Newbie 2004: Trash Panada Hour. Redux! GAME OVER

[Dunnstral]

...! This doesn't make sense for her to think as town

It's almost as if I was *gasp* viewing it from your perspective!

You know, like I very plainly was.

Why would you be considering my town point of view if you insist that I must be lying because you're counterclaiming me?

[Dunnstral]

I don't remember there being pressure on me. One, maybe two people angled suspicion toward me?

I wanted him to claim at L-1. You didn't. You tell me who looks worse for that.

Denial isn't a good look

[Blair]

...! This doesn't make sense for her to think as town

It's almost as if I was *gasp* viewing it from your perspective!

You know, like I very plainly was.

Why would you be considering my town point of view if you insist that I must be lying because you're counterclaiming me?

Because it's part of my job as town to get *other people* to vote for you, too. Which is why it was important to demonstrate that town!Dunnstral wouldn't make sense here.

This interpretation was extremely obvious, you're being deliberately obtuse.

[Blair]

Note: If there is a Cop or Mason present, you know Dunnstral is lying.

Friendly Neighbor also knows he's lying. (Because if you're a Friendly Neighbor then there must also be a Jailkeeper due to N1)

The only setup where Dunnstral isn't confirmed scum is C2. In every other instance, someone knows 100% that he's lying.

So don't let a lynch go through until every single player has responded to Dunnstral's claim with whether the believe it or not.

[Dunnstral]

The only setup where Dunnstral isn't confirmed scum is C2.

Uh... what, there isn't even a tracker in that setup

[Blair]

You'd still be confirmed scum to me, silly, but there isn't a power role in that setup that can know for sure that you're lying.

[Blair]

In every other setup there is either a real tracker who is about to counterclaim you or a role that can't exist with tracker.

[Dunnstral]

I'm not going to get counterclaimed.

[Blair]

Dunnstral has reached for low hanging fruit in my posts repeatedly on this page, by the way. He's deliberately misinterpreting my posts. Take note!

[Blair]

I'm not going to get counterclaimed.

I'm pretty sure we are not in C2 so enjoy sweating this one out.

[Blair]

(Well, actually, we could be in C2 and if we are scum knows we are because it's the only Goon/Goon setup where N1 makes any sense)

Smart claim if that's the case. *tips hat*

[Blair]

Now that I'm realizing that, this is interesting:

My slot targeted Formerfish night 1 - Received no result (implying a roleblocker or jailkeeper -> there has to be a jailkeeper because someone stopped a kill and it wasn't me)

It never occurred to Dunnstral that there could be a Doctor in the setup, because it never occurred to him that we could be in B3.

Because he's known we weren't in that column since Day 2.

[Blair]

Well, Day 1 actually.

He's known we were in C2 since Day 2.

[Dunnstral]

There is a jailkeeper soft in thread that aligns with my current reads.

If I were mafia I would have killed that over bbmolla. Just saying.

Should I out the soft? Asking non-blair players.

[Blair]

Genuine scumslips are so rare nowadays - this is exciting!

[Blair]

There is a jailkeeper soft in thread that aligns with my current reads.

It's fascinating how you bring this up now, when I've proven you knew more than you should about the setup.

Especially since I asked you just a few posts ago how you were *sure* Gibus wasn't the Jailkeeper and you didn't mention this at all.

[Dunnstral]

Nah I only realized it when I took a closer look at your roleblock target; you've been pr hunting it seems; Blair probably roleblocked the JK last night; she has an inkling on who it is already. Reminder that mafia rb takes precedence over town jailkeeper

I looked deeper into the iso of the predecessor of the player she roleblocked:

We aren't lynching Freddie. That was so clearly not scum play.

Freddie's play clearly came from noobtown. The timing of the claim does not come from scum. She was obviously confused after your role fishing.
Also, what have you learned from your gambit? You said you'd have the game solved, but here you are going for blood on an obvtown slot.
Doc/jk should probably breadcrumb their target from last night in case they die.

There could be a jailkeeper who locked up either the target or the mafia executing the kill

It looks to me that

Alartom

is the

Jailkeeper

and he jailkept

Blair

on night 1.

Remember how there was no night kill on night 1? That means that Blair was either the target of the kill, or the one doing the killing; do you guys really think a claimed vt slot that was flailing and under pressure would be targeted for the kill?

Here's more softing:

I'm not so much for a Blair/Freddie hook today.

Notice the use of the word 'hook', aka hooker, aka a roleblocker

Alartom

, you're making a big mistake by not pushing

Blair

here - it should be

pretty clear

that she's scum from your point of view.

As for me outting my thoughts here:

scum already know

, as evidenced by Blair's targetting. You're better off outting today and claiming who you're going to jailkeep the next day. Blair is the roleblocker - lynch her and we've got tracker + jailkeeper - you announce your target, I'll check someone else, maf has to kill me, you've got a clear, then you can do that 1 more time for a 2nd clear, I think it turns into auto win if I can convince you to move to Blair today.

[Dunnstral]

Now that I'm realizing that, this is interesting:

My slot targeted Formerfish night 1 - Received no result (implying a roleblocker or jailkeeper -> there has to be a jailkeeper because someone stopped a kill and it wasn't me)

It never occurred to Dunnstral that there could be a Doctor in the setup, because it never occurred to him that we could be in B3.

Because he's known we weren't in that column since Day 2.

I was roleblocked. There's no roleblocker in B3, from town or mafia. Ergo, we can't be in B3.

[Dunnstral]

+For clarification, if anyone is still confused:

Receiving 'no result' is different from getting a message saying 'your target didn't go anywhere'. It means my action failed. That + nobody dying at night + my own role told me what setup we are in

[Dunnstral]

I'm not going to get counterclaimed.

I'm pretty sure we are not in C2 so enjoy sweating this one out.

How can you be 'pretty sure' of that, anyway? You're claiming vt!

[Dunnstral]

Every living player has posted after I claimed, by the way.

[Nauci]

It's 3 something AM, going to bed at a normal time failed miserably, and now I'm going to solve the game just after getting up from a nap let's do this bitch

If isn't Battle Mage it's Alortom.

wait what the fuck

I feel like Mr Cellophane because no one engages my cases for why Alortom is definitely town unless I point it out to them like 6x

Notice something really important, by the way:

In Dunnstral's claim, he leaves the door open for me to possibly be the Jailkeeper - even though he is now arguing that there is a 0% chance that anyone would ever believe that (wouldn't that implicitly include him?)

He was hedging his bets just in case I really was.

Maybe because I just woke up but like I don't understand what you're trying to say here? Like, yeah, if he got a result on you and it's possible that you could have been the JK and you'd have to claim that and not get counter claimed and that's like just how the setup works whether he's real claiming or fake claiming and I don't understand how this is what you're pitching as AI?

Scum pair is Dunnstral and Battle Mage, they came into MYLO with an agenda they are pushing hard. Do not lynch Blair. If isn't Battle Mage it's Alortom.

If you believe scum came into MYLO with an agenda for this exact scenario... wouldn't it make sense for Nauci to be a potential partner, too?

It's like the whole thing was scripted. Dunn comes in crying about how we're about to lynch him when only Nauci was suggesting that. Almost like the plan was for her to hard bus him out the gate so he could claim "under pressure." They either win by mislynching me today or Nauci wins by virtue of their hard distancing in the next phase.

This is a ridiculous level of paranoia. I'm the only person who has been trying to get the Lilith/Dunn slot examined closely and/or lynched since the beginning of Day 2 while most people were letting it coast

I have no idea why he claimed so fucking early and I am extremely skeptical of it but like... literally YOU of all people know EXACTLY why I think the quickhammer meant he was basically confscum to me

Scum pair is Dunnstral and Battle Mage, they came into MYLO with an agenda they are pushing hard. Do not lynch Blair. If isn't Battle Mage it's Alortom.

Take a moment to think this through. Look at blair's arguments.

Yeah that's why I need to sleep and think. I feel the only thing my last few posts about you and Blair scum has mad clear is that I'm dumb. I plan to clear those other two things up tomorrow.

So many of your posts since the middle of Day 2 has been "I don't know what's going on at all"

Either post some substance or, actually, that's the only option I'm giving you. Post something of substance and not "I'll figure it out later"

I also think the NK is to set me up. BBMolla wanted Me and Dunnstral killed. So why did BM come hard targeting just me and ignoring Durnn? Because the play was for mass claim, I claim VT and Drunn fake claims and they power lynch me for the win.

I spoke too early. This is... an interesting theory? Except like... Dunnstral wasn't and isn't trying to lynch YOU, so... where does that leave it?

Fair, that might be the cleaner play.

I would think they would want to out power roles and hard distance for LyLo. Depends on the players involved, though.

I've not spent enough time doing setup game theory to know why it would be better to wait until LYLO? Why wouldn't scum want to do this now, so that the PR doesn't survive to LYLO?

The fact that Dunn outright states he was gunning for me to claim before him and BM had already moved me up the list is interesting.

Interesting how? Isn't that NAI? Like, if Dunn isn't lying, that's exactly the order he'd want to catch you in a lie? A maneuver that you yourself are absolutely expert at? And BM would do that as scum but would also do that as town who scumreads you?

If we're not massclaiming, I don't think it's helpful for me to share any further opinions today, and we can simply proceed to No Lynch. I think I have a good idea who the scumpair is.

Seriously though, wasting the opportunity to put scum on the backfoot and try and get some conf-towns ahead of LyLo (when we will presumably just get contested claims and may be unable to use any of the PR info, or our PR may just be dead) is incredibly lame. I'm disappointed in up to 60% of you.

How does this post even get made after what Dunnstral claimed

At this point we should probably not No Lynch, however, because we now know we have caught scum between Dunnstral and myself. Our odds of getting it right are higher when there are more living townies.

Won't this be a funny post if Dunn/Blair turned out to be the scum duo

[Nauci]

It's also why Nauci is wasting her time going through dozens of my games looking for a quick hammer

He essentially already claimed. Deadline was approaching. I made the correct play - I didn't want to get into an argument and maybe have to claim my role before I could get a result

While this is a mildly plausible reason for the quickhammer, I've yet to find an instance of you doing this, but multiple instances of you panick hammering when the lynch was between you or your scum teammate and a town player

Tracking isn't "caught scum." You yourself admitted I could be JK and you would unvote if I was.

Who's reaching now?

I mean, it kinda is when Freddie had claimed VT and you're smart enough to know that soooooooo

I don't remember there being pressure on me. One, maybe two people angled suspicion toward me?

I wanted him to claim at L-1. You didn't. You tell me who looks worse for that.

2 People voting you with a case isn't pressure in a game with 8 players?

Note: If there is a Cop or Mason present, you know Dunnstral is lying.

Note: If there is a Cop or Mason present, you know Dunnstral is lying.

Friendly Neighbor also knows he's lying. (Because if you're a Friendly Neighbor then there must also be a Jailkeeper due to N1)

The only setup where Dunnstral isn't confirmed scum is C2. In every other instance, someone knows 100% that he's lying.

So don't let a lynch go through until every single player has responded to Dunnstral's claim with whether the believe it or not.

You'd still be confirmed scum to me, silly, but there isn't a power role in that setup that can know for sure that you're lying.

In every other setup there is either a real tracker who is about to counterclaim you or a role that can't exist with tracker.

I'm not going to get counterclaimed.

I'm pretty sure we are not in C2 so enjoy sweating this one out.

(Well, actually, we could be in C2 and if we are scum knows we are because it's the only Goon/Goon setup where N1 makes any sense)

Smart claim if that's the case. *tips hat*

Now that I'm realizing that, this is interesting:

My slot targeted Formerfish night 1 - Received no result (implying a roleblocker or jailkeeper -> there has to be a jailkeeper because someone stopped a kill and it wasn't me)

It never occurred to Dunnstral that there could be a Doctor in the setup, because it never occurred to him that we could be in B3.

Because he's known we weren't in that column since Day 2.

WTH? He said he got No Result on N1 and no setups with doctors have role blockers of any type.

Well, Day 1 actually.

He's known we were in C2 since Day 2.

There is a jailkeeper soft in thread that aligns with my current reads.

It's fascinating how you bring this up now, when I've proven you knew more than you should about the setup.

Especially since I asked you just a few posts ago how you were *sure* Gibus wasn't the Jailkeeper and you didn't mention this at all.

There is literally 0 fucking way that I would believe that Blair did not make these realizations about what the setup possibilities are AND WHAT SCUM WOULD ALREADY KNOW until the above set of posts. NONE. Blair, you're one of the best Mafia players I've seen on this site, ever, and you are a master of utilizing TPR powers to catch scum out in lies, and this diatribe of bumbling IIOA "oh I just realized this obvious thing" is completely beyond belief coming from you. Blair literally has a recently completed newbie game from April and this isn't even her main account.

Nah I only realized it when I took a closer look at your roleblock target; you've been pr hunting it seems; Blair probably roleblocked the JK last night; she has an inkling on who it is already. Reminder that mafia rb takes precedence over town jailkeeper

I looked deeper into the iso of the predecessor of the player she roleblocked:

We aren't lynching Freddie. That was so clearly not scum play.

Freddie's play clearly came from noobtown. The timing of the claim does not come from scum. She was obviously confused after your role fishing.
Also, what have you learned from your gambit? You said you'd have the game solved, but here you are going for blood on an obvtown slot.
Doc/jk should probably breadcrumb their target from last night in case they die.

There could be a jailkeeper who locked up either the target or the mafia executing the kill

It looks to me that

Alartom

is the

Jailkeeper

and he jailkept

Blair

on night 1.

Remember how there was no night kill on night 1? That means that Blair was either the target of the kill, or the one doing the killing; do you guys really think a claimed vt slot that was flailing and under pressure would be targeted for the kill?

Here's more softing:

I'm not so much for a Blair/Freddie hook today.

Notice the use of the word 'hook', aka hooker, aka a roleblocker

Alartom

, you're making a big mistake by not pushing

Blair

here - it should be

pretty clear

that she's scum from your point of view.

As for me outting my thoughts here:

scum already know

, as evidenced by Blair's targetting. You're better off outting today and claiming who you're going to jailkeep the next day. Blair is the roleblocker - lynch her and we've got tracker + jailkeeper - you announce your target, I'll check someone else, maf has to kill me, you've got a clear, then you can do that 1 more time for a 2nd clear, I think it turns into auto win if I can convince you to move to Blair today.

VOTE: Dunnstral VOTE: Dunnstral VOTE: Dunnstral VOTE: Dunnstral

Fun Game for New Players Time: Spot why the above post is a complete scum fakeclaim giveaway! And then lynch it with me.

Guys, I've solved the game!

Blair, Dunnstral, and Gibus were the players who were most suspected at the end of D2. I am now doubling down on the fact that Blair voted Dunnstral briefly when he only had like 2 votes in order to distance, but very vehemently ran up a wagon on Gibus to get the heat off of both of them. Dunnstral was more widely scumread, so when the momentum to lynch gibus was in danger, he decided to throw himself on that grenade because he thought he'd probably eat rope once Gibus flipped town anyway (multiple players declared this). This is a move that I've seen Dunnstral do multiple times. Seeing my outrage and suspicion for the quickhammer + that I was going to meta-dive him and almost certainly shout for his head today, maybe they bet on a wild scum theater gambit where he claims a guilty on Blair so that players like me who has been reading via associatives a lot would rule out the possibility of scum!blair after Dunnstral flips.

At the very beginning of the day I gave that thought a lot of merit even though it didn't make sense to me that Blair was strongly scumreading Dunn but still wanted to No Lynch, but the last 3 friggin pages of Blair's OH I DIDN'T REALIZE extremely basic principles that have been in the newbie setup for a while. Like, literally one of the core foundations of Newbie games is analysis of the possible setups and figuring out which column or row the game has. Scum always know which column we're in, while town do not.

[Nauci]

Going to Bed Part 3: Plasmic Jamboree

P.S. TPR should NOT claim; scum is caught and no longer needs it

[Dunnstral]

If you think Blair and I are both scum together, why don't you vote Blair instead of me? That way you're not lynching the town pr if you're wrong....

Fun Game for New Players Time: Spot why the above post is a complete scum fakeclaim giveaway! And then lynch it with me.

Whatever reason you think you have is wrong. Or rather, why don't you point to what you're talking about instead of vaguely gesturing