Open 811 - Lovers and Losers (New Game+) [Game Over]

[Bambi Jay]

Ana, vote me too please.

Tbone and VFP, vote Llama then we'll both be at 3.

You'll figure out the scum team when Bingle and Kerset don't instantly hammer. They'll be confirmed town and we win after more debate and we prove Llama is the bad guy.

[yessiree]

VC 2.7

With 8 votes, it takes 5 to eliminate.

LlamaFluff (2)

- Anastasia, Bambi Jay

Bambi Jay (2)

- LlamaFluff, RationalMadman

Note voting - T-Bone, Kerset, Bingle, VFP

Day 2 ends in (expired on 2021-06-02 16:00:00)

[Bambi Jay]

Game is solved since Ration and Ana voted first. Those 2 voting me together will prove the results.

If me Tbone and VFP vote Llama they can't hammer without killing their teammate and being suspicious. Llama already is voting me so their 3 scum votes can't kill me.

Bingle and Kerset already agree I can only be scum with Tbone and VFP, so even if Ana decides to not unvote Llama here and team Tbone votes him to 4 votes neither Bingle or Kerset will hammer, and Ration won't kill his partner.

I'm not in danger of dying since if Ana switches we got all 3 baddies voting me and they won't hammer Llama. So we win when we prove the scumteam can only be Tbone/VFP/Bambi or Ration/Ana/Llama. With Kerset and Bingle as confirmed town to decide it town wins.

Edit: Mod you missed Ration voting me last page.

Fixed, just for you. -Y

[LlamaFluff]

Again... do I really need to make a case on anyone else when Bambi is just asking players to put me in hammer range to "prove they are town" to an extent where this is them betting the game on Bingle/Kerset being town if Bambi was town. Their entire argument is just badly flawed logic on multiple levels, especially after spending all of D1 pretty much just sheeping what others (me) had to say on everything. I think somewhere in that exceedingly convoluted logic though it shows Ana/RM are probably town though.

[Bambi Jay]

My plan doesn't really need your consent in the matter, but thanks for the input. I'll explain it more tommorow when I wake up.

[LlamaFluff]

I would *love* for you to explain how as scum I decide to bus Ana/RM out of nowhere entirely unprompted and then decide to completely flip that on SS.

[RationalMadman]

Ah Ration made his move, this'll be much easier.

You are absolutely losing your sanity at this point if you are Town.

You do understand if Ana votes you with me and you're Town the game is absolutely lost right?

[VFP]

Game is solved since Ration and Ana voted first. Those 2 voting me together will prove the results.

If me Tbone and VFP vote Llama they can't hammer without killing their teammate and being suspicious. Llama already is voting me so their 3 scum votes can't kill me.

Bingle and Kerset already agree I can only be scum with Tbone and VFP, so even if Ana decides to not unvote Llama here and team Tbone votes him to 4 votes neither Bingle or Kerset will hammer, and Ration won't kill his partner.

I'm not in danger of dying since if Ana switches we got all 3 baddies voting me and they won't hammer Llama. So we win when we prove the scumteam can only be Tbone/VFP/Bambi or Ration/Ana/Llama. With Kerset and Bingle as confirmed town to decide it town wins.

Edit: Mod you missed Ration voting me last page.

Fixed, just for you. -Y

Unless it's just you, Bingle, and Kerset...
I don’t understand what benefit this would have other than risk a 33% chance loss.

[Bingle]

I can’t wait for an explanation as to how this isn’t just a terrible idea, tbh.

[Bingle]

I don’t understand what benefit this would have other than risk a 33% chance loss.

I’d be interested in hearing how you arrived at 33% loss after Bambi explains herself. I also don’t think you’ve shared your analysis of potential partner groups yet.

[Bingle]

I would *love* for you to explain how as scum I decide to bus Ana/RM out of nowhere entirely unprompted and then decide to completely flip that on SS.

Lynx?

[Kerset]

To Ration, Bingle, and Kerset... Ana too I guess

Do all 4 of you agree I'm most likely to be partnered with Tbone and VFP? Genuine question because that'll tell me the course of action I gotta take.

No sinice only you follow Bone not the other way.

[Kerset]

Ana, vote me too please.

Tbone and VFP, vote Llama then we'll both be at 3.

You'll figure out the scum team when Bingle and Kerset don't instantly hammer. They'll be confirmed town and we win after more debate and we prove Llama is the bad guy.

You could ask bone to vote llama and vfp you. It would be simpler. The only problem will be if you happen to be scum with ana. In that case your complex plan gives you insta win.

[Kerset]

Bingle and Kerset already agree I can only be scum with Tbone and VFP

No

[Kerset]

Two and Three are WIFOM unless you are actually trying to say that you feel you can accurately tell the difference between town pushing reads and scum faking a read assuming they are going to die and scum faking a read trying to win it right here.

This is entire point of this game.

[Kerset]

@RM how is 1334 a towny mindset?

[Bambi Jay]

I can’t wait for an explanation as to how this isn’t just a terrible idea, tbh.

Let me explain it then. Assume your town okay?

Frankly fmp I know I'm town right? So I know how to minimize risk to myself here. Ration has been targeting me since day 1 and Ana didn't do much besides probably bus Llama. Not even that well considering she already admitted to wanting to switch votes.

Scum will usually vote first in this situation disregarding me and Llama since we already know the other has to be our target. If your scum you set your votes on both your partner and the VT to have an instant hammer opportunity when 2 of you vote.

From your perspective I guess I can be scum with them but since I can tell their goal is to get me killed I believe they just need Bingle and Kerset to vote me to win, hence me trusting them now.

I trust Tbone and VFP still obviously so having them vote Llama with me shows not only did they not wanna hammer me to show they aren't partners with Llama, Ration and Ana wouldn't be able to quick hammer Llama since that just kills their partner and it doesn't help them survive when we confirm that atleast Bingle and Kerset are town. Same but reversed if ya believe the other 2 are my partners. They'd only be able to hammer me.

To Ration, Bingle, and Kerset... Ana too I guess

Do all 4 of you agree I'm most likely to be partnered with Tbone and VFP? Genuine question because that'll tell me the course of action I gotta take.

No since only you follow Bone not the other way.

Okay, different question then. Since YOU know your town, and you know 1 of each a pair and a single are together, let's look at the pairs.

Bambi/Ration
Bambi/Tbone
Llama/Ration
Llama/Tbone

Which makes more sense to ya?

[Bambi Jay]

Ana, vote me too please.

Tbone and VFP, vote Llama then we'll both be at 3.

You'll figure out the scum team when Bingle and Kerset don't instantly hammer. They'll be confirmed town and we win after more debate and we prove Llama is the bad guy.

You could ask bone to vote llama and vfp you. It would be simpler. The only problem will be if you happen to be scum with ana. In that case your complex plan gives you insta win.

So in this scenario you want the votes to be like this?

Bambi: Ration, Llama, VFP
Llama: Bambi, Ana, Tbone

Considering my plan is to show your town, this can work too. Doesn't lock me in as partners with Tbone or Llama with Ration, but I can work with that and you have the assurance that a team of Bambi/Ration or Llama/Tbone doesn't fuck you over with a quick hammer.

I'll also agree with that just to prove to you it isn't you.

[VFP]

I don’t understand what benefit this would have other than risk a 33% chance loss.

I’d be interested in hearing how you arrived at 33% loss after Bambi explains herself. I also don’t think you’ve shared your analysis of potential partner groups yet.

And I pribably won't be doing so more so than what I have done.
Mainly because u don't understand where you want me to go with it?

[RationalMadman]

Okay I am done. Everyone vote Bambi.

[RationalMadman]

Bambi has actively refused to answer a direct question repeatedly.

[VFP]

I don’t understand what benefit this would have other than risk a 33% chance loss.

I’d be interested in hearing how you arrived at 33% loss after Bambi explains herself. I also don’t think you’ve shared your analysis of potential partner groups yet.

Well it would be 33% from Bambi's PoV.
From 1 pair being, you know... scum.

[VFP]

The plan from Bambi is so scum sided, I think I favour Bambi over Llama for it.
T-Bone, think I'm just being Paranoid here or is this reasonable?

[Bingle]

Well it would be 33% from Bambi's PoV.
From 1 pair being, you know... scum.

Not really. It's actually substantially more than that or substantially less than that from TownBambi's PoV. If you're talking from a position where she has already lost any game with RM/Ana scum it's a safe move for specifically her. If you're talking from a PoV of uninformed VT it's the case where either you or us are scum with Llama, which would be 66% of the time.

Kerset's suggestion would indeed conftown us with no risk of anyone else being able to hammer, but I don't know why anyone would actually agree to that since if you're townreading us to the extent of being willing to go through with that plan then you've functionally conftowned us anyways and it's just a useless gesture.

[Bingle]

The plan from Bambi is so scum sided, I think I favour Bambi over Llama for it.
T-Bone, think I'm just being Paranoid here or is this reasonable?

Why does scum Bambi suggest it?