Normal 222: Black Versus White Mafia (Endgame)

[Almost50]

@chickadee: I was relying on your detailed catch up. Did I miss it?

[Rick Dalton]

I do think there's a good wagon analysis if he flips town. It was kind of alarming how quickly the wagon built. But I also get the feel that people are excited about something happening in the game, and just want blood at this point.

But I do think it's a good lynch.

I think scum just bussed because they thought he was going down and now they’re just waiting to see if it passes.

Let’s just kill him. He’s gonna be stuck on nothing but the LAL mentality anyways.

[Chickadee]

@chickadee: I was relying on your detailed catch up. Did I miss it?

It ended up being much less detailed than I intended. It was just a reads list.

I've been laid up in bed dying from a sinus infection for a couple days, and thus exhausted by literally everything. I've been sleeping a lot instead of playing mafia.

[pisskop]

Seeking Replacement for johhny sno

[Rick Dalton]

Seeking Replacement for johhny sno

This is probably scum too.

[The Fonz]

I think scum just bussed because they thought he was going down and now they’re just waiting to see if it passes.

Let’s just kill him. He’s gonna be stuck on nothing but the LAL mentality anyways.

The brazenness is actually quite entertaining.

Rick 1322, "Fonz is scum because he's pushing on bad, not scummy play."

1326, "We should lynch Fonz anyway because he's going to continue playing badly even if he's town."

Rick is exactly the kind of cocky scumbag who thinks he can play in a way that draws out two investigative role claims and just shrug it off.

[Rick Dalton]

First of all, if I were scum, how is that cocky?

If I were scum, like you’re pushing, you wouldn’t be pushing that as brazenness.

You say I’m a cocky scumbag who “thinks” he can play in a way to draw out 2 investigatives. Wouldn’t that be good scum play to do that, and you’re pushing it like that would be a bad thing, and if you were town, from your perspective, the word “Thinks” shouldn’t have been there if you actually thought I was scum. The word “thinks” being there proves that you are out pushing a mislynch with a case that fits your narrative of lynch all liars on a “cocky scumbag who shrugs things off”.

I shrug it off because I am town, and it doesn’t do town any good to hang up on the fact. At this point, we should just mass claim, considering there’s already...3 PR’s outed, I believe? Maybe 4.

[Vorkuta]

At this point, we should just mass claim

About damn time

[Lil Uzi Vert]

I’ll get to this tonight.

[Chickadee]

Will you though?

[Rick Dalton]

Will I though?

[Chickadee]

We need to push something through. For anyone not on the Fonz wagon, can you express to me what your hesitation is, and propose your preferred lynch today?

[Almost50]

I've been laid up in bed dying from a sinus infection for a couple days, and thus exhausted by literally everything. I've been sleeping a lot instead of playing mafia.

As someone who has extremely allergic sinuses myself, I feel your pain. Get well soon.

[Almost50]

We need to push something through. For anyone not on the Fonz wagon, can you express to me what your hesitation is, and propose your preferred lynch today?

Are you on Fonz?? Because I said I'd be following you (and was under the impression you didn't do that catch up properly, so was still waiting for you to tell me what to do).

I also do agree to the massclaim thing now rather than later. I will go last.

[PMysterious]

I've been busy, but I'll go ahead and say the following.

Almost50- I can't defend the actions of anyone who was in my slot before me. I don't know them well enough to say anything about them that would be a solid defense. If people were scumreading those slots, then it wouldn't necessarily be fair to lump me into that same read just because of the previous slot.

Vault- I respect your list as it is. At least it is a unique spin on the town-scum read style, and it gives reasons instead of just lumping them in to a category.

At this point, we should just mass claim, considering there’s already...3 PR’s outed, I believe? Maybe 4.

This is a little risky to do at this point. Considering that there are only 2 nights worth of night actions and the fact that (as you mentioned, mind you), there's likely a ninja, and if there is, then there probably isn't as much tracking information to go off of. However, any other information on doctors that might have saved someone or maybe who the second killer on Night 2 was could be useful in the long run. So, I say we go for it.


Now, finally, I want to bring a few things up in regards to the night actions.

First off, there have been 4 deaths, a lynch on Day 1, a night kill on Night 1, no lynches on Day 2, and 2 night kills on Night 2. So, my question is, what happened during the nights?

Night 1

- Normally, it would be safe to assume that there's just one mafia team and the committed this kill. However, given that Night 2 had 2 kills, something is off. If the Mafia committed this crime, then there is either an Even night Serial Killer or an Even Night Vigilante.

However

, I would also like to think that maybe there are 2 killers and they either both happened to target the same person or one of them was saved by a doctor or some sorts. We will need a mass claim to confirm this.

Night 2

- The role PM left behind on the Chemis kill indicates that he has a Bodyguard like ability, so it is likely that whoever Chemis protected was the original target of either the Mafia or the Vigilante/SK. If I need to, I can ISO him to determine who is the person Chemis most likely detected.

So, with all of that out of the way, I have a few theories along with the one mentioned.

There is a Doctor or a 1 shot doctor who got lucky and saved someone on the first night.

- This will depend on if the Mafia and the other killer(s) work on Odd-Nights.

The Serial Killer/Vigilante works only on Even Nights.

The most likely circumstance given everything that has went down. If this is the case, then a claim on who the original target was would be nice for information sake. HOWEVER, if a Serial Killer or Vigilante claim is not brought up, then it brings me to my craziest yet somehow plausible theory.

There are actually 2 sets of Mafia.

I know this is highly unlikely, but given that there are 2 night kills and the name sake of the game is Black Versus White Mafia, it isn't entirely out of the question. Considering how crazy it is, I could be wrong on this assumption entirely.

Now, to recap everything.

1. Who is the second killer and what is their role in specific?

2. If the other killer works on odd nights, then did they target someone on Night 1 that might have likely been saved?

3. Did this other killer target someone OTHER than any of the 2 people that were killed on Night 2?

Once we answer these questions, then it's possible that this game could be cracked open. How will this help us? Because then we'll be able to know what exactly we need to be on the lookout for. So, hopefully, the mass claim possibility helps us answer these questions.

Now I'll go ahead and start the mass claim. I am a

Vanilla Townie

. Considering that there are 3 that have died already, there should be around 3 to 7 left besides me, depending on the setup.

[Rick Dalton]

VD claimed to shoot Ethos

[Chickadee]

@A50 - Yes, I'm on the Fonz at the moment. I'm inclined to stay there.

I think we do go for the mass claim.

I've already claimed, so to recap, I'm a tracker.

[The Fonz]

First of all, if I were scum, how is that cocky?

If I were scum, like you’re pushing, you wouldn’t be pushing that as brazenness.

You say I’m a cocky scumbag who “thinks” he can play in a way to draw out 2 investigatives. Wouldn’t that be good scum play to do that, and you’re pushing it like that would be a bad thing

Nah, this is misrep, I think he's playing well as scum. I think Rick believes he's essentially able to talk himself out of anything, so might as well just do the obvious things to help his side. I'm not even sure he's wrong, given how today is going. If he's playing town, he's playing badly, and I don't see the thought progression. Like, the fakeclaim here seems insufficiently flashy almost for the FL town meta I've read. I can see the thought process in fakeclaiming mason and seeing how that person reacts. I can see how an IC fakeclaim generates reactions. I don't see how claiming tracker, then claiming a confirmatory tracking on an already-claimed player is the kind of stir-shit-up play he's painting it as similar to. Nor do I see him forming any reads off the basis of it.

and if you were town, from your perspective, the word “Thinks” shouldn’t have been there if you actually thought I was scum. The word “thinks” being there proves that you are out pushing a mislynch with a case that fits your narrative of lynch all liars on a “cocky scumbag who shrugs things off”.

This makes literally no sense.

I'm fine with massclaim since it's basically already started. We gonna popcorn?

[Rick Dalton]

How’s it bad town play? I think it’s doing rather well, creating a lot of discussion. It had potential to be bad, but that’s why I knew Ihad to completely drop everything and let it not spiral for town.

Literally nothing bad’s come out of it, besides Chickadee’s outing.

[Almost50]

I'm fine with massclaim since it's basically already started. We gonna popcorn?

Feel free to claim and popcorn it to someone.

As of now the only serious claim I will consider is Chickadee's. Anyone else needs to claim even if they had done it already. Just for the record.

[Chickadee]

I'm gonna popcorn to LUV, since he said he'd get to this tonight.

[PMysterious]

My total results thus far are: Saudade N1 and Clem N2, both went nowhere on the night they were tracked. Do with this information what you will.

This is interesting information. Since I am a VT, I would have no reason (or even ability) to leave my house during the night.

As for Saud, while the ninja possibility is likely, it's highly unlikely that the first person Lapsa tracked was the Mafia Ninja (1/16 to be precise), so I'm going to say that Saud is likely town.

[Almost50]

Can we please claim in the order (popcorn) we're supposed to?

[Vorkuta]

Now I'll go ahead and start the mass claim. I am a Vanilla Townie. Considering that there are 3 that have died already, there should be around 3 to 7 left besides me, depending on the setup.

Technically not new information so...

[VaultDweller]

1. Who is the second killer and what is their role in specific?

I already claimed. I am a Town Ascetic JOAT (1x Even night Vig, 1x Jailkeeper). I shot ethos on N2