In post 6970, Pyro wrote:A comprehensive guide on why Dunnstral is scum
In post 5799, Dunnstral wrote:I'm an odd-night doctor
Night 1 was skipped
Night 3 I was on Starcrossed
I didn't get any kind of notification that I was redirected
Because of my role I thought that Kidamn's claim was very believable (it was claimed before the rolecop could do anything, too)
I argued against mafia having a doctor, but my own role and the vanilla cop claim made me think the gunsmith claim was more believable as well
Dunny claims odd-night doc in this post, stating that his own role and the vanilla cop claims made the gunsmith claim
more
believable.
I immediately question him on this - a gunsmith is a strong role, and to believe an odd night doc + even night rolestopper exist to create a follow the cop scenario to protect the gunsmith is very dubious. It's so much town power if you account for those 3 roles + the vanilla cop + the vig + the night skip + 2 or 3 masons. It's absolutely ridiculous from a balance standpoint. Remember, people were doubting War and Peace's claim because they thought a gunsmith + just the even night rolestopper may have been too dangerous of a combo, and Dunny has this information about his own role, and it makes him believe the gunsmith
more
, and not less.
There's a very simple explanation for why Dunny didn't think of how this was far, far too much power for town to have - and it's because he's scum with War and Peace.
I immediately question him on this, doubting how he could believe what he did:
In post 5819, Dunnstral wrote: In post 5812, olaf wrote:you thought both protectives with an ungated gunsmith made the gunsmith claim more believable?
you didn't think that was too much power?
also what do you mean the vanilla cop claim made you think the gunsmith was more believable as well?
Vanilla cop carries a gun. i.e. false guilty
Doctor is a role that never has a gun, which is why I thought gunsmith felt believeable (even though I'm town and don't have a gun, it made sense to me that I'd be made to look suspicious for being doctor with a gs in the game)
In post 5820, Dunnstral wrote: In post 5818, olaf wrote: In post 5799, Dunnstral wrote:I argued against mafia having a doctor, but my own role and the vanilla cop claim made me think the gunsmith claim was more believable as well
this makes no sense to me Dunny
you really need to explain why you thought two protectives that can cover all nights made you think the gunsmith was MORE believable and not less
Roleblockers, strongmans. And especially the day vig flipped. I think that was after the claim though, but I was thinking about that
He responds by saying scum could have a roleblocker/strongman. Scum
could
have these things, but even with them, town have far too much power at their disposal. I eventually
pushed out War and Peace using this same logic. I'm very confident that town!Dunny does not see all this power and think it makes sense because scum
could
have certain roles, and because a gunsmith can get a false guilty on a vanilla cop, and a false inno on a doc, and ignore the glaring reasoning about how it creates a follow the cop scenario and how it's far too much power.
This is all before any gunsmith claims:
97 - Dunny votes for WP
379 - WP have 3 votes and Dunny goes to vanity vote Sherlock instead (this is safe because they aren't a realistic wagon by any means right now)
404 - VC
486 - WP have received 2 more votes and are now at 4 with no real counter, Dunny moves back to vote them
535 - VC
657 - VC
770 - Dunny unvotes WP
1961 - WP are his SECOND TOP scumread
I'm not even going to try and assign an exact scum motivation behind this behaviour, but one thing is for sure, it's not natural and normal. Dunny is constantly shifting on and off the War and Peace wagon, and every single one of the votes are naked without any reasoning attached. This is scum!Dunny positioning himself on/off the wagon based on whether he wants to bus, and unvoting when he thinks they have a chance of survival. The thing that makes absolutely no sense with this uncertain behavior, however, is the fact that War and Peace have been a
solid
scumread for Dunny, as evidence by his readlist in the final post. This is scum behaving around a partner getting wagoned.
During day 3, we're finally making this wagon on War and Peace go through. I've been pushing for them all game and we're finally making it happen. Where is Dunny while this happens?
4880 5595 - Dunny clearly still thinks War and Peace are scummy during this time, and has had that opinion for most of the game, but his actions simply do not match his words, and he remains stubbornly voting Toogeloo for the entire phase. This by itself isn't sooo bad, he may just be very confident Toogeloo is scum, however, what is bad is the fact he does not comment on any of the arguments made on War and Peace being scum even
once
.
No mention of how he still thinks their claim makes them town because of him being a doc, no mention that he thinks they might be scum because of this or that... nothing. It's classical scum behaviour around a partner.
4106 - Dunny townreads Sarah
4364 - Dunny townreads Sarah
6177 - Dunny votes for Sarah when she's essentially decided to be the launch
Once again, there's no progression from Dunny townreading Sarah to eventually voting for her. He claims later that he liked the cases put against her in
6303, but again, the fact he doesn't care to comment on the cases
while
they're being made, whether with agreement or disagreement, is incredibly scum-indicative. He's seeing whether the cases against her will stick or not and staying out of it completely. Also, it's funny that the reason we thought Sarah was scum (bad progression on War and Peace - from townreading them to randomly having them in PoE) is the exact same thing Dunny is doing to Sarah here. Pretty good scumtell, huh?
THE WAR THAT KEEPS ON GIVING
In post 5766, olaf wrote:VOTE: Dunnstral
War and Peace's push onto him is really weird if he's town and does them no favours because it was an unpopular push
BUT if he's scum then maybe the logic they were using makes sense to them and they thought it'd make them look towny because they're technically correct
also they get some distancing in
War and Peace's push onto Dunny in
5519 really is strange if Dunny is town. Dunny at that point is close to UTR, and a very unpopular push for scum to make. Does scum!War really opt to push a townie like that who will only make them look worse? Absolutely not. Does scum!War opt to push a
partner
which they can distance from and that they actually believe the reasoning for? Absolutely.
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There were more instances of this but every time Dunny posted something like this, it just felt off and gave me pocketing vibes. I've felt that way towards Dunny all game - something about his tone is off and different from his play in Pooky v Flava. In that game, he was visibly irritated and almost antagonistic, getting
annoyed at Noraa, as well as pichu and Ydrasse for their silly antics. There has been none of that this game, and his tone is night and day.
That concludes things. I want to thank my keyboard for allowing me this amazing opportunity, and I want to thank Dunny for being a good deepwolf for giving us this challenge at the end. Games aren't always fun being townstomps, so I appreciate the work you've put in, my friend.