meme, vis a vie post 342

[Elements]

Cliff

[Elements]

The cliff wagon was getting going, so I joined it.

[Elements]

Didn't like his reaction to his wagon or my vote on it

[Elements]

@AaronFrost I agree that taking care of college stuff first is the right priority. Replacing in is good for the site, but it's better when you do it only when you're ready to play.

Yeah sorry I'm still reading my way through the thread. I'll be caught up by tonight.

Coz time zones, how long will that be?

[Elements]

Cause a commotion, maybe start an argument somehow. Get the game moving faster. It was fairly slow at that point. Didn't work though.

[Elements]

It's unorthodox so likely to cause discussion, which it has but not at the point in time I wanted it to.

[Elements]

I could get behind that

[Elements]

VOTE: rick
You have some good reasoning too gamma

[Elements]

I think their existence is lacklustre

[Elements]

how far back would catching up be?

[Elements]

is there enough content of importance for me to make an effort to catch up or can I just real the last page and a half

Very brief synopsis:
people don't like tchill, rick, cliff or me.
Profli and dave are town

[Elements]

Elements - Null. What's with you and self-voting?

It's my town tell

[Elements]

Also don't believe your SK claim.

What?! Did your phone auto-correct "do"??

[Elements]

Are SKs normally bulletproof on this site?

[Elements]

Are SKs normally bulletproof on this site?

Wouldn't be easier if you had checked your role PM??

this way it looks more like I'm fake claiming SK.

[Elements]

Titus vote Rick

Nah. I'm much more happy on Elements because of the resistance to him and his AtE when I was last reading.

There has been less resistance to my wagon then to anyone else's. I'm also the joint highest, L-5, of any wagon currently. This looks like an excuse to keep your vote on me.

[Elements]

I’m an investigative.

I’m a Day 3 IC.

Which one are you?
Or is the IC claim you saying you'll be obviously town at that point?

[Elements]

As much as I want to defend you more elements, I'm just not sure enough to put it up.

That's fair. I think I've crumbed my role sufficiently that if I have to claim I'll be believed and not lynched.

[Elements]

Titus vote Rick

Nah. I'm much more happy on Elements because of the resistance to him and his AtE when I was last reading.

There has been less resistance to my wagon then to anyone else's. I'm also the joint highest, L-5, of any wagon currently. This looks like an excuse to keep your vote on me.

I am cooling on you as well, but the case on me is trash. And if you’re town, yes, there is scum on you, but there’s scum on me right now too.

Yea, your defence seem highly aggravated, genuine and passionate too.

[Elements]

I’m an investigative.

I’m a Day 3 IC.

Which one are you?
Or is the IC claim you saying you'll be obviously town at that point?

I’m both.

You new here?

relatively

[Elements]

@Elements - I also fake claimed Day 3 IC, and if I didn’t get revealed as town, then to lynch me, and it drove scum wild in their PT, to the point Night 2 I had to make sure, so I spent hours doing analysis and i used my 1-shot Vigilante to hit the mafia doctor, and thus got the “scum should always kill Boon.” line in my signature.

So the Day 3 ic is kind of a recurring joke, which is actually more of a crumb for vigilante than IC.

Sounds like it was a fun game

[Elements]

I have nothing to hide, so why hide anything? Kinda mindset

Because you don't want scum to kill you...

[Elements]

Elements claimed SK but make of that what you will. I don't believe the claim personally.

I forgot about this.

Honestly, it could be mafia claiming SK to try to be “leashed”.

I hate that idea of leashing SK’s. Just kill them.

I haven't crumbed SK, I have crumbed my role.

[Elements]

I’m an investigative

Yay! That makes two of us. We'd make a great team..

Woah, I thought it was just a few of us. Starting to look like role madness with all of us detectives here.

let me join in the squad

[Elements]

Looks like we're claiming now. I'm the lynchproof compulsive bodyguard jester 1 shot loyal gladiator.

[Elements]

I'm getting the feeling this might be a game where the mafia are sitting back and letting the town tear themselves apart. I'm liking risk more even though he thinks I'm scum. still don't like Cliff.
VOTE: cliff

[Elements]

At what point should I claim?

[Elements]

I haven't crumbed SK, I have crumbed my role.

Doesn't telling everyone that you've crumbed your role kind of defeat the purpose of crumbing in the first place?

I treat crumbing as a "I've already hinted at my role".
I don't mind telling you I've done that

[Elements]

It's not rlly a sneaky crum

[Elements]

Dave, who do you think we should lynch today?

[Elements]

okay i'm going back to not caring again unless we lynch hopkirk or elements

Not caring about the game, not a towny thing to do.

[Elements]

aww we're gonna end up lynching elements today aren't we?

I don't wanna

This happened last time I rolled a PR role.

[Elements]

I'm a watcher

[Elements]

Spoiler:

Ah, OK, that makes sense, but I think my serious vote on roster is also good, right?

From where I'm standing the logic is flawless. Just remember it's a early vote so people night take it seriously. Other then self-voting - a ridiculous thing to do in almost any scenario - the first vote made by someone is almost never a talking point.

Anyway, I had another look at my role PM and apparently I'm a "Survivor Miller", not a "Miller Survivor". Not sure if the order of the words matter but thought I better bring it up anyway

In the case of your role, I don't think the order matters it's just convention to put modifiers before the role name eg loved watcher rather than watcher that is loved

Doesn't large balance do with either prs or more scum?
I'm not talking about lousy things like godfather or rolecop though.

Are we talking about setup now?
I was thinking something like 4 mafs - 2 or 3 power roles maybe rolecop and roleblocker maybe an x shot strongman, an SK or other anti-town third party, 3 -5 town power roles based on strength - 1 or 2 investigative roles (watcher and tracker would be a fun combo) maybe a protective role like doc or bg, possibly 2 or 3 masons. With 3 though, I'd expect one to be mafia for funness.
So maybe something like:
1/2 invest, 1 protective, 1/2 utility - Town
1 invest, 1/2 utility - Mafia
Third party - maybe bulletproof of some description

These are my 2 "crumb" posts. It's the reason I picked watcher as an example for everything.

[Elements]

I'll join the Tchill wagon.
VOTE: Tchill

[Elements]

Note: IF there's a Vig, please shoot the Aaron slot (EVEN if they replace out. Don't let that slick move fool you).

Also if there a STRONG Investigative (i.e. Something like a Cop or a Gunsmith, not a Tracker or a Motion Detector); please do "consider" investigating Titus. I'm not telling you what to do. Just please take that option into consideration. Thank you.

P-edit: U would have accepted a vote on almost anyone, but not the claimed Watcher!!

whos the claimed watcher and who were you suggesting be a PL? whats who i was gonna vote.

Im the watcher

[Elements]

This is a better wagon
VOTE: aaron

[Elements]

Carcalilly, when did you start scum reading me and why?

[Elements]

I voted Elements because, to put it bluntly, I don't believe his claim. I also don't see how him mentioning watcher a bunch of times as an example somehow counts as a crumb. Maybe I'm in the wrong here but that's not really much of a crumb (and if it is, it's not a very good one).

What is your definition of a crumb?

[Elements]

That's his gimmick d1. Dude hates d1. Plays wrecklessy because he doesn't care about it. I used to be that guy. I'm still kinda sorta that guy. Especially after d1 gets past PG 20.

I've been scumread day one every game I've played, except the one I was scum.

[Elements]

Elements didn't really do either of those things. And not only was his crumb not very good, he outright stated that he crumbed his role, which kind of goes against the point of crumbing in the first place.

I said I crumbed when people stated wanting to lynch me properly so they could go back and look for them and maybe change their read on me

[Elements]

That's his gimmick d1. Dude hates d1. Plays wrecklessy because he doesn't care about it. I used to be that guy. I'm still kinda sorta that guy. Especially after d1 gets past PG 20.

I've been scumread day one every game I've played, except the one I was scum.

I'd try to fix that. This is a you problem and in no way should be seen as you being good at scum lol.

I'm not saying I'm good at scum. I'm saying I'm always scum read day 1 as town.

[Elements]

Carcalilly, when did you start scum reading me and why?

as soon as you claimed. It looks fake as fuck.

I'm not 100% sure which is why I still want to lynch cliff

What about it seems fake??

[Elements]

Actually, question. You're just a watcher? No role modifiers?

There are modifications. I'm the town macho watcher and it turns out it might be a one shot ability so that's fun :/