mini 2126: the game is OVRE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Something_Smart]

The argument "scum would be bussing me" doesn't hold water, because the two most universally tr'd people are not voting me, and if one of them is scum that makes me town, and if one is scum with me then they are not bussing and you're wrong anyways!

What?

[Auro]

Nope.

[Eddie Cane]

Eddie, I don't see why RCE is a townread at all.
Can you also tell me who you think Alch's partners would be if he's scum?

Personally, I really liked RCE I liked for his EoD1 posting, and originally early in the day stuff + gunsmith claim. He's completely dropped off, that much is true. Outside of me, I got the vibe he is UTR, but maybe that's wrong.

I haven't really read for partners in other people in detail, yet. You/SS are probably aligned with how the gamestate is, leaning town vs scum partners. Alch is not distancing with Dann, for example. That's not the way partner pushes another partner. He's also not with you, I don't think. But that's just reads from memory, not from actual posting.

[Something_Smart]

Do you want the wifom rebuttal or the mechanical rebuttal?

I want you to stop spitting out garbage and engage with us on a level that we can actually understand.

And it's not that I don't understand what you're trying to say, you're just not giving any evidence or reasoning apart from WIFOM, and even if people's reads are random on average, good evidence and good reasoning still exists and is still possible to give.

What you said about Dany is on that level, and it's about the only thing you said that is. So I want you to continue to talk on that level, whatever that entails.

[Eddie Cane]

The argument "scum would be bussing me" doesn't hold water, because the two most universally tr'd people are not voting me, and if one of them is scum that makes me town, and if one is scum with me then they are not bussing and you're wrong anyways!

What?

If I am scum with one or two of Comical and RCE: then scum are not bussing me, because scum has been aligning all game.
If one or two of Comical and RCE are scum and I am town: scum are not bussing me, because I am town.
If all of us are town: then I am town.
If both of them are town and I am scum: then bussing me today is throwing, because Oka is a free lynch and even ignoring that, I have both town PRs pocketed.

[Auro]

His EoD post was something like "Pine lynch bad if town" IIRC; if you can actually dig up his posts and explain like I'm 5 I'd be glad.
The gunsmith claim was a reaction to Flavor's guilty... unless you mean the manner of his claim was towny?

[Something_Smart]

If both of them are town and I am scum: then bussing me today is throwing, because Oka is a free lynch and even ignoring that, I have both town PRs pocketed.

This is the part I want to talk about. Why is it that your partners wouldn't be bussing you just because they think you are genuinely scummy? A lot of people play that way as scum.

[Eddie Cane]

Do you want the wifom rebuttal or the mechanical rebuttal?

I want you to stop spitting out garbage and engage with us on a level that we can actually understand.

And it's not that I don't understand what you're trying to say, you're just not giving any evidence or reasoning apart from WIFOM, and even if people's reads are random on average, good evidence and good reasoning still exists and is still possible to give.

What you said about Dany is on that level, and it's about the only thing you said that is. So I want you to continue to talk on that level, whatever that entails.

"Reads" are bad. Tone, flow, individual post, content, whatever - reads are bad. You can keep playing with them because its more fun - I do! But reads are bad. What I am spitting out is "wifom" as much as the fact literally anything in a game is wifom. Handwaving shit away as wifom is how scum dismiss true statements and how town loses games.

The wifom argument is if you think me as scum with anybody in this game except Boon would be okay being bussed, that's laughable.

Imagine the world with me and Dany. My above post explains the PRs. I will explain again. If I am scum with one of the PRs refer to the below post. If I am scum, I have both PRs pocketed - RCE and Comical both town read me and have defended me vocally. This makes bussing me bad! The people with swing and power in the game are aligned with me. Bussing me, if both of them are town, is actually donkey. Dany has the perfect reason to not vote me - I did not hammer him! In contrast, Oka, one of his biggest pushers, is a major wagon. If he gets the bus off me, he gets by far the least credit, compared to Oka and SS and probably Auro too (at the time). Instead, he makes the person who previously strongly scum read him, Oka, almost confirmed town, kills a scum partner who was not very widely scum read, and is still scum read by several people (even if that will lighten up a little with the bus vote). Bussing needlessly is a fuckin site trend. You need to consider state of the game. And, if we are trying to distance, then I didn't meaningfully push him all game or even comment on him, so that still doesn't make sense? Because I'm not actively distancing him. And also, if Dany is bussing he's playing for late game, but he's clearly not that invested here with the Ellitell on him.

A lot of that logic applies to Luna, but she's a more reasonable slot to think could be sneaking a bus vote in, even though I think that exact reasoning is why thinking she's a bus vote is still bad.

I can't tell if you're scum who's frustrated people are town reading me when you feel I shouldn't be town read, or town who is tunnelled because you're a mechanical player and get frustrated with level 5 reads. If its the latter, and you dismiss this post as WIFOM, I can only do so much.

[Eddie Cane]

His EoD post was something like "Pine lynch bad if town" IIRC; if you can actually dig up his posts and explain like I'm 5 I'd be glad.
The gunsmith claim was a reaction to Flavor's guilty... unless you mean the manner of his claim was towny?

It was that, yea. Felt genuine. And the manner of his claim was townie, yes.

If both of them are town and I am scum: then bussing me today is throwing, because Oka is a free lynch and even ignoring that, I have both town PRs pocketed.

This is the part I want to talk about. Why is it that your partners wouldn't be bussing you just because they think you are genuinely scummy? A lot of people play that way as scum.

This is terrible play, but it is the site trend, so I will give it a response. Why wouldn't they? I'm assuming scum have day chat like every game nowadays. I would tell them that's a stupid play.

[OkaPoka]

So I'm banking on Alchemist or Dannflor's replacement now

[OkaPoka]

But really its dannflor's replacement is who i need to be a blessing

[Eddie Cane]

VOTE: Oka

There ya go champ. If we are TT, you officially played a .9/10 game, even worse than my 1/10.

[OkaPoka]

thanks bud

[Auro]

If we are TT, you officially played a .9/10 game, even worse than my 1/10

How so? Why is wanting you lynched for bad play <1/10?

[Alchemist21]

Why are you banking on me? I'm not going to vote Eddie.

[Eddie Cane]

If we are TT, you officially played a .9/10 game, even worse than my 1/10

How so? Why is wanting you lynched for bad play <1/10?

Do you really need to ask this question?

[Something_Smart]

The problem is not that I object to the TYPE of reasoning you're doing regarding wagons and people aligning themselves with each other.

The problem is that you're making tons of simplifying assumptions (that RCE and FL will continue to townread you, that Oka is lynchable, that you flipping scum would make people stop scumreading Oka, that you flipping scum would not make people stop scumreading Dany, that Dany if your partner was trying to lynch you when he voted you, etc). After having played video mafia I do understand that these assumptions are a lot more important there and a lot more likely to be valid there, but I don't think they are here because it seems like people in forum are a lot less predictable in general.

[Auro]

Eddie, do you think Oka was fakeclaiming?

[Auro]

If we are TT, you officially played a .9/10 game, even worse than my 1/10

How so? Why is wanting you lynched for bad play <1/10?

Do you really need to ask this question?

I'm dumb; I'm not really seeing why Oka's play this game has been <1/10. So, please explain

[Eddie Cane]

I mean, I'm still cleared off the Fire nightkill, but people don't do NKA so let's move past that. I think Flavor knows this and its part of why he's town reading me, though.

I don't think any of those assumptions matter though. I will try rephrasing

again

, and this will probably be my last time because I think even the fact I'm arguing this point this hard and like this virtually never happens S/S so I'm not with Dany

anyways

.
Fact: in the current game state, both claimed PRs town read me and have defended me two days in a row.
Fact: in the current game state, iDanyboy is fairly widely scum read, having got to l-1 twice in the last phase.
Let's go through all four worlds:

1) We are both town: I correctly chose not to lolhammer him. I am town; this world is irrelevant.
2) He is scum, I am town: I incorrectly chose to not meme hammer a second day in a row. I am town; this world is irrelevant.
I know the world is one of those two. Let's continue to worlds 3 and 4
3) I am scum, he is town: then we go back to my point that I have very few partners, and we can argue why I'm not with somebody else!

4) We are both scum: in this world, I have a few directions. I can hammer Dany one of the two times. This looks good for me, and I have an excuse to night kill Oka as he's obviously not with Dany*, the only person vocally pushing me. I chose not to do that, twice. Okay. Now Dany has a good reason to take me out of his scum list if we are partners distancing! "Well Eddie had literally no reason to not hammer me" is virtually the only line he needs. Oh look, my key to town read him as well! If any scum team is decent in this gamestate they'll be aligning because there's so few consensus reads due to the general lack of interest and effort. There is no benefit to him voting me as scum, and I will outline why in easy to read bullet points
- Oka had to pry the vote out of him after asking many times. He gets no credit from this if I flip red.
- He has been posting elsewhere on site during this game, clearly showing his interest in the game is low. If he is scum who is bussing me, that means he wants to live to end game, because he is pretty widely scum read before it and would need to contribute. Except, he clearly is not prioritizing the game, so this is incongruent. I would not be allowed to instruct him to fake this in the scum PT, so this line can't be a play. Ellitell.
- If I am lynched, I am confirmed scum in this world. This makes Oka almost confirmed town. This removes Oka as a mislynch, which sure is a great option because both PRs and a probably town Penguin are pushing him. If he pushes on Luna, then he has to push a busser world, incriminating him as well. And, it means both PRs lose their scum read, which means they are likely to push

and check

elsewhere. Unless the team is precisely me + Dany + comical/RCE, it does not work.
- His bad play has led to him being widely scum read... much more widely than me. Which, again, makes him bussing pointless. No credit.

The gamestate does not make sense for us to be partners. That is a fact. Again, this is the person in the game I think is the least likely to be my partner. If you do not understand nor agree we are not partners after this post, you are either scum or you are too tunnelled and I am not interested in discussing this further.


*oka dany is not actually impossible but oka eddie dany is so its fine for the purpose of analogy

[Eddie Cane]

For those who don't know me, I play mafia largely because I feel like it makes me smarter, and for practice with psychoanalysis. These kinds of logical wifom analysis stuff are my favorite part of the game, so keep 'em coming.

Eddie, do you think Oka was fakeclaiming?

Don't remember a claim unless you mean his memey doc claim in response to my memey cop claim. The site is lagging too bad for me to search atm.

If we are TT, you officially played a .9/10 game, even worse than my 1/10

How so? Why is wanting you lynched for bad play <1/10?

Do you really need to ask this question?

I'm dumb; I'm not really seeing why Oka's play this game has been <1/10. So, please explain

Its in snark about people like SS and you having the reaction to my now-more-serious posting to engage, whereas he is just on the same hill. I'm not serious

[Something_Smart]

"Well Eddie had literally no reason to not hammer me" is virtually the only line he needs.

If his only goal is to avoid being put in a position where he needs to vote you, yes.

But what do you think happens if Dany says "no, I won't vote Eddie" and then Oka can't find enough people to wagon you? Who do you think dies then? Almost certainly Dany.

And who looks VERY partnered with him? You.

Your reasoning might be "level 5" or whatever but this specific assumption-- that Dany as your partner would necessarily be townreading you just because he was given an opportunity to-- is level 0.

[OkaPoka]

so basically its up to dannflor's replacement and auro to decide the viability of this wagon, otherwise im moving back to idany

[Auro]

Don't remember a claim unless you mean his memey doc claim in response to my memey cop claim. The site is lagging too bad for me to search atm.

Your cop claim was obviously a joke, but there's no reason to believe Oka's claim

has

to be false.
It's interesting that you evaluated his claim as a meme, since I was reading his posting as serious.

[Eddie Cane]

2121 is more wifom than anything I've posted, and I'm done arguing an obvious point. I will boil it down to two true points that are actual wifom, unlike my previous posts.

- I am good at reading gamestates and scumplay in general. If I am with Dany, myself, his predecessor, and him have played terrible this whole game regarding each other. You reconcile this how you want to.
- I am willing to bet you can not, in all of mafiascum history, quote me one instance of scum adamantly defending being partnered with their partner. So regardless of any of my points, I'm not with Dany.

You are voting me and you can continue being wrong or scum, or you can actually evaluate my posts and/or go down other ones.