Micro 1013: IMoA [game over!]

[Datisi]

vote count 1.13

with 9 votes in play, it takes 5 to make a decision. day 1 ends in (expired on 2021-06-01 17:15:00).

execution

Iconeum [2]:

Andresvmb, Moongrass

Moongrass [2]:

ta vera, northsidegal

ta vera [2]:

VFP, Sigmund

VFP [1]:

UneveN

Sigmund [1]:

Iconeum

not voting [1]:

Something_Smart

mod notes

~ iconeum v/la weekends

flavour

Spoiler:

[northsidegal]

I'm having trouble following the thread of this game, that's definitely true. Not totally unhappy with my reads though. (Ta vera and nsg as townreads, Sigmund and Moongrass as townleans.)

again, not trying to harp on moongrass a ton, but why moongrass town? that's the only one here where i find it hard to see the perspective. nullread, maybe—townread, can't really see it personally at the moment.

[Moongrass]

Can you try voting one of your non town reads?

I could, but we still have plenty of time left in the day, and I'm skeptical that pressuring someone will actually make them easier to read.

It would make you easier to read lol.

[Moongrass]

when did you go from VFP at the bottom of your readslist to "i care if i take town with me"? this is a strange thing to say, even in the hypothetical where you're just talking to people as if they're town

I care about misreading people. If he is scum he has just as much reason to want to cover his tracks, that's why I said you need a good reason as town or scum.

[Moongrass]

if i thought someone were just voting me with literally no justification and they outright said they weren't going to give me one, i think that one of my first responses (and most people's first response) would be to make some sort of ruckus about how this is an obvious scum push.

That was in my first retaliation to his push on me, I told him that based on his reasoning he has no good reason to vote me. My later responses were addressing his argument that he doesn't need a reason to vote someone.

[Moongrass]

nsg I know you've worked out who I am, and if that's the case you should know I'm town by now.

If ta vera is scum then I think there's good links to nsg being her buddy.

[northsidegal]

nsg I know you've worked out who I am, and if that's the case you should know I'm town by now.

haven't actually, been a bit busy this week so haven't done as much sleuthing as i'd like. at this point i almost feel more invested in the game itself than in who people are (which i feel like is a rare feeling i should hold onto), but i put a decent amount of stock into self-meta claims similar to this, so i'll get back to it.


as an aside, i know is that this might mean little coming from me when it's something being leveled at me in the first place, but from an objective standpoint i think that post 193 never happens if me and ta vera are partnered. i only bring this up because it's something i sort of made a little note of when she posted it – i just thought to myself "huh, if i saw that interaction take place between two other people they probably would never be scum together".

[northsidegal]

if i thought someone were just voting me with literally no justification and they outright said they weren't going to give me one, i think that one of my first responses (and most people's first response) would be to make some sort of ruckus about how this is an obvious scum push.

That was in my first retaliation to his push on me, I told him that based on his reasoning he has no good reason to vote me. My later responses were addressing his argument that he doesn't need a reason to vote someone.

sorry, i don't really believe you and "i care about misreading people" doesn't really do it for me as a justification.

i find it difficult to look at the progression of someone being at the bottom of your readslist and you voting that person, to that person saying that they're going to vote you with no reason, to you voting someone else entirely, saying that you don't want to mislynch town so you'd really like reasons, and basically walking away from the conversation. i think that even the absolute most charitable players don't really tend to have progressions like that as town.

now, i could be wrong, but again i have to say it just makes it difficult for me to believe that you actually scumread VFP. instead, it seems more likely that you just wanted to disengage and vote for the easier ico wagon, for which support was building.

[Sigmund]

i would say that you overestimate the amount of people in this playerlist who know who i am and how much the scumteam even ought to fear me, but given even sigmund seems to know me perhaps it's more people in the playerlist than i realized. (although that second part still might be overestimated, i am quite rusty.)

I fear no one

[Sigmund]

oh shit scum slip oops

[Sigmund]

now, i could be wrong, but again i have to say it just makes it difficult for me to believe that you actually scumread VFP. instead, it seems more likely that you just wanted to disengage and vote for the easier ico wagon, for which support was building.

yeeeeeeeeeeeeees

[Sigmund]

I will now cover up my scum slip by posting random bullshit.

[Sigmund]

It would make you easier to read lol.

the easiest way to read something smart is to hack him to death with a dull machete and see what the mod says his alignment is

[northsidegal]

i get that you're having fun playing a character on an alt. i've done that myself fairly often. i'd just appreciate if you remembered that, if you're town, there are other people in the game trying to win who in part rely on you cooperating. and, even if you're scum, there's already one person who left this game in an emotional rage from your antics.

i'm not trying to come across as preachy (although i probably am), i just care about winning. i'm hope you can understand that.

[northsidegal]

I think Ta, SS, and Andre is a decent lim pool.

I would replace Andresvmb with Iconeum here. And outside of NorwegianboyEE's exit northsidegal has not felt particularly towny to me but I am willing to trust Sigmund on this matter at this time.

it's an interesting turn of phrase here to say that willing to trust sigmund on the matter. do you mean that you agree with his logic on norwee being town, or that you don't really see it yourself but you're agreeing because you think sigmund is town and trust his judgment? it's possible i'm reading into stuff too much here, but i'm just interested to hear a bit more of your thought process.

is your reason for scumreading ta vera mainly what you brought up in 453?

[UneveN]

I think Ta, SS, and Andre is a decent lim pool.

I would replace Andresvmb with Iconeum here. And outside of NorwegianboyEE's exit northsidegal has not felt particularly towny to me but I am willing to trust Sigmund on this matter at this time.

it's an interesting turn of phrase here to say that willing to trust sigmund on the matter. do you mean that you agree with his logic on norwee being town, or that you don't really see it yourself but you're agreeing because you think sigmund is town and trust his judgment? it's possible i'm reading into stuff too much here, but i'm just interested to hear a bit more of your thought process.

is your reason for scumreading ta vera mainly what you brought up in 453?

I do not really see it myself but I am agreeing because I think Sigmund is town and you are not at the top of my most desirable elimination list. Sigmund has a fire, for lack of a better word, and you can say he is playing a character and so forth but it feels like there is a fire and mafia generally are not particularly good at simulating that.

It is both what I brought up there and that she seemed frustrated that I was being townread in a way that mafia have before. Like the town is 'letting me' skate by through the parts of the game where I 'should' be miselimable and allowing me to potentially reach the part of the game where I can be semi-useful.

[UneveN]

Sigmund has a fire, for lack of a better word, and you can say he is playing a character and so forth but it feels like there is a fire and mafia generally are not particularly good at simulating that.

Though there is still that Something_Smart connection in the back of my mind.

[northsidegal]

It is both what I brought up there and that she seemed frustrated that I was being townread in a way that mafia have before. Like the town is 'letting me' skate by through the parts of the game where I 'should' be miselimable and allowing me to potentially reach the part of the game where I can be semi-useful.

could you point to posts where you think this is happening?

[Moongrass]

193 never happens if me and ta vera are partnered.

Perhaps not, I have pulled similar distancing stunts in the past myself.

[Moongrass]

i find it difficult to look at the progression of someone being at the bottom of your readslist and you voting that person, to that person saying that they're going to vote you with no reason, to you voting someone else entirely, saying that you don't want to mislynch town so you'd really like reasons, and basically walking away from the conversation. i think that even the absolute most charitable players don't really tend to have progressions like that as town.

I guess you could call it a cheeky progression.

[UneveN]

could you point to posts where you think this is happening?

The interactions with Moongrass containing these posts:

not seeing how this is town.

it hardly counts as multiple directions.

It didn't really feel to me like she was really disagreeing with the read or that she thought Moongrass was likely to be mafia because of it just seemed... frustrated by my being townread.

[UneveN]

Also I think 193 is an emulated behaviour for alt reasons but that is not alignment indicative.

[Moongrass]

now, i could be wrong, but again i have to say it just makes it difficult for me to believe that you actually scumread VFP. instead, it seems more likely that you just wanted to disengage and vote for the easier ico wagon, for which support was building.

yeeeeeeeeeeeeees

I'm willing to build any kind of wagon I agree with. I am happy following Sigmund bounce, as you saw earlier I followed him to ta vera also but then changed my mind.

[Sigmund]

i get that you're having fun playing a character on an alt. i've done that myself fairly often. i'd just appreciate if you remembered that, if you're town, there are other people in the game trying to win who in part rely on you cooperating. and, even if you're scum, there's already one person who left this game in an emotional rage from your antics.

i'm not trying to come across as preachy (although i probably am), i just care about winning. i'm hope you can understand that.

pls tell me more

[Sigmund]

mafia generally are not particularly good at simulating that.

if i was mafia my fire would burn 5x as bright as there would be no restraints placed on me