Newbie 2003: Earth [game over!]

[Maduisha]

I think I already explained why Midway is town for me right now, he's like too scummy to be scum. Like, he doesn't care about looking town even after having a 3-man wagon on himself and admitted to contradict himself without giving a fuck lol.

[DkKoba]

So can you tell me what you find townmotivated about midway? I see more scum motivation in his posts. Primarily did not like where he was apologetic about "fluff posting". Now, fluff posting tends to be a scum trait for newer players when they are afraid of not contributing enough and being called out on doing nothing. (well they are still doing nothing but you get the point.) So can you direct me to the reasoning that makes you think he is town?

[DkKoba]

Being 'too scummy to be scum" isn't a real reason to me. Sometimes its just that obvious.

[votato]

maduisha, why arent you voting anyone? you dont think anyone has done anything scummy? you disagree with all the arguments everyone else has made? I could see a maduisha midway scumpair here actually. please give me your top 2 scumreads maduisha, with reasoning about why.

can we please get momentum going on this wagon?

[DkKoba]

also, random re:joqiza saying im less aggressive than in games ive played with him: I learned quickly that this site's meta discourages that so I've toned it down but I still have emotional outbursts when something gets me going lol

[Ydrasse]

Hm, I guess I'm a "reverse Midway" slot for you in the sense that I do things you can agree with, but behavior behind it feels scummy. Well, fair enough, I can't address subjective reads so I understand you have to vote a slot that you don't think you can trust.

I insist my explanation of the wagon being useful doesn't detract from the usefulness of the wagon at all because of what I already said. The reasons to vote me and the reasons not to vote me exist regardless of anything I said. This means people will have reasons to join, leave it, or avoid it no matter how much I talk about it. Even refusing to communicate a read is communication, if you get what I mean. For example, Midway has joined the wagon a bit late even though he had been saying he scumreads me lightly for a couple of pages. The fact that he did not start the wagon himself at all is information. The fact that he did not counterwagon my wagon on him is also information. I am more inclined to believe Midway is town after seeing how he interacted with my wagon. Do you see what I mean? I don't think we should confuse lynch wagons for a reaction test: what I'm looking for is logic behind a push and the timing of said logic being reasonable within the slot's behavior until now, not just to see if people vote or not. And if I get policy lynched for being controversial, then we gather evidence from the way people joined a wagon, specially if they had a bigger scumread and still decided to capitalize on me.

As to why didn't I go after someone that isn't Midway immediately: I already replied Joqiza about it, but it's also in great part that I have a wagon on me and I want to see interactions with it.

okay, you have a wagon on you. good, we can see this. we can see interactions on it.

you have to understand how it makes you look though to just sit back and say. "yep, gonna wait for people to interact and vote on this instead of trying to actively find scum myself and instead let them come out of the woodwork." right? like. you can analyze the wagon on you all you want, more power to you, but you need to also be doing some of your own legwork in this situation. it's frustrating to not have any real push from you and instead spend most of the game focusing on a slot and then poof, nothing, no vote, just gonna hang out on the off chance someone does something that i can point out.

[Maduisha]

I'm sorry to disappoint you, DK, but I actually I'm going with that. I think I needed to stop my hard tunnel and consider the likeness of his play being fabricated vs actually having a personality that gives 0 fucks about appearances when playing town and that's what I'm running with.

He said he wasn't going to reveal his scumreads until he saw more about other slots and then revealed them anyway the first time someone asked him about it. Like... what? It's a glaring contradiction, but I don't see alignment indicative purpose for it, he just did it because he was impatient and angry at my push.

[votato]

Hm, I guess I'm a "reverse Midway" slot for you in the sense that I do things you can agree with, but behavior behind it feels scummy. Well, fair enough, I can't address subjective reads so I understand you have to vote a slot that you don't think you can trust.

I insist my explanation of the wagon being useful doesn't detract from the usefulness of the wagon at all because of what I already said. The reasons to vote me and the reasons not to vote me exist regardless of anything I said. This means people will have reasons to join, leave it, or avoid it no matter how much I talk about it. Even refusing to communicate a read is communication, if you get what I mean. For example, Midway has joined the wagon a bit late even though he had been saying he scumreads me lightly for a couple of pages. The fact that he did not start the wagon himself at all is information. The fact that he did not counterwagon my wagon on him is also information. I am more inclined to believe Midway is town after seeing how he interacted with my wagon. Do you see what I mean? I don't think we should confuse lynch wagons for a reaction test: what I'm looking for is logic behind a push and the timing of said logic being reasonable within the slot's behavior until now, not just to see if people vote or not. And if I get policy lynched for being controversial, then we gather evidence from the way people joined a wagon, specially if they had a bigger scumread and still decided to capitalize on me.

As to why didn't I go after someone that isn't Midway immediately: I already replied Joqiza about it, but it's also in great part that I have a wagon on me and I want to see interactions with it.

okay, you have a wagon on you. good, we can see this. we can see interactions on it.

you have to understand how it makes you look though to just sit back and say. "yep, gonna wait for people to interact and vote on this instead of trying to actively find scum myself and instead let them come out of the woodwork." right? like. you can analyze the wagon on you all you want, more power to you, but you need to also be doing some of your own legwork in this situation. it's frustrating to not have any real push from you and instead spend most of the game focusing on a slot and then poof, nothing, no vote, just gonna hang out on the off chance someone does something that i can point out.

i just want to note that you completely sheeped my argument from two posts above. interesting.

[Maduisha]

maduisha, why arent you voting anyone? you dont think anyone has done anything scummy? you disagree with all the arguments everyone else has made? I could see a maduisha midway scumpair here actually. please give me your top 2 scumreads maduisha, with reasoning about why.

can we please get momentum going on this wagon?

I already explained this like thrice? Please read the thread, I'm getting exhausted by you doing this so much.

[Ydrasse]

Hm, I guess I'm a "reverse Midway" slot for you in the sense that I do things you can agree with, but behavior behind it feels scummy. Well, fair enough, I can't address subjective reads so I understand you have to vote a slot that you don't think you can trust.

I insist my explanation of the wagon being useful doesn't detract from the usefulness of the wagon at all because of what I already said. The reasons to vote me and the reasons not to vote me exist regardless of anything I said. This means people will have reasons to join, leave it, or avoid it no matter how much I talk about it. Even refusing to communicate a read is communication, if you get what I mean. For example, Midway has joined the wagon a bit late even though he had been saying he scumreads me lightly for a couple of pages. The fact that he did not start the wagon himself at all is information. The fact that he did not counterwagon my wagon on him is also information. I am more inclined to believe Midway is town after seeing how he interacted with my wagon. Do you see what I mean? I don't think we should confuse lynch wagons for a reaction test: what I'm looking for is logic behind a push and the timing of said logic being reasonable within the slot's behavior until now, not just to see if people vote or not. And if I get policy lynched for being controversial, then we gather evidence from the way people joined a wagon, specially if they had a bigger scumread and still decided to capitalize on me.

As to why didn't I go after someone that isn't Midway immediately: I already replied Joqiza about it, but it's also in great part that I have a wagon on me and I want to see interactions with it.

okay, you have a wagon on you. good, we can see this. we can see interactions on it.

you have to understand how it makes you look though to just sit back and say. "yep, gonna wait for people to interact and vote on this instead of trying to actively find scum myself and instead let them come out of the woodwork." right? like. you can analyze the wagon on you all you want, more power to you, but you need to also be doing some of your own legwork in this situation. it's frustrating to not have any real push from you and instead spend most of the game focusing on a slot and then poof, nothing, no vote, just gonna hang out on the off chance someone does something that i can point out.

i just want to note that you completely sheeped my argument from two posts above. interesting.

i've been talking about this since 387. i don't think it's a particularly uncommon theme to want to see someone actually have a scumread/push.

[DkKoba]

*sigh* VOTE: Maduisha
please be cooperative.

[DkKoba]

L-1

[votato]

"And about why didn't I jump into a different wagon after dropping Midway's: As you might have already seen, I've been tunneling him mostly. My attention in his slot means I haven't watched others as carefully. The other player in my radar was Apogee, but he wasn't posting much at the moment, so I'm not going to suddenly case him without a more tangible vibe, even if I'm getting gut pings, because that's shitpushing and I can't expect him to defend in a reasonable manner if I have no argument, and I can't expect anyone to support me either for the same reason. I hope that makes sense." - 459

"I don't have a firm scum read yet, but I'm leaning scum on Midway, ye. Also watching Apogee ever since he made that purposely non commital push, but his content feels null for now. And I don't know if Midway looks like low hanging fruit and I'm looking scummy for trying to dig into his slot, but I honestly don't care. If I don't explore the things that ping me "because it might look bad" I might as well not post." - 298

thats all you said. you didnt really provide any scumreads. you've backtracked on midway, and now you're not willing to commit to anything else. my vote is staying right here on you until you at least make an attempt to find scum. there are lots of good candidates out there. I dont even care if your reasoning is bad at first. just take a stand on someone. place a vote. do something.

[Maduisha]

Hm, I guess I'm a "reverse Midway" slot for you in the sense that I do things you can agree with, but behavior behind it feels scummy. Well, fair enough, I can't address subjective reads so I understand you have to vote a slot that you don't think you can trust.

I insist my explanation of the wagon being useful doesn't detract from the usefulness of the wagon at all because of what I already said. The reasons to vote me and the reasons not to vote me exist regardless of anything I said. This means people will have reasons to join, leave it, or avoid it no matter how much I talk about it. Even refusing to communicate a read is communication, if you get what I mean. For example, Midway has joined the wagon a bit late even though he had been saying he scumreads me lightly for a couple of pages. The fact that he did not start the wagon himself at all is information. The fact that he did not counterwagon my wagon on him is also information. I am more inclined to believe Midway is town after seeing how he interacted with my wagon. Do you see what I mean? I don't think we should confuse lynch wagons for a reaction test: what I'm looking for is logic behind a push and the timing of said logic being reasonable within the slot's behavior until now, not just to see if people vote or not. And if I get policy lynched for being controversial, then we gather evidence from the way people joined a wagon, specially if they had a bigger scumread and still decided to capitalize on me.

As to why didn't I go after someone that isn't Midway immediately: I already replied Joqiza about it, but it's also in great part that I have a wagon on me and I want to see interactions with it.

okay, you have a wagon on you. good, we can see this. we can see interactions on it.

you have to understand how it makes you look though to just sit back and say. "yep, gonna wait for people to interact and vote on this instead of trying to actively find scum myself and instead let them come out of the woodwork." right? like. you can analyze the wagon on you all you want, more power to you, but you need to also be doing some of your own legwork in this situation. it's frustrating to not have any real push from you and instead spend most of the game focusing on a slot and then poof, nothing, no vote, just gonna hang out on the off chance someone does something that i can point out.

I will repeat myself again... I'm not going to push people to fill a town quota! I don't have a requirement to scumread people immediately after the slot I thought was scummy towntells a bit. Just because I don't have anything going against anyone currently doesn't mean I'm not trying to find scum. I'm getting tired of "if you're not pursuing a slot then you are scummy" logic. Then why don't you go after Clemency? He posted afk shit, pushed DK, backtracked and townread him and called it a day and hasn't come back ever since. Ahh, because not pushing anyone is actually not AI and you just want people to trust my wagon or...?

Speaking about contributions, you have a relatively small post count, so I'm guessing you have a lot of thoughts that haven't made it to posts, yes? Can you give a read list or do you not have a fleshed out one yet? If okay if you don't, but I want to see where you're at.

[DkKoba]

again: maduisha is at L-1 please take note before a lolhammer occurs.

[votato]

you dont have to lead the push. but you havent even said that you agree with any wagons or see anything scummy in anything anyone has done.

[Ydrasse]

Hm, I guess I'm a "reverse Midway" slot for you in the sense that I do things you can agree with, but behavior behind it feels scummy. Well, fair enough, I can't address subjective reads so I understand you have to vote a slot that you don't think you can trust.

I insist my explanation of the wagon being useful doesn't detract from the usefulness of the wagon at all because of what I already said. The reasons to vote me and the reasons not to vote me exist regardless of anything I said. This means people will have reasons to join, leave it, or avoid it no matter how much I talk about it. Even refusing to communicate a read is communication, if you get what I mean. For example, Midway has joined the wagon a bit late even though he had been saying he scumreads me lightly for a couple of pages. The fact that he did not start the wagon himself at all is information. The fact that he did not counterwagon my wagon on him is also information. I am more inclined to believe Midway is town after seeing how he interacted with my wagon. Do you see what I mean? I don't think we should confuse lynch wagons for a reaction test: what I'm looking for is logic behind a push and the timing of said logic being reasonable within the slot's behavior until now, not just to see if people vote or not. And if I get policy lynched for being controversial, then we gather evidence from the way people joined a wagon, specially if they had a bigger scumread and still decided to capitalize on me.

As to why didn't I go after someone that isn't Midway immediately: I already replied Joqiza about it, but it's also in great part that I have a wagon on me and I want to see interactions with it.

okay, you have a wagon on you. good, we can see this. we can see interactions on it.

you have to understand how it makes you look though to just sit back and say. "yep, gonna wait for people to interact and vote on this instead of trying to actively find scum myself and instead let them come out of the woodwork." right? like. you can analyze the wagon on you all you want, more power to you, but you need to also be doing some of your own legwork in this situation. it's frustrating to not have any real push from you and instead spend most of the game focusing on a slot and then poof, nothing, no vote, just gonna hang out on the off chance someone does something that i can point out.

I will repeat myself again... I'm not going to push people to fill a town quota! I don't have a requirement to scumread people immediately after the slot I thought was scummy towntells a bit. Just because I don't have anything going against anyone currently doesn't mean I'm not trying to find scum. I'm getting tired of "if you're not pursuing a slot then you are scummy" logic. Then why don't you go after Clemency? He posted afk shit, pushed DK, backtracked and townread him and called it a day and hasn't come back ever since. Ahh, because not pushing anyone is actually not AI and you just want people to trust my wagon or...?

Speaking about contributions, you have a relatively small post count, so I'm guessing you have a lot of thoughts that haven't made it to posts, yes? Can you give a read list or do you not have a fleshed out one yet? If okay if you don't, but I want to see where you're at.

why are you getting so defensive right now, and trying to turn attention onto someone else? i'm focusing on you right now, not clemency. as i've said before i thought throughout the game your tone and posts have sounded relatively scripted and it's not gotten any better.

i've already made as much clear about who i find most suspicious: you. and enomis, given the fact i was going after him earlier. i am voting you and have been as you have been my biggest scumread and you've done little to change that.

[Maduisha]

I don't get why do I have to commit or magically scumread someone after I have dropped my current train of thought just a bit ago to get a different perspective but alright.

L-1 is cool with me, do you guys want me to claim? Although I think it's easy to see what my role is without me having to say anything, anyway, so it's kind of pointless.

[Maduisha]

I said I was watching Apogee before, but I feel much better about his slot after his conversation with Joqiza, what can I say.

[votato]

yeah, we know you're a mafia goon.

[votato]

let me ask you this maduisha: are you scum?

[Maduisha]

Hm, I guess I'm a "reverse Midway" slot for you in the sense that I do things you can agree with, but behavior behind it feels scummy. Well, fair enough, I can't address subjective reads so I understand you have to vote a slot that you don't think you can trust.

I insist my explanation of the wagon being useful doesn't detract from the usefulness of the wagon at all because of what I already said. The reasons to vote me and the reasons not to vote me exist regardless of anything I said. This means people will have reasons to join, leave it, or avoid it no matter how much I talk about it. Even refusing to communicate a read is communication, if you get what I mean. For example, Midway has joined the wagon a bit late even though he had been saying he scumreads me lightly for a couple of pages. The fact that he did not start the wagon himself at all is information. The fact that he did not counterwagon my wagon on him is also information. I am more inclined to believe Midway is town after seeing how he interacted with my wagon. Do you see what I mean? I don't think we should confuse lynch wagons for a reaction test: what I'm looking for is logic behind a push and the timing of said logic being reasonable within the slot's behavior until now, not just to see if people vote or not. And if I get policy lynched for being controversial, then we gather evidence from the way people joined a wagon, specially if they had a bigger scumread and still decided to capitalize on me.

As to why didn't I go after someone that isn't Midway immediately: I already replied Joqiza about it, but it's also in great part that I have a wagon on me and I want to see interactions with it.

okay, you have a wagon on you. good, we can see this. we can see interactions on it.

you have to understand how it makes you look though to just sit back and say. "yep, gonna wait for people to interact and vote on this instead of trying to actively find scum myself and instead let them come out of the woodwork." right? like. you can analyze the wagon on you all you want, more power to you, but you need to also be doing some of your own legwork in this situation. it's frustrating to not have any real push from you and instead spend most of the game focusing on a slot and then poof, nothing, no vote, just gonna hang out on the off chance someone does something that i can point out.

I will repeat myself again... I'm not going to push people to fill a town quota! I don't have a requirement to scumread people immediately after the slot I thought was scummy towntells a bit. Just because I don't have anything going against anyone currently doesn't mean I'm not trying to find scum. I'm getting tired of "if you're not pursuing a slot then you are scummy" logic. Then why don't you go after Clemency? He posted afk shit, pushed DK, backtracked and townread him and called it a day and hasn't come back ever since. Ahh, because not pushing anyone is actually not AI and you just want people to trust my wagon or...?

Speaking about contributions, you have a relatively small post count, so I'm guessing you have a lot of thoughts that haven't made it to posts, yes? Can you give a read list or do you not have a fleshed out one yet? If okay if you don't, but I want to see where you're at.

why are you getting so defensive right now, and trying to turn attention onto someone else? i'm focusing on you right now, not clemency. as i've said before i thought throughout the game your tone and posts have sounded relatively scripted and it's not gotten any better.

i've already made as much clear about who i find most suspicious: you. and enomis, given the fact i was going after him earlier. i am voting you and have been as you have been my biggest scumread and you've done little to change that.

Why am I defensive one word: frustration.

Tell me you're not going to disregard my posts D2 if I make it. I'd rather get over it already. Also I asked for a read list, what are your townreads? I wanted to know more of what you think, not just what you find scummy.

[DkKoba]

u are frustrating me because ur AtE makes me want to townread u but I am ignoring that bc your actions are not town in this instance where you are just insisting on flopping over and not helping town. I put you at L-1 so you would contribute, not so you would claim and ask to get lynched.

[Maduisha]

I'm not scum, I'm just tired of scum mindset flying everywhere in this game and suddenly not having a scumread like if it was cooking instant noodles is claiming scum.

I'm so done with this game if that's the case. I will not self hammer because that destroys the last piece of evidence, but honestly... meh.

[DkKoba]

stop AtEing and start giving us logic.